Kevin Abrams-Not happening. Even Mara knows that will have fan revolt.
Joe Schoen-Sure.
Dave Ziegler-Sure.
Monti Ossenfort-Sure.
Ryan Poles-Sure.
Louis Riddick-Uh, no.
You'd have to guess Ossenfort or Ziegler as favorites
if they're truly married to Judfe for another year. Ossenfort seems to get more love here but Ziegler is interesting. He seemed to have the Broncos job sewn up last year but Belichick essentially created a promotion to convince him to stay.
Poles is an interesting guy. Younger than Judge. Seems to get a lot of credit for the Chiefs roster. Read an article awhile back when he was first mentioned by a poster here and he talked about managing a roster and being consistent with leadership. Was a good read.
Wtf is with Riddick? Has he been connected to any teams or is it just the Giants?
Means Judge is coming back. Abrams means rinse and repeat of the Giants way. Judge getting fired and non Abrams candidate is the best option. I know his love of Haskins and dogging on Thomas doesn’t look good for Riddick but if he’s the guy that comes with no strings I’d be open. Gettleman missed 95% of the time so I’d roll the dice on Riddick
Means Judge is coming back. Abrams means rinse and repeat of the Giants way. Judge getting fired and non Abrams candidate is the best option. I know his love of Haskins and dogging on Thomas doesn’t look good for Riddick but if he’s the guy that comes with no strings I’d be open. Gettleman missed 95% of the time so I’d roll the dice on Riddick
Schoen isn't directly tied to Judge. His only connections are having Daboll in Buffalo who is close with Judge and being hired by Parcells who obviously then leads to Belichick
Judge is coaching for his job in '22. The more I think about it...less I'm concerned about potential GM & his ties to JJ. I would hope next GM makes the final call on JJ, but if not...not the end of the world since I think we're going to suck in '22/Judge will be shown the door. The most important thing is that JJ isn't making decisions on moves past '22.
How can anyone prefer anyone on this list? None of these guys have ever been GMs. We don't know how much of a role they played on their respective teams.
They should be looking in Baltimore or Indy first.
And SF or Cleveland 2nd.
It’s been said but the problem with Schoen is that Buffalo isn’t particularly known for their systems or advanced systems more of a traditional scouting shop and if you just put another voice in the room it will be drowned out by all the other voices that we know are ineffective.
Ziegler is probably my favorite but I shudder to think how much longer they keeps Judge here plus if we’ve learned anything from Judge it’s that taking someone from New England does not mean you get their systems or even someone willing to innovate.
Looks like more of the same bullshit from the Giants.
Would be great choices but I think both are too smart and highly regarded to play Mara's games.
They would want full control of scouting and personal decisions and Mara is not going to let Chris and Petit go.
Neither one needs to jump into a bad situation.
Here comes Abrams and Riddick.
Because I hadn't really seen him name connected to the Giants until this post.
I had heard from someone that works for an NFC team that the Giants are going to try to pair Poles with Eric Bieniemy at HC.
Giddyup. That'd be an upgrade. But while Bieniemy has reportedly been a model citizen for a very long time, IDK, his issues in college don't sit well with me.
How can anyone prefer anyone on this list? None of these guys have ever been GMs. We don't know how much of a role they played on their respective teams.
Exactly. We're gonna be limited to what amounts to fluff pieces and the odd tweet with a breadcrumb here or there. I just hope whoever it is is a great talent evaluator who revamps the scouting department.
My company had an opening for a manager one level above me.
They went through three very expensive executives in about three years before giving up and restructuring the role. They eventually promoted me and a co-worker, and made the new hire a VP with a different brief. They hired a guy they'd interviewed and rejected before.
I was part of the hiring process on one go-round so I can say that it's very hard to gauge people in an interview process. You have to size up how good they'll be in the role and also how they'll mesh with the existing organization. But you have to be willing to face up to mistakes and try someone else. The Giants have been relatively reluctant to do that.
I also recently hired an underling who is my direct report. They have an extremely responsible job, covering a lot of what I used to do, working on deadline. The process worked and we love the person we hired.(We are even using a bunch of the people who didn't get the job as freelancers; the search was great for my team.) However we're dealing with human beings here, and human beings aren't cogs in a machine. They are more than their job function. They have to be managed with some sensitivity, especially in a pressurized position.
When you are talking about elite-level talents, both players and executives, that sensitivity has to be even higher. I think a lot of fans overlook that. The higher the talent and skill level, the less interchangeable the person and the more sensitivity is needed.
The fact that Abrams and Louis Riddick are on there...
Would be great choices but I think both are too smart and highly regarded to play Mara's games.
They would want full control of scouting and personal decisions and Mara is not going to let Chris and Petit go.
Neither one needs to jump into a bad situation.
Here comes Abrams and Riddick.
Bisignano said Petit is gone, said Chris Mara doesn’t have much of a role, really likes McDonnel. (Sp)
Have found him to be pretty connected. Also Judge is back
Because I hadn't really seen him name connected to the Giants until this post.
