So the NY Post published an article this morning about the edge rushers on the Giants. Suffice it to say, it's still shaky, filled with unproven veterans, free agents on one-year deals, and rookies. None of the returning edge guys had more than 2 sacks.
Now how are the Giants going to approach the pass rush (this includes the defensive line)? Complex blitz packages by scheme like last year? Rush 4 or 5?
Starting with the defensive line:
Leonard Williams is probably the closest answer right now coming off a 11.5-sack year, but he can't shoulder the pass rush by himself. When he doesn't get to the quarterback, nobody does.
For all the talk about Dexter Lawrence being the next pro-bowler, he's gotta get better and quicker at rushing the passer to become a more three-dimensional player. Lawrence has established himself as a great run defender, but Pro Bowl voters look for someone who can get 6-8 sacks when it comes to defensive tackles. Should the Giants use him more on passing downs since he's been on the field for less than 65% of the time?
For the edge guys: I feel like the Giants don't go anywhere without a strong presence at edge, having grown up watching Lawrence Taylor on film and Michael Strahan on TV, and so far what the Giants have is not encouraging for me. Carter and Ximines are both coming off of injury and have disappointed so far, Coughlin (who is switching to inside linebacker), Brown, Lalos, and Harris have had little playing time, Odenigbo (who is admittedly a solid situational rusher) and Anderson are only here on one-year deals, and Ojulari and Smith are rookies.
So have we upgraded? Who's gonna step up? Does the Patriot Way not allow for good edge rushers? Should we look to add another pass rusher in next year's draft?
If at least one of our guys prove their mettle with a 10+ sack season, I'll graciously eat my hat.
Edge rusher remains very shaky spot for Giants - (
New Window )
Call it facts.
That was overall team depth and scheme. And man, especially in that AFC championship game, their pass rush was intense. They kept KC under wraps really until about the last half of the 4th quarter.
Other than Van Noy I can't think of a notable rusher they had on that squad off the top o' me head.
The fans might see Pete Monty,Ryan Phillips,Gerris Wilkinson,and Chuck Faucette. The Giants see LT,Sam Huff,Van Pelt,and Banks.
Like the movie Shallow Hal
Evidently I'm not the only person who's concerned about the pass rush (these guys will be covering tight ends next) and I'd be a liar if I said I wasn't worried. Everybody's got something they're worried about; Jones, the wide receivers, the offensive line. For me it's the pass rush because I feel like it's something the Giants never do well without.
Think '85 Bears.
The fans might see Pete Monty,Ryan Phillips,Gerris Wilkinson,and Chuck Faucette. The Giants see LT,Sam Huff,Van Pelt,and Banks.
Like the movie Shallow Hal
Ha! Ok the shallow Hal line made me chuckle. Well done.
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But how about you stop obsessing over the Giants pass-rush since we're still two weeks away from the start of training camp? You keep asking questions that are impossible to answer right now. We don't even know who's going to make the squad and who won't, or what plans Graham & Co. have for the ones that do. Sheesh. Give it a rest.
Evidently I'm not the only person who's concerned about the pass rush (these guys will be covering tight ends next) and I'd be a liar if I said I wasn't worried. Everybody's got something they're worried about; Jones, the wide receivers, the offensive line. For me it's the pass rush because I feel like it's something the Giants never do well without.
Everyone's concerned, about a lot of things, but everyone doesn't either start a thread about the pass-rush (and how concerned they are about it), or post about it (and how concerned they are) on numerous other threads. You're turning concerns about the pass-rush into a cottage industry. And as I said above, we're still two weeks away from the start of camp, and you keep on asking questions - often the same ones - that can't possibly be answered now. Stop obsessing over it.
Relax. Listen to some music.
This year, they have improved the secondary and they have added more players with pass rush abilities. Patrick Graham has shown creativity in his defensive schemes and disguising coverages. This is going to be a pass rush by committee type of team, but in the end hopefully it will equal to more pressures, turnover opportunities and sacks.
None are all pro’s , most may not be close
But talent wise, a step above last yr. maybe two
And some real potential for possible multiple 8-10 sack guys
Giants have weaknesses and question marks but this is not an area I'm overly concerned about.
But there is training camp and associated injuries and associated improvements. It very well may come down to the health of the secondary starting September.
There's a bunch of guys that can set the edge- good luck trying to run against this defense
There's some guys that can cover.
There's some guys that are thumpers.
There's some guys that (theoretically) can rush the passer.
There's no doubt that the front 3 and back 7 are going to carry this defense.
Graham and JJ's goal from day one was to be multiple - they have the tools to be just that this year. I can't wait to see it.
The safeties allow for both coverage and blitzing options.
Graham’s defense last year was so impressive because of its limitations. With the improved personnel he will really be able to confuse offenses.
