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NFT: Mets have offered Scherzer $40 mil+

CMicks3110 : 11/28/2021 8:34 pm
Andy Martino
@martinonyc
·
18m
Sources: Mets have offered Scherzer more than $40 million per year. Length unknown. Doesn’t mean he’ll sign there; that’s still unclear.
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RE: for anyone who hasn't listed to Eppler's WFAN interview yesterday it's  
Dennis : 12/2/2021 6:21 pm : link
In comment 15477129 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
pretty solid. 2 most interesting things:

1. the #1 thing he wanted a commitment from Cohen on was the ability to build the culture across every level of the FO from the top down "to do things the right way not the easy way". Talked about how important it is to support the people in the organization and help them grow their careers with the resources they need to succeed, etc.

2. sort of goes hand in had with #1, but said Cohen has basically told him that he can have whatever resources he needs for anything as long as he can make the case for how it helps the team win. whether it's FO, staffing, spending on players, etc. Cohen will invest in whatever they can make a case for. Mets GM Billy Eppler talks Max Scherzer, manager search with Carton and Roberts - ( New Window )


Eppler:

“We can be opportunistic,” Eppler said. “We still have some rom here to do that…that kind of shows that Steve and Alex’s commitment to putting a great team on the field and giving us the resources,..."
opportunistic is a great approach  
Eric on Li : 12/2/2021 6:24 pm : link
is there a chance that bryant/rodon/whoever has a huge year next year and makes it look obvious in hindsight that they should have been aggressive for them now? Sure.

but I think at this point the most sensible path is making lower risk deals - which could still be 1 of those guys if their markets are soft, or it could be someone else. the only item i'd get super aggressive about if it's possible is a true top of rotation arm which is basically just castillo so i dont think that's all that realistic no matter how aggressive they get.
RE: opportunistic is a great approach  
Dennis : 12/2/2021 6:28 pm : link
In comment 15477403 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
is there a chance that bryant/rodon/whoever has a huge year next year and makes it look obvious in hindsight that they should have been aggressive for them now? Sure.

but I think at this point the most sensible path is making lower risk deals - which could still be 1 of those guys if their markets are soft, or it could be someone else. the only item i'd get super aggressive about if it's possible is a true top of rotation arm which is basically just castillo so i dont think that's all that realistic no matter how aggressive they get.


Eric, thanks for posting a link to that interview. He said what I hoped he would say, that they're opportunistic, and if I'm reading him right, maybe they're still not finished.
they definitely don't seem finished and that's the 2nd interview  
Eric on Li : 12/2/2021 6:34 pm : link
eppler joined where he commented that immediately prior he was talking about a trade with another club.

i think Dan's speculation is on the money and they are angling for 1 of the 6 SP available from CIN/OAK.

Rodon would be a fun guy to sign but he comes with a lot of risks so the type of SP they need is likely only available on the trade market.
RE: RE: opportunistic is a great approach  
Dennis : 12/2/2021 6:37 pm : link
In comment 15477407 Dennis said:
Quote:
In comment 15477403 Eric on Li said:


Quote:


is there a chance that bryant/rodon/whoever has a huge year next year and makes it look obvious in hindsight that they should have been aggressive for them now? Sure.

but I think at this point the most sensible path is making lower risk deals - which could still be 1 of those guys if their markets are soft, or it could be someone else. the only item i'd get super aggressive about if it's possible is a true top of rotation arm which is basically just castillo so i dont think that's all that realistic no matter how aggressive they get.



Eric, thanks for posting a link to that interview. He said what I hoped he would say, that they're opportunistic, and if I'm reading him right, maybe they're still not finished.


Thanks again, Eric. Your point is well taken, that anything further may come via a trade; and they have some pieces with which to facilitate that.
ex Oriole  
pjcas18 : 12/3/2021 9:30 am : link
Adam Jones is a fan of Buck Showalter:

Buck seems to be the popular choice  
Eric on Li : 12/3/2021 10:04 am : link
I think it's the right fit at the right time and would be kind of surprised if it doesn't happen since he's also got a lot of shared history with Eppler.

fringe benefit is that he's old enough you might be able to attract a really high quality young bench coach on the idea that they could be the manager of the future.

