Two all time greats who have one SB appearance and win each one but only one gets killed for being a choke artist and one is spared? Is it because Rodgers is more talented, had better teams, and because he's more douchy than Brees?
you could argue that Brees deserves it more. Only made the NFCCG twice other than the SB season. I do agree that a lot of it is due to the often fawning treatment Brees got from the press, but that shouldn’t be a valid one. If we’re really evaluating the merits of a QB’s career, it’s only what happens on the field that matters.
In 22 playoff games, 45 TDs/13 INTs, 65% completion%, 7.6 YPA, 8 AY/A, and the Packers have averaged 28PPG in those games. Those a pretty robust numbers against the best competition.
(His career numbers as comps, 65% completion%, 7.8 YPA and 8.45 AY/A.)
I think Rodgers is unique, different, etc. He isnt politically correct. He can sometimes be outspoken. He has a ton of talent and 1 SB.....can g on and on.
he was never a strong armed or overly athletic player so most would probably agree he made the most of his abilities in Payton's system. especially given the shoulder surgery that was bad enough that Nick Saban passed on him and instead signed Daunte Culpepper in FA.
Rodgers on the other hand might be the most talented QB to ever play the game. His arm talent and athleticism both set a new standard so it is surprising he only won the 1 SB.
Brees never won an MVP award (he finished 2nd 4x).
Rodgers won 3 (and may get #4 this year).
For whatever reason, despite all of his successes Brees has never been looked at by most people as an all time great. He’s mostly looked at as a very good QB but a bit of a stat compiler. He’s never in the conversation for the GOAT. Rodgers is. And with that comes more scrutiny…
of the Minneapolis miracle and the PI debacle against the Rams. Not to mention the loss at SF in 2011. He's had some pretty bad breaks in the playoffs.
of the Minneapolis miracle and the PI debacle against the Rams. Not to mention the loss at SF in 2011. He's had some pretty bad breaks in the playoffs.
The onside kick miscue by Brandon Bostick in 2015 NFCC against Seattle wasn't a bad break for Rodgers and Green Bay??
Ever think his family might suck? Rodgers is no doubt a strange guy, but whatever traits he picked up in life are almost certainly linked back to how he was raised. Dating back to the draft he's pretty much the same guy which means money and fame didn't change him.
Rodgers is no doubt a strange guy, but whatever traits he picked up in life are almost certainly linked back to how he was raised. Dating back to the draft he's pretty much the same guy which means money and fame didn't change him.
Yeah. The whole family thing I don't see the big deal, at all. I don't care too much for anyone in my family and get along with other people great. Some people just don't get along with members of their family.
Just because someone is your parent, sibling or cousin; doesn't mean they can't be assholes.
RE: because Brees was an overachiever relative to his talent
he was never a strong armed or overly athletic player so most would probably agree he made the most of his abilities in Payton's system. especially given the shoulder surgery that was bad enough that Nick Saban passed on him and instead signed Daunte Culpepper in FA.
Rodgers on the other hand might be the most talented QB to ever play the game. His arm talent and athleticism both set a new standard so it is surprising he only won the 1 SB.
Brees never won an MVP award (he finished 2nd 4x).
Rodgers won 3 (and may get #4 this year).
Wasn’t Saban overruled by MIA’s training staff and team docs, who were scared away by the shoulder? At least my recollection… could be wrong.
of the Minneapolis miracle and the PI debacle against the Rams. Not to mention the loss at SF in 2011. He's had some pretty bad breaks in the playoffs.
The onside kick miscue by Brandon Bostick in 2015 NFCC against Seattle wasn't a bad break for Rodgers and Green Bay??
Most unfortunate playoff loss I think I've ever seen, from a neutral perspective.
Makes Craig's fumble seem like not such a big deal.
Maybe I loathe Seattle's fortunes more than anything. :D
of the Minneapolis miracle and the PI debacle against the Rams. Not to mention the loss at SF in 2011. He's had some pretty bad breaks in the playoffs.
The onside kick miscue by Brandon Bostick in 2015 NFCC against Seattle wasn't a bad break for Rodgers and Green Bay??
Most unfortunate playoff loss I think I've ever seen, from a neutral perspective.
Makes Craig's fumble seem like not such a big deal.
Maybe I loathe Seattle's fortunes more than anything. :D
That was a crushing loss. That was during a time when Seattle and Wilson were out of their minds pulling rabbits out of hats to win games.
