NFT: Kappo Kakko

He has Selke potential and his offense will only increase from hereon out. I just really hope Drury doesn't do anything stupid and include him in a trade for a C unless it's for Sasha Barkov. But I wouldn't even do Kakko for Eichel straight up.

You don't draft a guy number two overall because he can backcheck and is good defensively. He was drafted to score. He has shown very little offensively and is the poster boy for a team that completely lacks grit and toughness.

He will be included in a trade as Rangers rebuild their roster.

In comment 15308566 averagejoe said:

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You don't draft a guy number two overall because he can backcheck and is good defensively. He was drafted to score. He has shown very little offensively and is the poster boy for a team that completely lacks grit and toughness. He will be included in a trade as Rangers rebuild their roster.

Your opinion sucks, and you should feel bad

to say the guy only plays defense and is the poster boy for a team that lacks grit and toughness, no?

He's a great young player and development of some of these young kids really accelerates. Look at the leap Jack Hughes has made.

In comment 15308566 averagejoe said:

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You don't draft a guy number two overall because he can backcheck and is good defensively. He was drafted to score. He has shown very little offensively and is the poster boy for a team that completely lacks grit and toughness. He will be included in a trade as Rangers rebuild their roster.

Agree with Greg.

not sure Drury would take that position on even swap, but I'm with you on sentiment. KK ever, soooo, slowly became a bit more attack minded last season. After the over worked, fatigued Fin slept walked through his rookie season, his skating improved, his on ice awareness improved, and his ability to match NHL forwards and d-men with his toughness cranked up in 2021. We saw it as an 18-year old in the World Juniors in 2019 where he was almost a man-boy among boys.

It seems he needs to break bread with the Breadman, lol

Last year was Kakko's age 19 season. He posted 9-8-17 in 48 games.

Know what Leon Draisaitl did when he was 19? 2-7-9 in 37 games.

In comment 15308574 ColHowPepper said:

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not sure Drury would take that position on even swap, but I'm with you on sentiment. KK ever, soooo, slowly became a bit more attack minded last season. After the over worked, fatigued Fin slept walked through his rookie season, his skating improved, his on ice awareness improved, and his ability to match NHL forwards and d-men with his toughness cranked up in 2021. We saw it as an 18-year old in the World Juniors in 2019 where he was almost a man-boy among boys. It seems he needs to break bread with the Breadman, lol

You're talking about a guy with serious neck issues earning 10M a year and who has a reputation for being a diva. Yes, he's insanely talented when healthy and again, if healthy, he's the 1C we desperately need, but there are way too many question marks surrounding him. No, I would not even trade Kakko straight up for Eichel. If he was healthy, yes. As it stands right now, no.

If we're going to trade for Eichel, which has been rumored all along, I sincerely hope we trade quantity over quality. I can live with #15, Chytil and one of Kravtsov, Lundkvist and Schneider for Eichel. But I'm not trading Kakko, Laf, Fox, K'Andre or Igor in any deal for Eichel. Total non-starter.

the simplistic take that players are only drafted to score and comments to the like.

Aren't players at the top drafted because they are really good players? Was Michael Jordan only drafted to score? Was Mike Trout drafted only to hit HR's?

If you look at the actual numbers, Kakko was one of NHL's most improved players. And his defensive ability shone. At 19 years old and living in a new country and having to also take on diabetes and celiac's disease. Think a learning curve might be in order?

In comment 15308570 Greg from LI said:

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In comment 15308566 averagejoe said: Quote: You don't draft a guy number two overall because he can backcheck and is good defensively. He was drafted to score. He has shown very little offensively and is the poster boy for a team that completely lacks grit and toughness. He will be included in a trade as Rangers rebuild their roster. Your opinion sucks, and you should feel bad

I do feel bad...lol...I must have been watching a different Kappo Kakko play last year....I do not see the awesome potential.

In comment 15308566 averagejoe said:

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You don't draft a guy number two overall because he can backcheck and is good defensively. He was drafted to score. He has shown very little offensively and is the poster boy for a team that completely lacks grit and toughness. He will be included in a trade as Rangers rebuild their roster.

