The Giants are a sad version of "Groundhog Day." Even great franchises have losing seasons, But the Giants have been terrible for years. I think we are 21-53 since our last SB appearance and have the second worst record in the league since 2017, behind only our NY counterparts, the equally hapless Jets.
There will be tons of changes in the offseason. Hernandez, Solder, Carter, Ximines, Engram, and many others won't be back. The problem is that we will be stuck with many of Dave's terrible contracts until 2023 at the earliest.
It won't happen, but right now I'd bench Solder for Peart, Hernandez for Bredeson, and Price for Skura. I'd then put Martin in for Skura, so the OL would be Thomas, Martin, Skura, Bredeson, and Peart.
I would also bench Barkley for Booker, and use the latter mostly as a blocker because the OL changes might result in confusion about blocking assignments.
On defense, I would blitz more. I'm tired of dying a death of a thousand defensive cuts. We're also paying a ton to Bradberry and Jackson. I expect then to be able to lock up their men on a regular basis.
Gettleman and Mara have screwed up virtually everything else, but not that. As big a disappointment as he has been Barkley has shown he has outstanding skills. He’s a great open field runner and a good receiver. He has many of the skills Dave Megget had back in the day. Had this been a somewhat functional team he would have been a weapon on offense. As it is, I agree that Booker should start over him. They just need a basic runner. Thats not on Barkley though, thats on the disfunction of this team. It can be argued that he wasn’t good enough to be the number 2 pick in the draft. Who then should we have drafted ? Darnold ?
That brings us to Jones. His rookie year he showed more than any other rookie quarterback thats been drafted recently, despite playing for a shit team. Since then he’s regressed, but even during that regression he’s shown plenty of signs he’s the guy. The OT win earlier this year was the best example. When he absolutely had to march down the field and score a TD, he did. Anyone think the Giants wouldn’t have found a way to lose if they settled for a field goal in that OT ?
Its true, he had a horrible game last week. Eli had horrible games even in his heyday. Rogers has horrible games. Mahomes looks like shit when things aren’t perfect. Back in the day Farve had horrible games, Montana had horrible games. None of those QB’s had to deal with the disfunction that Jones had and none of the QB’s had a dead man walking as an OC.
I will say SB would have had much better production with a outstanding OL. So would many backs.
As the second pick you find production. You plant LB's who blitz. You find the tough yards. Some of the all time greats did not have the best situations either and still got their yards.
said at face value, what is the binding tie that brings it all into focus?
Ownership. John acts like he knows what he’s doing but he’s clueless and he mettle’s in team operation. Almost worse, his brother Chris has been head of Personnel for a decade. See the problem.
BW and Terps have been right. Until the Mara’s get out of the business of ACTIVELY running this franchise, we ate screwed.
But too harsh. I don't see Joe Judge as a 'used car salesman'. I think he will be back next year and ultimately will get it together and be successful.
OL is so bad that despite last Monday, I still want to wait until the end of the season to make a determination about Jones, although as of right now I do not want them to pick up his fifth year option. I am also willing to wait until the end of the season before making any determination about Barkley. Maybe Kitchens can help improve their performance.
Yeah, but if they beat the Eagles....than.things feel better
But too harsh. I don't see Joe Judge as a 'used car salesman'. I think he will be back next year and ultimately will get it together and be successful.
All the best.
I love your optimism. If you're right about Joe Judge, it has to happen in 2022, because there will be no 2023.
But too harsh. I don't see Joe Judge as a 'used car salesman'. I think he will be back next year and ultimately will get it together and be successful.
All the best.
I love your optimism. If you're right about Joe Judge, it has to happen in 2022, because there will be no 2023.
I love your optimism. If you're right about Joe Judge, it has to happen in 2022, because otherwise there will be no 2023.
RE: The Giants did not screw up a #2 and #6 draft pick.
