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We need a rebuild correctly this time

Josh in the City : 10/17/2021 4:33 pm
There's a correct way to do a rebuild and then there's the way the Giants have done it. The last 10 years have been an absolute nightmare and it's time to actually start over and do this correctly.

I don't think there's any question that this thing needs to be blown up (again) but it needs to start with a new head of football operations. Ideally that means hiring a competent GM (FROM OUTSIDE THE ORGANIZATION AND NOT A KEVIN ABARAMS PROMOTION), who is then able to hire his own head coach. The GM and coach need to be on the same timeline and working together to build a roster that works within a specific scheme and around a cohesive plan. From there you let them build rebuild the roster correctly...ideally form the inside out and not by building around a RB (Barkley) and paying top dollar to an above average DT (Leonard Williams). We need a GM who is going to be on top of rebuilding the scouting program and embracing analytics. We also need to allow a new head coach to hire his own staff without trying to force past Giants on him (cough...Jason Garrett...cough). Lastly, and maybe most importantly, John Mara needs to stay out of the fucking way and keep his opinions to himself. They're almost always wrong.
+1  
cosmicj : 10/17/2021 4:34 pm : link
I’ll only add that the search for a new GM needs to be done by a committee headed by an unaffiliated NFL expert.
Getting family members like Chris Marra  
Chris L. : 10/17/2021 4:45 pm : link
out of the football operations would be a good start
They've failed with  
darren in pdx : 10/17/2021 4:48 pm : link
four hires already (McAdoo, Shurmur, Judge and Gettleman), what gives you any hope they can identify anyone that can actually help rebuild the organization?
RE: +1  
GFAN52 : 10/17/2021 4:48 pm : link
In comment 15417693 cosmicj said:
Quote:
I’ll only add that the search for a new GM needs to be done by a committee headed by an unaffiliated NFL expert.


Anybody but Ernie Accorsi.
Whoever the next GM is  
JoeyBigBlue : 10/17/2021 4:51 pm : link
Needs to rebuild both lines and get some quality linebackers. They can’t play a 3-4 base defense with the crap linebackers we have been toting out there the last few years.
No more half measures..  
BigBlue89 : 10/17/2021 4:54 pm : link
When we should be doing full measures.
Absolutely..  
Sean : 10/17/2021 4:55 pm : link
This franchise has actually never rebuilt. Constant retooling and quick fixes.
RE: Whoever the next GM is  
Angel Eyes : 10/17/2021 4:59 pm : link
In comment 15417773 JoeyBigBlue said:
Quote:
Needs to rebuild both lines and get some quality linebackers. They can’t play a 3-4 base defense with the crap linebackers we have been toting out there the last few years.

We could switch back to the 4-3 and not have to field so many linebackers…
Better late than never  
Spider43 : 10/17/2021 5:00 pm : link
New GM, new Head Coach, new everything. Let the new people decide on things. The old way hasn't worked. And in my mind there are no keepers on this team (for when we're really ready to win). NONE. Yes, I said it. Let the new guys decide on things.
What have  
family progtitioner : 10/17/2021 5:02 pm : link
former doormats of the league, CLE, CIN, ARI, etc done to improve themselves? For the most part it seems like they got QBs and drafted or acquired complimentary players well.

I really wanted DJ to succeed and he seems like he has the desire, just not the tools. His arm is average. He can run but can't create well on the run which separates the elite QBs from the ordinary. He just seems average in every aspect of his game.

It's a shame but this team is going to be terrible until they learn how to draft and get a legit QB.

And don't draft RBs at #2 or anywhere near the first rd. IMO still a decision that's killing this team
How They Should Rebuild  
Jimmy Googs : 10/17/2021 5:33 pm : link
will be the most interesting threads on here for the rest of the season.

First step on Monday is to announce that the GM job for next year will be available and thank Gettleman for his service.

We can work on Step 2 on Tuesday...
they can start by not passing on elite QB talent (like Herbert)  
Producer : 10/17/2021 5:36 pm : link
just because we have a QB (Jones). we might be paying for that incompetence for 15 years.
We had the right rebuilding plan  
weeg in the bronx : 10/17/2021 5:40 pm : link
The Gm did a bad job with his talent evaluations, which resulted in poor draft picks andFA signings..
They badly mis-evaluated the 2018 team  
JonC : 10/17/2021 5:44 pm : link
and it delayed the rebuild plan, which still looks to be behind schedule. The problem is individual talent evaluations AND they once again misjudged what the 2021 team would be capable of.