I had heard from someone that works for an NFC team that the Giants are going to try to pair Poles with Eric Bieniemy at HC.
Giddyup. That'd be an upgrade. But while Bieniemy has reportedly been a model citizen for a very long time, IDK, his issues in college don't sit well with me.
College in almost 30 yrs ago for him. Most of us did stupid shit in college. JJ was probably a choir boy. Did that matter? Jmho
Ossenfort, Ziegler, or Poles are fine. I like Schoen the best, but would prefer Dodds or Hortiz. The key is to get Mara to stop meddling in personnel decisions. The best candidates will probably pass until they are certain he won't.
but I think Pioli will be in the mix. I have serious doubts that Riddick would be under serious consideration. He’s been very critical of Giant management (he’s not wrong), but I don’t think Mara will consider him.
How can anyone prefer anyone on this list? None of these guys have ever been GMs. We don't know how much of a role they played on their respective teams.
So no one should ever hire a GM who’s never been a GM before? That’s an interesting take.
How can anyone prefer anyone on this list? None of these guys have ever been GMs. We don't know how much of a role they played on their respective teams.
So no one should ever hire a GM who’s never been a GM before? That’s an interesting take.
I’m not that impressed with the Titans or the Patriots draft picks during the Ossenfort years. They’ve whiffed a lot as well. Put me in the Schoen or Poles camp.
How some of you hold a vendetta against Riddick for preferring Haskins over Jones when the vast majority of fans wanted the same thing. Hindsight is a bitch ain’t it?
How some of you hold a vendetta against Riddick for preferring Haskins over Jones when the vast majority of fans wanted the same thing. Hindsight is a bitch ain’t it?
I don’t think it is just that Riddick preferred Haskins to Jones it is WHY he did that. If you look at Riddick’s thoughts on roster construction he hypes up physical tools, height/weight/speed, etc. and gives very short shrift to toolbox. He would prefer someone like JaMarcus Russell because he was big with a cannon arm. You don’t build a team bringing 90 Tarzans to camp and choosing the best 53. He also seems overly dismissive of those who disagree with him (a la Dave Gettleman).
How some of you hold a vendetta against Riddick for preferring Haskins over Jones when the vast majority of fans wanted the same thing. Hindsight is a bitch ain’t it?
I still say actual GM Riddick would've worked Haskins out and interviewed him and come to the same conclusion as 32 other front offices that he was undraftable. (Even WTF's scouts wanted him off the board, Snyder drafted him).
Riddick was viable in 2017, but I think he's been away from the game too long now in 2021 to be anything more than a sock puppet for Chris Mara and Tim McDonnell. May as well just promote Abrams.
How some of you hold a vendetta against Riddick for preferring Haskins over Jones when the vast majority of fans wanted the same thing. Hindsight is a bitch ain’t it?
If I remember corectly, I think the majority of analysts thought Haskins was a better prospect than Jones. In their defense, they were basing that decision based "on the tape". They had no way of knowing that Haskins was as lazy and immature as he appears to be.
Need a GM candidate that is experienced enough to be able to suggest
how a rebuild plan should be orchestrated and that he wants full commitment to execute on that plan without any complications or ties to the decisions made by the Giant front office in the past.
But the candidate needs to be mature enough to not just disparage the Giants decisions from the past, but to explain "they did what they did" based on available information they had in hand at the time but how intermingling those sunk costs with a new plan will only delay or possibly impede future progress altogether.
Put aside whether you believe/don't believe the Owners will stipulate...if any of the GM candidates named above can't articulate this message then they aren't the right guy for this job.
Chris Bisignano really disappointed me with the most recent episode
of his The Giant Insider podcast. It's one of the Giant podcasts I listen to regularly.
It's an insult to anyone who follows the Giants intelligence to keep pushing the story that Chris Mara doesn't do anything. He owns the team, he's in personnel meetings, he's in the draft room, he wanted to be the GM of the team, he can't be fired because he's an owner and the brother of the CEO. He has put himself into a position to have the people who work under him to want to please him and suck up to him at the minimum. What human would take a contrarian position against the group if one of the group is an owner? Like I said an insult to a Giant fans intelligence. The whole Chris Mara doesn't do anything garbage treads on Dittino territory.
His comment's on Tim McDonnell were worse. He said has some kind of Mara connection, does a great job and came to the Giants after Charlie Weis hired him at Notre Dame. Some kind of Mara connection? HE'S AN OWNER WHO CAN'T BE FIRED AND IS GOING TO BE THE NEXT CEO OF THE GIANTS. He is the son of Susan Mara, the 2nd old set child of Wellington and Ann Mara born between John and Chris Mara.
So IMO Chris Bisignano revealed himself as someone who is not objective at worst or an awful reporter. I'll still listen but any "inside the building" reporting that comes from him falls under the Dittino media tree for me from now on.
I highly recommend podcast listening as the best way to follow the Giants in the off season. All of the ones I listen to are different and have different perspectives and insights. If you want to follow the Giants search or searches and the draft I think podcasts are the best way to do it. Not for breaking news but for analysis. Let me know if I'm missing any that I should be listening to. I know about both of the Papa Banks podcasts and do listen on occasion.
