I like the path Cincy, Arizona, SD, and Buffalo are on.
The teams you mentioned have been historically bad. Finally after decades of futility there seems to be slight glimmers of hope. You sure you want to trade places?
I like the path Cincy, Arizona, SD, and Buffalo are on.
The teams you mentioned have been historically bad. Finally after decades of futility there seems to be slight glimmers of hope. You sure you want to trade places?
nothing more. However, I do think its pretty interesting how the Tepper praise has gone out the window. The owner that was supposed to revolutionize the analytical approach to the game, sparing no expense, doing any and everything to win including stealing Rhule from the Giants with an open checkbook.
Those comments didn't age well.
I think the Panthers are a viable comp to the Giants
new HCs the same year, Darnold was a possible Giants pick, now with them. Two highly paid RBs hurt. Thule was speculated to the Giants. You can taste a little of what it would be like to have Rhule and Darnold and it doesn't look good.
Is the idiocy that gets posted on BBI the next day. The strawman arguments are the worst of those.
“Do you guys still wish we were the Jets??? Do you still wish we had hired Rich Kotite???”
Damn, if only all of us had not foolishly wished we were the Panthers all off season like the OP…
The thread in question did happen, and the title did allude to jealousy of the Panthers. Where is this strawman idea coming from?
The use of "we" is the strawman. Or do we need a thread to rebut every individual idiotic post on this board.
Show me a thread where a significant number of posters were wishing we were the Panthers.
I get you have some of problem with me, no idea why but whatever, there was a 200 post thread and no it wasnt evwryone but a lot of people wanted Tepper over Mara and talked about Rhule over Judge and how the Panthers habe a lot of young talent..
so forgive me for starting a thread calling that out
hasnt he? To think the Panthers gave up multiple picks to get him too, and he gets pulled in game 7. Not good
he got traded for a 6th round pick and a leter 4th and 5 th or whatever? Those are basically lotto picks.
Incidentally if this coach staff was given free reign Jones would have gotten benched too after week 3. The dude is still not trusted to throw in the red zone. Explain to me how you are starting a QB like that?
hasnt he? To think the Panthers gave up multiple picks to get him too, and he gets pulled in game 7. Not good
he got traded for a 6th round pick and a leter 4th and 5 th or whatever? Those are basically lotto picks.
Incidentally if this coach staff was given free reign Jones would have gotten benched too after week 3. The dude is still not trusted to throw in the red zone. Explain to me how you are starting a QB like that?
He is not trusted to throw in the redzone? really? he threw a redzone td and had another one if Rudolph could of kept his foot in bounds..
he also had another redzone pass called..
This idea the coaching staff doesnt trust Jones is moronic and not based on facts
RE: RE: RE: Sam Darnold Has Quickly COme Back To Reality
hasnt he? To think the Panthers gave up multiple picks to get him too, and he gets pulled in game 7. Not good
he got traded for a 6th round pick and a leter 4th and 5 th or whatever? Those are basically lotto picks.
Incidentally if this coach staff was given free reign Jones would have gotten benched too after week 3. The dude is still not trusted to throw in the red zone. Explain to me how you are starting a QB like that?
He is not trusted to throw in the redzone? really? he threw a redzone td and had another one if Rudolph could of kept his foot in bounds..
he also had another redzone pass called..
This idea the coaching staff doesnt trust Jones is moronic and not based on facts
You kidding right now?? Firstly Rudoplh made that play. I cannot believe everyone here is so quick to jump on the guy. He broke a tackle there on a pass that I could have made. If it were Barkley he would've danced around and gotten tackled behind the line of scrimmage.
And last I checked 11 TDs is not a lot, and neither is has TD output. I mentioned this during the game thread. "Well Aaron Rodgers had a little 5 yard dump off for a TD -- that doesn't count either right?" As if on queue they cut to a game break when Rodgers throws some ridiculous 40 yard TD back shoulder or like up where only the Receiver can get it for a great TD play. That is what a confident, capable QB can also do.
Instead we're in 2 TE sets not even in the red zone on the 25 yard line and running the ball and calling trick plays.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Sam Darnold Has Quickly COme Back To Reality
hasnt he? To think the Panthers gave up multiple picks to get him too, and he gets pulled in game 7. Not good
he got traded for a 6th round pick and a leter 4th and 5 th or whatever? Those are basically lotto picks.
Incidentally if this coach staff was given free reign Jones would have gotten benched too after week 3. The dude is still not trusted to throw in the red zone. Explain to me how you are starting a QB like that?
He is not trusted to throw in the redzone? really? he threw a redzone td and had another one if Rudolph could of kept his foot in bounds..
he also had another redzone pass called..
This idea the coaching staff doesnt trust Jones is moronic and not based on facts
You kidding right now?? Firstly Rudoplh made that play. I cannot believe everyone here is so quick to jump on the guy. He broke a tackle there on a pass that I could have made. If it were Barkley he would've danced around and gotten tackled behind the line of scrimmage.
And last I checked 11 TDs is not a lot, and neither is has TD output. I mentioned this during the game thread. "Well Aaron Rodgers had a little 5 yard dump off for a TD -- that doesn't count either right?" As if on queue they cut to a game break when Rodgers throws some ridiculous 40 yard TD back shoulder or like up where only the Receiver can get it for a great TD play. That is what a confident, capable QB can also do.
Instead we're in 2 TE sets not even in the red zone on the 25 yard line and running the ball and calling trick plays.
wait you said they dont let him throw in the redzone, who cares what formation they are in and how far the throw was..the fact he was throwing completely contradicts your point..
What does a 40 yard throw compared to a 5 yard throw have anything to do with your point? just keeping moving the goal posts when someone calls you out
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Sam Darnold Has Quickly COme Back To Reality
What does a 40 yard throw compared to a 5 yard throw have anything to do with your point? just keeping moving the goal posts when someone calls you out
OK so you proved your point by pointing out one fucking throw in the red zone in like 7 games now?
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Sam Darnold Has Quickly COme Back To Reality
What does a 40 yard throw compared to a 5 yard throw have anything to do with your point? just keeping moving the goal posts when someone calls you out
OK so you proved your point by pointing out one fucking throw in the red zone in like 7 games now?
3 throws but whose counting and i am sure there is more, not being completed is a different argument but acting like they never throw in the redzone is fricken stupid
it should be obvious that Jones is playing differently than he has under Shurmur. It is pretty obvious they are going ultra conservative to minimize Jones mistakes. Whether you think that is dumb and Jones needs to show us if he is more like Glen en and DArnold than Aaron Rodgers is a story for another time.
