In that you know there is no way they will win most of their games.
It is different for me because in the 70s I had no experience with the Giants winning, so it felt like they just weren’t a team that won championships. I remember in 1987 when they took the field against the Broncos in the Superbowl that it didn’t feel like a real Superbowl because they were in it.
I now have the experience of the Giants winning multiple super bowls so this doesn’t feel as hopeless. But week to week, “we have no chance of winning this game?” It’s the same.
The 70s teams needed to be fumigated top to bottom, including having George Young forced on them so there was a football guy in the room. It feels like something similar is needed now. The guys in the building now are not equipped to fix this.
We had to go through 6 futile preseason games before the real suffering started. It felt worse to me because dynasties were for real. You had to hit on all your draft choices and/or trade to get better. No UFA. Teams were what they were. And the Giants were bad.
just posted on the other thread - to me those teams of the 70's
But mainly because we had never won a super bowl and it felt like we never would. Now that we have won 4 SB's it is SLIGHTLY easier to tolerate, but having lived through both, I can honestly say the feeling is starting to compare to the 70's.
then the 70's due to the way the NFL is setup today for teams to rebound and rebuild quickly. It goes to show the depth of incompetence in this leadership.
So I didn’t care as much, but it was a general feeling of futility. Then GY and Perkins and we got to the mid range. But we had some great players individually, in the LB corps, George Martin. Then we drafted this magic player named LT, this kid Simms got healthy, and a coach came along that could use and motivate guys.
This almost feels worse because we’re just churning coaches and GMs, and whatever move we make fails for talent or injury. Just feels like a treadmill of suck.
and a teen in the 70s. Dad and Brother were Cowboy fans and I got abused every season - every game. Brother rubbing it in, Dad chuckling at elder son's epic ball breaking
and the talent level was so bad. What makes the current situation frustrating is that there are pockets of talented players, but collectively the team stinks.
In the 70s Rozelle was the Knight in shining armor that saved the Mara's from themselves and enabled George Young to take over and run the show.
What Knight is out there today to save Johnny Boy's ass????
I see nobody and foresee this debacle continuing a long long time. Who is up next...... you guys all know who.....nonother than wonder boy Kevo Abrams....get ready and be prepared for the next decade of pure garbage.
Eli will be the next Joe Namath talking about the SBs he won as Giants fan attend home games getting blown out and waiting for the 20th SB Anniversary half time ceremony.
This organization has become a complete and utter unwatchable mess.
we at least had a 9 and 5 team that almost made the playoffs to offset the rest of the decade. I go back to the '40's and they weren't too good along with us having the gambling fiasco.
Was hideous. No hundred yards rushers, no receivers, sometimes qb by committee. One of the top players on the team was the punter. Ineptitude at all levels. There was no hope for playoffs and one day the sun came out. Four super bowls to ease the pain.
History must repeat itself and one man must be given total control of football operations that doesn't answer to a Mara. That is what ended the last disaster and must happen to end this one
The team had one good season 1970. Every other year the giants were a doormat beginning with the strange draft picks they came up with. It was depressing to see them win 2-4 games on average every year Trading those picks (randy White!) for Craig Morton was typical. Thank goodness for George Young.
The current team has a handful of good players but it appears the poor drafts are here to stay until they find an innovative mind to run the operation and replace some deadwood in the upper levels of management, and after watching Judge praise his players (“challenge them to play for 60 minutes’ what does that even mean for a professional athlete?) while still throwing cliches and platitudes at the fans (who have heard all this rehashed crud from prior bad giants coaches’ “we saw some good things” “that guy is tough he is a fighter” “I need to look at the tape to see what you all saw” etc I really wanted judge to succeed. In my opinion the downward spiral will continue with him in charge. He makes strange game day decisions and all three phases of his team led by his coaches are always reacting to what the opponent does without a plan. How else to explain the constant scoring just before halftime? You know the pass is coming and they still catch balls with no one within five yards of the receiver?
The results are on the scoreboard every week. We are joined by our frustration anger and sense of helplessness. The guy who owns the team has a zero football IQ. The guy putting the team together can’t draft good young players so he overpays in Fred agency and the guy coaching the team doesn’t seem to understand or anticipate situational football but apparently he is a great coach in the film room I’m depressed and old men should not be depressed about a football team
We are now nine years in, but there was 2016. I guess 2016 isn’t that much different than 1972. Neither season went anywhere or led to anything positive.
