I don't know what's scarier, the 50% certainty he would be retained before today (according to Glazer), or the one game 'turnaround' in their feelings after the game. Not good, either way.
I don't know what's scarier, the 50% certainty he would be retained before today (according to Glazer), or the one game 'turnaround' in their feelings after the game. Not good, either way.
It must get done. Keeping Judge would be a black cloud over this fan base all offseason. Mara has done enough to embarass us all. Good riddance Tommy Tuffnutz
said earlier today before the game that the Maras would likely retain him, but after today, especially those two QB sneaks and another dreadful offensive performance, I think he's gone.
“ "They want him gone." - @JayGlazer on people inside the Giants building on head coach Joe Judge ”
Who are the people inside the building? Seems like at least a couple people inside the building have the power to make a decision on his future being they are the ones who sign his checks.
Is very conflicting isn’t it? Your team just got whipped badly by double digits, they finish with a 4-13 record and look pathetic and yet you suddenly feel hopeful and almost like celebrating.
RE: The people inside the building want Judge gone.
I don't know what's scarier, the 50% certainty he would be retained before today (according to Glazer), or the one game 'turnaround' in their feelings after the game. Not good, either way.
that ultimately is the most scary. Like if they won this meaningless game by 3 pts that would be enough to ignore the whole season of ineptitude?
I mean we got lucky we lost but it also gives me no faith the Mara's are basing this decision on on game...
the idea of putting some numerical percentage on it is a joke.
I was 50% sure (that's basically a coin flip, so not sure at all, in any way) now I'm 25% sure. That's just 2 coin flips coming up same way.
How about 31.395%?
Is he 25% now? Or is he rounding? Is it 24.89%?
It's all BS. They're just spouting off about their "feeling" about what might happen. Only one person knows for sure, and probably he doesn't even know because his head's too far up his own backside. But he has to make a decision....
In attitude or belief began after the Philly game. It gained a ton of momentum after the Chicago game and then today, with that white flag mentality inside our own 5 yard line had to be the finishing touches.
The new GM, presumably currently employed, will most likely being their own coach with them.
2022 will be about rebuilding with some victories in mind. This draft- number of selections can help us solidify multiple positions and groups.
Is one of the locker room complainers.
I hope he goes too….or just goes.
I know there’s a big cap hit, but he’s the Solder of WRs.
Golladay has a point though, You bring him in at 15 million per, and you don't have a competent OL or QB to get him the ball..or calling 3rd down QB sneaks on 3rd and 9. I can see his point.
the idea of putting some numerical percentage on it is a joke.
I was 50% sure (that's basically a coin flip, so not sure at all, in any way) now I'm 25% sure. That's just 2 coin flips coming up same way.
How about 31.395%?
Is he 25% now? Or is he rounding? Is it 24.89%?
It's all BS. They're just spouting off about their "feeling" about what might happen. Only one person knows for sure, and probably he doesn't even know because his head's too far up his own backside. But he has to make a decision....
In attitude or belief began after the Philly game. It gained a ton of momentum after the Chicago game and then today, with that white flag mentality inside our own 5 yard line had to be the finishing touches.
The new GM, presumably currently employed, will most likely being their own coach with them.
2022 will be about rebuilding with some victories in mind. This draft- number of selections can help us solidify multiple positions and groups.
I sure hope so buddy. We need a clean reset from top to bottom
the HC, QB, GM and getting rid of any or all them will fix it. The issues run far deeper so don’t expect better results without first addressing and fixing the root causes. Pretty simple concept Eric.
both lasted the season, why is this hard for people to understand? Plus DG is “fired” anyway, just because it wasn’t announced at a podium doesn’t mean it didn’t happen.
Giants issues are far deeper than the HC. Been canning HC’s and GM’s for six years. Don’t let ownership off the hook.
who's letting them off the hook. The Mara's aren't going anywhere you can fire the owners. The only hope is if they give the keys to the new GM and Chris Mara + Mcdonnell are out of player personnel.
the HC, QB, GM and getting rid of any or all them will fix it. The issues run far deeper so don’t expect better results without first addressing and fixing the root causes. Pretty simple concept Eric.
Ownership structure isn’t changing so I guess it’s a doomed franchise for all of eternity?
Bobby Skinner
@BobbySkinner_
Joe Judge could get fired tomorrow and the man most responsible will get to walk away with the facade of a "retirement."
I don't get why anyone gives a shit about the semantics. He's gone, that's all that matters. Now show Judge the door and let's start to rebuild in earnest.
When they look at this season in it’s totality it was a disaster. Judge made bad decisions all year long. In reality, they started around the holidays last season. He’s had ample input into the roster and free agent signings. The QB situation is on him. How Jones has flatlined in red zone play is on him. He’s the HC and picked the staff. Three OL coaches in two years. Playing Solder and Hernandez and Engram nonstop and repeatedly talking them up despite preaching accountability.
He deluded some people with barebones offense and clawing wins middle of the year and his end of year presser criticizing the Eagles, because it shaded attention off the Giants December collapse, losing 3 out of last 4 with poor game plans on both sides of the ball largely to blame.
I wasn’t happy with him as the hire and I’m a results guy. He can take his process to some Division II program. I wish him well, elsewhere.
Are precisely who we should be most worried about right now. If they want judge gone it's probably because their jobs would feel more safe. Not exactly encouraging.
the HC, QB, GM and getting rid of any or all them will fix it. The issues run far deeper so don’t expect better results without first addressing and fixing the root causes. Pretty simple concept Eric.
I don’t disagree, but have to keep swinging the bat. Owners won’t change.
Are precisely who we should be most worried about right now. If they want judge gone it's probably because their jobs would feel more safe. Not exactly encouraging.
I haven't actually seen the clip, but someone wrote above its the players who want him out.
the HC, QB, GM and getting rid of any or all them will fix it. The issues run far deeper so don’t expect better results without first addressing and fixing the root causes. Pretty simple concept Eric.
Giants issues are far deeper than the HC. Been canning HC’s and GM’s for six years. Don’t let ownership off the hook.
who's letting them off the hook. The Mara's aren't going anywhere you can fire the owners. The only hope is if they give the keys to the new GM and Chris Mara + Mcdonnell are out of player personnel.
As I have said many times, the Giants will not start winning again till they start winning the physical battle of a NFL game. The Giants started this losing when they shifted years ago. Look at the recent draft and FA acquisitions and the trend continues. Mara may not get his family members out but he could maybe start with saying, “I think I’ve seen enough of this franchise being pushed around. It needs to stop now.”