But it there and plainly obvious.
well, for all the love Rhule gets here and all the "Mara fucked up"
what would you set the over/under at for Matt Rhule threads if CAR had curb stomped the NYG yesterday and moved his team into playoff position? 10? 15?
yesterday's result is 1 game. In the grand scheme of things it's meaningless. here's what is important beyond 1 game:
CAR gave Teddy Bridgewater $63m to win 5 games in 2020
CAR passed on the chance to trade up for Herbert (or Tua) in 2020
CAR traded 3 picks for Darnold in 2021 (including their 2nd in 2022)
CAR passed on drafting Fields or Mac Jones in 2021 and
CAR is still paying Bridgewater $7m
and the kicker...
Darnold has an 18m guaranteed salary next year
losing 1 game and even the 4 game losing streak is as meaningless as the earlier 3 game win streak.
however
those who praised their "process" and "culture" and "analytics" and all the other buzzwords amplified by Rhule's fluffer Mike Lombardi may want to consider that their decision making process appears to have been highly flawed - especially as it relates to the QB position.
they are going to enter the offseason of year 3 under this regime and they still aren't even out of the batter's box in the search for a franchise QB. They are likely to only have 1 top 50 pick thanks to the Darnold trade and their 3 wins makes it nearly impossible to pick higher than 5th with at least 2/4 teams ahead of them probably looking for QB's (NYJ, HOU, JAX, DET are pretty much locks to win less than 3 games).
Like most others I was enthusiastic about the possibility hiring Rhule before he went to Carolina and were I a Panther fan I would have been excited about him. Joe Brady seemed like a masterstroke and I'd still swap him for Garrett in a heartbeat. Both may still work out well - but I'd be really alarmed with how they've handled the QB position. More than Miami they may be in a desperate position feeling like they have to trade for Watson because unless they absolutely love one of the QBs in next year's draft do they really want to risk what will likely be a 3rd losing season in a row on a rookie QB? Trading for Watson could either be a coup that saves that regime or a purge of draft picks that sinks it - but either way I'd be very uneasy with the position the franchise is in having to make that decision.
I don’t think some of you know what strawman means
what would you set the over/under at for Matt Rhule threads if CAR had curb stomped the NYG yesterday and moved his team into playoff position? 10? 15?
yesterday's result is 1 game. In the grand scheme of things it's meaningless. here's what is important beyond 1 game:
CAR gave Teddy Bridgewater $63m to win 5 games in 2020
CAR passed on the chance to trade up for Herbert (or Tua) in 2020
CAR traded 3 picks for Darnold in 2021 (including their 2nd in 2022)
CAR passed on drafting Fields or Mac Jones in 2021 and
CAR is still paying Bridgewater $7m
and the kicker...
Darnold has an 18m guaranteed salary next year
losing 1 game and even the 4 game losing streak is as meaningless as the earlier 3 game win streak.
however
those who praised their "process" and "culture" and "analytics" and all the other buzzwords amplified by Rhule's fluffer Mike Lombardi may want to consider that their decision making process appears to have been highly flawed - especially as it relates to the QB position.
they are going to enter the offseason of year 3 under this regime and they still aren't even out of the batter's box in the search for a franchise QB. They are likely to only have 1 top 50 pick thanks to the Darnold trade and their 3 wins makes it nearly impossible to pick higher than 5th with at least 2/4 teams ahead of them probably looking for QB's (NYJ, HOU, JAX, DET are pretty much locks to win less than 3 games).
Like most others I was enthusiastic about the possibility hiring Rhule before he went to Carolina and were I a Panther fan I would have been excited about him. Joe Brady seemed like a masterstroke and I'd still swap him for Garrett in a heartbeat. Both may still work out well - but I'd be really alarmed with how they've handled the QB position. More than Miami they may be in a desperate position feeling like they have to trade for Watson because unless they absolutely love one of the QBs in next year's draft do they really want to risk what will likely be a 3rd losing season in a row on a rookie QB? Trading for Watson could either be a coup that saves that regime or a purge of draft picks that sinks it - but either way I'd be very uneasy with the position the franchise is in having to make that decision.
Do you think you are jumping the gun a little on Darnold? He played 2 bad games. Were you quick to point out how bad the Giants picked at #6 for Jones after how he played against the Cowboys and Rams?
Also you aqree really faulting them for trading a 6th ROund pick , a 2nd and a 4th? That sounds to me like they picked Darnold up for a song.
they stink with Darnold who also costs $18m against their cap in 2022 whether the keep him or cut him. They gave up a 2nd and a 4th to test drive a broken player and it hasn't worked. Had we done that you'd feel differently about that trade package, 100% guaranteed.
he's regressed basically every week - not dissimilar to how he did with the Jets. The RZ INT he threw to Bradberry yesterday was the text book "wtf" play that has haunted him even back to USC.
I'm not a Darnold hater - I actually don't think it was a terrible gamble to add him and hope for a Tannehill type turnaround away from a toxic franchise.
I think their bigger mistake was not trading up in 2020 when 2 teams were actively trying to trade back and instead selecting Derrick brown.
And that it may have been a bigger mistake to not take Mac Jones this past year. Even if he played behind Darnold for the year.
they stink with Darnold who also costs $18m against their cap in 2022 whether the keep him or cut him. They gave up a 2nd and a 4th to test drive a broken player and it hasn't worked. Had we done that you'd feel differently about that trade package, 100% guaranteed.
Right. Because we give up similar picks to acquire Leonard -- who was going to be a free agent anyway. But out of desperation of having 0 pass rush due to gettle's poor roster building just give those picks away for free.
they stink with Darnold who also costs $18m against their cap in 2022 whether the keep him or cut him. They gave up a 2nd and a 4th to test drive a broken player and it hasn't worked. Had we done that you'd feel differently about that trade package, 100% guaranteed.
Right. Because we give up similar picks to acquire Leonard -- who was going to be a free agent anyway. But out of desperation of having 0 pass rush due to gettle's poor roster building just give those picks away for free.
Ok each gave up similar.
One return brought back the defenses likely best player for 31 straight games and counting.
One return brought back a guy who got benched in game 7 and who they are probably praying someone will be willing to trade for in the offseason to save the $18m.