So we’re nine years in. That’s the only difference.
RE: just posted on the other thread - to me those teams of the 70's
were worse. I never felt like you had a chance with Goldsteyn, Randy Dean, and Pisarcik back there.
I was at opening day of the new Meadowlands stadium in 1976. We were 0-9 at that point of the season, which was only 14 games. We were awful
Are you sure about that???? My first Giants game ever in person was in 76 and they beat the Redskins 12-9. I am pretty sure that was their first win that season, but im almost just as sure that it wasnt the first game in the Meadowlands...first win, yes...but not first game. If it was...then wow!
My introduction to the NY Football Giants was in 1956. I was six years old and an avid follower of the NY Baseball Giants.
So, the year I turned 14, 2-10-2 was a huge shock. Losing to the expansion Dallas Cowboys was shameful. But 1965 brought a "rebuild", and 7-9 was going in the right direction.
1966 was the year Jets fans started to come out in my high school. and 1-12-1 was the absolute low point for a young Giants fan who had been brought up on winning.
You couldn't get Giants tickets. Every game was sold out. Fans left season tickets to their grandchildren. But on the field, it was catastrophic.
And it (almost) never got better. I was actually driving THROUGH Philadelphia listening to the game on the radio when Pisarcik fumbled away a certain win. But one of the reasons the fumble was so bad was because the Giants NEVER won, and here was a game they had won, and they threw it away.
Anyway, 1964-1982 was eighteen years of terrible football. All the same excuses, always the denial that the roster did not contain enough NFL-caliber players to reliably win games.
So, younguns - you haven't lived through eighteen terrible years. You don't have to put up with bragging Jets fans.
But your team is, front to back, not good enough to play against average NFL competition. I would have drafted Barkley. DJ looks OK to me - not a #6 pick, not yet anyway.
But you cannot judge the receivers, the QB, OR the running game without NFL-quality line play. You cannot judge the defense without a pass rush and run-stopping linebackers.
If DJ was Mahomes, or Murray, or Jackson, or Allen - nothing would be different.
The team on the field reflects the organization. And the organization is not competent to compete in the NFL.
All the bitching over who should be drafted where is meaningless if the talent evaluators and the money people can't find or pay players. Nate Solder is a symbol of 2020s NYG football - and a sorry symbol he is.
And as far as a new George Young - Pete Rozelle is not walking through that door. Your ideas about coming to New York as an attractive proposition are 50 years out of date.
Yes,. the Giants can't compete - but neither can the Jets, the Knicks, the Mets, the Rangers, or the Devils.
John Mara is going to have to do the right thing on his own.
It’s bad but the offense is better now then any I recall from the 70s,
to improve your team. You had the draft, and veterans cast off by other teams. To be this shitty for this long in a league designed far parity is truly awful.
This current run has been gutless team after gutless team and the situation is turning into really hopeless now.
During the 60s and 70s, the GIANTS did have some hope because there were some very entertaining units along the way.
When the "fifteen years of lousy football" began in the later 60s, Allie Sherman's offensive units could score a lot of points, and did some creative things, so they were fun to watch. Unfortunately he didn't give a damn about defense, traded away the heart of that unit and never replaced those guys (Sam Huff chief among them), so that's where things like the 72-41 pasting by the Redskins came from. And losing became consistent.
Then Red Webster actually had a .500 season as head coach with pretty much a cast of nobodies on the roster. Webster didn't lose the team in the locker room after things unraveled like McAdoodoo did, either.
Later on, Bill Arnsparger's defense was really great - good enough so that they could steal a win here and there if they got any help at all from the offense or special teams. Those defensive teams were a continuation of the defensive tradition of the 50s that was destroyed by Sherman. They could be very entertaining to watch as they stoned well regarded offensive units. And you never knew when those GIANTS would steal a win from a better team, you just knew that they were going to do it a couple times a year. I don't see current GIANT defenses doing much of anything. Of course, the rules don't let defenses do much of anything any more, which is one reason that I am totally frustrated with the current day NFL.
