So they are being ing Baez back which everyone thought for sure was a rental.
Noah/ Thor isn’t a Met but effectively hasn’t been in two years anyway. You still have degrom and lindor. I know comforts is gone but he’s be gone anyway
It’s because of this they are talking rebuild? He hasn’t played and they were in first place
I haven't heard anything about Baez yet?
While their front office search has been public, I don't think they plan on rebuilding.
I don't think they need a rebuild, but they definitely need a re-tool. I think they need to trade some pieces for young starting pitching. Dom Smith and J.D. Davis would seem to be two candidates to do so, even though Dom really hurt his value on the open market this year due to performance.
I really hope they can bring back Conforto. I know it's against the odds, but to me he's the most irreplaceable guy in the lineup. But whatever, at this point I'm used to be disappointed by this team. Richest owner in baseball and all of a sudden we can't afford to bring back homegrown talent at a position of need. But I'm sure they'll spend premium dollars on a half-washed SP.
Pretty much.
but like Boston what they need to do is not over extend themselves with questionable long term deals and place a big emphasis on rebuilding the farm.
that's why it's good that they aren't signing anyone with QO's attached. that is the right call. those top 70 picks + bonus pool $ are the silver lining to losing Thor and likely Conforto.
and most like Boston they need to lock in a good manager, the core young players produced from their system, and build a strong clubhouse. Boston sold some of their guys but they obviously didn't sell Boegarts or Devers and they also added from the outside with winning players like Kike.
Alonso, Lindor, and JDG are the Boegarts, Devers, Sale. Eppler needs a strong vision to build out the rest of the roster. Fresh eyes mean there should be no sacred cows. Maybe McNeil/Dom/Nimmo are part of that future or maybe they are Benintendi.
everything would start with Scherzer for me though. a massive 2 year deal would give them at least that much of a window at possibly having the best 1/2 punch in MLB and buy them 2 years to get the farm cranked up where it needs to be.
On everyday players:
-If they do have a season in 2022 - will it be with a D.H.? (Cano?)?
-Is Nimmo an everyday CF or does he move to a corner?
-Do we see Dom Smith in LF? (1B is obviously occupied although Pete can DH a few games.
-Is McNeil in the plans at 2B, OF, 3B? (A Ben Zobrist type role)?
-J.D. Davis?
-McCann bridge us to Fransisco Alvarez (What year is Alvarez's projected debut)?
Obviously we need to either bring Stroman back or replace him. We are not really "replacing" Syndergaard, his departure was more of a surprise but we went an entire 2 seasons without him. Are Lucchessi and Yammamotto still under contract for next year? I know they aren't super exciting but are live arms.
Jordan Yamamoto and Joey Lucchesi were only signed for 2021.
Link - ( New Window )
On everyday players:
-If they do have a season in 2022 - will it be with a D.H.? (Cano?)?
-Is Nimmo an everyday CF or does he move to a corner?
-Do we see Dom Smith in LF? (1B is obviously occupied although Pete can DH a few games.
-Is McNeil in the plans at 2B, OF, 3B? (A Ben Zobrist type role)?
-J.D. Davis?
-McCann bridge us to Fransisco Alvarez (What year is Alvarez's projected debut)?
Obviously we need to either bring Stroman back or replace him. We are not really "replacing" Syndergaard, his departure was more of a surprise but we went an entire 2 seasons without him. Are Lucchessi and Yammamotto still under contract for next year? I know they aren't super exciting but are live arms.
Nimmo +4 DRS, +4 OAA in CF. He's your CF unless moving him allows you to reel in somebody you normally wouldn't be able to (Marte if he insists on CF for example) or you trade for an all-star in CF.
Yamamoto and Luchessi are signed for 2022 but I've seen a few places that expect luchessi to be non-tendered. Alvarez hasn't even played above a-ball yet. His eta will be clearer after he gets in some time at AA, more. He still has substantial work to do behind the plate.
Jordan Yamamoto and Joey Lucchesi were only signed for 2021. Link - ( New Window )
They are both under contract assuming they are tendered.
Which is why it's expected he's non-tendered (and maybe a minor league deal) 1+ million isn't a ton but if he's not likely going to help until August etc. Probably not worth it.
Quote:
is just as pathetic as your football posts. Do you have evidence or are you just talking out of your ass (as usual)?
Pretty much.
It's that deep repository of MLB data known as the rectal database.
