Mike Garafolo
@MikeGarafolo
From
@NFLTotalAccess
: No resolution on #Giants coach Joe Judge coming tonight. It’ll be a multi-day process with meetings between him and ownership regarding the direction of the team.
Except TC-for all his faults-had some pelts on the wall after the '06 season. Hell, he actually had ONE winning season as HC in this league. Judge doesn't. I don't find the two situations all that similar.
Except TC-for all his faults-had some pelts on the wall after the '06 season. Hell, he actually had ONE winning season as HC in this league. Judge doesn't. I don't find the two situations all that similar.
I think the comparison was that they didn’t make an immediate decision.
Eagles fired Pederson last year about a week or so after the season.
Not the most apt comparison, I think. Pederson's job was likely safe going into the last game, and the decision to fire him seemed mostly a result of what happened in that game.
RE: hopefully dragging it out to complete a negotiation with harbough
Eagles fired Pederson last year about a week or so after the season.
Not the most apt comparison, I think. Pederson's job was likely safe going into the last game, and the decision to fire him seemed mostly a result of what happened in that game.
Based on what happened in the game on Sunday it actually could be an apt comparison.
Except TC-for all his faults-had some pelts on the wall after the '06 season. Hell, he actually had ONE winning season as HC in this league. Judge doesn't. I don't find the two situations all that similar.
TC had two teams in the AFC Championship.
section, I know. I was just bringing TC down to a level that JJ can't even claim, Haha.
BTW, I lost $ on that '99 AFC title game Jags loss vs. TN.
At least Coughlin had years of being a head coach with success. This guy, with his fake tough guy approach, is embarrassing. These owners are totally spineless.
Judge is laying out his next years offense for Mara.
Giving Judge time to find an OC and propose the rest of the offensive staff and provide a future vision for the offense.
Additionally, they want to talk to GM candidates and float the idea of keeping Judge and seeing how negative the views are. Most likely, Schoen, Poles, and Ossenfort were okay with working with Judge as of a month ago, but now might be skeptical.
Except TC-for all his faults-had some pelts on the wall after the '06 season. Hell, he actually had ONE winning season as HC in this league. Judge doesn't. I don't find the two situations all that similar.
TC had two teams in the AFC Championship.
section, I know. I was just bringing TC down to a level that JJ can't even claim, Haha.
BTW, I lost $ on that '99 AFC title game Jags loss vs. TN.
That Lefty QB killed them in the AFCC...both times.
like they've decided to let the new GM decide whether to keep him. They should just fire him instead, so the new GM doesn't have to do so, but it's better than them stating that he's definitely coming back.
Mara seems to see something in this Bozo. I don't see any harm in letting a new GM talk to him. Maybe there's some magic under the surface that us simple fans can't see.
And you can’t even see he’s gone by the FO messaging today. Seriously, the guy imploded in an epic way, by Eagles standards not even Giants standards. for 11 mins on an interview last week.
rather than being strung along and subjected to the plan of a as-yet-unknown GM just says "No thanks" and resigns. That's gotta be a possibility right?
rather than being strung along and subjected to the plan of a as-yet-unknown GM just says "No thanks" and resigns. That's gotta be a possibility right?
I'm sure Mara would love that. He wouldn't be on the hook for his remaining salary. Haha.
rather than being strung along and subjected to the plan of a as-yet-unknown GM just says "No thanks" and resigns. That's gotta be a possibility right?
I'm sure Mara would love that. He wouldn't be on the hook for his remaining salary. Haha.
I gotta think there's a chance, even a slim one. I think anyone with a modicum of pride and belief in themselves is gonna bristle at being told "Well, we're gonna let someone not currently in the room decide your fate". It also sets up this potentially hilarious situation with Judge screaming that he's good with people...
rather than being strung along and subjected to the plan of a as-yet-unknown GM just says "No thanks" and resigns. That's gotta be a possibility right?
I'm sure Mara would love that. He wouldn't be on the hook for his remaining salary. Haha.
I gotta think there's a chance, even a slim one. I think anyone with a modicum of pride and belief in themselves is gonna bristle at being told "Well, we're gonna let someone not currently in the room decide your fate". It also sets up this potentially hilarious situation with Judge screaming that he's good with people...
rather than being strung along and subjected to the plan of a as-yet-unknown GM just says "No thanks" and resigns. That's gotta be a possibility right?
I'm sure Mara would love that. He wouldn't be on the hook for his remaining salary. Haha.