From GM to Head Coach, because firing Judge is just same shit different day! No one with current or past ties to this team should be considered for employment! This has been a shit show for too long!!
Are precisely who we should be most worried about right now. If they want judge gone it's probably because their jobs would feel more safe. Not exactly encouraging.
I haven't actually seen the clip, but someone wrote above its the players who want him out.
If it's the players then my point is moot. If it's folks like Petit or Abrams that's just as big of a problem.
Are precisely who we should be most worried about right now. If they want judge gone it's probably because their jobs would feel more safe. Not exactly encouraging.
I haven't actually seen the clip, but someone wrote above its the players who want him out.
If it's the players then my point is moot. If it's folks like Petit or Abrams that's just as big of a problem.
Yea I agree. I'd like to actually watch what he said.
“ "They want him gone." - @JayGlazer on people inside the Giants building on head coach Joe Judge ”
Who are the people inside the building? Seems like at least a couple people inside the building have the power to make a decision on his future being they are the ones who sign his checks.
Meanwhile he quoites glazier, but I ccan't find a link or reference to it anywhere else. Is he paraphrasing, or did Glazier say that, and if so, where?
Giants issues are far deeper than the HC. Been canning HC’s and GM’s for six years. Don’t let ownership off the hook.
who's letting them off the hook. The Mara's aren't going anywhere you can fire the owners. The only hope is if they give the keys to the new GM and Chris Mara + Mcdonnell are out of player personnel.
As I have said many times, the Giants will not start winning again till they start winning the physical battle of a NFL game. The Giants started this losing when they shifted years ago. Look at the recent draft and FA acquisitions and the trend continues. Mara may not get his family members out but he could maybe start with saying, “I think I’ve seen enough of this franchise being pushed around. It needs to stop now.”
That’s the GMs job. Everyone on planet earth knows they need a better line, DG failed at it, not ownership.
the HC, QB, GM and getting rid of any or all them will fix it. The issues run far deeper so don’t expect better results without first addressing and fixing the root causes. Pretty simple concept Eric.
Ownership structure isn’t changing so I guess it’s a doomed franchise for all of eternity?
The ownership structure didn’t change when Young would brought in and Wellington got out of personnel
Up on ownership. Complain all you want but most of us were thrilled when they went outside the box and got Judge and most of us were snowballed by Judge's words/speeches.
Right now cleaning house of a GM who thought his connections to our previous SB teams meant he was the guy to get us back and a Coach who bullshitted his way into a job he was not ready for, is the way to go.
Then once we get folks in place for those jobs, we get a full coaching staff and start planning player acquisition based on our new scheme/identity.
“ "They want him gone." - @JayGlazer on people inside the Giants building on head coach Joe Judge ”
Who are the people inside the building? Seems like at least a couple people inside the building have the power to make a decision on his future being they are the ones who sign his checks.
Meanwhile he quoites glazier, but I ccan't find a link or reference to it anywhere else. Is he paraphrasing, or did Glazier say that, and if so, where?
Zack Rosenblatt
✔
@ZackBlatt
Jay Glazer just said he was at 50% certainty on Joe Judge returning as #Giants coach before today. Now he’s down to 25%.
he is best friends with Strahan. Does anyone think Strahan wants Judge gone so this team improves? Would he have his friend Jay help push this thing over the edge here?
he is best friends with Strahan. Does anyone think Strahan wants Judge gone so this team improves? Would he have his friend Jay help push this thing over the edge here?
What? Some of you are bewildering. As if you never heard of JAY GLAZIER.
Are precisely who we should be most worried about right now. If they want judge gone it's probably because their jobs would feel more safe. Not exactly encouraging.
I haven't actually seen the clip, but someone wrote above its the players who want him out.
I can’t imagine players looked to kindly at those QB sneaks.
jay glazer is a loud mouth, fat, ugly, bad dressing ignoramus who does
not understand probability and the different approaches to arriving at probable conclusions. He and he has compatriots on the tube are one of the reasons i have been losing my interest in sports.
Are precisely who we should be most worried about right now. If they want judge gone it's probably because their jobs would feel more safe. Not exactly encouraging.
I haven't actually seen the clip, but someone wrote above its the players who want him out.
If it's the players then my point is moot. If it's folks like Petit or Abrams that's just as big of a problem.
Yea I agree. I'd like to actually watch what he said.
What the poster reports as being said I can't find, in the comments available that Glazier has made today, so I'm not sure he actually said what's being claimed.
Up on ownership. Complain all you want but most of us were thrilled when they went outside the box and got Judge and most of us were snowballed by Judge's words/speeches.
Right now cleaning house of a GM who thought his connections to our previous SB teams meant he was the guy to get us back and a Coach who bullshitted his way into a job he was not ready for, is the way to go.
Then once we get folks in place for those jobs, we get a full coaching staff and start planning player acquisition based on our new scheme/identity.
Folks get hung up on ownership because it's been the one constant, and with this team it's been really constant in the administrative and scouting departments, like three decades kind of constant. New GMs and coaches are great but if you're hellbent on retaining lifers and family members. Philosophies don't change and things stagnate and eventually rot.
Are precisely who we should be most worried about right now. If they want judge gone it's probably because their jobs would feel more safe. Not exactly encouraging.
I haven't actually seen the clip, but someone wrote above its the players who want him out.
If it's the players then my point is moot. If it's folks like Petit or Abrams that's just as big of a problem.
Yea I agree. I'd like to actually watch what he said.
What the poster reports as being said I can't find, in the comments available that Glazier has made today, so I'm not sure he actually said what's being claimed.
Giants issues are far deeper than the HC. Been canning HC’s and GM’s for six years. Don’t let ownership off the hook.
What does this even mean?
I think it means that owners and owners nephews who have held front office positions while the team has been dreadful need to go too. Which is true but not realistic. Judge being canned will satisfy my blood lust. For now
the HC, QB, GM and getting rid of any or all them will fix it. The issues run far deeper so don’t expect better results without first addressing and fixing the root causes. Pretty simple concept Eric.
Ownership structure isn’t changing so I guess it’s a doomed franchise for all of eternity?
That seems to be the implication, unless he's advocating for extra-judicial measures to remove ownership. I don't see a way to force them to do our bidding legally.