Gettleman and Mara have screwed up virtually everything else, but not that. As big a disappointment as he has been Barkley has shown he has outstanding skills. He’s a great open field runner and a good receiver. He has many of the skills Dave Megget had back in the day. Had this been a somewhat functional team he would have been a weapon on offense. As it is, I agree that Booker should start over him. They just need a basic runner. Thats not on Barkley though, thats on the disfunction of this team. It can be argued that he wasn’t good enough to be the number 2 pick in the draft. Who then should we have drafted ? Darnold ?
That brings us to Jones. His rookie year he showed more than any other rookie quarterback thats been drafted recently, despite playing for a shit team. Since then he’s regressed, but even during that regression he’s shown plenty of signs he’s the guy. The OT win earlier this year was the best example. When he absolutely had to march down the field and score a TD, he did. Anyone think the Giants wouldn’t have found a way to lose if they settled for a field goal in that OT ?
Its true, he had a horrible game last week. Eli had horrible games even in his heyday. Rogers has horrible games. Mahomes looks like shit when things aren’t perfect. Back in the day Farve had horrible games, Montana had horrible games. None of those QB’s had to deal with the disfunction that Jones had and none of the QB’s had a dead man walking as an OC.
The Giants had just signed Solder, shitty Omameh, and had shitty Ereck Flowers as the OL pieces and you have to ask what they were supposed to do in the Barkley draft?
But too harsh. I don't see Joe Judge as a 'used car salesman'. I think he will be back next year and ultimately will get it together and be successful.
All the best.
I agree with this. Not sure if he will be successful, who is sure, but used car salesman is a bit premature.
Hey, I wanted to believe in this guy as much as everyone else.
But the proof is in the pudding and this team isn't getting better.
He's got seven games. Let's see what he can do.
But I'm not an optimistic. His in-game decision-making is baffling. He decided to fire Garrett this week instead of two weeks ago. The injury list is getting bigger even though they just came out of the bye when the opposite should be occurring.
We'll see how you guys feel if the Eagles and Washington sweep the Giants.
I am baffled why Garrett wasn't fired during the bye. That was logical timing. But I am of belief JG was forced on JJ so Mara wanted to hold out as long as he could.
say and I know Jerry Reese is very well not liked here. But I think today we now know how meddling John Mara has been behind the scenes. And I would love to know how entangled and hamstrung Jerry was in truly trying to move off of Eli and trying to maybe actually start the rebuild. It now seems to me Mara was pushing everyone to Win and Rebuild this team around a declining Eli for a very long time most likely influencing a GM's real strategy. Just a thought.
Hey, I wanted to believe in this guy as much as everyone else.
But the proof is in the pudding and this team isn't getting better.
He's got seven games. Let's see what he can do.
But I'm not an optimistic. His in-game decision-making is baffling. He decided to fire Garrett this week instead of two weeks ago. The injury list is getting bigger even though they just came out of the bye when the opposite should be occurring.
We'll see how you guys feel if the Eagles and Washington sweep the Giants.
I am not fully soured on Judge, yet I think he should have fired Garret last January.
Hey, I wanted to believe in this guy as much as everyone else.
But the proof is in the pudding and this team isn't getting better.
He's got seven games. Let's see what he can do.
But I'm not an optimistic. His in-game decision-making is baffling. He decided to fire Garrett this week instead of two weeks ago. The injury list is getting bigger even though they just came out of the bye when the opposite should be occurring.
We'll see how you guys feel if the Eagles and Washington sweep the Giants.
I almost backed off my hard line with him after he fired Garrett only to be baffled by his perceived gamesmanship about naming a play caller as if it makes a lick of difference. He is so cringing to me know in everything he does, I can't see myself ever getting behind this guy.
RE: The Giants did not screw up a #2 and #6 draft pick.
Gettleman and Mara have screwed up virtually everything else, but not that. As big a disappointment as he has been Barkley has shown he has outstanding skills. He’s a great open field runner and a good receiver. He has many of the skills Dave Megget had back in the day. Had this been a somewhat functional team he would have been a weapon on offense. As it is, I agree that Booker should start over him. They just need a basic runner. Thats not on Barkley though, thats on the disfunction of this team. It can be argued that he wasn’t good enough to be the number 2 pick in the draft. Who then should we have drafted ? Darnold ?