Just curious on this quiet day.
it's not as much a comparison of the players as the question of whether or not they are in the long term plan. Nimmo is injury prone and has 1 year on his contract so there's a decision to be made.
i'd personally look to extend him by the way because I agree with you he is a good player at a premium position and he seems to play the game the right way even if he's injury prone.
a bonus w ausmus is his prior relationship with scherzer. maybe that and cohens $ can get it done?
id probably lean more towards buck though. you dont win manager of the year with 3 different teams by accident. hes also shockingly only 65 (i thought he was def in his 70s).
Quote:
very much hesitate lumping a proven quantity like Brandon Nimmo with medicore Andrew Benintendi. Benintendi prior to the trade had 1 season where he posted more than 2.0 fWAR and a 107 career wRC+, Brandon Nimmo now has 2 3+ fWAR seasons and was on pace for one in both 2020 (shortened season) and 2017 and has a career 134 wRC+. Yes, he's injury prone but he's a far, far superior player and would be a major loss. In fact, I'd go as far as to say Nimmo would have an argument as the #1 FA OFer this season (if he were one), and at the very least "in the discussion".
it's not as much a comparison of the players as the question of whether or not they are in the long term plan. Nimmo is injury prone and has 1 year on his contract so there's a decision to be made.
i'd personally look to extend him by the way because I agree with you he is a good player at a premium position and he seems to play the game the right way even if he's injury prone.
If he's not part of your long term plans who exactly is? Lindor (by virtue of his contract), Alonso (I assume), deGrom (hopefully)? I mean if you don't look to retain any of your best players then yeah, that's what you call a rebuild (not calling for one) but if you lose Conforto, Syndergaard, Nimmo, Stroman in the span of 2 off-seasons you have to question what the plan is. Picks are awesome but they also take 2-3 years with most college players and a average of 5 for HS players so it's not as if you have a big draft or 2 and suddenly those guys are on the big club. Completely in on proactively looking to sign Brandon Nimmo.
If he's not part of your long term plans who exactly is? Lindor (by virtue of his contract), Alonso (I assume), deGrom (hopefully)? I mean if you don't look to retain any of your best players then yeah, that's what you call a rebuild (not calling for one) but if you lose Conforto, Syndergaard, Nimmo, Stroman in the span of 2 off-seasons you have to question what the plan is. Picks are awesome but they also take 2-3 years with most college players and a average of 5 for HS players so it's not as if you have a big draft or 2 and suddenly those guys are on the big club. Completely in on proactively looking to sign Brandon Nimmo.
the only legitimate concern is the injuries. is it a good use of 80-100m on a player always hurt? that usually doesnt get better with age.
(id say yes though bc i dont see a better cf alternative anywhere else)
Player Notes
Suzuki has been one of the, if not the, best hitters in Japan for the last several years, posting a .316/.415/.572 career line, notching a 20/20 season in 2019, and setting a career-high in homers (38) in ‘21. The righty-hitting outfielder has plus power that comes from a dip-and-rip style of hitting, where he just sort of collapses his back side and tries to pull the ball with power as often as possible.
That’s not to say Suzuki is a power goof. He has a cogent two-strike approach in which his leg kick gets toned down, and he’s great at recognizing and crushing breaking balls. In fact, if there’s one hole to his game it’s that he can be vulnerable to velocity on the inner third. Suzuki is at his best when he’s getting his arms extended on pitches well out over the plate, but he tends to foul off or swing under fastballs creeping in on him. It’s tough to say whether this would be exploited more in MLB and impact his success, and it’s even harder to say whether Suzuki will be able to adjust to MLB velocity (pitchers’ fastballs in Japan averaged 90 mph in 2021) until we see him face it. He has the talent to be an everyday right fielder with some hit tool risk because of the leap in stuff he’d need to deal with. – EL
maybe. i dont expect this but lets say the reds were willing to swap gray for nimmo? or maybe as part of a 3 team where the team getting nimmo sends cincy a prospect so they save $. something like that could make sense if they prefer signing marte.
letting him walk for nothing seems least likely to happen though because he embodies the modern approach to getting on base and they have no alternatives in cf (unless they do sign Marte).
I'm kind of with you on this. I'd resign him if the years are right. I'd be very concerned about how a smallish SP ages. A 3-yr deal is a no-brainer, but there will be a robust market for him.
Player Notes
Suzuki has been one of the, if not the, best hitters in Japan for the last several years, posting a .316/.415/.572 career line, notching a 20/20 season in 2019, and setting a career-high in homers (38) in ‘21. The righty-hitting outfielder has plus power that comes from a dip-and-rip style of hitting, where he just sort of collapses his back side and tries to pull the ball with power as often as possible.
