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Daniel Jones rated #22, tier 3 QB per Athletic survey:

Sean : 7/28/2021 8:55 am
Good analysis here, and I agree. There is some to like with Jones (running ability the biggest asset), but why does he turn the ball over so much? Is it lack of processing, or the offense? The consensus continues to be that this is a make or break year. Full analysis below:
Quote:
22. Daniel Jones
Tier 1 votes: 1 | Tier 3 votes: 28 | Tier 4 votes: 20 | Tier 5 votes: 1 | 2020 Tier: 3

The vote distribution for Jones this year is nearly identical to the distribution last year. Then as now, voters want to know why Jones holds the ball and suffers too many turnovers (a league-high 39 over the past two seasons, in 27 games). Is he a slow processor? Does he struggle to see the field? Will he build on whatever incremental progress was made last season?

“Playing him, the thing that scares you the most about him was his ability to run with the ball,” a defensive coach said. “They were running some of the zone-read stuff, but he was running away from secondary guys. He also had the ability to throw the ball, but he was not consistent.”

The return of Saquon Barkley and the additions of Kenny Golladay, Kadarius Toney and Kyle Rudolph have raised expectations.

“They are built to be a seven-on-seven team with the weapons they have, and if he cannot put up points with this group, he never will be able to,” an exec said.

The Giants averaged 17.4 offensive points per game in Jones’ starts last season, slightly less than the 1-15 Jaguars averaged. That was down from 19.7 during Jones’ 2019 rookie season.

“The way of the NFL now is to rush these guys to be great early,” a quarterbacks coach said. “They are not given a chance to just develop and learn the game. Some guys come in right away and play well, but other guys need 2-3 years and then they are ready to roll.”

The Bills’ Allen comes to mind in that latter group. He had a dozen fewer turnovers through two seasons than Jones has suffered.

“Jones’ fatal flaw has been the turnovers, but it’s because he holds the ball too long,” a defensive coach said. “That worries me all the time. Sometimes it is a product of the offense. I’m not sure that is the case there. It’s like he doesn’t see things all the time. Philly ended the game with a strip-sack, not because they got a great rush, but because he holds the ball a long time. I worry that he cannot get past that.”

A longtime offensive coach compared Jones to Dalton a decade ago. Put an excellent team around him and he’ll have a chance. Take away the above-average supporting cast, and prepare to struggle. Jones’ athleticism does separate him. He had an 80-yard run against the Eagles, punctuated by an open-field stumble.

“I think there is enough ability there,” an exec said. “You can start and win with him. He’s another guy, two different coaches, a couple of different offenses, haven’t really had a lot of weapons around him. They tried to upgrade that this offseason and they got Saquon Barkley coming back. This will be the truest evaluation of him.”

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For what it’s worth, Darnold is tier 4  
Sean : 7/28/2021 8:56 am : link
.
RE: For what it’s worth, Darnold is tier 4  
Jim in Forest Hills : 7/28/2021 8:59 am : link
In comment 15314788 Sean said:
Quote:
.


I'll repeat this, this year for Darnold/Rhule and Jones/Judge will be so fascinating, since the former had so many links to the Giants. Almost a what might have been season. Will be great to watch unfold.
Seems fair  
DavidinBMNY : 7/28/2021 9:06 am : link
And with that in mind in year 3, if Jones can jump into the top 16 or 1/2 of starting QBS I'd be pleased with that and I think it's achievable but in no way a given. Anything more then that would be absolute icing on the cake and forget the top no one is getting ahead of the Brady, Rodgers, Wilson types. A Super Bowl win does wonders for your ranking :-).

Who gave Jones a tier 1 vote?  
BrettNYG10 : 7/28/2021 9:17 am : link
I think this is fair. It's above his statistical performance last season, but gives credit for the skills he's shown.

I completely agree he's above Darnold.
I find this kind of thing virtually worthless  
BillT : 7/28/2021 9:35 am : link
Look, we get it. Jones hasn’t played that well so far. He’s had some good results and a number bad ones. He’s also played only two years surrounded by possibly the worst offensive talent in the league. His past performance may be indicative of what is to come or maybe not. Recounting his past performance tells us very little if anything about what is to come. This is just beating a dead horse.
This line is the most important one to me in that write up:  
The_Boss : 7/28/2021 9:36 am : link
“They are built to be a seven-on-seven team with the weapons they have, and if he cannot put up points with this group, he never will be able to,” an exec said.

