before Henry's injury Jones would be fine. In a system that isn't heavy dose of pounding run and play action Jones leaves a lot of points on the field.
I am in category B but, I do think he can play in the right system. But, if that system falters (ie Henry getting hurt) you have a lesser Tannehill.
This. Any other answer is just being stubborn. Just look at the run game. Are there any holes? Do teams respect play action? Does this line block at all? How are the health of the skill players. Jason Garrett was awful. But it’s all Jones fault.
No other QB outside Rodgers and maybe mahomes does anything with this team. Everyone’s love child Herbert would struggle just as much if not more because he doesn’t have the pocket mobility of jones who is excellent at avoiding the first rusher which is another things fans dismisss. Give the kid a chance before you dismiss him so quickly. He gets another year and possibly the fifth year. Get him 2 offensive lineman in the draft. Shore up the line a bit get a run game going and watch the kid work.
he hasn't elevated whats around him like eli did. Well - eli wasnt all that great the first couple of years either. Consistency, building a line, defense, run game to aid play action all helped.
Look around the league - the guys with the tools to succeed and consistency are winning. Those without... aren't.
The team has no Dline, no Oline, no run game, no TE, and suspect offensive coaching AT BEST and we want to run this kid out of here?
How ISN'T it A because he can't be fairly evaluated?!
What happened to the rookie QB who was dropping dimes and throwing
and overall talent and have a QB on a rookie QB. Hopefully they have a much more favorable situation.
The complication is who is selecting and coaching that QB. If it is Judge, Mara has to be convinced that he has the right guy as it will be a long process for Judge to potentially go without the playoffs. With the decade of losing the heat will be on Mara to stay the course.
Jones still may develop but between not showing enough and then the injuries I don't think it is prudent to continue with him as he becomes expensive. I also think the Giants failed to give him the best opportunity.
It comes down to what Judge thinks of Jones and then what Mara thinks of Judge imv.
Anyone who says there is a better alternative reasonably available (trade, vet signing, draft, CFL, spring league, dropped out of the sky by a giant flying reptile, etc.) is simply not being realistic.
The kid still isn't all we want him to be, but by the same token, he's ahead of any reasonable alternative at this point. He shows leadership, has a good arm, is mobile, and is not a china doll or a head case. Remember, there was this guy named Simms that missed quite a lot of time when he was a young QB with the G-men and he turned out to be pretty good.
Then there's the fact that DJ STILL hasn't had a real chance with a decent line in front of him, solid supportig cast AND with a decent OC running the show. Remember, he did pretty well with Shurmur, but Shurmur was in the wrong job with the G-men.
Let him play. They have MUCH bigger problems elsewhere, starting with ownership and the front office.
I don't think he's proven he's the guy, but I don't want to ditch him for the sake of ditching him. If there is a QB they like in the draft, they should take him. If there is a worthwhile FA QB, they should bring him in. At the very least for competition. What I don't want is reaching for QB in the draft.
The only difference amongst any of us is the level of delusion.
It didn't have to take this long to arrive at this answer either.
Funny how some people are already saying next year is the make or break year, when it was commonly this year prior to the season. Gettleman even said so.
This team has so many offensive problems and the Giants won't be in a position to get a QB that is a substantial improvement. Giants would be far better off keeping Jones and using those picks to buff the line which would benefit any other QB in the future if they have to move on.
I don't see a QB they'll be able to attain that will be able to overcome the offensive issues this team has on the line and system-wise.
at least three productive games in a row leading the offense before we even get excited he is the guy?
Frankly, I could care less he had some biggames in his rookie year. Outside those games he was pedestrian or less.
In the present day we don't score TD's. He also seems to be most productive when he runs, and teams are on to that so they keep him contained. He is not really mobile to scramble and buy time to make throws even with his speed.
H just doesn't look good based on the eye test from my living room.
He gets another season? Maybe two? This is a league built for scoring,and the Giants dont.
Though he’ll probably get next year because of his contract. He isn’t the only reason the team is having a losing year again but he has limitations to his game
I don't like the other options out there, either. I'm a Corral fan (Ole Miss alumnus) but I don't see him as a fit with this particular team. And has anyone watched the 'best' upcoming FA available next year play, in Russell Wilson? Looks horrible and would cost a ton.
Not saying C, b/c DJ has disappointed in various areas, but I want to see him perform with a competent GM, a consistent OL and a generally better roster around him before I say he's not the guy.