Yea because 20 year old players never improve?

He's getting shit on for just playing in the NHL. If he was dominating the Finnish league or the AHL and hadn't played an NHL game by nowhe would be hyped as one the best prospects there is. Same with Laf and Chytil.

players (the elite ones) of the past decade have a reputation for being fundamentally sound. It's their hallmark and part of the reason USA Hockey spent so much time studying Finland and created the ADM for youth sports.

A country the size of Massachusetts was figuratively running laps around the US in hockey.

Since that time USA has made massive leaps, but still I think there is an expectation the Finnish elite players process the game cerebrally very well.

No, Kakko was not drafted to score, he was drafted because his hockey IQ is off the charts, he can score and has scored huge goals in INTL play and will eventually in the NHL, and that part of his game will come, but he's a complete player or will be when he's old enough to drink a beer.

His future IMO is more Patrice Bergeron than Barkov though, he's more pass first, defense, IQ - and those players are harder to find than a Caufield IMO - who is pure scorer (awesome, but pure scorer).

I really like Aatu Räty in this upcoming draft - I hope he slides to 30, but I think 15-20 is more likely.

17 points in 688 minutes or .025 Jack Hughs was 31 pts in 1067 min or .029 so he is right there with #1 player drafted in his class. Factor in he had covid this year and you are not playing at 100%. If fine with him at this point. I do expect improvement.

Offense literally dies on his stick.

Prefer Svechkov or Pinelli.

In comment 15308602 pjcas18 said:

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players (the elite ones) of the past decade have a reputation for being fundamentally sound. It's their hallmark and part of the reason USA Hockey spent so much time studying Finland and created the ADM for youth sports. A country the size of Massachusetts was figuratively running laps around the US in hockey. Since that time USA has made massive leaps, but still I think there is an expectation the Finnish elite players process the game cerebrally very well. No, Kakko was not drafted to score, he was drafted because his hockey IQ is off the charts, he can score and has scored huge goals in INTL play and will eventually in the NHL, and that part of his game will come, but he's a complete player or will be when he's old enough to drink a beer. His future IMO is more Patrice Bergeron than Barkov though, he's more pass first, defense, IQ - and those players are harder to find than a Caufield IMO - who is pure scorer (awesome, but pure scorer). I really like Aatu Räty in this upcoming draft - I hope he slides to 30, but I think 15-20 is more likely.

Sounds like Aatu Raty's stock has taken a severe hit. For a guy who was rumored to be in the running for first overall this time last year, his projection is all over the place. I've heard pundits say they wouldn't sniff him until the 3rd round.

In comment 15308566 averagejoe said:

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You don't draft a guy number two overall because he can backcheck and is good defensively. He was drafted to score. He has shown very little offensively and is the poster boy for a team that completely lacks grit and toughness. He will be included in a trade as Rangers rebuild their roster.

This may be a popular take among impatient Rangers' fans, but KK is barely 20.5 years old. I think his initial season was a real struggle after an exhausting year and slow adjustment to the NHL. He's a guy who needs to reach a comfort zone.

But the worst part of your post is that I put in bold face. Did you watch the team at all last year? He is a tough checker and grinder, game after game. Does he drop his gloves at the first provocation? No, not his game, but your take here is way off. Does he need to expand his offensive game, his hands and positioning in and around the circles? Absolutely.

Kakko's defensive improvement was very obvious. It's rare to notice a player being great defensively.

And as Greg and others noted, many other players have made huge leaps after their first two seasons. Barkov is one example.

Yes, it'll be disappointing if Kakko turns into a 40-50 point player. But let's wait. I'll be furious if he's traded.

The major bone of contention with Eichel and the Sabres is that he wants a disc replacement, which as I understand it is a novel treatment. Apparently the orthodox course of action is a regular discectomy, but that has a recovery time of 6-8 months. If he gets surgery in August, we’re looking at a February return at the earliest and more likely, March or April.

So it's very possible he misses the entire regular season

with NHL (and MLB) drafts.

you are projecting 17 and 18 year old kids basically based on what they did at 15, 16 and 17 to grow into men.