Coach. But he’s further proof that Belichick’s success is unique and you can’t assume anyone who breathed the same air is going to replicate his results.
Talkin Giants has it. He did indeed say he spoke to people in the locker room who want him gone.
Thanks. He said "people inside the locker room" want him gone which probably means players rather, than the "building" which would infer perhaps other staff.
Talkin Giants has it. He did indeed say he spoke to people in the locker room who want him gone.
Thanks. He said "people inside the locker room" want him gone which probably means players rather, than the "building" which would infer perhaps other staff.
What? Some of you are bewildering. As if you never heard of JAY GLAZIER.
yeah, I have no idea who Jay Glazier is. However Jay Glazer, a supposed insider to come out on Twitter saying 50/50 says he does not know shit. Everyone here says it is 50/50. We dont need Glazer for that.
The decision has already been made by Mara. It is either 100% he stays or 100% he goes. If Jay knows the scoop... then he would tell us... but he doesn't.
Talkin Giants has it. He did indeed say he spoke to people in the locker room who want him gone.
Thanks. He said "people inside the locker room" want him gone which probably means players rather, than the "building" which would infer perhaps other staff.
This makes Carl Banks’ shilling that more embarrassing. For 3 weeks he’s talked about “culture and how he hasn’t lost the locker room.” Last week he talked about player development under Judge and listed Thomas, McKinney, Lemeuix (when called out he said he meant Gates) AZeez, cam brown and Elerson Smith. I wonder who state media pivots too in their pathetic rara effort to shift the blame from the man who signs their paycheck
not understand probability and the different approaches to arriving at probable conclusions. He and he has compatriots on the tube are one of the reasons i have been losing my interest in sports.
This is a really bad take and you obviously don’t know much about Jay Glazer. Ignorance is bliss I suppose.
What? Some of you are bewildering. As if you never heard of JAY GLAZIER.
yeah, I have no idea who Jay Glazier is. However Jay Glazer, a supposed insider to come out on Twitter saying 50/50 says he does not know shit. Everyone here says it is 50/50. We dont need Glazer for that.
The decision has already been made by Mara. It is either 100% he stays or 100% he goes. If Jay knows the scoop... then he would tell us... but he doesn't.
Is friends with Strahan and lots of players. He’s well connected in the NY sports landscape.
I can tell you right now he’s likely a guy who has direct contacts with guys like Leonard Williams and Logan Ryan. Intuitively, my gut tells me Williams is probably one of the players ticked off.
Handley was 14-18 so there is no comparison. Went to my first game in1976 McVay was coach for the next couple of years Who was very bad and he went 14-23 and I thought it could never get worse!!?
Bobby Skinner
@BobbySkinner_
Joe Judge could get fired tomorrow and the man most responsible will get to walk away with the facade of a "retirement."
I don't get why anyone gives a shit about the semantics. He's gone, that's all that matters. Now show Judge the door and let's start to rebuild in earnest.
Agreed, we shouldnt care hown they go as long as they go!
RE: jay glazer is a loud mouth, fat, ugly, bad dressing ignoramus who does
not understand probability and the different approaches to arriving at probable conclusions. He and he has compatriots on the tube are one of the reasons i have been losing my interest in sports.
Didn't you write this a few days ago:
Quote:
Many of you have turned BBI, a great example of sports private enterprise, into a foul, gutter reading fan form. Just try to raise the level a bit, act like true giant fans who criticize without stooping into the gutter to do so.
Comments like this don't really add anything to the discussion or raise the level of discussion.
Handley was 14-18 so there is no comparison. Went to my first game in1976 McVay was coach for the next couple of years Who was very bad and he went 14-23 and I thought it could never get worse!!?
Hand**y went 14-18 with a team that went 13-3 the year before he took over, and 11-5 the year after. Both years winning the division. He was the worst. He had good talent and just killed the team. That is much worse than starting with crap and not being able to make it better
RE: RE: jay glazer is a loud mouth, fat, ugly, bad dressing ignoramus who does
not understand probability and the different approaches to arriving at probable conclusions. He and he has compatriots on the tube are one of the reasons i have been losing my interest in sports.
Didn't you write this a few days ago:
Quote:
Many of you have turned BBI, a great example of sports private enterprise, into a foul, gutter reading fan form. Just try to raise the level a bit, act like true giant fans who criticize without stooping into the gutter to do so.
Comments like this don't really add anything to the discussion or raise the level of discussion.
Is Ownership is getting some good advice that retaining Joe would incredibly limit his GM search.
Except that doesn’t matter since it has been debated here that Chris and Tim are the ones in house running most of the show anyway. In fact, John Mara wants a limited GM search...
RE: You think Judge will be back on Patriots staff
Is Ownership is getting some good advice that retaining Joe would incredibly limit his GM search.
Except that doesn’t matter since it has been debated here that Chris and Tim are the ones in house running most of the show anyway. In fact, John Mara wants a limited GM search...
Chris is busy with his horses according to Schwartz. Drops in a couple meetings a year and does a couple player evaluations!
Owner's have shown their feelings wax and wane each week
not understand probability and the different approaches to arriving at probable conclusions. He and he has compatriots on the tube are one of the reasons i have been losing my interest in sports.
Didn't you write this a few days ago:
Quote:
Many of you have turned BBI, a great example of sports private enterprise, into a foul, gutter reading fan form. Just try to raise the level a bit, act like true giant fans who criticize without stooping into the gutter to do so.
Comments like this don't really add anything to the discussion or raise the level of discussion.
Nice...
RE: Owner's have shown their feelings wax and wane each week
5-12 should not have altered their thinking. There is no long term plan.
Exactly. Firing Judge bc they’re embarrassed by the last couple weeks (which they should be) on its own does very little to change the long term structural issues with the org
Is Ownership is getting some good advice that retaining Joe would incredibly limit his GM search.
Except that doesn’t matter since it has been debated here that Chris and Tim are the ones in house running most of the show anyway. In fact, John Mara wants a limited GM search...
Chris is busy with his horses according to Schwartz. Drops in a couple meetings a year and does a couple player evaluations!
Not according to numerous posters I have been discussing this topic with for weeks. Some think he is intimately involved and overrules GM decisions. Others have suggested the past decade of decline neatly aligns with his presence in the front office,
He started the season with a loss against a lower tier team with a healthy Giants team that we all expected to compete for a playoff spot. Remember all the talk about how good the defense was? Remember all the weapons that Jones was gonna have?
