NFT: Kemba Walker to the Knicks

Kemba at the garden
is just a very cool thing
in partic for any big east junkies

Building a team that would be better, and in the position to make a trade and not have a completely empty roster.

That in itself is a WIN

In comment 15322056 bceagle05 said:

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can pull out the most random of stats at a moment's notice. That's a good one though.

True, and TRUE! :)

In comment 15322058 ajr2456 said:

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Building a team that would be better, and in the position to make a trade and not have a completely empty roster.

This is def true. They could make a trade including IQ, Obi, Mitch, and a bunch of picks and not really take too big of a hit. Depth gets hurt but you would still have Taj at center grimes/Mcbride at guard, etc... Plus whoever you would trade for would obviously push someone to depth

As mentioned in the other thread, which I mentioned.

1) Knicks don't want to deal RJ, mainly because he is the type of guy that helps build a great culture beyond his talent

2) Knicks want to be an over the cap team next year with flexibility the year after, they are look at 2-3 contracts for players

3) They wanted Kemba 2 years ago, he has the most upside if healthy to be a difference maker and with the team depth if he misses games, it is ok.

4) Thibs is aware of the defensive liabilities of some of his players, which is why resigning Noel was very important to him as a rim protector.

5) Nothing has changed as the Knicks still have the assets and ability to make a trade for the next disgruntled star and flexibility to have cap space for when Zion, Towns and Booker could be free agents. See #1 for the Zion motivation with RJ as well.

Take all of this for what is worth, but stuff I have heard from writer friends.

In comment 15322055 Beezer said:

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In EACH of his last five seasons, Kemba Walker has averaged more than 19 points, more than 4 assists and 3+ made 3-pointers per game. In the 75-year history of the New York Knicks franchise, no PG has EVER averaged at least 19 points, 4 dimes and 3 treys in ANY single season.

gotta love Tommy and his super specific minimums, lol

Of course barely anybody in the league was making 3 threes a game until about 15 years ago. You can probably just go with how many Knick point guards have averaged more than 19 points a game and leave it at that. It's gotta be a very short list. Probably Clyde and.....?

Tough to see where Vildoza fits at this point. He’s no higher than 4th on the PG depth chart (Walker/Rose/IQ) and at SG (Fournier/IQ/Burks)and that doesn’t even include McBride or Grimes or Barrett playing some 2 or even shitty Knox

is that there aren't a lot of ways to get significantly better without giving away some of your ability to make moves in the future.

This threads that needle.

In comment 15322069 DanMetroMan said:

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Tough to see where Vildoza fits at this point. He’s no higher than 4th on the PG depth chart (Walker/Rose/IQ) and at SG (Fournier/IQ/Burks)and that doesn’t even include McBride or Grimes or Barrett playing some 2 or even shitty Knox

He's not helped himself in the Olympics, really, either.

for Turner now. I just feel like having a 5 that can hit a 3 would be huge. We have to penetrating PG's now and mitch will just be clogging the paint hoping they throw him an alley oop

"Who's playing PG for this team?!?"

lol

but man I want to see these young guys grow with the team. I mean shit, I can't remember the last time I was this excited about the SECOND line: Rose-Quickley-Burks-Toppin-Noel

In comment 15322075 Italianju said:

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for Turner now. I just feel like having a 5 that can hit a 3 would be huge. We have to penetrating PG's now and mitch will just be clogging the paint hoping they throw him an alley oop

Supposedly Myles Turner and Julius Randle have been working out together. I'm not sure how the salaries would work now in this kind of deal or who Indy would want, but Turner would make us a team to watch.

In comment 15322079 Pete44 said:

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In comment 15322075 Italianju said: Quote: for Turner now. I just feel like having a 5 that can hit a 3 would be huge. We have to penetrating PG's now and mitch will just be clogging the paint hoping they throw him an alley oop Supposedly Myles Turner and Julius Randle have been working out together. I'm not sure how the salaries would work now in this kind of deal or who Indy would want, but Turner would make us a team to watch.

What little I've read doesn't seem like Indy wants to send Turner away.

In comment 15322081 Ten Ton Hammer said:

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In comment 15322079 Pete44 said: Quote: In comment 15322075 Italianju said: Quote: for Turner now. I just feel like having a 5 that can hit a 3 would be huge. We have to penetrating PG's now and mitch will just be clogging the paint hoping they throw him an alley oop Supposedly Myles Turner and Julius Randle have been working out together. I'm not sure how the salaries would work now in this kind of deal or who Indy would want, but Turner would make us a team to watch. What little I've read doesn't seem like Indy wants to send Turner away.

There's a lot of mixed messaging. Apparently they like Sabonis at the 5 and tried to give Turner away for Hayward, but they still value him.

Not sure if Obi + gets it done for the Knicks.

