The results are definitely and definitively in... Dave Gettleman is an incompetent boob. Might be a nice man. But he has failed miserably.
He was one of the principle figures in hiring the last two head coaches. He has overseen four drafts and free agency periods. He blew BOTH the #2 and #6 picks in the entire draft.
Jerry Reese and Marc Ross were dreadful. But to follow them up with Gettleman has been a gigantic disaster.
Ho hum...
The damage that Gettleman has done is fresher in the minds of fans, but Reese had horrific drafts that turned this team into a joke in just a few years. Go back and look at Reese's draft history from 2011 to 2017. Look at his free agents then too.
Reese won us a super bowl.
It’s possible to separate the good stretch Reese had from the bad stretch. Mara should have fired Reese with Coughlin.
I can separate the nice job Gettleman did as the pro personnel director under Reese from the tragedy he’s become. He’s never had a day as a winning GM as the Giant, and I believe he’s had 1 week at .500.
2-2 in 2019. That was the high water mark.
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saying Reese was better than Gettleman are like people saying Kent Graham was better than Danny Kanell.
The damage that Gettleman has done is fresher in the minds of fans, but Reese had horrific drafts that turned this team into a joke in just a few years. Go back and look at Reese's draft history from 2011 to 2017. Look at his free agents then too.
Reese drafted and signed key members of both Super Bowl teams. A Reese Gettleman comparison is like comparing Eli to Kanell.
Thank you! Folks like to glance over these facts. I would almost replace Kanell with Kyle Lauletta...b/c he's done jack shit.
FWIW, I thought they were insane to draft Snee. I was right that it would become awkward, but I was about nine years off about the timing.
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Sshh. Remember folks on BBI think Reese kept us from winning 5 Superbowls.
Anyone who thinks we won 2 SBs BECAUSE of Reese? Is a fucking idiot. Reese and his buddy Ross started this fucking landslide.
We knew how this would end, we just didn’t think it would take this long.
Find a GM out there, past or present, who failed to build a team that could even manage to reach a .500 record at any point in time while consistently hitting the roof of the salary cap - THAT'S who Gettleman should be compared to.
Find a GM out there, past or present, who failed to build a team that could even manage to reach a .500 record at any point in time while consistently hitting the roof of the salary cap - THAT'S who Gettleman should be compared to.
They both suck ballz.
* traded JPP for a 3rd round pick
* overpaid by a mile for Nate Solder
* in the middle of a losing season, traded for Williams who would be a free agent by end of season
* drafted Barkley and Hernandez when he could have drafted Allen and Nick Chubb
* drafted Toney and passed on Micah Parsons
This is just off the top of my head.
* traded JPP for a 3rd round pick
* overpaid by a mile for Nate Solder
* in the middle of a losing season, traded for Williams who would be a free agent by end of season
* drafted Barkley and Hernandez when he could have drafted Allen and Nick Chubb
* drafted Toney and passed on Micah Parsons
This is just off the top of my head.
The first two are just fine. Collins hasn't reached Pro Bowl level with the WFT and JPP needed a change of scenery.
It's Solder, Barkley, Jones, Williams, DeAndre Baker trade-up, host of bad OL signings and lack of OL drafting that have killed the team. Even McCoy for Glennon likely just cost the Giants a game.
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* let Landon Collins walk
* traded JPP for a 3rd round pick
* overpaid by a mile for Nate Solder
* in the middle of a losing season, traded for Williams who would be a free agent by end of season
* drafted Barkley and Hernandez when he could have drafted Allen and Nick Chubb
* drafted Toney and passed on Micah Parsons
This is just off the top of my head.
The first two are just fine. Collins hasn't reached Pro Bowl level with the WFT and JPP needed a change of scenery.
It's Solder, Barkley, Jones, Williams, DeAndre Baker trade-up, host of bad OL signings and lack of OL drafting that have killed the team. Even McCoy for Glennon likely just cost the Giants a game.
Agree, totally.
Collins still isn't worth the money DC paid him.
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* let Landon Collins walk
* traded JPP for a 3rd round pick
* overpaid by a mile for Nate Solder
* in the middle of a losing season, traded for Williams who would be a free agent by end of season
* drafted Barkley and Hernandez when he could have drafted Allen and Nick Chubb
* drafted Toney and passed on Micah Parsons
This is just off the top of my head.
The first two are just fine. Collins hasn't reached Pro Bowl level with the WFT and JPP needed a change of scenery.
It's Solder, Barkley, Jones, Williams, DeAndre Baker trade-up, host of bad OL signings and lack of OL drafting that have killed the team. Even McCoy for Glennon likely just cost the Giants a game.
Collins hasn't been replaced with equivalent talent, moreover DG never attempted to trade him. All due respect, saying JPP needed a change of scenery is just silly. He didn't retain his talent because he now plays in Tampa Bay.
We knew how this would end, we just didn’t think it would take this long.
I was highly skeptical when he was hired lol
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* let Landon Collins walk
* traded JPP for a 3rd round pick
* overpaid by a mile for Nate Solder
* in the middle of a losing season, traded for Williams who would be a free agent by end of season
* drafted Barkley and Hernandez when he could have drafted Allen and Nick Chubb
* drafted Toney and passed on Micah Parsons
This is just off the top of my head.