The Giant Insider - fan podcast with an Internet beat reporter with team access (Bisignano)
Talkin Giants - fan podcast with Bobby Skinner
Blue Rush - NY Post Paul Schwartz and Lawrence Tynes
Big Blue Banter - Gen Z Giant fans who breaking down the all 22
Breaking Big Blue - ESPN Jordan Raanan
NYG Weekly - Gen Z Giant fans
Unfortunately, I reckon he's too smart to accept the terms/restrictions Mara wants.
It will be interesting to see how hard they go after him, how far down the road they get with him, and then the reasons given why they didn't hire him.
I blocked that out when it ended. Bisignano's repeated rants about Marc Ross while all true, were about 5 years too late. If you listen to that podcast Marc Ross and Gettleman are the only people that caused 10 years of disastrous Giants football. They are to blame for everything and to quote him "John Mara had the wool pulled over his eyes". While trying to defend Mara he basically said he's a complete idiot.
But if Ranaan is mostly correct, I will be impressed. The GM searches in 2007 and 2018 had short lists consisting of Giants employees with a broadcaster thrown in. They were embarrassing.
If this report holds, this is a real list with bona fide candidates (although I also am disappointed that the two Ravens AGMs aren’t on it - that should have been automatic).
Because I hadn't really seen him name connected to the Giants until this post.
I had heard from someone that works for an NFC team that the Giants are going to try to pair Poles with Eric Bieniemy at HC.
Giddyup. That'd be an upgrade. But while Bieniemy has reportedly been a model citizen for a very long time, IDK, his issues in college don't sit well with me.
College in almost 30 yrs ago for him. Most of us did stupid shit in college. JJ was probably a choir boy. Did that matter? Jmho
Covered up rape while a coach at UC and was a lead recruiter.
How can anyone prefer anyone on this list? None of these guys have ever been GMs. We don't know how much of a role they played on their respective teams.
So no one should ever hire a GM who’s never been a GM before? That’s an interesting take.
I think you misinterpreted my comment. The point of my comment was that no one knows here knows anything about these GM hopefuls. I'm not sure how anyone can have favorites or preferences. They're not GMs. For all we know, they could be glorified gofers for their respective teams. We just don't know enough about these execs to prefer one over the other.
Raanan said he can't understand why Gettleman hasn't already been fired so the Giants could start interviewing. He also said that Gettleman was in place before the season ended the year Reese was fired and that the other 3 interviews were 'a sham". He's the only one I've heard that says Riddick will get an interview this time.
How can anyone prefer anyone on this list? None of these guys have ever been GMs. We don't know how much of a role they played on their respective teams.
So no one should ever hire a GM who’s never been a GM before? That’s an interesting take.
I think you misinterpreted my comment. The point of my comment was that no one knows here knows anything about these GM hopefuls. I'm not sure how anyone can have favorites or preferences. They're not GMs. For all we know, they could be glorified gofers for their respective teams. We just don't know enough about these execs to prefer one over the other.
*no one here knows
It's possible that the Jaguars assistant GM is much better than any of these candidates. Maybe he has some great ideas but is handcuffed by Baalke. He may be the next great GM. By contrast, someone like Poles or Schoen could just be gofers.
I don’t understand the timeline here. Think you & I have discussed it. Why is interviewing a replacement for a retiring employee disrespectful to that person? Should have started in November. I suspect UberAlias’ acct is right - Mara was all ready to promote Abrams and was stunned by how 2021 went off the rails.
Raanan said he can't understand why Gettleman hasn't already been fired so the Giants could start interviewing. He also said that Gettleman was in place before the season ended the year Reese was fired and that the other 3 interviews were 'a sham". He's the only one I've heard that says Riddick will get an interview this time.
Gee, that's going out on a limb. A few of us were postulating that exact same outcome. And Riddick was given the interview to satisfy the Rooney Rule.
Kevin Abrams
Joe Schoen
Dave Ziegler
Monti Ossenfort
Ryan Poles
Louis Riddick
Assuming the current laughingstock on this team, Joe Judge, is kept on as HC, which would be incredulous at this point, I'm only interested in Schoen and Poles because they have no ties to Judge.
I don't want Ziegs and Ossenfort because they would essentially be brought on to support/endorse Judge. And I'm over the "Judge Way".
of his The Giant Insider podcast. It's one of the Giant podcasts I listen to regularly.
It's an insult to anyone who follows the Giants intelligence to keep pushing the story that Chris Mara doesn't do anything. He owns the team, he's in personnel meetings, he's in the draft room, he wanted to be the GM of the team, he can't be fired because he's an owner and the brother of the CEO. He has put himself into a position to have the people who work under him to want to please him and suck up to him at the minimum. What human would take a contrarian position against the group if one of the group is an owner? Like I said an insult to a Giant fans intelligence. The whole Chris Mara doesn't do anything garbage treads on Dittino territory.
