After reviewing the game and thinking about what happened I have come away with the impression that the Giants played not to lose rather than playing to win
The Giants never attempted to impose their will on the game
They were exceptionally conservative on offense and defense
It was about avoiding mistakes
Until late in the fourth quarter the defense played a soft zone without blitzing
This was bend but not break
The Giants never attempted to make Bridgewater uncomfortable they tried to confuse with coverage
On offense the Giants were running the ball and throwing short passes. This occurred until the game was out of hand
There was no attempt to stretch the field and attack the edges
In addition I was surprised that the Giants did not make changes at the half. They stuck with the game plan and did not make changes until the game was out of hand.
I think this is on Joe Judge as he establishes the game planning goals and objectives
I was inclined to criticize Garrett and Graham but in retrospect they were doing what Judge wanted
The coaching may be conservative in an attempt to cover for the weaknesses of the players
You have to let them play
Denver on the other hand played to win. On offense they took chances like going for it in 4th downs, on defense they blitzed for both runs and passes
It was applying pressure
This may not be a good team but I would take the training wheels off and let them play
Lets force the issue
Do you trust DJ to make it happen?
Do you trust the OL to keep him upright?
Do you trust the WR to get open?
Do you trust the defense to make a key stop on 3rd or 4th down?
It's hard to change the coaching philosophy when you trust your guys.
That's when you have to stop being a teacher and start being a coach.
Do you trust DJ to make it happen?
Do you trust the OL to keep him upright?
Do you trust the WR to get open?
Do you trust the defense to make a key stop on 3rd or 4th down?
It's hard to change the coaching philosophy when you trust your guys.
That's when you have to stop being a teacher and start being a coach.
Agree 100%. I feel they always game planning to hide the warts. Cover your ass seems to be the organization's plan.
They took a chance because they knew there was zero risk.
This was bend but not break"
Actually it was bend and then break!
with 4 minutes left in Q2 on the NYG possession that started inside their own 5 yard line they were clearly trying to not make a mistake. and they may as well have just punted on 1st down (they ran booker up the middle, a schemed pass attempt to penny, and a schemed short pass to rudolph). None of the 3 plays even had a chance to get past the sticks.
and the next time Daniel Jones attempted a pass was at 6:08 of the 3rd Quarter down 10 points because the Broncos had 2 long drives, with 4th down conversions, that resulted in touchdowns. And not just the 4th down conversions, several 3rd and longs that were either converted or put them into manageable 4th downs.
Those 3 possessions defined the game and dramatically flipped the entire game dynamic from the Giants leading to trailing by 10 with zero margin for error - without the offense even having a say in changing the momentum.
Both coordinators, and to whatever the head coach influenced them, put their players behind the 8 ball by playing things way too safe.
I'm less worried about the defense than the offense because we know Graham knows how to adjust. Garrett's offense was the same stale garbage we saw last year. Pat Shurmur's offense had more rhythm with a QB in his first game there than we've seen since Pat Shurmur was last here with a rookie QB.
On defense, blitzing and playing close to the line of scrimmage only works if you trust your defensive backs and covering linebackers to not give up huge plays.
If you play aggressively with shitty players, you could be down 4 touchdowns in the blink of an eye. Perhaps the coaches are not just stupid and this is simply the best the Giants can do given their roster limitations.
Now a bad roster and a shitty qb, who might we blame for that? Jason Garrett, right?
with 4 minutes left in Q2 on the NYG possession that started inside their own 5 yard line they were clearly trying to not make a mistake. and they may as well have just punted on 1st down (they ran booker up the middle, a schemed pass attempt to penny, and a schemed short pass to rudolph). None of the 3 plays even had a chance to get past the sticks.
What if the coaches are terrified of the offensive line attempting to block in that situation or Jones turning the ball over and risking a blow out at halftime? Let's just do it and be legends?
On defense, blitzing and playing close to the line of scrimmage only works if you trust your defensive backs and covering linebackers to not give up huge plays.
If you play aggressively with shitty players, you could be down 4 touchdowns in the blink of an eye. Perhaps the coaches are not just stupid and this is simply the best the Giants can do given their roster limitations.
Now a bad roster and a shitty qb, who might we blame for that? Jason Garrett, right?
The argument there is what is your expectation of winning if you're going in wanting to play a turtle offense.
Even at the height of Eli Manning's struggles, Tom Coughlin didn't choose to play a conservative, fear-based style of play.
If the coaches do.not trust the the OL...they can play.up tempo...which also favors Jones....
The lack of play action passes is befuddling.
The run game was not putting our RB is their best light.
The coaches failed their players and.failed us
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why a team does not play aggressively when it is physically overmatched. Its easy to say "open things up" and "go for big plays," but what if the coaches know the offensive line cannot block for plays that take time to develop? What if the coaches don't trust Jones to not make huge mistakes?
On defense, blitzing and playing close to the line of scrimmage only works if you trust your defensive backs and covering linebackers to not give up huge plays.
If you play aggressively with shitty players, you could be down 4 touchdowns in the blink of an eye. Perhaps the coaches are not just stupid and this is simply the best the Giants can do given their roster limitations.
