Joe Judge Speaks

Yeah, we should another 10 years for things to turn around. Speaking of blaming the fans, what’s P Dot up too these days?

Not his fault he was overhired and unprepared for the job, even without the deck stacked against him.

I wish someone would pay me $15M to go away.

In comment 15552879 JonC said:

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I wish someone would pay me $15M to go away.

You're too likable, Go Terps on the other hand...

In comment 15552681 rasbutant said:

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He told everyone this is what he was doing from the start. That it wasn’t going to be an over night process. Yet the cry baby instant gratification NYC fanbase just can’t help itself.

So I guess the former Giant players (i.e. Strahan, Cruz, Canty, etc.) who either called for or supported the decision to fire Judge are also cry babies that needed instant gratification.

Judge's Giants regressed in year 2 and what's most inexcusable - Judge quit on his team in the last 2 games.

but, alas, not to be. Aside from football issues, especially the offensive line mess, -- Colombo, coaching, etc -- he could have helped himself or the organization could have helped him with some professional messaging and communications counseling. Especially this year, the disconnect between what we were seeing on the field and what he we heard from him post-game and in public comments was jarring and seemed not credible. It wasn't just the ramble after the Bears game, although that might have been the killer, it was the constant talk about culture, the improvement he claimed was happening but we couldn't see, the inability to state the obvious, express some disappointment about the product on the field, created a perception about him that might not have been the reality.

Also, one wonders if he was part of Gettleman's smug declaration about how confident they were in offensive line personnel. If so, he clearly misjudged the key element that determined the team's and his failure. If not, then Gettleman set him up. I don't know if or how much, better coaching might have improved the O-line play or made a difference in a few games. But he seemed not to be able to get a handle on that whole aspect of the game.

Still, if Lawrence doesn't get called for that phantom offsides, if Jackson doesn't drop a game-sealing end zone int., if they found a way to win a very winnable KC game, if Jones doesn't get injured... who knows? He's a likeable guy. I hope he knows that the out-of-bounds viciousness displayed by some does not define the Giants fanbase.

With this roster.

He made mistakes. He was a young coach.

Gettleman did him no favors. Chris Mara and Tim McDonald with their lousy scouting department did him no favors.

He made mistakes but he was also hung out to dry. Nobody was going to win with that roster.

The bottom line, for me, is that I can't even articulate what he does well as a coach (in particular, from a tactical standpoint).

- Game management: Was bad when he started and showed no signs of improvement.

- Scheme/design: We don't know how much of an influence he had on the defensive scheme, but that was the ONLY aspect of this team that at times during his tenure showed some positive signs. Still, the play was inconsistent, frequently plagued by miscommunication and penalties.

- Discipline/intelligent play: Next question.

- Sum of the talent equaling more than the parts: To me, this is the number one thing you're looking for from a coach. Is he getting everything out of what's on the roster and then some. The Giants may have the worst talent in the league. It STILL felt to me like we were getting worse production than that. No unit showed any real progression under him. Problem spots remained problem spots. No real imagination in how strengths were utilized.

Again, he seems like a good guy. I liked everything I heard from him when he was hired. Two years later, I feel bad for him personally...but am not so worried that we'll be looking back at him as the one we cut loose too soon.

In comment 15552942 kelly said:

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With this roster. He made mistakes. He was a young coach. Gettleman did him no favors. Chris Mara and Tim McDonald with their lousy scouting department did him no favors. He made mistakes but he was also hung out to dry. Nobody was going to win with that roster.

+1

on the roster critique posts.

Well done in driving home this hot 2022 agenda even though they have been around for years and barely mentioned next to Gettleman's name.

:-)

In comment 15552947 Giantfan in skinland said:

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The bottom line, for me, is that I can't even articulate what he does well as a coach (in particular, from a tactical standpoint). - Game management: Was bad when he started and showed no signs of improvement. - Scheme/design: We don't know how much of an influence he had on the defensive scheme, but that was the ONLY aspect of this team that at times during his tenure showed some positive signs. Still, the play was inconsistent, frequently plagued by miscommunication and penalties. - Discipline/intelligent play: Next question. - Sum of the talent equaling more than the parts: To me, this is the number one thing you're looking for from a coach. Is he getting everything out of what's on the roster and then some. The Giants may have the worst talent in the league. It STILL felt to me like we were getting worse production than that. No unit showed any real progression under him. Problem spots remained problem spots. No real imagination in how strengths were utilized. Again, he seems like a good guy. I liked everything I heard from him when he was hired. Two years later, I feel bad for him personally...but am not so worried that we'll be looking back at him as the one we cut loose too soon.

This sums it up for me. You can have a bad season standings-wise and still witness improvement -- see the 2020 Giants, or the Lions this year. But the 2021 Giants were a mess from game 1, and Judge didn't come up with a single answer the entire time. He got dealt a shit hand, but even with bad personnel, did he do anything in 2021 as a coach -- discipline, scheme, game management, anything -- that showed he could improve on the promise of 2020? Or that he was actually building anything resembling sustained success? Beyond going on and on about "foundation" and "process" in interviews, I mean. Again, look at the Lions, their roster is pretty crap too, but at least you can say the coaching gave them the best chance to win with what they had.