Make or break…
When you have the league's worst WR corp  
Dr. D : 7/28/2021 9:38 am : link
in terms of getting separation, would that not affect how long a young QB holds onto the ball (as well as his decision making)?

Is it possible it's not going to be nearly as much of a problem this year when he'll have receivers who can actually get TF open (or be open when they're not, ie, catch contested passes like KG and KR)?

I believe so. Will find out pretty soon.
The  
Toth029 : 7/28/2021 9:41 am : link
Remark about the Philly game. He's joking, right? It ended when he dimed a pass down the sideline to an open receiver and it slipped through his fingers. This was on 3rd down if I recall right. The strip sack was with not much time left and they had to go all the way down the field.
Can't wait for Jones to prove all these non-believers wrong going to  
BBWreckingCrew : 7/28/2021 9:45 am : link
be great! Then everyone will hop on bandwagon and love him like they always do with other stars. It's hilarious. Bunch of Analytic computer dweebs.
RE: Seems fair  
dabru : 7/28/2021 9:49 am : link
In comment 15314807 DavidinBMNY said:
Quote:
And with that in mind in year 3, if Jones can jump into the top 16 or 1/2 of starting QBS I'd be pleased with that and I think it's achievable but in no way a given. Anything more then that would be absolute icing on the cake and forget the top no one is getting ahead of the Brady, Rodgers, Wilson types. A Super Bowl win does wonders for your ranking :-).


I agree, if he can move up into the bottom of tier 2 it would be a welcomed improvement. For him to move higher he is going to need to show not only elevated play but the ability to elevated the play of those around him. For me that is the biggest step he needs to make.
That voting spread puts him more like Tier 3.5  
NYGgolfer : 7/28/2021 9:49 am : link
For those with a subscription, how many QBs are included in each respective Tier?
RE: When you have the league's worst WR corp  
christian : 7/28/2021 9:49 am : link
In comment 15314872 Dr. D said:
Quote:
in terms of getting separation, would that not affect how long a young QB holds onto the ball (as well as his decision making)?


That analysis from NFL Next Gen stats measures the separation at the point when the quarterback throws the football.

That data point could very well be more of an indictment of when and to whom the QB threw the ball.

If Jones has trouble seeing the field or processing his reads, this metric isn’t likely to improve.

Shepard, Engram, Slayton and even Tate aren’t slow footed, bad route runners. There’s more to this issue.
RE: RE: When you have the league's worst WR corp  
pizbo : 7/28/2021 9:59 am : link
In comment 15314904 christian said:
Quote:
In comment 15314872 Dr. D said:


Quote:


in terms of getting separation, would that not affect how long a young QB holds onto the ball (as well as his decision making)?



That analysis from NFL Next Gen stats measures the separation at the point when the quarterback throws the football.

That data point could very well be more of an indictment of when and to whom the QB threw the ball.

If Jones has trouble seeing the field or processing his reads, this metric isn’t likely to improve.

Shepard, Engram, Slayton and even Tate aren’t slow footed, bad route runners. There’s more to this issue.


Also, most receivers don't get a ton of separation in general. It's pros vs pros. It's throwing to where the receiver will be able to catch it vs waiting for a receiver to be open. If you're waiting for someone to be open before throwing then you're usually already too late. This isn't college or high school ball.
.  
Go Terps : 7/28/2021 10:00 am : link
None of those descriptions scream "second contract". That's the important consideration at this point.
They must have corrected the page  
US1 Giants : 7/28/2021 10:16 am : link
Jones got no Tier 1 votes and 1 Tier 2 vote

22. Daniel Jones

Tier 2 votes: 1 | Tier 3 votes: 28 | Tier 4 votes: 20 | Tier 5 votes: 1 | 2020 Tier: 3

This is fair  
Biteymax22 : 7/28/2021 10:39 am : link
Right now I see both sides of the argument for and against Jones. Won't be shocked if he takes a big jump forward, won't be shocked if we're bundling picks to move up for "our guy" next year.

