I watched the Netflix series a few weeks back and I'm now hooked. Watched Monaco and Azerbaijan. There seems to be a lot to understand to fully appreciate this sport not the least of which is tire management. I'd love to have a continuing discussion for newbies on F1 from long time fans.
And go!
Got rid of Netflix so I have never seen their series. As you say, there are so many factors in F1. I hope and pray that the time of Mercedes dominance is coming to an end, we need some more races like that last one.
I would recommend you learn some of the great history of F1 starting with the awesome documentary SENNA and also the movies Rush and Grand Prix (with James Garner who actually drove F1 cars.)
There are also tons of YT videos from the old golden days of the glorious sound of the V12's and V10 days...
The SCCA is alive and doing well today and you can join, participate by actually driving your daily driver to volunteering at events. That folks is grass roots stuff up close and personal.
I'm a fellow McLaren fan. Mainly become of the McLaren F1 roadcar being my favorite of all time. They also were a top team when I started, it helped having Hamilton in a seat.
Formula 1 in a nutshell.
Next year, the Formula changes again, and the cars look awesome.
2022 F1 cars - ( New Window )
Its my newbie take that F1 is primarily an engineering competition. After that, you need a driver who is aggressive but not overly so who crashes. Lastly, strategy involving tires and pit stops.
I was also a big fan of CART which is now gone but was really fun racing and you got to see drivers get "promoted" into F1.
The tire strategy, the 2 sec pits, all great.
Some races though there was no passing which got a bit laborious to watch. I think Hamilton is the new Schumacher now so maybe the storylines are good. Always loved SPA and Silverstone, Monaco is famous but passing is so hard there.
F1 vs GT - ( New Window )
I've been a fan of all forms of motorsports since the 70's. When it comes to how a team will do over the course of the season in F1, it's all about the car. Single team dominance throughout it's history clearly shows that. It's one reason I prefer Indycar racing. The cars are essentially equal, and he drivers have much more of an effect on a race and season than they do in F1. But I still watch every F1 race, just to hope for a race like Monaco, or Baku, where the top cars have problems, and others can enter the fray. Watching Mercedes dominate the last several years has bored me. Hehe...
That being said I love F1. The technical aspects of the sport are unbelievable. Drive too slow? Not enough heat in the tires and brakes, you crash. Drive too fast? Youre over the line and you crash. They have to be perfect and I love that.
I was a huge fan of Alain Prost during his career. Those were the good old days of F1. Here in Montreal it was a three day event with the first two days being free to everyone. The island was packed those days. Race day was crazy. What a party.
Once Prost retired. I started to follow Damon Hill. Then after Hill I moved to Jenson Button. After Button left (2016-17?), with other things going on I kind of started following it less.
I do catch a race now and then. It is still an amazing show. Hamilton is just fantastic, and I am curious to see how Mick Schumacher is going to do. Will he live up to his name.
Notebook - ( New Window )
Have followed the sport my whole life, as in I had a Niki Lauda poster on my wall as a kid next to Reggie and Simms.
The field is as tight as it has been in this era of V6 hybrids. It may have been tight in the mid-field the last few seasons but the freezing of certain regulations in anticipation of brand new cars/a new formula next season has prevented huge leaps by the technical folks. The fight between Red Bull and Merc, Max vs. Lewis will no doubt go down in history as one of the better title fights ever. Not so bold prediction; the cars are just too close at this point and those two are simply elite.
Biggest problem with the sport right now is that the cars are 1,900lbs, up from 1,400+ in 2014. The peak horsepower of the combined gasoline and hybrid motors is in the neighborhood of 1,000hp, and the aerodynamics are so sophisticated that while it pushes the car down by thousands of pounds, if you disrupt the airflow with a tail-out slide where the driver has to correct, the cars become evil monsters to get back under control. Plus this level of performance absolutely EATS tires...braking and cornering forces can easily push tires beyond their limit in just a few laps given the right circumstances. Also, the cars' sensitivity to airflow is such that it is difficult to follow another car closely due to the turbulent wake, and the reduced level of cooling (mechanical and the tires) is also a deterrent to nose-to-tail combat.
So, what we have is a bit of a tire management game, which is not all that impressive in terms of the show as drivers on race day will often dial things back to save the tires. In contrast, Pirelli has had to make certain trade-offs in the interests of tire life, and race tires generally do not start producing any kind of grip until they exceed pretty high temps. 140* when I was racing on street-derived compounds but F1 tires require about 170*(!) surface temperature in order to 'work'. When they qualify, and this has happened to Mercedes quite a few times, the tire doesn't reach optimal temperature on their warm up lap and Hamilton has twice now not been able to lay one down in qualifying because the tires were not in the 'window'.