I don't think we need sherlock holmes to find the better deal.
they stink with Darnold who also costs $18m against their cap in 2022 whether the keep him or cut him. They gave up a 2nd and a 4th to test drive a broken player and it hasn't worked. Had we done that you'd feel differently about that trade package, 100% guaranteed.
Right. Because we give up similar picks to acquire Leonard -- who was going to be a free agent anyway. But out of desperation of having 0 pass rush due to gettle's poor roster building just give those picks away for free.
Ok each gave up similar.
One return brought back the defenses likely best player for 31 straight games and counting.
One return brought back a guy who got benched in game 7 and who they are probably praying someone will be willing to trade for in the offseason to save the $18m.
I don't think we need sherlock holmes to find the better deal.
Um if you really wanted to pay a kings ransom for leanord you could have waited till the end of the year to get him. No trade needed / no draft picks needed to be traded.
gotta say it's a very creative thread turn to justify D'arnold
they stink with Darnold who also costs $18m against their cap in 2022 whether the keep him or cut him. They gave up a 2nd and a 4th to test drive a broken player and it hasn't worked. Had we done that you'd feel differently about that trade package, 100% guaranteed.
Right. Because we give up similar picks to acquire Leonard -- who was going to be a free agent anyway. But out of desperation of having 0 pass rush due to gettle's poor roster building just give those picks away for free.
Answer my question, we are talking about Sam Darnold so stay on track. How exactly is that trade a song when he stinks and will cost them $18m next year unless they can trade him?
RE: gotta say it's a very creative thread turn to justify D'arnold
by proxy of the Leonard Williams trade - the day after the Williams-led defense played well enough to D'arnold benched.
Its because his original comment was absurd and got called out on it and has to save face some how.
The Giants fucked up on many things but trading a 2 and a 4 for Darnold wasn't one of them. He's a really bad player and they are stuck with him another year. Pretty funny considering they just benched him.
they stink with Darnold who also costs $18m against their cap in 2022 whether the keep him or cut him. They gave up a 2nd and a 4th to test drive a broken player and it hasn't worked. Had we done that you'd feel differently about that trade package, 100% guaranteed.
Right. Because we give up similar picks to acquire Leonard -- who was going to be a free agent anyway. But out of desperation of having 0 pass rush due to gettle's poor roster building just give those picks away for free.
Answer my question, we are talking about Sam Darnold so stay on track. How exactly is that trade a song when he stinks and will cost them $18m next year unless they can trade him?
You don't know whether he stinks or not. He has still has more wins and more Tds than Jones with otherwise similar numbers playing on a team in his first year with a new coach.
he shows me all the time. And this is you dodging the question twice now, care to make it a trifecta? We are talking about the trade for Darnold, no one else.
he shows me all the time. And this is you dodging the question twice now, care to make it a trifecta? We are talking about the trade for Darnold, no one else.
What exactly is your fucking question or point? That the Giants have never traded a 2nd and 4 th for Darnold?
how is that trade a song when the trade has been terrible for the Panthers? Its a very simple question with a very simple answer.
Again you this idea stcuk in your head that Darnold is terrible. If he's terrible -- with double the TDs and other similar numbers to Jones -- and more wins -- Than what is Jones? Someone who was #6 pick and is also going to make that same 20 mil?
And, my main point of the thread was organizational alignment. The Panthers had (and still do) an owner-GM-HC who all appear to be lockstep in their long term plan.
I like Judge, but the narrative here is much different. We have many people talking about how the new GM should have say in who the new HC is. The GM is a lame duck. From that standpoint, it is frustrating.
I’ll say this: both Judge and Rhule have 8-15 career records, but the narrative on each coach is much, much different.
RE: RE: RE: RE: i've asked you multiple times already
Mostly good football this season; (My opinion shared by quite a few others who cover the team for a living)
Daniel Jones is fun to watch and easy to root for, (again my opinion)
Daniel Jones will be the quarterback for this team next season, (not a fact, but a very high probability)
Fact, His critics here will continue to be relentless in their posts trying to get us to admit they are right about him and our hope for him is misplaced.
But, If you are an anti Jones guy, and twist every single thing he does, even his positive moments, to fit a negative narrative, never saying anything positive about him , you lack objectivity and eventually your pt of view falls on deaf ears.
I ve reached that pt. It s hard to have a meaningful discussion when someone suggests the Giants are afraid to allow Daniel to throw in the red zone. It s pathetic that trying to run in from the 1 ft line is interpreted as a lack of confidence in the quarterback.
so you trade for a guy who was a legit top 10 pick just a few years ago. He played on like the worst franchises in the NFL in terms of coaching; oline ; and receivers etc. You get him for 2nd and 4th ; you get him for 4 mil this year -- well below the avg league starters ; you have to pay him 18 mil again the league standard overall getting him cheap but, that is not good????? But you'll gladly hand that over to Jones who has 1/2 as many TDs and fewer wins who you pretty much know what you have???????
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: i've asked you multiple times already
so you trade for a guy who was a legit top 10 pick just a few years ago. He played on like the worst franchises in the NFL in terms of coaching; oline ; and receivers etc. You get him for 2nd and 4th ; you get him for 4 mil this year -- well below the avg league starters ; you have to pay him 18 mil again the league standard overall getting him cheap but, that is not good????? But you'll gladly hand that over to Jones who has 1/2 as many TDs and fewer wins who you pretty much know what you have???????
Whose paying Jones 18 million?
They traded for a qb who has been terrible, why would you up his salary? there was no reason to..
I dont get why you keep bring Jones into this, it has nothing tl do with him
I ve reached that pt. It s hard to have a meaningful discussion when someone suggests the Giants are afraid to allow Daniel to throw in the red zone.
I made that comment and i hope that Giants coaches are at fault for that. You mean to tell me Jones has had the green light this whole time and only threw 11 TDs last year and is right on track to do that this year???!!!
OK how is that a good starting NFL QB then????
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: i've asked you multiple times already
so you trade for a guy who was a legit top 10 pick just a few years ago. He played on like the worst franchises in the NFL in terms of coaching; oline ; and receivers etc. You get him for 2nd and 4th ; you get him for 4 mil this year -- well below the avg league starters ; you have to pay him 18 mil again the league standard overall getting him cheap but, that is not good????? But you'll gladly hand that over to Jones who has 1/2 as many TDs and fewer wins who you pretty much know what you have???????
Whose paying Jones 18 million?
They traded for a qb who has been terrible, why would you up his salary? there was no reason to..
