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| Justin Pugh is a key kog in (maybe) the NFL’s best offense and only undefeated team. He has allowed 0 sacks and has a 71.7 PFF grade. His cap hit is $6.9M. He was 27 when DG let him walk. He replaced him with Patrick Omameh for $10M GT’d who lasted 6 games. Unbelievable. |
Tampa's winning has more to do with the Tom Brady Effect, which no one other team including NYG has remotely replicated. There's no dancing around the fact NYG management is struggling historically in epic fashion. But, pining for JPP to still be here likely would've resulted in more of the same.
Now, it's time to make changes to try again at fixing the problems.
As for JPP, he was/is a great athlete who was great when he showed up to play. Problem with JPP is he only showed up every other year and on contract years (not to mention he was an idiot who blew-off half of his right hand)
lol
I loved JPP but both sides needed to part ways.
The Cardinals gambled on a an injury prone OG, and if he remains healthy, it seems to have paid off for them. No one was pining for Pugh's return, he was labled as a bust around here (rightfully so for his first round status).
The 1978 Yankees HATED each other. The 2002 Giants were a locker room mess. Even the 07 Giants weren't exactly besties in there.
This is exactly the kind of shit i've been screaming about the last few years with this franchise. Worry about the fucking football talent on the field, not how they act in the locker room. This team has been populated with a bunch of nice guys, everyone says the right thing, and then they get curb stomped on Sundays. Take a guess how long the good ship lolipop stays afloat with all this losing? Want to bet the locker room of assholes that win games stays afloat longer than this mess?
Locker room problem my ass. Giants dump the baby far too often.
You could spin a wheel in that locker room and land on a jerk.
In hindsight the larger problems were Snacks, Jenkins, and OBJ. But it’s a lot easier to play the culture card on players you don’t think are any good.
At my former job I was close enough to the Beckham situation to know the Giants were well aware of how dangerous he was. And they rewarded it.
There were plenty of worse locker room and real world dudes under Coughlin. Easy guess as to why that worked.
The 1978 Yankees HATED each other. The 2002 Giants were a locker room mess. Even the 07 Giants weren't exactly besties in there.
Uh. The difference between those teams you mentioned and the Justin Pugh years is ... Those teams won sonething.
When you're losing and you hear bitching it just makes it worse, IMO. Who cares what you have to say sort of thing?
You could spin a wheel in that locker room and land on a jerk.
In hindsight the larger problems were Snacks, Jenkins, and OBJ. But it’s a lot easier to play the culture card on players you don’t think are any good.
At my former job I was close enough to the Beckham situation to know the Giants were well aware of how dangerous he was. And they rewarded it.
There were plenty of worse locker room and real world dudes under Coughlin. Easy guess as to why that worked.
Losing creates jerks. Watch this team erode right before our eyes. Guys like Logan Ryan won't sound so cheerful and company line-ish when it's december and the Giants are 3-12.
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and the state of our team when it came time to decide their futures? This is bizarre.
Right? Neither were healthy or ever played. People complained about them then, and the Giants traded one and let the other go. People are living in some kind of alternate reality. Like the Macadoo thread yesterday.
Even So we are fans. They are the professionals, they have access to all the information and they are responsible to make the right decsisions.
It's not just JPP and Pugh
Eli Apple is still playing
Ereck FLowers is still starting
Landon Collins is still starting
Romeo Okwara has more sacks than anyone the Giants have had
etc etc
Meanwhile the Giants can't win any games
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I don't doubt the Giants deemed PUgh a problem or any inside info, but who the fuck cares?
The 1978 Yankees HATED each other. The 2002 Giants were a locker room mess. Even the 07 Giants weren't exactly besties in there.
Uh. The difference between those teams you mentioned and the Justin Pugh years is ... Those teams won sonething.
When you're losing and you hear bitching it just makes it worse, IMO. Who cares what you have to say sort of thing?
My point is locker room harmony has always been one of the most overstated sports myths of horse shit ever parroted since media and tv could talk. It's bullshit. A made up narrative from the media and fan base that look for any kind of angle to stir shit up.
Losing creates locker room dysfunction. Winning cures all. Always has, always will.
QB controversy is another line of crap too. The two best QBs of the 20th century played on the same team and didn't hide their hate for each other. BAttle lines were drawn and the players took sides. How'd those Niners teams ever overcome such turbulence? By winning.
Good point. They're losers. Bye.
Big distinction between waning positivity and being a jerk. Of course guys won’t be happy when the loses pile up. Completely different topic.
Coughlin was a strong leader, had the pelts, and had the balls.
Coughlin managed Toomer, Strahan, Boley, JPP, Diehl etc. to the podium. and these guys were making big real world mistakes in real life.