Now a bad roster and a shitty qb, who might we blame for that? Jason Garrett, right?
The argument there is what is your expectation of winning if you're going in wanting to play a turtle offense.
Even at the height of Eli Manning's struggles, Tom Coughlin didn't choose to play a conservative, fear-based style of play.
I do not view it as necessarily "fear-based." The coaches probably think its the best chance they have to win. Keep the game close and try to steal it at the end. The progression in these games is nearly identical from Shurmur to Judge. Keep the games within reach while getting badly outplayed in the first half and eventually get worn down and your doors blown off in the second half. It is a classic sign of a team that is overmatched and outclassed week after week.
The real problem is that the football players on the Giants are not as good at football as the football players on the other teams. That is why they lose.
It's hard to win in this league when you do not have a qb that has the ability to consistently push the ball downfield through the air as well as an offensive line that can support that style of play.
I think that is part of his problem, good observation.
You can't play scared out there, you need to feel relaxed
and play the game. It's year 3 for him, they can't have
him playing scared at this point.
right after that throw down the sideline to Slayton...
So they gain about 30+ yards, then they put Toney in.
The next play Garrett decides to run the end around or quick
toss...Von Miller is just waiting there in contain, lost about five yards. What do they do next, the always exciting draw play for zilch.
That was some bad playcalling right there. Then something the Giants are good at, punting.
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with 4 minutes left in Q2 on the NYG possession that started inside their own 5 yard line they were clearly trying to not make a mistake. and they may as well have just punted on 1st down (they ran booker up the middle, a schemed pass attempt to penny, and a schemed short pass to rudolph). None of the 3 plays even had a chance to get past the sticks.
What if the coaches are terrified of the offensive line attempting to block in that situation or Jones turning the ball over and risking a blow out at halftime? Let's just do it and be legends?
if the coaches are terrified of their chosen starters how does that say anything good about them as coaches?
in fact that's the whole point of the thread. Denver coaches weren't afraid to let their players try to make plays. What if Denver was afraid to give the NYG the ball at midfield before half? What reason did they have to trust a brand new QB in that situation, who had only put up 3 points so far in the game?
(the answer is they would have ended up down at halftime, perhaps by even more than they already were, instead of up and with momentum)
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is his agressiveness is gone because he is afraid to turn the ball over..
.
I think that is part of his problem, good observation.
You can't play scared out there, you need to feel relaxed
and play the game. It's year 3 for him, they can't have
him playing scared at this point.
that is thing, not all turnovers are the same, he needs tk realize this
Absolutely true. He worries more about turnovers than making big plays.
Exactly the opposite of Eli. Amen to your comment times 10
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if the coaches are terrified of their chosen starters how does that say anything good about them as coaches?
in fact that's the whole point of the thread. Denver coaches weren't afraid to let their players try to make plays. What if Denver was afraid to give the NYG the ball at midfield before half? What reason did they have to trust a brand new QB in that situation, who had only put up 3 points so far in the game?
(the answer is they would have ended up down at halftime, perhaps by even more than they already were, instead of up and with momentum)
I mean they can only play the players on the roster. If the crop of players they have to choose from stinks, I am not sure that is on them.
I agree that at the margins of an otherwise even game, aggressive play calling can yield big rewards if successful. But the game was not even or close. Denver was better in every way. Denver wasn't afraid to take chances on fourth down because they were confident their defense could handle the giants offense. Could you honestly say the same about the Giants defense yesterday? Come on.
Could you imagine Kyler Murray or Lamar Jackson in the Giants offense ? How would they perform in a conventional offense ?
We were up 7-3 at one point. Then the playcalling got even worse
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In comment 15364164 eugibs said:
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if the coaches are terrified of their chosen starters how does that say anything good about them as coaches?
in fact that's the whole point of the thread. Denver coaches weren't afraid to let their players try to make plays. What if Denver was afraid to give the NYG the ball at midfield before half? What reason did they have to trust a brand new QB in that situation, who had only put up 3 points so far in the game?
(the answer is they would have ended up down at halftime, perhaps by even more than they already were, instead of up and with momentum)
I mean they can only play the players on the roster. If the crop of players they have to choose from stinks, I am not sure that is on them.
I agree that at the margins of an otherwise even game, aggressive play calling can yield big rewards if successful. But the game was not even or close. Denver was better in every way. Denver wasn't afraid to take chances on fourth down because they were confident their defense could handle the giants offense. Could you honestly say the same about the Giants defense yesterday? Come on.
Denver took their biggest risk down 7-3 in the possession at the end of 2nd quarter, immediately after the NYG possession where they were most conservative.
And yes, the coaches have responsibility for the players, 100%. The same staff has been here for 2 full drafts (both with offensive players selected in the first round) and 2 full FA periods. They had a say in Golladay, Rudolph, Booker, Toney, and the majority of the OL.
They had 90+ to choose from entering camp. The absolute minimum of expectation should be "not terrified of letting them play" in week 1 when the roster is almost fully healthy.
It's time to atleast give DJ a chance to make those kinds of throws when it counts.
Giants punt in that situation - no doubt in my mind.