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Andrew Thomas - sick during pats preseason game

Elite12 : 9/10/2021 10:11 am
Article by Zack Rosenblatt today that says on the day of the pats preseason game Thomas "received multiple IVs due to dehydration, multiple people close to him said. He was sick all week in New England during joint practices. He started anyway — and struggled, allowing a sack on the game’s third play, and another on the next drive. Quarterback Daniel Jones was hit several times, and Thomas was often the culprit.

“You really have to know the reason why he came out looking sluggish,” said Kevin Johnson, Thomas’ mentor. “He could hardly breathe. One thing I told him was: ‘You’ve got guts, and you’ve got cajones, because most guys would fold.’ Most guys would say: ‘All right, I’m not playing.’”

That makes me feel better!


How Giants’ Andrew Thomas, a musician, learned to tune out the noise — with some help from Jay-Z - ( New Window )
I suggest everyone read  
bLiTz 2k : 9/10/2021 10:14 am : link
this entire article.
wow  
BleedBlue : 9/10/2021 10:14 am : link
makes some sense for sure.


THIS is a perfect example of fans making knee jerk reactions without really knowing much of anything. COuld we have known? No...but was it warranted to panic and say season over? also no
That's good to hear because  
M.S. : 9/10/2021 10:16 am : link

Andrew Thomas made alotta folks feel very sick that game.
I'll give Thomas and Jones this...  
Dnew15 : 9/10/2021 10:16 am : link
both guys are tremendous gamers.

I think that's why everyone (front office/coaches/players/even fans to an extent) want to see them succeed in the league.

The real question is - do they have the talent and skill to go along with their attitude and grit.
Not a surprise,  
Big Blue '56 : 9/10/2021 10:16 am : link
but when you’re “at this” as long as a bunch of us are, you put very little stock in preseason performances or even the first few games of the regular season, albeit winning is nice..😎
That's  
Professor Falken : 9/10/2021 10:17 am : link
a good way to get your QB killed.
Then why did Giants PR put him out there for postgame  
FranknWeezer : 9/10/2021 10:17 am : link
interviews if he was so ill?
RE: I'll give Thomas and Jones this...  
Big Blue '56 : 9/10/2021 10:18 am : link
In comment 15358219 Dnew15 said:
Quote:
both guys are tremendous gamers.

I think that's why everyone (front office/coaches/players/even fans to an extent) want to see them succeed in the league.

The real question is - do they have the talent and skill to go along with their attitude and grit.


Well as many of us have said re Jones, 25 games played if far from definitive, one way or the other and that THIS season should tell a bunch of us what we might have here moving forward (if they move forward)..
RE: Not a surprise,  
bLiTz 2k : 9/10/2021 10:19 am : link
In comment 15358220 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
but when you’re “at this” as long as a bunch of us are, you put very little stock in preseason performances or even the first few games of the regular season, albeit winning is nice..😎


Not sure if sarcasm, but this place is overreaction city.
if far=is far  
Big Blue '56 : 9/10/2021 10:19 am : link
.
Can't Be  
ZogZerg : 9/10/2021 10:20 am : link
Thomas Sucks and can't play LT.
It's impossible for players to improve from their Rookie year...


.... BBI
RE: Then why did Giants PR put him out there for postgame  
bLiTz 2k : 9/10/2021 10:20 am : link
In comment 15358222 FranknWeezer said:
[quote] interviews if he was so ill? [/quote

I believe the media requests the players to interview.
This should be Pinned...  
BigBlueJ : 9/10/2021 10:21 am : link
Cause it is BBI after all.
He didn’t look healthy at all to me.  
JoeyBigBlue : 9/10/2021 10:21 am : link
I’ll trust the excellent camp he was having over one game everyday of the week.
RE: He didn’t look healthy at all to me.  
Big Blue '56 : 9/10/2021 10:23 am : link
In comment 15358232 JoeyBigBlue said:
Quote:
I’ll trust the excellent camp he was having over one game everyday of the week.


I prefer the subjective and informed assessments of his preseason play..😎
RE: That's good to hear because  
bLiTz 2k : 9/10/2021 10:24 am : link
In comment 15358218 M.S. said:
Quote:

Andrew Thomas made alotta folks feel very sick that game.


More people are sick of the whining on this board above all else.
Makes sense if true.  
Everyone Relax : 9/10/2021 10:24 am : link
Let's just see a good game from him on Sunday so we dont have to hear excuses from his mentor anymore.
RE: RE: That's good to hear because  
Big Blue '56 : 9/10/2021 10:26 am : link
In comment 15358239 bLiTz 2k said:
Quote:
In comment 15358218 M.S. said:


Quote:



Andrew Thomas made alotta folks feel very sick that game.



More people are sick of the whining on this board above all else.


Yup and why I’ll step away for most if not all of the regular season meltdowns..
I'm not saying he didn't have some sort of ailment  
csb : 9/10/2021 10:26 am : link
But with COVID precautions if he had cold/flu-like symptoms and tested negative, wouldn't they still hold him out? I feel like anyone with a sniffle wouldn't be allowed to play in a preseason game. Maybe I'm wrong
RE: That's  
RCPhoenix : 9/10/2021 10:29 am : link
In comment 15358221 Professor Falken said:
Quote:
a good way to get your QB killed.


I've never understood the rationale for playing someone who is at, perhaps, no more than 50% effectiveness due to injury or illness. Isn't it better for the team to have someone who can perform adequately? Especially when it's the person protecting the starting QB's blind side.