That brings us to Jones. His rookie year he showed more than any other rookie quarterback thats been drafted recently, despite playing for a shit team. Since then he’s regressed, but even during that regression he’s shown plenty of signs he’s the guy. The OT win earlier this year was the best example. When he absolutely had to march down the field and score a TD, he did. Anyone think the Giants wouldn’t have found a way to lose if they settled for a field goal in that OT ?
Its true, he had a horrible game last week. Eli had horrible games even in his heyday. Rogers has horrible games. Mahomes looks like shit when things aren’t perfect. Back in the day Farve had horrible games, Montana had horrible games. None of those QB’s had to deal with the disfunction that Jones had and none of the QB’s had a dead man walking as an OC.
Good post. But yeah, they screwed up with both picks...
I am baffled why Garrett wasn't fired during the bye. That was logical timing. But I am of belief JG was forced on JJ so Mara wanted to hold out as long as he could.
I think he probably wanted to see the team at full strength and having two weeks to prepare, esp after winning 2 of 3.
Then seeing Monday night, he had enough.
I think Garrett was fired not because of his gameplanning -
Judge and the other coaches are very involved in offensive design and gameplanning — but because Garrett gave an insufficiently optimistic press conference right before the Tampa game.
He was fired for an error in PR spin, not actual coaching.
The proof is indeed in the pudding. The Maras also need to stop interfering with football operations. Garrett with John John's hire. Clear as day.
The Maras need to get the hell out of the way and hire a football Czar from a nuts and bolts organization, like the Ravens, and then let that guy run the show. Just as they did all those years ago when they hired GY. I'd hire Joe Horitz to run the show (see article below from a Bears writer), nut if the Maras stay in the way, then no executive worth his salt will want to come here. This is where the Tisches need to step in and put an end to Timmie, Chris, and John John's run of ineptitude.
This franchise has to start to be that young and ascending team that playoff worthy teams need to take notice of when on their schedule. After 4 years with Dave and 1.5 with Judge, this thing is still a fucking doormat, actually THE league’s doormat. It’s beyond ridiculous at this point. The depressing thought is this: IF they make the right moves this off-season (firing Dave, Judge, not hiring Abrams or anyone internally to GM), they’re still maybe another 2 years at minimum from being that young ascending team I’ve mentioned before, one where the arrow is truly “pointing up” as we’ve all hoped to have happen over the last 5 years. The losing isn’t going to stop anytime soon gents. But they can deliver hope by making competent decisions this winter/spring. The worrisome question that comes next is: are they capable of making sound decisions? I’m not sure…
Oh and to make it worse, the team they play tomorrow is what
They should be. Philly bottomed out and rebuilt enough quickly to the point where they should be a legit WC contender THIS year. Yes they have long term viability questions at QB, but their roster got appreciably better than the NYG in about a year’s time. That’s pathetic and infuriates me.
But, the Giants are still paying the price for the decisions made in 2018 and 2019. There are many reasons the franchise is in the mess it’s in, but I think this timeline represents it well:
2012-2015: There is no shame in a team declining after a long successful run which yielded two SB titles. Add in some shit luck with players like Kenny Phillips, David Wilson, Hakeem Nicks & Victor Cruz. Funny how Pugh & Flowers have established themselves elsewhere as well. But, it’s hard to fault the franchise for this, it isn’t uncommon.
2016: Try to extend Eli’s window by hiring McAdoo. Mara giving Reese a win or else mandate was incredibly stupid and desperation followed. A nice sugar high.
2018: Try to extend Eli’s window AGAIN off a 3-13 season. Draft a RB #2 as opposed to trying to trade down a build the line. Wouldn’t that have been the better plan if you’re trying to win with a 37 year old QB?
2019: Panic and reach for a QB while paying Eli a large portion of the cap.
2020: Hire Judge to implement a culture despite him inheriting an almost 70 year old GM at the time with a 9-23 record.
They are still paying for doubling down on Eli and then forcing the Jones pick. They need to start clean at QB.
Even if you like Jones, the Giants missed their window to win with him. It’s over.
