at the end of the day he wanted Daboll as his OC, but he couldn't get him. As a young 1st time head coach management foists Garrett on him. He should have pulled the plug on Garrett going into the season but he gave him a 2nd year and by the time he did can him he had effectively 1 game with an NFL caliber QB and they won. Then Jones is out for the rest of the year and the team hits the lowest low I have ever witnessed. Before he gets a chance to replace Garrett he's out as head coach and everyone is clamoring for his 1st choice as OC as the new Head Coach. I get it, but that doesn't mean I cant feel bad for him.
He really controlled his own destiny here. I think the pressure got to him and made him act so abberrant. It's the talking that did him in. He was like a drowning man out there.
I have nightmares about this. It would feel like hiring two guys with big fake moustaches named Domingo Gettlemanez and Jose Judgio.
Haha well done
Big no on Pioli for me too. Out of the league almost a decade. Yeah I'm sure he's kept in touch with friends in the business, but that's not the same as a candidate with hands on experience helping run a team in the modern age of analytics and scouting
yesterday's meeting with Mara and Tisch and today to make this happen? All eight GM candidates said "I am only talking to you if firing Judge is on the table?"
What happened was Mara and Tisch had their own meeting today after they spoke to judge yesterday, just like they are supposed to. Or did you think they should have had the discussion with Judge in the room?
Phones blew up with season ticket cancellations plus media coverage. The franchise was everybody’s dart board. I’ve never heard the phrase “clown show” used so much. Ever
That too. I bet judge pitching he wanted input on the next GM didn't help either. Or the fact Schoen wasn't stepping in the building with that hassle sitting there.
Either way, if they liked what he said and thought he was the guy, he'd still be here. Ultimately they lost faith in him.
than Ray Handley’s HCing stint. Just weird. Seemed like he was going to be a really good young coach and then wheels slowly came of the wagon; the wagon veered off the road, got out of control, and tumbled down a steep embankment.
He was hamstrung with a terrible GM and a flawed QB. Then he was overwhelmed by the pressure to win and sabotaged himself the last 6 games. The only coach I have seen who canned himself this badly was Bob Diaco at UConn. Joe had to go to attract GM candidates who want to start with a clean slate. Imagine if next season started out 0-4 or 0-5 again? Then what would we have done? This will be better for all involved. management, players and fans. Good luck Joe Judge.
And even his first season was okay enough, given the weakness of the roster. However, this season was an unmitigated disaster.
when his name first appeared as a candidate I pegged him as the dark horse, and was really happy when he got the job. This year, especially the last month, went so far off the rails I couldn't support him anymore.
Congrats everyone. Too good of a fanbase to have a coach like that.
Can you confirm that it was pressure from GM candidates that pushed this over the edge?
I've been busy but I'll ask around about the current list. I know many who dream of this opportunity already have their list of guys in mind. It would severely limit the pool of candidates and even the quality of candidates if ownership tried to force a coach who is clearly in over his head.
But you guys have to understand it's not just the coach. They want their own guys in the personnel department as well. Like-minded guys they know and trust.
I think the quarterback sneaks sealed his fate. But I still can't get over that scumbag Gettleman getting to ride off into the sunset ! He should have been publicly fired ! FUCK HIM AND HIS FUCKING SHITTY BOSTON ACCENT! Hope the GMEN finally get this thing rite !
I really like him and his enthusiasm. He just wasn't ready for prime-time. In a lot of ways he reminds me of Spags.
He ran into a perfect storm of ineptness starting in the Front Office (a GM who had lost his "mojo"), a nervous Nelly owner, incompetent coaching staff (and not-to-mention a ton of injuries).
So, instead of a John-Paul-Jones "hell with the torpedos, full speed ahead", he retreated into "let's just not lose"mentality - THAT is what (despite the players' loyalty, destroyed their belief they could win).
I just hope the next GM-combo doesn't take a wrecking ball to the place, the cupboard's not bare.
I really like him and his enthusiasm. He just wasn't ready for prime-time. In a lot of ways he reminds me of Spags.
He ran into a perfect storm of ineptness starting in the Front Office (a GM who had lost his "mojo"), a nervous Nelly owner, incompetent coaching staff (and not-to-mention a ton of injuries).
So, instead of a John-Paul-Jones "hell with the torpedos, full speed ahead", he retreated into "let's just not lose"mentality - THAT is what (despite the players' loyalty, destroyed their belief they could win).
I just hope the next GM-combo doesn't take a wrecking ball to the place, the cupboard's not bare.
