I'm not going to sit here and defend Jason Garrett by any means but the QB is supposed to get to the line, read the defense, and figure out what play will work against the look. One of the biggest flaws in DJ's game is he has absolutely ZERO vision. Say what you want about the playcalling but the bottom line is that a good QB will be able to figure out what defense they are seeing and how to overcome it. Right now we have a QB that cannot read a defense, cannot prevent turnovers at crucial points of the game, cannot move the football and consistently get first downs to take pressure off the defense, and cannot go through his progressions to find open receivers. 20 rushes for 60 yards yesterday. This QB is simply not good enough to not make a concerted effort to run the ball and establish play action. One of the biggest mistakes the DG made this offseason was not getting a competent backup QB that can plug in for this disaster of a pick when he eventually gets benched.
DJ locks on to a guy and that is obvious but your weird defense of Garrett is off base. You can't just audible to a completely different kind of play, you have options off the call but they are all based on formation and players on the field.
DJ needs work on a number of items BUT, this offense makes it impossible to get any kind of rhythm going and the lack of variation (receivers running routes to exploit the defense and or help other routes become open) is a HUGE drawback to anything we do.
My other take is that Jason Garrett is not a good OC, but hes not the issue. Daniel Jones is not a starting QB. He has 22 INT and 30 Fumbles(18 Lost) in 28 Games. Thats not going to win you games in the NFL.
So, the team can’t run the ball but and that makes the QBs job much more difficult but that’s Jones’ fault somehow or something? Ok. Got it.
That Jones needs to do is understand that even though he has the right read, at least look off the d initially knowing you are coming back to the right WR. This he didn't do and needs to.
There are no inner workings needed to know any of this. The QB has control at the line. If they’re not allowing him to call audibles at the line then he shouldn’t be the QB of this team. I’m not defending JG. The play calling has not been good either. The problem with this offense is the QB.
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How do you have inner workings of his offense and know what DJ is responsible for? Interesting.
There are no inner workings needed to know any of this. The QB has control at the line. If they’re not allowing him to call audibles at the line then he shouldn’t be the QB of this team. I’m not defending JG. The play calling has not been good either. The problem with this offense is the QB.
This just isn't true, if the playcalling says run the ball against this look the QB runs the play. Garrett needs to do a better job calling plays when they are disguising looks so hard. The Broncos were very aggressive in what they did and it's up to the playcaller to call plays to take advantage of that. What they were showing at the line wasn't close to what they were running. Thats not on the QB.
My other take is that Jason Garrett is not a good OC, but hes not the issue. Daniel Jones is not a starting QB. He has 22 INT and 30 Fumbles(18 Lost) in 28 Games. Thats not going to win you games in the NFL.
He had one turnover yesterday, which extrapolated over the year, is actually under league average for QB.
When every possession matters and it's like walking a tightrope, the turnovers matter more.
I mean look at how much better their offense looked last year without Garrett around. Before he was injured Dak was putting up insane numbers with almost the same offensive personnel that they had the prior year. Their line was actually weaker due to injury, so the only real addition was a rookie WR in CeeDee Lamb.
I realize their team statistical numbers were always “solid” with Garrett, but with the offensive line they had you would have expected top 5 production.
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In comment 15364399 Thunderstruck27 said:
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How do you have inner workings of his offense and know what DJ is responsible for? Interesting.
There are no inner workings needed to know any of this. The QB has control at the line. If they’re not allowing him to call audibles at the line then he shouldn’t be the QB of this team. I’m not defending JG. The play calling has not been good either. The problem with this offense is the QB.
This just isn't true, if the playcalling says run the ball against this look the QB runs the play. Garrett needs to do a better job calling plays when they are disguising looks so hard. The Broncos were very aggressive in what they did and it's up to the playcaller to call plays to take advantage of that. What they were showing at the line wasn't close to what they were running. Thats not on the QB.
Exactly...I doubt Jones walked up to the line after he drew the defense offsides and threw an absolute strike to Slayton and said...it's a great idea to run the goofiest play ever designed to our rookie WR. If he had the authority to check out of that...I'm willing to bet he would have.
When every possession matters and it's like walking a tightrope, the turnovers matter more.
