Simply put, I've ebbed and flowed emotionally, like many of you in recent years, hitching my allegiance wagon to guys like Jones, Judge, Barkley, etc. I've used excuses like injuries, bad timing, tough losses, etc. as a reason to still believe.
To that, with the exception of a select few players, starting with A Thomas, we shouldn't get emotionally attached to anyone on this team. No one. Because the winds of change, again, need to come.
Unfortunately, the only way forward is for a new, progressive, young GM to blow the whole thing up. All of it, with again, the exception of a few. Thomas, Toney, Jones (maybe).
Admittedly, I really want Jones to be the guy. I do. And frankly if he isn't the guy here via circumstance, timing, hell, bad luck, I will follow his career and cheer for him, where-ever, he goes, outside of the Eagles.
Facts are, the Cardinals had the #1 pick less than three years ago. They are undefeated right now. Nuts. And the reason being, their new GM through caution to the wind, re-drafted a top QB and went for it. Now, I do not think this draft has a Kyler Murray. Actually I almost know it. But that doesn't mean decisive, swift, and perhaps aggressive moves will be made.
My advise, embrace change, do not tie your emotions to any one player or coach. Because frankly it's over. And while the winds of change might feel cold now, it might usher in a new beginning.
It's hard to even have fucking hope. Mara is responsible for most of the issues of the last 10 years. Fired Coughlin, kept Reese. The shit-show of the last three coaches, hiring a familiar face in Gettleman, hiring a Belichick recommended special teams coach, Christ even creating the shittiest new stadium in the NFL. It's hard to have hope when it is Mara making these decisions. He's all over every single one of them.
So what now? The season is over and we can sit back and worry that Mara will blame the season on injuries, say DG got a bad break, etc... Maybe the Giants win a couple late season games and show 'fight'. Mara has been threatening shit at the end of seasons for years now saying he expects dramatic improvements. Nothing gets better ang guess what nothing gets changed and if it does, it's someone he knows.
I feel emotional because we all love the Giants. It binds us to our family members, our friends, our memories, our histories. For at least the last five years we have been the worst team in the league. I don't see it changing. Not with Mara making the decisions.
That is my emotional reality of being a Giants fan.
Posters are falling all over themselves to point out something that is wrong, was wrong, was done in a way that turned out poorly, what absolutely must happen to punish those that did the wrong things, what cannot happen if the team wants to win, how this character or that one is to blame...
...The Giants suck, but to be fair, the fanbase sucks too.
Toughen up Nancy, it's only October.
1. We have a really shitty stadium with turf that teams seem to complain about a lot
2. Our star players seem to get hurt more often than you would expect
I've had this same discussion recently in my family - there is no one Giants player that you could safely say - I want to root for this guy for the next 5 years of my life. There's no jersey I want to buy, no autograph I'm hoping my kid has a chance to get. No role model that I can point to. Nothing.
Imagine if 1 had a part in causing 2? The owner would be burned in effigy by the fans.
As far as the OP goes I agree with you except I don't believe in Daniel Jones. Before the game got away last Sunday he lead a great opening drive until it was money time and then threw a pass to Sheppard that was too hard and too high to catch and a fade that was so far out of bounds that the refs picked up a PI flag.
It's nothing new. He doesn't have enough money magic to be worth a 2nd contract. He still stares down his primary option. He still doesn't feel the rush. It's not going to change. I like him and I'll be happy if he finds success somewhere else. But his time with the Giants is up unless they pay him big money and he's worth it IMO.
I don't think it matters who is in the FO. We have owners meddling in who we sign and who we don't to the detriment of the team.
And that's why no matter what they change or how often they change it no progress will be made.
Now if I can only find a way not to get sucked in each March-August. That's the hard part.
As far as the OP goes I agree with you except I don't believe in Daniel Jones. Before the game got away last Sunday he lead a great opening drive until it was money time and then threw a pass to Sheppard that was too hard and too high to catch and a fade that was so far out of bounds that the refs picked up a PI flag.
It's nothing new. He doesn't have enough money magic to be worth a 2nd contract. He still stares down his primary option. He still doesn't feel the rush. It's not going to change. I like him and I'll be happy if he finds success somewhere else. But his time with the Giants is up unless they pay him big money and he's worth it IMO.
You re the only guy which includes. Papa, Banks, Schmeelk, and Shepherd himself that blamed that incompletion on Jones.
Been a fan for forty years and while certainly some lean years often times you had some hope. Perhaps a very good D, a QB you believed in, a Coach he you knew was capable, old warriors who were once champions giving it a last go.
This team.....not very much right now to believe in. I hope whatever course of action they take ownership keeps it simple and asks the question, "What did all those really good championship teams have in common?" Forget scheme, forget analytics for a moment. They all were exceptionally tough physical teams that made teams earn it. Draft players that fit that mold and they will be back shortly with a outstanding HC to put it together.
Posters are falling all over themselves to point out something that is wrong, was wrong, was done in a way that turned out poorly, what absolutely must happen to punish those that did the wrong things, what cannot happen if the team wants to win, how this character or that one is to blame...