His comment's on Tim McDonnell were worse. He said has some kind of Mara connection, does a great job and came to the Giants after Charlie Weis hired him at Notre Dame. Some kind of Mara connection? HE'S AN OWNER WHO CAN'T BE FIRED AND IS GOING TO BE THE NEXT CEO OF THE GIANTS. He is the son of Susan Mara, the 2nd old set child of Wellington and Ann Mara born between John and Chris Mara.
So IMO Chris Bisignano revealed himself as someone who is not objective at worst or an awful reporter. I'll still listen but any "inside the building" reporting that comes from him falls under the Dittino media tree for me from now on.
I highly recommend podcast listening as the best way to follow the Giants in the off season. All of the ones I listen to are different and have different perspectives and insights. If you want to follow the Giants search or searches and the draft I think podcasts are the best way to do it. Not for breaking news but for analysis. Let me know if I'm missing any that I should be listening to. I know about both of the Papa Banks podcasts and do listen on occasion.
The Giant Insider - fan podcast with an Internet beat reporter with team access (Bisignano)
Talkin Giants - fan podcast with Bobby Skinner
Blue Rush - NY Post Paul Schwartz and Lawrence Tynes
Big Blue Banter - Gen Z Giant fans who breaking down the all 22
Breaking Big Blue - ESPN Jordan Raanan
NYG Weekly - Gen Z Giant fans
The reason he may be correct on Chris Mara is that he had his last shot of being GM of the Giants come and go. He is 62/63 years old and he had a lot of recent success in horse racing and perhaps that has become his passion, with the Giants only being a part-time gig.
I do not know much about Tim McDonald. Let’s face it, none of us know what really goes on. I personally feel (guess) that Judge had a lot to do with not drafting oline which Gettleman wanted.
could easily be assembled from connecting known dots, hopefully it's not entirely accurate as Riddick belongs in a TV studio.
Yup. I question Ranaan having legit insight or sources. Right now the GM search is likely involving just a handful of people inside Giants executive suite and I know almost all of them won’t speak to Ranaan.
I will say I’m increasingly optimistic this hire is now going to be from outside. That’s a start. Hopefully they’ll redo the scouting and development side further which really was not improved under Gettleman, only some musical chairs.
Personally though they need to see how a full reset down through coaches is also needed.
What bothers me about Riddick is not just that he wanted Haskins
because I did too. But I've always said on here I'm no QB expert. But our next GM better be. And I don't have the access that these guys do about talent. I didn't like the trashing he did on the Giants after they didn't pick Haskins. Probably a great guy but......
How can anyone prefer anyone on this list? None of these guys have ever been GMs. We don't know how much of a role they played on their respective teams.
So no one should ever hire a GM who’s never been a GM before? That’s an interesting take.
I think you misinterpreted my comment. The point of my comment was that no one knows here knows anything about these GM hopefuls. I'm not sure how anyone can have favorites or preferences. They're not GMs. For all we know, they could be glorified gofers for their respective teams. We just don't know enough about these execs to prefer one over the other.
OK, sorry about that. I see your point. My response would be that I would look for someone who worked at multiple levels for a team that has built a personnel dept that consistently brings in young talent and depth. Candidates from orgs like Balt, Pitt, GB, etc, at least know how to build a personnel dept.
Now whether they would make a good GM, you’re right, none of us know. A good search and interview process should increase odds that you get a good candidate, but I haven’t seen this franchise show the ability to do that.
How can anyone prefer anyone on this list? None of these guys have ever been GMs. We don't know how much of a role they played on their respective teams.
is likely Rooney rule fodder and Beiniemy will likely NEVER be hired by the Giants based off his past.
I would have gone for someone like Rick Smith or Alonzo Highsmith if you want Rooney Rule
After reading that article yesterday about Smith, someone here linked it from the Athletic, I would look at Smith as a serious GM candidate.
That’s my point. I want Rooney Rule to be used on someone who has a legit shot at being GM or at least a major role in organization and not just a throw away on someone you will never hire in any role.
How can anyone prefer anyone on this list? None of these guys have ever been GMs. We don't know how much of a role they played on their respective teams.
Every GM has also started out not being a GM. We can't be picky here. if they can identify a someone who can be a GM, then go for him. Happens with every team.
all the candidates with the best analytics expertise. And I would therefore make sure that Kwesi Adofo-Mensah, Browns VP of football operations, be included among the interviewees.
How some of you hold a vendetta against Riddick for preferring Haskins over Jones when the vast majority of fans wanted the same thing. Hindsight is a bitch ain’t it?
I still say actual GM Riddick would've worked Haskins out and interviewed him and come to the same conclusion as 32 other front offices that he was undraftable. (Even WTF's scouts wanted him off the board, Snyder drafted him).
Riddick was viable in 2017, but I think he's been away from the game too long now in 2021 to be anything more than a sock puppet for Chris Mara and Tim McDonnell. May as well just promote Abrams.
After listening to him on MNF this year, I want nothing to do with him for GM.
yep, I posted a few weeks ago that Abrams has just as good of a chance at succeeding as any of these other guys. Hell, Abrams is going to have two top 10 picks, much like X GM we would hire. Probably going to make that GM look like a genius if those picks are good.
