It'd be lunacy to give him a second contract on par with McCaffrey, which I think him & his agent will want. His best year was his rookie season & since then he's always injured. Additionally, I just don't like him as a runner. He dances too much & is always waiting for a hole to open instead of just going for it.
My fear is that Mara sees him as a face of the franchise & wants to re-up him for PR wise. And hopefully Gettleman is gone because Lord knows he'd sign him to a lifetime contract.
Jones and Barkley need to go. They’re weighing down the franchise.
Only the Giants would be ridiculous enough to even consider it.
Does Ron Dayne count?
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than Barkley. I haven't seen one.
Does Ron Dayne count?
Dayne at least had 300 pounds of fat you had to worry about.
He's soft. How did they ruin his career. By handing him the ball thus outing him 225 Pound marshmallow?
Jones and Barkley need to go. They’re weighing down the franchise.
Same. This was a brutal loss. Jones doesn't have it. And Barkley doesn't have it. I was actually impressed by a run at one point and it was #28. That and all the picks were nails in the coffin for me. Not that my opinion matters.
He’s great at tackling himself too.
Never seen a RB who can’t keep his feet like Barkley. Falls down 3x min every game.
Maybe having giant legs is not all you need to be a good rb. He looked slow out there and is still hesitant and dancing. Incredibly frustrating.
I don't know if he's even going to get starting RB money right now. Maybe it's not here, but I hope he can go somewhere that can use his talents. Obviously a horrible pick, but he's not useless.
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You know how they say at some point, it all becomes clear? Tonight’s the night for me.
Jones and Barkley need to go. They’re weighing down the franchise.
Same. This was a brutal loss. Jones doesn't have it. And Barkley doesn't have it. I was actually impressed by a run at one point and it was #28. That and all the picks were nails in the coffin for me. Not that my opinion matters.
Same. I was like ok finally there we go! Then I’m like oh wait that’s Booker…
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In comment 15462697 Danny Kanell said:
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You know how they say at some point, it all becomes clear? Tonight’s the night for me.
Jones and Barkley need to go. They’re weighing down the franchise.
Same. This was a brutal loss. Jones doesn't have it. And Barkley doesn't have it. I was actually impressed by a run at one point and it was #28. That and all the picks were nails in the coffin for me. Not that my opinion matters.
Same. I was like ok finally there we go! Then I’m like oh wait that’s Booker…
Same here. I thought it was Barkley who ripped off a tough 10 yard run up the middle, then realized it was Booker. Barkley does not help this team. At best he's a 3rd down back, maybe occasionally split him out wide. I also find it hilarious how the media talks about Barkley's return to the lineup like it's going to ignite the offense. Anyone that watches the team regularly knows that he's a non factor. Toney is the most talented player on this team and should be getting the ball 10+ times per game.
I believe calling him a bust or the worst pick ever is disingenuous. Whether you like the pick or not, that is way too far of an exaggeration. Whether you believe the rookie year was more mirage or just the real thing, that year alone makes the extreme negative labels sound silly to me.
That said, tonight I reached the point where I absolutely do not care if I ever see him take another snap in a Giants uniform. I think he is still a talented back who can probably succeed with a semblance of a professional OL in front of him. I just don't want to invest a dime to find out. It would be an unwise business move to offer him a second contract.
Remember Perkins? They shipped him off to detriot. Although he was even tougher and at least gave you like 3 yards before going down. Kinda pathetic that we are comparing Barkley to 3rd string back you ship off to detriot though.
Wait a minute i am comparing a 3rd string back we shipped off to Detroit to Barkley Yea he has to go. He is stealing money at this point and I don't know his contract details but whatever is guaranteed you just grin and bear it and just release him to get whatever you can get back.
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But we’re stuck with him for another year. No one is trading for him and we won’t outright release him.
Exactly. Year Five options are now fully guaranteed. Exercising Barkley’s option after he blew out his knee was a questionable decision, but what’s done is done. He’s a $7MM Giant next year. We should all root for him to stay healthy and become the player Gettleman thought he would be. Unlikely, but not inconceivable as his knee and ankle improve.
I think the best outcome is Barkley regains some health and productivity, and he’s traded for a 3rd round pick.
At 7M it’s not a bad flyer for a competitive team, looking to add one more weapon.
I believe calling him a bust or the worst pick ever is disingenuous. Whether you like the pick or not, that is way too far of an exaggeration. Whether you believe the rookie year was more mirage or just the real thing, that year alone makes the extreme negative labels sound silly to me.
That said, tonight I reached the point where I absolutely do not care if I ever see him take another snap in a Giants uniform. I think he is still a talented back who can probably succeed with a semblance of a professional OL in front of him. I just don't want to invest a dime to find out. It would be an unwise business move to offer him a second contract.
Matt,
I am the opposite of you. I never wanted Barkley. I wrote long posts about how it is unwise to draft RBs that high, as well as pointing out that his running style was a problem.
