Downside: One-year starter who only settled in fully at wideout as a senior. Not yet a polished receiver — has made strides in his craft but isn’t yet refined or nuanced enough. Occasionally chaotic route runner with uneven tempo and false steps. Even by his own admission has had trouble grasping certain route concepts.
Still learning how to defeat press coverage outside of his quick release. Given limited responsibilities as a wideout — more of a gadget player at this stage of his development. Suffered multiple catchable drops in Senior Bowl one-on-one drills.
Lined up in the slot nearly 90 percent of the time the past two seasons and hasn’t run a full or complex route tree. Only targets 20-plus yards downfield 17 times in four seasons, per PFF. Only scored three TDs his first three seasons combined. Might need his touches manufactured early on.
Can run out of control and off balance at times — all gas, no brakes. Can almost look uncoordinated when he presses the issue. Will freelance and lose yards just as easily as he makes the first man miss. Could fine tune his situational awareness at times. Didn’t always earn coaches’ full trust for a heavier offensive diet prior to 2020.
Small, lean frame. Short arms (31 1/4 inches) and small hands (9 1/4 inches). Not ideally built for contested catches. Turned in disappointing testing numbers on the bench press (nine reps) and short shuttle (4.25 seconds), which should have been a drill he excelled at.
Florida WR Kadarius Toney is a dangerous weapon with the ball in his hands. (AP Photo/Mark Humphrey)
Medical evaluation could hurt his stock — battled through injuries most of his career and missed big chunks of the 2017 and 2019 seasons. Suffered multiple shoulder injuries in college and is at higher risk for future subluxations.
Battled immaturity early in career and multiple off-field incidents. Was suspended for 2018 season opener following an altercation on campus between multiple players and local residents, having painted an “air gun” to look like an AR-15 rifle that spring. Also was pulled over with a real (loaded) AR-15 rifle in his car two months later, claiming his needed to protect himself against the residents involved in the first incident.
Because this KT selection has Gettleman all over it - forcing a higher pick on a questionable player.
And furthermore, the particulars of the incident scream bad judgement.
Because this KT selection has Gettleman all over it - forcing a higher pick on a questionable player.
The only thing that makes me question that is KTs special teams experience
Link - ( New Window )
To have been a fly on the wall...
I think I saw draft reports of him going mid 20's to mid 2nd round.
Why would Graham have any say in offensive players? And why would John Mara go to bat for Kadarius Toney? I heard they used a Ouija board and Wellington Mara told them to take Toney.
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I think it's clear Tony was forced on Judge by someone, maybe Mara or Graham. He is literally the last type of player you would think Judge would draft.
Why would Graham have any say in offensive players? And why would John Mara go to bat for Kadarius Toney? I heard they used a Ouija board and Wellington Mara told them to take Toney.
maybe he meant chris mara?
a while back there was a jordan rannan podcast where he stated that chris mara was responsible for the davis webb, adam bisnowaty, and mykyele thomposon draft picks.
i don't think gettleman was pushing for toney because he was the one who looked dejected or frustrated after the televised war room argument that GoTerps referenced.
To have been a fly on the wall...
Wasn’t that in the second round and I’m not remembering any argument other than DG was clearly pissed an OL he wanted was gone. My best guess is he didn’t want to trade down in second round, that trade doesn’t seem like him at all. The first one is a no brainer, when a team is all hot and bothered for a QB you make it.
I don’t know how we can tell who is most responsible for this pick. We know Judge loves his SEC guys.
Third - definitely not a promising start, but let’s at least wait until the end of the year. Although, I’m starting to think he can’t run routes at an NFL level which turns into turnovers eventually (see Evan Engram, his route running turnovers aren’t talked about because of the the tip turnovers, but he often gets undercut because of his shitty routes)
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who is still in command of the draft hopefully this selection of KT clears up any doubt.
Because this KT selection has Gettleman all over it - forcing a higher pick on a questionable player.
The only thing that makes me question that is KTs special teams experience
While special teams are an important element of the game, I really don't want my high first round investment playing too many special teams plays. I want them playing bigger roles on the offense or defense. And quickly.
Special teams needs should be solved in the later rounds.
I liked KT's talent before the draft. But with only one quality year of production at UF, plus the off the field challenges, taking him in the first round was a stretch.
I thought the same thing.. smh..
Let’s be real, the Giants are in this huge mess because of the GM & scouts. Add below average OC & DC, and theirs your answer.
It'll take a season or two to find out how good he is. Nick Saban said, "We'd love to have him here, I'll tell you that."
Gettleman needs to be gone. Unfortunately he's not going to be taking Chris Mara with him.
I watch a lot of college football. Toney was an electric player at Florida with extraordinary vision and start and stop (make you miss) ability. He was like a video game character. Insanely elusive. His game is horizontal not vertical speed. Extremely tough as well.