I'm still shocked that Buck is only 65 though. I think it's equal parts that he predated Torre (who's 81) and his seinfeld ep was early enough that the yankees were still kind of a punchline. both seem like ancient history.
here's a puzzle piece that many have connected and could impact NYM  
Eric on Li : 12/3/2021 10:17 am : link
This is from Rosenthal today:

Quote:
Freddie and Matt, Matt and Freddie

The trade destination for A’s first baseman Matt Olson very well could be tied to the outcome of Freddie Freeman’s free agency. Olson is a native of Lilburn, Ga., a suburb of Atlanta. He likely would be the Braves’ No. 1 target if Freeman departs for the Yankees or Dodgers, the teams believed to be most interested in him. The A’s, though, will be in a position of great leverage, drawing interest in Olson not just from clubs that miss out on Freeman, but others as well.

It hardly qualifies as news that the Braves explored first-base alternatives such as Olson and free agent Anthony Rizzo in November while Freeman lingered on the open market; Freeman, at the moment, is not a member of their team. Braves president of baseball operations Alex Anthopoulos needs to do his due diligence, and make sure he can react quickly the moment he senses Freeman might depart.

Olson, who will play next season at 28 and is under club control through 2023, would seem almost an ideal replacement, if necessary. He had more home runs than Freeman (39 to 31) and a higher OPS-plus (153 to 133) last season, and also won Gold Gloves at first in 2018 and ’19. Of course, Olson does not have the same history with the Braves that Freeman does, and would cost the team top prospects, as opposed to just money.

Most of the industry still expects Freeman to stay with the Braves. Yet, his return no longer can be viewed as inevitable. One rival executive says the fact Freeman remains unsigned is a “slap in the face,” considering that he is a homegrown talent who won the NL MVP in 2020 and helped the team win the World Series in ’21. For Freeman, a native of Orange County, Ca., the Dodgers (or Angels) would appear a more natural fit than the Yankees. But just as the Braves are envisioning how they might replace him, he surely is envisioning what it might be like playing for a team other than the Braves.

At this point, how can he not be?


Freeman is from Socal (just south of LA) so I'd guess the LAD are the bigger threat, especially if they and the Yankees together bid each other up way beyond ATL.

Then if the A's deal Olson to whoever misses out that opens up a destination for Dom Smith. 3 years of him and some $ savings for 1 of their pitchers seems like a good fit and we know the 2 organizations have a lot of familiarity with each other. Eppler was in that division so he's very familiar with them. Sandy was in their organization for a couple years. Similar to Canha it may be that they have a stronger appreciation for one of their guys than others do. I like Dom but he's a replaceable piece. There are a lot of other options to backup 1b and COF, and they can likely sign a stronger LH DH (like Schwarber).
From Martino  
pjcas18 : 12/3/2021 5:53 pm : link
list of preliminary managerial candidates (link to full article below):

Quote:
...Through league sources, we were able to assemble most of the team’s preliminary list. The team has discussed other names internally, so additional candidates could yet emerge.

To be clear, this is not the list of people who the Mets have contacted or will definitely interview; it’s the list of people in whom the Mets have some level of preliminary interest:

Houston Astros bench coach Joe Espada
Veteran manager Buck Showalter
Tampa Bay bench coach Matt Quatraro
Pittsburgh bench coach Don Kelly
Former Tigers and Angels manager Brad Ausmus...

link - ( New Window )
RE: One  
DanMetroMan : 12/3/2021 7:15 pm : link
In comment 15476023 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
name I'm curious about as a potential manager (hold off on the "I don't want a first time manager") simply names that haven't been one...Don Kelly sounds like a very interesting candidate. FO experience, recently an explayer, went from player in 2016, to scout 2017, 1b coach, then bench coach... quite the quick rise.


