Pettis has a big few weeks coming up. He’s a former 2nd rounder. There is no reason he can’t establish himself as a reliable possession WR and figure in the teams future.
Hernandez is Sy's favorite punching bag. I love the guy, enjoy his write ups, but I think he grades on a curve when it comes to Hernandez vis a vis the others. There is no way Hernandez was worse than Solder or Price. And I saw him miss the stunt, I saw Brown beat him. I also saw him move bodies in the run game and play very well against Fox and Da'Quon Jones in pass pro.
Hernandez is not perfect, but he's far from the worst on the line.
Part of the absolute disappointment with Hernandez is that he was a second round pick. It's a massive fail they they didn't get a quality starter out of it. Misses like this set a team back years. Being optimistic about his development likely had them pass on players who would have stepped in and been better.
OL and Pass Rushers
OL and Pass Rushers
OL and Pass Rushers
OL and Pass Rushers
OL and Pass Rushers
======================
Trade down. Accumulate.
============
I'm hoping SY gets his wish about "statement games." He made similar comments after N.O. - not the same - but similar. I'm with prior posts from JonC- (not sure if he changed his mind), that G-MEN have no shot. For me-- this game forget about it as a Giants fan.
But Last year I thought Giants had no shot vs Eagles to win the game. In the NFL stranger things have happened. Hope I'm way wrong.
RE: Ojulari developing is very encouraging. As is X. McKinney.
Sy, I'm curious what you thought/think of the Golloday signing. Knowing that the Giants were hell bent on a WR in Round 1, di you think they should have signed an OL in FA rather than a WR?
I was ok with the Golladay signing. NYG needed a threat at WR and you can't be afraid to spend when a good player like this becomes available. The reservation I had revolved around the player's health history, not necessarily the idea of spending big bucks if that makes sense.
Was there an OL that could have been a better investment? Hindsight is 20/20...but the answer is yes. OG Joe Thuney (to KC), OC Corey Linsley (to LAC), OG Matt Feiler (to LAC) were available for similar if not cheaper cost.
Ellerson Smith has 2 weeks left on his clock, I'm assuming the Giants want him activated to aid in his development.
If there aren't any injuries between now and then, who from the OLB group do you move off the roster so Smith has a spot?
You can always wait and see if/when someone gets hurt. If everyone remains healthy, you are probably looking at Quincy Roche and Cam Brown fighting for their spot.
In your opinion if the Giants have a pick in the top 10 in next uears draft should they go Oline or Defensive front (DL or LB)?
Is the next draft deep at any position IYO?
I've spent most of may team on OL + DL when ti comes to detailed scouting. Our staff has assigned positions for the fall and then we start cross checking in December. I have a feel for other spots, but as of now I am really deep on just the OL/DL.
I see more depth along the OL than I do DL as of now. Tough to say at this point because of potential early declarations. If it were up to me in this moment? Spend a top 10 pick on a DE/OLB type (there will be 1 or 2 there that are GOOD) and go after talented OG in round 2. Depth lines up there nice.
but clinging for some hope. Is it possible Hernandez’s play could in any way be negatively impacted by the corpse of Nate Solder who has been lining up next to him?
They both have been equally awful on combo blocks and defending the stunts. For years. When I examine Hernandez, it is more about the lack of lower body flow, lack of reaction speed, and lack of sustainability in pass protection.
Pettis has a big few weeks coming up. He’s a former 2nd rounder. There is no reason he can’t establish himself as a reliable possession WR and figure in the teams future.
Hernandez is Sy's favorite punching bag. I love the guy, enjoy his write ups, but I think he grades on a curve when it comes to Hernandez vis a vis the others. There is no way Hernandez was worse than Solder or Price. And I saw him miss the stunt, I saw Brown beat him. I also saw him move bodies in the run game and play very well against Fox and Da'Quon Jones in pass pro.
Hernandez is not perfect, but he's far from the worst on the line.
He isn't the worst on the line, I never said that.
In this game, he was.