He had a major say in all personnel decisions. Almost his entire coaching staff was hand-picked by him, mostly SEC coaches.
believe a coach could have such a nothing offense. Matched with a prevent D.
I'm relieved. I legitimately couldn't watch another year of a Judge-coached team. His style is an insult to the NFL.
Insult is a good word. By the end he was insulting the fans (whether on purpose or inadvertently) and completely embarrassing the franchize. He needed to go.
But I think Joe Judge will be a Head Coach again and will succeed. It’s going out on a limb, but I did see some positives to go along with his passion, or gift of gab.
1. He chose the right Defensive Coordinater
2. The team played hard for him all of last year
3. Watching his weekly YouTube show, you could see how detail oriented he was and was very clear in his teaching.
I think he was torpedoed by a few things.
1. Gentleman and this atrocity of a roster
2. Garrett and his archaic offense
Mara said he’s a young coach who will need time to succeed. His game management should have been further along in year 2. That’s my biggest issue…. The immaturity shown with the press these final 6 weeks was him buckling under the immense pressure of a crumbling franchise.
With all of that being said this had to happen in order to get all facets of the organization on the same page. Unfortunately Judge was working with the biggest dopes in football.
But I think Joe Judge will be a Head Coach again and will succeed. It’s going out on a limb, but I did see some positives to go along with his passion, or gift of gab.
1. He chose the right Defensive Coordinater
2. The team played hard for him all of last year
3. Watching his weekly YouTube show, you could see how detail oriented he was and was very clear in his teaching.
I think he was torpedoed by a few things.
1. Gentleman and this atrocity of a roster
2. Garrett and his archaic offense
Mara said he’s a young coach who will need time to succeed. His game management should have been further along in year 2. That’s my biggest issue…. The immaturity shown with the press these final 6 weeks was him buckling under the immense pressure of a crumbling franchise.
With all of that being said this had to happen in order to get all facets of the organization on the same page. Unfortunately Judge was working with the biggest dopes in football.
Judge was over his head. If you can't see it...
RE: RE: I may be the dumbest poster on this message board
But I think Joe Judge will be a Head Coach again and will succeed. It’s going out on a limb, but I did see some positives to go along with his passion, or gift of gab.
1. He chose the right Defensive Coordinater
2. The team played hard for him all of last year
3. Watching his weekly YouTube show, you could see how detail oriented he was and was very clear in his teaching.
I think he was torpedoed by a few things.
1. Gentleman and this atrocity of a roster
2. Garrett and his archaic offense
Mara said he’s a young coach who will need time to succeed. His game management should have been further along in year 2. That’s my biggest issue…. The immaturity shown with the press these final 6 weeks was him buckling under the immense pressure of a crumbling franchise.
With all of that being said this had to happen in order to get all facets of the organization on the same page. Unfortunately Judge was working with the biggest dopes in football.
Judge was over his head. If you can't see it...
Oh, I saw it. But I wouldn’t be surprised if he gets a second Head Coaching shot and succeeds.
Judge was out all along. Mara delayed so Gettleman could save some face and retire rather than being fired. And delayed Judge firing as a lame move to separate the two events.
Totally agree. The way Saban's staff turns over, and with pro coaches welcome, I suspect Judge will have an opportunity in Tuscaloosa anytime he wants.
But it won't be anytime soon. He's young, he's an expert bullshitter and he knows the right things to say.
He's not our problem anymore
No chance. He killed that the last month and a half and especially the last few weeks. He wasn't even a strong candidate to begin with. He was a rogue hire because he talked tough and told people what they want to hear in an interview, but didn't know how to achieve any of it.
Even now, I'd argue he's worsened as a coach because of this tenure. He needs a few years of rehab down at the college level as an assistant and maybe he can get a Division II job somewhere.
I don't think Belichick would even take him right now. He's got some radioactivity to him.
He’ll get another shot at an NFL job in the next five years. He has to rebuild both his CV and the perception of his throwing other coaches under the bud.
Judge reminds me of Marty Mornhinweg. He wins coin toss in OT & results to kick off the ball. Lions never get ball back & lose to Chicago. That was a national story.
I bet JJ ends up on some staff somewhere, but I doubt he ever gets a shot @ HC again in the NFL.
He's an expert bullshitter. Fast forward 10 years from now, Judge will still be young, he'll still have the gift of gab and he'll have some bullshit "I learned from my experience with the Giants."
I could see him getting another HC job. It just won't be anytime soon.