I know the NFL has long had this macho thing about playing through injuries and illness, but there is a point at which it affects performance to the point where another player should be used.
I wish nj.com didn't have a paywall  
D HOS : 9/10/2021 10:36 am : link
Ads are displaying, but they also require payment.

I'll pay for the Athetic. NJ.com, not so much.
He could barely breath  
Gregorio : 9/10/2021 10:36 am : link
and was sick all week, why was he in the field? There’s a point where gutting it out becomes foolish.
RE: RE: That's  
Big Blue '56 : 9/10/2021 10:37 am : link
In comment 15358252 RCPhoenix said:
Quote:
In comment 15358221 Professor Falken said:


Quote:


a good way to get your QB killed.



I've never understood the rationale for playing someone who is at, perhaps, no more than 50% effectiveness due to injury or illness. Isn't it better for the team to have someone who can perform adequately? Especially when it's the person protecting the starting QB's blind side.

I know the NFL has long had this macho thing about playing through injuries and illness, but there is a point at which it affects performance to the point where another player should be used.


Or, he’s a warrior, wanted to give it a go to accrue more snaps in a limited pre-season, felt better with IVs and played as long as he could. Who could forget Jordan’s performance against the Knicks with a high temp and flu symptoms? Yes, it was not pre-season, but it says a lot, at least to me..
RE: I wish nj.com didn't have a paywall  
Big Blue '56 : 9/10/2021 10:39 am : link
In comment 15358265 D HOS said:
Quote:
Ads are displaying, but they also require payment.

I'll pay for the Athetic. NJ.com, not so much.


On my iPad, when that stuff shows, I click on reader’s view and the article usually comes in en toto. Sometimes, it doesn’t but most of the time for me.
Was Kevin Johnson The same guy  
SirLoinOfBeef : 9/10/2021 10:40 am : link
from last year that was explaining why Thomas was struggling early on? I remember something about how the Giants were changing his technique and it hurt his blocking. Or was it his old OL coach at Georgia?

RE: I wish nj.com didn't have a paywall  
Elite12 : 9/10/2021 10:40 am : link
In comment 15358265 D HOS said:
Quote:
Ads are displaying, but they also require payment.

I'll pay for the Athetic. NJ.com, not so much.


Use "reader view" on safari/iphone.
RE: RE: RE: That's  
Go Terps : 9/10/2021 10:42 am : link
In comment 15358269 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
In comment 15358252 RCPhoenix said:


Quote:


In comment 15358221 Professor Falken said:


Quote:


a good way to get your QB killed.



I've never understood the rationale for playing someone who is at, perhaps, no more than 50% effectiveness due to injury or illness. Isn't it better for the team to have someone who can perform adequately? Especially when it's the person protecting the starting QB's blind side.

I know the NFL has long had this macho thing about playing through injuries and illness, but there is a point at which it affects performance to the point where another player should be used.



Or, he’s a warrior, wanted to give it a go to accrue more snaps in a limited pre-season, felt better with IVs and played as long as he could. Who could forget Jordan’s performance against the Knicks with a high temp and flu symptoms? Yes, it was not pre-season, but it says a lot, at least to me..


That was against the Jazz.

If you're on the field, you're on the field. Playing as shitty as Thomas did could have gotten Jones or someone else hurt. Being sick is no excuse.
gracias  
D HOS : 9/10/2021 10:42 am : link
y danke schon
I'm feeling sick just...  
D HOS : 9/10/2021 10:44 am : link
... trying to imagine playing offensive line while feeling sick.
Sounds absurd to play him then  
Essex : 9/10/2021 10:45 am : link
in a preseason game if you want your QB alive for the regular season and during a pandemic. Anyway, all of this speculation will end in the next month. Andrew Thomas will have the opportunity to show he is the player that was developing the second half of last year or that the player from the first ten games is his real ability. I am rooting for him in every way possible.
If true, that's good to hear...  
sb from NYT Forum : 9/10/2021 10:47 am : link
...but I don't fault Giants fans for being worried after watching him against the Pats. He was that bad, and in ways that he didn't show last season.

Now what's Peart's excuse?
RE: RE: RE: RE: That's  
Big Blue '56 : 9/10/2021 10:47 am : link
In comment 15358279 Go Terps said:
Quote:
In comment 15358269 Big Blue '56 said:


Quote:


In comment 15358252 RCPhoenix said:


Quote:


In comment 15358221 Professor Falken said:


Quote:


a good way to get your QB killed.



I've never understood the rationale for playing someone who is at, perhaps, no more than 50% effectiveness due to injury or illness. Isn't it better for the team to have someone who can perform adequately? Especially when it's the person protecting the starting QB's blind side.

I know the NFL has long had this macho thing about playing through injuries and illness, but there is a point at which it affects performance to the point where another player should be used.



Or, he’s a warrior, wanted to give it a go to accrue more snaps in a limited pre-season, felt better with IVs and played as long as he could. Who could forget Jordan’s performance against the Knicks with a high temp and flu symptoms? Yes, it was not pre-season, but it says a lot, at least to me..



That was against the Jazz.

If you're on the field, you're on the field. Playing as shitty as Thomas did could have gotten Jones or someone else hurt. Being sick is no excuse.