It was almost fitting, though, that they lost two weeks later to New England on the incredible interception by Butler. It's like the Football Gods said "enough is enough"...have a seat.
is what keeps Packers underachieving in big moments, IMO.
It all makes sense if you really think about it.
His otherworldly arm talent and physical ability is plenty in the regular season against decent to very good teams.
In the postseason in the modern day, it's not enough. He caught lightning in a bottle that 2010 super bowl run, and had the defense as well.
But when things go south in the playoffs as they always do, he gives up easily.
Mentally, he's not super tough. I am the biggest Russell Wilson critic on the planet, but if Rodgers' had Wilson's mental toughness he'd have won a couple super bowls probably.
Garoppolo is even better than him in this instance. Plenty of QBs you could list. Brady is an absolute no brainer, and there are several others.
Rodgers' is just so damn talented, it's easy to ignore this stuff. Get wowed by that sick drive to end regulation against the Cards in 2015.....
But then last weekend, a fumble on the 2nd drive and immediately the guy gives up like he's down 21.
In the regular season, Rodgers gives you wins. But in the post, you need a team that can win in spite of him to some extent.
After a decade, something has to make sense of this. Were last year's Bucs really a better squad than all of last decade's Packers' teams?
The onside kick miscue by Brandon Bostick in 2015 NFCC against Seattle wasn't a bad break for Rodgers and Green Bay??
Most unfortunate playoff loss I think I've ever seen, from a neutral perspective.
Makes Craig's fumble seem like not such a big deal.
Maybe I loathe Seattle's fortunes more than anything. :D
That was a crushing loss. That was during a time when Seattle and Wilson were out of their minds pulling rabbits out of hats to win games.
It was almost fitting, though, that they lost two weeks later to New England on the incredible interception by Butler. It's like the Football Gods said "enough is enough"...have a seat.
I absolutely couldn't agree with you more, well said.
How quickly people forget. Luckiest team I've ever seen.
Ask Matt Stafford about that goal line punch out of Calvin Johnson by Kam Chancellor the season after. Just surreal what they pulled off.
Eli beat both Rodgers and Favre in Green Bay for the NFC Championship
is what keeps Packers underachieving in big moments, IMO.
It all makes sense if you really think about it.
His otherworldly arm talent and physical ability is plenty in the regular season against decent to very good teams.
In the postseason in the modern day, it's not enough. He caught lightning in a bottle that 2010 super bowl run, and had the defense as well.
But when things go south in the playoffs as they always do, he gives up easily.
Mentally, he's not super tough. I am the biggest Russell Wilson critic on the planet, but if Rodgers' had Wilson's mental toughness he'd have won a couple super bowls probably.
Garoppolo is even better than him in this instance. Plenty of QBs you could list. Brady is an absolute no brainer, and there are several others.
Rodgers' is just so damn talented, it's easy to ignore this stuff. Get wowed by that sick drive to end regulation against the Cards in 2015.....
But then last weekend, a fumble on the 2nd drive and immediately the guy gives up like he's down 21.
In the regular season, Rodgers gives you wins. But in the post, you need a team that can win in spite of him to some extent.
After a decade, something has to make sense of this. Were last year's Bucs really a better squad than all of last decade's Packers' teams?
There’s nothing factual about saying he isn’t mentally tough. The guy just took and entire offseason of shit from everyone with a Twitter account and a microphone, and put up an MVP season without camp. Mentally weak people can’t do that.
The better and more obvious reason is - he’s just like almost every other QB to ever play the game - winning super bowls is fucking hard and lots of breaks need to be in your favor.
is what keeps Packers underachieving in big moments, IMO.
It all makes sense if you really think about it.
His otherworldly arm talent and physical ability is plenty in the regular season against decent to very good teams.
In the postseason in the modern day, it's not enough. He caught lightning in a bottle that 2010 super bowl run, and had the defense as well.
But when things go south in the playoffs as they always do, he gives up easily.
Mentally, he's not super tough. I am the biggest Russell Wilson critic on the planet, but if Rodgers' had Wilson's mental toughness he'd have won a couple super bowls probably.
Garoppolo is even better than him in this instance. Plenty of QBs you could list. Brady is an absolute no brainer, and there are several others.
Rodgers' is just so damn talented, it's easy to ignore this stuff. Get wowed by that sick drive to end regulation against the Cards in 2015.....
But then last weekend, a fumble on the 2nd drive and immediately the guy gives up like he's down 21.
In the regular season, Rodgers gives you wins. But in the post, you need a team that can win in spite of him to some extent.
