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NFT: MLB Trade Deadline recap

allstarjim : 7/31/2021 1:08 pm
Just for discussion. I think one of the more interesting story lines of this crazy active MLB trading period was the Cubs and Nationals respective fire sales. For comparison, here is the total haul by the two teams (new prospect system ranking in parentheses following player name).

For Kimbrel/Tepera:

2B Nick Madrigal (2022 Starting 2B)
RHP Codi Heuer (immediate ML relief pitcher, potential closer)
LHP Bailey Horn (A-Ball prospect)

For Bryant:
OF Alexander Canario #7
RHP Caleb Kilian #16

For Baez & Williams:
OF Pete Crow-Armstrong #6

For Rizzo:

RHP Alexander Vizcaino #8
OF Kevin Alcantara #11

For Marisnick:

RHP Anderson Espinoza (Former top SP prospect in A-Ball, coming off two Tommy John surgeries.

Nationals:

For Scherzer & Turner:

C Keibert Ruiz (#1)
RHP Josiah Gray (#2)
RHP Gerardo Carrillo (#10)
OF Donovan Casey (#27)

For Daniel Hudson:

RHP Mason Thompson (ML rookie reliever but 5.74 ERA in 26.2 IP in AAA in 2021)
SS/2B Jordy Barley (#28)

For Schwarber:

RHP Adlo Ramirez (#11)

For Brad Hand:

C Riley Adams (#13)

For Gomes & Harrison:

C Drew Millas (#24)
RHP Richard Guasch (#30)
RHP Seth Shuman (High A-Ball SP, 2.25 ERA in 56 IP, 10 K/9 in 2021)

For Lester:

OF Lane Thomas (once highly regarded prospect, .265 hitter with .790 OPS in 127 PA in AAA in 2021)

Who did it better?
Depending on how Madrigal recovers  
Mike in NY : 7/31/2021 1:32 pm : link
I like that the best for Cubs as I find middle relievers interchangeable
So to recap:  
allstarjim : 7/31/2021 1:35 pm : link
Cubs new pipeline, without regard to Major Leaguers Madrigal, a key piece or Heuer, includes:

#6 OF Pete Crow-Armstrong
#7 OF Alexander Canario
#8 RHP Alexander Vizcaino
#11 OF Kevin Alcantara
#16 RHP Caleb Kilian

RHP Bailey Horn, RHP Anderson Espinoza

For Nationals:

#1 C Keibert Ruiz
#2 RHP Josiah Gray
#10 RHP Gerardo Carrillo
#11 RHP Aldo Ramirez
#13 C Riley Adams
#24 C Drew Millas
#27 OF Donovan Casey
#28 SS/2B Jordy Barley
#30 RHP Richard Guasch

RHP Seth Shuman, OF Lane Thomas

Got to love the Nationals' haul but obviously they gave up the two best players involved in any trade this deadline in Scherzer and Turner.
Keep in mind  
allstarjim : 7/31/2021 1:37 pm : link
RHP = Right-Handed Pitcher, not relief pitcher, if that wasn't clear.
...  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 7/31/2021 2:00 pm : link
Wild that the Cubs were in first place until late June & then bottom fell out.
I really like what the Cubs did  
Eric on Li : 7/31/2021 2:19 pm : link
and I think the Nats sold low on both of their guys. Madrigal tips it to the Cubs for me. I know with Kimbrel having extra years of control he had good trade value but they got a really good young 2b with elite contact skills who they will be able to pencil in for 5 prime years starting next year. That's a massive win. Especially since there's usually not a ton of competition for high end relievers if you're willing to spend money in the offseason. Kimbrel's vacated $ should be easy to reallocate if they want.

For the Nats, Ruiz is a solid gamble but they gave up perhaps the 2 best players at the deadline and didn't seem to clearly get the best best young asset. Perhaps not even one of the top 2-3 (Martin, Luzardo, Madrigal). So that's an L imo.

Had the Nats/Sherzer been willing to do a deal with the Mets I think I'd have had no problem doing PCA + Peterson for just Sherzer and then they could have spun off Turner for something else (maybe to LAD straight up for either player they got). Their 2 players were good enough I think splitting them was the way to go vs. 1 stop shopping with LAD.

But of course that depends on however strongly the scouts felt about Ruiz and Gray. Law for example has had Gray's upside as more of a #2 but some had him higher (FG) some lower. Law also had Ruiz slipping out of his top 100 a year ago but moved him back up to #80 this year. So there's definitely some variance on the opinions for the guys the Nats got.

Overall awesome deadline. Way more fun when teams are actually going for it.
...  
26.2 : 7/31/2021 2:26 pm : link
I'll speak for the Nats. I really like what they did. I like they players they got. Gray is set to start for the Nats on Monday so lets see what he's got. It wasn't just about the players. Maybe in theory they sold low, but 8 of the players they acquired are already in the Nats top 30 MiLB prospects. Plus every player traded except for one more year of Turner were going to be FA after the season. Thats how bad their farm system was.

