for display only
Big Blue Interactive The Corner Forum  
Back to the Corner

Archived Thread

NFT: Olympics have begun

Big Al : 7/21/2021 8:28 am
Sweden defeats USA 3 to 0 in Women’s football.
not that i want them to lose  
Joey from GlenCove : 7/21/2021 8:29 am : link
but they are so unlikeable
RE: not that i want them to lose  
Bold Ruler : Mod : 7/21/2021 8:35 am : link
In comment 15309299 Joey from GlenCove said:
Quote:
but they are so unlikeable


Really? I enjoy the USWNT a lot. Surprised they got smoked like that.
RE: not that i want them to lose  
KDavies : 7/21/2021 8:35 am : link
In comment 15309299 Joey from GlenCove said:
Quote:
but they are so unlikeable


Agreed
RE: not that i want them to lose  
dpinzow : 7/21/2021 8:38 am : link
In comment 15309299 Joey from GlenCove said:
Quote:
but they are so unlikeable


Why are they unlikeable?
RE: not that i want them to lose  
nygiants16 : 7/21/2021 8:38 am : link
In comment 15309299 Joey from GlenCove said:
Quote:
but they are so unlikeable


agreed
Their propaganda campaign where they are constantly suing  
bhill410 : 7/21/2021 8:41 am : link
The us federation over the fact that fifa pays the men’s teams in World Cup more than the woman’s World Cup is annoying to say the least. 1) the men’s World Cup makes 1000x more (or realistically 50x) and 2) the US federation has zero control over that. Instead you get a bunch of bozos with kids who play soccer hooting and hollering over discrimination which could not be farther from truth.
Rest of the world catching up to the USA women's soccer  
Rick in Dallas : 7/21/2021 8:41 am : link
Women's soccer leagues in Europe very strong now.France,Spain,Italy,Great Britain,Germany and Sweden have very strong women's soccer teams.
USA also has some age at key positions now(Loyld,Morgan,Rapnoe and Heath in their 30's). Time for the young players to step up.
To each their own  
UConn4523 : 7/21/2021 8:44 am : link
but when they were quiet and didn’t say anything everyone loved them. If you dont like Rapinoe, fine, but most of that team isn’t as outspoken.

How can anyone dislike Lavelle or Press or Heath?
RE: RE: not that i want them to lose  
Joey from GlenCove : 7/21/2021 8:45 am : link
In comment 15309304 dpinzow said:
Quote:
In comment 15309299 Joey from GlenCove said:


Quote:


but they are so unlikeable



Why are they unlikeable?


because they publicly mislead and lie about their pay and they have an overt political agenda.

Great team no doubt, best womens team in the world
RE: Their propaganda campaign where they are constantly suing  
robbieballs2003 : 7/21/2021 8:46 am : link
In comment 15309306 bhill410 said:
Quote:
The us federation over the fact that fifa pays the men’s teams in World Cup more than the woman’s World Cup is annoying to say the least. 1) the men’s World Cup makes 1000x more (or realistically 50x) and 2) the US federation has zero control over that. Instead you get a bunch of bozos with kids who play soccer hooting and hollering over discrimination which could not be farther from truth.


Someone on Twitter broke it down. One, the women's team turned down the Men's deal. They wanted more benefits since the men's team gets benefits from their original jobs. Two, the women made more tham the men. The women are focusing on one portion of the contract where if the men won the title they get more money. No shit. The men structures their contract as a pay for play contract. They lost so they didn't get paid. The women's contract was more even distributed so they didn't have to win the gold to make most of their money. They lost in court for a reason. And what they don't like to point out is that they negotiated their contract.
oh!  
I Love Clams Casino : 7/21/2021 8:47 am : link
didn't know....well whaddya know?
I shouldn't say the men's team didn't get paid.  
robbieballs2003 : 7/21/2021 8:47 am : link
They didn't get paid their bonus for winning the gold.
RE: RE: Their propaganda campaign where they are constantly suing  
KDavies : 7/21/2021 8:48 am : link
In comment 15309311 robbieballs2003 said:
Quote:
In comment 15309306 bhill410 said:


Quote:


The us federation over the fact that fifa pays the men’s teams in World Cup more than the woman’s World Cup is annoying to say the least. 1) the men’s World Cup makes 1000x more (or realistically 50x) and 2) the US federation has zero control over that. Instead you get a bunch of bozos with kids who play soccer hooting and hollering over discrimination which could not be farther from truth.



Someone on Twitter broke it down. One, the women's team turned down the Men's deal. They wanted more benefits since the men's team gets benefits from their original jobs. Two, the women made more tham the men. The women are focusing on one portion of the contract where if the men won the title they get more money. No shit. The men structures their contract as a pay for play contract. They lost so they didn't get paid. The women's contract was more even distributed so they didn't have to win the gold to make most of their money. They lost in court for a reason. And what they don't like to point out is that they negotiated their contract.


Exactly. Came on here to type exactly that, but you said it first.

3-0 is a pretty bad loss  
KDavies : 7/21/2021 8:51 am : link
they haven't lost that bad since they played 14 year olds.
RE: 3-0 is a pretty bad loss  
Joey from GlenCove : 7/21/2021 8:56 am : link
In comment 15309317 KDavies said:
Quote:
they haven't lost that bad since they played 14 year olds.


lol i think they were 15
RE: RE: 3-0 is a pretty bad loss  
KDavies : 7/21/2021 9:00 am : link
In comment 15309319 Joey from GlenCove said:
Quote:
In comment 15309317 KDavies said:


Quote:


they haven't lost that bad since they played 14 year olds.



lol i think they were 15


Isn't U-15 14 year olds (and some that turn 15 during the season)? I forget.
RE: To each their own  
Joey from GlenCove : 7/21/2021 9:00 am : link
In comment 15309308 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
but when they were quiet and didn’t say anything everyone loved them. If you dont like Rapinoe, fine, but most of that team isn’t as outspoken.

How can anyone dislike Lavelle or Press or Heath?


It's not about being quiet but they lost in court(appealed) and they are still misleading/lying. their union negotiated the contract. It's more annoying that its always a conversation abt pay as opposed to the game.

not sure if they could get sued but they should boycott/strike if they truly feel this is unfair
I pay more attention to performances than the off the field stuff  
dpinzow : 7/21/2021 9:02 am : link
so I have no reason to dislike them. They just played a poor game today, and everyone has a bad game once in a while
I believe the women's softball team started off with a win  
Jints in Carolina : 7/21/2021 9:02 am : link
.
add to everything  
KDavies : 7/21/2021 9:07 am : link
that they talk about how much more successful they are then the men's team in relation to their ridiculous pay complaints. I tell you one thing, the men's team would beat them handily, let alone a U-15 team.

The reason they are so much more successful than the men's teams? Because for a long time, women in the U.S. have had far more opportunities in sport than women in much of the rest of the world. Yet, they play victim because they signed a contract which had less risk, but less reward, and more security.
Haven’t been paying attention  
joeinpa : 7/21/2021 9:11 am : link
We’re their fans at the game? I m thinking I read someplace there was not going to be fans.

If that s the case, I probably won’t be watching any Olympics. Not a protest, not a political statement, just don t want to go back there.

One of the best things about the NBA finals was seeing the passion, enthusiasm and excitement the fans again.
RE: To each their own  
Stu11 : 7/21/2021 9:12 am : link
In comment 15309308 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
but when they were quiet and didn’t say anything everyone loved them. If you dont like Rapinoe, fine, but most of that team isn’t as outspoken.

