Maybe taking Toney in the 1st round wasn't so smart. maybe taking an OL in one of the 1st three rounds? I mean 2nd game into the season and it feels like we are scrambling at OL. I guess they still have more faith than I do, but I don't have the rose colored glasses they have on.
Giants clearly didn’t love the OL class beyond Sewell. They felt the WR class was top notch. Perhaps OL class is better in 2022. Who knows. But to judge the 1st round pick after 1 game is nonsensical.
Regardless - they valued the Bears 1st round pick next year over whatever difference of player they could draft between 11 and 20. Remains to be seen if they will be right.
If this OL move backfires tonight BBI will have a historic meltdown
that Judge didn’t like what he saw and is making a change. THAT’s more consistent with what he’s been saying. Accountability and performance. This opens the door for Brederson to replace Hernandez too. Hopefully, Peart gets a lot more snaps so they can start transitioning away from Solder. This could all still be crap. But rolling the same as last week for example, is the definition of insanity.
None of us really know how these guys look in practice. I respect the coaches right to make decision as to who plays where. However, if this season goes to hell then DG is not the only one who should be held accountable. We all loved Judge because he projects confidence and direction, but to date he has not proven much. Give him freedom to make this team and then hold him accountable if he fails to show progress this year.
but Hernandez at RG and Peart at RT doesn't inspire confidence. I'd much rather see Gates at RG and Bredeson at LG.
To be honest, we don't know that it isn't that way.. We are all projecting what is happening but until the Starting lineup is announced we are just guessing based on Lemieux being out.
But taking out actual talent / how much does a move like this limit them for play calling given that price likely doesn’t know whole playbook? Or are the stunts that centers asked to do relatively basic and it’s not a big issue?
But taking out actual talent / how much does a move like this limit them for play calling given that price likely doesn’t know whole playbook? Or are the stunts that centers asked to do relatively basic and it’s not a big issue?
I think NYG expected Vera-Tucker to be there at #20 after the trade down ...
I just new the Toney pick was a fall back.
Be curious to know if they expected, or hoped. Two different things, and expecting a fast rising offensive lineman to be there is foolish. Regardless, you always take that trade.
I think NYG expected Vera-Tucker to be there at #20 after the trade down ...
I'm not saying you're wrong, but it would have been silly for them to think that. It was pretty widely known that AVT would be a top #20 pick. In any event, I can't see them declining the trade with the Bears to take AVT.
Helping the Right tackle, who-ever he is. This will keep Hernandez from abandoning his post (and letting his man get a clear shot at the RB).
Two things Washington will do - try to suffocate the passing game to Shepard and stack up the box on our right side, till we prove we can run to the left.
As you may recall I am close to Kwity Paye and I was involved with the draft process....from what I heard the Giants had their eyes on Smith,Waddle, Slater ,Vera Tucker,Surtain and Horn....not necessarily in that order
After Smith went and we traded down I suspect realistic options came down to Slater and Vera Tucker but all the guys the Giants front office had targeted were off the board
While I am disappointed we didn’t take Kwity I am much more disappointed with who we took with the 20th but time will tell .
If it ain't broke don't fix it. 'Sarcastic shaking of the head' With Judge starting could mean he might play the first series. By the second half they might bring out 9 offensive linemen and have them interlock arms at the snap then start running together downfield with Barkley hidden behind them. Hell bring out 10 and give Jones a rest snap the ball directly to Barkley. Call it the Hog Mollie Scrambling Wedge
RE: RE: If Gates is as good as we all seem to think he is
then this is an upgrade at LG. Centers are Centers,
What do you mean centers are centers? The center position is crucial to the OL, he's the captain of the line.
Are you serious? I am saying a Center-Center by trade- can play center. Fucking Gates was a G/T we moved to center last year without a true off season and preseason. Price is a center, who has played in the league. We didn't go grab the emergency Goalie from the arena stands to start in goal, we are moving a Center from backup to starting and our Center to Guard.
Are you serious? I am saying a Center-Center by trade- can play center. Fucking Gates was a G/T we moved to center last year without a true off season and preseason. Price is a center, who has played in the league. We didn't go grab the emergency Goalie from the arena stands to start in goal, we are moving a Center from backup to starting and our Center to Guard.
I believe Gates has actually started more games at center in the NFL than Price.
RE: Pressure up the middle seems like begging for trouble
That QB-C relationship shouldn't be taken for granted. Jones and Gates don't appear to have issues with getting the play started. Why disrupt that?