I dont get why you keep bring Jones into this, it has nothing tl do with him
OK great you have your opinion and that is Darnold is awful. I don't believe for one second it isn't influenced by Jones and the fact the Giants passed on Darnold. When Darnold was 3-0 ; looking good throwing TDs and 300 yards this year -- was it that obvious that he sucked?
so you trade for a guy who was a legit top 10 pick just a few years ago. He played on like the worst franchises in the NFL in terms of coaching; oline ; and receivers etc. You get him for 2nd and 4th ; you get him for 4 mil this year -- well below the avg league starters ; you have to pay him 18 mil again the league standard overall getting him cheap but, that is not good????? But you'll gladly hand that over to Jones who has 1/2 as many TDs and fewer wins who you pretty much know what you have???????
Whose paying Jones 18 million?
They traded for a qb who has been terrible, why would you up his salary? there was no reason to..
I dont get why you keep bring Jones into this, it has nothing tl do with him
OK great you have your opinion and that is Darnold is awful. I don't believe for one second it isn't influenced by Jones and the fact the Giants passed on Darnold. When Darnold was 3-0 ; looking good throwing TDs and 300 yards this year -- was it that obvious that he sucked?
see unlike you i can have a conversation and make an opinion about another player without having to bring up the Giants or Jones..
Jones has nothing to do with Darnold, my view on Jones has nothing to do with my view on Darnold
so you trade for a guy who was a legit top 10 pick just a few years ago. He played on like the worst franchises in the NFL in terms of coaching; oline ; and receivers etc. You get him for 2nd and 4th ; you get him for 4 mil this year -- well below the avg league starters ; you have to pay him 18 mil again the league standard overall getting him cheap but, that is not good????? But you'll gladly hand that over to Jones who has 1/2 as many TDs and fewer wins who you pretty much know what you have???????
Whose paying Jones 18 million?
They traded for a qb who has been terrible, why would you up his salary? there was no reason to..
I dont get why you keep bring Jones into this, it has nothing tl do with him
OK great you have your opinion and that is Darnold is awful. I don't believe for one second it isn't influenced by Jones and the fact the Giants passed on Darnold. When Darnold was 3-0 ; looking good throwing TDs and 300 yards this year -- was it that obvious that he sucked?
That 3-0 start included the Jets, Texans and a Saints team missing numerous starters. Have you seen the Jets and Texans play football this season? You cannot possibly talk about that start without putting into context the teams he played. That’s the first thing you’d point out if Jones had done his damage against those teams then fell on his face when the tougher competition came up on the schedule. At least be consistent
RE: RE: here's a little hypothetical for those criticizing the OP
Do you think you are jumping the gun a little on Darnold? He played 2 bad games. Were you quick to point out how bad the Giants picked at #6 for Jones after how he played against the Cowboys and Rams?
Darnold's last three QBRs are 16,34 and 11. That is putrid.
I honestly think he's the worst starting QB in the NFL right now outside of the rookie QBs playing.
so you trade for a guy who was a legit top 10 pick just a few years ago. He played on like the worst franchises in the NFL in terms of coaching; oline ; and receivers etc. You get him for 2nd and 4th ; you get him for 4 mil this year -- well below the avg league starters ; you have to pay him 18 mil again the league standard overall getting him cheap but, that is not good????? But you'll gladly hand that over to Jones who has 1/2 as many TDs and fewer wins who you pretty much know what you have???????
Whose paying Jones 18 million?
They traded for a qb who has been terrible, why would you up his salary? there was no reason to..
I dont get why you keep bring Jones into this, it has nothing tl do with him
OK great you have your opinion and that is Darnold is awful. I don't believe for one second it isn't influenced by Jones and the fact the Giants passed on Darnold. When Darnold was 3-0 ; looking good throwing TDs and 300 yards this year -- was it that obvious that he sucked?
That 3-0 start included the Jets, Texans and a Saints team missing numerous starters. Have you seen the Jets and Texans play football this season? You cannot possibly talk about that start without putting into context the teams he played. That’s the first thing you’d point out if Jones had done his damage against those teams then fell on his face when the tougher competition came up on the schedule. At least be consistent
Yea but he didn't. There is no hypothetical needed. Jones went 0-3 against some very weak teams this year. In his 3rd year with the same team.
Darnold gets traded for a 2nd and 4th is making below avg salary this year but in bbi logic that is too generous. Like WTF? (He is starting in the NFL). Darnold even gets benched.
you really don't see the difference of treatment both by posters here and by coaches and owners?
RE: RE: RE: here's a little hypothetical for those criticizing the OP
Do you think you are jumping the gun a little on Darnold? He played 2 bad games. Were you quick to point out how bad the Giants picked at #6 for Jones after how he played against the Cowboys and Rams?
Darnold's last three QBRs are 16,34 and 11. That is putrid.
I honestly think he's the worst starting QB in the NFL right now outside of the rookie QBs playing.
Yeah, he's a hot mess right now.
How Am I supposed to prove this anyway without making a comparison?
And, my main point of the thread was organizational alignment. The Panthers had (and still do) an owner-GM-HC who all appear to be lockstep in their long term plan.
I like Judge, but the narrative here is much different. We have many people talking about how the new GM should have say in who the new HC is. The GM is a lame duck. From that standpoint, it is frustrating.
I’ll say this: both Judge and Rhule have 8-15 career records, but the narrative on each coach is much, much different.
see my post above. I understand the alignment point but both then and now their "fully aligned team" oddly hitched their wagon to Darnold over other better options. while things certainly looked better at 3-0 I believe it had been mentioned in that thread that Darnold's outings vs. the Jets and Houston in particular werent all that impressive. He was still making the same kind of play he made yesterday in the RZ with the Bradberry INT - which has always been his achilles heel.
Comparisons to Carolina, Arizona, the Chargers….are useless.
If they still want to : run the ball, stop the run , get to the QB, or, throw the ball to a bevy of great receivers; or, have a rock solid D and an adequate O; or….whatever; draft well to whatever identity they want, coach well to that identity, and be the GIANTS opponents respect.
That’d be a nice change from the last 12+years.
I like the path Cincy, Arizona, SD, and Buffalo are on.
I like the path Cincy, Arizona, SD, and Buffalo are on.
The teams you mentioned have been historically bad. Finally after decades of futility there seems to be slight glimmers of hope. You sure you want to trade places?
“Do you guys still wish we were the Jets??? Do you still wish we had hired Rich Kotite???”