My favorite website/youtube channel/podcast is linked below. Mark Hughes is the best analyst out there in my opinion.
Link - ( New Window )
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the Netflix show as well and I'm hooked. I'm still trying to figure out how much is the car and how much is the driver. There are some teams like Mclaren which seem to blame everything on the car, and others like Haas which seem to blame it on the driver.
I've been a fan of all forms of motorsports since the 70's. When it comes to how a team will do over the course of the season in F1, it's all about the car. Single team dominance throughout it's history clearly shows that. It's one reason I prefer Indycar racing. The cars are essentially equal, and he drivers have much more of an effect on a race and season than they do in F1. But I still watch every F1 race, just to hope for a race like Monaco, or Baku, where the top cars have problems, and others can enter the fray. Watching Mercedes dominate the last several years has bored me. Hehe...
Very true. The development is all around the performance of the car and the balance between aerodynamics and handling. We work with the major F1 teams on windtunnel testing and being able to iterate part design quickly to optimize the time constraints they have put in place, and 3D printing lends itself to that. Really fascinating to see the engineering work behind the scenes. I didn't realize how much went into a car until I saw the steering wheel functions and the control room at Renault (now Alpine), where they can control certain functions remotely during a race.
There are certainly drivers with more skill than others, but taking the best driver and putting him in an Alpha Tauri car isn't going to lead to a win.
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In comment 15282299 Everyone Relax said:
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the Netflix show as well and I'm hooked. I'm still trying to figure out how much is the car and how much is the driver. There are some teams like Mclaren which seem to blame everything on the car, and others like Haas which seem to blame it on the driver.
I've been a fan of all forms of motorsports since the 70's. When it comes to how a team will do over the course of the season in F1, it's all about the car. Single team dominance throughout it's history clearly shows that. It's one reason I prefer Indycar racing. The cars are essentially equal, and he drivers have much more of an effect on a race and season than they do in F1. But I still watch every F1 race, just to hope for a race like Monaco, or Baku, where the top cars have problems, and others can enter the fray. Watching Mercedes dominate the last several years has bored me. Hehe...
Very true. The development is all around the performance of the car and the balance between aerodynamics and handling. We work with the major F1 teams on windtunnel testing and being able to iterate part design quickly to optimize the time constraints they have put in place, and 3D printing lends itself to that. Really fascinating to see the engineering work behind the scenes. I didn't realize how much went into a car until I saw the steering wheel functions and the control room at Renault (now Alpine), where they can control certain functions remotely during a race.
There are certainly drivers with more skill than others, but taking the best driver and putting him in an Alpha Tauri car isn't going to lead to a win.
Any feedback from your contacts on how the new budget constraints are affecting their decision making in terms of what and how far to pursue innovation/improvements?
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In comment 15282318 Vinny from Danbury said:
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In comment 15282299 Everyone Relax said:
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the Netflix show as well and I'm hooked. I'm still trying to figure out how much is the car and how much is the driver. There are some teams like Mclaren which seem to blame everything on the car, and others like Haas which seem to blame it on the driver.
I've been a fan of all forms of motorsports since the 70's. When it comes to how a team will do over the course of the season in F1, it's all about the car. Single team dominance throughout it's history clearly shows that. It's one reason I prefer Indycar racing. The cars are essentially equal, and he drivers have much more of an effect on a race and season than they do in F1. But I still watch every F1 race, just to hope for a race like Monaco, or Baku, where the top cars have problems, and others can enter the fray. Watching Mercedes dominate the last several years has bored me. Hehe...
Very true. The development is all around the performance of the car and the balance between aerodynamics and handling. We work with the major F1 teams on windtunnel testing and being able to iterate part design quickly to optimize the time constraints they have put in place, and 3D printing lends itself to that. Really fascinating to see the engineering work behind the scenes. I didn't realize how much went into a car until I saw the steering wheel functions and the control room at Renault (now Alpine), where they can control certain functions remotely during a race.
There are certainly drivers with more skill than others, but taking the best driver and putting him in an Alpha Tauri car isn't going to lead to a win.
Any feedback from your contacts on how the new budget constraints are affecting their decision making in terms of what and how far to pursue innovation/improvements?
It's causing a shitload of issues. I've been fortunate to meet Frank Williams, as he used to come to work everytime I visited (pre=2020) and he'd be out in his wheelchair talking cars to anyone he could. He forsaw this happening and once Williams was acquired by a Capital venture firm, a lot of the longtime employees bailed on the F1 team and moved over to the Advanced Engineering side that deals mostly in consumer applications.
