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It's just a fact: this is a pretty competitive team

Azul Grande : 11/22/2021 11:49 am
Setting aside a funky week 1 game against Denver (week 1 is always weird), this team has played extremely competitively this season, and I don't care how much people on this board don't want to hear it.

Are they a great team? Of course not. But in the 8 games starting with Week 2, the team has played six competitive games and two uncompetitive games.

The uncompetitive games were against the Cowboys and Rams, two teams which are basically a game out of first place in the entire NFL.

News flash! The best teams in the NFL are tough!

Aside from when we played two great teams (teams so good they are tied for the second fewest losses in the league so far this season), we haven't lost a game by more than a field goal since week 1.

We have had 4th quarter leads in 6 of 9 games.

This isn't a crappy team. We've played down to bad opponents and lost games sloppily to be sure, but this isn't a crappy team.
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well, we'll find out tonight  
markky : 11/22/2021 11:51 am : link
the Bucs are beatable. let's see if the Giants can beat them
Cowboys game was competitive  
Johnny5 : 11/22/2021 11:57 am : link
Until Jones decided to use his head inappropriately. And Saquon went down. Again.
lot of ifs ands and buts here to justify the giants  
japanhead : 11/22/2021 12:01 pm : link
being a competitive team.

do you remember when the giants lost to the falcons at home and daniel jones threw for zero touchdown passes?

through the first 9 weeks this has been a bad team. the 3-6 record reflects that it's a bad team.
Setting aside laying an egg week 1  
Gatorade Dunk : 11/22/2021 12:06 pm : link
And then a dumb penalty against a WFT team that they should have not been within a FG of if they had played properly.

And then losing to a shitty Falcons team.

This team it what it is.

There's some promise in the way they've played the past few weeks. But they are what they deserve to be, to date, IMO.
Every team in the league is competitive  
Mike from Ohio : 11/22/2021 12:07 pm : link
The Texans beat the first place Titans yesterday. The Jaguars beat the Bills two weeks ago. The Lions have been in almost all of their games this year.

Saying the team is competitive is sort of not saying anything, unless you are keeping a moral victory tally.
Most games in the NFL are "competitive"  
rsjem1979 : 11/22/2021 12:09 pm : link
The 2021 New York Football Giants - "We're not crappy"

How exciting.

that remains  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 11/22/2021 12:09 pm : link
to be determined.

People may feel differently if the Eagles and Washington sweep the Giants.
It's the NFL, MOST games  
Section331 : 11/22/2021 12:10 pm : link
are competitive. Bad teams can compete with good ones, they just can't beat them that often. 3-6 says we aren't very competitive, and we won't be until the offense gets out of its own way. Fewer than 19 PPG isn't going to cut it.
As a poor football team  
JonC : 11/22/2021 12:11 pm : link
playing down to other poor football teams isn't the case, they're just both poor.

Giants are scrappy, they're playing hard there.
They’ve  
Les in TO : 11/22/2021 12:11 pm : link
Been competitive in 2/3 of their games and were beaten up in the other third. They’ve been below average on the whole. You can blame coaching talent injuries or a combination but that’s what it is.

A losing, competitive team is better than a team getting their butts kicked every week but it’s still a losing team and frustrating as a fan
RE: Every team in the league is competitive  
Johnny5 : 11/22/2021 12:15 pm : link
In comment 15460621 Mike from Ohio said:
Quote:
The Texans beat the first place Titans yesterday. The Jaguars beat the Bills two weeks ago. The Lions have been in almost all of their games this year.

Saying the team is competitive is sort of not saying anything, unless you are keeping a moral victory tally.

Yeah we are not good. But I think we are better than our record. Those losses to WFT and Atlanta were gigantic and inexcusable. If Gates and Thomas were healthy and the defense was playing well the 1st few games I think we would all feel a lot better about this team.

This team plays competitively sure but doesn't seem to know how to win. I don't see that changing for the better this year, but we'll see. We need better and more consistent blocking and better and more consistent pass rush and that's a fact. I don't see this team changing until those two things happen.
Great they are a competitive loser  
TyreeHelmet : 11/22/2021 12:30 pm : link
Lets plan a parade
Since 2000  
ajr2456 : 11/22/2021 12:35 pm : link
46% of NFL games end with a score margin of 7 or less. The whole league is competitive, and the line between winning and losing is razor thin.

