I have disagreed with Terps and bw for about two years on whether Daniel Jones is the right QB for the Giants or not. I said that I would give Jones until mid season to prove he is the Giants QB of the future feeling he had shown ability and never really had decent enough WRs and offensive parts to be fairly judged. I do not need to get to game 9.
I was wrong and they were correct. Daniel Jones is NOT the franchise QB for the New York Giants. He may be able to play on another team with a VG oline and good quality WRs, but not for the Giants. Once Toney left the game he looked panicked and started making poor decisions. Yes the line absolutely blew and even Sterling Shepard was dropping passes. But either he was still affected by the concussion or he was confused by the Rams defense. But he was dreadful after the first drive.
I will also say that whomever made the decision to switch Peart and Solder sides after Thomas went down was an absolute idiot. Peart played VG RT last week. Why double weaken the line by having them switch sides. I stopped watching after the INT with 5 min left in the 1st half when it was 14-3.
So, I was wrong and they were right and I could not return to BBI without that admission.
I actually don’t think Jones sucks or anything. I think he’s an average QB, not a good fit for the Giants in their current place and not worth paying $30mm/year for.
Fussing about individual players and making claims that certain posters were ‘right’ is silly. They need to start by getting a real change going at GM and adopting a vision which was compromised from the beginning around being sensitive to Manning and one last run mentalities.
If there's anything I have learned by watching the Giants - it's that player progress in the NFL is NOT linear.
Just because you're a young NFL player - it doesn't mean that that player is guaranteed to get better the next year and next year and so on...
THe best thing for Daniel Jones - is to get out of the NYG.
The best thing for the NYG - is to get out of Daniel Jones.
Totally agree. I did not realize we had so many “experts” on BBI. Some will not be happy until DJ is gone. He was put in a no win situation here. Good luck to the next QB who fails to meet the expectations of the mob.
Clearly Daniel Jones blew his lunch the second Kadarius Toney left the game, but are you going to completely wipe away Daniel Jones' performance against the Saints when he had good pass blocking and a decent set of WRs on the field?
Jones is certainly capable of having those games, but everything needs to be perfect around him - clean pocket, open WR's. That is not a franchise QB. So he's better than most backups and a handful of starters, is that who we're moving forward with?
Blake Bortles had his share of 300-400 yd games. Mitch Trubisky had 3 straight 300 yd games in year 2, one with 6 TD passes. But neither was able to do it with any consistency. The biggest mistake the organization can make is "but look what he did v the Saints!"
2021 ... there's almost nowhere to go but up, but they've got to get healthy and find reasons to keep working hard.
Again, nobody is "blaming" Jones, but he has shown that while he may not be the biggest part of the problem, he's likely not part of the solution either. QB is the most important position on the field, they get a lot of praise when they win, and a lot of blame when they lose.
Pat Mahomes is an exceptional talent, but Tyreek Hill, Kelce, and Andy Reid were all really, really good before Pat ever played a down. Justin Herbert has been amazing, but the people around him had terrific seasons while Herbert was still at Oregon. Lamar Jackson has surpassed Mike Vick as the most dynamic dual threat QB we’ve ever seen, but he’s on a franchise that’s elite from the top down. THAT STUFF MATTERS! I’ll never understand how so many people can just dismiss that. QBs need those things when they’re trying to learn how to play the game at the professional level. Once they gain experience, then they don’t need all of those things in order to perform.
Daniel Jones may not have ever been good enough to succeed. A lot of QBs don’t. But he never had a chance with this owner, general manager, head coaches, coordinators, offensive line, etc. And I don’t think a single one of the young QBs you guys love would’ve succeeded here either.
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In comment 15418922 Dnew15 said:
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"So you’re going to take a chance on another QB now in hope you find the next mahomes and keep changing until you do?"
That's exactly what you do.
It doesn't have to be Mahomes. It can be Murray, Herbert, Jackson, Allen...
You didn’t even know mahomes was going to be mahomes until he got put an a spread offense masterfully coach ed. And Herbert could be sitting on a bench still for all u know if not for the chargers dr hurting Taylor by mistake
Bullshit. I remember watching highlights from Mahomes’ first start late in his rookie season and sitting straight up because his play was so spectacular.
