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The converse of what most assume about DJ and the Giants

Producer : 11/23/2021 1:29 pm
may be true and it may be time to think about it as a possibility.

Many here tout that we cannot judge Jones until we have more in place (weapons / OL)

But maybe Daniel Jones is the main problem with the Giants and we can't properly judge this roster until we have a better QB.

There are numbers out there suggesting the pressure Jones faces is not inordinately poor. He has some talented weapons. We have a defense that seems pretty good but gets taxed late in games.

Maybe Jones just doesn't do enough with what he has and the effects are cascading down the roster. Maybe when he looked pretty good in some games, he should have been putting up 35, and putting more games away. he certainly left a lot on the field last night.

I think there is a significant probability that Jones is the biggest problem we have.
You, Producer, think that?  
Everyone Relax : 11/23/2021 1:30 pm : link
Why havent you said something sooner?!
It’s definitely him or them  
UConn4523 : 11/23/2021 1:32 pm : link
no I’m between whatsoever.
No one is good enough on this team except maybe Gano and Thomas  
Bold Ruler : Mod : 11/23/2021 1:35 pm : link
Jones doesn't instill confidence in me whatsoever. But neither does anyone else.
A Blind Person  
Samiam : 11/23/2021 1:35 pm : link
A blind person can watch the Giants and know more than you. You want to say that Jones is not a good QB, ok. But, he plays behind one of the worst OLs in the game, if not the worst, and you think he's the bigger problem? not enough discussing Garrett.
RE: A Blind Person  
Producer : 11/23/2021 1:42 pm : link
In comment 15464532 Samiam said:
Quote:
A blind person can watch the Giants and know more than you. You want to say that Jones is not a good QB, ok. But, he plays behind one of the worst OLs in the game, if not the worst, and you think he's the bigger problem? not enough discussing Garrett.


Daniel Jones has more time than many QBs, and he has enough time to make more plays than he does. You can yell at me all you want, the numbers suggest this is the case, and if the Giants don't at least consider it, they are committing malpractice.
i absolutely agree jones looks mentally slow, unsure of himself,  
japanhead : 11/23/2021 1:42 pm : link
has bad instincts, and has made the players around him worse, especially on the OL.

but jones never played like this under shurmur. he would wing the ball around. of course this resulted in him tying the rookie record for single-season turnovers, but i'd rather watch that version of jones than the neutered, impotent version we've seen since judge was hired.
Producer  
Archer : 11/23/2021 1:42 pm : link
You are consistant
Keep beating the drum

Even if all the problems with the offense are caused by DJ
There is no suitable alternative.

There is no sure thing QB in the draft (and Matt Coral will be selected before the Giants picks)
There is no suitable QB as a free agent
There is no QB that we can acquire without mortgaging the future

The team needs to acquire talent throughout the lineup or whoever the QB is he will fail

The Giants need to have better coaching and imoprove the team
Then we can worry about DJ






It's impossible to know what the crux is, and its possible to fix with  
PatersonPlank : 11/23/2021 1:43 pm : link
without replacing everything. Could be OL, QB, OC, and is likely a combination of all. You upgrade where you can. Its possible to fix 2 out of the 3 and be good. Then everyone will say the 3rd wasn't the problem after all, but it could be too. Its all inter related. Thats why a team can win the SB with Dilfer at QB, or a mediocre OL. The surrounding cast gets good enough, and the remaining part is ok, that it all floats up to good.
RE: It's impossible to know what the crux is, and its possible to fix with  
Producer : 11/23/2021 1:44 pm : link
In comment 15464580 PatersonPlank said:
Quote:
without replacing everything. Could be OL, QB, OC, and is likely a combination of all. You upgrade where you can. Its possible to fix 2 out of the 3 and be good. Then everyone will say the 3rd wasn't the problem after all, but it could be too. Its all inter related. Thats why a team can win the SB with Dilfer at QB, or a mediocre OL. The surrounding cast gets good enough, and the remaining part is ok, that it all floats up to good.


a sensible take
RE: You, Producer, think that?  
joeinpa : 11/23/2021 1:56 pm : link
In comment 15464496 Everyone Relax said:
Quote:
Why havent you said something sooner?!


