|
|
|
| Quote: |
| @TomRock_Newsday Giants are going to run out of gold watches. Another vet has retired. This time it’s OL Zach Fulton, who informed the team of his decision last night. Fulton joins Todd Davis, Joe Looney and Kelvin Benjamin as guys who have hung ‘em up so far this training camp. |
No question the Giants were a better team last year, but coaches being universally hated is not a recipe for success. Coughlin wasn't winning here until he softened up a bit and the team won the Super bowl THAT YEAR.
I’m gonna need to evidence that Judge is “universally hated”. There are tons of statements from the players saying the exact opposite, so please post some of these elusive universally hated articles. I look forward to seeing them…
Yup, there is no positive. Anyone who has ever been part of an organization where people start to quit will tell you that. It sucks for morale.
That said, I don't think this has anything to do with Judge.
No question the Giants were a better team last year, but coaches being universally hated is not a recipe for success. Coughlin wasn't winning here until he softened up a bit and the team won the Super bowl THAT YEAR.
Where is the evidence that says that Judge is universally hated?
Why are we comparing Judge to guys like Patricia? Players did not like him. When did you hear this about Judge? Name one. One.
Worst O-line depth 9 years running.
A veteran who is about to enter the grind of a season may hang it up for a variety of reasons. It doesn't have to be a negative reflection on anyone (nor a positive one, either).
I'd prefer it is guys who are unsure if they want to compete step aside, but I don't look at it as either a plus or a minus.
Another item to address. Versatility. Fulton maybe was only a one side guy. Wiggins has had experience all over including Tackle. People just assumed Fulton was ahead.
Quote:
when is it time to ask hard questions about Judge and his style? Between the retirements, Robert Saleh's answer to the question about running laps, Benjamin's comments on his way out, Kenny Wiggins comments about the punishment and being used to it since he played for Matt Patricia (who was notoriously hated by the players and subsequently fired)...there's a lot a smoke here.
No question the Giants were a better team last year, but coaches being universally hated is not a recipe for success. Coughlin wasn't winning here until he softened up a bit and the team won the Super bowl THAT YEAR.
I literally had the same discussion with a buddy yesterday. I do think this may be related to the COVID protocols as cited by a poster earlier, but I am concerned the tough rhetoric from Judge could end up falling on deaf ears at some point like we saw with Coughlin before they started that players council within the team and they got Coughlin to lighten up a bit.
It’s a fine line in pro sports because you can’t really scold a bunch of grown men like they are college kids on a regular basis. I mean many of these players are already multi millionaires and make more than the guy screaming at them.
If we start to see the team giving up in key moments of games you will have your answer on how his style is working. We also don’t see 100% of his actions. Coughlin had a lot of nit picky things behind the scenes like the getting to meetings 5 minutes early stuff that pissed off players. I haven’t heard anything like that about Judge up to this point. It’s all been on the field.
Last year, we saw the exact opposite of them giving up in key moments. The team was lauded for it's work ethic, conditioning, spirit.
Also, there was an article (can't recall whose it was) on the fight and ensuing laps, etc which also said that Judge has gone out of his way to incorporate players' opinions on any number of things in camp and during the season.
There is no smoke, just vets who are either unprepared or unmotivated to do it one more time.
That possibly has as much to do with his retirement than anything else. Especially considering his stage of the career, salary cut ,etc.
Sterling Shepard even said they did harder camps at OU.
We should take this as an incredibly good sign, that people who don't want to grind are tapping out.
@tashanreed
Three #Raiders have retired in the past week: RB Theo Riddick, LB James Onwualu and OT Sam Young.
The media will do what they want. No players have said it's too tough for them aside for the guys who now since retired. He's making these guys buy in. Getting upset over 53rds of the roster is kind of silly.
Wiggins being first off the bench is telling for someone like Fulton.
@tashanreed
Three #Raiders have retired in the past week: RB Theo Riddick, LB James Onwualu and OT Sam Young.
Young and Riddick old guys as well.
Like the guy above you. Just, I don't get it.
👍
Yeah, this is a good point. We don't hear any of that anonymous sources stuff.
All 3 are slated to start in 2021.
This is not exactly ignoring the OL.
But at least he said the right things prior to sprinting down to Roy Rogers.