That’s not to say Suzuki is a power goof. He has a cogent two-strike approach in which his leg kick gets toned down, and he’s great at recognizing and crushing breaking balls. In fact, if there’s one hole to his game it’s that he can be vulnerable to velocity on the inner third. Suzuki is at his best when he’s getting his arms extended on pitches well out over the plate, but he tends to foul off or swing under fastballs creeping in on him. It’s tough to say whether this would be exploited more in MLB and impact his success, and it’s even harder to say whether Suzuki will be able to adjust to MLB velocity (pitchers’ fastballs in Japan averaged 90 mph in 2021) until we see him face it. He has the talent to be an everyday right fielder with some hit tool risk because of the leap in stuff he’d need to deal with. – EL
if they sign an OF I think they need to go CF-capable. McNeil and/or Dom may both need spots in a corner since Cano would likely need DH (assuming that happens). Baty or Vientos may need a corner in the next year or two.
not opposed to the right COF on the right deal (including possibly bringing back Conforto if he has a cool market) but SP and CF are so thin organizationally they need to prioritize buying themselves time there.
extending Nimmo would be very high on my to do list if I was Eppler. That would send a good message as a first move.
Quote:
injuries are going to factor into the price. Good franchises do not let this level of talent walk in such a short period of time. This doesn't take into account the truth... if the Mets continue to allow core talent to walk, deGrom likely asks out/opts out. So yeah, then you're in a complete rebuild situation.
maybe. i dont expect this but lets say the reds were willing to swap gray for nimmo? or maybe as part of a 3 team where the team getting nimmo sends cincy a prospect so they save $. something like that could make sense if they prefer signing marte.
letting him walk for nothing seems least likely to happen though because he embodies the modern approach to getting on base and they have no alternatives in cf (unless they do sign Marte).
Kind of confused with your scenario. The Reds are trading 2 seasons of Gray for one season of Nimmo who they will have to pay? and the Mets offense can't afford to lose Nimmo AND Conforto and just add Marte. If we are talking in-season, the Reds wouldn't even get a pick so it would make even less sense.
Quote:
But I'd let Stroman walk. I think what we've seen from him in 2021 is the best version of him, I don't think he's going to sustain that, and if we're talking $22 mil per over 5 years, I'd rather them use that money to bring back Conforto.
I'm kind of with you on this. I'd resign him if the years are right. I'd be very concerned about how a smallish SP ages. A 3-yr deal is a no-brainer, but there will be a robust market for him.
I think he's all about himself. They need pitching desperately so if he comes back I won't complain about it, they know him better than we do, but he seems like he's always trying to prove things about himself.
@JonHeyman
·
33s
Starling Marte market is very hot, so he could be that rare star player who signs a big multiyear deal in November, as I just said on Hot Stove. Phillies, Yankees, Mets, Astros, Rangers, Marlins, many others in. @MLBNetwork
He'll be 29 before the season and his max games played in a season is 140 and he hasn't done that since he was 25.
He hasn't played more than 92 games in any other full season (omit 2020 where he was healthy, but it was obviously a shortened season).
His injuries are a significant issue. You, unfortunately, cannot rely on Brandon Nimmo in 2022 without a legitimate backup plan.
Probably spends the whole yr there
Big jump from high A but he has he barely missed a beat when promoted in 2021
1/2 yr triple A in 2023, 2nd half on Mets
Matt Allen. Probably just pitches a month in 2022, maybe just fastballs like Thor?
Might not see him up till 2024
Baty could be sometime in 2022, same with vientos ( if not used as a trade piece)
Mauricio? Probably sometime in 2023
Obviously all depends on progression?
Thoughts Dan?
Kind of confused with your scenario. The Reds are trading 2 seasons of Gray for one season of Nimmo who they will have to pay? and the Mets offense can't afford to lose Nimmo AND Conforto and just add Marte. If we are talking in-season, the Reds wouldn't even get a pick so it would make even less sense.
I mentioned Gray because he's supposedly on the block and the type of player the Mets should be interested in. From an onfield value standpoint he's probably pretty close to Nimmo so while I agree the Reds probably don't have interest in Nimmo there's probably a way to get a 3rd team involved - if the Mets wanted to go in a different direction than Nimmo over the next 3+ years (like Marte). Pick whatever team in MLB you think would be most interested in Nimmo and they can be a 3rd team and then Cincy could get a prospect package sort of like the Musgrove trade for Pitt last year.
But you only do something like that if you make the decision now to not resign Nimmo.
I think he's all about himself. They need pitching desperately so if he comes back I won't complain about it, they know him better than we do, but he seems like he's always trying to prove things about himself.