RE: I may be the dumbest poster on this message board
But I think Joe Judge will be a Head Coach again and will succeed. It’s going out on a limb, but I did see some positives to go along with his passion, or gift of gab.
1. He chose the right Defensive Coordinater
2. The team played hard for him all of last year
3. Watching his weekly YouTube show, you could see how detail oriented he was and was very clear in his teaching.
I think he was torpedoed by a few things.
1. Gentleman and this atrocity of a roster
2. Garrett and his archaic offense
Mara said he’s a young coach who will need time to succeed. His game management should have been further along in year 2. That’s my biggest issue…. The immaturity shown with the press these final 6 weeks was him buckling under the immense pressure of a crumbling franchise.
With all of that being said this had to happen in order to get all facets of the organization on the same page. Unfortunately Judge was working with the biggest dopes in football.
Very much agree. Particularly with the buckling at the end. Once it was clear gettlemen was done they turned on him and it was too much. It’s been a feeding frenzy for 2 months. Absolutely an organizational failure.
Well hope springs eternal
RE: RE: I may be the dumbest poster on this message board
But I think Joe Judge will be a Head Coach again and will succeed. It’s going out on a limb, but I did see some positives to go along with his passion, or gift of gab.
1. He chose the right Defensive Coordinater
2. The team played hard for him all of last year
3. Watching his weekly YouTube show, you could see how detail oriented he was and was very clear in his teaching.
I think he was torpedoed by a few things.
1. Gentleman and this atrocity of a roster
2. Garrett and his archaic offense
Mara said he’s a young coach who will need time to succeed. His game management should have been further along in year 2. That’s my biggest issue…. The immaturity shown with the press these final 6 weeks was him buckling under the immense pressure of a crumbling franchise.
With all of that being said this had to happen in order to get all facets of the organization on the same page. Unfortunately Judge was working with the biggest dopes in football.
Judge was over his head. If you can't see it...
When you get sent out in the Atlantic ocean in a row boat, it's easy to look "in over your head."
Judge has many things to work on, clearly (e.g. time mgt, more aggressive offensive approach, better use of the pre-season, etc), but he was hired as a 38 year old HC and the owner stated that they needed to show patience with him. They paired him with THE WORST GM in the NFL, and 10 years worth of bad decisions. They "encouraged" Judge to hire Garrett as his OC. This is an organizational failure and it consumed a young coach that had some potential.
RE: RE: Joe Judge may very well get another HC job
But it won't be anytime soon. He's young, he's an expert bullshitter and he knows the right things to say.
He's not our problem anymore
No chance. He killed that the last month and a half and especially the last few weeks. He wasn't even a strong candidate to begin with. He was a rogue hire because he talked tough and told people what they want to hear in an interview, but didn't know how to achieve any of it.
Even now, I'd argue he's worsened as a coach because of this tenure. He needs a few years of rehab down at the college level as an assistant and maybe he can get a Division II job somewhere.
I don't think Belichick would even take him right now. He's got some radioactivity to him.
What part of Belichick or saban makes you think he cares about whether a coach is liked or not in the media?
Steve Sarkesian was fired for being a drunk on the job as a head football coach and Saban rehabbed his career and got him another HC job.
He really controlled his own destiny here. I think the pressure got to him and made him act so abberrant. It's the talking that did him in. He was like a drowning man out there.
Quote:
No thanks. Lol
I have nightmares about this. It would feel like hiring two guys with big fake moustaches named Domingo Gettlemanez and Jose Judgio.
Haha well done
Big no on Pioli for me too. Out of the league almost a decade. Yeah I'm sure he's kept in touch with friends in the business, but that's not the same as a candidate with hands on experience helping run a team in the modern age of analytics and scouting
Can you confirm that it was pressure from GM candidates that pushed this over the edge?
Quote:
In comment 15546508 Mike from Ohio said:
Quote:
yesterday's meeting with Mara and Tisch and today to make this happen? All eight GM candidates said "I am only talking to you if firing Judge is on the table?"
What happened was Mara and Tisch had their own meeting today after they spoke to judge yesterday, just like they are supposed to. Or did you think they should have had the discussion with Judge in the room?
Phones blew up with season ticket cancellations plus media coverage. The franchise was everybody’s dart board. I’ve never heard the phrase “clown show” used so much. Ever
Either way, if they liked what he said and thought he was the guy, he'd still be here. Ultimately they lost faith in him.
over and over again.