When was that in college or on a stacked NFL team? he woudl have been running for his life yesterday like Jones was if he was playing vs. the Rams.
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you give him the rest of the season and then evaluate, you cant react to every single game, every single pass, wait until the end of the season and then see what happens
Economics matter though. This is NOT the NFL of Simms & Eli, QB’s need to make their mark during their rookie contract. Jones is 9-23 as a starter and continuously this team does not score enough points. Specifically, red zone offense.
I’m all for evaluating Jones at the end of the season, but committing him to another 4-5 years would be extremely foolish, pie in the sky thinking in my opinion.
So that's the real issue here. The team was supposed to be built to win this year and get better next year while Jones' numbers are still low.
I think Jones is/will be a decent QB. He needs a line and receivers, like most QBs. However, the economic argument is the best to move on from him. If we believe we are keeping most of these players, then you trade Jones and add a Rookie again.
If we feel the team, coach and GM are not part of the future then do a total rebuild. Trade for assets and start from scratch.
Daniel Jones may not have ever been good enough to succeed. A lot of QBs don’t. But he never had a chance with this owner, general manager, head coaches, coordinators, offensive line, etc. And I don’t think a single one of the young QBs you guys love would’ve succeeded here either.
This is true and it's probably going to be what his career is known for. There are other guys in history who might have succeeded but for the misfortune of languishing in a bad franchise.
I actually don’t think Jones sucks or anything. I think he’s an average QB, not a good fit for the Giants in their current place and not worth paying $30mm/year for.
How do you really know he is a bad fit? A Giants QB is being expected to write a novel with crayons. Evaluating any QB in Jones situation is a fools errand.
Pat Mahomes is an exceptional talent, but Tyreek Hill, Kelce, and Andy Reid were all really, really good before Pat ever played a down. Justin Herbert has been amazing, but the people around him had terrific seasons while Herbert was still at Oregon. Lamar Jackson has surpassed Mike Vick as the most dynamic dual threat QB we’ve ever seen, but he’s on a franchise that’s elite from the top down. THAT STUFF MATTERS! I’ll never understand how so many people can just dismiss that. QBs need those things when they’re trying to learn how to play the game at the professional level. Once they gain experience, then they don’t need all of those things in order to perform.
Daniel Jones may not have ever been good enough to succeed. A lot of QBs don’t. But he never had a chance with this owner, general manager, head coaches, coordinators, offensive line, etc. And I don’t think a single one of the young QBs you guys love would’ve succeeded here either.
Good post
No Kenny Golladay
No Kadarius Toney
No Darius Slayton
No Nick Gates
But yeah Daniel sucks for not carrying us to a win vs the Rams.
Exactly -since he has been a Giant has he had any type of weapons for more than 1 game? -no.. Has he had any semblance of a OL and run game for more than 1 game? -no.. Has he had an OL play together for more than 2 games? -no.
First play of game Solder gets beat -they take him off the field march down for 3. Thomas gets hurt, insert M PEart and he gets blasted in back by rusher the very next play fumbling the ball from a blindside hit -he didnt even take his fulldrop back after snap and got leveled. but yeah his fault.. His best and ONLY weapon Toney goes out injured -whose left that would scare anyone? Sheppard, Ross maybe, EE lol but blame Dan.. I hope Giants trade him to a good team like Broncos. He deserves better.
Want to believe yesterday was the real Daniel Jones and not a bad game , ok, your privilege.
Many quarterbacks, some great ones, have games like yesterday. But the narrative has been set with this guy for some of you
Not surprised that a game like yesterday would lead to your conclusion
I'm more worried that Judge and Co. are not the answer.
That's true, but with each passing week, Jones is looking more and more like an average QB at best.
It is difficult to succeed in this shitshow of an organization at this point.
For a YOUNG QB, it's like trying to climb a snowny mountain
with loafers on instead of boots. That's what it looked like yesterday at least.
A couple of turnovers weren't even on him though,
blindside sack and fumble for one, and Shepard falling down on a throw that Jones anticipated where he would be.
The two picks by Taylor Rapp were on Jones.
Rapp just read his eyes. BTW, if they are going to play
the project in Peart, just play him at RT. As soon as he
comes into the game, he allows the sack and fumble.