Arnsparger's defense hung in strong even after Bill was fired. They formed the basis of the team that John McVay almost coached to the turn-around. They were within a holding penalty called on a NYG OL that took a TD against Washington off the board from turning it all around. Unfortunately things unraveled after that call and resulting opening day loss. See why I don't like the zebras?
And that brings up another point - the GIANTS special teams back then could score on kick returns by guys like Rocky Thompson or Clarence Childs back during the "fifteen years of lousy football." The G-men haven't had a really dangerous regular kick returner since Ron Dixon.
I haven't seen anything consistently special about any unit on the GIANTS since the 2011 Super Bowl win. And that's a big part of the difference.
Another thing has intrigued me. Back then, the GIANTS had vet FA players that would be consistently solid for several years, like HB Doug Kotar. Now it seems like they keep signing these over-priced vet free agents who come in, have one good season, and then turn into pricey liabilities for the rest of their contract. This started under Reese and has continued under Gettleman. They also didn't let good drafted players walk as free agents and try to replace them with the draft like they have been doing over the last decade-plus. Yes, the system was different then, but the point remains.
There's a difference in the fan base now, too. Back in those days, GIANTS fans were regarded as some of the best and most knowledgeable in the league. Today's GIANTS fans generally don't know their ass from a hole in the ground, as seen by a host of the comments on this web site, and their behavior has deteriorated significantly as seen by the ice balls incident against the Bengals a few years ago.
This current run has been gutless team after gutless team and the situation is turning into really hopeless now.
During the 60s and 70s, the GIANTS did have some hope because there were some very entertaining units along the way.
When the "fifteen years of lousy football" began in the later 60s, Allie Sherman's offensive units could score a lot of points, and did some creative things, so they were fun to watch. Unfortunately he didn't give a damn about defense, traded away the heart of that unit and never replaced those guys (Sam Huff chief among them), so that's where things like the 72-41 pasting by the Redskins came from. And losing became consistent.
Then Red Webster actually had a .500 season as head coach with pretty much a cast of nobodies on the roster. Webster didn't lose the team in the locker room after things unraveled like McAdoodoo did, either.
Later on, Bill Arnsparger's defense was really great - good enough so that they could steal a win here and there if they got any help at all from the offense or special teams. Those defensive teams were a continuation of the defensive tradition of the 50s that was destroyed by Sherman. They could be very entertaining to watch as they stoned well regarded offensive units. And you never knew when those GIANTS would steal a win from a better team, you just knew that they were going to do it a couple times a year. I don't see current GIANT defenses doing much of anything. Of course, the rules don't let defenses do much of anything any more, which is one reason that I am totally frustrated with the current day NFL.
Arnsparger's defense hung in strong even after Bill was fired. They formed the basis of the team that John McVay almost coached to the turn-around. They were within a holding penalty called on a NYG OL that took a TD against Washington off the board from turning it all around. Unfortunately things unraveled after that call and resulting opening day loss. See why I don't like the zebras?
And that brings up another point - the GIANTS special teams back then could score on kick returns by guys like Rocky Thompson or Clarence Childs back during the "fifteen years of lousy football." The G-men haven't had a really dangerous regular kick returner since Ron Dixon.
I haven't seen anything consistently special about any unit on the GIANTS since the 2011 Super Bowl win. And that's a big part of the difference.
Another thing has intrigued me. Back then, the GIANTS had vet FA players that would be consistently solid for several years, like HB Doug Kotar. Now it seems like they keep signing these over-priced vet free agents who come in, have one good season, and then turn into pricey liabilities for the rest of their contract. This started under Reese and has continued under Gettleman. They also didn't let good drafted players walk as free agents and try to replace them with the draft like they have been doing over the last decade-plus. Yes, the system was different then, but the point remains.
There's a difference in the fan base now, too. Back in those days, GIANTS fans were regarded as some of the best and most knowledgeable in the league. Today's GIANTS fans generally don't know their ass from a hole in the ground, as seen by a host of the comments on this web site, and their behavior has deteriorated significantly as seen by the ice balls incident against the Bengals a few years ago.
That year when Bill got fired and they brought in McVay, 1976, was the worst team I have ever seen. Started 0-9, finished 3-11, had two QB's well over 30 (33 yrs old and 37 yrs old) who were never all that good even in their 20's. Sure the defense was ok, but the offense was absolutely putrid. No QB, Ray Rhodes and Jimmy Robinson were your best WR's, and the RB's were awful. A way over the hill Csonka (who was there for the money) and yes Kotar who was always just an undrafted, below average player.
