GMFB: Garafolo on the OC change and the future

And I am starting to wonder if Judge wants his own QB. If so Jones is auditioning for a different team these last 7 weeks.

The int to the DLinemen Monday was so bad that may be difficult to overcome. It was pathetic at best..

reflects terribly on both mara for pushing this guy on judge as the OC, and on judge for not insisting he be allowed to hire his preferred guys without interference or pressure from above.

mara must've gotten really overconfident after forcing coughlin to fire hufnagel, lewis and sheridan that he now believes it's his duty as owner to interfere in his HCs coordinator hires.

I have a very BAD feeling about tomorrow. If the offense falls flat on it's face (despite the OC change), things could get very ugly. I could see the Eagles putting up a big number against the Giants, just to rub it in.

In retrospect, it might have been better to postpone firing Garrett until after the Eagle game for Judge, as JC would make a good scapegoat for a disaster. A blowout is going to reflect directly on Judge. The team might not recover for the rest of this season.

that they havent found a way to throw the guy a 50/50 2-4 times a game with the way the league is now. It is LITERALLY his #1 skill, contested catches. It's the reason you signed him

And that’s on playcalling more then anything. You have to design plays for your playmakers. 1 read. 1 option. No bullshit. Scheme it and throw it.

Like was said I. The NFL now your gonna get a PI 1/3 times. Absurd

on 3rd and long and just fling it to him deep if no one is open in Madden. An int is like a punt, plus a big 50 ball guy reduces the chances of an int dramatically.

Everyone on Judges staff was telling Garrett to throw the ball to Golladay and use Toney and all sorts of other things. But Garrett just did what ever he wanted to do? We’re all supposed to believe that Joe Judge and all the other coaches on his staff were being ignored by Jason Garrett?

And this is supposed to make us feel better about Joe Judge the “CEO type” head coach that no one listens to? Got it.

And Gettleman still has confidence in Judge? Or is it Mara that still has confidence in Judge?

What a pure shit show the Giants are.

with the coaching staff has been that they preached using players in a way that utilized their best attributes. That hasn't happened at all, especially on offense. Even bad football players like Engram can be utilized better. Barkley's weaknesses are very apparent now but get him the ball in open space. Toney should be getting multiple WR screens a game, he's going to break one eventually. The Bucs throw multiple WR screens on Monday and got positive plays out of almost all of them.

when he's covered, he's open.

Collaborative offense

Pretty soon the head coaching job will be a collaboration,but the collaborators might not know it.

In comment 15468475 trueblueinpw said:

Quote:

Everyone on Judges staff was telling Garrett to throw the ball to Golladay and use Toney and all sorts of other things. But Garrett just did what ever he wanted to do? We’re all supposed to believe that Joe Judge and all the other coaches on his staff were being ignored by Jason Garrett? And this is supposed to make us feel better about Joe Judge the “CEO type” head coach that no one listens to? Got it. And Gettleman still has confidence in Judge? Or is it Mara that still has confidence in Judge? What a pure shit show the Giants are.

The article is silly and Garafolo is doing his Jints PR machine role.

They may have been yelling that but it was directed at the guy on the field with the ball in his hand-the quarterback.

I agree they should throw it to him more. Would the throw go to the Jacuzzi or to the training table. He's almost never on the field.

is a clown. He will go down as one of the worst coached in Giant history. Ray Handley who?

organization is for them to be obliterated EVERY week until the season ends. Maybe that will get the point through Mara’s stubborn skull that Massive changes are really needed. Clean house, front office (including his brother), coaching and QB. Start from scratch, build the right way with competent people. Only way this mess gets resolved. Sadly, I think the chances of this happening are close to Zero.

I'm not as down on him as some are but i certainly wouldn't defend him. What does he do well?

In comment 15468476 darren in pdx said:

Quote:

with the coaching staff has been that they preached using players in a way that utilized their best attributes. That hasn't happened at all, especially on offense. Even bad football players like Engram can be utilized better. Barkley's weaknesses are very apparent now but get him the ball in open space. Toney should be getting multiple WR screens a game, he's going to break one eventually. The Bucs throw multiple WR screens on Monday and got positive plays out of almost all of them.