The team never got any better. It’s probably something that most of us have forgotten but the Giants were out of the plays after 4 games. Did anyone think this team was going to the playoffs the week before Halloween? The Giants were a bad football team all season.
The offense was horrible. Bob Papa had some stats on the post game that were unbelievably horrific. The offense just got worse as the season went on.
And remember, Judge fired Jason Garrett. And the offense got worse. I mean, what the heck has Judge done well? Nothing.
Don’t give me this culture horse hockey. The Giants are a poorly prepared team of losers. They’re soft too. I was watching the Rams and Niners on delay just now. Either one of those teams would knock the snot out of Judges Giants. Joe Judge coached like a wussy. He team played like a bunch of wussies. Soft, poorly prepared losers. Fire him tomorrow.
G.T Bobby Thompson
@BThomps81
Report: the feeling around the #Giants organization is that HC Joe Judge will be fired
6:20 PM · Jan 9, 2022·Twitter for iPhone
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I think Judge learned to be a head coach from Friday Night Lights.
“Clear eyes, full hearts, can’t lose”
Just a weird dude. Or maybe he is too weird for NYC. Either way I hope he is gone and finds success somewhere else. He is a perfect college coach to be honest, control freak megalomaniac.
I'm the furthest thing from a Jason Garrett fan, but it doesn't seem like much of a reach to think that might have left other assistants with a bad taste in their mouths.
I'm the furthest thing from a Jason Garrett fan, but it doesn't seem like much of a reach to think that might have left other assistants with a bad taste in their mouths.
The great thing about being raised in NY, you are taught early, to believe what you see.
He started the season with a loss against a lower tier team with a healthy Giants team that we all expected to compete for a playoff spot. Remember all the talk about how good the defense was? Remember all the weapons that Jones was gonna have?
The team never got any better. It’s probably something that most of us have forgotten but the Giants were out of the plays after 4 games. Did anyone think this team was going to the playoffs the week before Halloween? The Giants were a bad football team all season.
The offense was horrible. Bob Papa had some stats on the post game that were unbelievably horrific. The offense just got worse as the season went on.
And remember, Judge fired Jason Garrett. And the offense got worse. I mean, what the heck has Judge done well? Nothing.
Don’t give me this culture horse hockey. The Giants are a poorly prepared team of losers. They’re soft too. I was watching the Rams and Niners on delay just now. Either one of those teams would knock the snot out of Judges Giants. Joe Judge coached like a wussy. He team played like a bunch of wussies. Soft, poorly prepared losers. Fire him tomorrow.
Jay Glazer
@JayGlazer
I believe Giants brass is torn on what to do w Joe Judge bc of revolving door of coaches they’ve had in recent years. Have hesitation to move on bc they’d add to that revolving door. At same time I have heard a ton of frustration inside that locker room. Not a little, a lot
11:00 PM · Jan 9, 2022·Twitter for iPhone
Jay Glazer
@JayGlazer
I believe Giants brass is torn on what to do w Joe Judge bc of revolving door of coaches they’ve had in recent years. Have hesitation to move on bc they’d add to that revolving door. At same time I have heard a ton of frustration inside that locker room. Not a little, a lot
11:00 PM · Jan 9, 2022·Twitter for iPhone
glazer twitter - ( New Window )
Awful logic by Mara. Judge signed sealed and delivered his firing with the 0-6 performances.
Jay Glazer
@JayGlazer
I believe Giants brass is torn on what to do w Joe Judge bc of revolving door of coaches they’ve had in recent years. Have hesitation to move on bc they’d add to that revolving door. At same time I have heard a ton of frustration inside that locker room. Not a little, a lot
11:00 PM · Jan 9, 2022·Twitter for iPhone
So does this locker room frustration mean that Judge has been trying to blow smoke when talking about the great culture he's been building the last two years?
glazer twitter - ( New Window )
I think the press conference last week was the tipping point
He was basically pleading for his job, claiming that player character under his guidance counts for more than the won-lost record. His pleading made him seem weak and desperate - and players do not respond to weak coaches. Mara and others gauged player reaction and made their decision.
for a second and concentrate on the product that has been on the field the last 2 years? It's awful. The playcalling, the "teaching", all of the stuff he talked about. He didn't deliver on any of it. He may have good ideas, but he has no idea how to achieve them.
for a second and concentrate on the product that has been on the field the last 2 years? It's awful. The playcalling, the "teaching", all of the stuff he talked about. He didn't deliver on any of it. He may have good ideas, but he has no idea how to achieve them.
I'm ready for a new head coach.
I'm with you brother. We absolutely suck at acquiring talent. PERIOD! Last SB we had talent on the field. Scored points, stopped the run and wasn't Mara the owner back then? What has happened in the last 10 years? Why were we "successful" back then? Everyone, me included, wants to blame someone but it's never just ONE person. Like Eric said we just don't know what's going on. Two GMs and FOUR coaches later we are still in the same boat. I was watching the Chiefs game Saturday evening and when Hunt when down who replaces him? Another clone! Where do they find these players and why can't we do the same? I am actually scared about having two #1 draft picks because I fear we will just pick the wrong players.
RE: I think the press conference last week was the tipping point
He was basically pleading for his job, claiming that player character under his guidance counts for more than the won-lost record. His pleading made him seem weak and desperate - and players do not respond to weak coaches. Mara and others gauged player reaction and made their decision.
let that paralyze your thinking. I don't see how Judge and staff or the Front office survive this. I lived through the '70s and this is worse. There is nothing this team does well. At least in the '70s you could root for the D and Dave Jennings, Doug Kotar on offense.
QB plunge on 3rd and 9 at your own 4?? Really?? Completely inept.
RE: RE: I think the press conference last week was the tipping point
He was basically pleading for his job, claiming that player character under his guidance counts for more than the won-lost record. His pleading made him seem weak and desperate - and players do not respond to weak coaches. Mara and others gauged player reaction and made their decision.
Pleading you say?
Jon Snow Beheads Janos Slynt Game of Thrones - ( New Window )
Kinda gruesome. I once read that after a beheading the head lives for some period of time before finally dying. Not pleasant.
for a second and concentrate on the product that has been on the field the last 2 years? It's awful. The playcalling, the "teaching", all of the stuff he talked about. He didn't deliver on any of it. He may have good ideas, but he has no idea how to achieve them.
I'm ready for a new head coach.
