How do you create cap space and how do you have enough draft capital to fix OL? Cuts need to be made and IMO giving up draft picks to move up is a mistake when there are so many holes to fill.
How do you create cap space and how do you have enough draft capital to fix OL? Cuts need to be made and IMO giving up draft picks to move up is a mistake when there are so many holes to fill.
Hutchinson is worth it...trade #5 to get Hutch,trade down #7 if you want more shots at the OL
if you think Aidan Hutchinson is going to make this a top 5 defense. Top half? Maybe, but top 5 is ridiculous. Besides, Wink has always run out of a 3-4 base, Hutchinson is a better fit for a 4-3 base defense.
Get ready for more losing until the rebuild is well under way. Think 2023 or 2024 at the earliest. If they have to dump Daniel Jones, it is going to take longer.
One is coming of a major injury, the other off a terrible year. This team needs to get younger and healthier, not keep running back the same highly paid vets who have been part of the losing and hoping for better results.
Martinez and Bradbury will likely be cut (Martinez due to the nature of his injury, and Bradbury due to his contract). I would like for the team to resign J. Smith, I felt he played well after joining late in the season. I really like Hutchinson, but he is a 4-3 DE and the team maybe running a 3-4 (someone indicated yesterday that Wink runs a 3-4).
to about everything you said. I love the optimism but I just don't see it.
Giants intend to dump, what was it, $40M? They are currently close to $11M over the cap for 2022. Moves will have to be made. Maybe, Bradbury just gets extended.
As to Martinez, he tore his ACL. I'm sincerely surprised by how optimistic people are for players returning from an ACL when it's very rare for players to return to form after recovery. Those that do recover, it most often takes more than 1 full year to do so. Patrick Peterson is the only true exception I've ever really found.
They need to dump players and that includes some good players that are just costing too much. It's reset time. We have more gaps than we currently have picks and those lower picks will likely not amount to much. If/When they dump high salary players they will have even more gaps to fill. Moving up will cost draft picks when they really need more draft picks.
Regardless, if everything goes the Giants way, you still have players learning a new defensive scheme and jumping from around a mid 20s level rank to top 5 is unlikely. I'd love to proven wrong though.
Get ready for more losing until the rebuild is well under way. Think 2023 or 2024 at the earliest. If they have to dump Daniel Jones, it is going to take longer.
If? Dumping Jones is the first thing they should do.
We darn near top 5 on D at the end of 2020
We added a great shut down corner in the off-season and along with Bradbury we can have one of the best CB duos in the league.
We are a different team with a healthy Martinez and if we had some semblance of a pass rush (Hutchinson) we can be back as an elite D...
RE: I think we can be a top 5 defense within the division
all they need to do is grow and stay healthy. Probably could withstand the loss of Bradberry, especially with Schoen/Daboll and the draft..
Not expecting Martinez to be retained. The ACL took away our core guy on D, imv..So LBs need an influx and hopefully they can be obtained in the draft. Carter may get a reprieve and they might have plans for the younger backers, but LB needs a lot of talent infusion..
We have a young DL and an Edge would be nice, but not sure HOW MUCH Wink values that position. TBD..
Fixing LB would go along way towards pointing the arrow up, imv
possibly correct- but not for the reasons you stated.
First, we have to get rid of players and make cap space before making any bold statements etc.
Second, we need to know what the Gmen plan to do defensively- guessing right now based on Wink's past defenses.
Third, we then need to acquire players.
I think this team can field a very young, hungry, aggressive defense but one that will have learning and growing pains. How fast the players can jell and how much of an impact can we get from guys in this years draft will be very important.
What will help our defense some is an offense that can at least score points this year. If we can get some points generated and some TOP on our side that will aid our defense.
Regardless this is a rebuilding year but we should see major strides by the end of the year.
We darn near top 5 on D at the end of 2020
We added a great shut down corner in the off-season and along with Bradbury we can have one of the best CB duos in the league.
We are a different team with a healthy Martinez and if we had some semblance of a pass rush (Hutchinson) we can be back as an elite D...