To be fair, teams have been sitting all over the short throws because the Giants can't run the ball or pass block, and the D knows it. There is no need to concede anything short with the Giants, in fact you know Jones is going to throw immediately. It can feel like a chokehold when you can't block anybody. To borrow an MMA term, Daniel Jones starts every game with someone on his back.

If Judge is retained, I think he’ll demand a new QB & don’t see Jones getting a THIRD head coach here.

In comment 15468536 Jint Fan in Buc Land said:

Quote:

I'm not as down on him as some are but i certainly wouldn't defend him. What does he do well?

He's really good at wasting TO's. Other than that, I have no idea what anyone sees in him right now. Any goodwill he 'earned' last season, he's completely blown.

In comment 15468497 BigBlueJ said:

Quote:

is a clown. He will go down as one of the worst coached in Giant history. Ray Handley who?

gtfo

he calls a play that has kenny wide open for a TD and the QB never even looks his way

and they are yelling at garrett to get the ball to kenny? shouldn't they be yelling at jones?

because he is owed 8 million against the cap and they only save 200K if they cut him. I hope there is a mid round draft pick or a better journeyman free agent than Glennon to take over for him before he ruins another season.

RE: garrett sucks but

In comment 15468596 GiantsFan84 said:

Quote:

he calls a play that has kenny wide open for a TD and the QB never even looks his way and they are yelling at garrett to get the ball to kenny? shouldn't they be yelling at jones?

It's easy to pick out a particular play.

But can you make this same argument well over the last two seasons? I don't think you can.


RE: IMO Daniel Jones will be the starting QB for the Giants in 2022

In comment 15468599 arniefez said:

Quote:

because he is owed 8 million against the cap and they only save 200K if they cut him. I hope there is a mid round draft pick or a better journeyman free agent than Glennon to take over for him before he ruins another season.

He'll be the starting QB in 2022 because it's what make sense.

You're such a blowhard.

In comment 15468475 trueblueinpw said:

Quote:

Everyone on Judges staff was telling Garrett to throw the ball to Golladay and use Toney and all sorts of other things. But Garrett just did what ever he wanted to do? We’re all supposed to believe that Joe Judge and all the other coaches on his staff were being ignored by Jason Garrett? And this is supposed to make us feel better about Joe Judge the “CEO type” head coach that no one listens to? Got it. And Gettleman still has confidence in Judge? Or is it Mara that still has confidence in Judge? What a pure shit show the Giants are.

Exactly. Either the offense was a collective failure, or Garrett went rogue and our CEO Judge did nothing about it for 11 weeks. The former looks bad, the latter catastrophic.

In comment 15468483 HomerJones45 said:

Quote:

The article is silly and Garafolo is doing his Jints PR machine role. They may have been yelling that but it was directed at the guy on the field with the ball in his hand-the quarterback.

Except the OPs quote actually uses the name Jason, so either the quote is wrong or you are.

hinges on how the team plays the rest of the season.

John Mara does NOT want to replace any of these guys and he will employ any plausible pretext to keep them. If the Giants go 4-3, they are all likely coming back.

They go 0-7 or 1-6. Maybe a different story

In comment 15468645 PakistanPete said:

Quote:

RE: garrett sucks but In comment 15468596 GiantsFan84 said: Quote: he calls a play that has kenny wide open for a TD and the QB never even looks his way and they are yelling at garrett to get the ball to kenny? shouldn't they be yelling at jones? It's easy to pick out a particular play. But can you make this same argument well over the last two seasons? I don't think you can. RE: IMO Daniel Jones will be the starting QB for the Giants in 2022 In comment 15468599 arniefez said: Quote: because he is owed 8 million against the cap and they only save 200K if they cut him. I hope there is a mid round draft pick or a better journeyman free agent than Glennon to take over for him before he ruins another season. He'll be the starting QB in 2022 because it's what make sense. You're such a blowhard.

In what world does keeping poor players in starting positions make sense?

slate. The fact that a guy with connections to the team is reporting that 'Judge is safe' means its coming from someone. Mara is still going to be pulling strings. We're screwed

If the team evaluates the player as poor then most likely he will be gone. That said there are salary cap implications that would keep a player on a roster that would not otherwise be on it. Also keeping below average (not necessarily poor) players as depth is common practice.