I have posted many time about how his rookie year was a mirage. He had a bunch of meaningless long runs and catches that padded his stats. But when I looked at success rate stats, Barkley was a complete failure even in his rookie year. He was consistently near the bottom of the league in success rate stats both running and receiving. Think of success rate as a plus play for the team. The top running backs are at about 55 to 60%. Very goo ones 45 to 55%. Middle of the pack 35 to 45%. Barkley languishes around 30%. In other words less than 1/3 of his touches his first 2 years, were good plays for the Giants. That is such bad statistic that it is crippling to the offense. I have long argues that Barkley is a net negative for the offense. I think that is becoming plainly obvious to everybody now.
Where is that game...is it like Gone With The Wind?
Can you imagine how a Belichick, a Shanahan or a McVay would scheme up getting him the ball - I can. How about Kingsberry teaming him up with Murray?
No he is not a powerback as people thought, but get him in space and he is scary.
Somebody would trade for him.
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But we’re stuck with him for another year. No one is trading for him and we won’t outright release him.
Can you imagine how a Belichick, a Shanahan or a McVay would scheme up getting him the ball - I can. How about Kingsberry teaming him up with Murray?
No he is not a powerback as people thought, but get him in space and he is scary.
Somebody would trade for him.
He's not lethal in the open field. He tapdances and gets tackled almost immediately.
Tom Brady had a better move in the Bucs game than Saquon.
He fucking sucks and his rookie year was a total mirage.
Where is it?
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In comment 15463031 JoeyBigBlue said:
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But we’re stuck with him for another year. No one is trading for him and we won’t outright release him.
Can you imagine how a Belichick, a Shanahan or a McVay would scheme up getting him the ball - I can. How about Kingsberry teaming him up with Murray?
No he is not a powerback as people thought, but get him in space and he is scary.
Somebody would trade for him.
He didn't look scary when he caught a pass and stutter stepped with nobody within 6 yards of him instead of running to the 1st down marker, ended up getting tackled short, and contributing to killing a drive.
He's not lethal in the open field. He tapdances and gets tackled almost immediately.
Tom Brady had a better move in the Bucs game than Saquon.
He fucking sucks and his rookie year was a total mirage.
Keep going with that. Guy is coming off an ankle injury and looked mechanical, yes.
The whole team looked like shit. Unprepared, uninspired and inept.
Where is it?
When rookie Saquon busts out a 60 yard td run hurdling over defenders (since he hates contact), its easy to forget all the negative plays he is responsible for that put our O behind schedule and 3 and out.
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I saw it...every single game.
Where is it?
When rookie Saquon busts out a 60 yard td run hurdling over defenders (since he hates contact), its easy to forget all the negative plays he is responsible for that put our O behind schedule and 3 and out.
I remember a ton of negative plays. But also a lot of minimal ones and a lot of positive ones.
Are we saying the burst part of his game is just gone forever and we are now only left with the negative parts?
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In comment 15465780 section125 said:
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In comment 15463031 JoeyBigBlue said:
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But we’re stuck with him for another year. No one is trading for him and we won’t outright release him.
Can you imagine how a Belichick, a Shanahan or a McVay would scheme up getting him the ball - I can. How about Kingsberry teaming him up with Murray?
No he is not a powerback as people thought, but get him in space and he is scary.
Somebody would trade for him.
He didn't look scary when he caught a pass and stutter stepped with nobody within 6 yards of him instead of running to the 1st down marker, ended up getting tackled short, and contributing to killing a drive.
He's not lethal in the open field. He tapdances and gets tackled almost immediately.
Tom Brady had a better move in the Bucs game than Saquon.
He fucking sucks and his rookie year was a total mirage.
Keep going with that. Guy is coming off an ankle injury and looked mechanical, yes.
The whole team looked like shit. Unprepared, uninspired and inept.
I got in an argument with some friends where I said Saquon was just Reggie Bush 2.0, and they all called me crazy. So I signed up for stat geek and plotted all of Reggie Bush's 2011 carries and all of Saquons 2018 carries on a spreadsheet - years when they both had 5 YPC. I will admit that I did not look at receiving and that's a big part to leave out, but I was talking about how the offense is just not functional with Saquon as a runner.
Findings as follows:
Barkley:
1307 yards on 261 carries
576 yards on highest gaining 13 carries (44% of yardage on top 5% of highest gaining carries)
781 yards on highest gaining 26 carries (59.7% of yardage on top 10% highest gaining carries)
Median ypc: 2
Mode ypc: 1
The most likely outcome of Saquon running the ball was a 1 yard gain.
34 carries resulted in negative yardage for a total of -99.
26 carries resulted in no gain.
41 carries resulted in 1 yard.
Bush:
1086 yards on 216 carries
328 yards on top 11 highest gaining carries
475 yards on top 22 highest gaining carries
median ypc: 3
mode ypc: 3
22 negative yardage runs for a total of -66 yards.