Hahaha. I thought the same thing.
If DJ was the 31st worse QB in the league  
BillT : 11/23/2021 2:00 pm : link
He would still be better than this OL.
RE: RE: A Blind Person  
jomps : 11/23/2021 2:01 pm : link
In comment 15464572 Producer said:
Quote:
In comment 15464532 Samiam said:


Quote:


A blind person can watch the Giants and know more than you. You want to say that Jones is not a good QB, ok. But, he plays behind one of the worst OLs in the game, if not the worst, and you think he's the bigger problem? not enough discussing Garrett.



Daniel Jones has more time than many QBs, and he has enough time to make more plays than he does. You can yell at me all you want, the numbers suggest this is the case, and if the Giants don't at least consider it, they are committing malpractice.


Hi Producer,

Sadly, your hate for the guy completely clouds your judgement.

I usually watch 4 1pm games, 3 4pm games and the 3 prime time ones, so like 10 games a week.

Literally every single game/team I watch has consistently more time to throw the ball and better designed plays. Obviously there are anomally games where some QB has no time to throw the ball and is sacked 6+ times, but this is normally the exception and happen to a different franchise each week.

With the Giants it is consistent and happens nearly every week, there's never time to throw the ball and the pocket is moved to the right too many times per game to extend plays.

This is not meant to be an excuse for anyone, because in the rare moments when we have time, our QB isn't delivering either.

We should seriously consider replacing everyone on this roster from DG and the coaches down to the players, with very few obvious exceptions like Andrew Thomas and Ojulari. But this is not going to be a one year rebuild, so if you're not comfortable with "X" QB at "Y" draft position you still have a lot of positions that need improvement and QB can be upgraded via FA, trade or 23 NFL Draft.
RE: A Blind Person  
26.2 : 11/23/2021 2:14 pm : link
In comment 15464532 Samiam said:
Quote:
A blind person can watch the Giants and know more than you. You want to say that Jones is not a good QB, ok. But, he plays behind one of the worst OLs in the game, if not the worst, and you think he's the bigger problem? not enough discussing Garrett.


To be fair, a blind person cannot watch anything.
RE: You, Producer, think that?  
montanagiant : 11/23/2021 2:17 pm : link
In comment 15464496 Everyone Relax said:
Quote:
Why havent you said something sooner?!

LMAO
RE: RE: You, Producer, think that?  
montanagiant : 11/23/2021 2:18 pm : link
In comment 15464754 montanagiant said:
Quote:
In comment 15464496 Everyone Relax said:


Quote:


Why havent you said something sooner?!


LMAO

I don't mean to dump on Producer but I did chuckle at that post.
RE: RE: It's impossible to know what the crux is, and its possible to fix with  
Blue21 : 11/23/2021 2:19 pm : link
In comment 15464595 Producer said:
Quote:
In comment 15464580 PatersonPlank said:


Quote:


without replacing everything. Could be OL, QB, OC, and is likely a combination of all. You upgrade where you can. Its possible to fix 2 out of the 3 and be good. Then everyone will say the 3rd wasn't the problem after all, but it could be too. Its all inter related. Thats why a team can win the SB with Dilfer at QB, or a mediocre OL. The surrounding cast gets good enough, and the remaining part is ok, that it all floats up to good.



a sensible take


yes yes and yes
RE: Producer  
markky : 11/23/2021 4:45 pm : link
In comment 15464576 Archer said:
Quote:
You are consistant

There is no sure thing QB in the draft (and Matt Coral will be selected before the Giants picks)
There is no suitable QB as a free agent
There is no QB that we can acquire without mortgaging the future



wait, this makes no sense. are you saying that if Matt Coral drops to us we should take him? because if you're asserting that he'll be gone by our pick then you're saying he's a better prospect than Jones and we should take him.
Taking the contra positive,  
TheEvilLurker : 11/23/2021 5:03 pm : link
We cannot judge the roster until we have a better qb? That doesn't make much sense.

I think if we have better role players, then we can figure out Daniel Jones.
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