IMO Raty had some growing pains, but I love the player.

I can see why scouts don't love him, he reminds me of a bigger Brendan Gallagher. Choppy skating style, but better shot than Gallagher and bigger.

I think he has a good NHL future.

And IMO once you're out of the top 15 or so players it's almost rolling the dice.

The odds of starting 200 games or something outside of the 1st round is low (25% of players selected in the second round from 1990 - 1999 played 200 games or more - 12% in the 3rd round).

Quote:

Doug MacLean said his math over the last decade showed that only 15% of second round picks ever become impact players.

with those odds, after the 1st round I'm going all in on upside.

...if you have a guy winning Selkes who does that, that's a very valuable guy to have around.

In comment 15308608 ColHowPepper said:

Quote:

In comment 15308566 averagejoe said: Quote: You don't draft a guy number two overall because he can backcheck and is good defensively. He was drafted to score. He has shown very little offensively and is the poster boy for a team that completely lacks grit and toughness. He will be included in a trade as Rangers rebuild their roster. This may be a popular take among impatient Rangers' fans, but KK is barely 20.5 years old. I think his initial season was a real struggle after an exhausting year and slow adjustment to the NHL. He's a guy who needs to reach a comfort zone. But the worst part of your post is that I put in bold face. Did you watch the team at all last year? He is a tough checker and grinder, game after game. Does he drop his gloves at the first provocation? No, not his game, but your take here is way off. Does he need to expand his offensive game, his hands and positioning in and around the circles? Absolutely.

Agree entirely.

He didn't even look like he belonged in the NHL during his first season. To go from that to being one of the best defensive forwards in the NHL along with being a good along the boards is a massive improvement. He's not done growing. He and Chytl were a nightmare for opposing teams last year too and neither got PP time.

In comment 15308602 pjcas18 said:

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players (the elite ones) of the past decade have a reputation for being fundamentally sound. It's their hallmark and part of the reason USA Hockey spent so much time studying Finland and created the ADM for youth sports. A country the size of Massachusetts was figuratively running laps around the US in hockey. Since that time USA has made massive leaps, but still I think there is an expectation the Finnish elite players process the game cerebrally very well. No, Kakko was not drafted to score, he was drafted because his hockey IQ is off the charts, he can score and has scored huge goals in INTL play and will eventually in the NHL, and that part of his game will come, but he's a complete player or will be when he's old enough to drink a beer. His future IMO is more Patrice Bergeron than Barkov though, he's more pass first, defense, IQ - and those players are harder to find than a Caufield IMO - who is pure scorer (awesome, but pure scorer). I really like Aatu Räty in this upcoming draft - I hope he slides to 30, but I think 15-20 is more likely.

Speaking of Finns, Anton Lundell looks like a real stud. Maybe not on Kakko's level overall, but he's another guy who has Selke potential.

In comment 15308566 averagejoe said:

Quote:

You don't draft a guy number two overall because he can backcheck and is good defensively. He was drafted to score. He has shown very little offensively and is the poster boy for a team that completely lacks grit and toughness. He will be included in a trade as Rangers rebuild their roster.

God no.

Reprise Kyle: From @4EverBlueshirts on twtrhttps://twitter.com/4EverBlueshirts/status/1417494837021102080

In comment 15308626 Greg from LI said:

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...if you have a guy winning Selkes who does that, that's a very valuable guy to have around.

Yeah, I'm really confident he's going to be an excellent player. I think he has much more offensive upside than he's shown this year. He dominated in the World Championships before the draft.

check out, which I know is a big if, no danger IMO.

Eichel is a top 10 center without question (if healthy).

I know it's an easy comprable because he is also Finnish but I have read that Mikko Rantanen is a good comprable for Kakko.

Nothing guaranteed but seems reasonable as a ceiling.

In comment 15308692 Drewcon40 said:

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I know it's an easy comprable because he is also Finnish but I have read that Mikko Rantanen is a good comprable for Kakko. Nothing guaranteed but seems reasonable as a ceiling.