One thing is for certain with him though, the kid puts the work in, seems respected by his teammates and represents the team very well. I hope he takes the Josh Allen jump this year and we don't have to pick another QB in next years draft.
Someone posted a podcast  
Lines of Scrimmage : 7/28/2021 10:41 am : link
a few months ago with Garrett being interviewed. He spoke about DJ and one thing that I found very interesting was that he said he is making the correct reads and now he has to just "let it rip". Most QB's fail for not being able to make the correct read.

I actually took it as a positive and hopefully he gains the confidence in himself and the target to just make a play while being smart and not reckless.
RE: .  
djm : 7/28/2021 10:42 am : link
In comment 15314921 Go Terps said:
Quote:
None of those descriptions scream "second contract". That's the important consideration at this point.


What if he takes a big step forward this season?
RE: Someone posted a podcast  
djm : 7/28/2021 10:48 am : link
In comment 15314967 Lines of Scrimmage said:
Quote:
a few months ago with Garrett being interviewed. He spoke about DJ and one thing that I found very interesting was that he said he is making the correct reads and now he has to just "let it rip". Most QB's fail for not being able to make the correct read.

I actually took it as a positive and hopefully he gains the confidence in himself and the target to just make a play while being smart and not reckless.


This is the shit that many fans either don't hear or don't care to hear.

If the Giants didn't think Jones was more likely to step forward than what the stats say, they wouldn't be building this thing around him. Doesn't mean they are right, but they aren't just blindly or stubbornly going full steam ahead and spitting in the face of logic.

If the QB is doing everything right but the wins and stats are not manifesting, teams will stick with that QB because there's plenty of reasons to expect things to get to a good place. Conversely, the NFL historical landscape is littered with QBs who peaked early because of talent and maybe even a little luck, only to fall apart by year 3-4-5. Why? Because they weren't cerebral. They didn't outwork everyone. They weren't receptive to coaching.

It goes both ways.

RE: That voting spread puts him more like Tier 3.5  
Scooter185 : 7/28/2021 10:55 am : link
In comment 15314902 NYGgolfer said:
Quote:
For those with a subscription, how many QBs are included in each respective Tier?

Tier 1: 5. Rodgers/Mahomes (T1, unanimous votes), Brady, Wilson, Watson
Tier 2: 9. Allen, Jackson, Stafford, Prescott, Herbert, Ryan, Murray, Tannehill, Burrow
Tier 3: 9. Carr, Big Ben, Baker, Cousins, Goff, Wentz, Jimmy G, Jones, Fitzpatrick
Tier 4: 11. Darnold, Winston, Bridgewater, Newton, Dalton, Tua, Hurts, Lock, Taylor, Hill, Flacco
Carr, Baker and maybe Cousins  
Jimmy Googs : 7/28/2021 11:52 am : link
could be moved into Tier 2.

Debatable but at first glance...
RE: RE: Someone posted a podcast  
Brown_Hornet : 7/28/2021 11:56 am : link
In comment 15314975 djm said:
Quote:


This is the shit that many fans either don't hear or don't care to hear.

If the Giants didn't think Jones was more likely to step forward than what the stats say, they wouldn't be building this thing around him.

This!

I think I like Judge. I think I trust him. I think that he's good at his job.

I could be WAY off here, but I'd bet he's better at his job than our resident analysts.

It's training camp. Optimism is peaking.
RE: RE: Someone posted a podcast  
Johnny5 : 7/28/2021 12:01 pm : link
In comment 15314975 djm said:
Quote:
In comment 15314967 Lines of Scrimmage said:


Quote:


a few months ago with Garrett being interviewed. He spoke about DJ and one thing that I found very interesting was that he said he is making the correct reads and now he has to just "let it rip". Most QB's fail for not being able to make the correct read.

I actually took it as a positive and hopefully he gains the confidence in himself and the target to just make a play while being smart and not reckless.



This is the shit that many fans either don't hear or don't care to hear.

If the Giants didn't think Jones was more likely to step forward than what the stats say, they wouldn't be building this thing around him. Doesn't mean they are right, but they aren't just blindly or stubbornly going full steam ahead and spitting in the face of logic.