I actually don't have a problem with that. Whatever an athlete needs to do to perform at a high level, as long as it's legal, is OK with me. I remember Michael Jordan making compliments other players gave him sound like insults so he could use it as fuel to his fire.
My concern is purely about how long Stroman can perform at this level. The track record for SP's his size when they get into their 30's isn't good.
He'll be 29 before the season and his max games played in a season is 140 and he hasn't done that since he was 25.
He hasn't played more than 92 games in any other full season (omit 2020 where he was healthy, but it was obviously a shortened season).
His injuries are a significant issue. You, unfortunately, cannot rely on Brandon Nimmo in 2022 without a legitimate backup plan.
100% agree. And if you are extending him, you need to plan to have a backup plan for as long as that deal lasts.
Marte isn't exactly an iron man either, nor Conforto/Baez, but for the Mets org now under Cohen it's not as simple as what is a fair contract for player X. It's what is the best use of the money?
is the best use of 80-100m on any player with the durability issues Nimmo has?
was 19m the best use on a player who hasn't pitched in 2 years?
they need to look at the full market and decide who the best investments are over the long term.
Lindor may yet end up a mistake but imo the best rationale for that deal was that they identified the player they wanted long term and instead of waiting for FA they went after their top choice. After 1 year the jury is very much out but they made a long term evaluation likely based on how they expect all the players in question to age and their tools to hold up. Hopefully they chose wisely.
Probably spends the whole yr there
Big jump from high A but he has he barely missed a beat when promoted in 2021
1/2 yr triple A in 2023, 2nd half on Mets
Matt Allen. Probably just pitches a month in 2022, maybe just fastballs like Thor?
Might not see him up till 2024
Baty could be sometime in 2022, same with vientos ( if not used as a trade piece)
Mauricio? Probably sometime in 2023
Obviously all depends on progression?
Thoughts Dan?
Agree with all of the above. Only caveat is, because Alvarez is a C, he impacts the entire pitching staff so unlike some other positions, he really has to be completely "ready" before he's out there in any substantial role, and obviously you won't have him sitting on the bench vs. getting time in the minors. I think we should assume Alvarez takes longer than his talent/stat-line would suggest.
Mauricio's development- who really knows? His physical transformation has really changed his profile from a no-doubt SS who may grow into some power to a potential CO type bat who likely can't play average MLB SS.
Allan- not really think about him at all (even on the minor league level) until 2023. If he throws this year it will be very limited.
Vientos feels like a trade chip but he could be viewed as a replacement for JD Davis.
Baty isn't MLB ready but if you told me he was the starting 3b come July, my mind wouldn't be blown.
Quote:
I think he's all about himself. They need pitching desperately so if he comes back I won't complain about it, they know him better than we do, but he seems like he's always trying to prove things about himself.
I actually don't have a problem with that. Whatever an athlete needs to do to perform at a high level, as long as it's legal, is OK with me. I remember Michael Jordan making compliments other players gave him sound like insults so he could use it as fuel to his fire.
My concern is purely about how long Stroman can perform at this level. The track record for SP's his size when they get into their 30's isn't good.
Stroman isn't michael jordan though. He talked a big game before 2020 and then opted out at the last minute and basically gave them no shot of going anywhere. He is constantly worried about off field stuff and creating drama where it's not needed (arguing with fans, writers, etc). He sideswiped Syndergaard immediately after his contract was reported.
if he was focused on winning or as dominant on the field as MJ sure. you can ignore a lot. or if he was Scherzer. But he's not. His more mid-rotation than top of the rotation.
and I actually think he's a pretty safe bet from a longevity standpoint. He pitches to contact, he's highly athletic, and his arm isn't dealing with big velocity. He could be productive for a while.
Cameron was a 5-tool guy. He stole 39 bases in AA and 123 over his minor league career. Mauricio is 19/41 career SB's (career high is 11) and is regarded as a 40 runner
And because you can't stop creating new handles to come back here after you've been banned.
im sure his current listed weight is wrong (166) but he is slender enough that he probably won't go beyond 200 pounds for a while. He may not have enough speed or enough instincts, or he could have both. Only 1 way to find out.
im sure his current listed weight is wrong (166) but he is slender enough that he probably won't go beyond 200 pounds for a while. He may not have enough speed or enough instincts, or he could have both. Only 1 way to find out.
Eric,
Brandon Nimmo was a HS sprinting star and a natural CF, George Springer stole 31 bases at UCONN. These are very weird comparisons. MLB.com gives him a 40 current speed grade and he's likely not even done growing.