I nonetheless didn't want him because of his off the field incidents and thought the Giants would pass for that reason, especially after Baker. He also only had one year of real production and has had multiple injuries.
I wanted Paye. I was surprised he was still available at #20, and thought the Giants would run to the podium to pick him.
If he's going to get on the field, they are going to need to sit Slayton, who has been really productive. My best guess is that they planned on Toney replacing Shepard. Whoops. Now he's our best receiver.
This team really struggles evaluating talent, even their own players.
This guy won’t contribute. Love to be wrong.
To have been a fly on the wall...
Bad start for the kid but this is the right take
1) he’s really cheap for the next four years
2) moving him would actually cost more than keeping him
I think he’s a really talented, bright kid. But he just keeps saying and doing stupid stuff. As the last ultra talented WR the Giants had learned, that can really get in the way.
Taken from an article after Day 1, so sounds like Pettit was perhaps influential in the pick.
I too really want Toney to shut up and stop saying dumb shit. You practically haven't practiced since you were drafted and now you want to be a diva 2 weeks into your rookie season. It makes me sick. I can't believe they picked him, essentially a gadget player that they are incapable of using properly anyway, who also had red flags on the field and off.
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So they took the deal and drafted Florida receiver Kadarius Toney, who might not be on the level of Smith or his Alabama teammate Jaylen Waddle, but as Chris Pettit, the Giants director of college scouting said, “He was close enough.”
Taken from an article after Day 1, so sounds like Pettit was perhaps influential in the pick.
I too really want Toney to shut up and stop saying dumb shit. You practically haven't practiced since you were drafted and now you want to be a diva 2 weeks into your rookie season. It makes me sick. I can't believe they picked him, essentially a gadget player that they are incapable of using properly anyway, who also had red flags on the field and off.
I'm sold on pre-season/training camp reports alone that I would take Elijah Moore and Bateman IN A SECOND over Toney.
I don’t say this as a way to defend or criticize either one only that I find it somewhat baffling.
In this case, so far, it would seem that immaturity is winning the battle.
I don’t say this as a way to defend or criticize either one only that I find it somewhat baffling.
lol, I think the same, but that has always been the case with whatever the current regime's whipping boy is. In the Coughlin era, it was Gilbride. If Eli did well, it was Coughlin's offense. If he did poorly, it was Gilbride's and suddenly people became arborists ranting about trimming trees
One interesting point from Boylhart was to use Toney like Christian Mcafferey. Don't make him just a receiver, play to his strengths. Have him return kicks and play out of the backfield. I wonder if this is how they see him, would make sense because Shep is in the slot. A little like Curtis Samuel.
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In comment 15374786 bw in dc said:
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who is still in command of the draft hopefully this selection of KT clears up any doubt.
Because this KT selection has Gettleman all over it - forcing a higher pick on a questionable player.
The only thing that makes me question that is KTs special teams experience
While special teams are an important element of the game, I really don't want my high first round investment playing too many special teams plays. I want them playing bigger roles on the offense or defense. And quickly.
Special teams needs should be solved in the later rounds.
I liked KT's talent before the draft. But with only one quality year of production at UF, plus the off the field challenges, taking him in the first round was a stretch.
Because this KT selection has Gettleman all over it - forcing a higher pick on a questionable player.
Cmon...if there was a player that had DG written all over him it was Paye and if one did for Judge was Toney considering his love of all things SEC. I'm sure you were saying the same thing predraft - that it was going to be Paye because of DG, even at the expense of Smith. This is being disingenuous based on the data.
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who is still in command of the draft hopefully this selection of KT clears up any doubt.
Because this KT selection has Gettleman all over it - forcing a higher pick on a questionable player.
Cmon...if there was a player that had DG written all over him it was Paye and if one did for Judge was Toney considering his love of all things SEC. I'm sure you were saying the same thing predraft - that it was going to be Paye because of DG, even at the expense of Smith. This is being disingenuous based on the data.
I kind of agree. I don't see KT as a Gettleman pick. I have no real opinion who drove the selection but Paye or Lattisaw would seem to be DG guys.
You most definitely do not know this. Matter of fact if anything it’s probably safe to assume judge did push for this player, if anything.
I’m still bullish on the guy tbh. I think he’s a tremendous weapons to have in the read option and RPO. He’s the one WR we have in RPO that can break the tackle as WR and take it to house. Also can put him in backfield in the read option when Saquon needs breather. Hoping with 10 days he’s ready to go and see saw drives. Throwing him out there 1 play at a time is moronic (and I think they realized that right away)
He says he likes OL, but we haven't really seen that. He doesn't seem to value pass rush, particularly from the edge.
Toney doesn't really match with the image that Gettleman tries to project. But when you look at what he actually does, it all seems kind of random. Its not easy to find a theme or a plan.
I think player acquisition is clearly a community effort and it’s a shambolic mess.
The committee idea is a good hypothesis because there does not seem to be any type of consistent vision or priorities.