Damn, if only all of us had not foolishly wished we were the Panthers all off season like the OP…
Quote:
Nor do I want to be the giants…
I like the path Cincy, Arizona, SD, and Buffalo are on.
The teams you mentioned have been historically bad. Finally after decades of futility there seems to be slight glimmers of hope. You sure you want to trade places?
As of 10-25-2021, I sure do.
“Do you guys still wish we were the Jets??? Do you still wish we had hired Rich Kotite???”
Damn, if only all of us had not foolishly wished we were the Panthers all off season like the OP…
The thread in question did happen, and the title did allude to jealousy of the Panthers. Where is this strawman idea coming from?
Those comments didn't age well.
Why would I want to be a football franchise?
Quote:
Is the idiocy that gets posted on BBI the next day. The strawman arguments are the worst of those.
“Do you guys still wish we were the Jets??? Do you still wish we had hired Rich Kotite???”
Damn, if only all of us had not foolishly wished we were the Panthers all off season like the OP…
The thread in question did happen, and the title did allude to jealousy of the Panthers. Where is this strawman idea coming from?
The use of "we" is the strawman. Or do we need a thread to rebut every individual idiotic post on this board.
Show me a thread where a significant number of posters were wishing we were the Panthers.
Quote:
In comment 15428396 Mike from Ohio said:
Quote:
Is the idiocy that gets posted on BBI the next day. The strawman arguments are the worst of those.
“Do you guys still wish we were the Jets??? Do you still wish we had hired Rich Kotite???”
Damn, if only all of us had not foolishly wished we were the Panthers all off season like the OP…
The thread in question did happen, and the title did allude to jealousy of the Panthers. Where is this strawman idea coming from?
The use of "we" is the strawman. Or do we need a thread to rebut every individual idiotic post on this board.
Show me a thread where a significant number of posters were wishing we were the Panthers.
I get you have some of problem with me, no idea why but whatever, there was a 200 post thread and no it wasnt evwryone but a lot of people wanted Tepper over Mara and talked about Rhule over Judge and how the Panthers habe a lot of young talent..
so forgive me for starting a thread calling that out
he got traded for a 6th round pick and a leter 4th and 5 th or whatever? Those are basically lotto picks.
Incidentally if this coach staff was given free reign Jones would have gotten benched too after week 3. The dude is still not trusted to throw in the red zone. Explain to me how you are starting a QB like that?
Quote:
hasnt he? To think the Panthers gave up multiple picks to get him too, and he gets pulled in game 7. Not good
he got traded for a 6th round pick and a leter 4th and 5 th or whatever? Those are basically lotto picks.
Incidentally if this coach staff was given free reign Jones would have gotten benched too after week 3. The dude is still not trusted to throw in the red zone. Explain to me how you are starting a QB like that?
He is not trusted to throw in the redzone? really? he threw a redzone td and had another one if Rudolph could of kept his foot in bounds..
he also had another redzone pass called..
This idea the coaching staff doesnt trust Jones is moronic and not based on facts
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In comment 15428426 LTIsTheGreatest said:
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hasnt he? To think the Panthers gave up multiple picks to get him too, and he gets pulled in game 7. Not good
he got traded for a 6th round pick and a leter 4th and 5 th or whatever? Those are basically lotto picks.
Incidentally if this coach staff was given free reign Jones would have gotten benched too after week 3. The dude is still not trusted to throw in the red zone. Explain to me how you are starting a QB like that?
He is not trusted to throw in the redzone? really? he threw a redzone td and had another one if Rudolph could of kept his foot in bounds..
he also had another redzone pass called..
This idea the coaching staff doesnt trust Jones is moronic and not based on facts
You kidding right now?? Firstly Rudoplh made that play. I cannot believe everyone here is so quick to jump on the guy. He broke a tackle there on a pass that I could have made. If it were Barkley he would've danced around and gotten tackled behind the line of scrimmage.
And last I checked 11 TDs is not a lot, and neither is has TD output. I mentioned this during the game thread. "Well Aaron Rodgers had a little 5 yard dump off for a TD -- that doesn't count either right?" As if on queue they cut to a game break when Rodgers throws some ridiculous 40 yard TD back shoulder or like up where only the Receiver can get it for a great TD play. That is what a confident, capable QB can also do.
Instead we're in 2 TE sets not even in the red zone on the 25 yard line and running the ball and calling trick plays.
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In comment 15428464 Debaser said:
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In comment 15428426 LTIsTheGreatest said:
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hasnt he? To think the Panthers gave up multiple picks to get him too, and he gets pulled in game 7. Not good
he got traded for a 6th round pick and a leter 4th and 5 th or whatever? Those are basically lotto picks.
Incidentally if this coach staff was given free reign Jones would have gotten benched too after week 3. The dude is still not trusted to throw in the red zone. Explain to me how you are starting a QB like that?
He is not trusted to throw in the redzone? really? he threw a redzone td and had another one if Rudolph could of kept his foot in bounds..
he also had another redzone pass called..
This idea the coaching staff doesnt trust Jones is moronic and not based on facts
You kidding right now?? Firstly Rudoplh made that play. I cannot believe everyone here is so quick to jump on the guy. He broke a tackle there on a pass that I could have made. If it were Barkley he would've danced around and gotten tackled behind the line of scrimmage.
And last I checked 11 TDs is not a lot, and neither is has TD output. I mentioned this during the game thread. "Well Aaron Rodgers had a little 5 yard dump off for a TD -- that doesn't count either right?" As if on queue they cut to a game break when Rodgers throws some ridiculous 40 yard TD back shoulder or like up where only the Receiver can get it for a great TD play. That is what a confident, capable QB can also do.
Instead we're in 2 TE sets not even in the red zone on the 25 yard line and running the ball and calling trick plays.
wait you said they dont let him throw in the redzone, who cares what formation they are in and how far the throw was..the fact he was throwing completely contradicts your point..
What does a 40 yard throw compared to a 5 yard throw have anything to do with your point? just keeping moving the goal posts when someone calls you out
What does a 40 yard throw compared to a 5 yard throw have anything to do with your point? just keeping moving the goal posts when someone calls you out
OK so you proved your point by pointing out one fucking throw in the red zone in like 7 games now?
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What does a 40 yard throw compared to a 5 yard throw have anything to do with your point? just keeping moving the goal posts when someone calls you out
OK so you proved your point by pointing out one fucking throw in the red zone in like 7 games now?