Funnily enough, both Lafreniere and Kakko were compared to Rantanen at their respective drafts when they were selected.

In comment 15308694 Anakim said:

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In comment 15308692 Drewcon40 said: Quote: I know it's an easy comprable because he is also Finnish but I have read that Mikko Rantanen is a good comprable for Kakko. Nothing guaranteed but seems reasonable as a ceiling. Funnily enough, both Lafreniere and Kakko were compared to Rantanen at their respective drafts when they were selected.

Were they really? Neither is close to him physically, I can see some similarities - more with Lafreniere and his shot, but I think there are better comps.

Rantanen is closer to Jagr/Lindros in size which creates obvious advantages neither Kakko or Lafreniere will ever have unless they hit a late life growth spurt.

I think Bergeron is a better comp for both than Rantanen.

In comment 15308691 pjcas18 said:

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check out, which I know is a big if, no danger IMO. Eichel is a top 10 center without question (if healthy).

I might be in the minority but I hope the Rangers trade for him, but only if it's a smart trade from NYR POV. I know Mika is a FA soon, but if we could package him with some youth and picks i'd do it. I don't love Mika as much as others do and think Eichel is a more explosive and prolific center. Mika always has a slump or two every year. I get the reasons why, but they still seem to occur every year.

Huberdeau - Laf
Stone - Kakko

are decent comparisons too.

I'd trade Schneider, Ryan Strome and a 1st for Eichel. or start out with that.

If that doesn't get it done, swap out Schneider for Nils Lundkvist.

Rangers suddenly have a very solid D pipeline.

Also, if BUF is in a giving mood I'd try and get Rasmus Ristolainen back too (in an altered deal). I've wanted him on the Habs for years.

He provides toughness (not fighting, but toughness) and solid D play that teams like the Rangers need.

Then, I let that team play for the year.

That team (with Mika and Eichel as 1c/2c) is a contender if not favorite in the metro (depending on other off-seasons).

After the season both Mika and Rasmus are UFAs, so you make that work for one year and based on the success (or not) sell at the deadline or figure out how to best manage resources keeping together what you can.

Kreider is a monkey wrench in all these plans, unloading him would be helpful, sadly he's never grown into his potential,

In comment 15308703 pjcas18 said:

Quote:

In comment 15308694 Anakim said: Quote: In comment 15308692 Drewcon40 said: Quote: I know it's an easy comprable because he is also Finnish but I have read that Mikko Rantanen is a good comprable for Kakko. Nothing guaranteed but seems reasonable as a ceiling. Funnily enough, both Lafreniere and Kakko were compared to Rantanen at their respective drafts when they were selected. Were they really? Neither is close to him physically, I can see some similarities - more with Lafreniere and his shot, but I think there are better comps. Rantanen is closer to Jagr/Lindros in size which creates obvious advantages neither Kakko or Lafreniere will ever have unless they hit a late life growth spurt. I think Bergeron is a better comp for both than Rantanen.

My mistake. They compared Kakko to Rantanen the NIGHT BEFORE the Draft and at the Draft, they compared him to Huberdeau. And with Lafreniere, they compared him to BOTH Rantanen and Huberdeau.


It's funny that they both drew the same two comparisons, but Kakko and Lafreniere are pretty dissimilar players.



0:14 mark. - ( New Window )

I'd do that deal, pj.

I suspect the Rangers might need to take a player like Okposo or something like that as well in a deal like that (I think he has a bonus coming up in a week).

In comment 15308691 pjcas18 said: [quote] check out, which I know is a big if, no danger IMO.
Eichel is a top 10 center without question (if healthy)./quote]What you say is true. But 'big ifs' are even bigger when spinal surgery is in play. Then there are the reports I've heard from buddies in Buffalo (think I mentioned this in a thread on the JD/Gorton firing/Drury hiring) that say Eichel is flat out an a-hole. Drury has to pay attention to the development and buy-in from the guys now in the room.

In comment 15308566 averagejoe said:

Quote:

You don't draft a guy number two overall because he can backcheck and is good defensively. He was drafted to score. He has shown very little offensively and is the poster boy for a team that completely lacks grit and toughness. He will be included in a trade as Rangers rebuild their roster.