Sorry, meant the Jazz (I really did).
Why would someone that sick be playing in an exhibition  
Greg from LI : 9/10/2021 10:49 am : link
That just seems weird to me
I am assuming this is true  
D HOS : 9/10/2021 10:51 am : link
Therefore, consider not a peep from him about it in his interview. Me... I'm not feeling well and someone ask me why I didn't do this or why I did that less good than normal and I'm immediately over-explaining how I'm not feeling well.

Thomas? Stone cold on that front. Accepted all the responsibility (blame). Good job!
RE: He could barely breath  
barens : 9/10/2021 10:52 am : link
In comment 15358266 Gregorio said:
Quote:
and was sick all week, why was he in the field? There’s a point where gutting it out becomes foolish.


Yup, almost got Jones killed.
IF this is TRUE  
MotownGIANTS : 9/10/2021 10:55 am : link
then the GM, COACHES and MEDICAL staff should be ashamed. Why risk all the potential injuries? He gutted out joint practices .... the risk is and was not worth the reward.
RE: RE: That's  
MotownGIANTS : 9/10/2021 10:55 am : link
In comment 15358252 RCPhoenix said:
Quote:
In comment 15358221 Professor Falken said:


Quote:


a good way to get your QB killed.



I've never understood the rationale for playing someone who is at, perhaps, no more than 50% effectiveness due to injury or illness. Isn't it better for the team to have someone who can perform adequately? Especially when it's the person protecting the starting QB's blind side.

I know the NFL has long had this macho thing about playing through injuries and illness, but there is a point at which it affects performance to the point where another player should be used.


Exactly ...
Can't read the article.  
SirLoinOfBeef : 9/10/2021 10:56 am : link
Is anyone form the Giants confirming this story?
So you put a guy who is ridiculously sick  
Mike from Ohio : 9/10/2021 10:58 am : link
out there to get run over and around and risked getting your QB blindsided in a game that means nothing?

I doubt this is true, and if it is Judge has some explaining to do, because that is reckless and stupid.
RE: Why would someone that sick be playing in an exhibition  
bradshaw44 : 9/10/2021 10:59 am : link
In comment 15358302 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
That just seems weird to me


This.
RE: Why would someone that sick be playing in an exhibition  
GNewGiants : 9/10/2021 11:04 am : link
In comment 15358302 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
That just seems weird to me


He probably had the case of the shits and his trainer/agent are blowing it up to be something else.

Here's what I know. Sunday is the real deal. If he can keep Chubb and Miller away from Jones - I dont give a shit about a preseason game. If he struggles, it will be a long year.
RE: Not a surprise,  
jvm52106 : 9/10/2021 11:04 am : link
In comment 15358220 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
but when you’re “at this” as long as a bunch of us are, you put very little stock in preseason performances or even the first few games of the regular season, albeit winning is nice..😎


Very true. I am more concerned that in that article it mentions his ankle injury from last year and in the game something clearly was wrong (sick or not) with his ankle as one minute it was not wrapped and then next it was heavily wrapped. Might be nothing and hopefully just sick but it didn't appear that way after re-watching that game.
Gettleman picked him, so he must be a talentless, gutless dog, right?  
Victor in CT : 9/10/2021 11:05 am : link
good for him. he needed the reps and toughed it out.
RE: RE: Why would someone that sick be playing in an exhibition  
Big Blue '56 : 9/10/2021 11:15 am : link
In comment 15358322 GNewGiants said:
Quote:
In comment 15358302 Greg from LI said:


Quote:


That just seems weird to me



He probably had the case of the shits and his trainer/agent are blowing it up to be something else.

Here's what I know. Sunday is the real deal. If he can keep Chubb and Miller away from Jones - I dont give a shit about a preseason game. If he struggles, it will be a long year.


If he struggles in this game it will be a long year? This is one of the reasons why it is healthier to take most of the regular season off from BBI..
Healthier for me,  
Big Blue '56 : 9/10/2021 11:16 am : link
that is
so our QB taking hits is a good idea  
ATL_Giants : 9/10/2021 11:18 am : link
because playing when you can't play well = cajones?
RE: Why would someone that sick be playing in an exhibition  
ATL_Giants : 9/10/2021 11:19 am : link
In comment 15358302 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
That just seems weird to me
Because having a healthy QB isn't important.
RE: RE: RE: Why would someone that sick be playing in an exhibition  
GNewGiants : 9/10/2021 11:20 am : link
In comment 15358334 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
In comment 15358322 GNewGiants said:


Quote:


In comment 15358302 Greg from LI said:


Quote:


That just seems weird to me



He probably had the case of the shits and his trainer/agent are blowing it up to be something else.

Here's what I know. Sunday is the real deal. If he can keep Chubb and Miller away from Jones - I dont give a shit about a preseason game. If he struggles, it will be a long year.



If he struggles in this game it will be a long year? This is one of the reasons why it is healthier to take most of the regular season off from BBI..


Yes, if Thomas doesnt play well - its gonna be a long year and it starts with game 1. I am not saying he needs to be Joe Thomas - but he needs to give us something to believe in.
i think folks are taking "he can hardly breath" comment  
UConn4523 : 9/10/2021 11:20 am : link
a bit too literally. You either believe that he was sick (sounds like a flu of sorts) or you don't. Coupled with the ankle and I'm hoping we chalk it up to a bad week for Thomas.
Results. That’s what the average Giant fan wants  
JohnB : 9/10/2021 11:23 am : link
And so far, Thomas has been lacking. Yes there are excuses but they only go so far.