In comment 15322079 Pete44 said:

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In comment 15322075 Italianju said: Quote: for Turner now. I just feel like having a 5 that can hit a 3 would be huge. We have to penetrating PG's now and mitch will just be clogging the paint hoping they throw him an alley oop Supposedly Myles Turner and Julius Randle have been working out together. I'm not sure how the salaries would work now in this kind of deal or who Indy would want, but Turner would make us a team to watch.

Yeah actually im not sure we can make it work salary wise anymore.

In comment 15322075 Italianju said:

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for Turner now. I just feel like having a 5 that can hit a 3 would be huge. We have to penetrating PG's now and mitch will just be clogging the paint hoping they throw him an alley oop

Turner makes $18 million per. I don't think we have the salaries to send out to match. Mitch/Luca/Knox only gets you to like $11 million.

Saved if they waive Vildoza

In comment 15322054 Jon in NYC said:

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it. When things were looking bleak, Rose and Co pulled off a great move. Kemba won't need to be a 35+ MPG player anymore. With Rose in the mix he can play 28 minutes, Rose can play 20. Maybe even split more.

The bench is going to absolutely feast on opponent 2nd units.

Rose-IQ-Burks-Toppin-Noel

that gets you close enough. But I don't know what I'm willing to trade Obi/Mitch for Turner. He's obviously an upgrade at the 5 - but I don't know that it moves the needle enough to make the sacrifice worth it.

In comment 15322089 DanMetroMan said:

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Saved if they waive Vildoza

No point anymore. He's more valuable to include as trade filler.

even hollinger likes it


John Hollinger
@johnhollinger
If this wasn't already obvious, Kemba at whatever his cap number is going to be is a fantastic move for the Knicks.

but this is about as good an offseason that didn't see the Knicks land a HOFer or two or build a big three OR manage to sneak their way into the top 3 of the draft without liquifying the entire roster. And we all know each of these scenarios was all but impossible, so we added a good in his prime SG that excels at 3% shooting and we upgraded the PG position. I don't think Walker was any less a risk/reward than the FAs out there, outside of Paul, and we likely pay Walker nothing that impacts 2022 cap space.

I have no problems with this off-season now. I don't know how anyone could. Knicks obviously did their homework and took the best route to improving the team while being smart or at least careful.

In comment 15322092 Enzo said:

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that gets you close enough. But I don't know what I'm willing to trade Obi/Mitch for Turner. He's obviously an upgrade at the 5 - but I don't know that it moves the needle enough to make the sacrifice worth it.

I'd probably need a pick or two back if I was trading both Obi and Mitch.

In comment 15322095 Italianju said:

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even hollinger likes it John Hollinger @johnhollinger If this wasn't already obvious, Kemba at whatever his cap number is going to be is a fantastic move for the Knicks.

This is the most surprising thing of the offseason.

but maybe in separate deals. Id def think about trading obi for turner, but you cant have Turner, Mitch, Noel, and Taj so you would need another deal lined up for mitch.

we kept ALL our trade chips.

We are in fine shape. I am excited for the coming season and not scared of the seasons to come after that. All one can really ask for.

Also, the best part might be that we still have all those 2nd and 3rd year players coming back. God forbid Obi, IQ and RJB and Mitch actually take steps forward one more time. It does happen, especially with good coaching in place.

Actually do this with McBride, Sims and Grimes if they are buried early on. Thibs said this last year but they didn’t actually do it

“I think game-time is important,’’ Thibodeau said. “So if a young player is not getting the appropriate amount of time to develop, we’ll utilize the G-League. That’s become an important part of our league. We’ll certainly take advantage of that.’’

In comment 15322101 DanMetroMan said:

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Actually do this with McBride, Sims and Grimes if they are buried early on. Thibs said this last year but they didn’t actually do it “I think game-time is important,’’ Thibodeau said. “So if a young player is not getting the appropriate amount of time to develop, we’ll utilize the G-League. That’s become an important part of our league. We’ll certainly take advantage of that.’’

Need to do this. Develop those guys because if they make a big trade they'll either be part of it or be in the new Knicks rotation.

In comment 15322095 Italianju said:

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even hollinger likes it John Hollinger @johnhollinger If this wasn't already obvious, Kemba at whatever his cap number is going to be is a fantastic move for the Knicks.

anyone else remember Hollinger just killing the Knicks for allowing the immortal Jackie Butler to sign the with Spurs?

In comment 15322027 bceagle05 said:

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but we have a talented roster with depth at every position - and young talent to develop at every position. We've come a long way in a year and a half.

Yep exactly. Room to grow and a fun team to watch. I think they win 50 games. they will be more the team from last year's second half than first half.