DG's "full bloom love" nonsense and the high draft spot prejudice alot of people against DJ. With a half-way decent line, some competent WR's who aren't injured all the time and a TE who can catch, I could see his upside being in the Stafford, Flacco, Dalton range. He throws a good deep ball and he can run.
Was he so damaged by Garrett that he is now a Solid B per the above?
Is he reclamable?
Do we draft a QB and start over....with a new GM.....being smarter with the cap?
That version of Danny had no pocket awareness and was turnover prone. He would be clueless to the oncoming rush and either throw a beautiful dime or get strip sacked. He had no internal clock.
Now the current less turn over prone Danny is fully aware of his shitty oline, internal clock is messed up, and is making 1 read throws or running for his life.
What is the team identity? Defense and a running game - he could be the guy - think 49ers (they would love him). He can make the throws but don't use him to pass to win. I would still like to find a real winner at qb but don't make some crazy trade for wilson. maybe wait till 2023 to draft the next qb or take a flyer on a QB like Grayson McCall in round 2 or 3
Like it or not, DJ is here at least through the 2022 season. This is a weak QB class in the upcoming draft, and I think the team is at a point where they must build up the OL and ER; these have been an issue far too long. They have spent too much premium draft capital on the shinny sports cars when they should have been spending some on the bulldozers. Until they fix the OL they will not know what they have in the Offensive skilled players.
The team is awful.
They need their draft picks to fill a ton of holes.
They have no cap space.
The college QB class appears to be nothing special.
So the best option might be to continue down the "A" track, knowing that it probably leads to "B" but figuring there's not much to lose by holding out hope for "C".
It's been complete dysfunction the entire time he's been here. Even his rookie year, he played for a coach that got fired that season, and his OC was Mike fucking Shula. With the worst group of OL & Skill players in the NFL.
And now, this year, in his "make or break year" he is again surrounded by dysfunction, including an OC that is so bad you have to fire him midseason. (And apparently warranted getting fired last year too, but didn't.)
We can say Case Closed on Jones all we want, but we never gave him a chance, and likely David Carr'd him at this point. If he is David Carr'd.....it's B.
but man, he's had shit to work with. No OL. Revolving door of talent. Gutless playcalling. I hope DJ goes somewhere where he has a shot with a better cast and coaching staff.
Has had a rough year but we have won 3 out of 5 at that pace we will win another 4-5 maybe more as the schedule has gotten much easier..... and be in the dance
I'm A. I don't think many QB's would be successful behind this dumpster fire of an O-line. Let the next GM understand that the number one priority in the draft is to come away with at least three new starters on the OL. Even then we are counting on rookies to make the jump for improvement but I want to see what DJ can do with at least an improved running game and an extra 1.5 seconds in the pocket. If he can prove it after that I'll jump on the B bandwagon.
He hasn't had a fair shake. shitty oline, key contributors hurt etc.. but the one thing i've noticed is he doesn't rise above that and make the players around him better.
If he needs everything to be perfect, then he's only as good as a those components.
Eli carried the team 2011, we didn't have much of a running game for most of the year and the line was ok, but not great and on the decline. Eli made that team better, he took no name TEs and made them key contributors (Ballard and Pascoe). Granted he wasn't able to overcome the shitty oline in the later years, but not many could.
Could DJ even come close to what Eli did in 2011? I know one things for sure, he would have left candlestick in a body bag.
The nail in the coffin for me was the Bucs game. That INT to the dlineman was inexcusable. Teams know how to beat him and I think at this point he is what he is, a good athlete that doesn't have championship DNA.
It's not even close.
B.
I am in category B but, I do think he can play in the right system. But, if that system falters (ie Henry getting hurt) you have a lesser Tannehill.
Still needs more time, as in more time behind something other than the worst offensive line in the NFL.
This. Any other answer is just being stubborn. Just look at the run game. Are there any holes? Do teams respect play action? Does this line block at all? How are the health of the skill players. Jason Garrett was awful. But it’s all Jones fault.
No other QB outside Rodgers and maybe mahomes does anything with this team. Everyone’s love child Herbert would struggle just as much if not more because he doesn’t have the pocket mobility of jones who is excellent at avoiding the first rusher which is another things fans dismisss. Give the kid a chance before you dismiss him so quickly. He gets another year and possibly the fifth year. Get him 2 offensive lineman in the draft. Shore up the line a bit get a run game going and watch the kid work.
Look around the league - the guys with the tools to succeed and consistency are winning. Those without... aren't.
The team has no Dline, no Oline, no run game, no TE, and suspect offensive coaching AT BEST and we want to run this kid out of here?