Bingo, people need to stop hammering on the turnovers. We need to call an offense that actually scores points, if we DJ creates turnovers at an unusually high rate at that point, fine you have a grip. But zeroing in on ONE turnover is ridiclous.
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being league average at turnovers wouldn't be a big deal.
When every possession matters and it's like walking a tightrope, the turnovers matter more.
Bingo, people need to stop hammering on the turnovers. We need to call an offense that actually scores points, if we DJ creates turnovers at an unusually high rate at that point, fine you have a grip. But zeroing in on ONE turnover is ridiclous.
Brett Favre was responsible for a lot of turnovers as well but they scored enough that it didn’t usually matter much.
People need to stop making excuses for Jason Garrett. He’s terrible and I seriously doubt Judge ever wanted him in the first place. Daniel Jones under Shurmer ran the gamut from really good to really bad. Under Garrett, he vacillates between average game manager and really bad. There’s never any high end performances. How is that not on Jason Garrett??
I mean look at how much better their offense looked last year without Garrett around. Before he was injured Dak was putting up insane numbers with almost the same offensive personnel that they had the prior year. Their line was actually weaker due to injury, so the only real addition was a rookie WR in CeeDee Lamb.
I realize their team statistical numbers were always “solid” with Garrett, but with the offensive line they had you would have expected top 5 production.
Garretts offense wants to control the ball and run long drives. Which actually worked with the Cowboys because they had a ton of offensive talent and they were able to keep their defense of the field.
I feel like we have zero synergy between what we want to do on offense and defense and how the team is constructed.
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In comment 15364399 Thunderstruck27 said:
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How do you have inner workings of his offense and know what DJ is responsible for? Interesting.
There are no inner workings needed to know any of this. The QB has control at the line. If they’re not allowing him to call audibles at the line then he shouldn’t be the QB of this team. I’m not defending JG. The play calling has not been good either. The problem with this offense is the QB.
This just isn't true, if the playcalling says run the ball against this look the QB runs the play. Garrett needs to do a better job calling plays when they are disguising looks so hard. The Broncos were very aggressive in what they did and it's up to the playcaller to call plays to take advantage of that. What they were showing at the line wasn't close to what they were running. Thats not on the QB.
You are 100% incorrect. The QB typically goes to the line with 3 options and they are not all run or all pass plays. That’s just utter stupidity and simply not how it works. If the QB reads the defense and a run play was called he can 100% change that play to a pass play or vice versa. Again, the play calling has not been good by Garrett but a good QB can make these simple adjustments needed to succeed. Go take a look at all of the QBs on Garrett’s other tenures. They’ve all mostly had success moving the ball. It’s time for everyone to admit already that this QB is a complete dud.
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In comment 15364414 Doubledeuce22 said:
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In comment 15364399 Thunderstruck27 said:
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How do you have inner workings of his offense and know what DJ is responsible for? Interesting.
There are no inner workings needed to know any of this. The QB has control at the line. If they’re not allowing him to call audibles at the line then he shouldn’t be the QB of this team. I’m not defending JG. The play calling has not been good either. The problem with this offense is the QB.
This just isn't true, if the playcalling says run the ball against this look the QB runs the play. Garrett needs to do a better job calling plays when they are disguising looks so hard. The Broncos were very aggressive in what they did and it's up to the playcaller to call plays to take advantage of that. What they were showing at the line wasn't close to what they were running. Thats not on the QB.
You are 100% incorrect. The QB typically goes to the line with 3 options and they are not all run or all pass plays. That’s just utter stupidity and simply not how it works. If the QB reads the defense and a run play was called he can 100% change that play to a pass play or vice versa. Again, the play calling has not been good by Garrett but a good QB can make these simple adjustments needed to succeed. Go take a look at all of the QBs on Garrett’s other tenures. They’ve all mostly had success moving the ball. It’s time for everyone to admit already that this QB is a complete dud.
Is it really fair to compare Garrett's other teams? How does the Cowboys offense look now that he's gone? Dak looks like the best QB in the NFL 2 years in a row(barring last years injury). The only thing fair to compare it to is when McCoy came in last year. He didn't exactly light up the scoreboard.
People need to stop making excuses for Jason Garrett. He’s terrible and I seriously doubt Judge ever wanted him in the first place. Daniel Jones under Shurmer ran the gamut from really good to really bad. Under Garrett, he vacillates between average game manager and really bad. There’s never any high end performances. How is that not on Jason Garrett??