For the business we do, Mercedes reduced their budget this year by 15%, and they are a premier team. They are likely taking a similar move next year and will have personnel cuts. Alpine is struggling with how to make it work and teams like alpha Tauri and Ferrari who are behind the other teams in terms of the way they utilize windtunnel testing are trying to figure things out. Most of their budget decisions for 2022 are being made in the next 60-90 days and we'll meet with them during shutdown.
Because resources are really constrained, I think you'll see the majority of time focused on the windtunnel and how to rapidly implement design changes. Luckily, with technology today, they can crank out design ideas in hours and the print sample parts quickly to test. Realistically, the spending only is going down a few million each year and the teams who are at the top already have the best practices in place for testing and iteration, so I'm not sure how much the field will be leveled by offering more testing time to the lower teams. They aren't necessarily bad because of testing - they are bad because their engineering lags.
Just my take
I really like the engineering aspect of the cars. F1 Tech is fun to watch if you like that type of thing. F1 is also a test bed for future technology that works its way down to street cars.
The battle in the mid field has gotten intense the past 2 to 3 years. It will only get better next year. Next years new rules is going to be interesting and will try to help level the playing field.
At the very lest you can watch the race highlites on Youtube.Not the same as watching the race play out in real time, but better then nothing. Glad you liking what oyu are watching
F1 Tech flexible wings - ( New Window )
I think F1 is like British Soccer: There are top teams that usually win the majority or entirely of the races, middle teams that occasionally might get a 2nd or 3rd place podium and "bottom dwellers / back markers that have no real chance.
The opposite of the salary cap, schedule and draft position "parity" that the NFL tries to impose, which gives fans of almost all teams hope that their team can will it all every year.
Right now, I root for Sebastian Vettel, Ferrari and Haas (American team).
I root against Hamilton as he has been very, very fortunate to be in a dominant car for 7 years, fortunate that his competition on his Mercedes team retired (Niko Rosberg) and extremely whiny when the rare case when something doesn't go his way.
No sir. Virtually every single component (approximately 5,000+) are built by each of the ten teams independently. There are very specific and strict exceptions, such as teams being able to purchase the power unit, gearbox, suspension design, and brake rotors (I believe each rotor costs around $50k to $75k with over 1,000 small diameter lengthy drill holes for cooling purposes), which may be shared via contractractual agreements.
The cars look very similar at face value due to brilliant minds on each team in engineering and aerodynamics coming largely to the same overall general conclusions given the fact the sport provides a precise set of rules and 3-Dimensional areas where design and placement of components is permitted. When looking at each car and their smallest aerodynamic elements, no two cars are the exact same, and the trick really comes down to using computers (computational fluid dynamics - simulations of air as a liquid) and scale model windtunnels to ensure the airflow from the tip of the front wing all the wing to the very most rearward components and the backwing provide the proper airflow and balance to the car. A perfectly balances car going around a corner at up to ~200 mph can literally receive a small gust of unexpected wind or a small theoretical push with one hand from someone standing next to the car and completely spin it out. They are always driving on the finest of lines to remain pointing the right way.
All aerodynamic parts and all of the wire routing, hydraulics, chassis, which is basically a carbon fiber survival cell which everything else is bolted to, like the power unit itself, then the transmission behind that, then the differential, then drive shafts and axles to the wheels in the rear, and finally the suspension attached externally to the gearbox, the rear wing mounted above the gearbox, and at the very end above the rear diffuser and floor, is the squared off rear crash structure.
All of that stuff has to be built by each team (called a constructor). In the case of HAAS, they were the first team where they design their own aero parts, have Dallara manufacture their chassis and aero components (Dallara is an Italian company and makes the identical cars for Indycar, Formula 2, and Formula 3 among others - Indycar only has one main difference, a Chevy or Honda drivetrain). Then HAAS buys as much technical components as possible, such as the suspension, power units, transmission, and differential from Ferrari.
This allowed HAAS to enter the sport at the lowest investment needed within the ruleset, but now they're the worst team on the grid after, I believe, five years in F1. This is despite just having Ferrari develop all of that tech for them and Ferrari capable of getting podiums this year, so it just shows you need both the tech and aero/chassis synergized to be successful.
Teams like Mercedes, Red Bull, Renault, and Ferrari in particular, manufacture everything on their cars including the entire powertrain (except during this year and prior years, where Red Bull had partnered with Renault for their powertrain and then for the past couple of years they partnered with Honda), but beginning with the new regulations next year, Red Bull has made a huge investment and is taking over the power unit project and intellectual property from Honda and will become an engine manufacturer for the first time.