Review is spot on. The real problem is. Mara and the clowns around him. When you have a family business you lean to hiring friends and relatives. His father did the same thing. He will not learn. After every season he sounds like a snake oil salesman. Once the George Young influence ended so did winning teams. Thanks for hard work. Sadly, it will not change .
Review is spot on. The real problem is. Mara and the clowns around him. When you have a family business you lean to hiring friends and relatives. His father did the same thing. He will not learn. After every season he sounds like a snake oil salesman. Once the George Young influence ended so did winning teams. Thanks for hard work. Sadly, it will not change .
Then it is hopeless, right? Why waste our time then?
I will say SB would have had much better production with a outstanding OL. So would many backs.
As the second pick you find production. You plant LB's who blitz. You find the tough yards. Some of the all time greats did not have the best situations either and still got their yards.
Exactly. Highly drafted rb generally go to poor teams. We were sold on Barkeley being a "generational running back"; the kind of running back you build the entire offense around. At 235 lbs (supposedly), the kind of back who could move the chains when needed with break away ability. He wasn't: not close.
Jones rookie year was built on a few games against woeful defenses as a rookie unknown quantity. He did nothing against any halfway decent team and once DC's had film on him, the party was over. Again, the brain trust sold themselves on a narrative: Jones was Eli 2.0, trained by the immortal Cutcliffe and many teams would pounce if the Giants didn't take him. They believed in the narrative even though he had no record of elevating the play of those around him in 4 years in college and other draft prognosticators believed he was basically another Keenum.
Eric is right; they blew both picks sky high.
Get a competent GM that is a good evaluator of talent and
Judge and the other coaches are very involved in offensive design and gameplanning — but because Garrett gave an insufficiently optimistic press conference right before the Tampa game.
He was fired for an error in PR spin, not actual coaching.
it may also have been because the locker room was dividing. After all, Freddie Kitchens was the "Senior Offensive Assistant" and asshole Judge buddy. He had no say in the offense or gameplanning? Please.
There was one guy in that room who had some success as an NFL head coach and it wasn't Joe Judge or Freddie. You have to figure that there were some players starting to look to Garrett in their time of trouble and not Mr Know it All.
RE: Get a competent GM that is a good evaluator of talent and
the family stuff will fall in line or be irrelevant...
Seen this movie before. It took 17 years and the towering presence of Pete Rozelle to get Daddy out of the GM suite. Who is going to tell Jawn that his time as GM Jr is over? Goodell?? Good luck.
RE: RE: I think Garrett was fired not because of his gameplanning -
Judge and the other coaches are very involved in offensive design and gameplanning — but because Garrett gave an insufficiently optimistic press conference right before the Tampa game.
He was fired for an error in PR spin, not actual coaching.
it may also have been because the locker room was dividing. After all, Freddie Kitchens was the "Senior Offensive Assistant" and asshole Judge buddy. He had no say in the offense or gameplanning? Please.
There was one guy in that room who had some success as an NFL head coach and it wasn't Joe Judge or Freddie. You have to figure that there were some players starting to look to Garrett in their time of trouble and not Mr Know it All.
I happen to agree with this... Judge is lying that this was not a snap decision. Garrett went of script and this maniacal control freak could not deal with it. I think this Sunday is going to be a historical event. The Eagles are supremely strong everywhere we are weak.
RE: Get a competent GM that is a good evaluator of talent and
the family stuff will fall in line or be irrelevant...
Seen this movie before. It took 17 years and the towering presence of Pete Rozelle to get Daddy out of the GM suite. Who is going to tell Jawn that his time as GM Jr is over? Goodell?? Good luck.
Yeah, I don't subscribe to a view that a capable GM can't keep family on reservation with proper decision making.
Dave Gettleman is the Senior VP and GM. He’s calling the shots. Is and always was. Way too much credit was given to Judge because some of the the acquisitions looked better in 2020, but Dave should get credit for that too. His sticky bun covered paws are all over everything.
You guys think it’s a coincidence Garrett took a shot at the roster construction and within a week Judge fires him? That was the final straw and if Garrett had any allies in management that was over.
The Maras get itchy when the guys in the football roles suck.