Results please
Enough of the outrage  
UberAlias : 9/10/2021 11:24 am : link
It's football.From the sound of it, I'm guessing most of you never played.
Rosenblatt is credible  
Biteymax22 : 9/10/2021 11:26 am : link
And has been doing a really good job getting some decent stories as of late so I'll take his word on this.

With that being said I find it odd that with the combination of covid and a coaching staff that's been so cautious with injured players that they'd let him go through a whole week that sick without resting.

This can explain why he got a random day off the next week, possibly his body never full recovered?
I find it hard to believe that Judge and the coaching staff  
jlukes : 9/10/2021 11:30 am : link
would have played Thomas so much if his health was such a detriment to his performance and thus put others on the field (Jones) at risk for injury
Would "most guys" have folded?  
Ten Ton Hammer : 9/10/2021 11:33 am : link
I don't know about that. Linemen are historically tough to the point of recklessness. They will play sick and hurt if you let them.
RE: Would  
Victor in CT : 9/10/2021 11:35 am : link
In comment 15358366 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
I don't know about that. Linemen are historically tough to the point of recklessness. They will play sick and hurt if you let them.


tell that to Eric Moore
RE: Enough of the outrage  
Mike from Ohio : 9/10/2021 11:36 am : link
In comment 15358351 UberAlias said:
Quote:
It's football.From the sound of it, I'm guessing most of you never played.


Or didn't play on teams that were very stupid.
Honestly not suprised, every knee jerked to his reaction, but he looke  
Zeke's Alibi : 9/10/2021 11:38 am : link
like a rock the other games we saw him in.
cmon  
Platos : 9/10/2021 11:38 am : link
HAVE WE LEARNED NOTHING FROM THE PANDEMIC?!?
Never cared a bit from the beginning  
John In CO : 9/10/2021 11:39 am : link
Its a PRESEASON game. A practice. Period. Should have been end of story. BUT....of course with the game being nationally televised and most people seeming to just be searching for anything to criticize the Giants about (DG and Judge aint what you would call popular outside of, and in many cases, inside NY), social media had to blow it up sky high. The ONLY thing that matters is his play from Sunday through the rest of the seasons. Thats it...thats all that matters. People want to blow up on Sunday night after he gives up sacks..fine....but to do it after a f'ing preseason game is just nuts.
I wonder what the excuse is going to be  
cjac : 9/10/2021 11:42 am : link
when Von Miller runs around him, and Bradley Chubb runs through him
Enough of the excuses  
Saos1n : 9/10/2021 11:43 am : link
Just prove it on the field. Feel better? Good. Play better
For everyone predicting that Miller and Chubb are going to wreak havoc  
Walker Gillette : 9/10/2021 11:58 am : link
You guys do realize that Miller hasn't played since 2019 and is now 32. Chubb had ankle surgery, barely practiced all summer, just got in a limited practice yesterday and to top it off was arrested this week! Lets play the game and see what happens.
Smells like PR a bit  
Jim in Forest Hills : 9/10/2021 12:00 pm : link
Von Miller is coming on Sunday, so we'll see.
I still believe he will be a outstanding  
Lines of Scrimmage : 9/10/2021 12:00 pm : link
OT and a big part of the turnaround. I have no issue with Judge playing him. He is building a culture of accountability and toughness.

Good article. Seems to have a great family and his mentor sounds like he has had a huge impact. Let's hope his HOF prediction comes to fruition.
Schwartz reports internal concern on Thomas  
Sean : 9/10/2021 12:02 pm : link
Ugh, cannot afford to botch another high OL pick. I’m still hopeful, but this is not good.
Link - ( New Window )
RE: RE: Why would someone that sick be playing in an exhibition  
Zeke's Alibi : 9/10/2021 12:07 pm : link
In comment 15358322 GNewGiants said:
Quote:
In comment 15358302 Greg from LI said:


Quote:


That just seems weird to me



He probably had the case of the shits and his trainer/agent are blowing it up to be something else.

Here's what I know. Sunday is the real deal. If he can keep Chubb and Miller away from Jones - I dont give a shit about a preseason game. If he struggles, it will be a long year.



So if he struggles against the league best in week 1 it's going to be a long year? Sample size 1 means little in stats.
RE: Schwartz reports internal concern on Thomas  
Lines of Scrimmage : 9/10/2021 12:10 pm : link
In comment 15358411 Sean said:
Quote:
Ugh, cannot afford to botch another high OL pick. I’m still hopeful, but this is not good. Link - ( New Window )


That is concerning. Schwartz is well connected with the Giants and I do not consider him someone to make things up.
RE: Schwartz reports internal concern on Thomas  
Go Terps : 9/10/2021 12:11 pm : link
In comment 15358411 Sean said:
Quote:
Ugh, cannot afford to botch another high OL pick. I’m still hopeful, but this is not good. Link - ( New Window )


We drafted that guy over Herbert, Lamb, and Wirfs...
Is Paul Schwartz of the Post a reliable reporter???  
Rick in Dallas : 9/10/2021 12:12 pm : link
Living in Dallas have no idea if this guy is reliable??
RE: Is Paul Schwartz of the Post a reliable reporter???  
Ira : 9/10/2021 12:15 pm : link
In comment 15358429 Rick in Dallas said:
Quote:
Living in Dallas have no idea if this guy is reliable??


Yes. He's steady and honest.
RE: Is Paul Schwartz of the Post a reliable reporter???  
Essex : 9/10/2021 12:19 pm : link
In comment 15358429 Rick in Dallas said:
Quote:
Living in Dallas have no idea if this guy is reliable??