This OL continues to be a shitshow too!
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The Giants organization ruined the start of Daniel Jones' career in the very same fashion they ruined the end of Eli's.
THe best thing for Daniel Jones - is to get out of the NYG.
The best thing for the NYG - is to get out of Daniel Jones.
Totally agree. I did not realize we had so many “experts” on BBI. Some will not be happy until DJ is gone. He was put in a no win situation here. Good luck to the next QB who fails to meet the expectations of the mob.
The mob is always going to have expectations for a QB taken #6 overall. Those expectations include making the team better, not requiring the team to be better before you can perform.
Justin Herbert made the Chargers better immediately. Speaking of Herbert, anyone else get the idea that someone told him where he was likely going to end up in the 2019 draft and he opted to stay at Oregon instead?
If so, kudos to him. And on top of that, I think some people have a hard time admitting that very often only 1 QB from a particular draft class ends up working out. Jones would have been the 4th or 5th QB taken in either 2018 or 2020, and most of those guys are still up in the air.
2018: Josh Allen and Lamar Jackson are head and shoulders above the class. Mayfield is below that, Darnold is what he is, and Josh Rosen is nowhere.
2019: Obviously Kyler Murray is a star. Jones is mediocre. Haskins is looking like a washout. Drew Lock can't get on the field. Weak QB draft in general.
2020: Burrow and Herbert look like the goods. Tua is going to be hurt so often it's not going to matter - I honestly never got it with that guy anyway. Hurts in the 2nd round is a maybe, Eagles will likely look to improve on that.
Point being, the reason people remember the 1983 and 2004 drafts is because they were unique. It is much more likely that the QB you take will NOT be the guy, and "the guy" is who wins Super Bowls.
So I'd pose this question: who in the NFL is Daniel Jones going to be better than?
Pick an adjective, embarrassing, pathetic, infuriating, etc.
Daniel Jones may not have ever been good enough to succeed. A lot of QBs don’t. But he never had a chance with this owner, general manager, head coaches, coordinators, offensive line, etc. And I don’t think a single one of the young QBs you guys love would’ve succeeded here either.
Why should we assume that the organization that has gotten it wrong at so many positions on the field got it right at QB?
Nobody is suggesting Jones should have won the game yesterday, or that the Giants should be 5-1 right now and he is holding them back. It is possible to have a bad QB on a good team just like you can have a good QB on a bad team.
Having Aaron Rodgers behind center yesterday would not have lead to a win. But you honestly think he would have been as lost and inaccurate as Jones? You think he would have stared holes in his first read all day like Jones did?
Gettleman put together a horrible team, and injuries have removed the few decent pieces they have. But you can still evaluate what a QB does with what he has. If you couldn’t, how would you say Archie Manning and Warren Moon were good QBs?
LMFAO, the Giants 5-1 with that trash defense surrendering points faster than Europe in the early 1940's
The reality is that his middling play seems to be what he is, a guy who won't kill you with turnovers, but a guy who is not going make a large impact on your offense regularly - with exceptions. Most years he'll probably sit in the 18-22 or so qb rankings, which is perfect for a guy who is, for the most part, a game manager.
If he was a third round pick, you could live with that. If you have a stout team around him you might sneak into the playoffs some years, without really seriously every contending for a title.
Bottom line is, if you have a chance to grab a guy with elite qb traits (e.g., elite arm, sees the field, moves well in and around the pocket), such as a Burrow, Herbert, Allen, Jackson, etc - you move heaven and earth to go get that guy in the draft and not let the presence of Jones stop you. The league is such now that you need a top passing game to have a shot most years, and you need a top qb to lead that part of the offense.
Put me in the "Overhaul the entire regime and let a new coach bring in a vet to challenge him" group. Not crazy about this QB class.
That's what I saw, he looked like Kurt Warner for the Giants when he struggled with post-concussion symptoms before Eli was installed. At a minimum, Jones should have been pulled for Glennon rather than go back in around 5 minutes remaining in the third quarter.
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"So you’re going to take a chance on another QB now in hope you find the next mahomes and keep changing until you do?"
That's exactly what you do.