...The Giants suck, but to be fair, the fanbase sucks too.
Toughen up Nancy, it's only October.
Haha, this made me laugh.
If Darnold puts up 30, a lot of people will get what they ve been calling for. There will be changes the next day
I am just not sure tearing it all down again...is our best way to get back to winning waya.
Who are these progressive GMs?
1. We have a really shitty stadium with turf that teams seem to complain about a lot
2. Our star players seem to get hurt more often than you would expect
I've had this same discussion recently in my family - there is no one Giants player that you could safely say - I want to root for this guy for the next 5 years of my life. There's no jersey I want to buy, no autograph I'm hoping my kid has a chance to get. No role model that I can point to. Nothing.
Imagine if 1 had a part in causing 2? The owner would be burned in effigy by the fans.
if you're talking about Saquon getting hurt, i'd like to point out he got injured in Chicago and Dallas. not sure how the turf at MetLife is to blame for that
I am just not sure tearing it all down again...is our best way to get back to winning waya.
Who are these progressive GMs?
I'd offer the cardinals. They commit to Rosen, realize it wasn't working out to their satisfaction. They were fortunate enough to have the opportunity to get Murray.
They did not second guess what they were seeing and hope for the best after another year of development.
I'd offer the Rams. They got to a super bowl (loss) with Jared Goff, and paid him like a franchise QB. They saw his limitations and made the move to get a proven veteran QB who fits more what they want to accomplish. The Rams were by no means a bad team with Goff. They have been contenders every year. They were not satisfied with that.
You can't really analyze the veracity of this hypothesis through the lens of any one player. It would be much more about the overall data set. But just for argument's sake, it could have been that Barkley suffered a series of smaller, undetectable injuries on the home turf before something blew up.
I've actually been searching today for data on injuries by stadium, but I haven't come up with anything yet. Something tells me that it won't be easy to find.
That means that natural grass - which is grown successfully at Lincoln Financial Field in Philly, for example, and is (beyond any shred of doubt) exponentially safer for players - is not an option, unfortunately.
Control the line of scrimmage on both sides of the ball. It’s the cost of entry to success. All the dance route concepts and DB packages, it all depends on being able to control the LOS or at least get a stalemate.
We can’t do it. We haven’t done it for years. It’s an incredible failing of our roster building that we now have poor pass blocking AND a piss poor pass rush.
We don’t need a friggin genius level IQ to come in here. We need someone who once and for all can build up our OL and DL from shitty to pretty good. From there everything else becomes possible.
But without it, we’re condemned to suck. It’s that simple.
Posters are falling all over themselves to point out something that is wrong, was wrong, was done in a way that turned out poorly, what absolutely must happen to punish those that did the wrong things, what cannot happen if the team wants to win, how this character or that one is to blame...
...The Giants suck, but to be fair, the fanbase sucks too.
Toughen up Nancy, it's only October.
of year 10
Posters are falling all over themselves to point out something that is wrong, was wrong, was done in a way that turned out poorly, what absolutely must happen to punish those that did the wrong things, what cannot happen if the team wants to win, how this character or that one is to blame...
...The Giants suck, but to be fair, the fanbase sucks too.
Toughen up Nancy, it's only October.
Yes, it's october, and we are way out of it. Wake up Nancy
Root for losses. That's the cost of drafting Barkley and Jones, paying Williams, failing to build the OL, etc. Those errors are costing us these years.
But the changes that are coming will at least be interesting to discuss. More interesting than this pathetic football every Sunday, anyway.
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Still prefer our 4 Lombardis.
I am just not sure tearing it all down again...is our best way to get back to winning waya.
Who are these progressive GMs?
I'd offer the cardinals. They commit to Rosen, realize it wasn't working out to their satisfaction. They were fortunate enough to have the opportunity to get Murray.
They did not second guess what they were seeing and hope for the best after another year of development.
I'd offer the Rams. They got to a super bowl (loss) with Jared Goff, and paid him like a franchise QB. They saw his limitations and made the move to get a proven veteran QB who fits more what they want to accomplish. The Rams were by no means a bad team with Goff. They have been contenders every year. They were not satisfied with that.
Excellent post. Making a mistake is not the problem. Refusing to admit it and correct it is the problem. Jones is not a guy you build upon, but around. Recognize that and move on.
The goal is to win games, not give each player an equal chance to succeed.
You're just so committed to the Giants sucking, and you hated the Williams trade, and you didn't want us to pay him, so you continue to spout this nonsense.
You need to pay good football players. He's one. So we paid him. This theory you have about stripping it all down, paying nobody, and somehow still putting a roster together on Sunday is not based in reality.
The draft isn't some exact science where some GMs are amazing at it and some are terrible. 90% of the league is in the middle. Find your quarterback, find your coach, get some luck to go your way with health and schedule, and you're pretty much on your way. NYG seemed to be trending up from 2019 to 2020, the 2021 season has not gone their way. Whether that be just bad football being played, bad coaching, whatever it is, it ain't happening so far this year. No reason to just give up and start rooting for losses. Go root for the Jets if you want to do that, I'm sure they'd love to have you. The rest of us will be rooting for the Giants to beat the Panthers on Sunday. So fuck off.