My Dad use to tell me how luck I was to be born when I did.
I was 10 when we beat the Eagles in the 81' wildcard game
My Dad was the happiest man alive that day. It had been so long since they actually had a playoff win.
The tide had turned new stadium, GM, and a rookie LB that looked pretty good.
I have been luck enough to have seen pretty good football for most of the time.
The mid 90's were bad all the talent from the parcells teams were gone and we had a QB carousel until Collins.
This has too be my lowest point as a Giants fan.
But we got out of the late 60's and 70's let's hope it doesn't take much longer.
This current run has been gutless team after gutless team and the situation is turning into really hopeless now.
During the 60s and 70s, the GIANTS did have some hope because there were some very entertaining units along the way.
When the "fifteen years of lousy football" began in the later 60s, Allie Sherman's offensive units could score a lot of points, and did some creative things, so they were fun to watch. Unfortunately he didn't give a damn about defense, traded away the heart of that unit and never replaced those guys (Sam Huff chief among them), so that's where things like the 72-41 pasting by the Redskins came from. And losing became consistent.
Then Red Webster actually had a .500 season as head coach with pretty much a cast of nobodies on the roster. Webster didn't lose the team in the locker room after things unraveled like McAdoodoo did, either.
Later on, Bill Arnsparger's defense was really great - good enough so that they could steal a win here and there if they got any help at all from the offense or special teams. Those defensive teams were a continuation of the defensive tradition of the 50s that was destroyed by Sherman. They could be very entertaining to watch as they stoned well regarded offensive units. And you never knew when those GIANTS would steal a win from a better team, you just knew that they were going to do it a couple times a year. I don't see current GIANT defenses doing much of anything. Of course, the rules don't let defenses do much of anything any more, which is one reason that I am totally frustrated with the current day NFL.
Arnsparger's defense hung in strong even after Bill was fired. They formed the basis of the team that John McVay almost coached to the turn-around. They were within a holding penalty called on a NYG OL that took a TD against Washington off the board from turning it all around. Unfortunately things unraveled after that call and resulting opening day loss. See why I don't like the zebras?
And that brings up another point - the GIANTS special teams back then could score on kick returns by guys like Rocky Thompson or Clarence Childs back during the "fifteen years of lousy football." The G-men haven't had a really dangerous regular kick returner since Ron Dixon.
I haven't seen anything consistently special about any unit on the GIANTS since the 2011 Super Bowl win. And that's a big part of the difference.
Another thing has intrigued me. Back then, the GIANTS had vet FA players that would be consistently solid for several years, like HB Doug Kotar. Now it seems like they keep signing these over-priced vet free agents who come in, have one good season, and then turn into pricey liabilities for the rest of their contract. This started under Reese and has continued under Gettleman. They also didn't let good drafted players walk as free agents and try to replace them with the draft like they have been doing over the last decade-plus. Yes, the system was different then, but the point remains.
There's a difference in the fan base now, too. Back in those days, GIANTS fans were regarded as some of the best and most knowledgeable in the league. Today's GIANTS fans generally don't know their ass from a hole in the ground, as seen by a host of the comments on this web site, and their behavior has deteriorated significantly as seen by the ice balls incident against the Bengals a few years ago.
Red Dog , you are spot on. At least the offense under Allie Sherman and later Alex Webster was entertaining but they couldn't stop any one. I once had a talk with Don Chandler and lots of players like Chandler hated Sherman and wanted out. And let me add some of the personnel blunders and inept drafting to your post. Allie Sherman cut Don Maynard. After the "earning" the first overall draft pick for the 1965 draft, they passed on Gale Sayers ,Dick Butkus and Joe Namath to take Tucker Fredrickson. After finishing 8-6 in 1972 and clearly needing help on defense, they took Rocky Thompson over Jack Tatum. Don't forget the trades of Tarkenton and Dryer which brought back those football immortals like Norm Snead , Bob Grim, Eldridge Small, and Larry Jacobsen among others. 1973-80 was bad but at least the foundation for the defense was being established and Phil Simms was drafted. I think these past 5 seasons are on course to at least equaling, if not surpassing the late'70s
Think about it. Fans actually paid to have a plane with a banner fly over the stadium. The league had to step in to help the Giants overcome the owners further embarrassment. The league stepping in now would be wishful thinking.