Maybe Cohen should give me a job lol
.  
DanMetroMan : 12/3/2021 7:49 pm : link
Per @longenhagen Baty struggled with the bat in the AFL. " I’m actually leaving my Fall League look at Baty with more skepticism than I entered it. Really struggling to get the bat head out there and hit velo. "
.  
DanMetroMan : 12/3/2021 8:34 pm : link
I'm not as "Buck or bust" as many Mets fans but his age should be a non-factor. 7 managers were 60+ in 2021 including the managers of both WS teams. 12 managers were 55+
RE: .  
Eric on Li : 12/3/2021 10:17 pm : link
In comment 15478524 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
I'm not as "Buck or bust" as many Mets fans but his age should be a non-factor. 7 managers were 60+ in 2021 including the managers of both WS teams. 12 managers were 55+


100%. There are older coaches/managers in every sport. Trader Jack was like 80 when the Marlins won.

it seems like a strong list of guys they are talking to so doesn't seem like they can go wrong, but I do think Buck seems like the best all around fit. Eppler keeps talking about characteristics the team needs and my list would start with culture, leadership, stability, accountability. Buck stands out in those areas. His experience both in NY and generally being a successful manager in several different places also stands out.
Granderson  
DanMetroMan : 12/3/2021 10:29 pm : link
a candidate per Robert Murray. Interesting.
RE: Granderson  
Eric on Li : 12/3/2021 10:37 pm : link
In comment 15478648 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
a candidate per Robert Murray. Interesting.


wow very. he's the exact type of guy who would be a perfect bench coach under Buck. I wonder if they know each other from TV?
Makes sense  
moespree : 12/3/2021 10:39 pm : link
There's a connection at almost every level. Alderson signed him, Eppler was with the Yankees during his time there.

Well thought of, smart professional guy. Handled the media very well in both NY stops. Definitely makes sense.
Mayer says he doesn't think he or Wright are in serious consideration  
Eric on Li : 12/3/2021 10:39 pm : link
Quote:
Michael Mayer @mikemayer22
2m
I was told Granderson was on the list earlier today, along with David Wright. But I don’t believe either of them are in serious consideration.

Like Eppler said, it’s was initially a “wide list”.


I could see either one as a bench coach. Crazy that the only guy on the current roster either of them probably played with is JDG. Maybe Lugo or Familia (if he ends up back)?
RE: RE: Granderson  
DanMetroMan : 12/3/2021 10:42 pm : link
In comment 15478657 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
In comment 15478648 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


a candidate per Robert Murray. Interesting.



wow very. he's the exact type of guy who would be a perfect bench coach under Buck. I wonder if they know each other from TV?


This would be a managerial candidate per Heyman, Murray and Mike Mayer.
Heyman and other picking it up now too  
pjcas18 : 12/3/2021 10:44 pm : link
Jon Heyman
@JonHeyman
· 11m
Curtis Granderson is on the Mets list of candidates for manager. The former Mets and Yankees star is now president of the Players Alliance. Was with Yankees when Billy Eppler was GM and Sandy Alderson signed him for the Mets. @ByRobertMurray 1st mentioned


J-Rod
@OfficialJohnRod
·
6m
Very Accurate. I was told days ago about Curtis Granderson being a Top Candidate for the @Mets
Manager Job indeed. Id be surprised if hes not a Finalist for the Managerial Gig. #Mets
Surprised  
DanMetroMan : 12/3/2021 10:45 pm : link
if he's not a finalist? They haven't conducted a single interview yet lol
RE: Mayer says he doesn't think he or Wright are in serious consideration  
pjcas18 : 12/3/2021 10:46 pm : link
In comment 15478660 Eric on Li said:
Quote:


Quote:


Michael Mayer @mikemayer22
2m
I was told Granderson was on the list earlier today, along with David Wright. But I don’t believe either of them are in serious consideration.

Like Eppler said, it’s was initially a “wide list”.



I could see either one as a bench coach. Crazy that the only guy on the current roster either of them probably played with is JDG. Maybe Lugo or Familia (if he ends up back)?


Nimmo too
.  
DanMetroMan : 12/3/2021 10:49 pm : link
Things change but as recently as February, Wright was said to be willing to return to a job in the organization but only in a part-time role
good call  
Eric on Li : 12/3/2021 10:50 pm : link
crazy how quick the roster turned over. feels like just yesterday wright was throwing syndergaard's lunch in the trash.
RE: .  
Eric on Li : 12/3/2021 10:52 pm : link
In comment 15478670 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
Things change but as recently as February, Wright was said to be willing to return to a job in the organization but only in a part-time role


based on nothing but gut I dont think he's a serious candidate for the managing role or even the type to be a manager one day. Granderson seems more like a real managerial prospect for whatever reason.
Inexperience would be a concern  
moespree : 12/3/2021 10:54 pm : link
But I can see their thinking if they went for it with him. There is a lot of potential there for a guy like Curtis to be a good manager I would think. Very smart, even tempered man who I've never heard anyone ever say anything bad about. Already proven he can handle the market and the media with no issue.