RE: RE: Ojulari developing is very encouraging. As is X. McKinney.
Sy, I'm curious what you thought/think of the Golloday signing. Knowing that the Giants were hell bent on a WR in Round 1, di you think they should have signed an OL in FA rather than a WR?
I was ok with the Golladay signing. NYG needed a threat at WR and you can't be afraid to spend when a good player like this becomes available. The reservation I had revolved around the player's health history, not necessarily the idea of spending big bucks if that makes sense.
Was there an OL that could have been a better investment? Hindsight is 20/20...but the answer is yes. OG Joe Thuney (to KC), OC Corey Linsley (to LAC), OG Matt Feiler (to LAC) were available for similar if not cheaper cost.
thanks Dave. Makes sense. Let's hope he can stay on the field. He looks like a difference maker when he plays.
was Graham not using him right? Most of the time before this week, he was mostly using bull rush and not being effective. However this week it seemed as if he was allowed to be let loose off the edge and was more productive.
was Graham not using him right? Most of the time before this week, he was mostly using bull rush and not being effective. However this week it seemed as if he was allowed to be let loose off the edge and was more productive.
He abused a rookie that, in my opinion, is not a NFL caliber player yet.
Good writeup. Can see that Leonard Williams and the other
defensive lineman are playing at a higher level in recent games. Some penetration versus running game, some quicker pressures and more penalties on opposing Olinemen.
And that goes a long way in helping Secondary who are sticking a bit closer and knocking down passes where they weren't even on the TV screen several games ago.
It would be nice to see same effort versus a better offense like Kansas City.
I also wanted Reddick in free agency and I could see the Giants expressing interest in him in free agency but they don't have a lot of cap room to get into a bidding war.
As for fixing the offensive line I would look to free agency to sign C Ted Karras as an option in the event that Gates isn't ready to return by camp which is likely. I would also re-sign Skura to a 1 year deal. I would like to see them draft an OL with one of their two 1st round picks plus adding another with one of their three day two picks.
The OL would look like this:
LT Thomas, 3rd round pick
LG Lemieux, Bredeson
C Gates, Karras
RG 1st round pick, Skura
RT Peart
I think the writing was on the wall for what Judge and company thought of the existing LBs when we drafted 5 in 2 years. Coughlin, Brown, Crowder, Ojulari, Elerson Smith, Blake Martinez, Reggie Ragland, Bernardrick McKinney have all been added in two years.
I think Skura and Price are a change as well, it's wide bodies who can pull and move and won't get you clobbered. I'm starting to see that DG and Judge have different talent evaluation criteria and it looks like Judge's way is creeping in.
Gettleman has devoted 24% of his draft selections to Linebacker / EDGE. The NFL average is 13% over the same four years (2018 - 2021).
And the amount of Draft and Free Agent resources he has devoted to the secondary is beyond crazy. Not to mention Gettleman has failed to re-build the O-line.
Oh, well. Next season Dave Gettleman can join BBI as the former GM of the NYG!
"Gettleman has devoted 24% of his draft selections to Linebacker / EDGE. The NFL average is 13% over the same four years (2018 - 2021)." is meaningless without weighting the picks. Many of them the last few years have been 6th and 7th rounders like Crowder and Coughlin who have represented good value for where they were chosen.
its because he switched the team from a 4-3 front to a 3-4, right?
I think the writing was on the wall for what Judge and company thought of the existing LBs when we drafted 5 in 2 years. Coughlin, Brown, Crowder, Ojulari, Elerson Smith, Blake Martinez, Reggie Ragland, Bernardrick McKinney have all been added in two years.
I think Skura and Price are a change as well, it's wide bodies who can pull and move and won't get you clobbered. I'm starting to see that DG and Judge have different talent evaluation criteria and it looks like Judge's way is creeping in.
Gettleman has devoted 24% of his draft selections to Linebacker / EDGE. The NFL average is 13% over the same four years (2018 - 2021).
And the amount of Draft and Free Agent resources he has devoted to the secondary is beyond crazy. Not to mention Gettleman has failed to re-build the O-line.