He is not Pat Leonard and he is not going to make anything up.

This would be a monumental miss if we did. I mean we have drafted 2,4,6 and those picks all of huge question marks from ability to position to injury etc etc. We need those guys to be cornerstones by Years 2,3, and 4 of their respective careers, not ? marks. It is going to get ugly around here if these guys don't produce this year and rightly so.
RE: Schwartz reports internal concern on Thomas  
BrettNYG10 : 9/10/2021 12:21 pm : link
In comment 15358411 Sean said:
Quote:
Ugh, cannot afford to botch another high OL pick. I’m still hopeful, but this is not good. Link - ( New Window )


This is really concerning. Schwartz says they thought he could step in be good - did they again select a 'high floor' player, misjudge the floor, and miss out on superior prospects? I'm hopeful on Thomas, but the initial analysis on him seemed to be wrong.
I really don't want to hear excuses for the 4th overall pick  
90.Cal : 9/10/2021 12:23 pm : link
He needs to play like what he was drafted to be, meaning he has to be more like Trent Williams or Tyron Smith and less like Ereck Flowers or Nate Solder. Let's see it now, period

As a Giants fan of course I want him to be great but my confidence in him is growing very thin.
..  
Sean : 9/10/2021 12:24 pm : link
At some point, the player personnel department will need to be overhauled. You can’t keep botching top 10 draft picks and just shuffle deck chairs around.

There was a very vocal group of posters here who hated Reese, but he still invested in the OL. What is different with Gettleman? It feels all the same to me.
RE: ..  
Lines of Scrimmage : 9/10/2021 12:29 pm : link
In comment 15358443 Sean said:
Quote:
At some point, the player personnel department will need to be overhauled. You can’t keep botching top 10 draft picks and just shuffle deck chairs around.

There was a very vocal group of posters here who hated Reese, but he still invested in the OL. What is different with Gettleman? It feels all the same to me.


I think Judge was very much in agreement on this pick and he may have very well been someone who pushed it.
If the Giants tank again in 2021 is John Mara ready to make changes  
Rick in Dallas : 9/10/2021 12:29 pm : link
I mean real substantive changes at the GM level, college scouting department and pro personnel department.I just don’t think it’s in his DNA. That’s what really frustrates me about this current mess.
If true about internal concerns with respect to Thomas ability some of this rests with Judge inability to assess his talent correctly not only DG.
Idk how much influence Judge had on Thomas..  
Sean : 9/10/2021 12:31 pm : link
He has strong ties to the Georgia program, but he never coached a game at that point and was only with the Giants for 3.5 months. I’m sure he was in agreement, but doubt he was the deciding factor.
RE: So you put a guy who is ridiculously sick  
Bill in UT : 9/10/2021 12:34 pm : link
In comment 15358315 Mike from Ohio said:
Quote:
out there to get run over and around and risked getting your QB blindsided in a game that means nothing?

I doubt this is true, and if it is Judge has some explaining to do, because that is reckless and stupid.


This
RE: RE: So you put a guy who is ridiculously sick  
Bill in UT : 9/10/2021 12:36 pm : link
In comment 15358458 Bill in UT said:
Quote:
In comment 15358315 Mike from Ohio said:


Quote:


out there to get run over and around and risked getting your QB blindsided in a game that means nothing?

I doubt this is true, and if it is Judge has some explaining to do, because that is reckless and stupid.



This


And where in this narrative does taping the ankle during the game fit in?
Ideally you want your OL  
Lines of Scrimmage : 9/10/2021 12:43 pm : link
coach putting these guys through a workout. With Covid, this was not the case.

Some of the draft guys said Thomas was sloppy with his footwork.

Columbo tried to change his footwork. Maybe Sale is trying to. Perhaps he may just be someone who it may look ugly but he gets the job done his own way.
Sean and Rick in order to overhaul the Player Personnel Department  
arniefez : 9/10/2021 12:51 pm : link
John Mara would have to fire his brother and his nephew. I'm doubtful that happens in my lifetime. Hopefully you guys are about 30 years younger. I'm almost 70.

Chris Mara is the Senior Vice President of Player Personnel and his nephew Tim McDonnell was just promoted to Co Director of Player Personnel after two years as Assistant Director of Player Personnel. Some people think Tim McDonnell, Susan Mara's son (she's the 2nd oldest of the Mara owners, John is the oldest), is next in line to be CEO of the Giants when John steps away. I doubt they're going anywhere.

The Giants did hire Kyle O’Brien, most recently with the Lions for 4 years and before that with Jacksonville, as a senior personnel executive in college scouting. Supposedly he was heavily involved in the Giants’ pre-draft process. The Giants created a position for him. He did not replace anyone.
If Thomas busts it wouldn't be a shock  
arniefez : 9/10/2021 12:55 pm : link
It has happened before with guys like Greg Robinson and Robert Gallery. Brandon Scherff was the 5th pick and he would up playing guard.

Hopefully Thomas develops into a very good OT. That is what he was drafted to be almost right away. So far not yet.
RE: He could barely breath  
BMac : 9/10/2021 12:58 pm : link
In comment 15358266 Gregorio said:
Quote:
and was sick all week, why was he in the field? There’s a point where gutting it out becomes foolish.


Can't win either way, eh?
RE: RE: Enough of the outrage  
UberAlias : 9/10/2021 1:00 pm : link
In comment 15358371 Mike from Ohio said:
Quote:
In comment 15358351 UberAlias said:


Quote:


It's football.From the sound of it, I'm guessing most of you never played.