I wouldn't hate it.

..  
DanMetroMan : 12/3/2021 10:57 pm : link

Pat Ragazzo
@ragazzoreport
·
1m
Can also confirm that David Wright is on the Mets’ wide list of managerial candidates but isn’t seen as a serious player for the job

Joe Espada and Buck Showalter are 2 names to watch in this


I have no clue regarding Granderson but Wright has long made clear he likes the idea of being involved but values his family time etc. I'm sure his leaving the organization was completely based on this. Should he ever return I suspect it wiill be again as an advisor and/or ST instructor
just my 2 cents but anyone who wants to be a great manager  
Eric on Li : 12/3/2021 10:57 pm : link
should have no problem being willing to start as a bench coach. If being a great manager is a long term goal you have to start towards that pursuit somewhere and it will only make you a better more qualified manager/managerial candidate. Especially under a guy who has been manager of the year multiple times.
could 100% see this  
Eric on Li : 12/3/2021 10:58 pm : link
In comment 15478681 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:

Should he ever return I suspect it wiill be again as an advisor and/or ST instructor


ST instructor just seems to fit his personality, sort of like Piazza.
If  
DanMetroMan : 12/3/2021 11:00 pm : link
Eppler is anything like Cashman, my guess is Espada would be the favorite. Known for his ability (in part) to process the numbers and suggestions of the FO, strong communicator, yes, allows for collaboration with the FO (which is the norm now), Espada was actually a player when Sandy was in Oakland.
listening to Eppler he mentions stick michael a lot more than anyone  
Eric on Li : 12/3/2021 11:15 pm : link
Which makes sense given his scouting background and the fact that he was a literal living legend. Buck literally came up through the yankees system promoted all the way through the big seat by Stick until Buck had his run in with big george.

Eppler was in NY obviously for a few years of Torre and then the hiring of Girardi (who had the 1 year managing FLA and won manager of the year).

At LAA he inherited Sciocsa but then made a very Girardi-esque hire with Ausmus.

Then Buck was a runner up to Maddon and some of the rumors were that Eppler preferred Buck.

He's been around all experienced managers and honestly most of them have done a pretty good job (Torre, Girardi, Sciocsa managed the 2 best years in LAA). And Sandy's last first timer hire obviously went real poorly.

So I think any first timer is going to have to really knock their socks off.
Martino chimes in on Granderson  
Eric on Li : 12/3/2021 11:17 pm : link
Quote:
Andy Martino
@martinonyc
Curtis Granderson’s name came up in an internal Mets discussion about managerial possibilities because he is so highly respected — but he is not expected to interview. Mets feel they need someone in that job with more experience.
.  
pjcas18 : 12/4/2021 8:57 am : link
Jack Ramsey
@jackwramsey
·
13h
FanGraphs seemingly updated their Top 100 Prospects:
#5 C. Francisco Álvarez
#14 3B Brett Baty
#24 SS Ronny Mauricio
#56 RHP Matt Allan
RE: .  
Eric on Li : 12/4/2021 10:58 am : link
In comment 15478775 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
Jack Ramsey
@jackwramsey
·
13h
FanGraphs seemingly updated their Top 100 Prospects:
#5 C. Francisco Álvarez
#14 3B Brett Baty
#24 SS Ronny Mauricio
#56 RHP Matt Allan


With this update their org rankings board also updated (linked below) which imo is the most interesting of all the prospect rankings because they value the farm systems based on the overall $ value they attribute to the gradable prospect groups based on their ratings.