In the 70s Rozelle was the Knight in shining armor that saved the Mara's from themselves and enabled George Young to take over and run the show.
What Knight is out there today to save Johnny Boy's ass????
I see nobody and foresee this debacle continuing a long long time. Who is up next...... you guys all know who.....nonother than wonder boy Kevo Abrams....get ready and be prepared for the next decade of pure garbage.
Eli will be the next Joe Namath talking about the SBs he won as Giants fan attend home games getting blown out and waiting for the 20th SB Anniversary half time ceremony.
This organization has become a complete and utter unwatchable mess.
These are not analogous situations. Rozelle had to step in because Tim and Welly had a long-running feud going that was destroying the team. That isn't the case here. There's no way any Commissioner is going to try to force an Owner, even an inept Owner, to relinquish power over his own business unless there's a very specific reason.
Think about it. Fans actually paid to have a plane with a banner fly over the stadium. The league had to step in to help the Giants overcome the owners further embarrassment. The league stepping in now would be wishful thinking.
It is different for me because in the 70s I had no experience with the Giants winning, so it felt like they just weren’t a team that won championships. I remember in 1987 when they took the field against the Broncos in the Superbowl that it didn’t feel like a real Superbowl because they were in it.
I now have the experience of the Giants winning multiple super bowls so this doesn’t feel as hopeless. But week to week, “we have no chance of winning this game?” It’s the same.
The 70s teams needed to be fumigated top to bottom, including having George Young forced on them so there was a football guy in the room. It feels like something similar is needed now. The guys in the building now are not equipped to fix this.
I was at opening day of the new Meadowlands stadium in 1976. We were 0-9 at that point of the season, which was only 14 games. We were awful
Yes....I'd say pretty much the same. This feels worse though I think because I'm older.
A very long night interrupted now and by a false dawn, only for darkness to fall again right away.
This almost feels worse because we’re just churning coaches and GMs, and whatever move we make fails for talent or injury. Just feels like a treadmill of suck.
Mendy's last season was 1980
Correct.
No matter what you think of Jones as a QB, he's miles better than Joe Pisarcik, Jerry Golsteyn, Randy Dean, an elderly Craig Morton, Norm Snead, etc.
There's a reason the Giants sold so many Dave Jennings posters back then. *grin*
Back then you didn’t see anything from Sunday to Sunday. It must have been brutal.
I was at opening day of the new Meadowlands stadium in 1976. We were 0-9 at that point of the season, which was only 14 games. We were awful
Back then you didn’t see anything from Sunday to Sunday. It must have been brutal.
What Knight is out there today to save Johnny Boy's ass????
I see nobody and foresee this debacle continuing a long long time. Who is up next...... you guys all know who.....nonother than wonder boy Kevo Abrams....get ready and be prepared for the next decade of pure garbage.
Eli will be the next Joe Namath talking about the SBs he won as Giants fan attend home games getting blown out and waiting for the 20th SB Anniversary half time ceremony.
This organization has become a complete and utter unwatchable mess.
History must repeat itself and one man must be given total control of football operations that doesn't answer to a Mara. That is what ended the last disaster and must happen to end this one
The current team has a handful of good players but it appears the poor drafts are here to stay until they find an innovative mind to run the operation and replace some deadwood in the upper levels of management, and after watching Judge praise his players (“challenge them to play for 60 minutes’ what does that even mean for a professional athlete?) while still throwing cliches and platitudes at the fans (who have heard all this rehashed crud from prior bad giants coaches’ “we saw some good things” “that guy is tough he is a fighter” “I need to look at the tape to see what you all saw” etc I really wanted judge to succeed. In my opinion the downward spiral will continue with him in charge. He makes strange game day decisions and all three phases of his team led by his coaches are always reacting to what the opponent does without a plan. How else to explain the constant scoring just before halftime? You know the pass is coming and they still catch balls with no one within five yards of the receiver?
The results are on the scoreboard every week. We are joined by our frustration anger and sense of helplessness. The guy who owns the team has a zero football IQ. The guy putting the team together can’t draft good young players so he overpays in Fred agency and the guy coaching the team doesn’t seem to understand or anticipate situational football but apparently he is a great coach in the film room I’m depressed and old men should not be depressed about a football team
So we’re nine years in. That’s the only difference.