How can anyone dislike Lavelle or Press or Heath?

I know right? It is amazing how unpopular women get when they advocate strongly for themselves and their causes. Also the revenue arguement compared to the men is bogus too. As of 2019 women's jersey sales and game revenues out paced the men for the previous 3 years. the tv rights are sold as a package for all us soccer games men and women so it's near impossible to break that revenue down. I agree that the CBA is negotiated and they have a tough leg to stand on there but the game field conditions and accomadations are not equal to the men and they should be. Also the men traditionally have had a much stronger bargaining position. My daughter is a sports nut but hates soccer so this is not about that. I love watching their games and find them fun.
RE: Their propaganda campaign where they are constantly suing  
Zeke's Alibi : 7/21/2021 9:13 am : link
In comment 15309306 bhill410 said:
Quote:
The us federation over the fact that fifa pays the men’s teams in World Cup more than the woman’s World Cup is annoying to say the least. 1) the men’s World Cup makes 1000x more (or realistically 50x) and 2) the US federation has zero control over that. Instead you get a bunch of bozos with kids who play soccer hooting and hollering over discrimination which could not be farther from truth.


Totally agreed. The deal they proposed would have bankrupted US Soccer and you have these dummies that don’t even follow soccer using them as another false example of wage gap.

Whose paying for this litigious behavior? No way the lawyers were working contingent on a win, anyone with half a brain cell saw this ending in a loss 99 percent of the time.

These are just a bunch of women who are mad their sports don’t make as much money as male sports. The deal they had in place was tremendous and exactly why you have seen these older players hold onto their place.

They’ve certainly stifled the growth of the team because young players don’t get call ups. Look at the cap numbers vs the men’s team, it’s crazy! Not surprised that’s finally catching up. They were able to take advantage of the unique title 9 situation here, good for them, but the political nonsense behind their campaign is gross and reeks of greed.
What does the fact that the men's team can beat the women's  
Jim in Forest Hills : 7/21/2021 9:16 am : link
team have anything to do with this?
RE: RE: To each their own  
UConn4523 : 7/21/2021 9:17 am : link
In comment 15309323 Joey from GlenCove said:
Quote:
In comment 15309308 UConn4523 said:


Quote:


but when they were quiet and didn’t say anything everyone loved them. If you dont like Rapinoe, fine, but most of that team isn’t as outspoken.

How can anyone dislike Lavelle or Press or Heath?



It's not about being quiet but they lost in court(appealed) and they are still misleading/lying. their union negotiated the contract. It's more annoying that its always a conversation abt pay as opposed to the game.

not sure if they could get sued but they should boycott/strike if they truly feel this is unfair


You can just ignore it, its really really harmless. Its their business and if this is they route they take, so be it. Doesn't change what happens when they step on the field which is usually high quality soccer.

And just because the union negotiated the contract doesn't mean you have to like it.
RE: RE: RE: To each their own  
Joey from GlenCove : 7/21/2021 9:23 am : link
In comment 15309335 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
In comment 15309323 Joey from GlenCove said:


Quote:


In comment 15309308 UConn4523 said:


Quote:


but when they were quiet and didn’t say anything everyone loved them. If you dont like Rapinoe, fine, but most of that team isn’t as outspoken.

How can anyone dislike Lavelle or Press or Heath?



It's not about being quiet but they lost in court(appealed) and they are still misleading/lying. their union negotiated the contract. It's more annoying that its always a conversation abt pay as opposed to the game.

not sure if they could get sued but they should boycott/strike if they truly feel this is unfair



You can just ignore it, its really really harmless. Its their business and if this is they route they take, so be it. Doesn't change what happens when they step on the field which is usually high quality soccer.

And just because the union negotiated the contract doesn't mean you have to like it.


when it's in your face as a fan its off putting, could just be me. Clearly w/e internal process they used did not work so they made it public. its to the point where this has been an issue for long time and the facts dont favor them.
.  
Jints in Carolina : 7/21/2021 9:24 am : link
Quote:
I know right? It is amazing how unpopular women get when they advocate strongly for themselves and their causes.


What causes? Did you read all the responses here at what really went on?
arrogance humbled  
gtt350 : 7/21/2021 9:24 am : link
.
I am guessing this will break down just like Grey Pilgrim's thread  
sb from NYT Forum : 7/21/2021 9:25 am : link
...
one of the things I hate about the Olympics  
KDavies : 7/21/2021 9:27 am : link
baseball and softball are Olympic sports again for the first time in 13 years, as Japan wanted those sports. They likely won't be Olympic sports in 2024, as from all reports I have read, Paris doesn't plan to have those sports. Presumably because they aren't good at them. That's a pretty dumb way to determine whether sports are in the Olympics or not.
is it really in your face?  
UConn4523 : 7/21/2021 9:28 am : link
I don't want to be that guy but it seems like the tiniest thing bothers a whole lot of people when they can easily just ignore it. If Meghan Rapinoe is talking post game about something I don't want to listen to I'll just turn it off.

Something being in my face would require it to be directed at me specifically. The USWNT took their shot on this and it didn't work out the way they wanted, really not that big of a deal.

As for greed, its everywhere in sports so I get that they wanted their piece of the pie.
RE: What does the fact that the men's team can beat the women's  
NYG22 : 7/21/2021 9:35 am : link
In comment 15309334 Jim in Forest Hills said:
Quote:
team have anything to do with this?


What a weird and stupid comment that was!
eh  
Bill2 : 7/21/2021 9:42 am : link
for me, in just my opinion:

The world is absolutely full of people who construct flimsy and incomplete arguments to get paid more.

Some otherwise delightful people are nuts when it comes to their sense of what they should get paid.

The world is full of people who resent what others get paid and spend a lot of mental energy on their resentment.

Imo, ever be on a team where toughness, defiance, group think was part of the secret sauce of their success? Ever notice its hard to say " we are all getting paid enough" to people half way through an average of a ten year peak pay period - and the most verbally adept and aggressive ones are the ones lobbying the hardest. You dont think the inner dynamics of that team couldnt out do Mean Girls by a factor of 100x?

So I tune it out, once its roughly fair pay, I dont care what they all get paid. Nothing I can do about it. So I just watch it. I like the team and most of the personalities on the field. Some of them are very very good. They play hard, they do a lot of things well a very high percent of the time.

Fact is the USWNT winning percentage is greater than the Yankees, Canadiens, Celtics or Lakers. The UCLA Wooden years or Bill Russell years is the closest I remember. Excellence is fun to watch

So I think the pride on all other issues is well earned.

On pay....if they were really fighting for the sport...the NWSL has to establish itself financially first. Its far from an essential sport or living on the front lines. Its a game. They get adulation and pay to play a game. Enjoy it.

imo
3-0  
Sec 103 : 7/21/2021 9:47 am : link
Embarrassing
RE: RE: What does the fact that the men's team can beat the women's  
KDavies : 7/21/2021 9:49 am : link
In comment 15309351 NYG22 said:
Quote:
In comment 15309334 Jim in Forest Hills said:


Quote:


team have anything to do with this?



What a weird and stupid comment that was!


Lol. It's "weird and stupid" to go bragging as the women's team how much more successful you are than the men's team, when you can't even beat 14/15 year old boy's teams. It's a different sport.

In Europe, South American, the Middle East, and other countries across the world, soccer is THE men's sport, if not one of the most popular. In those countries most of the best athletes play soccer from a young age. Here in the U.S., a lot of the best athletes play basketball, football, baseball, etc.

On the other hand, culturally, it is not as popular for women to play sports in many of those countries as it is in the United States. In some of those countries, women have virtually no rights.