Another One Bites The Dust - ( New Window )
::Tom Quinn grabs manilla envelope with photographs out of his safe::
Hi hopes for Judge
Hi hopes for Shurmur
Hi hopes for McAdoo
Rinse repeat ….hope not !!!
Well, said.
Quote:
No thanks. Lol
I have nightmares about this. It would feel like hiring two guys with big fake moustaches named Domingo Gettlemanez and Jose Judgio.
So Senor Speilbergo...
Come alive in 25!
Abysmal lack of talent.
Abysmal lack of coaching.
when his name first appeared as a candidate I pegged him as the dark horse, and was really happy when he got the job. This year, especially the last month, went so far off the rails I couldn't support him anymore.
But the head coach is responsible for the offense, and that was as bad a two season run of offense you'll ever see.
Agreed. I thought that was a turning point. Boy, I was wrong
Quote:
Congrats everyone. Too good of a fanbase to have a coach like that.
Can you confirm that it was pressure from GM candidates that pushed this over the edge?
I've been busy but I'll ask around about the current list. I know many who dream of this opportunity already have their list of guys in mind. It would severely limit the pool of candidates and even the quality of candidates if ownership tried to force a coach who is clearly in over his head.
But you guys have to understand it's not just the coach. They want their own guys in the personnel department as well. Like-minded guys they know and trust.
Johnny Ringo
Yes he is...
I really like him and his enthusiasm. He just wasn't ready for prime-time. In a lot of ways he reminds me of Spags.
He ran into a perfect storm of ineptness starting in the Front Office (a GM who had lost his "mojo"), a nervous Nelly owner, incompetent coaching staff (and not-to-mention a ton of injuries).
So, instead of a John-Paul-Jones "hell with the torpedos, full speed ahead", he retreated into "let's just not lose"mentality - THAT is what (despite the players' loyalty, destroyed their belief they could win).
I just hope the next GM-combo doesn't take a wrecking ball to the place, the cupboard's not bare.
I really like him and his enthusiasm. He just wasn't ready for prime-time. In a lot of ways he reminds me of Spags.
He ran into a perfect storm of ineptness starting in the Front Office (a GM who had lost his "mojo"), a nervous Nelly owner, incompetent coaching staff (and not-to-mention a ton of injuries).
So, instead of a John-Paul-Jones "hell with the torpedos, full speed ahead", he retreated into "let's just not lose"mentality - THAT is what (despite the players' loyalty, destroyed their belief they could win).
I just hope the next GM-combo doesn't take a wrecking ball to the place, the cupboard's not bare.
He had a major say in all personnel decisions. Almost his entire coaching staff was hand-picked by him, mostly SEC coaches.
But yeah, he's the victim here.
I'm relieved. I legitimately couldn't watch another year of a Judge-coached team. His style is an insult to the NFL.
I'm relieved. I legitimately couldn't watch another year of a Judge-coached team. His style is an insult to the NFL.
Insult is a good word. By the end he was insulting the fans (whether on purpose or inadvertently) and completely embarrassing the franchize. He needed to go.
1. He chose the right Defensive Coordinater
2. The team played hard for him all of last year
3. Watching his weekly YouTube show, you could see how detail oriented he was and was very clear in his teaching.
I think he was torpedoed by a few things.
1. Gentleman and this atrocity of a roster
2. Garrett and his archaic offense
Mara said he’s a young coach who will need time to succeed. His game management should have been further along in year 2. That’s my biggest issue…. The immaturity shown with the press these final 6 weeks was him buckling under the immense pressure of a crumbling franchise.
With all of that being said this had to happen in order to get all facets of the organization on the same page. Unfortunately Judge was working with the biggest dopes in football.
1. He chose the right Defensive Coordinater
2. The team played hard for him all of last year
3. Watching his weekly YouTube show, you could see how detail oriented he was and was very clear in his teaching.
I think he was torpedoed by a few things.
1. Gentleman and this atrocity of a roster
2. Garrett and his archaic offense
Mara said he’s a young coach who will need time to succeed. His game management should have been further along in year 2. That’s my biggest issue…. The immaturity shown with the press these final 6 weeks was him buckling under the immense pressure of a crumbling franchise.
With all of that being said this had to happen in order to get all facets of the organization on the same page. Unfortunately Judge was working with the biggest dopes in football.
Judge was over his head. If you can't see it...
Quote:
But I think Joe Judge will be a Head Coach again and will succeed. It’s going out on a limb, but I did see some positives to go along with his passion, or gift of gab.