The first two are just fine. Collins hasn't reached Pro Bowl level with the WFT and JPP needed a change of scenery.
It's Solder, Barkley, Jones, Williams, DeAndre Baker trade-up, host of bad OL signings and lack of OL drafting that have killed the team. Even McCoy for Glennon likely just cost the Giants a game.
The whole sign & trade OBJ (salary cap be damned). Jonathan Stewart signing. Can't forget about Pio. And even this year, when the OL injuries hit hard early, he starts trading draft capital for backup OL. Someone change the locks to the office!
Well this is his team now… and it sucks… and the cap is a mess again. DG had his chance and failed.
The most egregious failure is that the OL is still not fixed - even though that was his stated goal. Even without the injuries the right side of the line would consist of Hernandez and Solder. Not good enough.
I also can not understand why we signed Shep to the deal he has and then restructured his contract multiple times despite his injury history. Ridiculous.
DG's run on the Giants is one of the worst runs by any GM in NFL history. That ISN'T hyperbole.
The damage that Gettleman has done is fresher in the minds of fans, but Reese had horrific drafts that turned this team into a joke in just a few years. Go back and look at Reese's draft history from 2011 to 2017. Look at his free agents then too.
Exactly. David Wilson, Eli Apple, Evan Engram, Erick Flowers. Not to mention some absurd midround picks. What saves him compared o Gettleman is that he didn't have to pick a QB, and had some successes like JPP, Nicks and Beckham.
Reese's tenure ended poorly but he had a pretty good first few years that led to a second Super Bowl win. And he also deserves credit for the 2007 team - that '07 draft was great.
Reese's tenure ended poorly but he had a pretty good first few years that led to a second Super Bowl win. And he also deserves credit for the 2007 team - that '07 draft was great.
No I think many people (including me) have said he (and the Dept. in place for scouting with him) was very good at targeting and selecting specialized skill players. But the fact is the team deteriorated profoundly under his watch, with awful drafting especially around OL and overall team depth. He may or may not be better than Gettleman, but at this point that's not saying much.
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Do people forget Reese drafted Nicks and JPP, critical pieces to the 2011 run?
Reese's tenure ended poorly but he had a pretty good first few years that led to a second Super Bowl win. And he also deserves credit for the 2007 team - that '07 draft was great.
No I think many people (including me) have said he (and the Dept. in place for scouting with him) was very good at targeting and selecting specialized skill players. But the fact is the team deteriorated profoundly under his watch, with awful drafting especially around OL and overall team depth. He may or may not be better than Gettleman, but at this point that's not saying much.
He is 100% better than Gettleman, it isn't even close. And for as bad as his Oline drafting was, he's still got a couple players he drafted starting and contributing in the league.
The foundation of the 2007-2011 teams were build with Accorsi as GM, Reese as Director of College Scouting, and Gettleman as the Pro Personnel man.
Once Reese became GM and appointed Ross as Director of College Scouting, the drafts destroyed the team. We're not talking about 1, 2, 3 drafts. We're talking about 6, 7, 8 bad drafts in a row.
Jerry Reese Fired - ( New Window )
The 2011 was dead last or near dead last in defense and running the football. The OL was on its last legs. Eli, Nicks, and Cruz carried the Giants to the playoffs. The defense and running game then showed signs of life in the playoffs. The reason why the team fell apart so quickly is that he wasn't drafting well.
Now that doesnt take away what he did as a scout and as a GM til 2011. He should get credit for that.
But lets not act like he left Gettleman a gold mine when he was fired. that 2017 team was fucking abysmal and we had too many players making too much money and thats all on Ross and reese.
Gettleman's legacy will forever be tied to Barkley and Jones.
But the most painfully comical aspect of his tenure here was his inability to fix the OL that he claimed he would fix.
That 2011 team was enormously top-heavy, but he drafted those star players. We don't win the 2011 Super Bowl without JPP or Nicks.
Reese is worlds better than the obese buffoon we currently have.
The foundation of the 2007-2011 teams were build with Accorsi as GM, Reese as Director of College Scouting, and Gettleman as the Pro Personnel man.
Once Reese became GM and appointed Ross as Director of College Scouting, the drafts destroyed the team. We're not talking about 1, 2, 3 drafts. We're talking about 6, 7, 8 bad drafts in a row.
If we thought Ross was bad as Director of College Scouting, Louis Riddick will be that on steroids as GM. Neither have any idea how teams are built and rely on height/weight/speed/tools and not whether they have a toolbox or can actually play at the next level.
That 2011 team was enormously top-heavy, but he drafted those star players. We don't win the 2011 Super Bowl without JPP or Nicks.
Didnt the Jets draft Cruz?
- Greg Buttle
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He had been GM for 4 years at that point and while the core might have started to rot...they had enough to win it all. Reese fully deserves blame for the mess that ensued. If you are comparing tenures as GM between Gettleman and Reese...it is not really even close.