In comment 15308797 ColHowPepper said:

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In comment 15308691 pjcas18 said: [quote] check out, which I know is a big if, no danger IMO. Eichel is a top 10 center without question (if healthy)./quote]What you say is true. But 'big ifs' are even bigger when spinal surgery is in play. Then there are the reports I've heard from buddies in Buffalo (think I mentioned this in a thread on the JD/Gorton firing/Drury hiring) that say Eichel is flat out an a-hole. Drury has to pay attention to the development and buy-in from the guys now in the room.

That may be true (Eichel is an A-hole). I remember hearing similar things about Patrick Kane. So, if I'm Drury maybe I wouldn't want him (Kane) dating my daughter, but he (Kane) can be my RW any day. Same with Eichel - off ice/locker room very different and more important than public persona and anecdotes - as long as people aren't breaking laws.

I trust Drury would know who is or isn't an a-hole - Drury probably has connections all over the league.

In comment 15308817 pjcas18 said:

Quote:

In comment 15308797 ColHowPepper said: Quote: In comment 15308691 pjcas18 said: [quote] check out, which I know is a big if, no danger IMO. Eichel is a top 10 center without question (if healthy)./quote]What you say is true. But 'big ifs' are even bigger when spinal surgery is in play. Then there are the reports I've heard from buddies in Buffalo (think I mentioned this in a thread on the JD/Gorton firing/Drury hiring) that say Eichel is flat out an a-hole. Drury has to pay attention to the development and buy-in from the guys now in the room. That may be true (Eichel is an A-hole). I remember hearing similar things about Patrick Kane. So, if I'm Drury maybe I wouldn't want him (Kane) dating my daughter, but he (Kane) can be my RW any day. Same with Eichel - off ice/locker room very different and more important than public persona and anecdotes - as long as people aren't breaking laws. I trust Drury would know who is or isn't an a-hole - Drury probably has connections all over the league.

The ironic thing is that Drury fired the guy who knows him quite well from his college days

As usual, well considered stuff, pj.

I haven't read anything in media re. former Wolfpack players during Drury's GM tenure there in reaction to his hiring.

On Drury's playing career, if I ever was aware of this I had certainly forgotten:

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The Nordiques franchise was relocated to Denver, Colorado, in 1995, and renamed the Colorado Avalanche. Drury began his NHL career there in 1998–99. Recording 44 points in his first season, Drury was awarded the Calder Memorial Trophy as the league's top rookie. In so doing, he became the first player in history to have won both the Hobey Baker Award and the Calder Trophy.[10] After a 65-point season in 2000–01, Drury won the Stanley Cup with the Avalanche, adding 16 points in the playoffs. Drury became a fan favorite with the Avalanche crowd primarily due to his clutch play during playoffs. He had a total of 11 game-winning goals in four straight playoff seasons in Colorado. Avalanche captain Joe Sakic once said of Drury, "You want a goal, you're in overtime – you want him."[3][11] Because of his penchant for game-winning goals, Drury was often referred to as one of the best clutch players in the NHL.

In comment 15308841 ColHowPepper said:

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As usual, well considered stuff, pj. I haven't read anything in media re. former Wolfpack players during Drury's GM tenure there in reaction to his hiring. On Drury's playing career, if I ever was aware of this I had certainly forgotten: Quote: The Nordiques franchise was relocated to Denver, Colorado, in 1995, and renamed the Colorado Avalanche. Drury began his NHL career there in 1998–99. Recording 44 points in his first season, Drury was awarded the Calder Memorial Trophy as the league's top rookie. In so doing, he became the first player in history to have won both the Hobey Baker Award and the Calder Trophy.[10] After a 65-point season in 2000–01, Drury won the Stanley Cup with the Avalanche, adding 16 points in the playoffs. Drury became a fan favorite with the Avalanche crowd primarily due to his clutch play during playoffs. He had a total of 11 game-winning goals in four straight playoff seasons in Colorado. Avalanche captain Joe Sakic once said of Drury, "You want a goal, you're in overtime – you want him."[3][11] Because of his penchant for game-winning goals, Drury was often referred to as one of the best clutch players in the NHL.