We didn’t hear shit from Mara when Coughlin, Reese, and Gettleman were running the show and living in the playoffs.
When the Giants replace Gettleman with someone suited for the top gig, the family stuff will disappear.
I really don’t care about last week. Tampa is a million time more talented coming off back to back losses on the road in prime time. That outcome should not surprise anyone. This week is entirely different story. This is a game you can judge Jones and Judge by.
Garrett out of the way, are there signs we are fixing anything? The beats asked Judge if it was his decision to fire JG and he talked about a process. If I had to guess, Judge wanted to fire JG previously. There has been rumblings before. Mara probably told him to give JG the bye week to see if he could fix the issues and when he didn’t JJ had green light to make the move. JJ even said it wasn’t in response to Tampa. All signs indicate JJ wanted JG gone even before Tampa.
Garrett was foisted upon him from Mara. What's Judge going to say? He's never head coached anything. Judge was the perfect candidate. They had no choice to fire Garrett now, way too late.
When we lost out on Rhule, the next thing we heard was the Giants were reaching out to Garrett. We all panicked. Nobody wanted Garret as HC. Then they hire Judge. You could hear the collective sigh of relief that it wasn't Garrett for miles.
Then we were all thinking "Who?"... Judge came out of nowhere. He's young, ties to Saban and BB, talks "Blue Collar Football". People ate the shit up. Well, I agree with Eric and his used car salesman analogy. He's in over his head IMO and should go coach college football where the kids have no choice but to listen to his bullshit.
We had a coach once that said "Talk is cheap, play the damn game!".
Garett was certainly a problem and ownership mismanagement
direct ties to ownership disrupting a chain of command, and Campbell was an obvious red flag, Garett and Campbell basically set up their own independent autonomous faction.
say and I know Jerry Reese is very well not liked here. But I think today we now know how meddling John Mara has been behind the scenes. And I would love to know how entangled and hamstrung Jerry was in truly trying to move off of Eli and trying to maybe actually start the rebuild. It now seems to me Mara was pushing everyone to Win and Rebuild this team around a declining Eli for a very long time most likely influencing a GM's real strategy. Just a thought.
Possible scenario:
Judge before the bye - "I want to fire Garrett!"
Gettleman/Mara - "He hasn't had a healthy offense; let's see how he does with his weapons."
After TB - Everyone: "Fire the S.O.B.!"
with 30+ yard runs, he's quite likely the fastest QB in a 100 meter sprint, a long strider like Usain Bolt.
Watch as the coaching staff sends him on 0 runs.
Lol Eagle killer?
he couldn't even beat an injury-ravaged Eagle team in the final game of the 2019 with Barkley, Engram, Sterling Shepard, Tate and the Golden one Tate all healthy.
The last Eagle killer that we had was Plaxico Burress.
to get destroyed tomorrow. I think so highly of Sanders and that Oline. He is the Penn State asset we should have drafted not Barkley. I feel like the eagles are going to rack up 300 yards on the ground and bury this 4 year rebuild and finally leave it for dead. Hopefully Gentleman will get fired on Monday.
by our most hated division rival on the day that Strahan's jersey is going to get retired. Only had 12 seasons before this one to retire it, but let's wait until the team is at it's worst AND against a nearby division rival so they can get tickets and boo him during the ceremony. These idiots can't do anything right.
The Giants are a sad version of "Groundhog Day." Even great franchises have losing seasons, But the Giants have been terrible for years. I think we are 21-53 since our last SB appearance and have the second worst record in the league since 2017, behind only our NY counterparts, the equally hapless Jets.
There will be tons of changes in the offseason. Hernandez, Solder, Carter, Ximines, Engram, and many others won't be back. The problem is that we will be stuck with many of Dave's terrible contracts until 2023 at the earliest.
It won't happen, but right now I'd bench Solder for Peart, Hernandez for Bredeson, and Price for Skura. I'd then put Martin in for Skura, so the OL would be Thomas, Martin, Skura, Bredeson, and Peart.
I would also bench Barkley for Booker, and use the latter mostly as a blocker because the OL changes might result in confusion about blocking assignments.