So I guess that would be a world. One with salary cap implications or no clear upgrade.

hire or fire is the General Manager.
The GM should have the power to hire and fire any one he pleases including Chris Mara and Abrams.

And force a coach into him. Also seems pretty clear that JJ had a lot of pull in personnel decisions...so he’s just as responsible for the ingredients in this shit stew that he has to work with.

I think Abrams is actually going to be the next GM. Not saying it’s right, but it seems likely if they are sticking with Judge. Unless it’s a guy he’s worked with like Ziegler/Ossenfort.

That Jones does not want to throw contested balls. He has PTSD from all of his early career turnovers. Obviously Garrett And judge have been telling him to throw the ball to our Playmakers. He just doesnt do it....

In comment 15468927 cpgiants said:

Quote:

That Jones does not want to throw contested balls. He has PTSD from all of his early career turnovers. Obviously Garrett And judge have been telling him to throw the ball to our Playmakers. He just doesnt do it....

If that’s the case then it is valuable information that will aid in making an informed decision. So theres no downside?

In comment 15468856 Ned In Atlanta said:

Quote:

slate. The fact that a guy with connections to the team is reporting that 'Judge is safe' means its coming from someone. Mara is still going to be pulling strings. We're screwed

I doubt there's a single NFL team who's owner doesn't retain hiring and firing prerogatives for the head coach position. It'd be downright odd if Mara wasn't pulling the strings here.

the question is not so much whether he's earned that privilege, it's who's going to shake loose in free agency or be available in the draft that will clearly be a better alternative.

If Judge's job is going to on the line next season, is he really going to want to roll the dice on someone unproven.

In comment 15468954 BlackLight said:

Quote:

the question is not so much whether he's earned that privilege, it's who's going to shake loose in free agency or be available in the draft that will clearly be a better alternative. If Judge's job is going to on the line next season, is he really going to want to roll the dice on someone unproven.

He's rolling the dice with an unproven guy as we speak.

Actually, there's a good argument that Jones has proven what he is.

In comment 15468475 trueblueinpw said:

Quote:

Everyone on Judges staff was telling Garrett to throw the ball to Golladay and use Toney and all sorts of other things. But Garrett just did what ever he wanted to do? We’re all supposed to believe that Joe Judge and all the other coaches on his staff were being ignored by Jason Garrett? And this is supposed to make us feel better about Joe Judge the “CEO type” head coach that no one listens to? Got it. And Gettleman still has confidence in Judge? Or is it Mara that still has confidence in Judge? What a pure shit show the Giants are.

Spot on here. And don’t forget Judge said last week he doesn’t point fingers and that it’s all on him. Except when he wants to fire and load up all the blame on the OC who works under him.

Judge is a clown and this franchise has become a joke.

In comment 15468955 Go Terps said:

Quote:

In comment 15468954 BlackLight said: Quote: the question is not so much whether he's earned that privilege, it's who's going to shake loose in free agency or be available in the draft that will clearly be a better alternative. If Judge's job is going to on the line next season, is he really going to want to roll the dice on someone unproven. He's rolling the dice with an unproven guy as we speak. Actually, there's a good argument that Jones has proven what he is.

I’m with you on Jones. If anyone has been on the fence, his decision making the past couple of games should have opened a bunch of eyes. However, I am irrationally intrigued by how the game plays out today. Not that I’m expecting an overhaul of the offense, that’s impossible at this point. We all know it’s still going to be Garrett’s shitty playbook. But Judge and company have been expressing all week that they need to be more aggressive and get the ball in their playmakers hands. So let’s see it. Even though it’s the same playbook they can scheme things in within that system. I want to see how Jones reacts. While I do think Jones has major issues, today will will get a small glimpse into whether the issues are all in his own head or if Garrett was so obsessed with not turning the ball over that he was instructing Jones incessantly to not take chances downfield to the point it took away all of his aggressiveness.

I’m expecting the same ole same ole. Mostly because I don’t think Jones is any good when there’s the slightest bit of pressure. It’s up to Jones, Judge and Kitchens to prove me wrong. Garrett was dreadful. He’s gone. Jones is out of excuses as far as I’m concerned. Go out and show us.