I'm with you brother. We absolutely suck at acquiring talent. PERIOD! Last SB we had talent on the field. Scored points, stopped the run and wasn't Mara the owner back then? What has happened in the last 10 years? Why were we "successful" back then? Everyone, me included, wants to blame someone but it's never just ONE person. Like Eric said we just don't know what's going on. Two GMs and FOUR coaches later we are still in the same boat. I was watching the Chiefs game Saturday evening and when Hunt when down who replaces him? Another clone! Where do they find these players and why can't we do the same? I am actually scared about having two #1 draft picks because I fear we will just pick the wrong players.
this is the problem.
from 2015 - 2017, the "3 e's" erick flowers, eli apple, evan engram: no difference makers.
2018 we take a running back
2019 3 first round picks, no real difference makers. Jones was a gamble but it doesn't look like it paid off.
2020 we take AT. this is the first real difference maker.
2021 we take KT, can't stay on the field. we do get a first in 2022, but if we don't do something with it what difference does that make?
so from 2015-2021 we use 9 first round picks and have (as of today) only 1 person on the roster that we can call a difference maker.
so have 2 picks this year doesn't give me great comfort. but it is exciting to think about the possibilities from now until when they actually get on the field.
Alas, mercifully another Giants season is in the books.
We can look forward to some of the favorite pastimes on BBI,
will the GM go, will the HC go...where are the Giants situated in the draft, this is all we got around here
with this ongoing shitshow of an organization.
OH yeah, Judge needs to go too!
Guess some players really didn’t buy in…
This.
Kind of scary if true.
It must get done. Keeping Judge would be a black cloud over this fan base all offseason. Mara has done enough to embarass us all. Good riddance Tommy Tuffnutz
I hope he goes too….or just goes.
I know there’s a big cap hit, but he’s the Solder of WRs.
Who are the people inside the building? Seems like at least a couple people inside the building have the power to make a decision on his future being they are the ones who sign his checks.
haha - exactly
that ultimately is the most scary. Like if they won this meaningless game by 3 pts that would be enough to ignore the whole season of ineptitude?
I mean we got lucky we lost but it also gives me no faith the Mara's are basing this decision on on game...
Good Lord.
I was 50% sure (that's basically a coin flip, so not sure at all, in any way) now I'm 25% sure. That's just 2 coin flips coming up same way.
How about 31.395%?
Is he 25% now? Or is he rounding? Is it 24.89%?
It's all BS. They're just spouting off about their "feeling" about what might happen. Only one person knows for sure, and probably he doesn't even know because his head's too far up his own backside. But he has to make a decision....
The new GM, presumably currently employed, will most likely being their own coach with them.
2022 will be about rebuilding with some victories in mind. This draft- number of selections can help us solidify multiple positions and groups.
I hope he goes too….or just goes.
I know there’s a big cap hit, but he’s the Solder of WRs.
Golladay has a point though, You bring him in at 15 million per, and you don't have a competent OL or QB to get him the ball..or calling 3rd down QB sneaks on 3rd and 9. I can see his point.
I was 50% sure (that's basically a coin flip, so not sure at all, in any way) now I'm 25% sure. That's just 2 coin flips coming up same way.
How about 31.395%?
Is he 25% now? Or is he rounding? Is it 24.89%?
It's all BS. They're just spouting off about their "feeling" about what might happen. Only one person knows for sure, and probably he doesn't even know because his head's too far up his own backside. But he has to make a decision....
Have you ever heard of Jay Glazier?
What does this even mean?
The new GM, presumably currently employed, will most likely being their own coach with them.
2022 will be about rebuilding with some victories in mind. This draft- number of selections can help us solidify multiple positions and groups.
I sure hope so buddy. We need a clean reset from top to bottom
@BobbySkinner_
Joe Judge could get fired tomorrow and the man most responsible will get to walk away with the facade of a "retirement."
Quote:
Bobby Skinner
@BobbySkinner_
Joe Judge could get fired tomorrow and the man most responsible will get to walk away with the facade of a "retirement."
This is BS. Everyone knows Gettleman is being fired, just like everyone knew Coughlin was being fired.
who's letting them off the hook. The Mara's aren't going anywhere you can fire the owners. The only hope is if they give the keys to the new GM and Chris Mara + Mcdonnell are out of player personnel.
Ownership structure isn’t changing so I guess it’s a doomed franchise for all of eternity?
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Bobby Skinner
@BobbySkinner_
Joe Judge could get fired tomorrow and the man most responsible will get to walk away with the facade of a "retirement."
I don't get why anyone gives a shit about the semantics. He's gone, that's all that matters. Now show Judge the door and let's start to rebuild in earnest.
He deluded some people with barebones offense and clawing wins middle of the year and his end of year presser criticizing the Eagles, because it shaded attention off the Giants December collapse, losing 3 out of last 4 with poor game plans on both sides of the ball largely to blame.
I wasn’t happy with him as the hire and I’m a results guy. He can take his process to some Division II program. I wish him well, elsewhere.
I don’t disagree, but have to keep swinging the bat. Owners won’t change.
I haven't actually seen the clip, but someone wrote above its the players who want him out.
What are root causes if they aren’t GM HC and QB?
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Giants issues are far deeper than the HC. Been canning HC’s and GM’s for six years. Don’t let ownership off the hook.
who's letting them off the hook. The Mara's aren't going anywhere you can fire the owners. The only hope is if they give the keys to the new GM and Chris Mara + Mcdonnell are out of player personnel.
As I have said many times, the Giants will not start winning again till they start winning the physical battle of a NFL game. The Giants started this losing when they shifted years ago. Look at the recent draft and FA acquisitions and the trend continues. Mara may not get his family members out but he could maybe start with saying, “I think I’ve seen enough of this franchise being pushed around. It needs to stop now.”
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Are precisely who we should be most worried about right now. If they want judge gone it's probably because their jobs would feel more safe. Not exactly encouraging.
I haven't actually seen the clip, but someone wrote above its the players who want him out.
If it's the players then my point is moot. If it's folks like Petit or Abrams that's just as big of a problem.
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In comment 15539880 middleground said:
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Are precisely who we should be most worried about right now. If they want judge gone it's probably because their jobs would feel more safe. Not exactly encouraging.
I haven't actually seen the clip, but someone wrote above its the players who want him out.
If it's the players then my point is moot. If it's folks like Petit or Abrams that's just as big of a problem.
Yea I agree. I'd like to actually watch what he said.
