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NFT: Mets make offer to Brewers GM Matt Arnold to be PBO?

Everyone Relax : 10/26/2021 1:49 pm
Per Puma.

Someone wiser than me want to weigh in on Matt Arnold? Has he sexually harassed anyone or received a DUI recently?
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RE: RE: Here  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 2:02 pm : link
In comment 15431596 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
In comment 15431580 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


is what I'm referencing Link - ( New Window )



you didn't know Chris Christie's son was a huge proponent of Matt Arnold and Scott Harris?

save yourself the energy and don't take the clickbait Dan. if their "source familiar with the situation" was actually with the team, or anyone legitimately involved in MLB, they would have described them so.


Deesha Thosar hasn't exactly been known to be a rumor monger type. She's been by the book since covering them for NYDN which is why this is concerning.
Brewers  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 2:03 pm : link
extend Matt Arnold.
The biggest part of that Christie report for me  
moespree : 10/27/2021 2:12 pm : link
Is his son is apparently the amateur and international scouting director. What exactly are his qualifications for such a job that should lead anyone to think he can successfully handle such a role?
RE: The biggest part of that Christie report for me  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 2:20 pm : link
In comment 15431614 moespree said:
Quote:
Is his son is apparently the amateur and international scouting director. What exactly are his qualifications for such a job that should lead anyone to think he can successfully handle such a role?


Excellent point/question
Looks  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 2:34 pm : link
like Christie and Fred Wilpon were friends, Andrew Christie was hired as an intern with the Mets under Fred.
FO  
GF1080 : 10/27/2021 2:39 pm : link
Barf worthy that Christie and his son wiggled their way into the team. Mets.com still lists Tanous as scouting director.

Andrew Christie: Coordinator, Player Development Initiatives
Theo  
TyreeHelmet : 10/27/2021 2:40 pm : link
Cohen me with Theo right? Do you think the idea of part ownership was even broached? It's not my team but it seems like a no brainer if done right. Is 5% or whatever it would take even consequential to Cohen? Again not my money but I would do whatever it took to get the best...
RE: FO  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 2:44 pm : link
In comment 15431660 GF1080 said:
Quote:
Barf worthy that Christie and his son wiggled their way into the team. Mets.com still lists Tanous as scouting director.

Andrew Christie: Coordinator, Player Development Initiatives


From somebody who would know

"got promoted again recently too, he's now the "coordinator of player development initiatives" or something like that"
.  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 3:16 pm : link
Good Fundies Brian
@OmarMinayaFan
·
2m
It's all been speculation and nonsense and outrage for clicks until @DeeshaThosar
's latest piece. Deesha is the best on the beat and I am genuinely concerned about who Cohen is getting advice from.
.  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 3:41 pm : link
It would be "funny" after all of the proclamations that @mets
aren't interested in Sabean, for Sabean to be the hire and Cohen/Sandy state at the presser he was always their first choice"To be honest, we didn't think he was available"..
Michael  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 3:42 pm : link
Girsch said no to joining the Mets. Unbelievable.
RE: Michael  
Metnut : 10/27/2021 3:44 pm : link
In comment 15431737 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
Girsch said no to joining the Mets. Unbelievable.


It’s nice that they are reaching out to the right people but troublesome that everyone is saying no.
Is Cohen being cheap?  
Metnut : 10/27/2021 3:44 pm : link
You can’t think all of these young GM types are turning down tens of millions right? Cohen needs to blow someone away to make this work.
Semantics  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 3:47 pm : link
maybe but based on the phrasing...

Girsch, Theo, Bendix, Harris, Beane all said thanks but no thanks.

Arnold either was blocked or said no, Stearns blocked... yikes
Doesn't  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 3:49 pm : link
include Gomes who they were basically blocked on too...
RE: RE: Michael  
Eric on Li : 10/27/2021 3:50 pm : link
In comment 15431741 Metnut said:
Quote:
In comment 15431737 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


Girsch said no to joining the Mets. Unbelievable.