On defense, I would blitz more. I'm tired of dying a death of a thousand defensive cuts. We're also paying a ton to Bradberry and Jackson. I expect then to be able to lock up their men on a regular basis.
He has not been able to succeed because of poor protection and poor coaching.
Barkley, Golliday, Toney Shep and Ross all have great ability but can't stay healthy.
The Giants and Bears may both move up the draft board to the 5 and six picks
That brings us to Jones. His rookie year he showed more than any other rookie quarterback thats been drafted recently, despite playing for a shit team. Since then he’s regressed, but even during that regression he’s shown plenty of signs he’s the guy. The OT win earlier this year was the best example. When he absolutely had to march down the field and score a TD, he did. Anyone think the Giants wouldn’t have found a way to lose if they settled for a field goal in that OT ?
Its true, he had a horrible game last week. Eli had horrible games even in his heyday. Rogers has horrible games. Mahomes looks like shit when things aren’t perfect. Back in the day Farve had horrible games, Montana had horrible games. None of those QB’s had to deal with the disfunction that Jones had and none of the QB’s had a dead man walking as an OC.
Out of the torn and tattered sails of the good ship New York Giants.
All that’s left is for the bottom to be ripped out on a lee shore this Sunday.
Strike the colors.
As the second pick you find production. You plant LB's who blitz. You find the tough yards. Some of the all time greats did not have the best situations either and still got their yards.
Watch as the coaching staff sends him on 0 runs.
Ownership. John acts like he knows what he’s doing but he’s clueless and he mettle’s in team operation. Almost worse, his brother Chris has been head of Personnel for a decade. See the problem.
BW and Terps have been right. Until the Mara’s get out of the business of ACTIVELY running this franchise, we ate screwed.
All the best.
The coaches mistakes cost us 3 games...
Looking the past 10 years...as a whole makes little sense....
End of coughlin era....Ross had to go years earlier....the GB coach was a big mis-step....Shummur defense was a killer..and now the Judge experiment.
OL still not fixed and pass rush must get re-enforcements
All the best.
I love your optimism. If you're right about Joe Judge, it has to happen in 2022, because there will be no 2023.
Quote:
But too harsh. I don't see Joe Judge as a 'used car salesman'. I think he will be back next year and ultimately will get it together and be successful.
All the best.
I love your optimism. If you're right about Joe Judge, it has to happen in 2022, because there will be no 2023.
I love your optimism. If you're right about Joe Judge, it has to happen in 2022, because otherwise there will be no 2023.
That brings us to Jones. His rookie year he showed more than any other rookie quarterback thats been drafted recently, despite playing for a shit team. Since then he’s regressed, but even during that regression he’s shown plenty of signs he’s the guy. The OT win earlier this year was the best example. When he absolutely had to march down the field and score a TD, he did. Anyone think the Giants wouldn’t have found a way to lose if they settled for a field goal in that OT ?
Its true, he had a horrible game last week. Eli had horrible games even in his heyday. Rogers has horrible games. Mahomes looks like shit when things aren’t perfect. Back in the day Farve had horrible games, Montana had horrible games. None of those QB’s had to deal with the disfunction that Jones had and none of the QB’s had a dead man walking as an OC.
The Giants had just signed Solder, shitty Omameh, and had shitty Ereck Flowers as the OL pieces and you have to ask what they were supposed to do in the Barkley draft?
All the best.
I agree with this. Not sure if he will be successful, who is sure, but used car salesman is a bit premature.
I thought this was a thoughtful review Eric.
Nice work, Eric.
Nice work, Eric.
This is past the "it's getting old" stage.
I'm a patient guy, but we are at the same spot we were a decade ago. They are just spinning their wheels at this point.
Nice work, Eric.
Is this sarcasm?
But the proof is in the pudding and this team isn't getting better.
He's got seven games. Let's see what he can do.
But I'm not an optimistic. His in-game decision-making is baffling. He decided to fire Garrett this week instead of two weeks ago. The injury list is getting bigger even though they just came out of the bye when the opposite should be occurring.