It doesn't have to be Mahomes. It can be Murray, Herbert, Jackson, Allen...
Was it Bill Walsh or Bill Polian who said you draft a qb every year in the draft. Somewhere in the draft, to either develop and trade or be a backup or be the guy (even if you have THE GUY). You take one every year. I'd take those 2 guys at GM day day of the week over DG.
it was Gil Brandt. Dallas back then took on every year. I saw him say it on the Roger Staubach - A Football Life.
So I'd pose this question: who in the NFL is Daniel Jones going to be better than?
You're asking the wrong question. And the fact is no one really knows.
The question is does Jones have what it takes to be become a better QB that can out this team in a position to win Football games. From everything I have seen in Jones the answer is probably yes. Can you do better ? Perhaps but you cannot take a time machine now and draft Mahomes or Herbert. And Jones has shown you enough that you are go forward with him and hopefully change this dumpster fire of a front office and roster
Pat Mahomes is an exceptional talent, but Tyreek Hill, Kelce, and Andy Reid were all really, really good before Pat ever played a down. Justin Herbert has been amazing, but the people around him had terrific seasons while Herbert was still at Oregon. Lamar Jackson has surpassed Mike Vick as the most dynamic dual threat QB we’ve ever seen, but he’s on a franchise that’s elite from the top down. THAT STUFF MATTERS! I’ll never understand how so many people can just dismiss that. QBs need those things when they’re trying to learn how to play the game at the professional level. Once they gain experience, then they don’t need all of those things in order to perform.
Daniel Jones may not have ever been good enough to succeed. A lot of QBs don’t. But he never had a chance with this owner, general manager, head coaches, coordinators, offensive line, etc. And I don’t think a single one of the young QBs you guys love would’ve succeeded here either.
Joe Burrow. He had some talent at WR his rookie year, but his OL was awful, as was the Cincy D. And I'm not sure the talent he had at WR last year was that much better than Jones has had.
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In comment 15418922 Dnew15 said:
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"So you’re going to take a chance on another QB now in hope you find the next mahomes and keep changing until you do?"
That's exactly what you do.
It doesn't have to be Mahomes. It can be Murray, Herbert, Jackson, Allen...
Was it Bill Walsh or Bill Polian who said you draft a qb every year in the draft. Somewhere in the draft, to either develop and trade or be a backup or be the guy (even if you have THE GUY). You take one every year. I'd take those 2 guys at GM day day of the week over DG.
it was Gil Brandt. Dallas back then took on every year. I saw him say it on the Roger Staubach - A Football Life.
I’m surprised at Brandt on that, considering what he dealt with during 1971. That year, the Cowboys rotated between Staubach and Craig Morton every few plays and it was a drag on the team’s morale (delay of game penalties, divided locker room, barely above .500 at midseason) until the Cowboys put Lee Roy Jordan in a room with Tom Landry and Jordan demanded that Landry choose a quarterback. Landry chose Staubach, then things got better.
Put me in the "Overhaul the entire regime and let a new coach bring in a vet to challenge him" group. Not crazy about this QB class.
I agree with that. I wouldn't make too much of yesterday's game, it's possible he was still feeling the effects, and it was only one game. But the reality is that he has been mediocre to poor for 19 of his last 21 games. Having one great game and then 4 OK to bad ones isn't going to cut it.
I do agree that he is almost certainly going to be the starter Game 1 next season, but yeah, bring in a vet to compete. The real question will be, do they exercise his 5th year option this off season? Barring a complete collapse, I think they almost have to.
Jones doesn't have the talent to lead a top franchise. It's as simple as that. We shouldn't stick with him simply because he was selected by Gettleman.
And I disagree with others. He is a terrible bust. It is not clear he is above average. These are things we tell ourselves to feel better about a situation where we have been duped.
Jones is another in a long line of QBs, who show some signs of being decent and tease some observers, but ultimately, they're just bad: Trubisky, Mariota, Bortles, Brisset... He is not better than those guys. He will not become Josh Allen, which was always a statistically unlikely event. He is not an NFL starting quarterback, and his inept play makes our bad situation seem hopeless.
The sooner we are able to move on from this guy the better off we will be.
It is a whiff we will be dealing with for years.