Is this a new rumor?
Who are the people inside the building? Seems like at least a couple people inside the building have the power to make a decision on his future being they are the ones who sign his checks.
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In comment 15539838 Lines of Scrimmage said:
Quote:
Giants issues are far deeper than the HC. Been canning HC’s and GM’s for six years. Don’t let ownership off the hook.
who's letting them off the hook. The Mara's aren't going anywhere you can fire the owners. The only hope is if they give the keys to the new GM and Chris Mara + Mcdonnell are out of player personnel.
As I have said many times, the Giants will not start winning again till they start winning the physical battle of a NFL game. The Giants started this losing when they shifted years ago. Look at the recent draft and FA acquisitions and the trend continues. Mara may not get his family members out but he could maybe start with saying, “I think I’ve seen enough of this franchise being pushed around. It needs to stop now.”
That’s the GMs job. Everyone on planet earth knows they need a better line, DG failed at it, not ownership.
Quote:
the HC, QB, GM and getting rid of any or all them will fix it. The issues run far deeper so don’t expect better results without first addressing and fixing the root causes. Pretty simple concept Eric.
Ownership structure isn’t changing so I guess it’s a doomed franchise for all of eternity?
The ownership structure didn’t change when Young would brought in and Wellington got out of personnel
It will be ugly, but Mara has run this franchise into the ground.
Today was another disgrace.
4 years to 2, so maybe only half as bad...
Right now cleaning house of a GM who thought his connections to our previous SB teams meant he was the guy to get us back and a Coach who bullshitted his way into a job he was not ready for, is the way to go.
Then once we get folks in place for those jobs, we get a full coaching staff and start planning player acquisition based on our new scheme/identity.
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Giants issues are far deeper than the HC. Been canning HC’s and GM’s for six years. Don’t let ownership off the hook.
What does this even mean?
Bring someone from the outside
Quote:
“ "They want him gone." - @JayGlazer on people inside the Giants building on head coach Joe Judge ”
Who are the people inside the building? Seems like at least a couple people inside the building have the power to make a decision on his future being they are the ones who sign his checks.
Meanwhile he quoites glazier, but I ccan't find a link or reference to it anywhere else. Is he paraphrasing, or did Glazier say that, and if so, where?
Zack Rosenblatt
✔
@ZackBlatt
Jay Glazer just said he was at 50% certainty on Joe Judge returning as #Giants coach before today. Now he’s down to 25%.
That's hard to believe. Didn't he hand-pick the entire staff from his prior relationships?
What? Some of you are bewildering. As if you never heard of JAY GLAZIER.
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Are precisely who we should be most worried about right now. If they want judge gone it's probably because their jobs would feel more safe. Not exactly encouraging.
I haven't actually seen the clip, but someone wrote above its the players who want him out.
I can’t imagine players looked to kindly at those QB sneaks.
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In comment 15539891 bleedgiantsblue said:
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In comment 15539880 middleground said:
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Are precisely who we should be most worried about right now. If they want judge gone it's probably because their jobs would feel more safe. Not exactly encouraging.
I haven't actually seen the clip, but someone wrote above its the players who want him out.
If it's the players then my point is moot. If it's folks like Petit or Abrams that's just as big of a problem.
Yea I agree. I'd like to actually watch what he said.
Right now cleaning house of a GM who thought his connections to our previous SB teams meant he was the guy to get us back and a Coach who bullshitted his way into a job he was not ready for, is the way to go.
Then once we get folks in place for those jobs, we get a full coaching staff and start planning player acquisition based on our new scheme/identity.
Folks get hung up on ownership because it's been the one constant, and with this team it's been really constant in the administrative and scouting departments, like three decades kind of constant. New GMs and coaches are great but if you're hellbent on retaining lifers and family members. Philosophies don't change and things stagnate and eventually rot.
Talkin Giants has it. He did indeed say he spoke to people in the locker room who want him gone.
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In comment 15539909 middleground said:
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In comment 15539891 bleedgiantsblue said:
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In comment 15539880 middleground said:
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Are precisely who we should be most worried about right now. If they want judge gone it's probably because their jobs would feel more safe. Not exactly encouraging.
I haven't actually seen the clip, but someone wrote above its the players who want him out.
If it's the players then my point is moot. If it's folks like Petit or Abrams that's just as big of a problem.
Yea I agree. I'd like to actually watch what he said.
What the poster reports as being said I can't find, in the comments available that Glazier has made today, so I'm not sure he actually said what's being claimed.
Good note. Thanks.
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Giants issues are far deeper than the HC. Been canning HC’s and GM’s for six years. Don’t let ownership off the hook.
What does this even mean?
I think it means that owners and owners nephews who have held front office positions while the team has been dreadful need to go too. Which is true but not realistic. Judge being canned will satisfy my blood lust. For now
Quote:
the HC, QB, GM and getting rid of any or all them will fix it. The issues run far deeper so don’t expect better results without first addressing and fixing the root causes. Pretty simple concept Eric.
Ownership structure isn’t changing so I guess it’s a doomed franchise for all of eternity?
Quote:
Can't find it on Twitter.
Talkin Giants has it. He did indeed say he spoke to people in the locker room who want him gone.
Thanks. He said "people inside the locker room" want him gone which probably means players rather, than the "building" which would infer perhaps other staff.
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In comment 15539981 GFAN52 said:
Quote:
Can't find it on Twitter.
Talkin Giants has it. He did indeed say he spoke to people in the locker room who want him gone.
Thanks. He said "people inside the locker room" want him gone which probably means players rather, than the "building" which would infer perhaps other staff.
TY
One would hope that's the case. As long as it's not Ernie Accorsi...lol
https://twitter.com/talkingiants/status/1480345612864442370?s=21
What? Some of you are bewildering. As if you never heard of JAY GLAZIER.
yeah, I have no idea who Jay Glazier is. However Jay Glazer, a supposed insider to come out on Twitter saying 50/50 says he does not know shit. Everyone here says it is 50/50. We dont need Glazer for that.
The decision has already been made by Mara. It is either 100% he stays or 100% he goes. If Jay knows the scoop... then he would tell us... but he doesn't.
McDaniels got turfed and joined them for the 2011 playoff run
Every once in awhile information passes my way, and i heard the Giants are looking for a new HC starting tomorrow. We’ll see
Glazer video - ( New Window )
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In comment 15539981 GFAN52 said:
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Can't find it on Twitter.