Or didn't play on teams that were very stupid.
Care to explain?
RE: If Thomas busts it wouldn't be a shock  
Jay on the Island : 9/10/2021 1:11 pm : link
In comment 15358486 arniefez said:
Quote:
Brandon Scherff was the 5th pick and he would up playing guard.

Hopefully Thomas develops into a very good OT. That is what he was drafted to be almost right away. So far not yet.

Scherff was always expected to play guard in the NFL. There were reports that he could play OT but he was a much better prospect inside.
Thomas being a bust would be a worse development than Jones  
Eric on Li : 9/10/2021 1:18 pm : link
they got their pick of the litter in a very strong OL draft and one of the features of picking OL high is their relatively lower bust rate. Schwartz is usually pretty solid so if accurate that's one of the more concerning things i've seen written this preseason (if not the most concerning).
and to be clear I mean in terms of draft picks/evaluations  
Eric on Li : 9/10/2021 1:20 pm : link
but QB draft picks bust all the time. The odds are way against any QB first round pick. they aren't nearly as bad for top OL.

it would obviously be far worse in terms of on the field results for a QB to be a bust over any other position.
When Thomas was picked, my floor for him was  
cosmicj : 9/10/2021 1:25 pm : link
An above average yet unexciting player. That’s how sure a pick I thought he was. If he is a below average LT, that is f******g catastrophic, because we may well be starting a new QB clock this offseason and need a solid OL to relaunch and do it right this time.

And I don’t buy the “I was sick” line. Either it is a (false) line or Judge backed himself into a mistake where Thomas had to play because he hadn’t seen any action yet in the preseason. That something like this was going during a goddamn preseason game points to management failure.

RE: Thomas being a bust would be a worse development than Jones  
Jimmy Googs : 9/10/2021 1:26 pm : link
In comment 15358520 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
they got their pick of the litter in a very strong OL draft and one of the features of picking OL high is their relatively lower bust rate. Schwartz is usually pretty solid so if accurate that's one of the more concerning things i've seen written this preseason (if not the most concerning).


indeed...
Eric  
cosmicj : 9/10/2021 1:26 pm : link
You were clear. I’m 100% with you.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Why would someone that sick be playing in an exhibition  
Reale01 : 9/10/2021 1:27 pm : link
In comment 15358343 GNewGiants said:
Quote:
In comment 15358334 Big Blue '56 said:


Quote:


In comment 15358322 GNewGiants said:


Quote:


In comment 15358302 Greg from LI said:


Quote:


That just seems weird to me



He probably had the case of the shits and his trainer/agent are blowing it up to be something else.

Here's what I know. Sunday is the real deal. If he can keep Chubb and Miller away from Jones - I dont give a shit about a preseason game. If he struggles, it will be a long year.



If he struggles in this game it will be a long year? This is one of the reasons why it is healthier to take most of the regular season off from BBI..



Yes, if Thomas doesnt play well - its gonna be a long year and it starts with game 1. I am not saying he needs to be Joe Thomas - but he needs to give us something to believe in.


He may have believed the back up options were worse and so he tried to go.
I stepped away for a minute thought about this story  
cosmicj : 9/10/2021 1:37 pm : link
And think it’s either bullshit or it casts Judge in a bad light. Pick one, This is a preseason game.

re: Schwartz's info  
JonC : 9/10/2021 1:40 pm : link
ouch, not shocked if true but tend to think this could be a hard push to motivate him, which sucks on its own.
RE: For everyone predicting that Miller and Chubb are going to wreak havoc  
FStubbs : 9/10/2021 1:42 pm : link
In comment 15358406 Walker Gillette said:
Quote:
You guys do realize that Miller hasn't played since 2019 and is now 32. Chubb had ankle surgery, barely practiced all summer, just got in a limited practice yesterday and to top it off was arrested this week! Lets play the game and see what happens.


... that means he's well rested?

Von Miller is Von Miller until proven otherwise - which I hope somehow Thomas is able to
Watching Wirfs  
mittenedman : 9/10/2021 1:50 pm : link
last night was tough. He's a stud RT and had all the size, athleticism and character the Giants look for.

Hopefully they aren't overvaluing Georgia and Alabama connections.
RE: re: Schwartz's info  
Lines of Scrimmage : 9/10/2021 1:50 pm : link
In comment 15358572 JonC said:
Quote:
ouch, not shocked if true but tend to think this could be a hard push to motivate him, which sucks on its own.


Normally I would agree as Schwartz would be someone the Giants would use for this. I don't recall anywhere where attitude or work ethic has been a issue but who knows. Maybe a little too much drum playing.
RE: RE: RE: Why would someone that sick be playing in an exhibition  
Ten Ton Hammer : 9/10/2021 1:59 pm : link
In comment 15358419 Zeke's Alibi said:
Quote:


So if he struggles against the league best in week 1 it's going to be a long year? Sample size 1 means little in stats.


Sample size aside, he was the number 4 pick in the draft. I can buy this as a rookie. I wasn't concerned when he got lit up by Bud Dupree last year, but "he's going against the league's best" can't be the explanation when you're a top 5 pick. You're telling the world you think this guy is going to be among the league's best.
RE: Watching Wirfs  
Zeke's Alibi : 9/10/2021 2:14 pm : link
In comment 15358585 mittenedman said:
Quote:
last night was tough. He's a stud RT and had all the size, athleticism and character the Giants look for.