I'd offer the cardinals. They commit to Rosen, realize it wasn't working out to their satisfaction. They were fortunate enough to have the opportunity to get Murray.
They did not second guess what they were seeing and hope for the best after another year of development.
I'd offer the Rams. They got to a super bowl (loss) with Jared Goff, and paid him like a franchise QB. They saw his limitations and made the move to get a proven veteran QB who fits more what they want to accomplish. The Rams were by no means a bad team with Goff. They have been contenders every year. They were not satisfied with that.
I really REALLY liked Kyler Murray. But, to be fair, people were Killing Kingsbury on this site for falling in love with him and drafting him at #1. Most people that I recall thought it was a huge reach and a big mistake.
Who is the definitely the problem then?
Who is the definitely the problem then?
The problem is we can't block and we can't rush the passer. The first play from scrimmage on Sunday, Giants had a perfect play call, Shepard was open by about a million yards for a huge play down the middle. But because we can't block, Jones had about 1 second to throw the ball. What else is there to say?
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or not the reason the Giants suck. And the list of players named in these posts is fairly long if you looked at them all.
Who is definitely the problem then?
The problem is we can't block and we can't rush the passer. The first play from scrimmage on Sunday, Giants had a perfect play call, Shepard was open by about a million yards for a huge play down the middle. But because we can't block, Jones had about 1 second to throw the ball. What else is there to say?
So the problem list is just the OL and Edge Rushers?
LEADERSHIP and COACHING does.
We couldn't wait to jettison other highly paid overrated players like JPP and even Vernon. Then those guys won elsewhere.
Rinse. Repeat. Williams AINT the problem. But if you want him to be, have at it.
Judge and Jones aren't leading the team to wins when times were better. Now that times are terrible, they don't stand a chance. It's never simple, but this is how it's unfolding.
You need to pay the right good football players. He's not one. But we paid him. This theory you have about stripping it all down, paying nobody, and somehow still putting a roster together on Sunday is not based in reality.
I edited your paragraph above to be much more accurate.
Posters are falling all over themselves to point out something that is wrong, was wrong, was done in a way that turned out poorly, what absolutely must happen to punish those that did the wrong things, what cannot happen if the team wants to win, how this character or that one is to blame...
...The Giants suck, but to be fair, the fanbase sucks too.
Toughen up Nancy, it's only October.
Shut the fuck up already, douchebag.
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...seems to be that this crew whines an awful lot.
Posters are falling all over themselves to point out something that is wrong, was wrong, was done in a way that turned out poorly, what absolutely must happen to punish those that did the wrong things, what cannot happen if the team wants to win, how this character or that one is to blame...
...The Giants suck, but to be fair, the fanbase sucks too.
Toughen up Nancy, it's only October.
Shut the fuck up already, douchebag.
your response to a reasonable post is the definition of douchebaggery. Don't think you have ground to stand on to be calling people names
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In comment 15421571 Brown_Hornet said:
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...seems to be that this crew whines an awful lot.
Posters are falling all over themselves to point out something that is wrong, was wrong, was done in a way that turned out poorly, what absolutely must happen to punish those that did the wrong things, what cannot happen if the team wants to win, how this character or that one is to blame...
...The Giants suck, but to be fair, the fanbase sucks too.
Toughen up Nancy, it's only October.
Shut the fuck up already, douchebag.
your response to a reasonable post is the definition of douchebaggery. Don't think you have ground to stand on to be calling people names
It's not a reasonable post. As long as that guy has been here, his whole shtick has been to bash the fanbase while the team has been the worst team in football since 2017.
This team hasn't been a single game over .500 in 4.5 years now. Yet, his whole thing is to bash the fans on here instead of the franchise itself. It's fucking moronic and deserved to be called out.
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In comment 15421922 Dave in Hoboken said:
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In comment 15421571 Brown_Hornet said:
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...seems to be that this crew whines an awful lot.
Posters are falling all over themselves to point out something that is wrong, was wrong, was done in a way that turned out poorly, what absolutely must happen to punish those that did the wrong things, what cannot happen if the team wants to win, how this character or that one is to blame...
...The Giants suck, but to be fair, the fanbase sucks too.
Toughen up Nancy, it's only October.
Shut the fuck up already, douchebag.
your response to a reasonable post is the definition of douchebaggery. Don't think you have ground to stand on to be calling people names
It's not a reasonable post. As long as that guy has been here, his whole shtick has been to bash the fanbase while the team has been the worst team in football since 2017.
This team hasn't been a single game over .500 in 4.5 years now. Yet, his whole thing is to bash the fans on here instead of the franchise itself. It's fucking moronic and deserved to be called out.
it takes 20 minutes of reading these forums to realize he's right. the fanbase it toxic af. denying that is silly. Yes the team sucks, but that's not an excuse to be a piece of shit