I gotta think there's a chance, even a slim one. I think anyone with a modicum of pride and belief in themselves is gonna bristle at being told "Well, we're gonna let someone not currently in the room decide your fate". It also sets up this potentially hilarious situation with Judge screaming that he's good with people...
“What would you say it is you do here?”
Joe Judge comes in late but uses the side door so Mara doesn't see him. I'd say in the average week he gets about 10 minutes of actual work done.
RE: Judge is laying out his next years offense for Mara.
rather than being strung along and subjected to the plan of a as-yet-unknown GM just says "No thanks" and resigns. That's gotta be a possibility right?
Yes, the timing will be key so it doesn’t become disingenuous or look like a quitter. Most not see this, but giants front office placed him in a vice and not by accident. Mara and Tisch are pissed Re the 11 min self serving rant Judge did last week.
rather than being strung along and subjected to the plan of a as-yet-unknown GM just says "No thanks" and resigns. That's gotta be a possibility right?
Yes, the timing will be key so it doesn’t become disingenuous or look like a quitter. Most not see this, but giants front office placed him in a vice and not by accident. Mara and Tisch are pissed Re the 11 min self serving rant Judge did last week.
That's not really their MO. I think from where Mara is sitting the water is really muddy. We all want a pound of flesh because ultimately the buck stops with Judge. The product has been truly pitiful and he has floundered. In truth he regressed from his first season, which is a huge concern.
But Mara, for better or worse, is probably making 2 key considerations:
1) Gettleman has been historically bad in his time here
2) By all accounts Garrett and his offense were foisted upon Judge by Mara.
I can't help but think those are the 2 key things that have bought Judge all the consideration he's getting.
That's not really their MO. I think from where Mara is sitting the water is really muddy. We all want a pound of flesh because ultimately the buck stops with Judge. The product has been truly pitiful and he has floundered. In truth he regressed from his first season, which is a huge concern.
But Mara, for better or worse, is probably making 2 key considerations:
1) Gettleman has been historically bad in his time here
2) By all accounts Garrett and his offense were foisted upon Judge by Mara.
I can't help but think those are the 2 key things that have bought Judge all the consideration he's getting.
Agreed, but the issue becomes GM. Any GM would likely prefer an unknown over the 10-23 record that is Judge.
My guess is the Giants have a few candidates that they really like (I’m guessing Schoen & Poles), and what they say will have impact on Judge.
RE: RE: Judge is laying out his next years offense for Mara.
By all accounts Garrett and his offense were foisted upon Judge by Mara
Three points:
this pre-supposes that micro manager Judge, who nearly got into a fist fight with Columbo over a point of blocking technique, had nothing to say about the offense and was just strung along by Garrett. And this also does not account for FOJ Freddie Kitchens being named Senior Offensive Assistant. If he wasn't Joe's spy and mouthpiece, wtf was he doing as the SOA?
The offense was remarkably even more conservative once Garrett was gone and totally shit the bed once Judge and his asshole buddy the SOA were in complete control.
After watching Judge just fucking implode over the last 4-6 weeks you have to wonder if Garrett wasn't the adult in the room.
If anyone has a spare For Sale sign go plant it in Judges front lawn. It could speed things up.
The players could have a say if they are unhappy. Next season in training camp. JJ "OK because I am not happy with you guys we are going to run one hundred yard gassers!" The entire team "NO!"
By all accounts Garrett and his offense were foisted upon Judge by Mara
Three points:
this pre-supposes that micro manager Judge, who nearly got into a fist fight with Columbo over a point of blocking technique, had nothing to say about the offense and was just strung along by Garrett. And this also does not account for FOJ Freddie Kitchens being named Senior Offensive Assistant. If he wasn't Joe's spy and mouthpiece, wtf was he doing as the SOA?
The offense was remarkably even more conservative once Garrett was gone and totally shit the bed once Judge and his asshole buddy the SOA were in complete control.
After watching Judge just fucking implode over the last 4-6 weeks you have to wonder if Garrett wasn't the adult in the room.
I was pretty clear in saying I wasn't defending Judge, only trying to wrap my head around why Mara has given him such a long leash.
After watching Judge just fucking implode over the last 4-6 weeks you have to wonder if Garrett wasn't the adult in the room.
I said something similar earlier today.
Right now, the job is way too big for Judge. And I don't like the possibility of giving him more time to possibly figure it out. The two-year experiment should be over.
"To disrespect the game by going out there and not competing for 60 minutes and doing everything you can to help those players win, we will never do that as long as I'm the coach of the Giants"
- Joe Judge last year after crying about how the Eagles "gave up" in week 17.
like they've decided to let the new GM decide whether to keep him. They should just fire him instead, so the new GM doesn't have to do so, but it's better than them stating that he's definitely coming back.