Talkin Giants has it. He did indeed say he spoke to people in the locker room who want him gone.
Thanks. He said "people inside the locker room" want him gone which probably means players rather, than the "building" which would infer perhaps other staff.
This makes Carl Banks’ shilling that more embarrassing. For 3 weeks he’s talked about “culture and how he hasn’t lost the locker room.” Last week he talked about player development under Judge and listed Thomas, McKinney, Lemeuix (when called out he said he meant Gates) AZeez, cam brown and Elerson Smith. I wonder who state media pivots too in their pathetic rara effort to shift the blame from the man who signs their paycheck
Every once in awhile information passes my way, and i heard the Giants are looking for a new HC starting tomorrow. We’ll see
I agree and thanks for the tidbit. I hope you are correct. Seems most signs are pointing this way.
This is a really bad take and you obviously don’t know much about Jay Glazer. Ignorance is bliss I suppose.
Every once in awhile information passes my way, and i heard the Giants are looking for a new HC starting tomorrow. We’ll see
I assume its just semantics but
I would hope they would hire the GM before the HC...and let the GM pick his HC.
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What? Some of you are bewildering. As if you never heard of JAY GLAZIER.
yeah, I have no idea who Jay Glazier is. However Jay Glazer, a supposed insider to come out on Twitter saying 50/50 says he does not know shit. Everyone here says it is 50/50. We dont need Glazer for that.
The decision has already been made by Mara. It is either 100% he stays or 100% he goes. If Jay knows the scoop... then he would tell us... but he doesn't.
He just did...
I can tell you right now he’s likely a guy who has direct contacts with guys like Leonard Williams and Logan Ryan. Intuitively, my gut tells me Williams is probably one of the players ticked off.
THIS
Keep the focus on the inept and overbearing owners, meddling family in personnel, and shit organizational scouting.
Handley was 14-18 so there is no comparison. Went to my first game in1976 McVay was coach for the next couple of years Who was very bad and he went 14-23 and I thought it could never get worse!!?
Bring someone from the outside
+100
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Bobby Skinner
@BobbySkinner_
Joe Judge could get fired tomorrow and the man most responsible will get to walk away with the facade of a "retirement."
I don't get why anyone gives a shit about the semantics. He's gone, that's all that matters. Now show Judge the door and let's start to rebuild in earnest.
Didn't you write this a few days ago:
Comments like this don't really add anything to the discussion or raise the level of discussion.
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He is worse than Ray Handley.
Handley was 14-18 so there is no comparison. Went to my first game in1976 McVay was coach for the next couple of years Who was very bad and he went 14-23 and I thought it could never get worse!!?
Hand**y went 14-18 with a team that went 13-3 the year before he took over, and 11-5 the year after. Both years winning the division. He was the worst. He had good talent and just killed the team. That is much worse than starting with crap and not being able to make it better
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not understand probability and the different approaches to arriving at probable conclusions. He and he has compatriots on the tube are one of the reasons i have been losing my interest in sports.
Didn't you write this a few days ago:
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Many of you have turned BBI, a great example of sports private enterprise, into a foul, gutter reading fan form. Just try to raise the level a bit, act like true giant fans who criticize without stooping into the gutter to do so.
Comments like this don't really add anything to the discussion or raise the level of discussion.
Nice...
Except that doesn’t matter since it has been debated here that Chris and Tim are the ones in house running most of the show anyway. In fact, John Mara wants a limited GM search...
McDaniels got turfed and joined them for the 2011 playoff run
LOL, that would be funny.
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Is Ownership is getting some good advice that retaining Joe would incredibly limit his GM search.
Except that doesn’t matter since it has been debated here that Chris and Tim are the ones in house running most of the show anyway. In fact, John Mara wants a limited GM search...
Chris is busy with his horses according to Schwartz. Drops in a couple meetings a year and does a couple player evaluations!
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In comment 15539985 plato said:
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not understand probability and the different approaches to arriving at probable conclusions. He and he has compatriots on the tube are one of the reasons i have been losing my interest in sports.
Didn't you write this a few days ago:
Quote:
Many of you have turned BBI, a great example of sports private enterprise, into a foul, gutter reading fan form. Just try to raise the level a bit, act like true giant fans who criticize without stooping into the gutter to do so.
Comments like this don't really add anything to the discussion or raise the level of discussion.
Nice...
Exactly. Firing Judge bc they’re embarrassed by the last couple weeks (which they should be) on its own does very little to change the long term structural issues with the org
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In comment 15540022 RAIN said:
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Is Ownership is getting some good advice that retaining Joe would incredibly limit his GM search.
Except that doesn’t matter since it has been debated here that Chris and Tim are the ones in house running most of the show anyway. In fact, John Mara wants a limited GM search...
Chris is busy with his horses according to Schwartz. Drops in a couple meetings a year and does a couple player evaluations!
Not according to numerous posters I have been discussing this topic with for weeks. Some think he is intimately involved and overrules GM decisions. Others have suggested the past decade of decline neatly aligns with his presence in the front office,
This is all so confusing. Or is it...
Guys...where are you?
The team never got any better. It’s probably something that most of us have forgotten but the Giants were out of the plays after 4 games. Did anyone think this team was going to the playoffs the week before Halloween? The Giants were a bad football team all season.
The offense was horrible. Bob Papa had some stats on the post game that were unbelievably horrific. The offense just got worse as the season went on.
And remember, Judge fired Jason Garrett. And the offense got worse. I mean, what the heck has Judge done well? Nothing.
Don’t give me this culture horse hockey. The Giants are a poorly prepared team of losers. They’re soft too. I was watching the Rams and Niners on delay just now. Either one of those teams would knock the snot out of Judges Giants. Joe Judge coached like a wussy. He team played like a bunch of wussies. Soft, poorly prepared losers. Fire him tomorrow.
Maybe Judge got wind and that is why he is trying to get the Giants to keep Abrams
Can you imagine Bill Parcells ever making such a call.
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Never saw that from the Giants before. Just curl up and die like that.
Can you imagine Bill Parcells ever making such a call.
Plus, I'm sure he's not thrilled that he'll have to pay all these coaches (Shurmur, Judge, the new HC...are we still on the hook for McAdoodoo?)
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In comment 15540223 MartyNJ1969 said:
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Never saw that from the Giants before. Just curl up and die like that.
Can you imagine Bill Parcells ever making such a call.