So, in the women comparing their results to the men's results it has been apples to oranges. It's not that hard to understand. The men's team is competing with some of the best athletes in the world that have been in programs developing their talent for decades. The women's team have not been playing the same level of competition within the respective sports. That is a trend that is changing.

 
christian : 7/21/2021 9:51 am : link
Investing personal energy in the labor disputes of athletes is one of the most bizarre pursuits for fans.

Answer this: at the outcome of this dispute, I’m impacted because ______.
Well said..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 7/21/2021 9:51 am : link
Bill.

Getting worked up about athletes tying to maximize their pay seems strange. There is a very small window for them to cash in on their talents and it isn't our money they are taking, so what skin do we have in it to comment?

And the team would be just as good no matter what they are paid because they are competitors. My wife's cousin was the US men's lacrosse goalie for a few years, won a World Championship, and played 12 years in the MLL. Won three titles. All the time, he was working a second job and basically his expenses were covered and he got a couple hundred dollars outside of that a game plus a bonus for winning. He said the most he ever made in a season was $30K. I bet most people don't even know his name - Adam Fullerton. Today, lacrosse is still not that well compensated outside of the very top guys, but that doesn't impact how competitive they are. And if lacrosse players end up getting more money, I'll applaud them instead of jeer.

If lacrose
RE: eh  
Bill L : 7/21/2021 9:53 am : link
In comment 15309360 Bill2 said:
Quote:
for me, in just my opinion:

The world is absolutely full of people who construct flimsy and incomplete arguments to get paid more.

Some otherwise delightful people are nuts when it comes to their sense of what they should get paid.

The world is full of people who resent what others get paid and spend a lot of mental energy on their resentment.

Imo, ever be on a team where toughness, defiance, group think was part of the secret sauce of their success? Ever notice its hard to say " we are all getting paid enough" to people half way through an average of a ten year peak pay period - and the most verbally adept and aggressive ones are the ones lobbying the hardest. You dont think the inner dynamics of that team couldnt out do Mean Girls by a factor of 100x?

So I tune it out, once its roughly fair pay, I dont care what they all get paid. Nothing I can do about it. So I just watch it. I like the team and most of the personalities on the field. Some of them are very very good. They play hard, they do a lot of things well a very high percent of the time.

Fact is the USWNT winning percentage is greater than the Yankees, Canadiens, Celtics or Lakers. The UCLA Wooden years or Bill Russell years is the closest I remember. Excellence is fun to watch

So I think the pride on all other issues is well earned.

On pay....if they were really fighting for the sport...the NWSL has to establish itself financially first. Its far from an essential sport or living on the front lines. Its a game. They get adulation and pay to play a game. Enjoy it.

imo


From Bill Gates on down, I honestly don't give a crap how much other people have or make. I know what I make and if it's not enough to meet my needs I bitch( although TBH, I mostly just readjust me needs). Otherwise, I'm good.

People own yachts and Cesnas; it's not something I waste time thinking about.
There's wanting a bigger piece of the pie, and there's wanting  
Zeke's Alibi : 7/21/2021 9:54 am : link
to bankrupt US Soccer type pay when you already are subsidized by Mens World Cup Money. They used the one year the men didn't make it(which essentially probably won't ever happen again) as their financial argument for unfair pay.

It would be like paying an employee 20 an hour that only produces 15 an hour and they come back to you and say thats not enough, I want 25 an hour. It's ridiculous and obvious to anyone with any iota of sense. I'm generally very pro-worker because they don't have any real leverage generally, but this reeks of greed. They were opportunistic and jumped on the women's rights bandwagon that ebbs and flows. This does a massive disservice to women that are disadvantaged. I'm not sure why it's controversial this doesn't sit well with some people.
the highest paid WNBA players  
KDavies : 7/21/2021 9:57 am : link
make under $225K. The highest paid NBA player is Curry, who makes $43 million. That is a factor of nearly 200x as much pay. It's not news that in the sports industry, there are pay differences between men and women. But there is a reason for this. If the market for the WNBA was the same as it was for the NBA, we would be telling a different story.

In the instance of USMNT and USWNT, the parties signed very different contracts. So the fact that the market demand for the two sports is very different is immaterial. When the USWNT contract is up, they can renegotiate their contract. They may even wind up making more money than the men in that instance, depending on the success of the respective teams.
watching last nights game  
Bill2 : 7/21/2021 9:57 am : link
1) Dunn is not a left back. Very good player but she is playing out of position. She is all around better than others at the position right now...but driving up her side of the field has been a weakness we cant figure out for a couple of years and against good teams it matters. The Brits, French and the Netherland teams tried to do the same thing in the WC tournament.

Ertz in midfield is their MVP. And one of the very best players in the world. When she is out or injured a differentiating strength of the team becomes a crippling weakness on defense and offense. She played in the second half and the improvement in movement and organization was clear.

Morgan and Lloyd are not good enough distributors or defenders. I have never liked Lloyds game. Morgan is a winger that is effective against some styles and teams and a weakness when the other team plays back and plays defense well. She doesnt appear to be as fast as she used to be and speed was a big factor in her success in the past.

I dont think there are younger players that are better but not on the team. As sports goes it seems a meritocracy viewed over a two and a half decade span
RE: …  
KDavies : 7/21/2021 10:01 am : link
In comment 15309365 christian said:
Quote:
Investing personal energy in the labor disputes of athletes is one of the most bizarre pursuits for fans.

Answer this: at the outcome of this dispute, I’m impacted because ______.


I agree with you for the most part. I don't give a shit what someone makes. Nobody here gives a shit either. What they do care about is the false narrative that was perpetuated that is part of a larger false narrative. The women signed a contract, and as it worked out, they were paid less than the men were because of how the contract was constructed.
RE: To each their own  
bigblue5611 : 7/21/2021 10:05 am : link
In comment 15309308 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
but when they were quiet and didn’t say anything everyone loved them. If you dont like Rapinoe, fine, but most of that team isn’t as outspoken.

How can anyone dislike Lavelle or Press or Heath?


Love me some Alex Morgan
RE: There's wanting a bigger piece of the pie, and there's wanting  
UConn4523 : 7/21/2021 10:05 am : link
In comment 15309371 Zeke's Alibi said:
Quote:
to bankrupt US Soccer type pay when you already are subsidized by Mens World Cup Money. They used the one year the men didn't make it(which essentially probably won't ever happen again) as their financial argument for unfair pay.

It would be like paying an employee 20 an hour that only produces 15 an hour and they come back to you and say thats not enough, I want 25 an hour. It's ridiculous and obvious to anyone with any iota of sense. I'm generally very pro-worker because they don't have any real leverage generally, but this reeks of greed. They were opportunistic and jumped on the women's rights bandwagon that ebbs and flows. This does a massive disservice to women that are disadvantaged. I'm not sure why it's controversial this doesn't sit well with some people.


I think its a reasonable take, I just wouldn't be appalled by it like some seem to be. Labor disputes get ugly, and usually its because of greed on one or both sides. And they are also responsible for bringing a lot of positive conversations to light which I think is often glossed over.
...  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 7/21/2021 10:08 am : link
I would pay $ just to watch Alex Morgan read a phonebook. She's a smokeshow.
eh...boy.  
wigs in nyc : 7/21/2021 10:13 am : link
I ignore so much about what I like so that I can still like it.

It's sort of amazing to me the way politics (or more like perceived 'not-my-tribe' identifications) can stick in people's craw so easily. First to admit, it happens to me, too.