3 throws but whose counting and i am sure there is more, not being completed is a different argument but acting like they never throw in the redzone is fricken stupid
But it there and plainly obvious.
Doesn't necessarily mean Judge is the GUY, but I also think the jury is clearly still out on both of them.
yesterday's result is 1 game. In the grand scheme of things it's meaningless. here's what is important beyond 1 game:
CAR gave Teddy Bridgewater $63m to win 5 games in 2020
CAR passed on the chance to trade up for Herbert (or Tua) in 2020
CAR traded 3 picks for Darnold in 2021 (including their 2nd in 2022)
CAR passed on drafting Fields or Mac Jones in 2021 and
CAR is still paying Bridgewater $7m
and the kicker...
Darnold has an 18m guaranteed salary next year
losing 1 game and even the 4 game losing streak is as meaningless as the earlier 3 game win streak.
however
those who praised their "process" and "culture" and "analytics" and all the other buzzwords amplified by Rhule's fluffer Mike Lombardi may want to consider that their decision making process appears to have been highly flawed - especially as it relates to the QB position.
they are going to enter the offseason of year 3 under this regime and they still aren't even out of the batter's box in the search for a franchise QB. They are likely to only have 1 top 50 pick thanks to the Darnold trade and their 3 wins makes it nearly impossible to pick higher than 5th with at least 2/4 teams ahead of them probably looking for QB's (NYJ, HOU, JAX, DET are pretty much locks to win less than 3 games).
Like most others I was enthusiastic about the possibility hiring Rhule before he went to Carolina and were I a Panther fan I would have been excited about him. Joe Brady seemed like a masterstroke and I'd still swap him for Garrett in a heartbeat. Both may still work out well - but I'd be really alarmed with how they've handled the QB position. More than Miami they may be in a desperate position feeling like they have to trade for Watson because unless they absolutely love one of the QBs in next year's draft do they really want to risk what will likely be a 3rd losing season in a row on a rookie QB? Trading for Watson could either be a coup that saves that regime or a purge of draft picks that sinks it - but either way I'd be very uneasy with the position the franchise is in having to make that decision.
yesterday's result is 1 game. In the grand scheme of things it's meaningless. here's what is important beyond 1 game:
CAR gave Teddy Bridgewater $63m to win 5 games in 2020
CAR passed on the chance to trade up for Herbert (or Tua) in 2020
CAR traded 3 picks for Darnold in 2021 (including their 2nd in 2022)
CAR passed on drafting Fields or Mac Jones in 2021 and
CAR is still paying Bridgewater $7m
and the kicker...
Darnold has an 18m guaranteed salary next year
losing 1 game and even the 4 game losing streak is as meaningless as the earlier 3 game win streak.
however
those who praised their "process" and "culture" and "analytics" and all the other buzzwords amplified by Rhule's fluffer Mike Lombardi may want to consider that their decision making process appears to have been highly flawed - especially as it relates to the QB position.
they are going to enter the offseason of year 3 under this regime and they still aren't even out of the batter's box in the search for a franchise QB. They are likely to only have 1 top 50 pick thanks to the Darnold trade and their 3 wins makes it nearly impossible to pick higher than 5th with at least 2/4 teams ahead of them probably looking for QB's (NYJ, HOU, JAX, DET are pretty much locks to win less than 3 games).
Like most others I was enthusiastic about the possibility hiring Rhule before he went to Carolina and were I a Panther fan I would have been excited about him. Joe Brady seemed like a masterstroke and I'd still swap him for Garrett in a heartbeat. Both may still work out well - but I'd be really alarmed with how they've handled the QB position. More than Miami they may be in a desperate position feeling like they have to trade for Watson because unless they absolutely love one of the QBs in next year's draft do they really want to risk what will likely be a 3rd losing season in a row on a rookie QB? Trading for Watson could either be a coup that saves that regime or a purge of draft picks that sinks it - but either way I'd be very uneasy with the position the franchise is in having to make that decision.
Do you think you are jumping the gun a little on Darnold? He played 2 bad games. Were you quick to point out how bad the Giants picked at #6 for Jones after how he played against the Cowboys and Rams?
Also you aqree really faulting them for trading a 6th ROund pick , a 2nd and a 4th? That sounds to me like they picked Darnold up for a song.
Best post on here.
You are Canton bound - ( New Window )
I'm not a Darnold hater - I actually don't think it was a terrible gamble to add him and hope for a Tannehill type turnaround away from a toxic franchise.
I think their bigger mistake was not trading up in 2020 when 2 teams were actively trying to trade back and instead selecting Derrick brown.
And that it may have been a bigger mistake to not take Mac Jones this past year. Even if he played behind Darnold for the year.
Right. Because we give up similar picks to acquire Leonard -- who was going to be a free agent anyway. But out of desperation of having 0 pass rush due to gettle's poor roster building just give those picks away for free.
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they stink with Darnold who also costs $18m against their cap in 2022 whether the keep him or cut him. They gave up a 2nd and a 4th to test drive a broken player and it hasn't worked. Had we done that you'd feel differently about that trade package, 100% guaranteed.
Right. Because we give up similar picks to acquire Leonard -- who was going to be a free agent anyway. But out of desperation of having 0 pass rush due to gettle's poor roster building just give those picks away for free.
Ok each gave up similar.
One return brought back the defenses likely best player for 31 straight games and counting.
One return brought back a guy who got benched in game 7 and who they are probably praying someone will be willing to trade for in the offseason to save the $18m.
I don't think we need sherlock holmes to find the better deal.
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In comment 15428642 UConn4523 said:
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they stink with Darnold who also costs $18m against their cap in 2022 whether the keep him or cut him. They gave up a 2nd and a 4th to test drive a broken player and it hasn't worked. Had we done that you'd feel differently about that trade package, 100% guaranteed.
Right. Because we give up similar picks to acquire Leonard -- who was going to be a free agent anyway. But out of desperation of having 0 pass rush due to gettle's poor roster building just give those picks away for free.
Ok each gave up similar.
One return brought back the defenses likely best player for 31 straight games and counting.
One return brought back a guy who got benched in game 7 and who they are probably praying someone will be willing to trade for in the offseason to save the $18m.
I don't think we need sherlock holmes to find the better deal.
Um if you really wanted to pay a kings ransom for leanord you could have waited till the end of the year to get him. No trade needed / no draft picks needed to be traded.