I would have like to heard what Madden would have said about that call.
Why not just hand off to Barkley? And based on that answer you should have the reason why he doesn’t get a second contract...
“Clear eyes, full hearts, can’t lose”
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are Judge is not well liked amongst his own staff either.
That's hard to believe. Didn't he hand-pick the entire staff from his prior relationships?
Not hard to believe at all. He could be a totally different guy to work for and have as your boss vs the guy he was when you were on the same level.
@BThomps81
Report: the feeling around the #Giants organization is that HC Joe Judge will be fired
6:20 PM · Jan 9, 2022·Twitter for iPhone
435
Retweets
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There ya go. Mara only has to pay for 3.
“Clear eyes, full hearts, can’t lose”
Just a weird dude. Or maybe he is too weird for NYC. Either way I hope he is gone and finds success somewhere else. He is a perfect college coach to be honest, control freak megalomaniac.
Just because they were his personal connections doesnt mean hes a not a complete dick to work for.
The great thing about being raised in NY, you are taught early, to believe what you see.
He seems destined for the Saban school of rehab, and then a replacement for Leach when that guy inevitably does something stupid.
n comment 15540196 trueblueinpw said:
The team never got any better. It’s probably something that most of us have forgotten but the Giants were out of the plays after 4 games. Did anyone think this team was going to the playoffs the week before Halloween? The Giants were a bad football team all season.
The offense was horrible. Bob Papa had some stats on the post game that were unbelievably horrific. The offense just got worse as the season went on.
And remember, Judge fired Jason Garrett. And the offense got worse. I mean, what the heck has Judge done well? Nothing.
Don’t give me this culture horse hockey. The Giants are a poorly prepared team of losers. They’re soft too. I was watching the Rams and Niners on delay just now. Either one of those teams would knock the snot out of Judges Giants. Joe Judge coached like a wussy. He team played like a bunch of wussies. Soft, poorly prepared losers. Fire him tomorrow.
Jay Glazer
@JayGlazer
I believe Giants brass is torn on what to do w Joe Judge bc of revolving door of coaches they’ve had in recent years. Have hesitation to move on bc they’d add to that revolving door. At same time I have heard a ton of frustration inside that locker room. Not a little, a lot
11:00 PM · Jan 9, 2022·Twitter for iPhone
glazer twitter - ( New Window )
Jay Glazer
@JayGlazer
I believe Giants brass is torn on what to do w Joe Judge bc of revolving door of coaches they’ve had in recent years. Have hesitation to move on bc they’d add to that revolving door. At same time I have heard a ton of frustration inside that locker room. Not a little, a lot
11:00 PM · Jan 9, 2022·Twitter for iPhone
glazer twitter - ( New Window )
Awful logic by Mara. Judge signed sealed and delivered his firing with the 0-6 performances.
Jay Glazer
@JayGlazer
I believe Giants brass is torn on what to do w Joe Judge bc of revolving door of coaches they’ve had in recent years. Have hesitation to move on bc they’d add to that revolving door. At same time I have heard a ton of frustration inside that locker room. Not a little, a lot
11:00 PM · Jan 9, 2022·Twitter for iPhone
So does this locker room frustration mean that Judge has been trying to blow smoke when talking about the great culture he's been building the last two years?
glazer twitter - ( New Window )
I'm ready for a new head coach.
I'm ready for a new head coach.
I'm with you brother. We absolutely suck at acquiring talent. PERIOD! Last SB we had talent on the field. Scored points, stopped the run and wasn't Mara the owner back then? What has happened in the last 10 years? Why were we "successful" back then? Everyone, me included, wants to blame someone but it's never just ONE person. Like Eric said we just don't know what's going on. Two GMs and FOUR coaches later we are still in the same boat. I was watching the Chiefs game Saturday evening and when Hunt when down who replaces him? Another clone! Where do they find these players and why can't we do the same? I am actually scared about having two #1 draft picks because I fear we will just pick the wrong players.
Pleading you say?
Jon Snow Beheads Janos Slynt Game of Thrones - ( New Window )
It means Mara's are incompetent. Changing GM and coach won't fix Giants as long as Mara's stay involved. Quote:
Giants issues are far deeper than the HC. Been canning HC’s and GM’s for six years. Don’t let ownership off the hook.
What does this even mean?
QB plunge on 3rd and 9 at your own 4?? Really?? Completely inept.
Quote:
He was basically pleading for his job, claiming that player character under his guidance counts for more than the won-lost record. His pleading made him seem weak and desperate - and players do not respond to weak coaches. Mara and others gauged player reaction and made their decision.
Pleading you say?
Jon Snow Beheads Janos Slynt Game of Thrones - ( New Window )
Kinda gruesome. I once read that after a beheading the head lives for some period of time before finally dying. Not pleasant.
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for a second and concentrate on the product that has been on the field the last 2 years? It's awful. The playcalling, the "teaching", all of the stuff he talked about. He didn't deliver on any of it. He may have good ideas, but he has no idea how to achieve them.
I'm ready for a new head coach.
I'm with you brother. We absolutely suck at acquiring talent. PERIOD! Last SB we had talent on the field. Scored points, stopped the run and wasn't Mara the owner back then? What has happened in the last 10 years? Why were we "successful" back then? Everyone, me included, wants to blame someone but it's never just ONE person. Like Eric said we just don't know what's going on. Two GMs and FOUR coaches later we are still in the same boat. I was watching the Chiefs game Saturday evening and when Hunt when down who replaces him? Another clone! Where do they find these players and why can't we do the same? I am actually scared about having two #1 draft picks because I fear we will just pick the wrong players.
this is the problem.
from 2015 - 2017, the "3 e's" erick flowers, eli apple, evan engram: no difference makers.
2018 we take a running back
2019 3 first round picks, no real difference makers. Jones was a gamble but it doesn't look like it paid off.
2020 we take AT. this is the first real difference maker.
2021 we take KT, can't stay on the field. we do get a first in 2022, but if we don't do something with it what difference does that make?
so from 2015-2021 we use 9 first round picks and have (as of today) only 1 person on the roster that we can call a difference maker.
so have 2 picks this year doesn't give me great comfort. but it is exciting to think about the possibilities from now until when they actually get on the field.
We can look forward to some of the favorite pastimes on BBI,
will the GM go, will the HC go...where are the Giants situated in the draft, this is all we got around here
with this ongoing shitshow of an organization.
OH yeah, Judge needs to go too!