We'll see how you guys feel if the Eagles and Washington sweep the Giants.
But the proof is in the pudding and this team isn't getting better.
He's got seven games. Let's see what he can do.
But I'm not an optimistic. His in-game decision-making is baffling. He decided to fire Garrett this week instead of two weeks ago. The injury list is getting bigger even though they just came out of the bye when the opposite should be occurring.
We'll see how you guys feel if the Eagles and Washington sweep the Giants.
I am not fully soured on Judge, yet I think he should have fired Garret last January.
But the proof is in the pudding and this team isn't getting better.
He's got seven games. Let's see what he can do.
But I'm not an optimistic. His in-game decision-making is baffling. He decided to fire Garrett this week instead of two weeks ago. The injury list is getting bigger even though they just came out of the bye when the opposite should be occurring.
We'll see how you guys feel if the Eagles and Washington sweep the Giants.
I almost backed off my hard line with him after he fired Garrett only to be baffled by his perceived gamesmanship about naming a play caller as if it makes a lick of difference. He is so cringing to me know in everything he does, I can't see myself ever getting behind this guy.
That brings us to Jones. His rookie year he showed more than any other rookie quarterback thats been drafted recently, despite playing for a shit team. Since then he’s regressed, but even during that regression he’s shown plenty of signs he’s the guy. The OT win earlier this year was the best example. When he absolutely had to march down the field and score a TD, he did. Anyone think the Giants wouldn’t have found a way to lose if they settled for a field goal in that OT ?
Its true, he had a horrible game last week. Eli had horrible games even in his heyday. Rogers has horrible games. Mahomes looks like shit when things aren’t perfect. Back in the day Farve had horrible games, Montana had horrible games. None of those QB’s had to deal with the disfunction that Jones had and none of the QB’s had a dead man walking as an OC.
Good post. But yeah, they screwed up with both picks...
I think he probably wanted to see the team at full strength and having two weeks to prepare, esp after winning 2 of 3.
Then seeing Monday night, he had enough.
He was fired for an error in PR spin, not actual coaching.
The Maras need to get the hell out of the way and hire a football Czar from a nuts and bolts organization, like the Ravens, and then let that guy run the show. Just as they did all those years ago when they hired GY. I'd hire Joe Horitz to run the show (see article below from a Bears writer), nut if the Maras stay in the way, then no executive worth his salt will want to come here. This is where the Tisches need to step in and put an end to Timmie, Chris, and John John's run of ineptitude.
Joe Hortiz: A Possible Next Chicago Bears GM Deep Dive By ERIK LAMBERT - NOV 13, 2021 - ( New Window )
2012-2015: There is no shame in a team declining after a long successful run which yielded two SB titles. Add in some shit luck with players like Kenny Phillips, David Wilson, Hakeem Nicks & Victor Cruz. Funny how Pugh & Flowers have established themselves elsewhere as well. But, it’s hard to fault the franchise for this, it isn’t uncommon.
2016: Try to extend Eli’s window by hiring McAdoo. Mara giving Reese a win or else mandate was incredibly stupid and desperation followed. A nice sugar high.
2018: Try to extend Eli’s window AGAIN off a 3-13 season. Draft a RB #2 as opposed to trying to trade down a build the line. Wouldn’t that have been the better plan if you’re trying to win with a 37 year old QB?
2019: Panic and reach for a QB while paying Eli a large portion of the cap.
2020: Hire Judge to implement a culture despite him inheriting an almost 70 year old GM at the time with a 9-23 record.
They are still paying for doubling down on Eli and then forcing the Jones pick. They need to start clean at QB.
Even if you like Jones, the Giants missed their window to win with him. It’s over.
Then it is hopeless, right? Why waste our time then?
As the second pick you find production. You plant LB's who blitz. You find the tough yards. Some of the all time greats did not have the best situations either and still got their yards.
Jones rookie year was built on a few games against woeful defenses as a rookie unknown quantity. He did nothing against any halfway decent team and once DC's had film on him, the party was over. Again, the brain trust sold themselves on a narrative: Jones was Eli 2.0, trained by the immortal Cutcliffe and many teams would pounce if the Giants didn't take him. They believed in the narrative even though he had no record of elevating the play of those around him in 4 years in college and other draft prognosticators believed he was basically another Keenum.