It was big news in CT, from Trumbull CT little league world series champion pitcher at 12 to hobey baker, calder, and SC playoff winner, the guy was just a winner.

Peaked early as a player, was always consistent and a guy you wanted on your team, but just not the star some people expected after the early success.

Andy Strickland
@andystrickland

Won’t be easy to pry Pavel Buchnevich away from the #NYR but #stlblues among those with serious interest. 20 goals and nearly a point per game this past season.

I wouldn't deal Buch. Yes, there are holes on this team. But you don't deal young, dynamic emerging players who continue to improve year over year. He's also one of our best PK forwards.

He's really come into his own. I don't get the point of dealing him.

for Nick Deslauriers. If that happens, that would probably go down as the worst trade ever made. Like legitimately.

In comment 15308998 Anakim said:

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for Nick Deslauriers. If that happens, that would probably go down as the worst trade ever made. Like legitimately.

LOL that has to be a joke. Didn't he retire? or was sent to the AHL?

abysmal post by averagejoe.

Let's pray Drury isn't that dumb.

In comment 15309000 pjcas18 said:

Quote:

In comment 15308998 Anakim said: Quote: for Nick Deslauriers. If that happens, that would probably go down as the worst trade ever made. Like legitimately. LOL that has to be a joke. Didn't he retire? or was sent to the AHL?

No clue. But it would actually be the worst trade ever made. A first round pick for a 4th line goon.
Link - ( New Window )

In comment 15309000 pjcas18 said:

Quote:

In comment 15308998 Anakim said: Quote: for Nick Deslauriers. If that happens, that would probably go down as the worst trade ever made. Like legitimately. LOL that has to be a joke. Didn't he retire? or was sent to the AHL?

We're the Rangers. We are going to be linked to everybody for clicks. Also if you go on hockey forums like HFBoards every rumor about us making a bad deal attracts a bunch of haters lighting up at the thought.

See below:

https://hfboards.mandatory.com/threads/zach-hyman-to-nyr.2834673/

In comment 15309008 drake88 said:

Quote:

In comment 15309000 pjcas18 said: Quote: In comment 15308998 Anakim said: Quote: for Nick Deslauriers. If that happens, that would probably go down as the worst trade ever made. Like legitimately. LOL that has to be a joke. Didn't he retire? or was sent to the AHL? We're the Rangers. We are going to be linked to everybody for clicks. Also if you go on hockey forums like HFBoards every rumor about us making a bad deal attracts a bunch of haters lighting up at the thought. See below: https://hfboards.mandatory.com/threads/zach-hyman-to-nyr.2834673/

The joys of Sather being around again. Being linked to goons and to every free agent on the market.

In comment 15309012 Anakim said:

Quote:

In comment 15309008 drake88 said: Quote: In comment 15309000 pjcas18 said: Quote: In comment 15308998 Anakim said: Quote: for Nick Deslauriers. If that happens, that would probably go down as the worst trade ever made. Like legitimately. LOL that has to be a joke. Didn't he retire? or was sent to the AHL? We're the Rangers. We are going to be linked to everybody for clicks. Also if you go on hockey forums like HFBoards every rumor about us making a bad deal attracts a bunch of haters lighting up at the thought. See below: https://hfboards.mandatory.com/threads/zach-hyman-to-nyr.2834673/ The joys of Sather being around again. Being linked to goons and to every free agent on the market.

Just ignore it. We haven't done anything stupid yet. Once we do I'll panic. Goodrow was an overpay but that's what the market is. Similar guys like Coleman, Hyman and Danault are all going to get paid too much and given too much term. Would't surprise me if they get 5/6/6.5. Tampa giving up a first for Goodrow was a different sort of overpay as well.

We have decent guys in the pipeline like Culleye, Bedard and Barron who hopefully ensure that is the one and only time we overpay for sandpaper/grit/toughness/whatever you want to call it.