I was at opening day of the new Meadowlands stadium in 1976. We were 0-9 at that point of the season, which was only 14 games. We were awful
Are you sure about that???? My first Giants game ever in person was in 76 and they beat the Redskins 12-9. I am pretty sure that was their first win that season, but im almost just as sure that it wasnt the first game in the Meadowlands...first win, yes...but not first game. If it was...then wow!
I remember a poster some guy held in front of me “Earl wasn’t good enough for Allie” this feels just as bad
So, the year I turned 14, 2-10-2 was a huge shock. Losing to the expansion Dallas Cowboys was shameful. But 1965 brought a "rebuild", and 7-9 was going in the right direction.
1966 was the year Jets fans started to come out in my high school. and 1-12-1 was the absolute low point for a young Giants fan who had been brought up on winning.
You couldn't get Giants tickets. Every game was sold out. Fans left season tickets to their grandchildren. But on the field, it was catastrophic.
And it (almost) never got better. I was actually driving THROUGH Philadelphia listening to the game on the radio when Pisarcik fumbled away a certain win. But one of the reasons the fumble was so bad was because the Giants NEVER won, and here was a game they had won, and they threw it away.
Anyway, 1964-1982 was eighteen years of terrible football. All the same excuses, always the denial that the roster did not contain enough NFL-caliber players to reliably win games.
So, younguns - you haven't lived through eighteen terrible years. You don't have to put up with bragging Jets fans.
But your team is, front to back, not good enough to play against average NFL competition. I would have drafted Barkley. DJ looks OK to me - not a #6 pick, not yet anyway.
But you cannot judge the receivers, the QB, OR the running game without NFL-quality line play. You cannot judge the defense without a pass rush and run-stopping linebackers.
If DJ was Mahomes, or Murray, or Jackson, or Allen - nothing would be different.
The team on the field reflects the organization. And the organization is not competent to compete in the NFL.
All the bitching over who should be drafted where is meaningless if the talent evaluators and the money people can't find or pay players. Nate Solder is a symbol of 2020s NYG football - and a sorry symbol he is.
And as far as a new George Young - Pete Rozelle is not walking through that door. Your ideas about coming to New York as an attractive proposition are 50 years out of date.
Yes,. the Giants can't compete - but neither can the Jets, the Knicks, the Mets, the Rangers, or the Devils.
John Mara is going to have to do the right thing on his own.
But this current team would be on the low end of the 70s.
This is an inferior product being trotted out there each and every week.
The confidence is shattered and the losing is chronic.
Followed by false hope (2016), then anger leading to rage (2017-2019)...
...and finally resigned hopelessness? Just curious.
This current run has been gutless team after gutless team and the situation is turning into really hopeless now.
During the 60s and 70s, the GIANTS did have some hope because there were some very entertaining units along the way.
When the "fifteen years of lousy football" began in the later 60s, Allie Sherman's offensive units could score a lot of points, and did some creative things, so they were fun to watch. Unfortunately he didn't give a damn about defense, traded away the heart of that unit and never replaced those guys (Sam Huff chief among them), so that's where things like the 72-41 pasting by the Redskins came from. And losing became consistent.
Then Red Webster actually had a .500 season as head coach with pretty much a cast of nobodies on the roster. Webster didn't lose the team in the locker room after things unraveled like McAdoodoo did, either.
Later on, Bill Arnsparger's defense was really great - good enough so that they could steal a win here and there if they got any help at all from the offense or special teams. Those defensive teams were a continuation of the defensive tradition of the 50s that was destroyed by Sherman. They could be very entertaining to watch as they stoned well regarded offensive units. And you never knew when those GIANTS would steal a win from a better team, you just knew that they were going to do it a couple times a year. I don't see current GIANT defenses doing much of anything. Of course, the rules don't let defenses do much of anything any more, which is one reason that I am totally frustrated with the current day NFL.
Arnsparger's defense hung in strong even after Bill was fired. They formed the basis of the team that John McVay almost coached to the turn-around. They were within a holding penalty called on a NYG OL that took a TD against Washington off the board from turning it all around. Unfortunately things unraveled after that call and resulting opening day loss. See why I don't like the zebras?