In comment 15322044 Heisenberg said:

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In comment 15322036 widmerseyebrow said: Quote: ? Rod Strickland and Mark Jackson lol

Charlie Ward and Chris Childs as a combo were not bad at all but your point is well taken.

what does this make - 13 guaranteed contracts?
1-Randle
2-Fournier
3-Rose
4-Noel
5-Burks
6-RJ
7-Knox
8-Kemba
9-Taj
10-Mitch
11-Quickly
12-Grimes
13-Obi
Non-guaranteed - Vildoza, McBride, Sims

They still have the room exception of 4.9 mil as well. Sounds like Sims got a 2 way contract, would be interested to see if Vildoza & McBride make the 14th and 15th or if one gets pushed off for a 4.9 mil room exception.

not title winning good but they very much are "any night we can take down any team" good.

In comment 15322108 Steve in Greenwich said:

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what does this make - 13 guaranteed contracts? 1-Randle 2-Fournier 3-Rose 4-Noel 5-Burks 6-RJ 7-Knox 8-Kemba 9-Taj 10-Mitch 11-Quickly 12-Grimes 13-Obi Non-guaranteed - Vildoza, McBride, Sims They still have the room exception of 4.9 mil as well. Sounds like Sims got a 2 way contract, would be interested to see if Vildoza & McBride make the 14th and 15th or if one gets pushed off for a 4.9 mil room exception.

According to Begley, the Burks and Noel deals are not guaranteed in the 3rd year. Fournier not guaranteed in the 4th year.

Worth the risk/reward. Avoided Schroeder. I still hate the Noel move, but this def makes up for it.

I'll admit I'm a bigger fan of his than many, and he did struggle last year, but maybe another off-season helps the knee heal. When healthy, he is a terrific scorer. On a minimum or near-minimum deal, this is a really strong signing.

In comment 15322111 Ten Ton Hammer said:

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In comment 15322108 Steve in Greenwich said: Quote: what does this make - 13 guaranteed contracts? 1-Randle 2-Fournier 3-Rose 4-Noel 5-Burks 6-RJ 7-Knox 8-Kemba 9-Taj 10-Mitch 11-Quickly 12-Grimes 13-Obi Non-guaranteed - Vildoza, McBride, Sims They still have the room exception of 4.9 mil as well. Sounds like Sims got a 2 way contract, would be interested to see if Vildoza & McBride make the 14th and 15th or if one gets pushed off for a 4.9 mil room exception. According to Begley, the Burks and Noel deals are not guaranteed in the 3rd year. Fournier not guaranteed in the 4th year.

Are you 100% sure on this? Others have said the wording said not fully guaranteed. That's a big difference.

.

In comment 15322114 Section331 said:

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I'll admit I'm a bigger fan of his than many, and he did struggle last year, but maybe another off-season helps the knee heal. When healthy, he is a terrific scorer. On a minimum or near-minimum deal, this is a really strong signing.

I love his potential especially paired with Noel on clean up duty. That assumes health of course, but his ability to drive and create opportunities in the paint is special.

In comment 15322111 Ten Ton Hammer said:

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In comment 15322108 Steve in Greenwich said: Quote: what does this make - 13 guaranteed contracts? 1-Randle 2-Fournier 3-Rose 4-Noel 5-Burks 6-RJ 7-Knox 8-Kemba 9-Taj 10-Mitch 11-Quickly 12-Grimes 13-Obi Non-guaranteed - Vildoza, McBride, Sims They still have the room exception of 4.9 mil as well. Sounds like Sims got a 2 way contract, would be interested to see if Vildoza & McBride make the 14th and 15th or if one gets pushed off for a 4.9 mil room exception. According to Begley, the Burks and Noel deals are not guaranteed in the 3rd year. Fournier not guaranteed in the 4th year.

Unless Begley changed his time he said they are not “fully guaranteed” not that they are not guaranteed. Fournier’s option is in fact a team option

In comment 15322055 Beezer said:

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In EACH of his last five seasons, Kemba Walker has averaged more than 19 points, more than 4 assists and 3+ made 3-pointers per game. In the 75-year history of the New York Knicks franchise, no PG has EVER averaged at least 19 points, 4 dimes and 3 treys in ANY single season.

No way! How is it possible Clyde Frazier never averaged 3 treys? (Eyeroll)

His *tune*

Elf Payton in the past two years (108 games) 10.1 pts, 6.2 AST, 5.3 rbs
2.7 WS

Kemba in Boston (99 games)
19.9 points 4.8 AST 3.9 rbs
9.7 WS

Not a Knox guy at all. But good on him to realize his career is fading fast and requesting to play summer ball. Not inconceivable he turns it around and adds value. Tough with his poor defense but who knows?

And the Knicks.
Kemba needs days off to keep the Knee healthy but when he is on the court he is all out and fringe all-star.
The knee is a time bomb from the rumors from Boston and that's why they wanted out.
But with Rose, McBride and Quickley there are plenty of rest for Kemba

Love having Kemba here. Very excited to watch him this offseaosn. Overall I really like the moves now. Will be a fun team to watch.

the Thunder are going to pay him to walk. Curious how much they took on.

Lost in the Kemba love... we get to watch Rokas, Grimes, McBride, IQ, Obi, Sims, Vildoza starting Sunday... oh and Knox