After a decade, something has to make sense of this. Were last year's Bucs really a better squad than all of last decade's Packers' teams?
There’s nothing factual about saying he isn’t mentally tough. The guy just took and entire offseason of shit from everyone with a Twitter account and a microphone, and put up an MVP season without camp. Mentally weak people can’t do that.
The better and more obvious reason is - he’s just like almost every other QB to ever play the game - winning super bowls is fucking hard and lots of breaks need to be in your favor.
He's super tough off the field, almost too tough.
On the field, IMO could be tougher.
But agree, too much stock put into QBs being responsible for everything.
However, when you tell casual fans he's only won 1 SB, they all act shocked.
Really terrific QB, not taking that away from a HoF career. But he played in a dome and in a division with pretty much always good weather. Again, he’s a HoF QB. No doubt about. But I don’t think Brees is any better than Eli, in fact I’d argue the opposite that Eli’s clearly had a much more difficult division and obviously worse weather. But yeah, for some reason people yerk and jizz all over Brees but then say Eli isn’t anything special. Playing indoors for a QB is a high advantage.
As far as Rodgers? He better than all but a handful to ever play the game. I don’t understand how that isn’t clear to anyone and everyone that’s a fan of the game. Weird dude. Always has been. Seems like a real stiff prick too. But he’s an all time great QB.
There’s nothing factual about saying he isn’t mentally tough. The guy just took and entire offseason of shit from everyone with a Twitter account and a microphone, and put up an MVP season without camp. Mentally weak people can’t do that.
The better and more obvious reason is - he’s just like almost every other QB to ever play the game - winning super bowls is fucking hard and lots of breaks need to be in your favor.
I agree and the Packers FO deserves some blame. They're overly stingy adding talent through FA (some ST help maybe?). And maybe an impact player taken with the Love pick would've made a difference.
of the Minneapolis miracle and the PI debacle against the Rams. Not to mention the loss at SF in 2011. He's had some pretty bad breaks in the playoffs.
The onside kick miscue by Brandon Bostick in 2015 NFCC against Seattle wasn't a bad break for Rodgers and Green Bay??
I don’t disagree but Brees had some really brutal luck in a few playoff games. I don’t remember many outright stinkers or games where the saints got blown out.
Plus, the Katrina situation was a very big feel-good story for Brees...
In 22 playoff games, 45 TDs/13 INTs, 65% completion%, 7.6 YPA, 8 AY/A, and the Packers have averaged 28PPG in those games. Those a pretty robust numbers against the best competition.
(His career numbers as comps, 65% completion%, 7.8 YPA and 8.45 AY/A.)
He doesn't piss me off. But he is a total tool & I love watching him lose.
Rodgers on the other hand might be the most talented QB to ever play the game. His arm talent and athleticism both set a new standard so it is surprising he only won the 1 SB.
Brees never won an MVP award (he finished 2nd 4x).
Rodgers won 3 (and may get #4 this year).
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Bonds didn't get in the HoF and Ortiz did. People like Brees and they don't like Rodgers.
Plus, the Katrina situation was a very big feel-good story for Brees...
That is true... plus he seems like a really good dad.
I think in the history of the Super Bowl, there are only 12 qb's who have more than one win.
Rodgers followed Favre in one of the most successful franchises in NFL history. Plus he blew big home games in the playoffs routinely.
Did he choke against Dallas 2 years ago in the playoffs when he drove the offensive down the field in well under a minute to beat the Cowboys?
It's basically like saying Dan Marino was a choke artist.
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very entertaining
He doesn't piss me off. But he is a total tool & I love watching him lose.
Him winning MVPs has to sting then.
Guy is awesome to watch. Don’t care about his personal life. Wish he was a giant.
Did he choke against Dallas 2 years ago in the playoffs when he drove the offensive down the field in well under a minute to beat the Cowboys?
It's basically like saying Dan Marino was a choke artist.
It’s lame. Take out the extreme outlier (Brady) and you are left with the field who are all chokers, apparently.
On that note, Brady choked last weekend, right?
On the other hand, Rodgers has never had a HoF coach and very likely elevated the coaching records of his HCs.
His own family doesn't want to deal with him.
Did he choke against Dallas 2 years ago in the playoffs when he drove the offensive down the field in well under a minute to beat the Cowboys?
It's basically like saying Dan Marino was a choke artist.
How about unfulfilled greatness? As for Marino, he’s be unstoppable today.
The onside kick miscue by Brandon Bostick in 2015 NFCC against Seattle wasn't a bad break for Rodgers and Green Bay??