It’s nice that they are reaching out to the right people but troublesome that everyone is saying no.


agreed. I think a factor we need to consider with the type of hire they are most exploring (younger up and comers) is that a lot of them are complete unknowns to even 99% of MLB fans and probably like it that way. hitting the back pages of NY newspapers changes things and this job is a spotlight job.

not implying that they've done anything as nefarious, but everyone saw how quickly the spotlight exposed Porter and became a big deal. Would it have been as bad for him if he took a job in Seattle or remained in AZ? I kind of doubt it.
RE: Is Cohen being cheap?  
Eric on Li : 10/27/2021 3:53 pm : link
In comment 15431744 Metnut said:
Quote:
You can’t think all of these young GM types are turning down tens of millions right? Cohen needs to blow someone away to make this work.


hard to blow someone without a track record away pre-interview. that'd be risky and borderline negligent no matter how well regarded they are. Theo or Beane sure.

if I were Cohen I'd be on the phone with Theo upping the equity, but I'd have been doing that 2 weeks ago also.
It's not good  
moespree : 10/27/2021 3:53 pm : link
I don't honestly believe it has much to do with Alderson either. He makes an easy target to blame for the media, but I think it is genuine that he has little interest in being day to day.

So I guess that leaves Cohen himself as the potential stumbling block for not wanting the job. I admit I am somewhat confused by that though.

Cohen may have a negative reputation in some circles but you're passing up a chance to run a team in the NY market with not unlimited, but very high monetary resources at your disposal. Perhaps I am overvaluing the attraction of that though.
.  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 3:55 pm : link
Biggest red flags are Bendix/Girsch. Neither have a path to #1 in their organization and both rejected the Mets. Arnold would be a similar situation, but unclear if he said no or was actually blocked. At least Harris is from San Fran.
RE: It's not good  
Eric on Li : 10/27/2021 3:58 pm : link
In comment 15431759 moespree said:
Quote:
I don't honestly believe it has much to do with Alderson either. He makes an easy target to blame for the media, but I think it is genuine that he has little interest in being day to day.

So I guess that leaves Cohen himself as the potential stumbling block for not wanting the job. I admit I am somewhat confused by that though.

Cohen may have a negative reputation in some circles but you're passing up a chance to run a team in the NY market with not unlimited, but very high monetary resources at your disposal. Perhaps I am overvaluing the attraction of that though.


I think it's a double edged sword.

Some guys would probably be thrilled to have the chance to be a big swinging dick getting rich in NY.

Some probably value that they are already living some version of their dream life and don't want to uproot their families and mess that up. Remember execs don't move around as frequently as coaches/players do and aren't used to being in the media spotlight as much either.

It goes without saying they need to find the first type of guy who only cares about winning championships.
Valid-  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 4:00 pm : link
BS
@thebs19
·
3m
Replying to
@rywatty88
and
@WexlerRules
Milw got Stearns to leave Houston + Arnold to leave TB.

LAD got Friedman to leave TB.

Sox got Bloom to leave TB.

Cubs got Theo to leave Boston and Hoyer to leave SD.

Braves got AA to leave LA.

Houston got Click to leave TB despite being in the middle of a huge scandal.
presumably the Mets could have gotten bloom too but they chose bvw  
Eric on Li : 10/27/2021 4:04 pm : link
stearns we don't know because he clearly got blocked but he'd worked here prior and was from the area. and they did get both Porter/Scott last year.

at the end of the day it's on Cohen to find someone willing to take his check. if it needs to be a bigger check so be it. i can't imagine he hasn't found himself in similar situations before attempting to secure highly sought after talent.
.  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 4:10 pm : link
Dana Brown (ATL), Billy Owens (OAK), James Harris (CLE), Carlos Rodriguez (TB), Pete Putila (HOU) are all guys who often come up as "well thought of" executives @StevenACohen2
may want to contact (shhhh I'm not really Chris Christie)
I am not sure what we are concerned about here  
bhill410 : 10/27/2021 4:48 pm : link
Cohen is leading the search and frankly should be. Guy has been nothing but successful in hires and at identifying what he wants in an organization. Now we may be investigated for cheating in 8 years but in interim I expect them to be filled with extremely smart (if unscrupulous) individuals. Wasn’t everyone complaining about alderson just 3 days ago? This is essentially saying all of those fears were not justified.
So  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 4:56 pm : link
Chris Christie and his son being the ones advising him or now 8 names either passing or being blocked isn't a concern? That's one way to see it.
Peter  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 4:57 pm : link
Bendix, Scott Harris, Mike Girsch are all second in command (or worse) and all passed on running the Mets. That's a major, major red flag any way you want to spin it. Who knows the truth in regard to Arnold's situation (blocked or passed) but his situation is the same, a #2 with no path to #1.
And  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 4:59 pm : link
actually, as for Alderson... that's a strawman argument. My entire concern was Alderson and son being a turnoff to other candidates (as was also mentioned in the Athletic piece) how has this proven otherwise? Eric insisted Sandy was essential to the search process (that's not a shot at Eric) but that was never the real "Sandy debate". It was Sandy and his Bryn being president and recently promoted assistant GM and how other candidates might take that.
THIS  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 5:02 pm : link
was the gist of the Alderson "issue", not his involvement in the search.

