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How will defeneses adjust to the Read Option?

BH28 : 9/17/2021 2:52 pm
I am ALMOST convinced we didn't run any against Denver just to not give WFT any tape on it.

That said, now that it is out there again, teams will adjust to it, so what will the Giants do? IMO, they need to incorporate more RPO than what we saw sprinkled in there.

If defenses need to keep a QB spy, more passes out of the run formation will lead to desirable one on one match-ups.

Side note: somebody needs to take the WR reverse away from Garrett. Hide that sheet in his playbook or something.
I don't know, but..  
Producer : 9/17/2021 2:55 pm : link
I say let's run it all the time and find out. Since that's what this kid does best.
While i'm not really high on Dan Jones as a complete QB  
cjac : 9/17/2021 2:56 pm : link
he runs that read option about as good as any QB in the in NFL.
RE: While i'm not really high on Dan Jones as a complete QB  
Producer : 9/17/2021 2:56 pm : link
In comment 15374545 cjac said:
Quote:
he runs that read option about as good as any QB in the in NFL.


well, he's not Lamar, but he's real good.
It's extremely tough with Saquon in the backfield (still need to respe  
Zeke's Alibi : 9/17/2021 3:04 pm : link
his playmaking ability). It's why it was so open last night. So while Saquon wasn't great, his presence helped the offense. Teams key on him, and we'll see if thats the case moving forward.
RE: It's extremely tough with Saquon in the backfield (still need to respe  
Producer : 9/17/2021 3:06 pm : link
In comment 15374557 Zeke's Alibi said:
Quote:
his playmaking ability). It's why it was so open last night. So while Saquon wasn't great, his presence helped the offense. Teams key on him, and we'll see if thats the case moving forward.


also, it helps to have a speedy back like Barkley to run the read option. When Dobbins went down, Edwards as the lead back in that backfield wasn't ideal, as he was the power guy to Dobbins' speed. Running the read option with Barkley could be a very dangerous combo.
RE: RE: While i'm not really high on Dan Jones as a complete QB  
Joe Beckwith : 9/17/2021 3:07 pm : link
In comment 15374548 Producer said:
Quote:
In comment 15374545 cjac said:


Quote:


he runs that read option about as good as any QB in the in NFL.



well, he's not Lamar, but he's real good.


We don’t need Lamar.
We need DJ and 10 other guys that can block, route run, get open enough, catch, not get caught illegally downfield , pushing off or holding.
We have folks that should be able to do those things, and I agree, it should be incorporated into the O.
I thought defenses would adjust...  
bw in dc : 9/17/2021 3:07 pm : link
based on the Philly game last year. Which is why it was very surprising WFT kept biting since there are in the division.

I think DJ is eventually going to get crushed running the ball. But it's also his best feature because I just don't think he's consistently good enough from the pocket. So keep trying to run to both sides until DJ gets knocked out.

I know that sounds harsh, but WTF at this point...
RE: RE: RE: While i'm not really high on Dan Jones as a complete QB  
Producer : 9/17/2021 3:16 pm : link
In comment 15374562 Joe Beckwith said:
Quote:
In comment 15374548 Producer said:


Quote:


In comment 15374545 cjac said:


Quote:


he runs that read option about as good as any QB in the in NFL.



well, he's not Lamar, but he's real good.



We don’t need Lamar.
We need DJ and 10 other guys that can block, route run, get open enough, catch, not get caught illegally downfield , pushing off or holding.
We have folks that should be able to do those things, and I agree, it should be incorporated into the O.


it should be half the offense. Washington couldn't defend it.
RE: I thought defenses would adjust...  
NYG007 : 9/17/2021 3:26 pm : link
In comment 15374565 bw in dc said:
Quote:
based on the Philly game last year. Which is why it was very surprising WFT kept biting since there are in the division.

I think DJ is eventually going to get crushed running the ball. But it's also his best feature because I just don't think he's consistently good enough from the pocket. So keep trying to run to both sides until DJ gets knocked out.

I know that sounds harsh, but WTF at this point...


Jones was awesome both in the pocket and RPO last night. Last night was the first game that I can recall where he ACTUALLY had time to pass. What we saw last night, was what franchises kill to see. A QB carrying his entire team, Jones did it last night. We should be celebrating his amazing game and hope for the future. Instead, we have a terrible coaching staff who cant step on someone's freaking NECK AND WIN!!!!!!!!!!!!
I think they should just fully commit to making the Read Option  
BH28 : 9/17/2021 4:13 pm : link
the base offense until someone stops it. There are a lot of different looks you can present the D and still run it. But it does seem to be the thing that Jones does best, so they should lean into harder.
RE: I thought defenses would adjust...  
section125 : 9/17/2021 4:31 pm : link
In comment 15374565 bw in dc said:
Quote:
based on the Philly game last year. Which is why it was very surprising WFT kept biting since there are in the division.

I think DJ is eventually going to get crushed running the ball. But it's also his best feature because I just don't think he's consistently good enough from the pocket. So keep trying to run to both sides until DJ gets knocked out.