Hopefully they aren't overvaluing Georgia and Alabama connections.


According to the asshats it was between Wirfs and AT, but do you take a good LT over a very good RT? That's the debate they had in house.

AT looked very solid in preseason before the Pats game, people need to chill, especially after this report.
RE: RE: For everyone predicting that Miller and Chubb are going to wreak havoc  
Walker Gillette : 9/10/2021 2:16 pm : link
In comment 15358575 FStubbs said:
Quote:
In comment 15358406 Walker Gillette said:


Quote:


You guys do realize that Miller hasn't played since 2019 and is now 32. Chubb had ankle surgery, barely practiced all summer, just got in a limited practice yesterday and to top it off was arrested this week! Lets play the game and see what happens.



... that means he's well rested?

Von Miller is Von Miller until proven otherwise - which I hope somehow Thomas is able to


Same thing goes for Saquon, Golladay and Rudolph!
RE: RE: RE: RE: Why would someone that sick be playing in an exhibition  
Zeke's Alibi : 9/10/2021 2:17 pm : link
In comment 15358602 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
In comment 15358419 Zeke's Alibi said:


Quote:




So if he struggles against the league best in week 1 it's going to be a long year? Sample size 1 means little in stats.



Sample size aside, he was the number 4 pick in the draft. I can buy this as a rookie. I wasn't concerned when he got lit up by Bud Dupree last year, but "he's going against the league's best" can't be the explanation when you're a top 5 pick. You're telling the world you think this guy is going to be among the league's best.


Right, but people have wild expectations of what they think struggling is. The fans here zero in on the negatives with the Giants players, but not other players. Just look at how one poor throw is diagnosed from DJ ad naesuem. I watched Dak make like 8 of those yesterday (tbf he did throw the ball 50 times or whatever it was)

They think good LTs go out and stonewall guys play after play after play. That's what ELITE LTs do. Go look at the history of the top 10, most these guys don't turn out to be Elite and many are straight up busts. If he gives up a sack with minimal pressures Sunday, whatever. If he's giving up pressures left and right, that will be concerning.
Ereck Flowers  
Silver Spoon : 9/10/2021 2:57 pm : link
Part Deux
RE: Ereck Flowers  
Joe Beckwith : 9/10/2021 3:18 pm : link
In comment 15358681 Silver Spoon said:
Quote:
Part Deux


Then we could have a powerful Guard.
very thoughtful piece  
ColHowPepper : 9/10/2021 5:20 pm : link
reminds me of another LT, Beatty (like Peart, from UConn, I think), whose life's love was poetry, so you wondered whether he was truly cut out to be an NFL lineman. He had injury issues too, cut his career short and I think led to some of the Flowers drama.

Want Thomas to do very well
I agree with this cosmic  
Eric on Li : 9/10/2021 5:45 pm : link
In comment 15358565 cosmicj said:
Quote:
And think it’s either bullshit or it casts Judge in a bad light. Pick one, This is a preseason game.


And re: Judge, I know this will get spun into a different narrative that I don't intend, but imo the choice between those 4 OT's last year is 100% on him. So if they are already publicly bagging the guy they chose (which I'm inclined to not believe) that's not only a bad thing to do but a terrible reflection on their draft process. Wills played at Bama where Judge had current staffers on staff. Thomas played for Kirby Smart, and where he had a current coach on staff.

If both players are graded closely and the other guy ends up a little better you tip your cap. If 1 ends up a lemon and it's not the one you chose that's a big failure of process.

Now all that said I believe the mystery illness rumor before I believe they are publicly knocking a 2nd year player who played through an ankle injury last year that required surgery, for a coach they saw fit to fire halfway through the year (team's bad hire, not Thomas'). Thomas had plenty of chances to do unwise things like blame his problems on Columbo or the injury and it didn't seem like he did anything out of step. If they wanted to send a message they could just as easily have let Solder play more at LT like they did with Peart at RT. But they didn't.
 
christian : 9/10/2021 5:52 pm : link
I don’t think the Giants would use the press to get through to a player. But I don’t discount frustration in the building with Thomas’s play.

All said, Sale has a tough gig. Four of the five guys on the line need to really improve their consistency from their last time out.
I wouldn't discount them being frustrated with a lot of guys  
Eric on Li : 9/10/2021 5:58 pm : link
In comment 15358861 christian said:
Quote:
I don’t think the Giants would use the press to get through to a player. But I don’t discount frustration in the building with Thomas’s play.

All said, Sale has a tough gig. Four of the five guys on the line need to really improve their consistency from their last time out.


but that's normal. I'm sure there are varying levels of frustration with Toney, Slayton (drops), Engram (hurt again), Jackson/Golladay (both hurt already), Jones (int), Peart actually got demoted, etc. that'd all be normal and if Coughlin were the head coach he'd probably have verbatim rant to that effect.

Judge seems a little more big picture and progress oriented with young players. So i'd see him getting more frustrated with the coaching staff not finding a way to make things work than with the player (especially since they invested so much in OL coaches).
RE: RE: RE: RE: That's  
BestFeature : 9/10/2021 6:06 pm : link
In comment 15358279 Go Terps said:
Quote:
In comment 15358269 Big Blue '56 said:


Quote:


In comment 15358252 RCPhoenix said:


Quote:


In comment 15358221 Professor Falken said:


Quote:


a good way to get your QB killed.