Why do you care since Jones sucks as far as you are concerned. Wouldn't this just help your cause?
Well, I certainly haven't been shy that I didn't think Jones was worthy of the 6th pick in the draft. And to date, his play has demonstrated that. But I would like him to succeed. So having his reliable C playing C seems the less risky move.
Price was drafted as a center in the first round but asked to play guard because of the development of Hopkins. The unanimous first-team All-American and Remington Trophy winner makes his return to the pivot and I'm excited about it. I think NYG will benefit from this move.. I was one who thought Gates was NYG's best lineman last year but he's the type who can play multiple positions and perform well. I'm sure there will be growing pains so try to expect it.. It may help to prevent you from having a meltdown. That also goes for Hernandez, remember he's never played RG. There are many people I know who feel switching sides at guard is more difficult than switching sides as a tackle. He has a challenge ahead of him.
Price has been a center all through college. He was the Rimmington trophy winner if I recall. There was every reason to think he would be successful when the Bengals drafted him. But the Bengals may be worse than us at developing OL prospects. He "could" be a long term answer at C (yes its a massive long shot), and Gates "could" be a long term answer at guard. Putting Price or Skura at guard, NOT very good positions for them isn't smart.
Maybe this has been answered but why not start Skura instead of Price?
Starting 50+ games for the Ravens is not chopped liver and he knows DJ from 2015 at Duke ... though DJ didn’t play that year. My bet is at some point the interior line is going to be Bredeson, Skura and Gates.
Price was drafted as a center in the first round but asked to play guard because of the development of Hopkins. The unanimous first-team All-American and Remington Trophy winner makes his return to the pivot and I'm excited about it.
But then he fell completely out of the starting lineup last year. That can’t be ignored. He’s had real struggles.
Price has been a center all through college. He was the Rimmington trophy winner if I recall. There was every reason to think he would be successful when the Bengals drafted him. But the Bengals may be worse than us at developing OL prospects. He "could" be a long term answer at C (yes its a massive long shot), and Gates "could" be a long term answer at guard. Putting Price or Skura at guard, NOT very good positions for them isn't smart.
Did you watch Manning Night Football the other night?
Peyton said the most underrated relationship in football is between QB and C. On and off the field. And right now, Gates is a good solution at C. So I see more risk in trusting that to Price for now, regardless of what he did at Ohio State...
Price was drafted as a center in the first round but asked to play guard because of the development of Hopkins. The unanimous first-team All-American and Remington Trophy winner makes his return to the pivot and I'm excited about it. I think NYG will benefit from this move.. I was one who thought Gates was NYG's best lineman last year but he's the type who can play multiple positions and perform well. I'm sure there will be growing pains so try to expect it.. It may help to prevent you from having a meltdown. That also goes for Hernandez, remember he's never played RG. There are many people I know who feel switching sides at guard is more difficult than switching sides as a tackle. He has a challenge ahead of him.
Price was drafted as a center in the first round but asked to play guard because of the development of Hopkins. The unanimous first-team All-American and Remington Trophy winner makes his return to the pivot and I'm excited about it.
But then he fell completely out of the starting lineup last year. That can’t be ignored. He’s had real struggles.
Well, Christian, the fact of the matter is he's played less than 600 snaps at the position he received those accolades at and where he was drafted in the first round to play. A vast majority of those snaps as a rookie. Give him a chance here brother. Let's see how it plays out.
RE: Maybe this has been answered but why not start Skura instead of Price?
Starting 50+ games for the Ravens is not chopped liver and he knows DJ from 2015 at Duke ... though DJ didn’t play that year. My bet is at some point the interior line is going to be Bredeson, Skura and Gates.
so then why not skip Price altogether? if they had designs on Skura starting he'd be starting tonight.
imo this move signals 2 things:
1. they think Price has real upside as a starting C (not just a depth player).
2. they still believe in Hernandez at RG. I'm a little surprised they aren't just flipping Hernandez to LG and Gates to RG.
I'm mostly surprised they aren't just keeping Bredeson in for the short week.
The only viable explanation for moving Gates off C however is that they must think highly of Price.
RE: RE: Maybe this has been answered but why not start Skura instead of Price?