Oh, well. Next season Dave Gettleman can join BBI as the former GM of the NYG!
"Gettleman has devoted 24% of his draft selections to Linebacker / EDGE. The NFL average is 13% over the same four years (2018 - 2021)." is meaningless without weighting the picks. Many of them the last few years have been 6th and 7th rounders like Crowder and Coughlin who have represented good value for where they were chosen.
its because he switched the team from a 4-3 front to a 3-4, right?
Gettleman somehow forgot about how defenses work. A 3-4 for example is reliant on good linebackers to stop the run and rush the passer because the linemen are often two-gapping to free up the linebackers; none of the top linebackers for the great 80s run were drafted lower than the fourth round: Carson was a 4th rounder in '76, LT was a 1st rounder in '81, Banks was a 1st rounder in '84, and Reasons was a 4th in the same draft as Banks. Outside of possibly Ojulari in the 2nd round, the best linebackers since we've adopted the 3-4 have been acquired via free agency (Martinez, possibly Golden). Most of the other linebackers we've drafted since Gettleman got here have either underwhelmed (Carter, Ximines, possibly Crowder) or barely played (Cam Brown, Carter Coughlin)
I'd say switch back to the 4-3 since there's a number of players whose contracts are expiring or we can cut bait with and we wouldn't need a spot for another inside linebacker with Martinez.
Pettis has a big few weeks coming up. He’s a former 2nd rounder. There is no reason he can’t establish himself as a reliable possession WR and figure in the teams future.
Fans' POV on Hernandez have become a bit of an IQ test. He really hasn't been good, but DG acolytes and NYG pollyannas seem to think otherwise.
Is a great receiver, but we can all see he's not being used properly. He's a 6'4", contested catch king and he's being used for slants. How many down field chances has he gotten? I remember Jones hitting Board down the field for one, but don't remember one route where Jones had down to KG.
And I don't know if it has been highlighted, but it's worth repeating even if it has been:
Quote:
(1) Back in 2018, almost everyone had Darnold as the top quarterback in the class. I never saw it. No, I’m not patting myself on the back at all (I had Josh Rosen as QB1). I go back and examine my hits and misses every offseason to try and figure out where I went wrong and what I can do to improve my own scouting.
I love this. That's what sets legitimate professionals apart from blowhard dilettantes: the urge to continually improve. That includes owning up to mistakes and analyzing the thought process that led to them. This is sorely missing in most sports media (I'll leave the rest aside). So, kudos, Sy. I always enjoy your analysis and I'll appreciate it even more now.
Quote:
Pettis has a big few weeks coming up. He’s a former 2nd rounder. There is no reason he can’t establish himself as a reliable possession WR and figure in the teams future.
Hernandez is Sy's favorite punching bag. I love the guy, enjoy his write ups, but I think he grades on a curve when it comes to Hernandez vis a vis the others. There is no way Hernandez was worse than Solder or Price. And I saw him miss the stunt, I saw Brown beat him. I also saw him move bodies in the run game and play very well against Fox and Da'Quon Jones in pass pro.
Hernandez is not perfect, but he's far from the worst on the line.
Part of the absolute disappointment with Hernandez is that he was a second round pick. It's a massive fail they they didn't get a quality starter out of it. Misses like this set a team back years. Being optimistic about his development likely had them pass on players who would have stepped in and been better.
OL and Pass Rushers
OL and Pass Rushers
OL and Pass Rushers
OL and Pass Rushers
======================
Trade down. Accumulate.
============
I'm hoping SY gets his wish about "statement games." He made similar comments after N.O. - not the same - but similar. I'm with prior posts from JonC- (not sure if he changed his mind), that G-MEN have no shot. For me-- this game forget about it as a Giants fan.
But Last year I thought Giants had no shot vs Eagles to win the game. In the NFL stranger things have happened. Hope I'm way wrong.