Here we go again. Let’s start blaming all the weapons now. The team has a plethora of weapons and you’re simply not right. I was at the game too. It’s not hard to cover guys when the QB is staring down the receiver from the second the ball is snapped. I love how everyone blames a freaking offensive coordinator and not the QB who in incapable of throwing for 300 yards. He cannot move the ball consistently. Good QBs find a way to move the ball regardless of O line, regardless of “weapons” which the Giants have plenty of. Are you going to sit here and tell me Tyrod Taylor has better weapons on Houston? They moved the ball just fine yesterday and I’m not talking about one game. DJ hasn’t been able to consistently move the ball in well over a seasons worth of games now.
As the unit starts playing better fundamentally, I think we’ll see DJ and Garret’s offense improve.
As the unit starts playing better fundamentally, I think we’ll see DJ and Garret’s offense improve.
Is it fair to say that Jones best play yesterday was when he let one go after the Denver false start? He completed a great pass to Slayton immediately after throwing the playbook out the window.
Not once in those 17 games have the Giants topped 400 yards of total offense.
When the offense has been bad for 17 games, what's the common thread? The guy in charge of the offense. We had a brief change of QB last year due to injury and it's not like the lights switched on. It was still like pulling teeth.
Not once in those 17 games have the Giants topped 400 yards of total offense.
Interesting. Didn't Jones set records as a rookie in YPG and TDs?
Here we go again. Let’s start blaming all the weapons now. The team has a plethora of weapons and you’re simply not right. I was at the game too. It’s not hard to cover guys when the QB is staring down the receiver from the second the ball is snapped. I love how everyone blames a freaking offensive coordinator and not the QB who in incapable of throwing for 300 yards. He cannot move the ball consistently. Good QBs find a way to move the ball regardless of O line, regardless of “weapons” which the Giants have plenty of. Are you going to sit here and tell me Tyrod Taylor has better weapons on Houston? They moved the ball just fine yesterday and I’m not talking about one game. DJ hasn’t been able to consistently move the ball in well over a seasons worth of games now.
I’m not blaming “the weapons” for the fact no one is open on so many plays. I’m blaming Jason Garrett.
As for your point about “300 yards”, Daniel Jones threw for 300+ yards and amassed 4+ total TDs in the same game FOUR times as a rookie. He’s yet to throw for 300 yards under Garrett or account for more than two TDs in a game.
Jason Garrett isn’t a victim here. And I’m not trying to convince anyone that Jones is Joe Montana. But we can’t pretend Jones has never done these things before or act like he’s incapable of doing them. He did them under Pat Shurmer with an equally crappy offensive line and probably less skill position talent around him.
I try to stick to things I can say with confidence. It seems to me Jones, Barkley, and Slayton have all regressed since JG took over as OC. So that's where my mind is.
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the amount of plays in which NO ONE is even remotely open outnumber the plays in which Jones makes a terrible decision or misses an open receiver (and those plays surely existed yesterday).
People need to stop making excuses for Jason Garrett. He’s terrible and I seriously doubt Judge ever wanted him in the first place. Daniel Jones under Shurmer ran the gamut from really good to really bad. Under Garrett, he vacillates between average game manager and really bad. There’s never any high end performances. How is that not on Jason Garrett??
Here we go again. Let’s start blaming all the weapons now. The team has a plethora of weapons and you’re simply not right. I was at the game too. It’s not hard to cover guys when the QB is staring down the receiver from the second the ball is snapped. I love how everyone blames a freaking offensive coordinator and not the QB who in incapable of throwing for 300 yards. He cannot move the ball consistently. Good QBs find a way to move the ball regardless of O line, regardless of “weapons” which the Giants have plenty of. Are you going to sit here and tell me Tyrod Taylor has better weapons on Houston? They moved the ball just fine yesterday and I’m not talking about one game. DJ hasn’t been able to consistently move the ball in well over a seasons worth of games now.
Now you just sound dumb. Are we supposed to ignore Jones rookie season?
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In comment 15364435 shockeyisthebest8056 said:
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the amount of plays in which NO ONE is even remotely open outnumber the plays in which Jones makes a terrible decision or misses an open receiver (and those plays surely existed yesterday).