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Daniel Jones may not have ever been good enough to succeed. A lot of QBs don’t. But he never had a chance with this owner, general manager, head coaches, coordinators, offensive line, etc. And I don’t think a single one of the young QBs you guys love would’ve succeeded here either.
Why should we assume that the organization that has gotten it wrong at so many positions on the field got it right at QB?
Who’s saying that we should? My disagreement is with the notion that if you dropped any of these other young QBs into this clown car organization that they would have anything close to the same level of success they’re currently having. It’s just hard for me to judge Daniel Jones thoroughly in a situation where no QB would be successful. Unfortunately for him, he’s not going to get his option picked up and he’ll be lucky to even compete for the starting job next year. The team has to move on.
The reality is that his middling play seems to be what he is, a guy who won't kill you with turnovers, but a guy who is not going make a large impact on your offense regularly - with exceptions. Most years he'll probably sit in the 18-22 or so qb rankings, which is perfect for a guy who is, for the most part, a game manager.
If he was a third round pick, you could live with that. If you have a stout team around him you might sneak into the playoffs some years, without really seriously every contending for a title.
Bottom line is, if you have a chance to grab a guy with elite qb traits (e.g., elite arm, sees the field, moves well in and around the pocket), such as a Burrow, Herbert, Allen, Jackson, etc - you move heaven and earth to go get that guy in the draft and not let the presence of Jones stop you. The league is such now that you need a top passing game to have a shot most years, and you need a top qb to lead that part of the offense.
These post mortems are kind of funny to em. It just so happens that all of these elite QBs play on stacked teams huh?
So then which are the teams that are stacked that just sneak into the playoffs and are longshots with a so so QB?
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In comment 15419011 shockeyisthebest8056 said:
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Daniel Jones may not have ever been good enough to succeed. A lot of QBs don’t. But he never had a chance with this owner, general manager, head coaches, coordinators, offensive line, etc. And I don’t think a single one of the young QBs you guys love would’ve succeeded here either.
Why should we assume that the organization that has gotten it wrong at so many positions on the field got it right at QB?
Who’s saying that we should? My disagreement is with the notion that if you dropped any of these other young QBs into this clown car organization that they would have anything close to the same level of success they’re currently having. It’s just hard for me to judge Daniel Jones thoroughly in a situation where no QB would be successful. Unfortunately for him, he’s not going to get his option picked up and he’ll be lucky to even compete for the starting job next year. The team has to move on.
if you can't judge him in year 3 it's time to move on.
Yesterday was not some kind of outlier performance from Jones. New Orleans was the outlier. Has he had bright spots in his career where he looked like he may be a franchise QB? Absolutely. But more times than not, he is what they call in hockey a passenger. He doesn’t move the needle for the team at all. If everything is clicking he is clicking. When things break down or go sideways he goes off the rails.
I don’t understand why so many people want to hold onto the very few “flashes” he shows and disregard the majority of his play.
It’s ok to be a Giant fan and think some of the players aren’t very good. Everyone on this board thinks Engram should be fired into the sun. That’s ok. But when if you think Jones is not very good, you are some miserable person who hates the Giants.
The question is not is Daniel Jones a nice guy that you want to see succeed. The answer to that is yes. The really question is “have you seen enough to know this guy can put a team on his shoulders and carry them, and you want to commit serious money to him?” I really can’t fathom that people are still answering “yes” to that second question.
It all adds up to "blahtastic". It's been three years now and the folks who said his upside was Case Keenum were correct. We blew the pick.
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He's not a complete disaster, or a notable draft bust. He has games where he can be a difference maker, (TB in 2019, Eagles last year 2nd game, NO this year); games where he is pedestrian; not really moving the offense because he misses open receivers/doesn't see the field/misses throws; and then games where he is a complete disaster, like yesterday for example.
The reality is that his middling play seems to be what he is, a guy who won't kill you with turnovers, but a guy who is not going make a large impact on your offense regularly - with exceptions. Most years he'll probably sit in the 18-22 or so qb rankings, which is perfect for a guy who is, for the most part, a game manager.
If he was a third round pick, you could live with that. If you have a stout team around him you might sneak into the playoffs some years, without really seriously every contending for a title.