That all being said the Giants have the worst record in the league in the last 5 years. And here they are again with the season over by Thanksgiving. That says a lot.
Being in the game in the 4th quarter is not a good basis  
Jimmy Googs : 11/22/2021 12:42 pm : link
in determining a "pretty competitive team" in the NFL. Particularly when their won-loss record hovers around 30% or so for this year and over the last 4 years.

Unless of course you think 30% mark is pretty competitive in the NFL...
 
christian : 11/22/2021 12:55 pm : link
There are very few uncompetitive teams in the NFL.

Week-to-week the teams that can’t stay in a game is probably limited to Houston, Detroit, and Jacksonville. And as we saw the last couple of weeks, even they can punch above their weight.

If you want to play the what if game, then take the Vegas and NO wins off the board too.
RE: …  
Gatorade Dunk : 11/22/2021 12:57 pm : link
In comment 15460699 christian said:
Quote:
There are very few uncompetitive teams in the NFL.

Week-to-week the teams that can’t stay in a game is probably limited to Houston, Detroit, and Jacksonville. And as we saw the last couple of weeks, even they can punch above their weight.

If you want to play the what if game, then take the Vegas and NO wins off the board too.

The pollyannas will never do that. Wins are set in stone, losses are in sand.

I miss the days when we were a good team and didn't have to pretend to be one or have fans who couldn't tell the difference.
RE: Most games in the NFL are  
Scooter185 : 11/22/2021 1:02 pm : link
In comment 15460623 rsjem1979 said:
Quote:
The 2021 New York Football Giants - "We're not crappy"

How exciting.


Man this is worse than the Yankees "Luxury Tax Champions" year 😂
Not to trigger anyone by using this reference  
Ten Ton Hammer : 11/22/2021 1:05 pm : link
but participation trophies are no consolation prize.

I would say  
The Jake : 11/22/2021 1:06 pm : link
that it's tough to have an honest debate when you present your opinion as fact.
RE: …  
Sean : 11/22/2021 1:07 pm : link
In comment 15460699 christian said:
Quote:
There are very few uncompetitive teams in the NFL.

Week-to-week the teams that can’t stay in a game is probably limited to Houston, Detroit, and Jacksonville. And as we saw the last couple of weeks, even they can punch above their weight.

If you want to play the what if game, then take the Vegas and NO wins off the board too.

Exactly. The Lions have had some brutal losses too. Every team competes and could have more wins. You either win or don’t.
NFL  
TyreeHelmet : 11/22/2021 1:12 pm : link
Who isn't competitive in the NFL?
 
christian : 11/22/2021 1:14 pm : link
I remember when Giants fans were all over Accorsi, Coughlin, and Manning after winning 19 games and 2 playoff appearances in two years.

In 3.5 years the Giants have won 18 total games.

Competitive doesn’t feel the same as winning.
OP showing how low we have fallen  
giantstock : 11/22/2021 1:20 pm : link
Someone needs to remind the OP that losing while being competitive as long as the Giants have bene losing -- sucks.
I never understand why people keep bringing up 5 years ago  
PatersonPlank : 11/22/2021 1:24 pm : link
different HC, different GM, different players, its a completely different team.

This team in Judge year 2 is 3-3 in its last 6, with wins over N.O, Carolina, and LV (all .500 teams right now). Consider that Jones was knocked out in Q2 of the Cowboys game, the Giants are 3-2 in the last 5 he has played. Also as pointed out they are a stupid offsides, etc. from winning 1 or 3 of the first 3 games.

Are the Giants good, no. However they are young and clearly improving. Most here would have taken an 8-9 or 9-8 record, and over 2/3 of the season they are tracking that way.

However if you read 5 or 6 of the posters on here, you'd think we were 0-9 and never scored a pt.
RE: I never understand why people keep bringing up 5 years ago  
ajr2456 : 11/22/2021 1:25 pm : link
In comment 15460738 PatersonPlank said:
Quote:
different HC, different GM, different players, its a completely different team.

This team in Judge year 2 is 3-3 in its last 6, with wins over N.O, Carolina, and LV (all .500 teams right now). Consider that Jones was knocked out in Q2 of the Cowboys game, the Giants are 3-2 in the last 5 he has played. Also as pointed out they are a stupid offsides, etc. from winning 1 or 3 of the first 3 games.

Are the Giants good, no. However they are young and clearly improving. Most here would have taken an 8-9 or 9-8 record, and over 2/3 of the season they are tracking that way.

However if you read 5 or 6 of the posters on here, you'd think we were 0-9 and never scored a pt.