The 2011 was dead last or near dead last in defense and running the football. The OL was on its last legs. Eli, Nicks, and Cruz carried the Giants to the playoffs. The defense and running game then showed signs of life in the playoffs. The reason why the team fell apart so quickly is that he wasn't drafting well.
All relevant statements...the core was rotting. But when it mattered they had the players on the roster who stepped up. I do not think anyone is saying Reese was a good GM or did not deserve to get fired. Gettleman has been GM for 4 years and no one is defending him based on what happened 4 years ago. Reese's roster won a Super Bowl 4 years into his tenure yet we don't give him credit for that?
Picking at the top of the Draft every year, maxing out the cap every year, and spending above his means on the cap that it caused contracts to be restructured every year, these are the results from Gettleman's time:
5-11 season
4-12 season
6-10 season
5-12 season (estimated)
Ironically, 4 years later we are left today with a team that needs better coaching, will need to turnover their starting QB, rebuild an OL, find more impactful players on Defense, and build a winning culture.
well done Dave...
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is failing to fix the OL. It compounds mistakes made elsewhere. And the drumbeat to replace Jones is a mistake prior to actually fixing the damn OL. Get the OL fixed and then find your QB.
Gettleman's legacy will forever be tied to Barkley and Jones.
But the most painfully comical aspect of his tenure here was his inability to fix the OL that he claimed he would fix.
Would you agree that Barkley and Jones might have been negatively impacted by the shitty OL? We don't know the future, but both Barkley and Jones could go on to long NFL careers. They might not be stars, but I can see a scenario where they are important cogs in some team. Should players careers in the end be evaluated based on draft position or what they did over the spanse of their career?
Clean. House.
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is failing to fix the OL. It compounds mistakes made elsewhere. And the drumbeat to replace Jones is a mistake prior to actually fixing the damn OL. Get the OL fixed and then find your QB.
Gettleman's legacy will forever be tied to Barkley and Jones.
But the most painfully comical aspect of his tenure here was his inability to fix the OL that he claimed he would fix.
I think Jones and Barkley would have been fine if it wasn't for the utter, total disaster of a failure to fix the line - that and some dreadfully awful FA signings, i.e., Stewart, Solder, over paying for others like Jackson and Golladay.
...and Abrams too for not talking DG out of some of these signings.
He was mediocre in high school, which is why he ended up walking on at Duke. He never particularly stood out at Duke, either. Now he's stinking it up in the pros. Face it, the guy just isn't all that good.
JPP, Joseph, Nicks, Beatty, Phillips, Thomas, Manningham, Ross, Smith, Boss, DeOssie, and Bradhshaw were all competent NFL players.
Landing 12 legit players who contributed to winning teams over a 4 year draft period is a good clip.
Reese had a very competent front half, and a very incompetent back half tenure as the GM.
And yet somehow, even as poorly as the team was constructed from 2013-2017 — those teams were a notch better than anything Gettleman has put on the field.
He was mediocre in high school, which is why he ended up walking on at Duke. He never particularly stood out at Duke, either. Now he's stinking it up in the pros. Face it, the guy just isn't all that good.
Are there worse QBs than DJ? Yeah. But like Goff, unless the situation around him is right AND everything breaks his/the teams way , he's not going to get very far in the playoffs, if ge gets there at all
Even the fucking BArkley pick, one I have defended as recently as last night right here, and I don't question the talent like some, but the team was so BAD and so thin along the OL and the QB was old....
Sorry I even entertained the notion of defending these moves. I defended Dave Brown somewhat as well, prior to 1997. I thought I learned a lot of lessons over the years watching this franchise succeed and fail but I guess my heart and fandom wanted to feel some hope even in the face of certain doom.
You take a RB at 2-3-4-5 when you have a ready made OL in place. Not in 2018 when Nate Solder is your best lineman.
Not that it matters. We could have taken any other great player at 2 and we'd still be a hot mess today. BUT...and this is a big one, if they just forced a QB then they don't take Jones one year later and maybe the QB they did take at 2 was the right one. Even allowing for the choice of Darnold, Rosen, Allen and Jackon, maybe they pick Allen...
No way in hell this franchise takes allen or jackson though, who the hell we kidding...
whatever, fans don't need to always be right, the GM and HC does. And the fact that I have considered better moves than DG has pulled off here speaks volumes.
I am terrified of what we do next.
JPP, Joseph, Nicks, Beatty, Phillips, Thomas, Manningham, Ross, Smith, Boss, DeOssie, and Bradhshaw were all competent NFL players.
Landing 12 legit players who contributed to winning teams over a 4 year draft period is a good clip.
Reese had a very competent front half, and a very incompetent back half tenure as the GM.
And yet somehow, even as poorly as the team was constructed from 2013-2017 — those teams were a notch better than anything Gettleman has put on the field.
Reese's later drafts were pretty bad, but he also drafted a whole bunch of very good players whose careers were either prematurely ended or severely degraded due to major injuries.
Another thing to point out with Reese: Pugh & Flowers have since flourished elsewhere. JPP is still a cog in Tampa.
I find it insulting when people compare Gettleman to Reese. You can’t just ignore the first half of his tenure.