Starting 50+ games for the Ravens is not chopped liver and he knows DJ from 2015 at Duke ... though DJ didn’t play that year. My bet is at some point the interior line is going to be Bredeson, Skura and Gates.
so then why not skip Price altogether? if they had designs on Skura starting he'd be starting tonight.
imo this move signals 2 things:
1. they think Price has real upside as a starting C (not just a depth player).
2. they still believe in Hernandez at RG. I'm a little surprised they aren't just flipping Hernandez to LG and Gates to RG.
I'm mostly surprised they aren't just keeping Bredeson in for the short week.
The only viable explanation for moving Gates off C however is that they must think highly of Price.
I hope you’re right ... I was just looking at this simplistically ... Skura starts 50 games for a perennial winning team known for good OLs and Price has trouble breaking in with the Bengals... I hope Price isn’t getting first dibs because he cost the a Giants BJ Hill vs Skura coming for free.
Strong but slow-of-foot. Gates is a little quicker and can play every position.
I wish they had an answer for RT, but they don't so they're forced to help that hole with the tight end and fullback.
Regarding Hernandez being replaced by Lemieux last year, how come Thomas started playing relatively better even though Lemieux isn't that good a pass protector?
Football team most likely prepared to face Gates at Center which eliminates the bull rush into the backfield. I’m sure they prepped not to face a smaller center. This should give the oline with a more powerful guard at point of attack, and football team will need to make in game adjustments. Just hopefully they are as bad at that as us.
Bengals ol sucked...and he couldn't start....is not a good answer.
Giants clearly didn’t love the OL class beyond Sewell. They felt the WR class was top notch. Perhaps OL class is better in 2022. Who knows. But to judge the 1st round pick after 1 game is nonsensical.
Regardless - they valued the Bears 1st round pick next year over whatever difference of player they could draft between 11 and 20. Remains to be seen if they will be right.
To be honest, we don't know that it isn't that way.. We are all projecting what is happening but until the Starting lineup is announced we are just guessing based on Lemieux being out.
I just new the Toney pick was a fall back.
Gates will probably still handle the line calls.
Quote:
I think NYG expected Vera-Tucker to be there at #20 after the trade down ...
I just new the Toney pick was a fall back.
Be curious to know if they expected, or hoped. Two different things, and expecting a fast rising offensive lineman to be there is foolish. Regardless, you always take that trade.
I'm not saying you're wrong, but it would have been silly for them to think that. It was pretty widely known that AVT would be a top #20 pick. In any event, I can't see them declining the trade with the Bears to take AVT.
Hog mollies from heaven??????????
Time to take your pension, DG, and live out your halcyon years at the Cape!!!!
It only took 14 years, five coaches and 3 GMs!
Should have also been more than one owner (not counting Tisch)!!!!!!!!!!
Two things Washington will do - try to suffocate the passing game to Shepard and stack up the box on our right side, till we prove we can run to the left.
After Smith went and we traded down I suspect realistic options came down to Slater and Vera Tucker but all the guys the Giants front office had targeted were off the board
While I am disappointed we didn’t take Kwity I am much more disappointed with who we took with the 20th but time will tell .
That QB-C relationship shouldn't be taken for granted. Jones and Gates don't appear to have issues with getting the play started. Why disrupt that?
I’m sure he can as long as the center doesn’t screw up the snap count again…
What do you mean centers are centers? The center position is crucial to the OL, he's the captain of the line.
"Giants go into a tight formation on 4th and 1 at WTF's 22 yard line with 1:05 in the game left on the clock":
"Price snaps the ball.................
Jones, FUMBLE!!!!!!!!!!!!"
"Recovered by WTF's defensive tackle Daron Payne -
with 1:02 left on the clock and the Skins up 19-17...."
Fighting back tears as usual!!!!
That QB-C relationship shouldn't be taken for granted. Jones and Gates don't appear to have issues with getting the play started. Why disrupt that?
Honestly think Gates' more natural position is guard. This could be a long term play.
This is exactly right. Either the line plays great or we get epic BBI meltdown. I’ve got a bunch of cold brews waiting for whichever one we get
Quote:
then this is an upgrade at LG. Centers are Centers,
What do you mean centers are centers? The center position is crucial to the OL, he's the captain of the line.
Are you serious? I am saying a Center-Center by trade- can play center. Fucking Gates was a G/T we moved to center last year without a true off season and preseason. Price is a center, who has played in the league. We didn't go grab the emergency Goalie from the arena stands to start in goal, we are moving a Center from backup to starting and our Center to Guard.