On what planet are they tracking toward going 5-3/6-2 in the last 8?
Azul Grande  
M.S. : 11/22/2021 1:25 pm : link

Your Words:
"Setting aside a funky week 1 game against Denver (week 1 is always weird), this team has played extremely competitively this season, and I don't care how much people on this board don't want to hear it."

Did you see the Dallas and L.A. Rams games?
3-6 tracks to 8-9?  
Go Terps : 11/22/2021 1:26 pm : link
Strange math.
RE: 3-6 tracks to 8-9?  
PatersonPlank : 11/22/2021 1:29 pm : link
In comment 15460742 Go Terps said:
Quote:
Strange math.


My point was they are 3-3 in their last 6, so over the last 2/3 of the season so far yes they are playing .500 ball. You knew what I was saying. I don't know why you feel it necessary to go on thread after thread, over and over, just bashing away. We all get your position and agenda.
The Giants are 3-6 and in last place in the NFCE  
Go Terps : 11/22/2021 1:31 pm : link
Chopping up and cherry picking the schedule, finding moral victories...that is what indicates an agenda.

3-6. Last place.
RE: I never understand why people keep bringing up 5 years ago  
japanhead : 11/22/2021 1:33 pm : link
In comment 15460738 PatersonPlank said:
Quote:
different HC, different GM, different players, its a completely different team.

This team in Judge year 2 is 3-3 in its last 6, with wins over N.O, Carolina, and LV (all .500 teams right now). Consider that Jones was knocked out in Q2 of the Cowboys game, the Giants are 3-2 in the last 5 he has played. Also as pointed out they are a stupid offsides, etc. from winning 1 or 3 of the first 3 games.

Are the Giants good, no. However they are young and clearly improving. Most here would have taken an 8-9 or 9-8 record, and over 2/3 of the season they are tracking that way.

However if you read 5 or 6 of the posters on here, you'd think we were 0-9 and never scored a pt.


this is a stretch.

the giants beat the panthers with sam darnold at QB- who was benched at the half and will likely never start another NFL game. one of their other two wins was over a spiraling raiders team, that had to travel east having just lost its legend HC, its star WR, and its star CB. the raiders started spiraling before they played NYG, and their nosedive has continued since.

also, jones knocked himself out of the dallas game by making a dumb decision to muscle through two LBs with his head, and prior to that he had completed something like one out of eight passes in that game.
competitive means winning  
djm : 11/22/2021 1:35 pm : link
time to win. If they don't win, and finish around 7-10 while losing 3 more close games along the way, that's not a competitive team. That's not a terrible team, but it aint good either.

Time to be good again. I'm ready when the Giants are.
RE: The Giants are 3-6 and in last place in the NFCE  
PatersonPlank : 11/22/2021 1:35 pm : link
In comment 15460749 Go Terps said:
Quote:
Chopping up and cherry picking the schedule, finding moral victories...that is what indicates an agenda.

3-6. Last place.


a bad offsides call away from 4-5. another mistake from 5-4. I can play this too.

I think we will definitely end up .500 over the last 14 games of the season. If we can make up the initial 3 losses I don't know, but going .500 over the last 14 would be a noticeable improvement for the fans that actually are objective

Keep it up, you probably have about 6 more negative posts here before you go to your next thread and start over.
RE: RE: The Giants are 3-6 and in last place in the NFCE  
ajr2456 : 11/22/2021 1:37 pm : link
In comment 15460757 PatersonPlank said:
Quote:
In comment 15460749 Go Terps said:


Quote:


Chopping up and cherry picking the schedule, finding moral victories...that is what indicates an agenda.

3-6. Last place.



a bad offsides call away from 4-5. another mistake from 5-4. I can play this too.

I think we will definitely end up .500 over the last 14 games of the season. If we can make up the initial 3 losses I don't know, but going .500 over the last 14 would be a noticeable improvement for the fans that actually are objective

Keep it up, you probably have about 6 more negative posts here before you go to your next thread and start over.


A missed recovered fumble from being 2-7. A team not going 1-9 in the red zone from being 1-8.
If you ignore tackling and blocking  
Vanzetti : 11/22/2021 1:41 pm : link
this is a heck of a team
RE: RE: The Giants are 3-6 and in last place in the NFCE  
Go Terps : 11/22/2021 1:41 pm : link
In comment 15460757 PatersonPlank said:
Quote:
In comment 15460749 Go Terps said:


Quote:


Chopping up and cherry picking the schedule, finding moral victories...that is what indicates an agenda.