Bottom line is, if you have a chance to grab a guy with elite qb traits (e.g., elite arm, sees the field, moves well in and around the pocket), such as a Burrow, Herbert, Allen, Jackson, etc - you move heaven and earth to go get that guy in the draft and not let the presence of Jones stop you. The league is such now that you need a top passing game to have a shot most years, and you need a top qb to lead that part of the offense.
These post mortems are kind of funny to em. It just so happens that all of these elite QBs play on stacked teams huh?
So then which are the teams that are stacked that just sneak into the playoffs and are longshots with a so so QB?
you think it's a coincidence that all the best teams have the best QBs? You think only Jones has dealt with adversity? Rodgers, Brady and Russ all had major line and roster problems, you still know they are great.
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So I'd pose this question: who in the NFL is Daniel Jones going to be better than?
You're asking the wrong question. And the fact is no one really knows.
The question is does Jones have what it takes to be become a better QB that can out this team in a position to win Football games. From everything I have seen in Jones the answer is probably yes.
That's speculative too.
Maybe this will help, who will Daniel Jones almost certainly not be better than?
Jackson, Allen, Herbert, Burrow, Murray immediately come to mind, just among Jones's immediate contemporaries. Then among slightly older QBs there are Mahomes and Dak Prescott.
That doesn't even include obvious elite veterans like Rodgers, Brady, Wilson and Stafford. Not even including this year's rookie class or Deshaun Watson, that leaves Jones at no better than 12th in the MOST optimistic assessment that also leaves out Carr, Mayfield, Wentz, and Matt Ryan - and again that's being very generous.
For me this is still Jones "Prove It Year" before I make a decision on whether he is our QB of the future or another first round draft pick bust.
Let's be honest this roster as currently constructed is a shitshow. You have highly paid defensive players who are underperforming. Injuries on the OL which admittedly was a weak OL to start with that cannot run block at all and pass block now.
3 WR's suffering from injuries and our generational RB coming back from a serious knee injury now on the shelf with an ankle injury.
Yesterday a QB coming back from concussion 6 days earlier.
A coaching staff that is underperforming just like the players.
It's not all just about the QB. This freaking team stinks and yet DJ has only 11 games to go in his Prove It Year.
Thanks to DG and the Mara family family this debacle is getting close to the late 60's and 70's.
Hey old timers remember Tom Kennedy at QB for the Giants in the late 60's???
More likely than not this shot continues for another decade.
Joe Burrow. He had some talent at WR his rookie year, but his OL was awful, as was the Cincy D. And I'm not sure the talent he had at WR last year was that much better than Jones has had.
Would you take Tyler Boyd, Tee Higgins, an aging AJ Green, Gio Bernard, and 5 games of Joe Mixon over Darius Slayton, Sterling Shepard, an aging Golden Tate, Wayne Gallman, and 5 quarters of Saquon Barkley? I think I would. I sure as fuck would take Zac Taylor (or Ann Taylor) calling plays over Jason Garrett. According to ESPN’s analytics, the Giants were the worst pass blocking team in the sport last season. This season Joe Mixon has almost more rushing yards than the Giants entire team. (He has 60% more yards than Barkley & Booker combined.)
Joe Burrow is more accurate than Daniel Jones and does quite a few other things better too. No shit he’s better, but even his situation with the Bengals somehow is superior to what the Giants have. It’s simply a catastrophic organizational failure.
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In comment 15419094 lax counsel said:
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He's not a complete disaster, or a notable draft bust. He has games where he can be a difference maker, (TB in 2019, Eagles last year 2nd game, NO this year); games where he is pedestrian; not really moving the offense because he misses open receivers/doesn't see the field/misses throws; and then games where he is a complete disaster, like yesterday for example.
The reality is that his middling play seems to be what he is, a guy who won't kill you with turnovers, but a guy who is not going make a large impact on your offense regularly - with exceptions. Most years he'll probably sit in the 18-22 or so qb rankings, which is perfect for a guy who is, for the most part, a game manager.
If he was a third round pick, you could live with that. If you have a stout team around him you might sneak into the playoffs some years, without really seriously every contending for a title.