In my case I've tried to be more aware of it, and have found it tempering, and look for commonalities, and they're there.

In the same breath can we really bitch about socialism or marxism or whatever scary word of the day today, and also at the same time people fighting for their share of the pie - however slanted the attempt.

We're all Americans, ya'll. Get the gold.
RE: ...  
Jints in Carolina : 7/21/2021 10:21 am : link
In comment 15309380 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
Quote:
I would pay $ just to watch Alex Morgan read a phonebook. She's a smokeshow.


yes sir
RE: RE: There's wanting a bigger piece of the pie, and there's wanting  
Zeke's Alibi : 7/21/2021 10:25 am : link
In comment 15309378 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
In comment 15309371 Zeke's Alibi said:


Quote:


to bankrupt US Soccer type pay when you already are subsidized by Mens World Cup Money. They used the one year the men didn't make it(which essentially probably won't ever happen again) as their financial argument for unfair pay.

It would be like paying an employee 20 an hour that only produces 15 an hour and they come back to you and say thats not enough, I want 25 an hour. It's ridiculous and obvious to anyone with any iota of sense. I'm generally very pro-worker because they don't have any real leverage generally, but this reeks of greed. They were opportunistic and jumped on the women's rights bandwagon that ebbs and flows. This does a massive disservice to women that are disadvantaged. I'm not sure why it's controversial this doesn't sit well with some people.



I think its a reasonable take, I just wouldn't be appalled by it like some seem to be. Labor disputes get ugly, and usually its because of greed on one or both sides. And they are also responsible for bringing a lot of positive conversations to light which I think is often glossed over.


I'm a big USMNT fan and the way they wanted to structure it would bankrupt US Soccer, it was preposterous. Even if they were forced to come to a settlement, it would have really hurt the Men's side. A side that already subsidizes their wages. It isn't like they are destitute. Shit they have 75% paid maternity leave for a year in a career that completely matches with child-rearing age!

Then you have to listen to this preposterous narrative that the women aren't paid fairly that's completely disingenuous. People protesting outside events and that ridiculous HBO doc that has a 100 percent on Rotten Tomatoes. It's annoying and an acute example of a larger problem and it has become a larger talking point whether people want to hear it or not. I mean the President weighed in with his misinformed opinion as a way to curry political favor. It's just fucking annoying at this point.
Good God you guys are slow  
Bricktop : 7/21/2021 10:26 am : link
Soccer players always been the hottest female athletes IMO.  
Zeke's Alibi : 7/21/2021 10:28 am : link
Alex Morgan is unbelievable.
RE: Soccer players always been the hottest female athletes IMO.  
KDavies : 7/21/2021 10:36 am : link
In comment 15309395 Zeke's Alibi said:
Quote:
Alex Morgan is unbelievable.


That said, I hope you're not looking forward to Megan Rapinoe modeling for Victoria's Secret
It has nothing to do with politics but it’s been  
bhill410 : 7/21/2021 10:41 am : link
A purposeful campaign to mislead folks (see stu) snd as a result has caused folks to allege discrimination when there is none. I don’t enjoy seeing entities attempt to maximize revenue but sowing what are essentially lies regarding societal actions. Their actions have more ramifications than simply what xyz athlete gets paid.
RE: RE: Soccer players always been the hottest female athletes IMO.  
Bricktop : 7/21/2021 10:50 am : link
In comment 15309401 KDavies said:
Quote:
In comment 15309395 Zeke's Alibi said:


Quote:


Alex Morgan is unbelievable.



That said, I hope you're not looking forward to Megan Rapinoe modeling for Victoria's Secret


Or Hope Solo's mud flaps. Yikes.
RE: RE: RE: Soccer players always been the hottest female athletes IMO.  
KDavies : 7/21/2021 10:55 am : link
In comment 15309411 Bricktop said:
Quote:
In comment 15309401 KDavies said:


Quote:


In comment 15309395 Zeke's Alibi said:


Quote:


Alex Morgan is unbelievable.



That said, I hope you're not looking forward to Megan Rapinoe modeling for Victoria's Secret



Or Hope Solo's mud flaps. Yikes.


Now I'm thinking Arby's for lunch...
RE: RE: Soccer players always been the hottest female athletes IMO.  
Jim in Fairfax : 7/21/2021 11:03 am : link
In comment 15309401 KDavies said:
Quote:
In comment 15309395 Zeke's Alibi said:


Quote:


Alex Morgan is unbelievable.



That said, I hope you're not looking forward to Megan Rapinoe modeling for Victoria's Secret


RE: It has nothing to do with politics but it’s been  
Stu11 : 7/21/2021 11:04 am : link
In comment 15309404 bhill410 said:
Quote:
A purposeful campaign to mislead folks (see stu) snd as a result has caused folks to allege discrimination when there is none. I don’t enjoy seeing entities attempt to maximize revenue but sowing what are essentially lies regarding societal actions. Their actions have more ramifications than simply what xyz athlete gets paid.

Believe me there are many ways to look at the pay structure here as well as the working conditions. How about the guys in here who readily parrot the male/female revenue disparity argument comparing it to basketball when it hasn't applied with soccer for at least 5 years? They are misinformed. I said the cba is the problem for them and the court agreed. As for women's issues in general they have gotten the short end of the stick for generations. Anything that helps change that is good and whether you agree or don't like it this issue helps.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Soccer players always been the hottest female athletes IMO.  
Bricktop : 7/21/2021 11:08 am : link
In comment 15309414 KDavies said:
Quote:
In comment 15309411 Bricktop said:


Quote:


In comment 15309401 KDavies said:


Quote:


In comment 15309395 Zeke's Alibi said:


Quote:


Alex Morgan is unbelievable.



That said, I hope you're not looking forward to Megan Rapinoe modeling for Victoria's Secret



Or Hope Solo's mud flaps. Yikes.



Now I'm thinking Arby's for lunch...


All beef. Hold the cheddar.
who cares?  
Paulie Walnuts : 7/21/2021 11:17 am : link
I used to love the summer Olympics..now, Meh. Giants starting in less than a week
RE: who cares?  
UConn4523 : 7/21/2021 11:23 am : link
In comment 15309425 Paulie Walnuts said:
Quote:
I used to love the summer Olympics..now, Meh. Giants starting in less than a week


Plenty of people and I'm looking forward to watching it. The Giants don't play their first preseason game until mid- August, what exactly are you watching them do?
So the USWNT  
Ron Johnson : 7/21/2021 11:40 am : link
basically has 2 must win games now ..... is that right?
RE: So the USWNT  
Stu11 : 7/21/2021 11:45 am : link
In comment 15309435 Ron Johnson said:
Quote:
basically has 2 must win games now ..... is that right?

Yeah either way they'll have a tough quarter. Frankly as dominant as they've been since 2000 the past 8 years is a whole new level because they has never won back to back WC's and Olympics. So it wouldn't be a shock if they dont win gold here.
RE: RE: It has nothing to do with politics but it’s been  
Zeke's Alibi : 7/21/2021 11:53 am : link
In comment 15309418 Stu11 said:
Quote:
In comment 15309404 bhill410 said:


Quote:


A purposeful campaign to mislead folks (see stu) snd as a result has caused folks to allege discrimination when there is none. I don’t enjoy seeing entities attempt to maximize revenue but sowing what are essentially lies regarding societal actions. Their actions have more ramifications than simply what xyz athlete gets paid.