The other six teams purchase engines/powertrains/hybrid power and battery systems from the four powertrain manufacturers.
2022 will be exciting, as the powertrain development is largely stalled, but the aerodynamic regulations were redone from the ground up to create more downforce from the floor (which effectively sucks the car to the ground), and less downforce from the front and rear wings. This allows cars immediately behind other cars to experience less turbulent "dirty air" and slowing them down, because the floor downforce doesn't rely on clean air to create effective downforce as much as the front and rear wings do. They also modernized the design to make it look more futuristic.
Teams have been working on designs for these new regulations for many years now, even before they were finalized (so, with the pandemic delaying implementation, I'd say the very first design is probably four to five years old right now). This could shake up the entire rankings of the teams and allow for some real innovative features. But, the richest teams, Mercedes, Ferrari, and Red Bull for example, will have also had the most time and resources to work on the new regulations, so they're more likely to remain at the sharp end of the rankings when compared to the other seven teams. But, who knows, as teams will show up to winter testing with these brand new highly secretive designs and legitimately be seeing what the other teams did at the very same time as the general public.
Pick a driver and/or team, and enjoy the drama. It's a large part of the sport. Have fun. :)
In 2018 and 2019 Ferrari were as fast or faster than Mercedes using an illegal engine, and with Max Verstappen and Red Bull, they have had at certain short-periods of time the faster car, but this year their car seems to be on par with Mercedes. Max is essentially guaranteed to be the next "Hamilton-level" talent of his generation and has dominated all of his teammates.
I think since the beginning of 2018, he has driven nearly flawlessly, making mistakes where he's the sole person on the team to blame which led to a ruined race, counted on less than one hand. If Hamilton can add one to three more championships over what is likely his final five seasons in F1, he will be considered the greatest of all time in my opinion.
Yes, other champions were amazingly talented, including Aryton Senna's life tragically cut-short, and Michael Schumacher with his 7 titles, but Schumacher did the same thing Hamilton has been able to do. 1. Find early success (Hamilton was instantly battling his two-time world champion teammate in his rookie season - Fernando Alonso, and won his first championship in 2008). 2. Find success in more than just one team, moving to a team at the right moment where everything is in place or being developed to be be the best all-around team, which is did by moving from McLaren to Mercedes in 2013, a year before the hybrid engine era began in 2014, where Mercedes has won every championship since then. The legendary Niki Lauda personally convinced Hamilton to leave the better (at the time) McLaren team for the mid-field Mercedes time during the 2012 season.
Anyway, Hamilton's deal is pretty simple. He most likely makes the fewest mistakes on the grid, by both percentage and in a cumulative total over the past five years at least. He is in contention to be the fastest over one lap in qualifying in about 95% or more of the races. He has no track where you can legitimately call him "weak." He recently had a ridiculous scoring streak over the course of three years ended (I believe it was 56 races straight within the top 10?) In head-to-head racing, he is known to be highly talented and takes less risk, while never giving up throughout the race, which has led to wins in both cases (such as Max being too aggressive and crashing out, or 4-time world champion Vettel spinning out or making an error as Hamilton drives by), he is as fit as any driver on the grid at the age of 37 I believe? Finally, he is masterful in the rain, a quality shared among the best drivers, such as Verstappen. All of this without any major controversy on-track, such as cheating, intentionally crashing into another car and getting away with it to win a championship (it's been done a few famous times by others), faking a crash or brake lock-up, putting out caution flags and intentionally ruining the qualifying lap of all competitors behind you, and so on.
He has plenty of haters, but I think he will go down as the greatest. He's also an amazing person by all accounts. Leading efforts for diversity in sports and racial equality within F1, the most vocal on taking care of the planet, and has enough side-interests to have about four or five other careers which he pursues when he's not at a race weekend, and then when he lands for the race weekend, he switches every other passion off and performs as well as every other weekend. Dude is just an animal of a human and should be studied hah.
They also have a driver in the FIA Formula 2 from China that they really want to see excel so they can start to expand the fanbase in China.
They also have a driver in the FIA Formula 2 from China that they really want to see excel so they can start to expand the fanbase in China.
Hopefully they'll be able to race there again next season. Fun track
This year he's already proven that he's maybe the best in the field at chasing, staying close enough to Max when the turbulence and temperature issues say he shouldn't be able to, then lays down a series of head scratching lap times at the end of a tire stint. I am lucky enough to have seen Senna, Prost, Mansell, Schumacher and Hakkinen live in their prime. Maybe they would have all done what LH has done with the edge he's been given in his Mercedes tenure, but maybe not when you consider the complexity of driving these later-day F1 cars.