People need to stop making excuses for Jason Garrett. He’s terrible and I seriously doubt Judge ever wanted him in the first place. Daniel Jones under Shurmer ran the gamut from really good to really bad. Under Garrett, he vacillates between average game manager and really bad. There’s never any high end performances. How is that not on Jason Garrett??
Here we go again. Let’s start blaming all the weapons now. The team has a plethora of weapons and you’re simply not right. I was at the game too. It’s not hard to cover guys when the QB is staring down the receiver from the second the ball is snapped. I love how everyone blames a freaking offensive coordinator and not the QB who in incapable of throwing for 300 yards. He cannot move the ball consistently. Good QBs find a way to move the ball regardless of O line, regardless of “weapons” which the Giants have plenty of. Are you going to sit here and tell me Tyrod Taylor has better weapons on Houston? They moved the ball just fine yesterday and I’m not talking about one game. DJ hasn’t been able to consistently move the ball in well over a seasons worth of games now.
Now you just sound dumb. Are we supposed to ignore Jones rookie season?
The second year is the hardest year for a QB to sustain success as there is now a full years worth of game film on him. DJ has done nothing but regress at this point. Again, I don't care for Garrett either but a lot of the blame needs to be directed at the QB. You think a good QB come here and can't throw for 300 yards under the same regime? The problem is that he is not a good QB. All you have to do is watch the game to know this. This is his "no excuses" year, right? Well then let's stop with the excuses then. I know it's one game but it's alarming that this guy is incapable of moving the ball.
a)His rookie season consisted of three big games (against bad teams) and a bunch of mediocre games.
b)Why should his rookie performance outweigh his subsequent performance? Do you not think that coaches around the league have learned more about how to defend him since his rookie season?
I don’t know what got screwed up but somehow Jones threw a difficult pass, incomplete, which was far short of the first down.
That’s just dumb football and it could have been the difference between a win or loss.
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In comment 15364435 shockeyisthebest8056 said:
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the amount of plays in which NO ONE is even remotely open outnumber the plays in which Jones makes a terrible decision or misses an open receiver (and those plays surely existed yesterday).
People need to stop making excuses for Jason Garrett. He’s terrible and I seriously doubt Judge ever wanted him in the first place. Daniel Jones under Shurmer ran the gamut from really good to really bad. Under Garrett, he vacillates between average game manager and really bad. There’s never any high end performances. How is that not on Jason Garrett??
Here we go again. Let’s start blaming all the weapons now. The team has a plethora of weapons and you’re simply not right. I was at the game too. It’s not hard to cover guys when the QB is staring down the receiver from the second the ball is snapped. I love how everyone blames a freaking offensive coordinator and not the QB who in incapable of throwing for 300 yards. He cannot move the ball consistently. Good QBs find a way to move the ball regardless of O line, regardless of “weapons” which the Giants have plenty of. Are you going to sit here and tell me Tyrod Taylor has better weapons on Houston? They moved the ball just fine yesterday and I’m not talking about one game. DJ hasn’t been able to consistently move the ball in well over a seasons worth of games now.
Now you just sound dumb. Are we supposed to ignore Jones rookie season?
And how many games did the giants win in this myth that Jones had an amazing rookie season? It was more of the same bone headed plays that cost the team the game by and large and a bunch of garbage time stats. Before the fumble happened when the game was still a winnable game or at least close Jones had one td ; not even 200 yards passing and one bi costly fumble. It is something similar to last years viking game on the lateral play ; or his bone headed int in the 49 ers game ; or his frequent int's in the patriots game.
I love all these garret critics. He is calling a boring conservative game. Do you think maybe he knows what he is doing and knows that the jints are basically out gunned and out coached every week and that is the only chance they have at winning what otherwise would be a complete humiliation??
Let's get frankly realistic about the Giants. This is not a good team. And i am starting to wonder about judge now. THose guys were not ready to play yesterday.
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In comment 15364480 Doubledeuce22 said:
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In comment 15364435 shockeyisthebest8056 said:
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the amount of plays in which NO ONE is even remotely open outnumber the plays in which Jones makes a terrible decision or misses an open receiver (and those plays surely existed yesterday).