Anyway, I try not to get caught up with whether a coach comes off as a "good guy" or a martinet or a wet noodle. On-the-field results are the only thing that will change the perception of this team, and on that level, Judge was right there with Shurmur as a coach. Both seem like decent men, both were working at a disadvantage, and both were in over their heads. To quote Parcells, you are what your record says you are.

Because He and His coaches could NOT coach up the players or devise schemes to put them in a position to do what the player does best.
Yes, the endless injuries and lower level talent were reasons , in part, for not being better, let alone much better.
His lack of confidence in his players by (ultra) conservative game plans and play calls would be a towel throw-in to some / many players who in turn opted to make business decisions (Golladay, Bradberry) at critical times. The game plan the last 1/4 of the season especially , was the anti- “you play to win the game.”
His in game coaching was, suspect, often, each game.
His off the wall comments were the piece de resistance to doing himself in, and I think were intentional so he could be where he is now.
Like DG, he made promises yet kept accomplishing the anti- promise.
He’ll be fine with his 15M ‘ bonus’. So will his agent.

Never bothered me the way that Shurmur did. I loathed Pat Shurmur.

Judge may not have been cut out to be a head coach, but he certainly put in the effort, it just didn't translate on the field and he was dealt a brutal roster by the DG.

That said, I don't see him getting a serious rebound position in the pros any time soon. I could see BB taking him back on in his prior role. But, I certainly don't think another HC opportunity is in the immediate cards and I wouldn't take a chance on him as a coordinator either. I assume given his QB background he would be more in line for offensive coaching positions, but ST may lead to some defensive ones.

I know a lot see him returning to college ranks. But, as what? Even there I don't see him as a coordinator.

That was a beautiful post. Thank you.

In comment 15552327 I am Ninja said:

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Wish him well. Hey, he made a deal with the devil. He was a barely 38 year old dude walking into a pile of shit with little reason to believe the existing infrastructure would do any better by him than it had for the last two guys. But he went to bed one night a ST coordinator and woke up the next day the head coach of an NFL team. He wasnt given the keys to a Cadillac by any means. It was a beater at best, and the mechanic fashioned repairs in duct tape. If he could pull it off, he'd be set in the business for life. The flip side being, obviously, if he couldnt pull a rabbit out of his hat, he'd be carried off on his shield. I think what we saw, both in words and actions, was frustration boiling over giving rise to clouded judgment. The words were a mistake. I think he thought he was saying the right things. Defending his guys and his organization, contrasting his operation against some of the crazy stuff that once went on here and that goes on other places. He failed to consider that in drawing these comparisons, he was, necessarily, taking shots at men who, while not perfect, are respected. The actions, namely, the back to back sneaks, werent strategic. They were a message: fuck-you-back. In either case, you just cant. My biggest regret for him, and what I think his biggest mistake was during his entire tenure, was not that he was fundamentally "too conservative." It was that he failed to take advantage of having nothing to lose. His roster was not good to begin with, then injury depleted. His record was bad from week 1 both seasons. He literally had nothing to lose. That's exactly the situation where no one, not ownership, not players, not media, not fans, are going to give you shit for saying, fuck it, taking the governor off and going balls out to make something happen. No one was going to criticize him for being reckless. Like they say about an animal backed into a corner is most dangerous, he was backed into a corner from games 2-16/17 both years and instead of bowing up and throwing haymakers, he shrunk. He put his gloves to his head and prayed for the bell. What a wasted opportunity.

Ninja - i really love your analogies. great post.

that Daniel Jones, Logan Ryan and David Sills were a handful of players who went to Judge's house Wednesday Night when he entertained coaches and others as a thank you get together.

In comment 15553202 jvm52106 said:

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that Daniel Jones, Logan Ryan and David Sills were a handful of players who went to Judge's house Wednesday Night when he entertained coaches and others as a thank you get together.

They must really like him, because they couldn't have been there for the quality of pizza and beer.

While I am glad he is no longer the head coach, I wish there was some way we could have him come back as the special teams coach. I think he would be very successful here in that role but know it could never happen.

He had a golden opportunity, he hit the lottery, and he blew it sky high. Instead of digging down and trying something, anything, he pouted and threw a tantrum. Contrast that with Dan Campbell the last game of the season. He threw everything but the kitchen sink at the opponent- wingback pass off a fake reverse, flea flicker, fake punt, reverses. "We wanted to empty the chamber" said Campbell.

Campbell didn't pitch several fits; he kept punching even though that team started 0-10, and he didn't get any 200 million spend on free agents. Maybe that's why Campbell still has a job and Judge doesn't. Judge is immature and needs to grow up before he can be a HC. Good bye and Godspeed.

In comment 15553276 Tom [Giants fan] said:

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While I am glad he is no longer the head coach, I wish there was some way we could have him come back as the special teams coach. I think he would be very successful here in that role but know it could never happen.

Did you see something in our special teams the last two years that makes you think this?

No one could have done a good job with this team. And I believe he did his best to get out of town instead of staying around for another season of losing. So mission accomplished $20 million dollars later by Judge.