In comment 15468563 Sean said:

Quote:

If Judge is retained, I think he’ll demand a new QB & don’t see Jones getting a THIRD head coach here.

Denver was high on Jones and Shurmur is the OC there. So maybe there is a trade to be had.......

Jones puts up a few touchdowns with his arm and legs, and half of this fan board would go right back to being in his camp. Or at least still thinking he "might" be the right guy.

In comment 15469016 NYGgolfer said:

Quote:

Jones puts up a few touchdowns with his arm and legs, and half of this fan board would go right back to being in his camp. Or at least still thinking he "might" be the right guy.

Maybe. Let’s see him do it. Hell, I’ve defended him in the past too. And every time I do he goes out and plays like ass in a game that we all say he needs to show us he’s the guy. Go out there and beat the Eagles and look like he belongs. Give us something to debate. Until he does, based on what we’ve seen there isn’t really much to debate.

In comment 15469021 BigBlueShock said:

Quote:

In comment 15469016 NYGgolfer said: Quote: Jones puts up a few touchdowns with his arm and legs, and half of this fan board would go right back to being in his camp. Or at least still thinking he "might" be the right guy. Maybe. Let’s see him do it. Hell, I’ve defended him in the past too. And every time I do he goes out and plays like ass in a game that we all say he needs to show us he’s the guy. Go out there and beat the Eagles and look like he belongs. Give us something to debate. Until he does, based on what we’ve seen there isn’t really much to debate.

It would be great if Jones did play well and lead the team to a win.

Only suggesting fan conclusions bounce around like ping pong balls regarding this topic each week versus looking at the overall body of work from the 2.5 years.

According to this report, Garrett wasn’t listening to what Judge instructed? Or flat out going rouge against the predetermined game plan? Or does Judge have zero to do with the offense.

I understand this is part of the PR game and deflecting blame for Judge. But how does this make him look good?

In comment 15469036 TyreeHelmet said:

Quote:

According to this report, Garrett wasn’t listening to what Judge instructed? Or flat out going rouge against the predetermined game plan? Or does Judge have zero to do with the offense. I understand this is part of the PR game and deflecting blame for Judge. But how does this make him look good?

So by your account, a coordinator should never be held accountable because he reports to the HC. How does this make sense? If you suck at your job, they aren’t going to fire your boss before they fire you.

It was Garrett’s job to put a productive product on the field. Judge may have had some say but if he’s calling all the shots, what the hell does he need a coordinator for?

Wanted him out after last season but was overruled according to this article. Take it for what it’s worth but it’s not hard to believe, they’ve never seemed to be on the same page from day one, imo.
Judge wanted Garrett out last year - ( New Window )

In comment 15468477 Spiciest Memelord said:

Quote:

when he's covered, he's open.

You can tell Daniel Jones all day that Golladay is open when he is covered and it may not matter. The QB has to *see* it and know how to throw to a contested catch receiver.

It seems Jones can't do either. You guys don't think Garrett knew they had to throw to KG? Give me a break. Jones couldn't do it. It's only easier to throw to a contested catch WR if you see him as open and know how to get the ball to him. Jones holds the ball forever and lacks the touch, accuracy and anticipation to get the ball to KG properly. remember when KG was yelling on the sideline? Now he's given up.

In comment 15468784 DonQuixote said:

Quote:

In comment 15468483 HomerJones45 said: Quote: The article is silly and Garafolo is doing his Jints PR machine role. They may have been yelling that but it was directed at the guy on the field with the ball in his hand-the quarterback. Except the OPs quote actually uses the name Jason, so either the quote is wrong or you are.

Thank for your input. Here is how you believe football is played at the professional level "Daniel, this play is designed for Kenny; you are to throw the ball to no one else."

Enjoy the Kool-Aid you are drinking..

In comment 15469053 BigBlueShock said:

Quote:

In comment 15469036 TyreeHelmet said: Quote: According to this report, Garrett wasn’t listening to what Judge instructed? Or flat out going rouge against the predetermined game plan? Or does Judge have zero to do with the offense. I understand this is part of the PR game and deflecting blame for Judge. But how does this make him look good? So by your account, a coordinator should never be held accountable because he reports to the HC. How does this make sense? If you suck at your job, they aren’t going to fire your boss before they fire you. It was Garrett’s job to put a productive product on the field. Judge may have had some say but if he’s calling all the shots, what the hell does he need a coordinator for?