And that brings up another point - the GIANTS special teams back then could score on kick returns by guys like Rocky Thompson or Clarence Childs back during the "fifteen years of lousy football." The G-men haven't had a really dangerous regular kick returner since Ron Dixon.
I haven't seen anything consistently special about any unit on the GIANTS since the 2011 Super Bowl win. And that's a big part of the difference.
Another thing has intrigued me. Back then, the GIANTS had vet FA players that would be consistently solid for several years, like HB Doug Kotar. Now it seems like they keep signing these over-priced vet free agents who come in, have one good season, and then turn into pricey liabilities for the rest of their contract. This started under Reese and has continued under Gettleman. They also didn't let good drafted players walk as free agents and try to replace them with the draft like they have been doing over the last decade-plus. Yes, the system was different then, but the point remains.
There's a difference in the fan base now, too. Back in those days, GIANTS fans were regarded as some of the best and most knowledgeable in the league. Today's GIANTS fans generally don't know their ass from a hole in the ground, as seen by a host of the comments on this web site, and their behavior has deteriorated significantly as seen by the ice balls incident against the Bengals a few years ago.
The 70's were much worse but it's coming to that
This current run has been gutless team after gutless team and the situation is turning into really hopeless now.
During the 60s and 70s, the GIANTS did have some hope because there were some very entertaining units along the way.
When the "fifteen years of lousy football" began in the later 60s, Allie Sherman's offensive units could score a lot of points, and did some creative things, so they were fun to watch. Unfortunately he didn't give a damn about defense, traded away the heart of that unit and never replaced those guys (Sam Huff chief among them), so that's where things like the 72-41 pasting by the Redskins came from. And losing became consistent.
Then Red Webster actually had a .500 season as head coach with pretty much a cast of nobodies on the roster. Webster didn't lose the team in the locker room after things unraveled like McAdoodoo did, either.
Later on, Bill Arnsparger's defense was really great - good enough so that they could steal a win here and there if they got any help at all from the offense or special teams. Those defensive teams were a continuation of the defensive tradition of the 50s that was destroyed by Sherman. They could be very entertaining to watch as they stoned well regarded offensive units. And you never knew when those GIANTS would steal a win from a better team, you just knew that they were going to do it a couple times a year. I don't see current GIANT defenses doing much of anything. Of course, the rules don't let defenses do much of anything any more, which is one reason that I am totally frustrated with the current day NFL.
Arnsparger's defense hung in strong even after Bill was fired. They formed the basis of the team that John McVay almost coached to the turn-around. They were within a holding penalty called on a NYG OL that took a TD against Washington off the board from turning it all around. Unfortunately things unraveled after that call and resulting opening day loss. See why I don't like the zebras?
And that brings up another point - the GIANTS special teams back then could score on kick returns by guys like Rocky Thompson or Clarence Childs back during the "fifteen years of lousy football." The G-men haven't had a really dangerous regular kick returner since Ron Dixon.
I haven't seen anything consistently special about any unit on the GIANTS since the 2011 Super Bowl win. And that's a big part of the difference.
Another thing has intrigued me. Back then, the GIANTS had vet FA players that would be consistently solid for several years, like HB Doug Kotar. Now it seems like they keep signing these over-priced vet free agents who come in, have one good season, and then turn into pricey liabilities for the rest of their contract. This started under Reese and has continued under Gettleman. They also didn't let good drafted players walk as free agents and try to replace them with the draft like they have been doing over the last decade-plus. Yes, the system was different then, but the point remains.
There's a difference in the fan base now, too. Back in those days, GIANTS fans were regarded as some of the best and most knowledgeable in the league. Today's GIANTS fans generally don't know their ass from a hole in the ground, as seen by a host of the comments on this web site, and their behavior has deteriorated significantly as seen by the ice balls incident against the Bengals a few years ago.
That year when Bill got fired and they brought in McVay, 1976, was the worst team I have ever seen. Started 0-9, finished 3-11, had two QB's well over 30 (33 yrs old and 37 yrs old) who were never all that good even in their 20's. Sure the defense was ok, but the offense was absolutely putrid. No QB, Ray Rhodes and Jimmy Robinson were your best WR's, and the RB's were awful. A way over the hill Csonka (who was there for the money) and yes Kotar who was always just an undrafted, below average player.