I've never understood the rationale for playing someone who is at, perhaps, no more than 50% effectiveness due to injury or illness. Isn't it better for the team to have someone who can perform adequately? Especially when it's the person protecting the starting QB's blind side.

I know the NFL has long had this macho thing about playing through injuries and illness, but there is a point at which it affects performance to the point where another player should be used.



Or, he’s a warrior, wanted to give it a go to accrue more snaps in a limited pre-season, felt better with IVs and played as long as he could. Who could forget Jordan’s performance against the Knicks with a high temp and flu symptoms? Yes, it was not pre-season, but it says a lot, at least to me..



That was against the Jazz.

If you're on the field, you're on the field. Playing as shitty as Thomas did could have gotten Jones or someone else hurt. Being sick is no excuse.


If you're trying to predict his performance when he's healthy it's definitely an excuse as it likely obscures his abilities while healthy.
 
christian : 9/10/2021 6:06 pm : link
I think it takes a different type of frustration for it to get to a reporter.

I hate to say it, but if there’s a loudmouth in the front office not following the Judge script, it’s not hard for me to guess who that is.
Having a guy play sick  
Dave on the UWS : 9/10/2021 6:06 pm : link
when he says “I’m fine” isn’t so far/ fetched. Also, Schwartz is a pretty good reporter, but I’ve never liked the “un-named sources in the building” stuff. Good be people who favored Wirfs and didn’t like the pick.
I believe what I see. He improved quite a bit last year PLAYING ON AN ANKLE that needed surgery. There have been NO reports ( unlike with Erik Flowers), that he doesn’t work hard and that he doesn’t taking coaching well.
He wasn’t really good out of the gate? Happens all the time. Like with Jones, we should know a lot more by season’s end.
....  
ColHowPepper : 9/10/2021 6:18 pm : link
well, for one thing, the gist of the article was that Johnson was teaching Thomas to tune out the (advance) media, since when have the Giants used a reporter to get a player to get his head straight? Sounds asinine, particularly in a Joe Judge environment.

Frustration publicly vented for the Sale et al.? Equally dubious: we saw that Judge dealt with Colombo quite directly. Perhaps it's not the loudmouth as in usual suspects, but the usual suspects trying to mollify angry and frustrated fans, à la McAdoo and Geno. Just more mud against the wall.

As I said in a different context, nothing about this pre-season augurs well for me.
Two words  
M.S. : 9/10/2021 6:23 pm : link

Tristan Wirfs.
RE: …  
Ten Ton Hammer : 9/10/2021 8:18 pm : link
In comment 15358874 christian said:
Quote:
I think it takes a different type of frustration for it to get to a reporter.

I hate to say it, but if there’s a loudmouth in the front office not following the Judge script, it’s not hard for me to guess who that is.


If you mean DG, that seems hard to believe. Then again he's an accorsi student who also loves to talk.

Garrett has a little history of knives in the back of his head coach. Plenty think he had a lot to do with wade Phillips getting fired
RE: Ereck Flowers  
WillVAB : 9/10/2021 8:53 pm : link
In comment 15358681 Silver Spoon said:
Quote:
Part Deux


Yep, same trash technique that can’t be coached out of him. The OL scouts in the organization are terrible.
RE: RE: Schwartz reports internal concern on Thomas  
LakeGeorgeGiant : 9/10/2021 10:30 pm : link
In comment 15358427 Go Terps said:
Quote:
In comment 15358411 Sean said:


Quote:


Ugh, cannot afford to botch another high OL pick. I’m still hopeful, but this is not good. Link - ( New Window )



We drafted that guy over Herbert, Lamb, and Wirfs...


It is worth noting that if they had taken Lamb you would have been leading the chorus of people crying about taking a WR.
RE: So you put a guy who is ridiculously sick  
bw in dc : 9/10/2021 10:31 pm : link
In comment 15358315 Mike from Ohio said:
Quote:
out there to get run over and around and risked getting your QB blindsided in a game that means nothing?

I doubt this is true, and if it is Judge has some explaining to do, because that is reckless and stupid.


I read all the comments on this and your first paragraph nails it for me.

If this was a regular season game, I could appreciate the valor. But to expose our QB to injury because our unproven LT is too sick to play in a preseason game is pure negligence.

It's become very clear that Judge pays attention to every detail. So it this is true, there is no doubt in my mind Judge knew this. And the media should relentlessly hound him on this for more information and clarity.
Imagine thinking that your LT, who has played one season  
BestFeature : 9/10/2021 11:33 pm : link
is a bust already. This board is a joke. LT is one of the hardest positions to play and people already know he's a bust, fucking embarrassing.
I hope we win the first game  
joe48 : 9/11/2021 9:22 am : link
This board will explode with negativity if we lose. It has become so toxic. Winning could fix that.
Wonder if  
ghost718 : 9/11/2021 10:13 pm : link
Thomas claiming he was sick and than the insider info coming out are just a coincidence.

Doesn't make certain people look good,that's for sure.
RE: Two words  
Ned In Atlanta : 9/11/2021 10:26 pm : link
In comment 15358890 M.S. said:
Quote:

Tristan Wirfs.


Wirfs is clearly the best tackle of the class, and from what i have read from people who know what they're talking about he's already playing at an all pro level. Its unfortunate that the Giants didn't pick what looks like is clearly the best tackle of the class, but no one can predict that and we don't have a time machine. The Giants just need Thomas to be at worst an above average left tackle which I still think is within the range of outcomes. If he's a bust we may be looking at another 3-5 years of awful football.
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