A new GM might want to take the route the Colts did when Ballard took over. Keep the coach on the hot seat as a lighting rod for a difficult first year while they gut the squad to free cap and gather picks. If you're a GM thinking, this is such a mess it's going to be two years before we're competitive, you can buy a free year behind the lame duck coach (as long as you make sensible other decisions) before getting your guy in.
Not a route I'd take, I'd only do it if my HC had struggled but had managed to develop a few players and if the HC was the malleable sort, Judge hasn't done much of the former and certainly isn't the latter.
The moment Judge asked for a say in the GM is the moment he definitively is no longer a Giant. However, our owner is neither, and the way things have gone over the last 10 years, every wild rumor has a decent chance of being true.
It's crazy because even an Onion article or tweet from a parody account or whatever else that would instantly be detected as a lie or joke has been difficult to dissect. Every nutty rumor seems like it could be true at this point.
like they've decided to let the new GM decide whether to keep him. They should just fire him instead, so the new GM doesn't have to do so, but it's better than them stating that he's definitely coming back.
A new GM might want to take the route the Colts did when Ballard took over. Keep the coach on the hot seat as a lighting rod for a difficult first year while they gut the squad to free cap and gather picks. If you're a GM thinking, this is such a mess it's going to be two years before we're competitive, you can buy a free year behind the lame duck coach (as long as you make sensible other decisions) before getting your guy in.
Not a route I'd take, I'd only do it if my HC had struggled but had managed to develop a few players and if the HC was the malleable sort, Judge hasn't done much of the former and certainly isn't the latter.
That had been the route I would take until a couple of weeks ago. The regression or lack of progression on the offensive side of the ball has been alarming and shows we have a “burning platform” there, one that requires intervention.
in on Judge? Didn't think there was going to be an expected resolution this soon.
Assume this is just a year-end postmortem with owners/Judge so the owners are fully briefed on all aspects of team, Judge can give his views/opinions on what to do, and the owners finalize their perspectives on the head coach.
Or correct me if you think differently...
RE: Thread title is confusing as I thought a new GM was going to weigh
in on Judge? Didn't think there was going to be an expected resolution this soon.
Assume this is just a year-end postmortem with owners/Judge so the owners are fully briefed on all aspects of team, Judge can give his views/opinions on what to do, and the owners finalize their perspectives on the head coach.
Or correct me if you think differently...
It seems to me that the new GM is going to decide on everything. He'll be the President of Football Operations in charge of everything.
in on Judge? Didn't think there was going to be an expected resolution this soon.
Assume this is just a year-end postmortem with owners/Judge so the owners are fully briefed on all aspects of team, Judge can give his views/opinions on what to do, and the owners finalize their perspectives on the head coach.
Or correct me if you think differently...
It seems to me that the new GM is going to decide on everything. He'll be the President of Football Operations in charge of everything.
Likewise. If new GM performs well in role, I could see him given a promotion in title to President/Football Ops and promote one of his own guys he cultivates or brings into the personnel office fold, in few years to run day to day GM duties.
All the good turnaround stories/teams in front office tend to do it (allows slack for promotion and observation).
TC had two teams in the AFC Championship.
I think the comparison was that they didn’t make an immediate decision.
Not the most apt comparison, I think. Pederson's job was likely safe going into the last game, and the decision to fire him seemed mostly a result of what happened in that game.
i heard harbaugh to vegas today on NFLN.
id good with schoen and whoever he choses but id love daboll. i think he is a creative mind and definitely a good fit for todays game.
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Eagles fired Pederson last year about a week or so after the season.
Not the most apt comparison, I think. Pederson's job was likely safe going into the last game, and the decision to fire him seemed mostly a result of what happened in that game.
Based on what happened in the game on Sunday it actually could be an apt comparison.
Quote:
Except TC-for all his faults-had some pelts on the wall after the '06 season. Hell, he actually had ONE winning season as HC in this league. Judge doesn't. I don't find the two situations all that similar.
TC had two teams in the AFC Championship.
section, I know. I was just bringing TC down to a level that JJ can't even claim, Haha.
BTW, I lost $ on that '99 AFC title game Jags loss vs. TN.
Additionally, they want to talk to GM candidates and float the idea of keeping Judge and seeing how negative the views are. Most likely, Schoen, Poles, and Ossenfort were okay with working with Judge as of a month ago, but now might be skeptical.
Quote:
In comment 15544210 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
Quote:
Except TC-for all his faults-had some pelts on the wall after the '06 season. Hell, he actually had ONE winning season as HC in this league. Judge doesn't. I don't find the two situations all that similar.