I was 10 when we beat the Eagles in the 81' wildcard game
My Dad was the happiest man alive that day. It had been so long since they actually had a playoff win.
The tide had turned new stadium, GM, and a rookie LB that looked pretty good.
I have been luck enough to have seen pretty good football for most of the time.
The mid 90's were bad all the talent from the parcells teams were gone and we had a QB carousel until Collins.
This has too be my lowest point as a Giants fan.
But we got out of the late 60's and 70's let's hope it doesn't take much longer.
This current run has been gutless team after gutless team and the situation is turning into really hopeless now.
During the 60s and 70s, the GIANTS did have some hope because there were some very entertaining units along the way.
When the "fifteen years of lousy football" began in the later 60s, Allie Sherman's offensive units could score a lot of points, and did some creative things, so they were fun to watch. Unfortunately he didn't give a damn about defense, traded away the heart of that unit and never replaced those guys (Sam Huff chief among them), so that's where things like the 72-41 pasting by the Redskins came from. And losing became consistent.
Then Red Webster actually had a .500 season as head coach with pretty much a cast of nobodies on the roster. Webster didn't lose the team in the locker room after things unraveled like McAdoodoo did, either.
Later on, Bill Arnsparger's defense was really great - good enough so that they could steal a win here and there if they got any help at all from the offense or special teams. Those defensive teams were a continuation of the defensive tradition of the 50s that was destroyed by Sherman. They could be very entertaining to watch as they stoned well regarded offensive units. And you never knew when those GIANTS would steal a win from a better team, you just knew that they were going to do it a couple times a year. I don't see current GIANT defenses doing much of anything. Of course, the rules don't let defenses do much of anything any more, which is one reason that I am totally frustrated with the current day NFL.
Arnsparger's defense hung in strong even after Bill was fired. They formed the basis of the team that John McVay almost coached to the turn-around. They were within a holding penalty called on a NYG OL that took a TD against Washington off the board from turning it all around. Unfortunately things unraveled after that call and resulting opening day loss. See why I don't like the zebras?
And that brings up another point - the GIANTS special teams back then could score on kick returns by guys like Rocky Thompson or Clarence Childs back during the "fifteen years of lousy football." The G-men haven't had a really dangerous regular kick returner since Ron Dixon.
I haven't seen anything consistently special about any unit on the GIANTS since the 2011 Super Bowl win. And that's a big part of the difference.
Another thing has intrigued me. Back then, the GIANTS had vet FA players that would be consistently solid for several years, like HB Doug Kotar. Now it seems like they keep signing these over-priced vet free agents who come in, have one good season, and then turn into pricey liabilities for the rest of their contract. This started under Reese and has continued under Gettleman. They also didn't let good drafted players walk as free agents and try to replace them with the draft like they have been doing over the last decade-plus. Yes, the system was different then, but the point remains.
There's a difference in the fan base now, too. Back in those days, GIANTS fans were regarded as some of the best and most knowledgeable in the league. Today's GIANTS fans generally don't know their ass from a hole in the ground, as seen by a host of the comments on this web site, and their behavior has deteriorated significantly as seen by the ice balls incident against the Bengals a few years ago.
It was we either had a good offense and a lousy defense or vice versa. It was when Tarkenton was traded back to Minnesota we got really bad.
It wasn’t until George Young arrived did we begin to turn it around with Scott Brunner and Phil Simms as QBs and Ray Perkins as HC.
What Knight is out there today to save Johnny Boy's ass????
I see nobody and foresee this debacle continuing a long long time. Who is up next...... you guys all know who.....nonother than wonder boy Kevo Abrams....get ready and be prepared for the next decade of pure garbage.
Eli will be the next Joe Namath talking about the SBs he won as Giants fan attend home games getting blown out and waiting for the 20th SB Anniversary half time ceremony.
This organization has become a complete and utter unwatchable mess.
These are not analogous situations. Rozelle had to step in because Tim and Welly had a long-running feud going that was destroying the team. That isn't the case here. There's no way any Commissioner is going to try to force an Owner, even an inept Owner, to relinquish power over his own business unless there's a very specific reason.
The hopelessness to me now is worse. Fortunately (or unfortunately) I again have plenty other things to do.