How ISN'T it A because he can't be fairly evaluated?!
Was he so damaged by Garrett that he is now a Solid B per the above?
Is he reclamable?
Do we draft a QB and start over....with a new GM.....being smarter with the cap?
The complication is who is selecting and coaching that QB. If it is Judge, Mara has to be convinced that he has the right guy as it will be a long process for Judge to potentially go without the playoffs. With the decade of losing the heat will be on Mara to stay the course.
Jones still may develop but between not showing enough and then the injuries I don't think it is prudent to continue with him as he becomes expensive. I also think the Giants failed to give him the best opportunity.
It comes down to what Judge thinks of Jones and then what Mara thinks of Judge imv.
He is not the guy.
The kid still isn't all we want him to be, but by the same token, he's ahead of any reasonable alternative at this point. He shows leadership, has a good arm, is mobile, and is not a china doll or a head case. Remember, there was this guy named Simms that missed quite a lot of time when he was a young QB with the G-men and he turned out to be pretty good.
Then there's the fact that DJ STILL hasn't had a real chance with a decent line in front of him, solid supportig cast AND with a decent OC running the show. Remember, he did pretty well with Shurmur, but Shurmur was in the wrong job with the G-men.
Let him play. They have MUCH bigger problems elsewhere, starting with ownership and the front office.
It's not even close.
B.
So I guess he was just LUCKY to throw 24 TDs in 12 games his rookie year? Must be some luck!
He played 8 other games that year that weren't good - 9 TDs, 12 INTs, 7 FLs.
You don't have to go down with the ship just because you had a couple of good meals.
It didn't have to take this long to arrive at this answer either.
It didn't have to take this long to arrive at this answer either.
Funny how some people are already saying next year is the make or break year, when it was commonly this year prior to the season. Gettleman even said so.
I don't see a QB they'll be able to attain that will be able to overcome the offensive issues this team has on the line and system-wise.
Frankly, I could care less he had some biggames in his rookie year. Outside those games he was pedestrian or less.
In the present day we don't score TD's. He also seems to be most productive when he runs, and teams are on to that so they keep him contained. He is not really mobile to scramble and buy time to make throws even with his speed.
H just doesn't look good based on the eye test from my living room.
He gets another season? Maybe two? This is a league built for scoring,and the Giants dont.
Not saying C, b/c DJ has disappointed in various areas, but I want to see him perform with a competent GM, a consistent OL and a generally better roster around him before I say he's not the guy.
put me down for B, but i've felt that way for quite a while now
The wild card is, if DG is sent out to pasture, will Judge commit to Jones? I wouldn't be so sure the answer is yes.
Was he so damaged by Garrett that he is now a Solid B per the above?
Is he reclamable?
Do we draft a QB and start over....with a new GM.....being smarter with the cap?
That version of Danny had no pocket awareness and was turnover prone. He would be clueless to the oncoming rush and either throw a beautiful dime or get strip sacked. He had no internal clock.
Now the current less turn over prone Danny is fully aware of his shitty oline, internal clock is messed up, and is making 1 read throws or running for his life.
Its a B for me.
um...that should've read "Definitely B".
The team is awful.
They need their draft picks to fill a ton of holes.
They have no cap space.
The college QB class appears to be nothing special.
So the best option might be to continue down the "A" track, knowing that it probably leads to "B" but figuring there's not much to lose by holding out hope for "C".
And now, this year, in his "make or break year" he is again surrounded by dysfunction, including an OC that is so bad you have to fire him midseason. (And apparently warranted getting fired last year too, but didn't.)
We can say Case Closed on Jones all we want, but we never gave him a chance, and likely David Carr'd him at this point. If he is David Carr'd.....it's B.
Lets see where this goes
Go Gettem Danny Boy.....bring home the bacon
Have you considered the possibility that David Carr was overdrafted and never going to be any good regardless of where his career started?
If he needs everything to be perfect, then he's only as good as a those components.
Eli carried the team 2011, we didn't have much of a running game for most of the year and the line was ok, but not great and on the decline. Eli made that team better, he took no name TEs and made them key contributors (Ballard and Pascoe). Granted he wasn't able to overcome the shitty oline in the later years, but not many could.
Could DJ even come close to what Eli did in 2011? I know one things for sure, he would have left candlestick in a body bag.
The nail in the coffin for me was the Bucs game. That INT to the dlineman was inexcusable. Teams know how to beat him and I think at this point he is what he is, a good athlete that doesn't have championship DNA.
At this point you have to move on. But don't be surprised if he goes to another team and becomes something good.