3-6. Last place.



a bad offsides call away from 4-5. another mistake from 5-4. I can play this too.

I think we will definitely end up .500 over the last 14 games of the season. If we can make up the initial 3 losses I don't know, but going .500 over the last 14 would be a noticeable improvement for the fans that actually are objective

Keep it up, you probably have about 6 more negative posts here before you go to your next thread and start over.


You haven't learned yet that second half moral victory runs are meaningless? Even if the Giants do go over .500 in the last 14 games, so what? Won't mean anything for 2022 - that has been borne out over and over again this past decade of terrible football.

3-6. Last place. That's not negativity. That's what's in the standings.
RE: I never understand why people keep bringing up 5 years ago  
Jimmy Googs : 11/22/2021 1:49 pm : link
In comment 15460738 PatersonPlank said:
Quote:
different HC, different GM, different players, its a completely different team.

This team in Judge year 2 is 3-3 in its last 6, with wins over N.O, Carolina, and LV (all .500 teams right now). Consider that Jones was knocked out in Q2 of the Cowboys game, the Giants are 3-2 in the last 5 he has played. Also as pointed out they are a stupid offsides, etc. from winning 1 or 3 of the first 3 games.

Are the Giants good, no. However they are young and clearly improving. Most here would have taken an 8-9 or 9-8 record, and over 2/3 of the season they are tracking that way.

However if you read 5 or 6 of the posters on here, you'd think we were 0-9 and never scored a pt.


Plank - when does this fabulous tracking poll you seem to utilize have us in the Super Bowl...this year or next?
It's tough to swear by Parcells  
Ten Ton Hammer : 11/22/2021 1:54 pm : link
but then toss away his wisdom when it's convenient.

Parcells would never stand for moral victories and "they played hard". The record is what it is.

Yeah sure, whatever - this place is overrun by 5 or 6 ridiculously  
PatersonPlank : 11/22/2021 2:02 pm : link
negative posters who just go thread to thread dominating the conversation and crapping over more positive posters. Have at it, you seem to have fun doing it.
RE: Yeah sure, whatever - this place is overrun by 5 or 6 ridiculously  
Go Terps : 11/22/2021 2:03 pm : link
In comment 15460795 PatersonPlank said:
Quote:
negative posters who just go thread to thread dominating the conversation and crapping over more positive posters. Have at it, you seem to have fun doing it.


What's the Giants' record?
Noticeable improvements  
Jimmy Googs : 11/22/2021 2:05 pm : link
In 2020 the Giants started 1-7 and then went 5-3 to finish the year. The reason I know this is the "noticeable improvement posters" let us know that factoid everyday this past offseason in predicting a year of expected success.

Yet somehow that noticeable improvement was either short-lived, or got lost or was possibly even not real as the Giants went back to their losing ways and started this year at 3-6.

But wait...there is another noticeable improvement just on the horizon!
They are in the bottom 10 in point differential so it’s not like  
Metnut : 11/22/2021 2:06 pm : link
they’ve been even a mediocre team that’s just been unlucky.

Finish 6-2 (with 5 games against teams unlikely to make the playoffs) and get to 9-8 if they want to show tangible progress for once.
Win tonight.  
Sean : 11/22/2021 2:07 pm : link
No excuses. Win tonight.

Let’s not have excuses ready if the Giants lose or any moral victories ready. Win the game.
Improvement is a funny word  
Go Terps : 11/22/2021 2:11 pm : link
What that word doesn't capture is the condition from which the improvement is occurring.

For example: Daniel Jones is on pace to throw for 15 TD passes in 2021, which would be a 36% increase over his total of 11 in 2020.

Sounds great when you put it that way...
RE: Win tonight.  
Jimmy Googs : 11/22/2021 2:12 pm : link
In comment 15460804 Sean said:
Quote:
No excuses. Win tonight.

Let’s not have excuses ready if the Giants lose or any moral victories ready. Win the game.


Yep. Tampa has shown some cracks lately, they have a few receivers that are out or banged up, and their starting secondary is full of backups. And we are getting some guys back.