16 rushes resulted in no gain.
20 rushes resulted in 1 yard.
Who would you rather have to help this offense move the ball given the Giants talent level?
Barkley was like this in college also. I fucking hated the pick at the time, have hated it since. I hated his run style even when he was putting up at numbers because it's really not sustainable for an offense to move the ball.
Hell, the 2014-2015 "slant to Odell and wait for him to bail us out" offense was more sustainable
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I was in favor of drafting him before they made the selection. I think that had just as much to do with my thoughts on that QB class as it did with my thoughts about Barkley. I certainly expected more from him. Even his great rookie season, when you look at it, was a bit of a mirage. How many of those yards were 1 big run the 2nd half of a meaningless game. Even still, the talent was there.
I believe calling him a bust or the worst pick ever is disingenuous. Whether you like the pick or not, that is way too far of an exaggeration. Whether you believe the rookie year was more mirage or just the real thing, that year alone makes the extreme negative labels sound silly to me.
That said, tonight I reached the point where I absolutely do not care if I ever see him take another snap in a Giants uniform. I think he is still a talented back who can probably succeed with a semblance of a professional OL in front of him. I just don't want to invest a dime to find out. It would be an unwise business move to offer him a second contract.
Matt,
I am the opposite of you. I never wanted Barkley. I wrote long posts about how it is unwise to draft RBs that high, as well as pointing out that his running style was a problem.
I have posted many time about how his rookie year was a mirage. He had a bunch of meaningless long runs and catches that padded his stats. But when I looked at success rate stats, Barkley was a complete failure even in his rookie year. He was consistently near the bottom of the league in success rate stats both running and receiving. Think of success rate as a plus play for the team. The top running backs are at about 55 to 60%. Very goo ones 45 to 55%. Middle of the pack 35 to 45%. Barkley languishes around 30%. In other words less than 1/3 of his touches his first 2 years, were good plays for the Giants. That is such bad statistic that it is crippling to the offense. I have long argues that Barkley is a net negative for the offense. I think that is becoming plainly obvious to everybody now.
I agree with this. But even if I were to say that his rookie year actually WAS great - what's he done since?
His rookie year, whatever one thinks of it, was clearly his peak. I said then that "Barkley's prime is right now, we're seeing him as good as he'll ever be" and that was correct.
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In comment 15465785 Bear vs Shark said:
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In comment 15465780 section125 said:
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In comment 15463031 JoeyBigBlue said:
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But we’re stuck with him for another year. No one is trading for him and we won’t outright release him.
Can you imagine how a Belichick, a Shanahan or a McVay would scheme up getting him the ball - I can. How about Kingsberry teaming him up with Murray?
No he is not a powerback as people thought, but get him in space and he is scary.
Somebody would trade for him.
He didn't look scary when he caught a pass and stutter stepped with nobody within 6 yards of him instead of running to the 1st down marker, ended up getting tackled short, and contributing to killing a drive.
He's not lethal in the open field. He tapdances and gets tackled almost immediately.
Tom Brady had a better move in the Bucs game than Saquon.
He fucking sucks and his rookie year was a total mirage.
Keep going with that. Guy is coming off an ankle injury and looked mechanical, yes.
The whole team looked like shit. Unprepared, uninspired and inept.
I got in an argument with some friends where I said Saquon was just Reggie Bush 2.0, and they all called me crazy. So I signed up for stat geek and plotted all of Reggie Bush's 2011 carries and all of Saquons 2018 carries on a spreadsheet - years when they both had 5 YPC. I will admit that I did not look at receiving and that's a big part to leave out, but I was talking about how the offense is just not functional with Saquon as a runner.
Findings as follows:
Barkley:
1307 yards on 261 carries
576 yards on highest gaining 13 carries (44% of yardage on top 5% of highest gaining carries)
781 yards on highest gaining 26 carries (59.7% of yardage on top 10% highest gaining carries)
Median ypc: 2
Mode ypc: 1
The most likely outcome of Saquon running the ball was a 1 yard gain.
34 carries resulted in negative yardage for a total of -99.
26 carries resulted in no gain.
41 carries resulted in 1 yard.
Bush:
1086 yards on 216 carries
328 yards on top 11 highest gaining carries
475 yards on top 22 highest gaining carries
median ypc: 3
mode ypc: 3
22 negative yardage runs for a total of -66 yards.
16 rushes resulted in no gain.
20 rushes resulted in 1 yard.
Who would you rather have to help this offense move the ball given the Giants talent level?
Barkley was like this in college also. I fucking hated the pick at the time, have hated it since. I hated his run style even when he was putting up at numbers because it's really not sustainable for an offense to move the ball.
Hell, the 2014-2015 "slant to Odell and wait for him to bail us out" offense was more sustainable
Yep. Barkley is basically not a RB at all. He's a gadget player. You have to scheme him into space for him to be a plus player.