Eric is right; they blew both picks sky high.
He was fired for an error in PR spin, not actual coaching.
There was one guy in that room who had some success as an NFL head coach and it wasn't Joe Judge or Freddie. You have to figure that there were some players starting to look to Garrett in their time of trouble and not Mr Know it All.
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Judge and the other coaches are very involved in offensive design and gameplanning — but because Garrett gave an insufficiently optimistic press conference right before the Tampa game.
He was fired for an error in PR spin, not actual coaching.
it may also have been because the locker room was dividing. After all, Freddie Kitchens was the "Senior Offensive Assistant" and asshole Judge buddy. He had no say in the offense or gameplanning? Please.
There was one guy in that room who had some success as an NFL head coach and it wasn't Joe Judge or Freddie. You have to figure that there were some players starting to look to Garrett in their time of trouble and not Mr Know it All.
I happen to agree with this... Judge is lying that this was not a snap decision. Garrett went of script and this maniacal control freak could not deal with it. I think this Sunday is going to be a historical event. The Eagles are supremely strong everywhere we are weak.
Maybe the best post I’ve read on BBI. So true.
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the family stuff will fall in line or be irrelevant...
Seen this movie before. It took 17 years and the towering presence of Pete Rozelle to get Daddy out of the GM suite. Who is going to tell Jawn that his time as GM Jr is over? Goodell?? Good luck.
Yeah, I don't subscribe to a view that a capable GM can't keep family on reservation with proper decision making.
Dave Gettleman is the Senior VP and GM. He’s calling the shots. Is and always was. Way too much credit was given to Judge because some of the the acquisitions looked better in 2020, but Dave should get credit for that too. His sticky bun covered paws are all over everything.
You guys think it’s a coincidence Garrett took a shot at the roster construction and within a week Judge fires him? That was the final straw and if Garrett had any allies in management that was over.
The Maras get itchy when the guys in the football roles suck.
We didn’t hear shit from Mara when Coughlin, Reese, and Gettleman were running the show and living in the playoffs.
When the Giants replace Gettleman with someone suited for the top gig, the family stuff will disappear.
Garrett out of the way, are there signs we are fixing anything? The beats asked Judge if it was his decision to fire JG and he talked about a process. If I had to guess, Judge wanted to fire JG previously. There has been rumblings before. Mara probably told him to give JG the bye week to see if he could fix the issues and when he didn’t JJ had green light to make the move. JJ even said it wasn’t in response to Tampa. All signs indicate JJ wanted JG gone even before Tampa.
Garrett was foisted upon him from Mara. What's Judge going to say? He's never head coached anything. Judge was the perfect candidate. They had no choice to fire Garrett now, way too late.
When we lost out on Rhule, the next thing we heard was the Giants were reaching out to Garrett. We all panicked. Nobody wanted Garret as HC. Then they hire Judge. You could hear the collective sigh of relief that it wasn't Garrett for miles.
Then we were all thinking "Who?"... Judge came out of nowhere. He's young, ties to Saban and BB, talks "Blue Collar Football". People ate the shit up. Well, I agree with Eric and his used car salesman analogy. He's in over his head IMO and should go coach college football where the kids have no choice but to listen to his bullshit.
We had a coach once that said "Talk is cheap, play the damn game!".
Possible scenario:
Judge before the bye - "I want to fire Garrett!"
Gettleman/Mara - "He hasn't had a healthy offense; let's see how he does with his weapons."
After TB - Everyone: "Fire the S.O.B.!"
Watch as the coaching staff sends him on 0 runs.
Lol Eagle killer?
he couldn't even beat an injury-ravaged Eagle team in the final game of the 2019 with Barkley, Engram, Sterling Shepard, Tate and the Golden one Tate all healthy.
The last Eagle killer that we had was Plaxico Burress.
Toney
Rudolph
Smith
Which means our run game blocking will need to come from T eligible blocking and spread formations.