Everyone is against Abrams because he’s been working for the Giants for awhile. So be it.
yep, I posted a few weeks ago that Abrams has just as good of a chance at succeeding as any of these other guys. Hell, Abrams is going to have two top 10 picks, much like X GM we would hire. Probably going to make that GM look like a genius if those picks are good.
Everyone is against Abrams because he’s been working for the Giants for awhile. So be it.
Can you blame them? It’s reasonable and logical to assign blame to Abrams for some of this current mess and question why if he believed it different and altering moves to make the team better he didn’t do it. Gettleman is the boogeyman and punching bag right now but Abrams and Judge are part of the executive team. Their involvement is significant and sensitive to the actuality of failure that has played out.
Don’t know much about Poles, Ossenfort or Ziegler
Joe Schoen-Sure.
Dave Ziegler-Sure.
Monti Ossenfort-Sure.
Ryan Poles-Sure.
Louis Riddick-Uh, no.
Poles is an interesting guy. Younger than Judge. Seems to get a lot of credit for the Chiefs roster. Read an article awhile back when he was first mentioned by a poster here and he talked about managing a roster and being consistent with leadership. Was a good read.
Wtf is with Riddick? Has he been connected to any teams or is it just the Giants?
Ryan Poles Hopes to Win Super Bowl on Chiefs Staff
I want the best talent evaluator. Next two drafts are critical.
Schoen isn't directly tied to Judge. His only connections are having Daboll in Buffalo who is close with Judge and being hired by Parcells who obviously then leads to Belichick
Would open up my sundays for sure.
I want the best talent evaluator. Next two drafts are critical.
Poles and Ziegler seem well regarded in that respect.
And SF or Cleveland 2nd.
It’s been said but the problem with Schoen is that Buffalo isn’t particularly known for their systems or advanced systems more of a traditional scouting shop and if you just put another voice in the room it will be drowned out by all the other voices that we know are ineffective.
Ziegler is probably my favorite but I shudder to think how much longer they keeps Judge here plus if we’ve learned anything from Judge it’s that taking someone from New England does not mean you get their systems or even someone willing to innovate.
Looks like more of the same bullshit from the Giants.
He’s the best candidate on that list by a mile.
Dan Morgan
Catherine Raiche
John Dorsey
He did not say they would all be interviewed but these are names he has heard and expects the first 5 or 6 he named to be interviewed.
Also said 50/50 Judge is back, the rant really hurt him, but expects him back.
He’s the best candidate on that list by a mile.
To be fair, you'd be impressed if you heard Joe Judge speak too....And the Giants were.
and if he tries to bring back Judge,the fan base is already pissed.So what's next? The thousand yard stare?
He’s incredibly smart, and he’s got the pelts too.
I had heard from someone that works for an NFC team that the Giants are going to try to pair Poles with Eric Bieniemy at HC.
Chris Petit
Chris Mara
They would want full control of scouting and personal decisions and Mara is not going to let Chris and Petit go.
Neither one needs to jump into a bad situation.
Here comes Abrams and Riddick.
I had heard from someone that works for an NFC team that the Giants are going to try to pair Poles with Eric Bieniemy at HC.
Giddyup. That'd be an upgrade. But while Bieniemy has reportedly been a model citizen for a very long time, IDK, his issues in college don't sit well with me.
That dude just makes shit up.
Come to think of it, I can understand his popularity here.
That said, I would be surprised if there is not one or 2 second time Gms interviewed. (re-tread if you like)
It would be foolish not to get that feed back, and as mentioned above they are the only ones that have a clear, demonstrated track record.
I'm not opposed to a first time GM, but I am aware that my opinion is only a guess on them.
I had heard from someone that works for an NFC team that the Giants are going to try to pair Poles with Eric Bieniemy at HC.
Bieniemy worries me. Doesn’t Reid call the plays there?
Quote:
If you get a chance to hear Poles, you’ll be impressed.
He’s the best candidate on that list by a mile.
To be fair, you'd be impressed if you heard Joe Judge speak too....And the Giants were.
we all were
I really like the way Buffalo is built. They built the offensive line then added a QB and focused several assets in addressing the pass rush.
Exactly. We're gonna be limited to what amounts to fluff pieces and the odd tweet with a breadcrumb here or there. I just hope whoever it is is a great talent evaluator who revamps the scouting department.
I was part of the hiring process on one go-round so I can say that it's very hard to gauge people in an interview process. You have to size up how good they'll be in the role and also how they'll mesh with the existing organization. But you have to be willing to face up to mistakes and try someone else. The Giants have been relatively reluctant to do that.
I also recently hired an underling who is my direct report. They have an extremely responsible job, covering a lot of what I used to do, working on deadline. The process worked and we love the person we hired.(We are even using a bunch of the people who didn't get the job as freelancers; the search was great for my team.) However we're dealing with human beings here, and human beings aren't cogs in a machine. They are more than their job function. They have to be managed with some sensitivity, especially in a pressurized position.