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Pretty simple.
His own family doesn't want to deal with him.
Ever think his family might suck? Rodgers is no doubt a strange guy, but whatever traits he picked up in life are almost certainly linked back to how he was raised. Dating back to the draft he's pretty much the same guy which means money and fame didn't change him.
I mean isn't his dad a weirdo from how he acts in public? Or is that someone else I'm thinking of?
Either way, there are two sides to every story.
Yeah. The whole family thing I don't see the big deal, at all. I don't care too much for anyone in my family and get along with other people great. Some people just don't get along with members of their family.
Just because someone is your parent, sibling or cousin; doesn't mean they can't be assholes.
Rodgers on the other hand might be the most talented QB to ever play the game. His arm talent and athleticism both set a new standard so it is surprising he only won the 1 SB.
Brees never won an MVP award (he finished 2nd 4x).
Rodgers won 3 (and may get #4 this year).
Wasn’t Saban overruled by MIA’s training staff and team docs, who were scared away by the shoulder? At least my recollection… could be wrong.
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of the Minneapolis miracle and the PI debacle against the Rams. Not to mention the loss at SF in 2011. He's had some pretty bad breaks in the playoffs.
The onside kick miscue by Brandon Bostick in 2015 NFCC against Seattle wasn't a bad break for Rodgers and Green Bay??
Most unfortunate playoff loss I think I've ever seen, from a neutral perspective.
Makes Craig's fumble seem like not such a big deal.
Maybe I loathe Seattle's fortunes more than anything. :D
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crap. It's really the dumbest statement being floated out there right now.
Did he choke against Dallas 2 years ago in the playoffs when he drove the offensive down the field in well under a minute to beat the Cowboys?
It's basically like saying Dan Marino was a choke artist.
How about unfulfilled greatness? As for Marino, he’s be unstoppable today.
Soo, unfulfilled greatness makes you a choke artist?
Can't compare Minneapolis miracle to 2011.
The onside kick miscue by Brandon Bostick in 2015 NFCC against Seattle wasn't a bad break for Rodgers and Green Bay??
Most unfortunate playoff loss I think I've ever seen, from a neutral perspective.
Makes Craig's fumble seem like not such a big deal.
Maybe I loathe Seattle's fortunes more than anything. :D
That was a crushing loss. That was during a time when Seattle and Wilson were out of their minds pulling rabbits out of hats to win games.
It was almost fitting, though, that they lost two weeks later to New England on the incredible interception by Butler. It's like the Football Gods said "enough is enough"...have a seat.
It all makes sense if you really think about it.
His otherworldly arm talent and physical ability is plenty in the regular season against decent to very good teams.
In the postseason in the modern day, it's not enough. He caught lightning in a bottle that 2010 super bowl run, and had the defense as well.
But when things go south in the playoffs as they always do, he gives up easily.
Mentally, he's not super tough. I am the biggest Russell Wilson critic on the planet, but if Rodgers' had Wilson's mental toughness he'd have won a couple super bowls probably.
Garoppolo is even better than him in this instance. Plenty of QBs you could list. Brady is an absolute no brainer, and there are several others.
Rodgers' is just so damn talented, it's easy to ignore this stuff. Get wowed by that sick drive to end regulation against the Cards in 2015.....
But then last weekend, a fumble on the 2nd drive and immediately the guy gives up like he's down 21.
In the regular season, Rodgers gives you wins. But in the post, you need a team that can win in spite of him to some extent.
After a decade, something has to make sense of this. Were last year's Bucs really a better squad than all of last decade's Packers' teams?
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In comment 15574933 bw in dc said:
The onside kick miscue by Brandon Bostick in 2015 NFCC against Seattle wasn't a bad break for Rodgers and Green Bay??
Most unfortunate playoff loss I think I've ever seen, from a neutral perspective.
Makes Craig's fumble seem like not such a big deal.
Maybe I loathe Seattle's fortunes more than anything. :D
That was a crushing loss. That was during a time when Seattle and Wilson were out of their minds pulling rabbits out of hats to win games.
It was almost fitting, though, that they lost two weeks later to New England on the incredible interception by Butler. It's like the Football Gods said "enough is enough"...have a seat.
I absolutely couldn't agree with you more, well said.
How quickly people forget. Luckiest team I've ever seen.
Ask Matt Stafford about that goal line punch out of Calvin Johnson by Kam Chancellor the season after. Just surreal what they pulled off.
I don't understand why that not greatness deserving of the Hall of Fame
It all makes sense if you really think about it.