Fatman, got any good Cyril gossip for us? Always seemed like a bit of a phony though I acknowledge that his racing resume is incredibly solid. Never seemed like a leader.
I deal with the Additive Manufacturing departments and work closely with them on engineering and optimizing testing. Don't really hear too much about the teams themselves. I've worked with Renault for years and now Alpine, and never knew who their lower division drivers and youth drivers were until recently. Alonso likely won't be there next year, so they are betting on Ocon making a huge leap. And they think they will next year. You never know.
I mentioned above about getting to talk to Frank Williams quite a bit. One time we pulled up in a Tesla and he says to our sales rep, "That's a damn nice car, but way too quiet. No heart". We laughed. Then we get inside and the engineer from the US that was with us said "Why do they let a guy in the wheelchair hang out front?" Luckily or contact played it off by saying "If you want to ask him to leave, be our guest", but I really thought we were getting kicked out. Our sales rep said "This is why we don't like having engineer talk". Facepalm!
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Fatman, got any good Cyril gossip for us? Always seemed like a bit of a phony though I acknowledge that his racing resume is incredibly solid. Never seemed like a leader.
I deal with the Additive Manufacturing departments and work closely with them on engineering and optimizing testing. Don't really hear too much about the teams themselves. I've worked with Renault for years and now Alpine, and never knew who their lower division drivers and youth drivers were until recently. Alonso likely won't be there next year, so they are betting on Ocon making a huge leap. And they think they will next year. You never know.
I mentioned above about getting to talk to Frank Williams quite a bit. One time we pulled up in a Tesla and he says to our sales rep, "That's a damn nice car, but way too quiet. No heart". We laughed. Then we get inside and the engineer from the US that was with us said "Why do they let a guy in the wheelchair hang out front?" Luckily or contact played it off by saying "If you want to ask him to leave, be our guest", but I really thought we were getting kicked out. Our sales rep said "This is why we don't like having engineer talk". Facepalm!
I'm a business person. I know this is one in a million.
But, I will do untold things to/for/with you for any hint at some special access to a grand prix weekend. It is surpassing the NY Football Giants as my most followed and passionate sport.
If I didn't hit the lottery with a stranger on the internet, then do it for the children. No, but for real, if you do have any kind of connections in the industry that you're "sort of" friendly with, a short intro and LinkedIn connection would go a long way, as I try to slow-play a long-term relationship with the the utmost respect to not make you look bad or weird post-introduction.
When I was 27 I was diagnosed with one-year left to live. My mind went to trying to do anything possible "Make-a-Wish" style, but with my own money. That's when I was just starting in the sport, so imagine now. Thankfully, even Memorial Sloan Kettering Cancer Center, the best of the best, sometimes provide the wrong prognosis. Thank to Dr. Jonathan Coleman for not giving up and saving my life.
Also, please don't blame me for trying. :)
With COVID, the access for this year isn't likely because our travel hasn't resumed yet, but we'll have some in the future.
Sometimes we'll have offers for a race and passes to the setup/motorhome they have in the paddock, depending on which team, but more likely it will be a site visit to the HQ where you can see the cars in the lobby and get a tour. Because I'm in the US, we usually let the UK office or the Italian office use the tickets for taking customers out. I've only gone to two actual races, but do site visits, when I'm traveling, 10-12 times a year.
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Fatman, got any good Cyril gossip for us? Always seemed like a bit of a phony though I acknowledge that his racing resume is incredibly solid. Never seemed like a leader.
I deal with the Additive Manufacturing departments and work closely with them on engineering and optimizing testing. Don't really hear too much about the teams themselves. I've worked with Renault for years and now Alpine, and never knew who their lower division drivers and youth drivers were until recently. Alonso likely won't be there next year, so they are betting on Ocon making a huge leap. And they think they will next year. You never know.
I mentioned above about getting to talk to Frank Williams quite a bit. One time we pulled up in a Tesla and he says to our sales rep, "That's a damn nice car, but way too quiet. No heart". We laughed. Then we get inside and the engineer from the US that was with us said "Why do they let a guy in the wheelchair hang out front?" Luckily or contact played it off by saying "If you want to ask him to leave, be our guest", but I really thought we were getting kicked out. Our sales rep said "This is why we don't like having engineer talk". Facepalm!
I agree with you that Zhou is destined for a seat in '22. I was surprised given the low likelihood that the car would be competitive in this last year of the old regs that they didn't give him a year to settle in.
Never one to hold back, that Sir Frank.