When you are talking about elite-level talents, both players and executives, that sensitivity has to be even higher. I think a lot of fans overlook that. The higher the talent and skill level, the less interchangeable the person and the more sensitivity is needed.
They would want full control of scouting and personal decisions and Mara is not going to let Chris and Petit go.
Neither one needs to jump into a bad situation.
Here comes Abrams and Riddick.
Bisignano said Petit is gone, said Chris Mara doesn’t have much of a role, really likes McDonnel. (Sp)
Have found him to be pretty connected. Also Judge is back
Would he cut AT day one since he criticized him indicating he should not have even been drafted earlier this year.
And if it’s because they cant even get him in the door for an interview- that’s even sadder.
And if it’s because they cant even get him in the door for an interview- that’s even sadder.
Would you want to waste your time when you can’t pick the head coach and have to have the owner’s relatives looking over your shoulder?
Quote:
Because I hadn't really seen him name connected to the Giants until this post.
I had heard from someone that works for an NFC team that the Giants are going to try to pair Poles with Eric Bieniemy at HC.
Giddyup. That'd be an upgrade. But while Bieniemy has reportedly been a model citizen for a very long time, IDK, his issues in college don't sit well with me.
College in almost 30 yrs ago for him. Most of us did stupid shit in college. JJ was probably a choir boy. Did that matter? Jmho
Dorsey has a great eye for talent.
Yea, not a fan of the others either
Dorsey has a great eye for talent.
He would fix the talent problem for sure but I wonder how long he'd last before wearing out his welcome.
and why wouldn’t Ossenfort, Ziegler, or Poles?
I agree that Petit should be fired.
New coach, new GM, non of it matters until the three stooges step aside.
So no one should ever hire a GM who’s never been a GM before? That’s an interesting take.
Quite a range of options...
I had heard from someone that works for an NFC team that the Giants are going to try to pair Poles with Eric Bieniemy at HC.
Wow. I’d be on the fence with Bienemy, but if Poles comes with him, sign me up.
Quote:
How can anyone prefer anyone on this list? None of these guys have ever been GMs. We don't know how much of a role they played on their respective teams.
So no one should ever hire a GM who’s never been a GM before? That’s an interesting take.
Gettleman was a GM before
I don’t think it is just that Riddick preferred Haskins to Jones it is WHY he did that. If you look at Riddick’s thoughts on roster construction he hypes up physical tools, height/weight/speed, etc. and gives very short shrift to toolbox. He would prefer someone like JaMarcus Russell because he was big with a cannon arm. You don’t build a team bringing 90 Tarzans to camp and choosing the best 53. He also seems overly dismissive of those who disagree with him (a la Dave Gettleman).
Quote:
Who would make any positive impact.
and why wouldn’t Ossenfort, Ziegler, or Poles?
They haven’t had the degree of responsibility for choosing personnel that Schoen has.
I still say actual GM Riddick would've worked Haskins out and interviewed him and come to the same conclusion as 32 other front offices that he was undraftable. (Even WTF's scouts wanted him off the board, Snyder drafted him).
Riddick was viable in 2017, but I think he's been away from the game too long now in 2021 to be anything more than a sock puppet for Chris Mara and Tim McDonnell. May as well just promote Abrams.
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In comment 15535099 christian said:
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If you get a chance to hear Poles, you’ll be impressed.
He’s the best candidate on that list by a mile.
To be fair, you'd be impressed if you heard Joe Judge speak too....And the Giants were.
we all were
To be fair, there were some here (myself included) that didn't fall for the Judge bullshit Hollywood central casting line of talk.
If we would have taken Haskins we would be in a better spot right now
Because we would have moved on already
Now we’re stuck with Jones
If I remember corectly, I think the majority of analysts thought Haskins was a better prospect than Jones. In their defense, they were basing that decision based "on the tape". They had no way of knowing that Haskins was as lazy and immature as he appears to be.
But the candidate needs to be mature enough to not just disparage the Giants decisions from the past, but to explain "they did what they did" based on available information they had in hand at the time but how intermingling those sunk costs with a new plan will only delay or possibly impede future progress altogether.
Put aside whether you believe/don't believe the Owners will stipulate...if any of the GM candidates named above can't articulate this message then they aren't the right guy for this job.
It's an insult to anyone who follows the Giants intelligence to keep pushing the story that Chris Mara doesn't do anything. He owns the team, he's in personnel meetings, he's in the draft room, he wanted to be the GM of the team, he can't be fired because he's an owner and the brother of the CEO. He has put himself into a position to have the people who work under him to want to please him and suck up to him at the minimum. What human would take a contrarian position against the group if one of the group is an owner? Like I said an insult to a Giant fans intelligence. The whole Chris Mara doesn't do anything garbage treads on Dittino territory.
His comment's on Tim McDonnell were worse. He said has some kind of Mara connection, does a great job and came to the Giants after Charlie Weis hired him at Notre Dame. Some kind of Mara connection? HE'S AN OWNER WHO CAN'T BE FIRED AND IS GOING TO BE THE NEXT CEO OF THE GIANTS. He is the son of Susan Mara, the 2nd old set child of Wellington and Ann Mara born between John and Chris Mara.