That works if you’re a HOFer like Michael Strahan. Not a JAG who gave up 11 sacks last year
But at least he said the right things prior to sprinting down to Roy Rogers.
The way he he left is simply not what would happen if you're a player who felt like the camp was bullshit being run by a know-nothing coach.
"Looney's agent Andy Ross told NFL Network's Mike Garafolo that once the O-lineman realized his body couldn't continue to take the pounding, it was time to ride into the sunset.
"Joe always felt when his body didn't respond the way he needed it to, it would be time to step away," Ross told Garafolo. "He has too much respect for the Giants and (offensive coordinator Jason) Garrett to not do that.""
Quote:
is this a way for vets to get out of training camp while not taking up a roster spot? Only to unretire when the season starts?
That works if you’re a HOFer like Michael Strahan. Not a JAG who gave up 11 sacks last year
Strahan didn't retire and come back he was allowed to sit out. Technically they can do this and it doesn't break any rules. Just a thought....
"Looney's agent Andy Ross told NFL Network's Mike Garafolo that once the O-lineman realized his body couldn't continue to take the pounding, it was time to ride into the sunset.
"Joe always felt when his body didn't respond the way he needed it to, it would be time to step away," Ross told Garafolo. "He has too much respect for the Giants and (offensive coordinator Jason) Garrett to not do that.""
"He has too much respect..." is a good way to start off a friendly parting. You guys should well trained in this type of speech.
That's pure speculation. One could easily guess this is COVID/vaccine related. But that would be speculation too.
You don't want players on the team who are not fully committed to doing what it takes to win
There are players who are in it for a pay check and would like to skate by.
This will not happen with Joe Judge's Giants
The team is better off knowing now then in season
This gives the Giants an opportunity to find a replacement
If you're worried about how the players feel about Judge I'd recommend you read the comments from Shepard and Ryan. Two of the most veteran and respected players on the team and locker room leaders.
To quote Shepard "If you don't like it, then you're welcome to leave. But that's the way that we do things around here and everybody is standing by that, and I'm all for it". Coming from a guy who has played for McAdoo & Shurmer before Judge and only for the Giants.
To quote Ryan "Players are tired of losing games around here. The fanbase is tired. Management gave us an opportunity and gave us a better roster this year, and we're coming out competing". Coming from one of the few guys in the locker room who has a Super Bowl ring.
And this one from Ryan too “It’s football. It’s a physical sport. If you’re not tough or chippy I don’t know if you can play this game. Me, Evan, we’re locker buddies. We’ll be fine. This is a football team. Practice gets physical and chippy, but everything gets left between the lines". “There’s going to be some chippiness. There’s going to be some griminess. But we’re leaving it within the lines,” Ryan said. “And I’ll take a team like that. I’ll take a team like that every single day.”
I've had a front seat on the Joe Judge bandwagon train since the first day I heard him speak. He's backing up the talk with actions. The Giants had a terrible roster last year and he was a first year coach dealing with very limited team building opportunity before the season began because of COVID. It showed on the field but the team got better as the season went on and there is something building here that I think is going to be great.
I have a feeling in a month or two we're going to have to add a lot more cars to the Joe Judge bandwagon train. Get on now while good seats are still available.
lol
Maybe Fulton saw the writing on the wall and knew he was probably going to be beaten out
@DougKyed
·
55m
It's easy to wonder if there's a larger issue at hand after three Giants players (Todd Davis, Joe Looney and Zach Fulton) recently retired during training camp.
"There is absolutely nothing there. The Giants were great," a source close to a retired player said this morning.
Raiders
Link - ( New Window )
These guys a making big money but they know when their bodies can't taking the pounding anymore (or the specter of living with arthritis or brain injury, after multiple concussions); we all need to respect that.
No question the Giants were a better team last year, but coaches being universally hated is not a recipe for success. Coughlin wasn't winning here until he softened up a bit and the team won the Super bowl THAT YEAR.
Holy crap, those must be some seriously worn down pearls you're clutching
I kid, I kid.
The real problem with the Looney and Fulton retirements are depth.
There is no smoke, just vets who are either unprepared or unmotivated to do it one more time.
Yep, but not surprised by the reaction of some, it seems to be the MO of quite a few posters.