People need to stop making excuses for Jason Garrett. He’s terrible and I seriously doubt Judge ever wanted him in the first place. Daniel Jones under Shurmer ran the gamut from really good to really bad. Under Garrett, he vacillates between average game manager and really bad. There’s never any high end performances. How is that not on Jason Garrett??
Here we go again. Let’s start blaming all the weapons now. The team has a plethora of weapons and you’re simply not right. I was at the game too. It’s not hard to cover guys when the QB is staring down the receiver from the second the ball is snapped. I love how everyone blames a freaking offensive coordinator and not the QB who in incapable of throwing for 300 yards. He cannot move the ball consistently. Good QBs find a way to move the ball regardless of O line, regardless of “weapons” which the Giants have plenty of. Are you going to sit here and tell me Tyrod Taylor has better weapons on Houston? They moved the ball just fine yesterday and I’m not talking about one game. DJ hasn’t been able to consistently move the ball in well over a seasons worth of games now.
Now you just sound dumb. Are we supposed to ignore Jones rookie season?
The second year is the hardest year for a QB to sustain success as there is now a full years worth of game film on him. DJ has done nothing but regress at this point. Again, I don't care for Garrett either but a lot of the blame needs to be directed at the QB. You think a good QB come here and can't throw for 300 yards under the same regime? The problem is that he is not a good QB. All you have to do is watch the game to know this. This is his "no excuses" year, right? Well then let's stop with the excuses then. I know it's one game but it's alarming that this guy is incapable of moving the ball.
First let me apologize if my reply was insensitive. You seem like you have well thought out posts. I think our argument is over perspective. I expect a good coach to come in and get the most out of our players. My problem if you go back to 2019 and look at not just Jones, but Slayton...another rookie, both have regressed to the point of being bad. After 2019, one could argue that Jones turnovers were brutal but was promising in other catagories and that Slayton had a promising career ahead. 1 year and 1 game later...both look like shit. What exactly is Garrett responsible for? Coaches need to put players in positions to win.
I don’t know what got screwed up but somehow Jones threw a difficult pass, incomplete, which was far short of the first down.
That’s just dumb football and it could have been the difference between a win or loss.
It was not only that but I still think they should have went for the FG anyway. Instead you punt from the 40 ; it was a touch back ; and they get the ball on the 20. What did you save 20 yards???
On the other hand, good coordinators are supposed to bend their scheme to the talent of their players which obviously has not happened in 17 games. Poor fits for other and some arrogance thrown in as well and the results are possibly a bottom 3 offense… again
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Now you just sound dumb. Are we supposed to ignore Jones rookie season?
a)His rookie season consisted of three big games (against bad teams) and a bunch of mediocre games.
b)Why should his rookie performance outweigh his subsequent performance? Do you not think that coaches around the league have learned more about how to defend him since his rookie season?
Umm… they’ve also played bad teams while Jason Garrett has been here and those big games are nowhere to be found. In fact, I’m sure rookies have been playing bad teams since the creation of the sport, yet only two other rookies put up games like that. And those guys weren’t scrubs.
I don’t see anyone saying that those games as a rookie should “outweigh his subsequent performance”. I think the point is that some here act like Jones is incapable of doing those things when we saw it several times with Shurmer. Under Garrett, there’s nothing that remotely resembles those performances. In addition, Colt McCoy didn’t exactly come in and light it up while Jones was injured.
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In comment 15364607 Thunderstruck27 said:
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Now you just sound dumb. Are we supposed to ignore Jones rookie season?
a)His rookie season consisted of three big games (against bad teams) and a bunch of mediocre games.
b)Why should his rookie performance outweigh his subsequent performance? Do you not think that coaches around the league have learned more about how to defend him since his rookie season?
Umm… they’ve also played bad teams while Jason Garrett has been here and those big games are nowhere to be found. In fact, I’m sure rookies have been playing bad teams since the creation of the sport, yet only two other rookies put up games like that. And those guys weren’t scrubs.
I don’t see anyone saying that those games as a rookie should “outweigh his subsequent performance”. I think the point is that some here act like Jones is incapable of doing those things when we saw it several times with Shurmer. Under Garrett, there’s nothing that remotely resembles those performances. In addition, Colt McCoy didn’t exactly come in and light it up while Jones was injured.