Believe me there are many ways to look at the pay structure here as well as the working conditions. How about the guys in here who readily parrot the male/female revenue disparity argument comparing it to basketball when it hasn't applied with soccer for at least 5 years? They are misinformed. I said the cba is the problem for them and the court agreed. As for women's issues in general they have gotten the short end of the stick for generations. Anything that helps change that is good and whether you agree or don't like it this issue helps.


How are there many ways to look at the pay strucute as well as working conditions? They take in a larger percentage of their gate than the men do and are treated more like full time employees (with all the benefits than the mens side (which are essentially treated like independant contractors). They get

The woman's argument is essentially we win world cups so we deserve more money, which is asinine. They've based their legal argument around a cherry picked year in which the men played almost no games because they missed the world cup(a rare occurence).

This is a legal battle that has gone on for years now and I really want to know who is paying the women's lawyers. This is money that can be used to grow the game in America.

They've stifled the women's pro league because they didn't want the competition internationally. These aren't what I'd consider selfless role models like they are often portrayed.

The whole argument from the CBA perspective is interesting as well. They've really killed the competition for spots and probably why you are seeing them struggle recently. They are getting old, but the way its structured, it's hard to get young talent in because of severance deals. Just look at the cap numbers, they are unreal in the discrepancy. Making the USWNT is like getting a good government job.

There's really no excuse for the women not to play in the finals for the next 3 cycles (until the rest of the world catches up - and efforts have started) and yet I feel like there is a good chance we see them miss the finals the next time up.

The fact of the matter is the women were offered the same deal as the men and turned it down. Why? Because their current deal is better than the men's side. Their whole argument is we win world cups so we deserve more, which is asinine. Trying to use the women's pay gap and sexism in this argument when it's really just about specific women (fuck the rest of them) rubs people the wrong way. They had a chance to really grow the women's game professionally and turned their back on it. Not faulting them for it, but it is what it is. Don't expect everyone to be selfless heroes, but do have a problem when they are portrayed like that.
RE: RE: What does the fact that the men's team can beat the women's  
DCGMan : 7/21/2021 11:53 am : link
In comment 15309351 NYG22 said:
Quote:
In comment 15309334 Jim in Forest Hills said:


Quote:


team have anything to do with this?



What a weird and stupid comment that was!


When it comes to watchability?

Level of play. The top women in the world suck compared men's and advanced boys' teams. The women's team, arguably a top 3 women's side in the world, lost to a U-15 Dallas boys academy team in 2017.

Removing national team affiliation, why would I want to watch that? Their quality is far inferior to MLS academy, men's college, professional men's leagues, and men's national teams. Throw in the men's team as well. If I wasn't American, why would I watch them? I like Reyna, Dest, McKennie, and Pulisic, but they wouldn't be must watch if I wasn't American. Hopefully, Reyna can develop into a must watch player.

I tune into the USMNT and USWNT, because they represent the USA. I can only watch the semis/finals of women's soccer. I watch USMNT qualifying and major tournaments. The last qualifying cycle was hard to watch.

I wish the women's game the best, but their best product is far inferior to average and best men's products. I'd rather watch La Liga, EPL, CL and men's national team tournaments like WC, Euro, and Copa America.
RE: I believe the women's softball team started off with a win  
Matt M. : 7/21/2021 11:58 am : link
In comment 15309326 Jints in Carolina said:
Quote:
.
2-0 with Kat Osterman returning and pitching 6 innings of shutout ball.
RE: It has nothing to do with politics but it’s been  
Matt M. : 7/21/2021 12:01 pm : link
In comment 15309404 bhill410 said:
Quote:
A purposeful campaign to mislead folks (see stu) snd as a result has caused folks to allege discrimination when there is none. I don’t enjoy seeing entities attempt to maximize revenue but sowing what are essentially lies regarding societal actions. Their actions have more ramifications than simply what xyz athlete gets paid.
What exactly is misleading? On one hand, they do have a negotiated contract. But, they had little choice to agree. It's that or not play the game they love and are the best in the world at. They aren't even arguing to be paid because they are the best. They are arguing that they sell more tickets and merchandise and have a larger following than their US male counterparts, to go along with WAY more success than their counterparts, yet their pay, accommodations, etc. are all inferior. That is a reasonable argument, in my opinion.
RE: RE: RE: What does the fact that the men's team can beat the women's  
Matt M. : 7/21/2021 12:03 pm : link
In comment 15309448 DCGMan said:
Quote:
In comment 15309351 NYG22 said:


Quote:


In comment 15309334 Jim in Forest Hills said:


Quote:


team have anything to do with this?



What a weird and stupid comment that was!



When it comes to watchability?

Level of play. The top women in the world suck compared men's and advanced boys' teams. The women's team, arguably a top 3 women's side in the world, lost to a U-15 Dallas boys academy team in 2017.

Removing national team affiliation, why would I want to watch that? Their quality is far inferior to MLS academy, men's college, professional men's leagues, and men's national teams. Throw in the men's team as well. If I wasn't American, why would I watch them? I like Reyna, Dest, McKennie, and Pulisic, but they wouldn't be must watch if I wasn't American. Hopefully, Reyna can develop into a must watch player.

I tune into the USMNT and USWNT, because they represent the USA. I can only watch the semis/finals of women's soccer. I watch USMNT qualifying and major tournaments. The last qualifying cycle was hard to watch.

I wish the women's game the best, but their best product is far inferior to average and best men's products. I'd rather watch La Liga, EPL, CL and men's national team tournaments like WC, Euro, and Copa America.
DC - I don't agree with that. Whether they can beat the men's team or any other men's team is irrelevant. Their team in comparison to other women's national teams is what's important. Those games, I find, fun and exciting to watch and they are the best in the world at it.
RE: RE: It has nothing to do with politics but it’s been  
Matt M. : 7/21/2021 12:13 pm : link
In comment 15309457 Matt M. said:
Quote:
In comment 15309404 bhill410 said:


Quote:


A purposeful campaign to mislead folks (see stu) snd as a result has caused folks to allege discrimination when there is none. I don’t enjoy seeing entities attempt to maximize revenue but sowing what are essentially lies regarding societal actions. Their actions have more ramifications than simply what xyz athlete gets paid.

What exactly is misleading? On one hand, they do have a negotiated contract. But, they had little choice to agree. It's that or not play the game they love and are the best in the world at. They aren't even arguing to be paid because they are the best. They are arguing that they sell more tickets and merchandise and have a larger following than their US male counterparts, to go along with WAY more success than their counterparts, yet their pay, accommodations, etc. are all inferior. That is a reasonable argument, in my opinion.
Saw a couple of posts up earlier in this thread and will look into it further. My understanding was they had a beef with the US governing body; I was not aware of anything to do with FIFA. Again, my understanding was stritly for participation on the US team, they received less pay and lesser accommodations (including training facilities and the like).

Just reading some of the Tweets from US Soccer is interesting.
RE: RE: RE: What does the fact that the men's team can beat the women's  
Jim in Forest Hills : 7/21/2021 12:13 pm : link
In comment 15309448 DCGMan said:
Quote:
In comment 15309351 NYG22 said:


Quote:


In comment 15309334 Jim in Forest Hills said:


Quote:


team have anything to do with this?



What a weird and stupid comment that was!



When it comes to watchability?

Level of play. The top women in the world suck compared men's and advanced boys' teams. The women's team, arguably a top 3 women's side in the world, lost to a U-15 Dallas boys academy team in 2017.

Removing national team affiliation, why would I want to watch that? Their quality is far inferior to MLS academy, men's college, professional men's leagues, and men's national teams. Throw in the men's team as well. If I wasn't American, why would I watch them? I like Reyna, Dest, McKennie, and Pulisic, but they wouldn't be must watch if I wasn't American. Hopefully, Reyna can develop into a must watch player.