So IMO Chris Bisignano revealed himself as someone who is not objective at worst or an awful reporter. I'll still listen but any "inside the building" reporting that comes from him falls under the Dittino media tree for me from now on.
I highly recommend podcast listening as the best way to follow the Giants in the off season. All of the ones I listen to are different and have different perspectives and insights. If you want to follow the Giants search or searches and the draft I think podcasts are the best way to do it. Not for breaking news but for analysis. Let me know if I'm missing any that I should be listening to. I know about both of the Papa Banks podcasts and do listen on occasion.
The Giant Insider - fan podcast with an Internet beat reporter with team access (Bisignano)
Talkin Giants - fan podcast with Bobby Skinner
Blue Rush - NY Post Paul Schwartz and Lawrence Tynes
Big Blue Banter - Gen Z Giant fans who breaking down the all 22
Breaking Big Blue - ESPN Jordan Raanan
NYG Weekly - Gen Z Giant fans
He’s the best candidate on that list by a mile.
That's what they said about Judge.
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If you get a chance to hear Poles, you’ll be impressed.
He’s the best candidate on that list by a mile.
That's what they said about Judge.
Poles is impressive.
The Judge comment is short-sighted. You would rather the Owners hire someone that doesn't at least come off that way during the interviews?
It will be interesting to see how hard they go after him, how far down the road they get with him, and then the reasons given why they didn't hire him.
I had heard from someone that works for an NFC team that the Giants are going to try to pair Poles with Eric Bieniemy at HC.
Poles is an ex off lineman working for a team that knows what OL talent is. Hiring him may be part of a targeted upgrade of a deficient scouting area.
If this report holds, this is a real list with bona fide candidates (although I also am disappointed that the two Ravens AGMs aren’t on it - that should have been automatic).
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In comment 15535114 Big Rick in FL said:
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Because I hadn't really seen him name connected to the Giants until this post.
I had heard from someone that works for an NFC team that the Giants are going to try to pair Poles with Eric Bieniemy at HC.
Giddyup. That'd be an upgrade. But while Bieniemy has reportedly been a model citizen for a very long time, IDK, his issues in college don't sit well with me.
College in almost 30 yrs ago for him. Most of us did stupid shit in college. JJ was probably a choir boy. Did that matter? Jmho
Covered up rape while a coach at UC and was a lead recruiter.
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How can anyone prefer anyone on this list? None of these guys have ever been GMs. We don't know how much of a role they played on their respective teams.
So no one should ever hire a GM who’s never been a GM before? That’s an interesting take.
I think you misinterpreted my comment. The point of my comment was that no one knows here knows anything about these GM hopefuls. I'm not sure how anyone can have favorites or preferences. They're not GMs. For all we know, they could be glorified gofers for their respective teams. We just don't know enough about these execs to prefer one over the other.
See the Legal Issues section - ( New Window )
bienemy - ( New Window )
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In comment 15535095 Anakim said:
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How can anyone prefer anyone on this list? None of these guys have ever been GMs. We don't know how much of a role they played on their respective teams.
So no one should ever hire a GM who’s never been a GM before? That’s an interesting take.
I think you misinterpreted my comment. The point of my comment was that no one knows here knows anything about these GM hopefuls. I'm not sure how anyone can have favorites or preferences. They're not GMs. For all we know, they could be glorified gofers for their respective teams. We just don't know enough about these execs to prefer one over the other.
*no one here knows
It's possible that the Jaguars assistant GM is much better than any of these candidates. Maybe he has some great ideas but is handcuffed by Baalke. He may be the next great GM. By contrast, someone like Poles or Schoen could just be gofers.
That's my point, Section
Gee, that's going out on a limb. A few of us were postulating that exact same outcome. And Riddick was given the interview to satisfy the Rooney Rule.
Joe Schoen
Dave Ziegler
Monti Ossenfort
Ryan Poles
Louis Riddick
Assuming the current laughingstock on this team, Joe Judge, is kept on as HC, which would be incredulous at this point, I'm only interested in Schoen and Poles because they have no ties to Judge.
I don't want Ziegs and Ossenfort because they would essentially be brought on to support/endorse Judge. And I'm over the "Judge Way".
It's an insult to anyone who follows the Giants intelligence to keep pushing the story that Chris Mara doesn't do anything. He owns the team, he's in personnel meetings, he's in the draft room, he wanted to be the GM of the team, he can't be fired because he's an owner and the brother of the CEO. He has put himself into a position to have the people who work under him to want to please him and suck up to him at the minimum. What human would take a contrarian position against the group if one of the group is an owner? Like I said an insult to a Giant fans intelligence. The whole Chris Mara doesn't do anything garbage treads on Dittino territory.