I sense too many chefs in the roster building soup, and not one who's good at it.
RE: They badly mis-evaluated the 2018 team  
Producer : 10/17/2021 5:47 pm : link
In comment 15417959 JonC said:
Quote:
and it delayed the rebuild plan, which still looks to be behind schedule. The problem is individual talent evaluations AND they once again misjudged what the 2021 team would be capable of.

I sense too many chefs in the roster building soup, and not one who's good at it.


My hunch is that it is more than just the talent evals. They also made strategic errors, like spending a #2 on Barkley. Which also indicates they are operating with an outdated philosophy about the run vs the pass.
I find it hard to be optimistic  
Aaroninma : 10/17/2021 5:55 pm : link
Because i KNOW they will promote Abrams and i fear nothing will change
RE: RE: They badly mis-evaluated the 2018 team  
Jimmy Googs : 10/17/2021 5:55 pm : link
In comment 15417964 Producer said:
Quote:
In comment 15417959 JonC said:


Quote:


and it delayed the rebuild plan, which still looks to be behind schedule. The problem is individual talent evaluations AND they once again misjudged what the 2021 team would be capable of.

I sense too many chefs in the roster building soup, and not one who's good at it.



My hunch is that it is more than just the talent evals. They also made strategic errors, like spending a #2 on Barkley. Which also indicates they are operating with an outdated philosophy about the run vs the pass.


Of course.

There were some big-time strategic errors made in judgement on what to do from the get-go. Not just causing delays but moreso just wasting everybody's time & owner's money, and also using up valuable assets in the wrong manner.

No cohesive plan to rebuild the roster, no modern philosophy of how to win and where to invest on player acquisition, no forward-thinking anywhere...

I would spend the coming draft  
Bill in UT : 10/17/2021 5:57 pm : link
on the OL and pass rush. I would not spend a high choice on QB or RB without them having the opportunity to succeed. Any maybe, by chance, with a line in front of him DJ will get to the point where we don't need a high QB pick. Just maybe
Why would anyone trust John Mara to make good decisions?  
shockeyisthebest8056 : 10/17/2021 6:00 pm : link
..
"No guts, no glory kid"  
santacruzom : 10/17/2021 6:06 pm : link
Gettleman probably thought he sounded like Humphrey Bogart when he made that quip. I joked at the time that it sounded more like he was taking inventory.

Imagine having the guts exhibited by the Cards when they moved on from their coach and QB after just one year. Obviously they haven't won the Super Bowl yet, but they sure seem to be experiencing quite a bit of regular season glory at the moment.

Injuries are playing a role  
Coopcomic : 10/17/2021 6:09 pm : link
I felt like the game was over when Toney went out. It's not a little thing when that happens. Star players are star players. You could make a sensible argument that the line (which was shaky coming into the season) has had unsustainable bad luck - but that happens, I guess. Couple of plays, couple of injuries, and the season is different, along with a few coaching decisions I hate. But, with the history, there just is no room for bad luck, and now it's a avalanche of shit.
Jerry Reese part 2  
Rambo : 10/17/2021 6:25 pm : link
Folks we got screwed again. Another buffoon spent much of our cap money on players who don't execute = we cannot improve much next season or next.
It was bad enough that DG didn’t rebuild the OL like he said he would.  
BillT : 10/17/2021 6:52 pm : link
Acquiring only two OLs in his first two years. But that he so misunderstood the roster that he though he could do quick reset in 2018 should have gotten him fired in both 2018 and 2019. So, we are nowhere and seems we are going nowhere.
RE: It was bad enough that DG didn’t rebuild the OL like he said he would.  
Jimmy Googs : 10/17/2021 7:04 pm : link
In comment 15418137 BillT said:
Quote:
Acquiring only two OLs in his first two years. But that he so misunderstood the roster that he though he could do quick reset in 2018 should have gotten him fired in both 2018 and 2019. So, we are nowhere and seems we are going nowhere.


Yep, a lot of this. Did you see it earlier?
Is Solder not his biggest failure! TWICE  
rasbutant : 10/17/2021 8:12 pm : link
I think Solder is an awesome human being from what I know of him. However it is clear that he is not an NFL level talent anymore. He is fools gold. Shows well in practice but lets you down in the game.
They've got to get real with this coaching staff.  
mittenedman : 10/17/2021 8:21 pm : link
This is the New York Giants. Supposed to be the best of the best. They should have the very best coaches in the world, including coordinators. HC and DC of the Giants in particular should be prestigious positions.

Enough with this bullcrap McAdoo & Judge. Go out and move the Earth for somebody. It's long past the point where you owe it to the fans to open the coffers and back up the BRINKS truck for a winner. I couldn't care less how much it costs.

From the sounds of it, Tisch was pissed off at Mara before they hired Judge. He may have to put his foot down if he has any leverage.
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