Colt Mccoy got the job done. They won and upset a much better team. Clot Mccoy had some clutch plays down the stretch that extended drives. While those plays only show up on a stat sheet as just another completion and 8 yard gains. They were vital to winning. I also remember the defense came in fired up and Leonard made some big plays in that game. It's a team sport and Jones bone headed plays are momentum killers and game losing mistakes. No one is expecting Colt McCoy to come in and throw for 400 yards and 5 TDs against the Seahawks. Just like no one -- exccept some BBi faithful is expecting Jones to for that either wo all the turnovers that went along with it.
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In comment 15364628 Greg from LI said:
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In comment 15364607 Thunderstruck27 said:
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Now you just sound dumb. Are we supposed to ignore Jones rookie season?
a)His rookie season consisted of three big games (against bad teams) and a bunch of mediocre games.
b)Why should his rookie performance outweigh his subsequent performance? Do you not think that coaches around the league have learned more about how to defend him since his rookie season?
Umm… they’ve also played bad teams while Jason Garrett has been here and those big games are nowhere to be found. In fact, I’m sure rookies have been playing bad teams since the creation of the sport, yet only two other rookies put up games like that. And those guys weren’t scrubs.
I don’t see anyone saying that those games as a rookie should “outweigh his subsequent performance”. I think the point is that some here act like Jones is incapable of doing those things when we saw it several times with Shurmer. Under Garrett, there’s nothing that remotely resembles those performances. In addition, Colt McCoy didn’t exactly come in and light it up while Jones was injured.
Colt Mccoy got the job done. They won and upset a much better team. Clot Mccoy had some clutch plays down the stretch that extended drives. While those plays only show up on a stat sheet as just another completion and 8 yard gains. They were vital to winning. I also remember the defense came in fired up and Leonard made some big plays in that game. It's a team sport and Jones bone headed plays are momentum killers and game losing mistakes. No one is expecting Colt McCoy to come in and throw for 400 yards and 5 TDs against the Seahawks. Just like no one -- exccept some BBi faithful is expecting Jones to for that either wo all the turnovers that went along with it.
You do realize that the Colt McCoy game last year wasn't called by Garrett. He had Covid that game.
Still don't think Jones is particularly good either, though, and I've said that from day 1 as well.
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In comment 15364692 shockeyisthebest8056 said:
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In comment 15364628 Greg from LI said:
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In comment 15364607 Thunderstruck27 said:
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Now you just sound dumb. Are we supposed to ignore Jones rookie season?
a)His rookie season consisted of three big games (against bad teams) and a bunch of mediocre games.
b)Why should his rookie performance outweigh his subsequent performance? Do you not think that coaches around the league have learned more about how to defend him since his rookie season?
Umm… they’ve also played bad teams while Jason Garrett has been here and those big games are nowhere to be found. In fact, I’m sure rookies have been playing bad teams since the creation of the sport, yet only two other rookies put up games like that. And those guys weren’t scrubs.
I don’t see anyone saying that those games as a rookie should “outweigh his subsequent performance”. I think the point is that some here act like Jones is incapable of doing those things when we saw it several times with Shurmer. Under Garrett, there’s nothing that remotely resembles those performances. In addition, Colt McCoy didn’t exactly come in and light it up while Jones was injured.
Colt Mccoy got the job done. They won and upset a much better team. Clot Mccoy had some clutch plays down the stretch that extended drives. While those plays only show up on a stat sheet as just another completion and 8 yard gains. They were vital to winning. I also remember the defense came in fired up and Leonard made some big plays in that game. It's a team sport and Jones bone headed plays are momentum killers and game losing mistakes. No one is expecting Colt McCoy to come in and throw for 400 yards and 5 TDs against the Seahawks. Just like no one -- exccept some BBi faithful is expecting Jones to for that either wo all the turnovers that went along with it.
You do realize that the Colt McCoy game last year wasn't called by Garrett. He had Covid that game.
Oh right so they magiccally changed game plans to 5 wide out sets and had a bunch of deep route schemes. right?
You and a few Jones homers are the only ones who think this guy can just have a bnuch 4 WR sets and throw 30 yard passes like he is Dan fucking Marino without also fumbling or getting intercepted like 4X. Maybe he could. I have seen nothing NOTHING to indicate that. Not one game winning drive. Not one pass yesterday that was not a free play from an offsides. He can't even throw short. How many times does he just look right on a little curl and throw it at someone's feet.