If the QB is doing everything right but the wins and stats are not manifesting, teams will stick with that QB because there's plenty of reasons to expect things to get to a good place. Conversely, the NFL historical landscape is littered with QBs who peaked early because of talent and maybe even a little luck, only to fall apart by year 3-4-5. Why? Because they weren't cerebral. They didn't outwork everyone. They weren't receptive to coaching.

It goes both ways.

Agreed. I think the article is a fair assessment. The difference between the pessimists and I is the belief (and the biggest reason for my bullishness on him) is it's a confidence thing. I totally agree that he seems to be making the correct reads but is just not "letting it rip". Case in point that 2 pt conversion where you can see he sees it, but he hesitates. That's a confidence thing. Will he break that? Maybe. I think he will. Slight improvements all around will breed success, and success breeds confidence (which breeds more success). This is the way I see the season going down as LONG AS the OL improves as well. It's definitely going to be an interesting year.
Just shows you some of these execs either have no idea what the  
Zeke's Alibi : 7/28/2021 12:03 pm : link
hell they are talking about or have their own narratives to spin

In what fucking world is this team built to be a 7 on 7 team? Couldn’t be further from the truth. If Judge read that comment he’d probably lose it laughing.
....  
BrettNYG10 : 7/28/2021 12:03 pm : link
I'm confused as to why Gardner Minshew isn't on the list. He has solid TD/INT ratios.

I'd rather have him starting than Lock or Bridgewater. IF a higher draft pick put up those numbers, I think he'd be in tier 2 or 3.
The 7v7 comment is...  
Brown_Hornet : 7/28/2021 12:07 pm : link
...likely a compliment to what the Giants have built around DJ. The reference being that 7v7 games are high scoring affairs.

RE: RE: RE: Someone posted a podcast  
santacruzom : 7/28/2021 12:13 pm : link
In comment 15315091 Johnny5 said:
Quote:
Case in point that 2 pt conversion where you can see he sees it, but he hesitates. That's a confidence thing.


That's not necessarily true. It may have nothing to do with confidence, and more to do with the speed at which information flows from his eyes, to his brain, and then to action.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Someone posted a podcast  
Johnny5 : 7/28/2021 12:17 pm : link
In comment 15315113 santacruzom said:
Quote:
In comment 15315091 Johnny5 said:


Quote:


Case in point that 2 pt conversion where you can see he sees it, but he hesitates. That's a confidence thing.



That's not necessarily true. It may have nothing to do with confidence, and more to do with the speed at which information flows from his eyes, to his brain, and then to action.

Of course. No one is saying that is true, we each have our opinions. My opinion is it's more of a confidence thing. Especially based on the OL issues and the coaching/system changes in his 2nd year with no preseason or camp. He could fail epically... lol. But based on his progression before and after that hamstring injury, I fully believe it's more a confidence thing. I really believe this offense breaks out quite a bit especially if the OL also improves.
I mean  
santacruzom : 7/28/2021 12:20 pm : link
he definitely could be hesitating until he's entirely confident a turnover won't result from a throw. But I imagine that's part of every QB's pre-throw thought process. It's just that some execute that process faster/slower than average, and we're talking tenths of a second that can make all the difference.
RE: I mean  
Johnny5 : 7/28/2021 12:28 pm : link
In comment 15315129 santacruzom said:
Quote:
he definitely could be hesitating until he's entirely confident a turnover won't result from a throw. But I imagine that's part of every QB's pre-throw thought process. It's just that some execute that process faster/slower than average, and we're talking tenths of a second that can make all the difference.

For sure. I think that's what any of us are terrified of, because he clearly doesn't have that "my spidey senses are tingling" like Mahomes... lol. But does he need to? Or better question at what level does it need to be for him to be successful. He has a lot of good attributes as do all drafted QBs. I believe many of the failures these guys suffer is where they land... scheme, coaching, and impatience certainly plays it's part in the quagmire of failed QBs... lol. Ultimately I think he has the tools, and I think they will scheme well for him this year, as long as it's more of a confidence thing than processing power... which I believe it is.
he's grouped with the right players (esp. Baker)  
Eric on Li : 7/28/2021 12:30 pm : link
some guys are a little higher than I'd put them (Watson is probably tier 2 not tier 1) but overall I think this is a pretty fair list. If Jones plays more like he did in year 1 he should rise to a tier 2 QB this year and move beyond the category of Derek Carr/Jared Goff types.