I tune into the USMNT and USWNT, because they represent the USA. I can only watch the semis/finals of women's soccer. I watch USMNT qualifying and major tournaments. The last qualifying cycle was hard to watch.

I wish the women's game the best, but their best product is far inferior to average and best men's products. I'd rather watch La Liga, EPL, CL and men's national team tournaments like WC, Euro, and Copa America.


I just have a different view I guess as a casual Soccer fan. The USWNT is the team I want to watch, they are the draw. I watch their friendlies. I dont watch any of the Mens games. and I think what I'm watching is the best women in the world playing aka the level of play is the highest possible for women. But I also really enjoyed the Women's March Madness this year so maybe I'm weird.

Do you not watch March Madness because its not the NBA? Even though its the best college teams?
their product is absolutely not inferior  
UConn4523 : 7/21/2021 12:31 pm : link
you may enjoy watching the Men play more (I do too) but I don't equate that with it being higher quality.

Look at UConn Women vs. Men - there's no question who's the more skillful team and the quality of play is a glaring and obvious example.
surprising to me  
TJ : 7/21/2021 12:54 pm : link
I had no idea so many sports fans harbored such a deep personal butthurt over the financial side of women's sports.
RE: surprising to me  
Matt M. : 7/21/2021 1:41 pm : link
In comment 15309509 TJ said:
Quote:
I had no idea so many sports fans harbored such a deep personal butthurt over the financial side of women's sports.
Butthurt? Hardly. In fact, most aren't even champions for women's sports in general. In most cases, the women's sport is less watched and generates less revenue. In this particular case, and only in terms of the national teams, the women's product is far superior. They have far more success for a sustained period of time (decades) and they do generate more revenue and interest.
RE: RE: surprising to me  
Matt M. : 7/21/2021 1:46 pm : link
In comment 15309548 Matt M. said:
Quote:
In comment 15309509 TJ said:


Quote:


I had no idea so many sports fans harbored such a deep personal butthurt over the financial side of women's sports.

Butthurt? Hardly. In fact, most aren't even champions for women's sports in general. In most cases, the women's sport is less watched and generates less revenue. In this particular case, and only in terms of the national teams, the women's product is far superior. They have far more success for a sustained period of time (decades) and they do generate more revenue and interest.
That said, I do retract my earlier comments about their suit. It does appear they are misrepresenting their situation through the media and the current contract, which they requested and signed is not only fair, but guarantees them more money than the men. Yes, technically the men will get more money per game if they play and more if they win, but they get no money if they don't play.

If I understand it correctly, the USWNT members not only generate a six figure salary + benefits whether they play or not, but they also receive a near six figure salary guaranteed by US Soccer for playing in the NWSL. So, for example, during COVID lockdowns, when no games were played, they were receiving paychecks every 2 weeks plus benefits, while their male counterparts received nothing. Do I have this correct?
Grown men getting all worked up  
PwndPapi : 7/21/2021 1:49 pm : link
because a team of successful female athletes want to get paid and it doesn't jibe with their political leanings. What a shocker.
RE: RE: RE: surprising to me  
KDavies : 7/21/2021 1:58 pm : link
In comment 15309551 Matt M. said:
Quote:
In comment 15309548 Matt M. said:


Quote:


In comment 15309509 TJ said:


Quote:


I had no idea so many sports fans harbored such a deep personal butthurt over the financial side of women's sports.

Butthurt? Hardly. In fact, most aren't even champions for women's sports in general. In most cases, the women's sport is less watched and generates less revenue. In this particular case, and only in terms of the national teams, the women's product is far superior. They have far more success for a sustained period of time (decades) and they do generate more revenue and interest.

That said, I do retract my earlier comments about their suit. It does appear they are misrepresenting their situation through the media and the current contract, which they requested and signed is not only fair, but guarantees them more money than the men. Yes, technically the men will get more money per game if they play and more if they win, but they get no money if they don't play.

If I understand it correctly, the USWNT members not only generate a six figure salary + benefits whether they play or not, but they also receive a near six figure salary guaranteed by US Soccer for playing in the NWSL. So, for example, during COVID lockdowns, when no games were played, they were receiving paychecks every 2 weeks plus benefits, while their male counterparts received nothing. Do I have this correct?


Don't exactly remember the numbers, but this seems to jive with my recollection. I followed it quite a bit as I deal with employment discrimination in my work quite a bit.

In short, the women wanted more security and benefits. The men usually got that in their regular soccer jobs, overseas or MLS.

RE: RE: RE: RE: surprising to me  
Matt M. : 7/21/2021 2:13 pm : link
In comment 15309566 KDavies said:
Quote:
In comment 15309551 Matt M. said:


Quote:


In comment 15309548 Matt M. said:


Quote:


In comment 15309509 TJ said:


Quote:


I had no idea so many sports fans harbored such a deep personal butthurt over the financial side of women's sports.

Butthurt? Hardly. In fact, most aren't even champions for women's sports in general. In most cases, the women's sport is less watched and generates less revenue. In this particular case, and only in terms of the national teams, the women's product is far superior. They have far more success for a sustained period of time (decades) and they do generate more revenue and interest.

That said, I do retract my earlier comments about their suit. It does appear they are misrepresenting their situation through the media and the current contract, which they requested and signed is not only fair, but guarantees them more money than the men. Yes, technically the men will get more money per game if they play and more if they win, but they get no money if they don't play.

If I understand it correctly, the USWNT members not only generate a six figure salary + benefits whether they play or not, but they also receive a near six figure salary guaranteed by US Soccer for playing in the NWSL. So, for example, during COVID lockdowns, when no games were played, they were receiving paychecks every 2 weeks plus benefits, while their male counterparts received nothing. Do I have this correct?



Don't exactly remember the numbers, but this seems to jive with my recollection. I followed it quite a bit as I deal with employment discrimination in my work quite a bit.

In short, the women wanted more security and benefits. The men usually got that in their regular soccer jobs, overseas or MLS.
But, it sounds like they have that security and benefits now.
when the contract was renegotiated in 2017  
KDavies : 7/21/2021 2:20 pm : link
the women turned down the pay-for-play. Whether circumstances/goals have changed, they may decide differently when the next contract is up. But dishonestly playing victim the way they have is a bizarre way to go about things.

RE: RE: who cares?  
Paulie Walnuts : 7/21/2021 2:48 pm : link
In comment 15309430 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
In comment 15309425 Paulie Walnuts said:


Quote:


I used to love the summer Olympics..now, Meh. Giants starting in less than a week



Plenty of people and I'm looking forward to watching it. The Giants don't play their first preseason game until mid- August, what exactly are you watching them do?


I'll watch the Golf portion. The rest? naw too much bullshit Im out
...  
christian : 7/21/2021 2:50 pm : link
They've extracted major concessions on the conditions and accommodations front, received a written apology and retraction on the equal skill argument, and most importantly have won in the court of public opinion.

Seems like expert strategizing as they go into the next round of collective bargaining.

I think this falls under the legal statute of don't hate the player, hate the game.
RE: ...  
Zeke's Alibi : 7/21/2021 2:58 pm : link
In comment 15309621 christian said:
Quote:
They've extracted major concessions on the conditions and accommodations front, received a written apology and retraction on the equal skill argument, and most importantly have won in the court of public opinion.

Seems like expert strategizing as they go into the next round of collective bargaining.

I think this falls under the legal statute of don't hate the player, hate the game.