Good point. They're losers. Bye.
Simple as that. They suck. We are over thinking whether it's MAra, Judge or the boogeyman. It's all of them until proven otherwise. If the Giants want to win again they do everything in their power to hire the best people and players to run things. They self analyze and analyze everyone else.
Like I said, how many HCs lose miserably in one place only to win a lot somewhere else? Not many. Judge is a problem. I don't care how bad Mara or DG are, Judge aint helping. He's saying all the right things and losing.
If Jones wasn't worth the squeeze, does anyone here truly trust Judge that he would convey that to upper mgmt? Do we trust his judgement? Do we trust that this offense is helping Jones? It's HIS team. Not GArrett's. This is Judge's baby and its dying on the vine.
Lol ok. Amazing how Dallas laps us every year in wins yet they draft and sign assholes every year. Even the Skins win more despite their issues. Same with Philly. Remember when Michael Vick was going to be a locker room cancer? I do. Then he fucked us twice in the same season.
I'm not saying you TRY and sign assholes but talent trumps locker room harmony and always has. The proof is incontrovertible. Literally, incontrovertible.
Yes that includes Barkley and Jones.
Your examples, Cowboys haven't won shit since 1996, Vick won nothing in the NFL.
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when some of you guys play an organized sport, let me know.
Lol ok. Amazing how Dallas laps us every year in wins yet they draft and sign assholes every year. Even the Skins win more despite their issues. Same with Philly. Remember when Michael Vick was going to be a locker room cancer? I do. Then he fucked us twice in the same season.
I'm not saying you TRY and sign assholes but talent trumps locker room harmony and always has. The proof is incontrovertible. Literally, incontrovertible.
I think your overarching point is an interesting one - Jints Central hasn't done a good job of managing different personalities over the last decade or so. No matter what you do for a living - healthcare, software, construction, professional football - success comes down to finding talent and managing it. And being flexible enough to manage different personalities to achieve success.
At the same time, there is merit in the idea that some people just need a change of scenery - hearing different voices, different processes, etc - to get back on track.
But I think it's always healthy to look back on situations like this to see where the failures occurred and what processes can be added to enhanced better outcomes.
A strong leader can keep the outside character flaws from permeating the workplace. Coughlin did this. Shurmur couldn't.
Take OBJ. Practice and gym rat.
His shit talking in private about the org was well known in Manahattan. He got so comfortable doing it, he did it on TV. That was poison for the other players.
Whatever, my point stands. You work with the talent. You fix the issues rather than cut n run every time a talented player mouths off during a bad season.
Dallas has come one or two games away from a super bowl appearance. When they are relatively healthy, they win a lot of games. You can't condemn their whole model based on losing to Aaron Rodgers in a playoff game. That's way too easy.
The Browns signed Kareem Hunt. Known bad guy. It worked. I can all day long with this.
The Giants would rather turn their backs on a good player than even think about risking bad PR. We all know it. And it isn't working.
It aint the player. It's the franchise.
You're dead wrong. The Giants extended OBJ when everyone in Manhattan knew he enjoyed nose candy, openly talked shit about ownership, and Shurmur had to fly to LA and ask him pretty please to tone it down.
What do you think?
There will always be players you'll wish they held on to for one reason or another. JPP and Pugh are not on that list for me. YMMV
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The Giants would rather turn their backs on a good player than even think about risking bad PR. We all know it. And it isn't working.
You're dead wrong. The Giants extended OBJ when everyone in Manhattan knew he enjoyed nose candy, openly talked shit about ownership, and Shurmur had to fly to LA and ask him pretty please to tone it down.
Odell posted Instagram photos in bed with a mirror with what looked to be nose candy on it. He wasn't very subtle.
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The Giants would rather turn their backs on a good player than even think about risking bad PR. We all know it. And it isn't working.
You're dead wrong. The Giants extended OBJ when everyone in Manhattan knew he enjoyed nose candy, openly talked shit about ownership, and Shurmur had to fly to LA and ask him pretty please to tone it down.
Well... Was he wrong on ownership?
That's a guess - I have no inside knowledge of that what-so-ever...but would it really shock anyone?
Once that happens - it's all over for him.
Pugh, good riddance.
This organization/team is terrible right now. That doesn't mean we need to keep malcontents around because they had a good season 10 years ago and have suddenly matured on a championship team.
It's easy to buy in and work when times are good. Much harder finding people who will continue to work hard under less than ideal circumstances. Same goes for Pugh. And I liked Pugh.
JPP needed to move on. I still love the player but at the time with the hand, it made sense to move on
In the grand scheme of moves, to me these were both legitimate moves.
Almost everything he has touched has turned sour.