Btw last year Kyler Murray and Josh Allen were both tier 3. Josh Allen was actually #22 on last year's list. I think it's hard to understate the impact Hopkins and Diggs had on both of those guys in their ascension last year.
RE: The 7v7 comment is...  
Zeke's Alibi : 7/28/2021 12:34 pm : link
In comment 15315101 Brown_Hornet said:
Quote:
...likely a compliment to what the Giants have built around DJ. The reference being that 7v7 games are high scoring affairs.


It’s insinuating this is going to be a pass happy, high scoring offense aka 7 on 7. The personnel doesn’t say that at all. We have added NFL talent to the outside is what we did and we have an OL that is much better at run blocking than pass blocking with an elite back. If you took out top 3 receiving threats and compared it around the league it’s top half, but nothing to say we would be pass happy, especially considering the offensive line situation.

Kyle Rudolph? I think expectations are way too high for him, still a great red zone threat and nice check down piece on 3rd and medium, but he’s not the same player he was, and even at his best wasn’t an elite TE. Golladay is a top 10 wr probably, but once again not elite. Shephard and Slayton are both solid in their roles, but nothing special. The real X factor is Toney, but he’s a rookie that went 20th. This is an offense that is going to flow through the run game or we really open up the offensive line to exposure, and we don’t have the elite talent on outside for it to make any sense to deviate from that for the most part. I’ll eat my hat if this is a 7 on 7 offense week to week. I’m sure we will see some pass happy games occasionally when the opponent doesn’t match up well on outside with a poor pass rush, but that’s only a handful of teams.
The best thing for Jones  
Lines of Scrimmage : 7/28/2021 12:34 pm : link
and the Giants is to get ahead of the game in down and distance. This is important for any QB and significantly more important for a young QB finding his way.

I hope winning first down is a major emphasis this camp. If they can do this with more consistency turnovers will improve and they will open up the bigger chunk plays downfield.
RE: RE: .  
Go Terps : 7/28/2021 1:38 pm : link
In comment 15314969 djm said:
Quote:
In comment 15314921 Go Terps said:


Quote:


None of those descriptions scream "second contract". That's the important consideration at this point.



What if he takes a big step forward this season?


That applies to anyone. What if Jon Ross turns into Marvin Harrison this season? Then yeah, that changes things. But until then Ross is Ross and Jones is Jones.
lets see how this season goes  
Paulie Walnuts : 7/28/2021 1:52 pm : link
what was past is really nothing
.  
Go Terps : 7/28/2021 4:39 pm : link
Josh Allen - #6
Lamar Jackson - #7
Justin Herbert - #10

Great job, front office.
And yet..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 7/28/2021 5:02 pm : link
another thread where any positive news about Jones has to be shouted down by a specific few.

It is like a compulsion at this point.
Wait what?  
NoGainDayne : 7/28/2021 5:04 pm : link
We pick a player 6th in the draft, they play 2 NFL seasons. They are ranked #22 in the league as a starting QB. This is positive news??
Forget the positive part..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 7/28/2021 5:07 pm : link
then. Every Jones thread turns into yet another chance for the usual suspects to come take a gigantic shit on him.

I'm sure they think there's a point to it, but most of us just shake our heads.
Interesting Tier 1 and Tier 2 QBs...  
bw in dc : 7/28/2021 5:12 pm : link
Among them - Allen, Lamar Jax and Justin Herbert.

No one is "taking a shit" on Jones  
NoGainDayne : 7/28/2021 5:25 pm : link
pointing to his statistics and saying they don't really point at all to the breakout a lot of people seem to be expecting is not taking taking a shit on someone.

It's actually quite reflective of the way in which people want to twist anything into something positive for Jones that it was said that this is a positive thread on him while ranked #22. That's actually a microcosm for a lot of the threads that bother people I think, a lot of the tone here seems to be like "hey, aren't you so excited to see the #22 QB in the league take the field this season?!!"