Still don't think Jones is particularly good either, though, and I've said that from day 1 as well.
That's the point. Jones might not be good, but at least I've seen him have a big game. Garrett...not so much.
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In comment 15364704 Debaser said:
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In comment 15364692 shockeyisthebest8056 said:
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In comment 15364628 Greg from LI said:
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In comment 15364607 Thunderstruck27 said:
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Now you just sound dumb. Are we supposed to ignore Jones rookie season?
a)His rookie season consisted of three big games (against bad teams) and a bunch of mediocre games.
b)Why should his rookie performance outweigh his subsequent performance? Do you not think that coaches around the league have learned more about how to defend him since his rookie season?
Umm… they’ve also played bad teams while Jason Garrett has been here and those big games are nowhere to be found. In fact, I’m sure rookies have been playing bad teams since the creation of the sport, yet only two other rookies put up games like that. And those guys weren’t scrubs.
I don’t see anyone saying that those games as a rookie should “outweigh his subsequent performance”. I think the point is that some here act like Jones is incapable of doing those things when we saw it several times with Shurmer. Under Garrett, there’s nothing that remotely resembles those performances. In addition, Colt McCoy didn’t exactly come in and light it up while Jones was injured.
Colt Mccoy got the job done. They won and upset a much better team. Clot Mccoy had some clutch plays down the stretch that extended drives. While those plays only show up on a stat sheet as just another completion and 8 yard gains. They were vital to winning. I also remember the defense came in fired up and Leonard made some big plays in that game. It's a team sport and Jones bone headed plays are momentum killers and game losing mistakes. No one is expecting Colt McCoy to come in and throw for 400 yards and 5 TDs against the Seahawks. Just like no one -- exccept some BBi faithful is expecting Jones to for that either wo all the turnovers that went along with it.
You do realize that the Colt McCoy game last year wasn't called by Garrett. He had Covid that game.
Oh right so they magiccally changed game plans to 5 wide out sets and had a bunch of deep route schemes. right?
You and a few Jones homers are the only ones who think this guy can just have a bnuch 4 WR sets and throw 30 yard passes like he is Dan fucking Marino without also fumbling or getting intercepted like 4X. Maybe he could. I have seen nothing NOTHING to indicate that. Not one game winning drive. Not one pass yesterday that was not a free play from an offsides. He can't even throw short. How many times does he just look right on a little curl and throw it at someone's feet.
While you're babbling, you prove the point that someone else can come in for one game and run Garrett's offense better than him with a backup QB. Don't need Dan Marino...we need Colt McCoy and Freddie Kitchens. Please...
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In comment 15364714 Thunderstruck27 said:
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In comment 15364704 Debaser said:
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In comment 15364692 shockeyisthebest8056 said:
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In comment 15364628 Greg from LI said:
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In comment 15364607 Thunderstruck27 said:
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Now you just sound dumb. Are we supposed to ignore Jones rookie season?
a)His rookie season consisted of three big games (against bad teams) and a bunch of mediocre games.
b)Why should his rookie performance outweigh his subsequent performance? Do you not think that coaches around the league have learned more about how to defend him since his rookie season?
Umm… they’ve also played bad teams while Jason Garrett has been here and those big games are nowhere to be found. In fact, I’m sure rookies have been playing bad teams since the creation of the sport, yet only two other rookies put up games like that. And those guys weren’t scrubs.
I don’t see anyone saying that those games as a rookie should “outweigh his subsequent performance”. I think the point is that some here act like Jones is incapable of doing those things when we saw it several times with Shurmer. Under Garrett, there’s nothing that remotely resembles those performances. In addition, Colt McCoy didn’t exactly come in and light it up while Jones was injured.
Colt Mccoy got the job done. They won and upset a much better team. Clot Mccoy had some clutch plays down the stretch that extended drives. While those plays only show up on a stat sheet as just another completion and 8 yard gains. They were vital to winning. I also remember the defense came in fired up and Leonard made some big plays in that game. It's a team sport and Jones bone headed plays are momentum killers and game losing mistakes. No one is expecting Colt McCoy to come in and throw for 400 yards and 5 TDs against the Seahawks. Just like no one -- exccept some BBi faithful is expecting Jones to for that either wo all the turnovers that went along with it.