His otherworldly arm talent and physical ability is plenty in the regular season against decent to very good teams.
In the postseason in the modern day, it's not enough. He caught lightning in a bottle that 2010 super bowl run, and had the defense as well.
But when things go south in the playoffs as they always do, he gives up easily.
Mentally, he's not super tough. I am the biggest Russell Wilson critic on the planet, but if Rodgers' had Wilson's mental toughness he'd have won a couple super bowls probably.
Garoppolo is even better than him in this instance. Plenty of QBs you could list. Brady is an absolute no brainer, and there are several others.
Rodgers' is just so damn talented, it's easy to ignore this stuff. Get wowed by that sick drive to end regulation against the Cards in 2015.....
But then last weekend, a fumble on the 2nd drive and immediately the guy gives up like he's down 21.
In the regular season, Rodgers gives you wins. But in the post, you need a team that can win in spite of him to some extent.
After a decade, something has to make sense of this. Were last year's Bucs really a better squad than all of last decade's Packers' teams?
There’s nothing factual about saying he isn’t mentally tough. The guy just took and entire offseason of shit from everyone with a Twitter account and a microphone, and put up an MVP season without camp. Mentally weak people can’t do that.
The better and more obvious reason is - he’s just like almost every other QB to ever play the game - winning super bowls is fucking hard and lots of breaks need to be in your favor.
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is what keeps Packers underachieving in big moments, IMO.
It all makes sense if you really think about it.
His otherworldly arm talent and physical ability is plenty in the regular season against decent to very good teams.
In the postseason in the modern day, it's not enough. He caught lightning in a bottle that 2010 super bowl run, and had the defense as well.
But when things go south in the playoffs as they always do, he gives up easily.
Mentally, he's not super tough. I am the biggest Russell Wilson critic on the planet, but if Rodgers' had Wilson's mental toughness he'd have won a couple super bowls probably.
Garoppolo is even better than him in this instance. Plenty of QBs you could list. Brady is an absolute no brainer, and there are several others.
Rodgers' is just so damn talented, it's easy to ignore this stuff. Get wowed by that sick drive to end regulation against the Cards in 2015.....
But then last weekend, a fumble on the 2nd drive and immediately the guy gives up like he's down 21.
In the regular season, Rodgers gives you wins. But in the post, you need a team that can win in spite of him to some extent.
After a decade, something has to make sense of this. Were last year's Bucs really a better squad than all of last decade's Packers' teams?
There’s nothing factual about saying he isn’t mentally tough. The guy just took and entire offseason of shit from everyone with a Twitter account and a microphone, and put up an MVP season without camp. Mentally weak people can’t do that.
The better and more obvious reason is - he’s just like almost every other QB to ever play the game - winning super bowls is fucking hard and lots of breaks need to be in your favor.
He's super tough off the field, almost too tough.
On the field, IMO could be tougher.
But agree, too much stock put into QBs being responsible for everything.
However, when you tell casual fans he's only won 1 SB, they all act shocked.
As far as Rodgers? He better than all but a handful to ever play the game. I don’t understand how that isn’t clear to anyone and everyone that’s a fan of the game. Weird dude. Always has been. Seems like a real stiff prick too. But he’s an all time great QB.
There’s nothing factual about saying he isn’t mentally tough. The guy just took and entire offseason of shit from everyone with a Twitter account and a microphone, and put up an MVP season without camp. Mentally weak people can’t do that.
The better and more obvious reason is - he’s just like almost every other QB to ever play the game - winning super bowls is fucking hard and lots of breaks need to be in your favor.
I agree and the Packers FO deserves some blame. They're overly stingy adding talent through FA (some ST help maybe?). And maybe an impact player taken with the Love pick would've made a difference.
There’s so much wrong with this take I don’t know where to begin. But let’s start with Brees losing 9 playoff games yet showed up for all of them?
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of the Minneapolis miracle and the PI debacle against the Rams. Not to mention the loss at SF in 2011. He's had some pretty bad breaks in the playoffs.
The onside kick miscue by Brandon Bostick in 2015 NFCC against Seattle wasn't a bad break for Rodgers and Green Bay??
I don’t disagree but Brees had some really brutal luck in a few playoff games. I don’t remember many outright stinkers or games where the saints got blown out.
Most fun player to watch in the league for me the last 15 years. I also enjoy all the reasons why he’s hated, they are fairly petty and funny.
He’s a toolbag, that’s your reason for hating him, seems reasonable.
Agree to disagree, I suppose.