What I take issue with is all this legal representation is expensive and taking away from the coffers to develop the game locally. I really don't think the average person understands how soccer is financed in this country since its unlike any other sport.

I certainly hate the player and the game in this aspect. Doing shitty things for money, still makes you shitty. In fact, it makes you even shittier imo.
What is lost on most making the snide comments  
bhill410 : 7/21/2021 2:59 pm : link
Is that I would never begrudge them for trying to make as much as possible for being the best at what they do. They however have done it is a completely deplorable manner where they frankly have lied and accused a bunch of people of being discriminatory when that simply wasn’t the case. IMO it’s reprehensible to make people look bigoted so that you have a stronger negotiating opinion and detrimental to society.
RE: RE: ...  
giants#1 : 7/21/2021 3:09 pm : link
In comment 15309627 Zeke's Alibi said:
Quote:
In comment 15309621 christian said:


Quote:


They've extracted major concessions on the conditions and accommodations front, received a written apology and retraction on the equal skill argument, and most importantly have won in the court of public opinion.

Seems like expert strategizing as they go into the next round of collective bargaining.

I think this falls under the legal statute of don't hate the player, hate the game.



What I take issue with is all this legal representation is expensive and taking away from the coffers to develop the game locally. I really don't think the average person understands how soccer is financed in this country since its unlike any other sport.

I certainly hate the player and the game in this aspect. Doing shitty things for money, still makes you shitty. In fact, it makes you even shittier imo.


Wouldn't legal fees come out of the Woman's team union fees?

And I bet the US soccer federation (or whatever they're called) already has an internal team of lawyers on staff. How much extra in legal fees do you think they're paying?
RE: RE: ...  
KDavies : 7/21/2021 3:09 pm : link
In comment 15309627 Zeke's Alibi said:
Quote:
In comment 15309621 christian said:


Quote:


They've extracted major concessions on the conditions and accommodations front, received a written apology and retraction on the equal skill argument, and most importantly have won in the court of public opinion.

Seems like expert strategizing as they go into the next round of collective bargaining.

I think this falls under the legal statute of don't hate the player, hate the game.



What I take issue with is all this legal representation is expensive and taking away from the coffers to develop the game locally. I really don't think the average person understands how soccer is financed in this country since its unlike any other sport.

I certainly hate the player and the game in this aspect. Doing shitty things for money, still makes you shitty. In fact, it makes you even shittier imo.


Well said. And from my perspective who represents workers (include many who are exploited - illegal immigrants, etc.), and deals with employment discrimination issues on a frequent basis, I find their behavior particularly reprehensible. It's just like women who cry rape when there is none. I don't understand the "well, it's bringing attention to issue attitude." Yes, and it's being shown to be a farce, and indirectly harming the credibility of those who have been actually harmed in similar situations.
In my experience most will bitch  
LakeGeorgeGiant : 7/21/2021 3:20 pm : link
about "political agendas" only when those agendas don't align with their own beliefs. It's bullshit.


RE: RE: RE: not that i want them to lose  
Gatorade Dunk : 7/21/2021 5:00 pm : link
In comment 15309309 Joey from GlenCove said:
Quote:
In comment 15309304 dpinzow said:


Quote:


In comment 15309299 Joey from GlenCove said:


Quote:


but they are so unlikeable



Why are they unlikeable?



because they publicly mislead and lie about their pay and they have an overt political agenda.

Great team no doubt, best womens team in the world

So they don't get paid less than their male counterparts? Is that the lie?
RE: RE: RE: ...  
Zeke's Alibi : 7/21/2021 5:07 pm : link
In comment 15309636 giants#1 said:
Quote:
In comment 15309627 Zeke's Alibi said:


Quote:


In comment 15309621 christian said:


Quote:


They've extracted major concessions on the conditions and accommodations front, received a written apology and retraction on the equal skill argument, and most importantly have won in the court of public opinion.

Seems like expert strategizing as they go into the next round of collective bargaining.

I think this falls under the legal statute of don't hate the player, hate the game.



What I take issue with is all this legal representation is expensive and taking away from the coffers to develop the game locally. I really don't think the average person understands how soccer is financed in this country since its unlike any other sport.

I certainly hate the player and the game in this aspect. Doing shitty things for money, still makes you shitty. In fact, it makes you even shittier imo.



Wouldn't legal fees come out of the Woman's team union fees?

And I bet the US soccer federation (or whatever they're called) already has an internal team of lawyers on staff. How much extra in legal fees do you think they're paying?


They are going to hand the bill over to US Soccer at the next CBA, guarantee it. No way that is coming out of their pay right now, don't think they could even afford it. This lawsuit is going on for years now. Which makes them even more unlikeable.
......  
Route 9 : 7/21/2021 5:13 pm : link
Great job, ladies. Hey maybe one of them can be our starting quarterback now? I'm sure they're all tougher than Evan engram LOL
RE: Grown men getting all worked up  
Route 9 : 7/21/2021 5:20 pm : link
In comment 15309553 PwndPapi said:
Quote:
because a team of successful female athletes want to get paid and it doesn't jibe with their political leanings. What a shocker.


No way man, equality. Excluding the women from any criticism or any fun joking around is indeed sexist.
RE: RE: RE: RE: What does the fact that the men's team can beat the women's  
DCGMan : 7/21/2021 6:39 pm : link
In comment 15309472 Jim in Forest Hills said:
Quote:
In comment 15309448 DCGMan said:


Quote:


In comment 15309351 NYG22 said:


Quote:


In comment 15309334 Jim in Forest Hills said:


Quote:


team have anything to do with this?



What a weird and stupid comment that was!



When it comes to watchability?

Level of play. The top women in the world suck compared men's and advanced boys' teams. The women's team, arguably a top 3 women's side in the world, lost to a U-15 Dallas boys academy team in 2017.

Removing national team affiliation, why would I want to watch that? Their quality is far inferior to MLS academy, men's college, professional men's leagues, and men's national teams. Throw in the men's team as well. If I wasn't American, why would I watch them? I like Reyna, Dest, McKennie, and Pulisic, but they wouldn't be must watch if I wasn't American. Hopefully, Reyna can develop into a must watch player.

I tune into the USMNT and USWNT, because they represent the USA. I can only watch the semis/finals of women's soccer. I watch USMNT qualifying and major tournaments. The last qualifying cycle was hard to watch.

I wish the women's game the best, but their best product is far inferior to average and best men's products. I'd rather watch La Liga, EPL, CL and men's national team tournaments like WC, Euro, and Copa America.



I just have a different view I guess as a casual Soccer fan. The USWNT is the team I want to watch, they are the draw. I watch their friendlies. I dont watch any of the Mens games. and I think what I'm watching is the best women in the world playing aka the level of play is the highest possible for women. But I also really enjoyed the Women's March Madness this year so maybe I'm weird.

Do you not watch March Madness because its not the NBA? Even though its the best college teams?


The only college sports games I watch involve my school.
 
christian : 7/21/2021 6:42 pm : link
In comment 15309727 Zeke's Alibi said:
Quote:
They are going to hand the bill over to US Soccer at the next CBA, guarantee it. No way that is coming out of their pay right now, don't think they could even afford it. This lawsuit is going on for years now. Which makes them even more unlikeable.


Not that fees aren’t substantial, but I think you’re overestimating the cost of outside counsel for US soccer. This isn’t a a league bankrupting type action.

And the union doesn’t have recourse to collect legal fees via collective bargaining for pending litigation.

This isn’t an atypical tactic to get the upper hand in bargaining.