They have the Mets org:
15th overall in total value of prospects (209m)
3rd to last in total number of gradeable prospects (29)
2nd best in average value per prospect (7.2m per prospect)

so the top of the system is well above average and bottom well below.

of note the values of the top players are:
$55m - Alvarez (60 grade)
$46m - Baty + Mauricio (55 grade)
$21m - Allan (50 grade)
$6m/4m - Vientos, Ginn, Lee (45 grade)
(ramirez 40+ and plummer 40 would be next but plummer isn't listed in mets system)

some notable 40+ former mets (may be missing a few):
$21m - SWR (50 grade)
$6m - PCA (45 grade)
$3m - Wolf (40+ grade)
$2m - Greene (40 grade)
$2m - Valdez (40 grade)

if you added the former mets to the current mets the system would be top 10 and the count of gradeable prospects would still be a little below average but less so.

Some notable recent graduates Kelenic (60 grade, $55m), Megill (40 grade, $2m), and Gimenez (50 grade, $28m).

Bottomline Tramuta/Tanous have done a really good job identifying quality prospects so with all the draft capital they are set to have next year the system has a chance to get up to the top 10 since it's unlikely any of the top 4 graduate in 2022. Believe I saw recent estimate that had them 3rd in current bonus pool with the chance to end up 2nd if they get the extra pick from Conforto signing elsewhere.

Will be interesting to see if they take a top heavy approach and go for 2 or 3 stars (sort of like the Baty/Wolf/Allan group in 2019) or more of a quantity approach with 6 top 100 picks. Slot value for those 6 will likely average 1.5m per pick, which is close to the bonus amounts they paid SWR + Vientos as 2nd round picks. Preferable to add 6 players projected in the 45-50 grade range or 2 or 3 50+? In a vacuum i think i'd go quality > quantity but if you told me they could add 5+ SWR/Vientos' next year that's pretty appealing.
fangraphs org rankings - ( New Window )
Apparently  
DanMetroMan : 12/4/2021 11:59 am : link
both Wright and Granderson have indicated they are not interested in managing.
I know some people  
pjcas18 : 12/4/2021 12:05 pm : link
don't want a first time manager, but I'd pivot back to Beltran.

I don't hate any of the names mentioned, but I really like how Beltran thinks the game (other than taking a curve ball for strike three)
RE: I know some people  
DanMetroMan : 12/4/2021 1:04 pm : link
In comment 15478919 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
don't want a first time manager, but I'd pivot back to Beltran.

I don't hate any of the names mentioned, but I really like how Beltran thinks the game (other than taking a curve ball for strike three)


I hate one of the names mentioned... Larry Bowa? Really? lol
Not  
DanMetroMan : 12/4/2021 1:05 pm : link
knocking the Mets, rather Heyman suggesting Larry Bowa might be a candidate.
RE: RE: .  
Mike in NY : 12/4/2021 1:52 pm : link
In comment 15478862 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
In comment 15478775 pjcas18 said:


Quote:


Jack Ramsey
@jackwramsey
·
13h
FanGraphs seemingly updated their Top 100 Prospects:
#5 C. Francisco Álvarez
#14 3B Brett Baty
#24 SS Ronny Mauricio
#56 RHP Matt Allan



With this update their org rankings board also updated (linked below) which imo is the most interesting of all the prospect rankings because they value the farm systems based on the overall $ value they attribute to the gradable prospect groups based on their ratings.

They have the Mets org:
15th overall in total value of prospects (209m)
3rd to last in total number of gradeable prospects (29)
2nd best in average value per prospect (7.2m per prospect)

so the top of the system is well above average and bottom well below.

of note the values of the top players are:
$55m - Alvarez (60 grade)
$46m - Baty + Mauricio (55 grade)
$21m - Allan (50 grade)
$6m/4m - Vientos, Ginn, Lee (45 grade)
(ramirez 40+ and plummer 40 would be next but plummer isn't listed in mets system)

some notable 40+ former mets (may be missing a few):
$21m - SWR (50 grade)
$6m - PCA (45 grade)
$3m - Wolf (40+ grade)
$2m - Greene (40 grade)
$2m - Valdez (40 grade)

if you added the former mets to the current mets the system would be top 10 and the count of gradeable prospects would still be a little below average but less so.

Some notable recent graduates Kelenic (60 grade, $55m), Megill (40 grade, $2m), and Gimenez (50 grade, $28m).

Bottomline Tramuta/Tanous have done a really good job identifying quality prospects so with all the draft capital they are set to have next year the system has a chance to get up to the top 10 since it's unlikely any of the top 4 graduate in 2022. Believe I saw recent estimate that had them 3rd in current bonus pool with the chance to end up 2nd if they get the extra pick from Conforto signing elsewhere.