Bottom line is, if you have a chance to grab a guy with elite qb traits (e.g., elite arm, sees the field, moves well in and around the pocket), such as a Burrow, Herbert, Allen, Jackson, etc - you move heaven and earth to go get that guy in the draft and not let the presence of Jones stop you. The league is such now that you need a top passing game to have a shot most years, and you need a top qb to lead that part of the offense.
These post mortems are kind of funny to em. It just so happens that all of these elite QBs play on stacked teams huh?
So then which are the teams that are stacked that just sneak into the playoffs and are longshots with a so so QB?
you think it's a coincidence that all the best teams have the best QBs? You think only Jones has dealt with adversity? Rodgers, Brady and Russ all had major line and roster problems, you still know they are great.
Don’t bother with this moron.
if you can't judge him in year 3 it's time to move on.
98% of BBI is in agreement that we need to move on. I’m just warning some of you who think you can just drop a QB into this shitshow and that he’ll be successful (or better than Jones) that you’re in for a rude awakening.
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if you can't judge him in year 3 it's time to move on.
98% of BBI is in agreement that we need to move on. I’m just warning some of you who think you can just drop a QB into this shitshow and that he’ll be successful (or better than Jones) that you’re in for a rude awakening.
Of course we know that a new QB doesn't transform this team into the 70s Steelers. But a great QB would show much better than we have seen from Jones. He is a stiff, robotic QB who is incapable of improvisation. And he is alarmingly non-productive when he focuses on protecting the ball. And when he lets it loose, he makes mistakes and turnovers. He's not the guy. We don't need five seasons of backup level QB play from our starter to figure it out.
The reality is that his middling play seems to be what he is, a guy who won't kill you with turnovers, but a guy who is not going make a large impact on your offense regularly - with exceptions. Most years he'll probably sit in the 18-22 or so qb rankings, which is perfect for a guy who is, for the most part, a game manager.
If he was a third round pick, you could live with that. If you have a stout team around him you might sneak into the playoffs some years, without really seriously every contending for a title.
Bottom line is, if you have a chance to grab a guy with elite qb traits (e.g., elite arm, sees the field, moves well in and around the pocket), such as a Burrow, Herbert, Allen, Jackson, etc - you move heaven and earth to go get that guy in the draft and not let the presence of Jones stop you. The league is such now that you need a top passing game to have a shot most years, and you need a top qb to lead that part of the offense.
I agree 100% with this post.
Would you take Tyler Boyd, Tee Higgins, an aging AJ Green, Gio Bernard, and 5 games of Joe Mixon over Darius Slayton, Sterling Shepard, an aging Golden Tate, Wayne Gallman, and 5 quarters of Saquon Barkley? I think I would. I sure as fuck would take Zac Taylor (or Ann Taylor) calling plays over Jason Garrett. According to ESPN’s analytics, the Giants were the worst pass blocking team in the sport last season. This season Joe Mixon has almost more rushing yards than the Giants entire team. (He has 60% more yards than Barkley & Booker combined.)
Joe Burrow is more accurate than Daniel Jones and does quite a few other things better too. No shit he’s better, but even his situation with the Bengals somehow is superior to what the Giants have. It’s simply a catastrophic organizational failure.
In 6 games, Mixon averaged a whopping 3.5 ypc, was he a measurable improvement over Gallman? And AJ Green was flat out awful - 47 catches in 104 targets. 104! Golden Tate was better than Green was last year, and that is saying something.
Tee Higgins is a good player, but was he that much better than Slayton? He had fewer catches and a few more yards. He's better than Slayton, who has been very overrated by Giants fans, but doesn't move the needle that much. And Boyd is no better than Shepard, and their OL was really bad.
Part of pressure rate is dictated on how quickly a QB gets rid of the ball. Jones holds the ball too long, and doesn't do his OL any favors. Yes, the OL is bad, but a QB can help manage that.
The talent is terrible, I agree, but he rarely makes plays that show any potential for future rewards. I like that he can run but teams will quickly adapt to the fact that he cannot throw on the run and make adjustments.
They need a vet to come in and man the ship until a hopefully new GM sees a new QB in the draft that's worth pouncing on. The Giants are, unfortunately, going to stink for a awhile until that happens