There’s a good chance this suit cleared enough of the framework upfront that the mediation exercise will be very short, and actually cost both sides less in legal fees.

RE: …  
Zeke's Alibi : 7/21/2021 7:01 pm : link
In comment 15309766 christian said:
Quote:
In comment 15309727 Zeke's Alibi said:


Quote:


They are going to hand the bill over to US Soccer at the next CBA, guarantee it. No way that is coming out of their pay right now, don't think they could even afford it. This lawsuit is going on for years now. Which makes them even more unlikeable.



Not that fees aren’t substantial, but I think you’re overestimating the cost of outside counsel for US soccer. This isn’t a a league bankrupting type action.

And the union doesn’t have recourse to collect legal fees via collective bargaining for pending litigation.

This isn’t an atypical tactic to get the upper hand in bargaining.

There’s a good chance this suit cleared enough of the framework upfront that the mediation exercise will be very short, and actually cost both sides less in legal fees.


Are you saying that years of unnecessary legal fees is justifiable because of shorter arbitration for the next CBA? If that's what you are saying, I'm going to have to disagree, but I could certainly be confused as IANAL.

They are literally asking for money that US Soccer doesn't have and their real beef is with FIFA. The whole point of this is to put pressure on US Soccer to pay the prize pool out equally for mens and womens world cup. That isn't happening in a billion years because if it were possible, USWNT would have just brought this to FIFA itself. They know its a waste of time, but the want US Soccer to waste resources on a case. Like yeah I'm sure they have in-house consul, but for a case like that I have to imagine they would need to bring in outsiders and pay them as well. Or increase your law staff.
That should read put pressure on FIFA to pay out the Mens and Womens  
Zeke's Alibi : 7/21/2021 7:02 pm : link
World Cups more "equally"
 
christian : 7/21/2021 7:30 pm : link
The gender discrimination suit was filed in 2019, this isn’t Gaines Vs. New Orleans. No one is going bankrupt over 2.5 years of action.

If you want to take exception for the legal maneuvering to play this out in civil court to stack the deck for the upcoming CBA, I get that.

And you’re right, there was no chance this action was going to compel FIFA to pay out an equal pool, or US soccer to eat it or split the pool evenly.

This was a play for the court of public opinion to get an advantage going to negotiations for the 21 CBA renewal, and to get some easy wins on the travel and conditions.

If this is sensibility offending, so be it.
What the women's team gets paid  
Bricktop : 7/21/2021 7:47 pm : link
doesn't affect me AT ALL. Like not even a little bit. I couldn't care less. And I'm a big soccer fan. Some folks are really up in arms about some female soccer players. If you really think playing the women is holding back the men's team, I just don't really know what to say to that. This discussion is bizarre and funny, however - so thank you for that.
RE: RE: It has nothing to do with politics but it’s been  
ColHowPepper : 7/21/2021 7:58 pm : link
In comment 15309418 Stu11 said:
Quote:
In comment 15309404 bhill410 said:
Quote: A purposeful campaign to mislead folks (see stu) snd as a result has caused folks to allege discrimination when there is none. I don’t enjoy seeing entities attempt to maximize revenue but sowing what are essentially lies regarding societal actions. Their actions have more ramifications than simply what xyz athlete gets paid.///


Believe me there are many ways to look at the pay structure here as well as the working conditions. How about the guys in here who readily parrot the male/female revenue disparity argument comparing it to basketball when it hasn't applied with soccer for at least 5 years? They are misinformed. I said the cba is the problem for them and the court agreed. As for women's issues in general they have gotten the short end of the stick for generations. Anything that helps change that is good and whether you agree or don't like it this issue helps.
Good post, Stu. Part of the disconnect in perceptions on the part of some of the 'caliber' of mens' vs womens' soccer and whether their payscales should be equivalent revolves around glib (imo) notions that a U17 mens' team could whip the USWNT 4 of 5 or 5 of 5; maybe, but for me that's not the point: for almost a decade now USWNT plays a 'style' of soccer, cohesion, concept, teamwork, tactics, and fundamentals that I enjoy watching (as in Sue Bird as a PG), it seems to me executed in a way the game is meant to be played, while the USMNT is most often, for the better part of a decade, again to my eye, just a mess on the pitch. It doesn't matter to me that USMNT might beat the pants off the girls.
As to today''s result  
ColHowPepper : 7/21/2021 8:04 pm : link
I think it's a good thing for women's soccer--and for USWNT. Notwithstanding its lone non-win in last 21 (?) matches came vs Sweden this Spring, they came out as an entitled team and got their asses whipped. Sweden is bigger, faster (in most cases), just as experienced, plays an excellent technical game--its execution on set pieces was terrific and USWNT team laid an egg. Moreover, SWE played physically, edgy, aggressively, and smartly: US women were interested in theatrical simulation attempts trying to draw fouls when, most often, there were none. USA have to re-tool their mindset the rest of the way or they will be outside looking in.
Well  
section125 : 7/21/2021 8:08 pm : link
1.) Like watching the USWNT play.

2.) Politics and sports should not mix, especially at the Olympics

3.) Whatever the players (both teams) get paid I could care less. Not my business.

4.) To fabricate pay issues in public is a tactic, however lying about the issues for public consumption is poor judgement

5.) I hope they rally and make it out of the early rounds.
I watched the extended highlights (God knows what hour these games  
Del Shofner : 7/21/2021 8:09 pm : link
are actually on live, being in Tokyo). Came away thinking two things.

If you don't mark the opposing players closely, they will score. Same as it ever was.

If you have any liking for how the USWNT looks, you'll love Sweden. Holy moly. 11 tall blond physically fit women who also play as a unit and seem likable.
What’s never really mentioned is that  
Joey from GlenCove : 7/21/2021 8:13 pm : link
They don’t have the same job as the men. One plays women’s soccer vs other sr women’s intl teams. And the other plays men’s soccer vs other sr men’s intl teams. So the comparisons between them aren’t great.

They have lied and mislead the public about their fight for “equal” pay. This makes them unlikable in my view, similar to you not liking a player because he’s holding out. They’ve taken it further by claiming gender discrimination where there isn’t any and lying.

They are extremely good at their job. They should fight for what they think it’s worth. Unfortunately for them they agreed to the wrong structure and I think wrong public discussion.
RE: RE: RE: Soccer players always been the hottest female athletes IMO.  
Matt M. : 7/21/2021 9:00 pm : link
In comment 15309417 Jim in Fairfax said:
Quote:
In comment 15309401 KDavies said:


Quote:


In comment 15309395 Zeke's Alibi said:


Quote:


Alex Morgan is unbelievable.



That said, I hope you're not looking forward to Megan Rapinoe modeling for Victoria's Secret



Call me crazy, but she doesn't look half bad in that picture.
RE: What’s never really mentioned is that  
Matt M. : 7/21/2021 9:06 pm : link
In comment 15309808 Joey from GlenCove said:
Quote:
They don’t have the same job as the men. One plays women’s soccer vs other sr women’s intl teams. And the other plays men’s soccer vs other sr men’s intl teams. So the comparisons between them aren’t great.

They have lied and mislead the public about their fight for “equal” pay. This makes them unlikable in my view, similar to you not liking a player because he’s holding out. They’ve taken it further by claiming gender discrimination where there isn’t any and lying.

They are extremely good at their job. They should fight for what they think it’s worth. Unfortunately for them they agreed to the wrong structure and I think wrong public discussion.
Did they fight for the wrong structure or did they get greedy? It sounds like they have a sweet deal.
Back to the Corner