So at least 2 year rebuild for the Nats which should make you Mets fans happy.
RE: ...  
Eric on Li : 7/31/2021 2:40 pm : link
In comment 15318406 26.2 said:
Quote:
I'll speak for the Nats. I really like what they did. I like they players they got. Gray is set to start for the Nats on Monday so lets see what he's got. It wasn't just about the players. Maybe in theory they sold low, but 8 of the players they acquired are already in the Nats top 30 MiLB prospects. Plus every player traded except for one more year of Turner were going to be FA after the season. Thats how bad their farm system was.

So at least 2 year rebuild for the Nats which should make you Mets fans happy.


jmo but I think they sort of prioritized getting 2 players who fans can watch the rest of the season instead of getting more value. If I were a selling GM I'd have really wanted to somehow end up with Madrigal and if I had the 2 best players to change teams I'd be pretty disappointed if I were unable to make it happen and someone else did.

just from a NYM fan point of view if we use Keith Law's rankings, they gave up a comparable prospect to Ruiz for Baez as a rental. So if we consider that half of the value of the LAD proposal was Ruiz for Turner, that seems not great.

It's a no brainer to me that if the NYM could only deal for one of them it would have been Scherzer so I consider him to be the more valuable asset even if he's a rental. Wherever he was willing to waive to he is likely to be willing to extend so whoever dealt for him was at least getting some opportunity to keep him. So if we chalk up the best rated prospect (gray) in the deal to Scherzer, then the question becomes whether or not there was a better asset to get from anyone else he was willing to waive to. Without knowing who he'd have accepted a trade to it's difficult but like I said I'd have worked real hard to find a way to grab Madrigal.
RE: RE: ...  
26.2 : 7/31/2021 2:51 pm : link
In comment 15318409 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
In comment 15318406 26.2 said:


Quote:


I'll speak for the Nats. I really like what they did. I like they players they got. Gray is set to start for the Nats on Monday so lets see what he's got. It wasn't just about the players. Maybe in theory they sold low, but 8 of the players they acquired are already in the Nats top 30 MiLB prospects. Plus every player traded except for one more year of Turner were going to be FA after the season. Thats how bad their farm system was.

So at least 2 year rebuild for the Nats which should make you Mets fans happy.



jmo but I think they sort of prioritized getting 2 players who fans can watch the rest of the season instead of getting more value. If I were a selling GM I'd have really wanted to somehow end up with Madrigal and if I had the 2 best players to change teams I'd be pretty disappointed if I were unable to make it happen and someone else did.

just from a NYM fan point of view if we use Keith Law's rankings, they gave up a comparable prospect to Ruiz for Baez as a rental. So if we consider that half of the value of the LAD proposal was Ruiz for Turner, that seems not great.

It's a no brainer to me that if the NYM could only deal for one of them it would have been Scherzer so I consider him to be the more valuable asset even if he's a rental. Wherever he was willing to waive to he is likely to be willing to extend so whoever dealt for him was at least getting some opportunity to keep him. So if we chalk up the best rated prospect (gray) in the deal to Scherzer, then the question becomes whether or not there was a better asset to get from anyone else he was willing to waive to. Without knowing who he'd have accepted a trade to it's difficult but like I said I'd have worked real hard to find a way to grab Madrigal.


The only comment I'll say this is (and its my opinion) there is no way Scherzer would have waived his NT clause to go to the Mets.
..  
Named Later : 7/31/2021 4:32 pm : link
Just looking at all the Trades from an NL East viewpoint, I think what the Braves and Phillies did is going to make a difference in the pennant race.

Atlanta filled some gaping holes.....and didn't really give up too much. That Catcher Alex Jackson might turn out to be something for the Marlins. But I think their GM got her pockets picked for Duvall.

The Braves only parted with mediocre Pitcher Bryse Wilson and a minor RHP for Reliever Rich Rod. They traded another Bryse named Ball, who's blocked by Freedy Fredman. I don't know what Jorge Soler will bring to Atlanta, but Bravos held on to Drew Waters and Christian Pache, completing these trades without including their top minor leaguers.

The Phils grabbed some pitching help, along with a reliever for their ragged bullpen. They got Fredy Galvis back, and they got some pitching prospects to boot.

Buckle up, it's going to be a wild 2 months.







RE: RE: RE: ...  
Eric on Li : 7/31/2021 6:19 pm : link
In comment 15318412 26.2 said:
Quote:

The only comment I'll say this is (and its my opinion) there is no way Scherzer would have waived his NT clause to go to the Mets.


Zack Scott acknowledged that publicly so your opinion is right. I'm sure the 10/5 rights limited the Nats just pointing out where there was some missed opportunity had they not been restricted (which they weren't w turner which is why i think dealing them together may not have been ideal).
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