Sy, I'm curious what you thought/think of the Golloday signing. Knowing that the Giants were hell bent on a WR in Round 1, di you think they should have signed an OL in FA rather than a WR?
I was ok with the Golladay signing. NYG needed a threat at WR and you can't be afraid to spend when a good player like this becomes available. The reservation I had revolved around the player's health history, not necessarily the idea of spending big bucks if that makes sense.
Was there an OL that could have been a better investment? Hindsight is 20/20...but the answer is yes. OG Joe Thuney (to KC), OC Corey Linsley (to LAC), OG Matt Feiler (to LAC) were available for similar if not cheaper cost.
He never improved the holes in his a game. When NFL coaches got some film on him, they knew what to expose and Hernandez just hasn't;t responded.
If there aren't any injuries between now and then, who from the OLB group do you move off the roster so Smith has a spot?
You can always wait and see if/when someone gets hurt. If everyone remains healthy, you are probably looking at Quincy Roche and Cam Brown fighting for their spot.
Is the next draft deep at any position IYO?
I've spent most of may team on OL + DL when ti comes to detailed scouting. Our staff has assigned positions for the fall and then we start cross checking in December. I have a feel for other spots, but as of now I am really deep on just the OL/DL.
I see more depth along the OL than I do DL as of now. Tough to say at this point because of potential early declarations. If it were up to me in this moment? Spend a top 10 pick on a DE/OLB type (there will be 1 or 2 there that are GOOD) and go after talented OG in round 2. Depth lines up there nice.
They both have been equally awful on combo blocks and defending the stunts. For years. When I examine Hernandez, it is more about the lack of lower body flow, lack of reaction speed, and lack of sustainability in pass protection.
So, no.
Quote:
Pettis has a big few weeks coming up. He’s a former 2nd rounder. There is no reason he can’t establish himself as a reliable possession WR and figure in the teams future.
Hernandez is Sy's favorite punching bag. I love the guy, enjoy his write ups, but I think he grades on a curve when it comes to Hernandez vis a vis the others. There is no way Hernandez was worse than Solder or Price. And I saw him miss the stunt, I saw Brown beat him. I also saw him move bodies in the run game and play very well against Fox and Da'Quon Jones in pass pro.
Hernandez is not perfect, but he's far from the worst on the line.
He isn't the worst on the line, I never said that.
In this game, he was.
Quote:
OL is going to be a problem for a while.
Sy, I'm curious what you thought/think of the Golloday signing. Knowing that the Giants were hell bent on a WR in Round 1, di you think they should have signed an OL in FA rather than a WR?
I was ok with the Golladay signing. NYG needed a threat at WR and you can't be afraid to spend when a good player like this becomes available. The reservation I had revolved around the player's health history, not necessarily the idea of spending big bucks if that makes sense.
Was there an OL that could have been a better investment? Hindsight is 20/20...but the answer is yes. OG Joe Thuney (to KC), OC Corey Linsley (to LAC), OG Matt Feiler (to LAC) were available for similar if not cheaper cost.
thanks Dave. Makes sense. Let's hope he can stay on the field. He looks like a difference maker when he plays.
Sure. But I wouldn't get too excited about that. You can say that about 40-50 second year players right now. Half will reach that level, at the most.
He needs to keep improving the skill set (reads, angles...etc). The goods are there, they need to be applied now.
He abused a rookie that, in my opinion, is not a NFL caliber player yet.
And that goes a long way in helping Secondary who are sticking a bit closer and knocking down passes where they weren't even on the TV screen several games ago.
It would be nice to see same effort versus a better offense like Kansas City.
As for fixing the offensive line I would look to free agency to sign C Ted Karras as an option in the event that Gates isn't ready to return by camp which is likely. I would also re-sign Skura to a 1 year deal. I would like to see them draft an OL with one of their two 1st round picks plus adding another with one of their three day two picks.