Curious as to your opinion as to the duties of the Senior Offensive Assistant who is also a personal friend of the HC. Thanks in advance.

In comment 15469079 BigBlueShock said:

Quote:

Wanted him out after last season but was overruled according to this article. Take it for what it’s worth but it’s not hard to believe, they’ve never seemed to be on the same page from day one, imo. Judge wanted Garrett out last year - ( New Window )

Goes to show the biggest issue and concern we all need to worry about is ownership. Too much family meddling here, its truly become a late Al Davis like situation here.

Doesn’t give me much confidence we can win today. The coaches should be completely focused on getting every edge to beating a superior Eagles team. I doubt that sort of focus can exist in this environment.

The Giants have lived in this drama bullshit since the day everyone wet their pants over Mcadoo benching Manning.

I can’t wait until the Giants turn the corner and have a quality GM and head coach, who know their role and have the autonomy to do their jobs.

About putting their players in the best position to succeed but in reality are married to their system and often don’t know how to best use their weapons.

In comment 15469130 HomerJones45 said:

Quote:

In comment 15469053 BigBlueShock said: Quote: In comment 15469036 TyreeHelmet said: Quote: According to this report, Garrett wasn’t listening to what Judge instructed? Or flat out going rouge against the predetermined game plan? Or does Judge have zero to do with the offense. I understand this is part of the PR game and deflecting blame for Judge. But how does this make him look good? So by your account, a coordinator should never be held accountable because he reports to the HC. How does this make sense? If you suck at your job, they aren’t going to fire your boss before they fire you. It was Garrett’s job to put a productive product on the field. Judge may have had some say but if he’s calling all the shots, what the hell does he need a coordinator for? Curious as to your opinion as to the duties of the Senior Offensive Assistant who is also a personal friend of the HC. Thanks in advance.

Who the hell knows. I’m guessing he had his hands in every part of the offense. Helping with the OL, TE’s, RB’s, QBs etc. An extension of the HC. I don’t think he was dedicated to any one area and I damn sure know he wasn’t calling the plays. This also wasn’t his offensive system. It was Garrett’s.

Look, there is plenty of blame to go around. But it is incredibly baffling to me to see so many posters on here not think the OFFENSIVE COORDINATOR should be held responsible for the production of the offense. What a world we live in. So in your world, the OC gets all the credit if things are going great, resulting in HC opportunities and all the praise in the world. But if the results suck, eh, not his fault! Blame the GM, HC and every assistant on the team, but not the OC!

In comment 15469134 beatrixkiddo said:

Quote:

In comment 15469079 BigBlueShock said: Quote: Wanted him out after last season but was overruled according to this article. Take it for what it’s worth but it’s not hard to believe, they’ve never seemed to be on the same page from day one, imo. Judge wanted Garrett out last year - ( New Window ) Goes to show the biggest issue and concern we all need to worry about is ownership. Too much family meddling here, its truly become a late Al Davis like situation here.

The man who saved this organization had a simple philosophy: "Owners, own; managers, manage; coaches coach and scouts scout.” Owner is doing more than just owning, and it has wasted a decade of football. And counting!

In comment 15469162 joeinpa said:

Quote:

About putting their players in the best position to succeed but in reality are married to their system and often don’t know how to best use their weapons.

And here comes the guy playing Dixieland Jazz on the poop deck of the Titanic.

This meme that a guy who played qb in the NFL, served as an O Coordinator for 5 years and a HC for a playoff team somehow does not know his profession is ludicrous - and the same happy horseshit that deprived us of one of the most innovative minds on offense in the NFL in favor of a buffoon whose claim to fame was apparently getting coffee for Aaron Rodgers.

The Cowboys were annually in or near the top 10 in passing yards per attempt and never cracked the top 10 in rushing attempts save for one season until Elliot got there in 2016. Oh yeah, and hang the turnovers- we were the beneficiary of that philosophy in 2007 if you will recall.

So ask yourself: if a guy with a proven track record of "no risk it- no biscuit" is not doing so here, should we ask the reason. Nah, let's just go with the meme.