His comment's on Tim McDonnell were worse. He said has some kind of Mara connection, does a great job and came to the Giants after Charlie Weis hired him at Notre Dame. Some kind of Mara connection? HE'S AN OWNER WHO CAN'T BE FIRED AND IS GOING TO BE THE NEXT CEO OF THE GIANTS. He is the son of Susan Mara, the 2nd old set child of Wellington and Ann Mara born between John and Chris Mara.
So IMO Chris Bisignano revealed himself as someone who is not objective at worst or an awful reporter. I'll still listen but any "inside the building" reporting that comes from him falls under the Dittino media tree for me from now on.
I highly recommend podcast listening as the best way to follow the Giants in the off season. All of the ones I listen to are different and have different perspectives and insights. If you want to follow the Giants search or searches and the draft I think podcasts are the best way to do it. Not for breaking news but for analysis. Let me know if I'm missing any that I should be listening to. I know about both of the Papa Banks podcasts and do listen on occasion.
The Giant Insider - fan podcast with an Internet beat reporter with team access (Bisignano)
Talkin Giants - fan podcast with Bobby Skinner
Blue Rush - NY Post Paul Schwartz and Lawrence Tynes
Big Blue Banter - Gen Z Giant fans who breaking down the all 22
Breaking Big Blue - ESPN Jordan Raanan
NYG Weekly - Gen Z Giant fans
The reason he may be correct on Chris Mara is that he had his last shot of being GM of the Giants come and go. He is 62/63 years old and he had a lot of recent success in horse racing and perhaps that has become his passion, with the Giants only being a part-time gig.
I do not know much about Tim McDonald. Let’s face it, none of us know what really goes on. I personally feel (guess) that Judge had a lot to do with not drafting oline which Gettleman wanted.
Yup. I question Ranaan having legit insight or sources. Right now the GM search is likely involving just a handful of people inside Giants executive suite and I know almost all of them won’t speak to Ranaan.
I will say I’m increasingly optimistic this hire is now going to be from outside. That’s a start. Hopefully they’ll redo the scouting and development side further which really was not improved under Gettleman, only some musical chairs.
Personally though they need to see how a full reset down through coaches is also needed.
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In comment 15535095 Anakim said:
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How can anyone prefer anyone on this list? None of these guys have ever been GMs. We don't know how much of a role they played on their respective teams.
So no one should ever hire a GM who’s never been a GM before? That’s an interesting take.
I think you misinterpreted my comment. The point of my comment was that no one knows here knows anything about these GM hopefuls. I'm not sure how anyone can have favorites or preferences. They're not GMs. For all we know, they could be glorified gofers for their respective teams. We just don't know enough about these execs to prefer one over the other.
OK, sorry about that. I see your point. My response would be that I would look for someone who worked at multiple levels for a team that has built a personnel dept that consistently brings in young talent and depth. Candidates from orgs like Balt, Pitt, GB, etc, at least know how to build a personnel dept.
Now whether they would make a good GM, you’re right, none of us know. A good search and interview process should increase odds that you get a good candidate, but I haven’t seen this franchise show the ability to do that.
I would have gone for someone like Rick Smith or Alonzo Highsmith if you want Rooney Rule
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is likely Rooney rule fodder and Beiniemy will likely NEVER be hired by the Giants based off his past.
I would have gone for someone like Rick Smith or Alonzo Highsmith if you want Rooney Rule
After reading that article yesterday about Smith, someone here linked it from the Athletic, I would look at Smith as a serious GM candidate.
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In comment 15535619 BigBlueCane said:
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is likely Rooney rule fodder and Beiniemy will likely NEVER be hired by the Giants based off his past.
I would have gone for someone like Rick Smith or Alonzo Highsmith if you want Rooney Rule
After reading that article yesterday about Smith, someone here linked it from the Athletic, I would look at Smith as a serious GM candidate.
That’s my point. I want Rooney Rule to be used on someone who has a legit shot at being GM or at least a major role in organization and not just a throw away on someone you will never hire in any role.
Every GM has also started out not being a GM. We can't be picky here. if they can identify a someone who can be a GM, then go for him. Happens with every team.
And miss.
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How some of you hold a vendetta against Riddick for preferring Haskins over Jones when the vast majority of fans wanted the same thing. Hindsight is a bitch ain’t it?
I still say actual GM Riddick would've worked Haskins out and interviewed him and come to the same conclusion as 32 other front offices that he was undraftable. (Even WTF's scouts wanted him off the board, Snyder drafted him).
Riddick was viable in 2017, but I think he's been away from the game too long now in 2021 to be anything more than a sock puppet for Chris Mara and Tim McDonnell. May as well just promote Abrams.
After listening to him on MNF this year, I want nothing to do with him for GM.
Everyone is against Abrams because he’s been working for the Giants for awhile. So be it.
Everyone is against Abrams because he’s been working for the Giants for awhile. So be it.
Can you blame them? It’s reasonable and logical to assign blame to Abrams for some of this current mess and question why if he believed it different and altering moves to make the team better he didn’t do it. Gettleman is the boogeyman and punching bag right now but Abrams and Judge are part of the executive team. Their involvement is significant and sensitive to the actuality of failure that has played out.