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they stink with Darnold who also costs $18m against their cap in 2022 whether the keep him or cut him. They gave up a 2nd and a 4th to test drive a broken player and it hasn't worked. Had we done that you'd feel differently about that trade package, 100% guaranteed.
Right. Because we give up similar picks to acquire Leonard -- who was going to be a free agent anyway. But out of desperation of having 0 pass rush due to gettle's poor roster building just give those picks away for free.
Answer my question, we are talking about Sam Darnold so stay on track. How exactly is that trade a song when he stinks and will cost them $18m next year unless they can trade him?
Its because his original comment was absurd and got called out on it and has to save face some how.
The Giants fucked up on many things but trading a 2 and a 4 for Darnold wasn't one of them. He's a really bad player and they are stuck with him another year. Pretty funny considering they just benched him.
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In comment 15428642 UConn4523 said:
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they stink with Darnold who also costs $18m against their cap in 2022 whether the keep him or cut him. They gave up a 2nd and a 4th to test drive a broken player and it hasn't worked. Had we done that you'd feel differently about that trade package, 100% guaranteed.
Right. Because we give up similar picks to acquire Leonard -- who was going to be a free agent anyway. But out of desperation of having 0 pass rush due to gettle's poor roster building just give those picks away for free.
Answer my question, we are talking about Sam Darnold so stay on track. How exactly is that trade a song when he stinks and will cost them $18m next year unless they can trade him?
You don't know whether he stinks or not. He has still has more wins and more Tds than Jones with otherwise similar numbers playing on a team in his first year with a new coach.
What exactly is your fucking question or point? That the Giants have never traded a 2nd and 4 th for Darnold?
They are paying him below starter salary for this year.
Again you this idea stcuk in your head that Darnold is terrible. If he's terrible -- with double the TDs and other similar numbers to Jones -- and more wins -- Than what is Jones? Someone who was #6 pick and is also going to make that same 20 mil?
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how is that trade a song when the trade has been terrible for the Panthers? Its a very simple question with a very simple answer.
They are paying him below starter salary for this year.
you realize they upped his salary for next year and will be mamong 18 million right?
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In comment 15428726 UConn4523 said:
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how is that trade a song when the trade has been terrible for the Panthers? Its a very simple question with a very simple answer.
They are paying him below starter salary for this year.
you realize they upped his salary for next year and will be mamong 18 million right?
Ok so what do you expect a starting NFL QB to make in his 5th year? And like what did you want them to do?
I like Judge, but the narrative here is much different. We have many people talking about how the new GM should have say in who the new HC is. The GM is a lame duck. From that standpoint, it is frustrating.
I’ll say this: both Judge and Rhule have 8-15 career records, but the narrative on each coach is much, much different.
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In comment 15428739 Debaser said:
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In comment 15428726 UConn4523 said:
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how is that trade a song when the trade has been terrible for the Panthers? Its a very simple question with a very simple answer.
They are paying him below starter salary for this year.
you realize they upped his salary for next year and will be mamong 18 million right?
Ok so what do you expect a starting NFL QB to make in his 5th year? And like what did you want them to do?
I dont know, maybe wait to see what he did this year, pick up his option and then go from there?
Daniel Jones is fun to watch and easy to root for, (again my opinion)
Daniel Jones will be the quarterback for this team next season, (not a fact, but a very high probability)
Fact, His critics here will continue to be relentless in their posts trying to get us to admit they are right about him and our hope for him is misplaced.
But, If you are an anti Jones guy, and twist every single thing he does, even his positive moments, to fit a negative narrative, never saying anything positive about him , you lack objectivity and eventually your pt of view falls on deaf ears.
I ve reached that pt. It s hard to have a meaningful discussion when someone suggests the Giants are afraid to allow Daniel to throw in the red zone. It s pathetic that trying to run in from the 1 ft line is interpreted as a lack of confidence in the quarterback.
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In comment 15428759 nygiants16 said:
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In comment 15428739 Debaser said:
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In comment 15428726 UConn4523 said:
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how is that trade a song when the trade has been terrible for the Panthers? Its a very simple question with a very simple answer.
They are paying him below starter salary for this year.
you realize they upped his salary for next year and will be mamong 18 million right?
Ok so what do you expect a starting NFL QB to make in his 5th year? And like what did you want them to do?
I dont know, maybe wait to see what he did this year, pick up his option and then go from there?
That’s not how fifth year options work. They had to decide May 3rd
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In comment 15428765 Debaser said:
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In comment 15428759 nygiants16 said:
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In comment 15428739 Debaser said:
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In comment 15428726 UConn4523 said:
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how is that trade a song when the trade has been terrible for the Panthers? Its a very simple question with a very simple answer.
They are paying him below starter salary for this year.
you realize they upped his salary for next year and will be mamong 18 million right?
Ok so what do you expect a starting NFL QB to make in his 5th year? And like what did you want them to do?
I dont know, maybe wait to see what he did this year, pick up his option and then go from there?
That’s not how fifth year options work. They had to decide May 3rd
right, but they didnt have to up his salary
Whose paying Jones 18 million?
They traded for a qb who has been terrible, why would you up his salary? there was no reason to..
I dont get why you keep bring Jones into this, it has nothing tl do with him
I like the path Cincy, Arizona, SD, and Buffalo are on.
I ve reached that pt. It s hard to have a meaningful discussion when someone suggests the Giants are afraid to allow Daniel to throw in the red zone.
I made that comment and i hope that Giants coaches are at fault for that. You mean to tell me Jones has had the green light this whole time and only threw 11 TDs last year and is right on track to do that this year???!!!
OK how is that a good starting NFL QB then????
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In comment 15428774 nygiants16 said:
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In comment 15428765 Debaser said:
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In comment 15428759 nygiants16 said:
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In comment 15428739 Debaser said:
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In comment 15428726 UConn4523 said:
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how is that trade a song when the trade has been terrible for the Panthers? Its a very simple question with a very simple answer.
They are paying him below starter salary for this year.
you realize they upped his salary for next year and will be mamong 18 million right?
Ok so what do you expect a starting NFL QB to make in his 5th year? And like what did you want them to do?
I dont know, maybe wait to see what he did this year, pick up his option and then go from there?
That’s not how fifth year options work. They had to decide May 3rd
right, but they didnt have to up his salary
What are you saying? They didn’t up anything the $18 million value of the option is pre determined.