Quote:
But there’s another potential issue lurking, regarding the curious timing of the promotion of Alderson’s son, Bryn, who along with Ian Levin was promoted to assistant general manager this summer when the Mets didn’t have a GM or president of baseball operations. Bryn, who joined the organization as a scout in late 2011, was previously scouting director.

Sandy Alderson has said his preference would be to transition fully to the business side. But there is skepticism within the industry that it would even be feasible, and some in the game have pointed out that Bryn is now in a high-ranking position on the baseball side regardless. The dynamic of having a high-powered father-son duo is a potentially concerning component for any new front-office hire, one that sources say has adversely come into play before in the Mets’ current organizational structure. Who, some wonder, would really hold the power to make organizational decisions?

Alderson declined to discuss specifics of the president of baseball operations search with The Athletic on Tuesday.

Asked specifically about potential concerns of the autonomy of a future front-office hire with his son in a high-ranking position, he said: “That will not be an issue, I can assure you.”



How has this been proven "wrong"? If anything we are left wondering WHY are so many candidates disinterested in a promotion (and a likely substantial raise)?
I highly doubt someone as hyper type A  
bhill410 : 10/27/2021 5:05 pm : link
And ruthless/cunning as Cohen is blindly taking advice from Chris Christie or frankly anyone for that matter. There are probably specific aspects or contacts Christie may have that a reporter is latching on to. Regardless of your opinion on him, Cohen is a known entity from a business standpoint. He is highly demanding, wants incredibly smart people, and wants people that are going to do things in a certain way. That isn’t for everyone and we shouldn’t IMO be alarmed that some random individual who we never heard of before today was turned off by it. I trust the guys ability to build out an org more than alderson and these all seem like positive developments.
RE: I highly doubt someone as hyper type A  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 5:08 pm : link
In comment 15431876 bhill410 said:
Quote:
And ruthless/cunning as Cohen is blindly taking advice from Chris Christie or frankly anyone for that matter. There are probably specific aspects or contacts Christie may have that a reporter is latching on to. Regardless of your opinion on him, Cohen is a known entity from a business standpoint. He is highly demanding, wants incredibly smart people, and wants people that are going to do things in a certain way. That isn’t for everyone and we shouldn’t IMO be alarmed that some random individual who we never heard of before today was turned off by it. I trust the guys ability to build out an org more than alderson and these all seem like positive developments.


You don't find it at all troubling/unusual the amount of candidates that have passed? Again the "big 3"... had their own situations but when GM's (or lower in Bendix case) pull their names when they have no path to run the franchise, that's a red flag. Not sure how that can be spun any other way. Mozeliak has essentially run the Cardinals for going on 15 years, a guy like Girsch is likely NEVER running that team, and even he passes? Very strange.
I've  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 5:10 pm : link
heard of and had knowledge of 100% of the candidates the Mets have spoken to with Peter Bendix being a name I was only aware of after Neander was promoted. These other names are all GM's of other teams, why wouldn't they be known? These aren't "deep dives".
so which nepotism criticism is it?  
Eric on Li : 10/27/2021 5:11 pm : link
that cohen's a loose cannon cutting Sandy out of the search in favor of chris christie and his son (deesha's article based on "a source familiar with the situation")

or that Sandy is trying to create an Alderson dynasty in the met front office and scaring people off? (last week's article that was based on "an industry source" if I remember right)

we can all argue about a lot of things but so far the list of candidates they've gone after is exactly the list we'd all want. Do we think they aren't trying to get all of these guys they are...trying to get?

the result is all that matters and the result is not in yet. most if not all of the loosely sourced external reports of palace intrigue is from those looking to create the exact reaction lolmets twitter predictably contributes.
RE: THIS  
Eric on Li : 10/27/2021 5:16 pm : link
In comment 15431869 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
was the gist of the Alderson "issue", not his involvement in the search.



Quote:


But there’s another potential issue lurking, regarding the curious timing of the promotion of Alderson’s son, Bryn, who along with Ian Levin was promoted to assistant general manager this summer when the Mets didn’t have a GM or president of baseball operations. Bryn, who joined the organization as a scout in late 2011, was previously scouting director.

Sandy Alderson has said his preference would be to transition fully to the business side. But there is skepticism within the industry that it would even be feasible, and some in the game have pointed out that Bryn is now in a high-ranking position on the baseball side regardless. The dynamic of having a high-powered father-son duo is a potentially concerning component for any new front-office hire, one that sources say has adversely come into play before in the Mets’ current organizational structure. Who, some wonder, would really hold the power to make organizational decisions?