Quote:
Move Price to G.
That QB-C relationship shouldn't be taken for granted. Jones and Gates don't appear to have issues with getting the play started. Why disrupt that?
Honestly think Gates' more natural position is guard. This could be a long term play.
Yes especially with the Lemieux injury.. Price can be fine at center and this will help shore up the right side as well.
That QB-C relationship shouldn't be taken for granted. Jones and Gates don't appear to have issues with getting the play started. Why disrupt that?
Why do you care since Jones sucks as far as you are concerned. Wouldn't this just help your cause?
Quote:
Move Price to G.
That QB-C relationship shouldn't be taken for granted. Jones and Gates don't appear to have issues with getting the play started. Why disrupt that?
Honestly think Gates' more natural position is guard. This could be a long term play.
But he's a very competent C. Can we say Price is even competent right now at any position?
I believe Gates has actually started more games at center in the NFL than Price.
Everybody talks about Young, but Allen and Payne are damn good.
They keep improving every year. We'll see how this works out tonight?
Quote:
Move Price to G.
That QB-C relationship shouldn't be taken for granted. Jones and Gates don't appear to have issues with getting the play started. Why disrupt that?
Why do you care since Jones sucks as far as you are concerned. Wouldn't this just help your cause?
Well, I certainly haven't been shy that I didn't think Jones was worthy of the 6th pick in the draft. And to date, his play has demonstrated that. But I would like him to succeed. So having his reliable C playing C seems the less risky move.
But then he fell completely out of the starting lineup last year. That can’t be ignored. He’s had real struggles.
Did you watch Manning Night Football the other night?
Peyton said the most underrated relationship in football is between QB and C. On and off the field. And right now, Gates is a good solution at C. So I see more risk in trusting that to Price for now, regardless of what he did at Ohio State...
Good info, thanks
Quote:
Price was drafted as a center in the first round but asked to play guard because of the development of Hopkins. The unanimous first-team All-American and Remington Trophy winner makes his return to the pivot and I'm excited about it.
But then he fell completely out of the starting lineup last year. That can’t be ignored. He’s had real struggles.
Well, Christian, the fact of the matter is he's played less than 600 snaps at the position he received those accolades at and where he was drafted in the first round to play. A vast majority of those snaps as a rookie. Give him a chance here brother. Let's see how it plays out.
so then why not skip Price altogether? if they had designs on Skura starting he'd be starting tonight.
imo this move signals 2 things:
1. they think Price has real upside as a starting C (not just a depth player).
2. they still believe in Hernandez at RG. I'm a little surprised they aren't just flipping Hernandez to LG and Gates to RG.
I'm mostly surprised they aren't just keeping Bredeson in for the short week.
The only viable explanation for moving Gates off C however is that they must think highly of Price.
Quote:
Starting 50+ games for the Ravens is not chopped liver and he knows DJ from 2015 at Duke ... though DJ didn’t play that year. My bet is at some point the interior line is going to be Bredeson, Skura and Gates.
so then why not skip Price altogether? if they had designs on Skura starting he'd be starting tonight.
imo this move signals 2 things:
1. they think Price has real upside as a starting C (not just a depth player).
2. they still believe in Hernandez at RG. I'm a little surprised they aren't just flipping Hernandez to LG and Gates to RG.
I'm mostly surprised they aren't just keeping Bredeson in for the short week.
The only viable explanation for moving Gates off C however is that they must think highly of Price.
I hope you’re right ... I was just looking at this simplistically ... Skura starts 50 games for a perennial winning team known for good OLs and Price has trouble breaking in with the Bengals... I hope Price isn’t getting first dibs because he cost the a Giants BJ Hill vs Skura coming for free.
Strong but slow-of-foot. Gates is a little quicker and can play every position.
I wish they had an answer for RT, but they don't so they're forced to help that hole with the tight end and fullback.
Strong but slow-of-foot. Gates is a little quicker and can play every position.
I wish they had an answer for RT, but they don't so they're forced to help that hole with the tight end and fullback.
Regarding Hernandez being replaced by Lemieux last year, how come Thomas started playing relatively better even though Lemieux isn't that good a pass protector?
I guess that's a testament to Thomas, who started to figure it out. Thomas got dinged this year, early and it affected him.
He's gonna be good (not great) for a long time.
That QB-C relationship shouldn't be taken for granted. Jones and Gates don't appear to have issues with getting the play started. Why disrupt that?