1. He chose the right Defensive Coordinater
2. The team played hard for him all of last year
3. Watching his weekly YouTube show, you could see how detail oriented he was and was very clear in his teaching.
I think he was torpedoed by a few things.
1. Gentleman and this atrocity of a roster
2. Garrett and his archaic offense
Mara said he’s a young coach who will need time to succeed. His game management should have been further along in year 2. That’s my biggest issue…. The immaturity shown with the press these final 6 weeks was him buckling under the immense pressure of a crumbling franchise.
With all of that being said this had to happen in order to get all facets of the organization on the same page. Unfortunately Judge was working with the biggest dopes in football.
Judge was over his head. If you can't see it...
Oh, I saw it. But I wouldn’t be surprised if he gets a second Head Coaching shot and succeeds.
He's not our problem anymore
He doesn't need tears.
He doesn't need tears.
Totally agree. The way Saban's staff turns over, and with pro coaches welcome, I suspect Judge will have an opportunity in Tuscaloosa anytime he wants.
He's not our problem anymore
No chance. He killed that the last month and a half and especially the last few weeks. He wasn't even a strong candidate to begin with. He was a rogue hire because he talked tough and told people what they want to hear in an interview, but didn't know how to achieve any of it.
Even now, I'd argue he's worsened as a coach because of this tenure. He needs a few years of rehab down at the college level as an assistant and maybe he can get a Division II job somewhere.
I don't think Belichick would even take him right now. He's got some radioactivity to him.
I bet JJ ends up on some staff somewhere, but I doubt he ever gets a shot @ HC again in the NFL.
I could see him getting another HC job. It just won't be anytime soon.
1. He chose the right Defensive Coordinater
2. The team played hard for him all of last year
3. Watching his weekly YouTube show, you could see how detail oriented he was and was very clear in his teaching.
I think he was torpedoed by a few things.
1. Gentleman and this atrocity of a roster
2. Garrett and his archaic offense
Mara said he’s a young coach who will need time to succeed. His game management should have been further along in year 2. That’s my biggest issue…. The immaturity shown with the press these final 6 weeks was him buckling under the immense pressure of a crumbling franchise.
With all of that being said this had to happen in order to get all facets of the organization on the same page. Unfortunately Judge was working with the biggest dopes in football.
Very much agree. Particularly with the buckling at the end. Once it was clear gettlemen was done they turned on him and it was too much. It’s been a feeding frenzy for 2 months. Absolutely an organizational failure.
Well hope springs eternal
Quote:
But I think Joe Judge will be a Head Coach again and will succeed. It’s going out on a limb, but I did see some positives to go along with his passion, or gift of gab.
1. He chose the right Defensive Coordinater
2. The team played hard for him all of last year
3. Watching his weekly YouTube show, you could see how detail oriented he was and was very clear in his teaching.
I think he was torpedoed by a few things.
1. Gentleman and this atrocity of a roster
2. Garrett and his archaic offense
Mara said he’s a young coach who will need time to succeed. His game management should have been further along in year 2. That’s my biggest issue…. The immaturity shown with the press these final 6 weeks was him buckling under the immense pressure of a crumbling franchise.
With all of that being said this had to happen in order to get all facets of the organization on the same page. Unfortunately Judge was working with the biggest dopes in football.
Judge was over his head. If you can't see it...
When you get sent out in the Atlantic ocean in a row boat, it's easy to look "in over your head."
Judge has many things to work on, clearly (e.g. time mgt, more aggressive offensive approach, better use of the pre-season, etc), but he was hired as a 38 year old HC and the owner stated that they needed to show patience with him. They paired him with THE WORST GM in the NFL, and 10 years worth of bad decisions. They "encouraged" Judge to hire Garrett as his OC. This is an organizational failure and it consumed a young coach that had some potential.
Quote:
But it won't be anytime soon. He's young, he's an expert bullshitter and he knows the right things to say.
He's not our problem anymore
No chance. He killed that the last month and a half and especially the last few weeks. He wasn't even a strong candidate to begin with. He was a rogue hire because he talked tough and told people what they want to hear in an interview, but didn't know how to achieve any of it.
Even now, I'd argue he's worsened as a coach because of this tenure. He needs a few years of rehab down at the college level as an assistant and maybe he can get a Division II job somewhere.
I don't think Belichick would even take him right now. He's got some radioactivity to him.
What part of Belichick or saban makes you think he cares about whether a coach is liked or not in the media?
Steve Sarkesian was fired for being a drunk on the job as a head football coach and Saban rehabbed his career and got him another HC job.