Will be interesting to see if they take a top heavy approach and go for 2 or 3 stars (sort of like the Baty/Wolf/Allan group in 2019) or more of a quantity approach with 6 top 100 picks. Slot value for those 6 will likely average 1.5m per pick, which is close to the bonus amounts they paid SWR + Vientos as 2nd round picks. Preferable to add 6 players projected in the 45-50 grade range or 2 or 3 50+? In a vacuum i think i'd go quality > quantity but if you told me they could add 5+ SWR/Vientos' next year that's pretty appealing. fangraphs org rankings - ( New Window )


My feeling is quality > quantity if there is a significant difference between BPA and BPA that is signable until you have used up your pool. I will always take the option of tanking picks in the 8th through 10th rounds to draft BPA. As you start requiring higher picks to tank, I would need to see a much higher difference between BPA and BPA Signable. That was my concern about drafting Ginn. I thought it required too many picks to be tanked for someone I did not have as much better than signable options. On the other had, Allan was by far BPA. In 2021 Draft, even without knowing about Rocker's medicals, I thought Watson and House were at least on same tier as Rocker and would have gone for either of them rather than opening the bank for Rocker.
Agree Rocker was exciting but I think there’s a better use of $  
Eric on Li : 12/4/2021 2:58 pm : link
Baty and Kelenic were under slot picks. Give me a solid 45+ grade HS position player with a plus hit tool and far fewer injury risks than any P, and even better if they come with the extra slot room to go over for a high upside arm later.

The current scouting group has proven they are really strong with that profile. I’m not sure Nimmo or Dom ever graded over 45/50 but they obviously worked out and Kelenic/Baty have. Cecchini was the only bust but I think he was closer to being a big leaguer than most. Just needed a little more d or a little more hit. The bigger miss was his intangibles bc they seemed to bury him quick a few times when they could have given him a longer look if they liked him. So I assume they didn’t like something about him.
RE: RE: I know some people  
pjcas18 : 12/4/2021 4:39 pm : link
In comment 15478973 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
In comment 15478919 pjcas18 said:


Quote:


don't want a first time manager, but I'd pivot back to Beltran.

I don't hate any of the names mentioned, but I really like how Beltran thinks the game (other than taking a curve ball for strike three)



I hate one of the names mentioned... Larry Bowa? Really? lol


I had not heard Bowa mentioned, I would not be a fan of him as manager.
RE: RE: RE: I know some people  
DanMetroMan : 12/4/2021 4:47 pm : link
In comment 15479244 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
In comment 15478973 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


In comment 15478919 pjcas18 said:


Quote:


don't want a first time manager, but I'd pivot back to Beltran.

I don't hate any of the names mentioned, but I really like how Beltran thinks the game (other than taking a curve ball for strike three)



I hate one of the names mentioned... Larry Bowa? Really? lol



I had not heard Bowa mentioned, I would not be a fan of him as manager.


Heyman mentioned him as a candidate
The analysis  
pjcas18 : 12/4/2021 5:04 pm : link
will not be complete until we see where Rocker goes in this draft and how his career turns out.

So it will be a while, but hard to spin that as anything but a fuck up IMO.

Even if the Mets get a player who turns out better than Rocker in this draft.
RE: The analysis  
Eric on Li : 12/4/2021 5:27 pm : link
In comment 15479280 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
will not be complete until we see where Rocker goes in this draft and how his career turns out.

So it will be a while, but hard to spin that as anything but a fuck up IMO.

Even if the Mets get a player who turns out better than Rocker in this draft.


They get the exact same pick and slot value so Rocker vs. whoever they pick in 22 is imo no different than any other player x vs. player y draft discussion. 1 will end up better than the other but that's just the nature of drafting, not necessarily a fuck up if Rocker ends up better or brilliant strategy if it's the other guy. the NYM scouts have been strong and in either instance they are going to take whoever they like best and cross fingers.

The fuck up was losing the wasted bonus pool saved on the other guys they signed under slot.

but:

1. picking Rocker because they liked him a lot
2. letting him go because they were worried about his medicals that they didn't have access to prior to selection

are both acceptable decisions.