Alderson declined to discuss specifics of the president of baseball operations search with The Athletic on Tuesday.

Asked specifically about potential concerns of the autonomy of a future front-office hire with his son in a high-ranking position, he said: “That will not be an issue, I can assure you.”




How has this been proven "wrong"? If anything we are left wondering WHY are so many candidates disinterested in a promotion (and a likely substantial raise)?


At least 2 of the candidates received promotions and likely substantial raises (Gomes + Arnold).

And they received those bumps without having to interview for a position they may not have ended up getting.

Good organizations go to great lengths to keep good talent and putting them in positions between a bird in a hand (promotion/raise) and 2 in the bush (interviewing for a bigger promotion/bigger raise) is a pretty common tactic.
.  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 5:16 pm : link
Mike Girsch GM of the Cardinals since 2017
Matt Arnold GM of the Brewers since 2019
Scott Harris GM of the Giants since 2019
David Stearns (goes without saying)
Billy Beane (goes without saying)
Theo Epstein (goes without saying)
Brandon Gomes (admittedly a lesser "known" name, assistant GM of the Dodgers since 2019
Peter Bendix

So who exactly are these names fans wouldn't normally know?

Girsch is blocked
Arnold is blocked
Stearns is the head man
Beane is the head man
Epstein is... well Epstein
Gomes is blocked (he was blocked by the Dodgers so wasn't a true option)
Bendix (is blocked)
Harris is blocked

It's pretty odd to see 2nd bananas all pass like this (admittedly we don't know the Arnold situation with true clarity)
Arnold  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 5:17 pm : link
did not and could not receive a promotion. He was the GM, the promotion would be to Stearns job. Only the Mets (or another team) could have offered him a "promotion". That's the point.
Eric  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 5:18 pm : link
how about Bendix? Girsch? Harris? We can make excuses for each and every candidate but 2nd and 3rd bananas all passing is not the norm. Not when they have young bosses aka no chance they will be running those teams any time soon.
RE: .  
Eric on Li : 10/27/2021 5:20 pm : link
In comment 15431889 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
Mike Girsch GM of the Cardinals since 2017
Matt Arnold GM of the Brewers since 2019
Scott Harris GM of the Giants since 2019
David Stearns (goes without saying)
Billy Beane (goes without saying)
Theo Epstein (goes without saying)
Brandon Gomes (admittedly a lesser "known" name, assistant GM of the Dodgers since 2019
Peter Bendix

So who exactly are these names fans wouldn't normally know?

Girsch is blocked
Arnold is blocked
Stearns is the head man
Beane is the head man
Epstein is... well Epstein
Gomes is blocked (he was blocked by the Dodgers so wasn't a true option)
Bendix (is blocked)
Harris is blocked

It's pretty odd to see 2nd bananas all pass like this (admittedly we don't know the Arnold situation with true clarity)


Dan if you asked the average fan at any pro game in any sport I can almost guarantee they couldn't name 5 GM's in their league, 5 prospects in their system, or 5 team staffers beyond whoever their head coach/manager is.

The couple hundred/maybe thousand of us who pay close attention to these things are in the extreme minority.
Part  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 5:22 pm : link
of the Rays model is knowing they will lose their FO talent

Friedman left for LA
Click went to Houston (despite the cheating stuff)
Bloom left for Boston
Arnold left for Milwaukee

Why is this suddenly "well the Rays likely gave him a raise" for Bendix as if this is what is generally what happens? It's really not. There is some sort of stink around the Mets right now. It's a far less appealing job than it should be. Why? Everybody is wondering that right now.
RE: Eric  
Eric on Li : 10/27/2021 5:23 pm : link
In comment 15431893 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
how about Bendix? Girsch? Harris? We can make excuses for each and every candidate but 2nd and 3rd bananas all passing is not the norm. Not when they have young bosses aka no chance they will be running those teams any time soon.


we don't know what conversations were had with any of them - but if they are the goods I'd bet their teams made attempts to keep them. if you want someone a team isn't fighting to keep there's a good chance your getting art howe'd.

a lot of what we see with these searches is standard business practice it's just playing out publicly.

none of that excuses cohen from his duty which is to get the position filled at whatever cost necessary to get a quality hire. can't we wait to see who they actually hire before believing the GM is going to be chosen in a trial by combat between house christie and house alderson?
MLBTR  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 5:24 pm : link
suggests they could still be interested in Byrnes but last week it was reported "he's unlikely to leave LA".
MLBTR's  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 5:26 pm : link
Byrnes thing kinda sounds like a rehash

"The Mets have already been turned down by a handful of targets in their search for a new baseball operations head. Each of Theo Epstein, Billy Beane, David Stearns, Matt Arnold, Scott Harris and Brandon Gomes had been raised as potential candidates only to later be ruled out of consideration.