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so you trade for a guy who was a legit top 10 pick just a few years ago. He played on like the worst franchises in the NFL in terms of coaching; oline ; and receivers etc. You get him for 2nd and 4th ; you get him for 4 mil this year -- well below the avg league starters ; you have to pay him 18 mil again the league standard overall getting him cheap but, that is not good????? But you'll gladly hand that over to Jones who has 1/2 as many TDs and fewer wins who you pretty much know what you have???????
Whose paying Jones 18 million?
They traded for a qb who has been terrible, why would you up his salary? there was no reason to..
I dont get why you keep bring Jones into this, it has nothing tl do with him
OK great you have your opinion and that is Darnold is awful. I don't believe for one second it isn't influenced by Jones and the fact the Giants passed on Darnold. When Darnold was 3-0 ; looking good throwing TDs and 300 yards this year -- was it that obvious that he sucked?
End of fucking story.
No more Garret excuses.
No more excuses!
He will not be an NFL QB unless he figures this out.
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In comment 15428801 Debaser said:
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so you trade for a guy who was a legit top 10 pick just a few years ago. He played on like the worst franchises in the NFL in terms of coaching; oline ; and receivers etc. You get him for 2nd and 4th ; you get him for 4 mil this year -- well below the avg league starters ; you have to pay him 18 mil again the league standard overall getting him cheap but, that is not good????? But you'll gladly hand that over to Jones who has 1/2 as many TDs and fewer wins who you pretty much know what you have???????
Whose paying Jones 18 million?
They traded for a qb who has been terrible, why would you up his salary? there was no reason to..
I dont get why you keep bring Jones into this, it has nothing tl do with him
OK great you have your opinion and that is Darnold is awful. I don't believe for one second it isn't influenced by Jones and the fact the Giants passed on Darnold. When Darnold was 3-0 ; looking good throwing TDs and 300 yards this year -- was it that obvious that he sucked?
see unlike you i can have a conversation and make an opinion about another player without having to bring up the Giants or Jones..
Jones has nothing to do with Darnold, my view on Jones has nothing to do with my view on Darnold
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In comment 15428801 Debaser said:
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so you trade for a guy who was a legit top 10 pick just a few years ago. He played on like the worst franchises in the NFL in terms of coaching; oline ; and receivers etc. You get him for 2nd and 4th ; you get him for 4 mil this year -- well below the avg league starters ; you have to pay him 18 mil again the league standard overall getting him cheap but, that is not good????? But you'll gladly hand that over to Jones who has 1/2 as many TDs and fewer wins who you pretty much know what you have???????
Whose paying Jones 18 million?
They traded for a qb who has been terrible, why would you up his salary? there was no reason to..
I dont get why you keep bring Jones into this, it has nothing tl do with him
OK great you have your opinion and that is Darnold is awful. I don't believe for one second it isn't influenced by Jones and the fact the Giants passed on Darnold. When Darnold was 3-0 ; looking good throwing TDs and 300 yards this year -- was it that obvious that he sucked?
That 3-0 start included the Jets, Texans and a Saints team missing numerous starters. Have you seen the Jets and Texans play football this season? You cannot possibly talk about that start without putting into context the teams he played. That’s the first thing you’d point out if Jones had done his damage against those teams then fell on his face when the tougher competition came up on the schedule. At least be consistent
Do you think you are jumping the gun a little on Darnold? He played 2 bad games. Were you quick to point out how bad the Giants picked at #6 for Jones after how he played against the Cowboys and Rams?
Darnold's last three QBRs are 16,34 and 11. That is putrid.
I honestly think he's the worst starting QB in the NFL right now outside of the rookie QBs playing.
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In comment 15428811 nygiants16 said:
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In comment 15428801 Debaser said:
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so you trade for a guy who was a legit top 10 pick just a few years ago. He played on like the worst franchises in the NFL in terms of coaching; oline ; and receivers etc. You get him for 2nd and 4th ; you get him for 4 mil this year -- well below the avg league starters ; you have to pay him 18 mil again the league standard overall getting him cheap but, that is not good????? But you'll gladly hand that over to Jones who has 1/2 as many TDs and fewer wins who you pretty much know what you have???????
Whose paying Jones 18 million?
They traded for a qb who has been terrible, why would you up his salary? there was no reason to..
I dont get why you keep bring Jones into this, it has nothing tl do with him
OK great you have your opinion and that is Darnold is awful. I don't believe for one second it isn't influenced by Jones and the fact the Giants passed on Darnold. When Darnold was 3-0 ; looking good throwing TDs and 300 yards this year -- was it that obvious that he sucked?
That 3-0 start included the Jets, Texans and a Saints team missing numerous starters. Have you seen the Jets and Texans play football this season? You cannot possibly talk about that start without putting into context the teams he played. That’s the first thing you’d point out if Jones had done his damage against those teams then fell on his face when the tougher competition came up on the schedule. At least be consistent
Yea but he didn't. There is no hypothetical needed. Jones went 0-3 against some very weak teams this year. In his 3rd year with the same team.
Darnold gets traded for a 2nd and 4th is making below avg salary this year but in bbi logic that is too generous. Like WTF? (He is starting in the NFL). Darnold even gets benched.
you really don't see the difference of treatment both by posters here and by coaches and owners?
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Do you think you are jumping the gun a little on Darnold? He played 2 bad games. Were you quick to point out how bad the Giants picked at #6 for Jones after how he played against the Cowboys and Rams?
Darnold's last three QBRs are 16,34 and 11. That is putrid.
I honestly think he's the worst starting QB in the NFL right now outside of the rookie QBs playing.
I like Judge, but the narrative here is much different. We have many people talking about how the new GM should have say in who the new HC is. The GM is a lame duck. From that standpoint, it is frustrating.
I’ll say this: both Judge and Rhule have 8-15 career records, but the narrative on each coach is much, much different.
see my post above. I understand the alignment point but both then and now their "fully aligned team" oddly hitched their wagon to Darnold over other better options. while things certainly looked better at 3-0 I believe it had been mentioned in that thread that Darnold's outings vs. the Jets and Houston in particular werent all that impressive. He was still making the same kind of play he made yesterday in the RZ with the Bradberry INT - which has always been his achilles heel.
Comparisons to Carolina, Arizona, the Chargers….are useless.
If they still want to : run the ball, stop the run , get to the QB, or, throw the ball to a bevy of great receivers; or, have a rock solid D and an adequate O; or….whatever; draft well to whatever identity they want, coach well to that identity, and be the GIANTS opponents respect.
That’d be a nice change from the last 12+years.