That was overall team depth and scheme. And man, especially in that AFC championship game, their pass rush was intense. They kept KC under wraps really until about the last half of the 4th quarter.
Other than Van Noy I can't think of a notable rusher they had on that squad off the top o' me head.
And it's not like Van Noy is a stud pass rusher. He has 23.5 sacks in 7 seasons with a career high of 6.5...
Smith is a guy who I think would've gone much higher in a normal draft year.
They improved their secondary via FA and the draft which should aid the pass rush and also added some edge options that can likely outperform the guys they loss (namely Fackrell).
He will need to bulk up a bit, but it would nice to see some impactful plays from him as a rookie to give him and the coaches some confidence that he can hold his own.
The rest of the Edge guys offer nothing special and obvious they went with quantity over quality in hopes to maybe get lucky. The Giants will likely still need to be looking for another Edge guy next offseason...
They need this year to have some closers on the outside which is where Ojulari fits in and I expect very good results. The others will compete and contribute.
Schematically, the potential outstanding secondary will allow Graham to use personnel in creative blitzes. The whole package will work if the Giants first play good run defense to create unfavorable down/distance.
This was one of the team's major areas of weakness in 2020.
The team added a number of new components via free agency and the draft.
It remains to be seen how these new components perform.
(This is pretty much true of any team dealing with any weakness).
You rarely have great units at every level of the D. But if the edge guys can hold their own this D will be just fine.
And there are the two rookies. There is upside unlike recent year's past.
Yes it would be nice if someone stepped up as the guy but I feel we have enough skill in the group to improve. We put our top priority on the Deffensive backfield and Im ok with that.
The big thing with Judge/Graham is that just about everyone dressed will get snaps. This is team deffense and all about playing Chess and using your pieces to attack.
- 10th in sacks
- 9th in pressures
- 9th in pressure percentage
- 6th in QB knockdowns
- 6th in TFLs
- 6th in rush yards per attempt
- Only two teams had 2 players with double digit sacks in 2020
- The Giants two leading blitzers were Martinez and Peppers
- The Giants had 22.5 sacks by down lineman
Maybe Graham prefers inside pass rush and the outside linebackers to set the edge? Maybe he'll play a lot of 3 corner, 3 safety looks?
In short, maybe this isn't a problem?
It beats making the Olivier Vernons of the world the highest paid D-linemen in the league.
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In comment 15303956 Klaatu said:
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But how about you stop obsessing over the Giants pass-rush since we're still two weeks away from the start of training camp? You keep asking questions that are impossible to answer right now. We don't even know who's going to make the squad and who won't, or what plans Graham & Co. have for the ones that do. Sheesh. Give it a rest.
Evidently I'm not the only person who's concerned about the pass rush (these guys will be covering tight ends next) and I'd be a liar if I said I wasn't worried. Everybody's got something they're worried about; Jones, the wide receivers, the offensive line. For me it's the pass rush because I feel like it's something the Giants never do well without.
Everyone's concerned, about a lot of things, but everyone doesn't either start a thread about the pass-rush (and how concerned they are about it), or post about it (and how concerned they are) on numerous other threads. You're turning concerns about the pass-rush into a cottage industry. And as I said above, we're still two weeks away from the start of camp, and you keep on asking questions - often the same ones - that can't possibly be answered now. Stop obsessing over it.
Relax. Listen to some music.
This.
The OP just seems to like seeing his name in lights on the active thread page.
The Giants had a pretty good pass rush last year, and it’s clear as day the emphasis was on pass rush up the middle not around the edge.
The Giants have invested in Williams, Lawrence, Martinez, and Peppers — these guys are getting pressure on the QB.
If you’re going to generate pressure up the middle as identity, you’re going to play a lot of contain and edge setting.
Simple example, the linebacker playing to Williams’s side is going to be playing contain a lot, because Williams is not. He’s a pass rusher, a really good one.
The Giants had a pretty good pass rush last year, and it’s clear as day the emphasis was on pass rush up the middle not around the edge.
The Giants have invested in Williams, Lawrence, Martinez, and Peppers — these guys are getting pressure on the QB.
If you’re going to generate pressure up the middle as identity, you’re going to play a lot of contain and edge setting.
Simple example, the linebacker playing to Williams’s side is going to be playing contain a lot, because Williams is not. He’s a pass rusher, a really good one.
You're simultaneously preaching to the choir (I think most NYG fans either understand this or at a minimum have faith in Graham as DC), and also trying to educate the OP who isn't here to be educated. Since joining the board, he has started more threads than he's commented on. That's a very telling stat, IMO.
^^ This
OL is worth our concern & then some.
The key will be mixing it up and creating mis-matches at times. I think we will be run blitzing Peppers, McKinney a lot to create pressure.