I know that sounds harsh, but WTF at this point...


Well you have an agenda and God forbid that you would have to admit that given just a little bit of time he can make plays. He was not perfect last night - missed a few throws behind the WRs. But that was the best game he has played in a long time - maybe rookie year. It may have been his best game, period. What happens when he gets on the same page with Golladay and Toney? He started to figure out Rudolph.

The RPO works because it is designed to work. It works in college and in high school. It is hard to defend against with a QB that can read the defense. Eventually it will freeze LBs and DBs and open up lanes behind them. Two or three times per game is enough because you don't want the D to get a bead on him.
BW the read option is predicated  
Dave on the UWS : 9/17/2021 4:32 pm : link
on two threats on the same play. If they key on Barkley, Jones is likely going to have a lane. If they compensate to stop Jones, Barkley should have easier sledding outside and he's already an established threat. If they keep running it right, its a staple for this offense, very difficult to defend. Jones sells it well, which helps a great deal.
They need to incorporate the pass out of it and that would make 3 threats on the same play. That's a lot to ask any defense to defend.
RE: RE: I thought defenses would adjust...  
bw in dc : 9/17/2021 4:40 pm : link
In comment 15374680 section125 said:
Quote:
In comment 15374565 bw in dc said:


Quote:


based on the Philly game last year. Which is why it was very surprising WFT kept biting since there are in the division.

I think DJ is eventually going to get crushed running the ball. But it's also his best feature because I just don't think he's consistently good enough from the pocket. So keep trying to run to both sides until DJ gets knocked out.

I know that sounds harsh, but WTF at this point...



Well you have an agenda and God forbid that you would have to admit that given just a little bit of time he can make plays. He was not perfect last night - missed a few throws behind the WRs. But that was the best game he has played in a long time - maybe rookie year. It may have been his best game, period. What happens when he gets on the same page with Golladay and Toney? He started to figure out Rudolph.

The RPO works because it is designed to work. It works in college and in high school. It is hard to defend against with a QB that can read the defense. Eventually it will freeze LBs and DBs and open up lanes behind them. Two or three times per game is enough because you don't want the D to get a bead on him.


What agenda? I was complimentary last night of Jones's overall play. He has proven over his five games against WFT that he loves to play against them.
let's settle down a little  
Producer : 9/17/2021 4:45 pm : link
there's a reason that historically option football worked well in college and not in the pros. Front sevens were lightning fast in the pro game, relative to college.

We have seen recently that as part of a mix with pro-style it can work, especially now since we have QBs with better running ability than in the past. How much read option can we do without reaching the point of diminishing returns, is the question. I think more than we have seen so far. 30%? 50%?

Jones looked very comfortable  
bigbluehoya : 9/17/2021 4:52 pm : link
with both the zone read and RPO last night. there's no telling what the 'correct' mix of it is, but when a team shows no inclination to start defending it well (like last night), there's no damn reason to stop.

and it would have been perfect for that 4th quarter drive after the INT, when you want to really go hard for a first down, but also want to keep the clock ticking.
RE: RE: I thought defenses would adjust...  
Keyser : 9/17/2021 6:26 pm : link
There is a lot I like about Jones, but when push came to shove in the last two drives, when it was time for the offense to win the game, they played their worst football. Jones has to take responsibility for that as well.

In comment 15374604 NYG007 said:
Quote:
In comment 15374565 bw in dc said:


Quote:


based on the Philly game last year. Which is why it was very surprising WFT kept biting since there are in the division.

I think DJ is eventually going to get crushed running the ball. But it's also his best feature because I just don't think he's consistently good enough from the pocket. So keep trying to run to both sides until DJ gets knocked out.

I know that sounds harsh, but WTF at this point...



Jones was awesome both in the pocket and RPO last night. Last night was the first game that I can recall where he ACTUALLY had time to pass. What we saw last night, was what franchises kill to see. A QB carrying his entire team, Jones did it last night. We should be celebrating his amazing game and hope for the future. Instead, we have a terrible coaching staff who cant step on someone's freaking NECK AND WIN!!!!!!!!!!!!
RE: While i'm not really high on Dan Jones as a complete QB  
GMen72 : 9/18/2021 12:48 am : link
In comment 15374545 cjac said:
Quote:
he runs that read option about as good as any QB in the in NFL.


This! DJs best attribute (to this point) is his running ability. He needs 10 carries a game for half a season...the rush will slow down and teams will have to use a spy. That's when passing gets easier.
Jones is not Lamar  
shadow_spinner0 : 9/18/2021 4:09 pm : link
meaning you can't run the read option all the time. Lamar is someone who is very good at evading defenders, scrambling and extending plays. Jones is good at running in a strait line, has good acceleration but that's basically all he does. Baltimore can run the read more because they know Lamar is capable of extending plays if it's busted. Jones as of now hasn't shown that. Meaning that is why the Giants run it less as if to catch the defense by surprise. If they do it more often, would Jones be able to improvise?
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