You do realize that the Colt McCoy game last year wasn't called by Garrett. He had Covid that game.
Oh right so they magiccally changed game plans to 5 wide out sets and had a bunch of deep route schemes. right?
You and a few Jones homers are the only ones who think this guy can just have a bnuch 4 WR sets and throw 30 yard passes like he is Dan fucking Marino without also fumbling or getting intercepted like 4X. Maybe he could. I have seen nothing NOTHING to indicate that. Not one game winning drive. Not one pass yesterday that was not a free play from an offsides. He can't even throw short. How many times does he just look right on a little curl and throw it at someone's feet.
While you're babbling, you prove the point that someone else can come in for one game and run Garrett's offense better than him with a backup QB. Don't need Dan Marino...we need Colt McCoy and Freddie Kitchens. Please...
No I did NOT! you are just so myopic on your Garret bashing that you completely missed the point. The point is that you are over emphasizing Garrets role. And you are pumping up Jones to be more than what he is.
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In comment 15364758 Debaser said:
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In comment 15364714 Thunderstruck27 said:
While you're babbling, you prove the point that someone else can come in for one game and run Garrett's offense better than him with a backup QB. Don't need Dan Marino...we need Colt McCoy and Freddie Kitchens. Please...
No I did NOT! you are just so myopic on your Garret bashing that you completely missed the point. The point is that you are over emphasizing Garrets role. And you are pumping up Jones to be more than what he is.
How am I pumping up Jones? By saying he had some good games in his rookie year and he's played like shit since? What is Garret's role again? Offensive Coordinator? That makes him responsible for...what? The....OFFENSE? The same offense that was absolutely brutal all last season and one game this season? Myopic indeed
I don't think jones has that feel, yet, and I hope he can develop it at some point
Blessed with a top 5 offensive line and a top 5 QB, you can look pretty smart. Even smarter than you really are. If he was so much of a plus to Dallas, how was he replaced so easily? Why didn't people in the league want him as their head coach?
Had playcalling stripped from him twice in Dallas
You really expect 3 -4 wide receiver sets and he’s just going to throw five TDS a game? Is that what you guys are really thinking ? Explain to me what you have seen in year 3 from jones that indicates that strategy of being more “aggressive “ would not result in like a fumble or getting intercepted like 5x???????
Maybe it’s the fact garret knows exactly what he has in jones and thinks being conservative is the only way to possibly win or otherwise suffer humiliating losses.
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We're talking about a guy who coached a 13-3 team and I think whose worst record as an NFL coach in a decade was 8-8. I wish this team would be 8-8. How sad is that. But I am sure you know more than he does ....
Had playcalling stripped from him twice in Dallas
By who that idiot owner jones? The guy is the biggest moron ever. He admitted twenty years later that firing coach Johnson was a mistake. Like no shit. Coach Johnson would not even toast after their third super bowl. Furthermore he started calling plays as offensive coordinator. The fact he stopped call ing plays as a head coach proved nothing.
Maybe it’s the fact garret knows exactly what he has in jones and thinks being conservative is the only way to possibly win or otherwise suffer humiliating losses.
Wild. The Giants are starting Jones at QB knowing the coordinator thinks he's a trash can? Seems implausible.
Also who are they going to start colt McCoy?
The fact is we have to watch this ridiculous spectacle because of Dave gettle”s brain fart. They didn’t win a lot of games during his rookie season you know. Gunslinger QBs turnover a lot but also win a lot
That Jones needs to do is understand that even though he has the right read, at least look off the d initially knowing you are coming back to the right WR. This he didn't do and needs to.
It's as if he's afraid that if he takes his eyes off the receiver, he won't be able to find him again.
No I did NOT! you are just so myopic on your Garret bashing that you completely missed the point. The point is that you are over emphasizing Garrets role. And you are pumping up Jones to be more than what he is.
Guys, guys, no need to argue... chances are you are both right. There's plenty of room for two incompetent people to coexist on this incompetent team.
Like DJ this is Garrett's prove it year with more talent on the offensive side of the ball. It has been slowed down due to injuries in the preseason but let's see what happens especially over the last half of the year.