I'm like no, not really, in fact it's a little frustrating to feel like the rest of the team might really be taking shape and our #6 pick QB and #2 pick RB are big question marks. Not to mention an OL that has plagued us for pretty much a decade now. And even a little more frustrating that expressing these ideas seems to be increasingly twisted into people rooting against the Giants. Nothing would make me happier than seeing Jones take a big step forward, that doesn't mean we should act like we should be happy with how he's played to date and who he's shown to be as a QB. No one should be happy to have the #22nd ranked QB two full seasons after they were drafted #6, no one
RE: And yet..  
Jimmy Googs : 7/28/2021 5:32 pm : link
In comment 15315513 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
another thread where any positive news about Jones has to be shouted down by a specific few.

It is like a compulsion at this point.


You mean like a compulsion to join every one of these same DJ threads and bitch and moan at those very same posters?
RE: RE: The 7v7 comment is...  
Angel Eyes : 7/28/2021 5:33 pm : link
In comment 15315140 Zeke's Alibi said:
Quote:
In comment 15315101 Brown_Hornet said:


Quote:


...likely a compliment to what the Giants have built around DJ. The reference being that 7v7 games are high scoring affairs.




It’s insinuating this is going to be a pass happy, high scoring offense aka 7 on 7. The personnel doesn’t say that at all. We have added NFL talent to the outside is what we did and we have an OL that is much better at run blocking than pass blocking with an elite back. If you took out top 3 receiving threats and compared it around the league it’s top half, but nothing to say we would be pass happy, especially considering the offensive line situation.

Kyle Rudolph? I think expectations are way too high for him, still a great red zone threat and nice check down piece on 3rd and medium, but he’s not the same player he was, and even at his best wasn’t an elite TE. Golladay is a top 10 wr probably, but once again not elite. Shephard and Slayton are both solid in their roles, but nothing special. The real X factor is Toney, but he’s a rookie that went 20th. This is an offense that is going to flow through the run game or we really open up the offensive line to exposure, and we don’t have the elite talent on outside for it to make any sense to deviate from that for the most part. I’ll eat my hat if this is a 7 on 7 offense week to week. I’m sure we will see some pass happy games occasionally when the opponent doesn’t match up well on outside with a poor pass rush, but that’s only a handful of teams.

If Rudolph can be a solid blocker and red-zone target, it'll have been a good signing (he hasn't dropped a pass in two years). That being said, we should probably look at drafting a tight end early next draft since Engram is up at the end of this year (5th year option) and Rudolph is a) getting along in years and b) a FA after 2022.
RE: .  
Eric on Li : 7/28/2021 5:40 pm : link
In comment 15315485 Go Terps said:
Quote:
Josh Allen - #6
Lamar Jackson - #7
Justin Herbert - #10

Great job, front office.


if you are going to value the rankings Josh Allen was #22 last year (entering year 3 same as Jones) and #29 the year before (year 2) after his rookie season, with a problem the expert commentators thought was an unfixable fatal flaw (his inaccuracy and 56% completion % through 2 years). Lamar Jackson was #28 going into his year 2. Herbert was unranked last year because he was a rookie.

Either Jones takes the Allen/Murray step forward this year or he doesn't. The insistence that it's already a foregone conclusion he won't or can't is tiresome. Mayfield has been in the league 1 year longer and he could still go either way too.
RE: RE: And yet..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 7/28/2021 9:50 pm : link
In comment 15315557 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
In comment 15315513 FatMan in Charlotte said:


Quote:


another thread where any positive news about Jones has to be shouted down by a specific few.

It is like a compulsion at this point.



You mean like a compulsion to join every one of these same DJ threads and bitch and moan at those very same posters?


I'm sure you can point to new information being shared, right Clownshoes?
RE: RE: .  
Scooter185 : 7/28/2021 9:53 pm : link
In comment 15315562 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
In comment 15315485 Go Terps said:


Quote:


Josh Allen - #6
Lamar Jackson - #7
Justin Herbert - #10

Great job, front office.



if you are going to value the rankings Josh Allen was #22 last year (entering year 3 same as Jones) and #29 the year before (year 2) after his rookie season, with a problem the expert commentators thought was an unfixable fatal flaw (his inaccuracy and 56% completion % through 2 years). Lamar Jackson was #28 going into his year 2. Herbert was unranked last year because he was a rookie.

Either Jones takes the Allen/Murray step forward this year or he doesn't. The insistence that it's already a foregone conclusion he won't or can't is tiresome. Mayfield has been in the league 1 year longer and he could still go either way too.