They are still good but clearly vulnerable...go win the game Judge/Giants. Looking forward to it.
It took time  
UberAlias : 11/22/2021 2:13 pm : link
But the defense has been playing like we'd expect the past few weeks. The offense is putrid. Let's see how they look down the stretch with more to work with. It's funny the way some of you guys keep going around in circles chasing absolutes. I hope some of you caught some of the other games these past two weeks we were off. I've been watching those absolutes you put all of your conviction be seriously challenged.
RE: Noticeable improvements  
Johnny5 : 11/22/2021 2:14 pm : link
In comment 15460801 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
In 2020 the Giants started 1-7 and then went 5-3 to finish the year. The reason I know this is the "noticeable improvement posters" let us know that factoid everyday this past offseason in predicting a year of expected success.

Yet somehow that noticeable improvement was either short-lived, or got lost or was possibly even not real as the Giants went back to their losing ways and started this year at 3-6.

But wait...there is another noticeable improvement just on the horizon!

We knew going into the season we lack pass rush and consistent (even average) blocking.

Neither got fixed. Actually they are both worse (OL mostly because of injuries). These 2 things need to be corrected or this team will never go anywhere, let alone show progression. Hopefully Thomas plays tonight but I'm not expecting him to be lights out after being out for 4+ weeks.

I'll be shocked if we win this game, shocked I tell you. lol

That said, I am optimistic with better OL play and Pass rush this team can hang. Big if though.
RE: RE: Noticeable improvements  
Jimmy Googs : 11/22/2021 2:19 pm : link
In comment 15460817 Johnny5 said:
Quote:
In comment 15460801 Jimmy Googs said:


Quote:


In 2020 the Giants started 1-7 and then went 5-3 to finish the year. The reason I know this is the "noticeable improvement posters" let us know that factoid everyday this past offseason in predicting a year of expected success.

Yet somehow that noticeable improvement was either short-lived, or got lost or was possibly even not real as the Giants went back to their losing ways and started this year at 3-6.

But wait...there is another noticeable improvement just on the horizon!


We knew going into the season we lack pass rush and consistent (even average) blocking.

Neither got fixed. Actually they are both worse (OL mostly because of injuries). These 2 things need to be corrected or this team will never go anywhere, let alone show progression. Hopefully Thomas plays tonight but I'm not expecting him to be lights out after being out for 4+ weeks.



The Front Office thought they did address those issue though.

In their view, they were getting Carter and Ximines back from injury and they added a top pick in Ojulari. The GM also said he didn't add anything big to the OL in free agency or the draft because they had more confidence in their existing OL guys than the rest of us.

remember?
RE: RE: The Giants are 3-6 and in last place in the NFCE  
Section331 : 11/22/2021 2:27 pm : link
In comment 15460757 PatersonPlank said:
Quote:

a bad offsides call away from 4-5. another mistake from 5-4. I can play this too.

I think we will definitely end up .500 over the last 14 games of the season. If we can make up the initial 3 losses I don't know, but going .500 over the last 14 would be a noticeable improvement for the fans that actually are objective

Keep it up, you probably have about 6 more negative posts here before you go to your next thread and start over.


This is exactly what we heard last year. They were 1-7, they finished 5-3, they're ready to turn the corner. Those of us who urged caution and pointed that 5 of those 6 wins were against teams with a combined 28-50-1 record, all with backup QB's, were told we were too negative and had agendas. Management agreed with you and overspent on FA's with the misguided assumption that we would be contenders. How did that turn out?

Maybe we're not the ones with agendas?
Who the F**K cares about competitive?  
Matt M. : 11/22/2021 2:33 pm : link
Really? I'm tired of shit like this and "moral victories" and the like. The bottom line is this team has sucked for the better part of a decade. It no longer matters if games are close or not. A loss is a loss is a loss. And the Giants have chalked up more than anyone else over the last several years. Win some some games and then you can look at individual games for these mini positives. But, until then, they lost the game. Period.

Now, tonight, would be a nice step with a win. An actual winning streak? How about that. But, if they lose, I don't care if it is by 1 point or 20. It's just another in a LONG string of losses.
 
christian : 11/22/2021 2:36 pm : link
The problem with pulling out a subset of games and saying “see, things were better in this isolated frame” — is that all the games count every year.

The point of the season isn’t to succeed over small windows of time, it’s to win enough games to make the tournament.

The Giants play 6 teams with a losing record as of now in the final two months of the season.

Thomas is back, Barkley is back, Golladay is back, Toney is back. Skura is playing better in my view than Lemieux did last year. Peart looks like he can supplant Solder.

All things considered, going into the back half of the season, most of the nucleus on offensive is there. Time to go win some games if this is a positive story.
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