The OL would look like this:
LT Thomas, 3rd round pick
LG Lemieux, Bredeson
C Gates, Karras
RG 1st round pick, Skura
RT Peart
Quote:
In comment 15429851 Joey in VA said:
Quote:
I think the writing was on the wall for what Judge and company thought of the existing LBs when we drafted 5 in 2 years. Coughlin, Brown, Crowder, Ojulari, Elerson Smith, Blake Martinez, Reggie Ragland, Bernardrick McKinney have all been added in two years.
I think Skura and Price are a change as well, it's wide bodies who can pull and move and won't get you clobbered. I'm starting to see that DG and Judge have different talent evaluation criteria and it looks like Judge's way is creeping in.
Gettleman has devoted 24% of his draft selections to Linebacker / EDGE. The NFL average is 13% over the same four years (2018 - 2021).
And the amount of Draft and Free Agent resources he has devoted to the secondary is beyond crazy. Not to mention Gettleman has failed to re-build the O-line.
Oh, well. Next season Dave Gettleman can join BBI as the former GM of the NYG!
"Gettleman has devoted 24% of his draft selections to Linebacker / EDGE. The NFL average is 13% over the same four years (2018 - 2021)." is meaningless without weighting the picks. Many of them the last few years have been 6th and 7th rounders like Crowder and Coughlin who have represented good value for where they were chosen.
its because he switched the team from a 4-3 front to a 3-4, right?
Quote:
In comment 15429888 M.S. said:
Quote:
In comment 15429851 Joey in VA said:
Quote:
I think the writing was on the wall for what Judge and company thought of the existing LBs when we drafted 5 in 2 years. Coughlin, Brown, Crowder, Ojulari, Elerson Smith, Blake Martinez, Reggie Ragland, Bernardrick McKinney have all been added in two years.
I think Skura and Price are a change as well, it's wide bodies who can pull and move and won't get you clobbered. I'm starting to see that DG and Judge have different talent evaluation criteria and it looks like Judge's way is creeping in.
Gettleman has devoted 24% of his draft selections to Linebacker / EDGE. The NFL average is 13% over the same four years (2018 - 2021).
And the amount of Draft and Free Agent resources he has devoted to the secondary is beyond crazy. Not to mention Gettleman has failed to re-build the O-line.
Oh, well. Next season Dave Gettleman can join BBI as the former GM of the NYG!
"Gettleman has devoted 24% of his draft selections to Linebacker / EDGE. The NFL average is 13% over the same four years (2018 - 2021)." is meaningless without weighting the picks. Many of them the last few years have been 6th and 7th rounders like Crowder and Coughlin who have represented good value for where they were chosen.
its because he switched the team from a 4-3 front to a 3-4, right?
Gettleman somehow forgot about how defenses work. A 3-4 for example is reliant on good linebackers to stop the run and rush the passer because the linemen are often two-gapping to free up the linebackers; none of the top linebackers for the great 80s run were drafted lower than the fourth round: Carson was a 4th rounder in '76, LT was a 1st rounder in '81, Banks was a 1st rounder in '84, and Reasons was a 4th in the same draft as Banks. Outside of possibly Ojulari in the 2nd round, the best linebackers since we've adopted the 3-4 have been acquired via free agency (Martinez, possibly Golden). Most of the other linebackers we've drafted since Gettleman got here have either underwhelmed (Carter, Ximines, possibly Crowder) or barely played (Cam Brown, Carter Coughlin)
I'd say switch back to the 4-3 since there's a number of players whose contracts are expiring or we can cut bait with and we wouldn't need a spot for another inside linebacker with Martinez.
Fans' POV on Hernandez have become a bit of an IQ test. He really hasn't been good, but DG acolytes and NYG pollyannas seem to think otherwise.
Of course the other side of the debate would say that they would want a stable and competent cornerback opposite Bradberry.
Giants won...but they still need to fire Garrett.
I love this. That's what sets legitimate professionals apart from blowhard dilettantes: the urge to continually improve. That includes owning up to mistakes and analyzing the thought process that led to them. This is sorely missing in most sports media (I'll leave the rest aside). So, kudos, Sy. I always enjoy your analysis and I'll appreciate it even more now.