They gave JT Ginn $3m even though he needed TJS so presumably there was something significant to pass on Rocker without negotiating when they clearly liked him a lot prior to the medicals.
If Rocker  
pjcas18 : 12/4/2021 5:38 pm : link
gets picked this year, shows no health issues, and goes on and has a good major league career, no idea how you can do anything but see the Mets look bad.

If he doesn't and his injury proves to be what the Mets thought then the Mets were right, which is why I said the analysis of the Rocker pick is TBD.

However I thought in the latest CBA (2016) they allowed for pre-draft medicals.
RE: If Rocker  
Mike in NY : 12/4/2021 5:46 pm : link
In comment 15479336 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
gets picked this year, shows no health issues, and goes on and has a good major league career, no idea how you can do anything but see the Mets look bad.

If he doesn't and his injury proves to be what the Mets thought then the Mets were right, which is why I said the analysis of the Rocker pick is TBD.

However I thought in the latest CBA (2016) they allowed for pre-draft medicals.


Pre-draft medicals are optional. If you submit to MLB's centralized doctors a team has to offer I believe 40% of slot in order to receive a compensatory pick if eligible. If they don't submit, a team can offer no signing bonus and receive a compensatory pick if eligible.
submitting medical to teams is voluntary for the players/agents  
Eric on Li : 12/4/2021 5:51 pm : link
boras and rocker chose not to. I'm not sure if that's a Boras policy for all his clients or something he and his clients decide case by case.

Quote:
As part of the new CBA, the top 50 pitching prospects in each year's draft will now be able to volunteer for MRIs to provide clarity about their health.


hopefully something they fix in the new cba because it's just a bad situation for both parties. Rocker has to wait a full year before getting a SB and is probably going to fall no matter what.

when the Mets were on the clock they obviously loved Rocker so they picked him.

im sure everyone involved preferred to not have their doctors find something once they got to the physical.

once they did though they didn't even make him an offer. the doctors may be right or wrong but that doesn't seem like what would happen if they didn't see a lot of risk. especially considering they'd already said they weren't planning on having him throw any more innings last summer.
There's good and bad with the MLB's new voluntary MRI program for draft prospects - ( New Window )
Now  
pjcas18 : 12/4/2021 6:05 pm : link
all of a sudden you trust the Mets doctors got something right?
Good point here I think  
pjcas18 : 12/4/2021 6:53 pm : link

Tim Healey
@timbhealey
· 10m
Mets executives won’t say that they had a clubhouse character problem last season. But they do admit they want to improve in that area next season.

Story: https://nwsdy.li/3lvscLR


Joe DeMayo
@PSLToFlushing
·
1m
I don’t believe it is a coincidence that the Mets haven’t brought back a single one of their pending free agents as of yet. And they may not at all.
RE: Now  
Eric on Li : 12/4/2021 7:01 pm : link
In comment 15479395 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
all of a sudden you trust the Mets doctors got something right?


Your memory isn’t what you think it is.

I’ve never once questioned the HSS drs ability to read an MRI (I was 1 of the only ones who said there was zero chance they were lying about JDGs elbow being structurally sound).

The Mets decisions on player performance (rehab assignments, workload management, etc) are a totally different thing, and where they’ve most struggled. The HSS isn’t why Carrasco didn’t do any rehab starts in the minors before debuting.
RE: RE: Now  
pjcas18 : 12/5/2021 8:35 am : link
In comment 15479530 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
In comment 15479395 pjcas18 said:


Quote:


all of a sudden you trust the Mets doctors got something right?



Your memory isn’t what you think it is.

I’ve never once questioned the HSS drs ability to read an MRI (I was 1 of the only ones who said there was zero chance they were lying about JDGs elbow being structurally sound).

The Mets decisions on player performance (rehab assignments, workload management, etc) are a totally different thing, and where they’ve most struggled. The HSS isn’t why Carrasco didn’t do any rehab starts in the minors before debuting.


You're the one who said regardless of what the medicals came back as you would rest players longer what the Mets did or leaked they planned to, you question the medical approach for players like Syndergaard and Carrasco (the two most recent who come to mind) constantly even to suggest it led to their re-injury/delayed return.

Yet, you're convinced these same doctors got Rocker right?
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