TC had two teams in the AFC Championship.
section, I know. I was just bringing TC down to a level that JJ can't even claim, Haha.
BTW, I lost $ on that '99 AFC title game Jags loss vs. TN.
That Lefty QB killed them in the AFCC...both times.
Mara seems to see something in this Bozo. I don't see any harm in letting a new GM talk to him. Maybe there's some magic under the surface that us simple fans can't see.
Pederson had won a SB.
Judge hasn't won more than 10 games over two full seasons.
Hahahaha. Nice work pal
I'm sure Mara would love that. He wouldn't be on the hook for his remaining salary. Haha.
Quote:
rather than being strung along and subjected to the plan of a as-yet-unknown GM just says "No thanks" and resigns. That's gotta be a possibility right?
I'm sure Mara would love that. He wouldn't be on the hook for his remaining salary. Haha.
I gotta think there's a chance, even a slim one. I think anyone with a modicum of pride and belief in themselves is gonna bristle at being told "Well, we're gonna let someone not currently in the room decide your fate". It also sets up this potentially hilarious situation with Judge screaming that he's good with people...
Quote:
In comment 15544323 j_rud said:
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rather than being strung along and subjected to the plan of a as-yet-unknown GM just says "No thanks" and resigns. That's gotta be a possibility right?
I'm sure Mara would love that. He wouldn't be on the hook for his remaining salary. Haha.
I gotta think there's a chance, even a slim one. I think anyone with a modicum of pride and belief in themselves is gonna bristle at being told "Well, we're gonna let someone not currently in the room decide your fate". It also sets up this potentially hilarious situation with Judge screaming that he's good with people...
“What would you say it is you do here?”
Quote:
In comment 15544330 SFGFNCGiantsFan said:
Quote:
In comment 15544323 j_rud said:
Quote:
rather than being strung along and subjected to the plan of a as-yet-unknown GM just says "No thanks" and resigns. That's gotta be a possibility right?
I'm sure Mara would love that. He wouldn't be on the hook for his remaining salary. Haha.
I gotta think there's a chance, even a slim one. I think anyone with a modicum of pride and belief in themselves is gonna bristle at being told "Well, we're gonna let someone not currently in the room decide your fate". It also sets up this potentially hilarious situation with Judge screaming that he's good with people...
“What would you say it is you do here?”
Joe Judge comes in late but uses the side door so Mara doesn't see him. I'd say in the average week he gets about 10 minutes of actual work done.
Don't forget play #3 - punt on a 4th and 2 in the opponent's territory.
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Fire Judge while Mara watches through that police interrogation room glass. Whoever fires him the “best” will get the GM job.
LOL LMAO Love what you wrote.
I laughed out loud at this one. There were a bunch of comments today that had me laughing out loud.
Yes, the timing will be key so it doesn’t become disingenuous or look like a quitter. Most not see this, but giants front office placed him in a vice and not by accident. Mara and Tisch are pissed Re the 11 min self serving rant Judge did last week.
How do people not see this?
Quote:
rather than being strung along and subjected to the plan of a as-yet-unknown GM just says "No thanks" and resigns. That's gotta be a possibility right?
Yes, the timing will be key so it doesn’t become disingenuous or look like a quitter. Most not see this, but giants front office placed him in a vice and not by accident. Mara and Tisch are pissed Re the 11 min self serving rant Judge did last week.
How do people not see this?
I have now heard it all...
But Mara, for better or worse, is probably making 2 key considerations:
1) Gettleman has been historically bad in his time here
2) By all accounts Garrett and his offense were foisted upon Judge by Mara.
I can't help but think those are the 2 key things that have bought Judge all the consideration he's getting.
But Mara, for better or worse, is probably making 2 key considerations:
1) Gettleman has been historically bad in his time here
2) By all accounts Garrett and his offense were foisted upon Judge by Mara.
I can't help but think those are the 2 key things that have bought Judge all the consideration he's getting.
Agreed, but the issue becomes GM. Any GM would likely prefer an unknown over the 10-23 record that is Judge.
My guess is the Giants have a few candidates that they really like (I’m guessing Schoen & Poles), and what they say will have impact on Judge.
Quote:
“John I’m simplifying it to two plays, QB sneak and victory formation “.
Don't forget play #3 - punt on a 4th and 2 in the opponent's territory.
“I’d say in a given game, my offenses generate about ten actual yards of passing.”