I'd say there's as much insistence that he's going to take a leap like Allen
RE: RE: RE: .  
dabru : 7/28/2021 10:25 pm : link
In comment 15315836 Scooter185 said:
Quote:
In comment 15315562 Eric on Li said:


Quote:


In comment 15315485 Go Terps said:


Quote:


Josh Allen - #6
Lamar Jackson - #7
Justin Herbert - #10

Great job, front office.



if you are going to value the rankings Josh Allen was #22 last year (entering year 3 same as Jones) and #29 the year before (year 2) after his rookie season, with a problem the expert commentators thought was an unfixable fatal flaw (his inaccuracy and 56% completion % through 2 years). Lamar Jackson was #28 going into his year 2. Herbert was unranked last year because he was a rookie.

Either Jones takes the Allen/Murray step forward this year or he doesn't. The insistence that it's already a foregone conclusion he won't or can't is tiresome. Mayfield has been in the league 1 year longer and he could still go either way too.



I'd say there's as much insistence that he's going to take a leap like Allen


I am hopeful and in the wait and see camp, but why shouldn’t there be more optimism than pessimism among fans?

We want the team we follow to succeed and having other fans crap all over things that haven’t come to pass yet annoying. Will they celebrate if they are correct?
RE: RE: RE: RE: .  
Scooter185 : 7/28/2021 10:44 pm : link
In comment 15315889 dabru said:
Quote:
In comment 15315836 Scooter185 said:


Quote:


In comment 15315562 Eric on Li said:


Quote:


In comment 15315485 Go Terps said:


Quote:


Josh Allen - #6
Lamar Jackson - #7
Justin Herbert - #10

Great job, front office.



if you are going to value the rankings Josh Allen was #22 last year (entering year 3 same as Jones) and #29 the year before (year 2) after his rookie season, with a problem the expert commentators thought was an unfixable fatal flaw (his inaccuracy and 56% completion % through 2 years). Lamar Jackson was #28 going into his year 2. Herbert was unranked last year because he was a rookie.

Either Jones takes the Allen/Murray step forward this year or he doesn't. The insistence that it's already a foregone conclusion he won't or can't is tiresome. Mayfield has been in the league 1 year longer and he could still go either way too.



I'd say there's as much insistence that he's going to take a leap like Allen



I am hopeful and in the wait and see camp, but why shouldn’t there be more optimism than pessimism among fans?

We want the team we follow to succeed and having other fans crap all over things that haven’t come to pass yet annoying. Will they celebrate if they are correct?


I don't believe the team deserves the benefit of the doubt until they actually prove it on the field. That goes for the team overall and Jones. So put me solidly in the I'll believe it when it happens camp.

As far as celebrating if they're correct, with the amount of crap hurled at BW and GT I wouldn't blame them for it. Not to say they're rooting for the Giants to lose, but they certainly would be entitled to an I told you so or 5.

Although some "optimists" have already expressed how they'll spin a poor season by the Giants to continue dumping on BW and GT
RE: RE: RE: And yet..  
Jimmy Googs : 7/28/2021 10:48 pm : link
In comment 15315829 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
In comment 15315557 Jimmy Googs said:


Quote:


In comment 15315513 FatMan in Charlotte said:


Quote:


another thread where any positive news about Jones has to be shouted down by a specific few.

It is like a compulsion at this point.



You mean like a compulsion to join every one of these same DJ threads and bitch and moan at those very same posters?



I'm sure you can point to new information being shared, right Clownshoes?


New information...you mean besides the new survey that was the theme of the thread? The thread that you took so much time reading through that you described it as “positive news” ? The positive news in your view being our 3rd year starting QB was being ranked as #22 in the league?

It’s ponderous you want to act like the compulsive behavior isn’t yours...
LOL..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 7/28/2021 10:53 pm : link
you mean the compulsive behavior of being banned and coming back as a different handle for a year, all while denying you did exactly that??

I don't think a person so fucked up that they would exist on the board after being banned and then tell others they were wrong for calling it out should talk about compulsion.

But then again, you spend most of the time telling people what posts are bad by them. Or bad looks. From a guy kicked off the board.

Compulsion and hypocrisy. Good stuff, Clownshoes.
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