Cardinals general manager Michael Girsch can be added to that list, as Derrick Goold of the St. Louis Post-Dispatch reports (Twitter link) that New York reached out to the Cards for permission to speak with him last week. Girsch, however, declined to pursue the opportunity, electing to remain in St. Louis instead."

and then towards the bottom

"Dodgers senior vice president Josh Byrnes — a former GM with the Diamondbacks and Padres — has previously been mentioned as one candidate the Mets were discussing internally."
Everyone is wondering this, not everyone is conspiracy theorizing it  
Eric on Li : 10/27/2021 5:27 pm : link
In comment 15431896 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
It's a far less appealing job than it should be. Why? Everybody is wondering that right now.


to some it has been less appealing than we would hope/want.
others got blocked by their current teams.
others got promoted/incentivized by their current teams to not interview.

each situation has i'm sure had it's own set of circumstances but the process isn't over yet. they seem to be intent on bringing in highly regarded executives and i expect at some point one of them will take the money.
You're  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 5:32 pm : link
big on Martino, he claimed earlier they only have one name remaining on their POBO list.
RE: You're  
Eric on Li : 10/27/2021 5:37 pm : link
In comment 15431905 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
big on Martino, he claimed earlier they only have one name remaining on their POBO list.


and he's been claiming for days they may shift the search to a GM and not a POBO. since the real big names passed i've said I don't really care who they get or what the title is - just bring in a really smart up and coming mind. not a retread. and not an experiment like bvw.
.  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 5:41 pm : link
What will be interesting is the lengths they go to sell Mr. X as their top choice etc. Seems close to impossible to do at this point but teams almost have to.
Christie  
GF1080 : 10/27/2021 5:47 pm : link
On the board of directors. Just disgusting.

OWNERSHIP

Steven A. Cohen: Owner, Chairman and CEO
Alexandra M. Cohen: Owner & President, Amazin' Mets Foundation
Andrew B. Cohen: Vice Chairman
Fred Wilpon: Chairman Emeritus
Jeanne Melino: Board of Directors
Chris Christie: Board of Directors
RE: .  
Eric on Li : 10/27/2021 5:47 pm : link
In comment 15431910 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
What will be interesting is the lengths they go to sell Mr. X as their top choice etc. Seems close to impossible to do at this point but teams almost have to.


Everyone knows Theo and Beane were the top choices and I don't think anyone (including the Mets) will try to imply they like whoever they end up with more than those guys.

It also won't be too hard to dismiss anyone they haven't spoken to.

Id imagine they will likely claim that out of the set of people who they were able to interview, person X was the best person for the job.

And the only thing that will matter is if person X is the right person for the job. We will im sure do our best to evaluate person X but the reality is none of these guys except Theo were risk free.
Blue Jays  
DanMetroMan : 10/27/2021 8:48 pm : link
Reject Mets request to speak to Shapiro and Gomes was not interested in speaking to the Mets. Both per NYPost.
Once again I am just not sure  
bhill410 : 10/27/2021 8:54 pm : link
How big of a deal this is. We have zero idea of what occurred in those interviews or whether Cohen would have even been interested after meeting with him. Sure I wish the optics on this were better and who knows I may end up being disappointed but I am not willing to simply say someone is a bad hire because of allegations coming out of xyz camp. Once again everyone’s concern was that alderson was too involved. That’s clearly not the case here and reality is we are going to sink or swim with Cohen. So I will trust his judgement since we have no other option.
new update from the mouthpiece  
Eric on Li : 10/27/2021 10:48 pm : link
Quote:
martinonyc's avatar
Andy Martino @martinonyc
33m
In Mets exec search, Sandy Alderson is currently vetting candidates for Steve Cohen. He’ll make some permission requests and the process will continue.

Andy Martino @martinonyc
21m
Brian Sabean has not been on Mets radar during this search.


so far the list + permission requests have been for all the top guys we'd want. hopefully the list is longer than we know and Cohen can close the deal on one of them. I for one am glad they aren't deviating and panicking to trying to sell a name that doesn't fit what they are looking for (like Sabean - although I will admit he's an accomplished and experienced exec who probably doesn't actually qualify as a retread).
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