Three points:
this pre-supposes that micro manager Judge, who nearly got into a fist fight with Columbo over a point of blocking technique, had nothing to say about the offense and was just strung along by Garrett. And this also does not account for FOJ Freddie Kitchens being named Senior Offensive Assistant. If he wasn't Joe's spy and mouthpiece, wtf was he doing as the SOA?
The offense was remarkably even more conservative once Garrett was gone and totally shit the bed once Judge and his asshole buddy the SOA were in complete control.
After watching Judge just fucking implode over the last 4-6 weeks you have to wonder if Garrett wasn't the adult in the room.
The players could have a say if they are unhappy. Next season in training camp. JJ "OK because I am not happy with you guys we are going to run one hundred yard gassers!" The entire team "NO!"
Quote:
By all accounts Garrett and his offense were foisted upon Judge by Mara
Three points:
this pre-supposes that micro manager Judge, who nearly got into a fist fight with Columbo over a point of blocking technique, had nothing to say about the offense and was just strung along by Garrett. And this also does not account for FOJ Freddie Kitchens being named Senior Offensive Assistant. If he wasn't Joe's spy and mouthpiece, wtf was he doing as the SOA?
The offense was remarkably even more conservative once Garrett was gone and totally shit the bed once Judge and his asshole buddy the SOA were in complete control.
After watching Judge just fucking implode over the last 4-6 weeks you have to wonder if Garrett wasn't the adult in the room.
I was pretty clear in saying I wasn't defending Judge, only trying to wrap my head around why Mara has given him such a long leash.
After watching Judge just fucking implode over the last 4-6 weeks you have to wonder if Garrett wasn't the adult in the room.
I said something similar earlier today.
Right now, the job is way too big for Judge. And I don't like the possibility of giving him more time to possibly figure it out. The two-year experiment should be over.
- Joe Judge last year after crying about how the Eagles "gave up" in week 17.
Giants Run a QB Sneak on 3rd & 9 - ( New Window )
A new GM might want to take the route the Colts did when Ballard took over. Keep the coach on the hot seat as a lighting rod for a difficult first year while they gut the squad to free cap and gather picks. If you're a GM thinking, this is such a mess it's going to be two years before we're competitive, you can buy a free year behind the lame duck coach (as long as you make sensible other decisions) before getting your guy in.
Not a route I'd take, I'd only do it if my HC had struggled but had managed to develop a few players and if the HC was the malleable sort, Judge hasn't done much of the former and certainly isn't the latter.
It's crazy because even an Onion article or tweet from a parody account or whatever else that would instantly be detected as a lie or joke has been difficult to dissect. Every nutty rumor seems like it could be true at this point.
Quote:
like they've decided to let the new GM decide whether to keep him. They should just fire him instead, so the new GM doesn't have to do so, but it's better than them stating that he's definitely coming back.
A new GM might want to take the route the Colts did when Ballard took over. Keep the coach on the hot seat as a lighting rod for a difficult first year while they gut the squad to free cap and gather picks. If you're a GM thinking, this is such a mess it's going to be two years before we're competitive, you can buy a free year behind the lame duck coach (as long as you make sensible other decisions) before getting your guy in.
Not a route I'd take, I'd only do it if my HC had struggled but had managed to develop a few players and if the HC was the malleable sort, Judge hasn't done much of the former and certainly isn't the latter.
That had been the route I would take until a couple of weeks ago. The regression or lack of progression on the offensive side of the ball has been alarming and shows we have a “burning platform” there, one that requires intervention.
Lmao. So true. The QB sneaks play right into it.
Assume this is just a year-end postmortem with owners/Judge so the owners are fully briefed on all aspects of team, Judge can give his views/opinions on what to do, and the owners finalize their perspectives on the head coach.
Or correct me if you think differently...
Assume this is just a year-end postmortem with owners/Judge so the owners are fully briefed on all aspects of team, Judge can give his views/opinions on what to do, and the owners finalize their perspectives on the head coach.
Or correct me if you think differently...
Quote:
in on Judge? Didn't think there was going to be an expected resolution this soon.
Assume this is just a year-end postmortem with owners/Judge so the owners are fully briefed on all aspects of team, Judge can give his views/opinions on what to do, and the owners finalize their perspectives on the head coach.
Or correct me if you think differently...
It seems to me that the new GM is going to decide on everything. He'll be the President of Football Operations in charge of everything.
Likewise. If new GM performs well in role, I could see him given a promotion in title to President/Football Ops and promote one of his own guys he cultivates or brings into the personnel office fold, in few years to run day to day GM duties.
All the good turnaround stories/teams in front office tend to do it (allows slack for promotion and observation).