Yes - this the same thinking is what got Gettleman fired and me thinking the Giants could go places this past season -- well I was wrong and so was Gettleman -- you most likely will be disappointed in what is about to happen now because:
This team was in last place in the division this year -- they were terrible and getting worse -- we are 11 million over the cap and the new GM wants to trim $40 million off the cap -- this means players are going to be cut -- and players with big salaries like Bradbury and Martinez will either be cut, traded or take a pay cut -- you take Bradbury out of the equation and you don't even know if Martinez can play at the same level again -- and you are trimming a defense that for most of the season couldn't stop the other team from making a first down or scoring on third down or the end of any half
You guys do realize we are still one of the worst teams in the NFL?
The Bears beat the Giants 29-3. The Bears.
Come on... to be fair the wheels were completely off when we played the Bears... with Glennon going what was it like 2 for 20 and 30 yards lol. You could also go the other way and point out the fact that prior to wheels off we only lost to the Chiefs 20-17 (and really should have won that game).
We darn near top 5 on D at the end of 2020
We added a great shut down corner in the off-season and along with Bradbury we can have one of the best CB duos in the league.
We are a different team with a healthy Martinez and if we had some semblance of a pass rush (Hutchinson) we can be back as an elite D...
And you forget how many backup QB’s we faced in the 2nd half of 2020.
We darn near top 5 on D at the end of 2020
We added a great shut down corner in the off-season and along with Bradbury we can have one of the best CB duos in the league.
We are a different team with a healthy Martinez and if we had some semblance of a pass rush (Hutchinson) we can be back as an elite D...
They weren't "darn near" anything. They were 9th in points allowed, but they were closer to 16th than they were to 5th.
The only thing you can say about that defense is that they were good at holding opponents to FGs. Unfortunately, here's what they were bad at:
3rd downs (T-25th)
RZ trips (24th)
Plays per drive (T-31th)
Time per drive (29th)
They aren't one player away from being an "elite" defense, and even if they were it's unlikely that player is in this draft. Trading up is a preposterous idea.
We darn near top 5 on D at the end of 2020
We added a great shut down corner in the off-season and along with Bradbury we can have one of the best CB duos in the league.
We are a different team with a healthy Martinez and if we had some semblance of a pass rush (Hutchinson) we can be back as an elite D...
And you forget how many backup QB’s we faced in the 2nd half of 2020.
and being honest with themselves regarding the talent and design, and the true potential of the team year after year is why they're terrible. With DG et al being ushered out, some people in the building need to be adults and make the hard decisions, get the hard realities across to the mgmt ranks.
No more consolation prizes, no more seeing things that aren't reality and making decisions as such.
Get ready for more losing until the rebuild is well under way. Think 2023 or 2024 at the earliest. If they have to dump Daniel Jones, it is going to take longer.
If? Dumping Jones is the first thing they should do.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Everyone knows you want Jones gone. You post it everywhere you can. Give it a rest.
I don't think you're taking into account what we have to do to simply be able to sign our rookies this year let alone any free agents. Burning draft picks to move up is complete fantasy.
Schoen has said he wants as many at bats as he can get when it comes to the draft on top of this. Not to mention we may need to burn draft capital next year to move up for a QB.
Our offense has been 31st 3 of the last 5 years, burning picks for an edge in a deep class is the last thing i would do
I think the speed of the turnaround depends on these three things:
- How quickly can the Giants get demonstrably more production at QB
- How well the new front office self scouts and subtracts/keeps the right players
- How many of the top 100 picks over the next 2 years become immediate contributors
Football has unmistakably become a resource allocation business.
There are critical components to the pie, and the good teams get as many of the big slices at or below their proportionate cost/value.
The Giants have like one or two players you can say that about.
Moving up to get Hutchinson would be a huge mistake, that would
Hutchinson is worth it...trade #5 to get Hutch,trade down #7 if you want more shots at the OL
Bad strategy.
You guys do realize we are still one of the worst teams in the NFL?
The Bears beat the Giants 29-3. The Bears.
We're starting over again.
Get ready for more losing until the rebuild is well under way. Think 2023 or 2024 at the earliest. If they have to dump Daniel Jones, it is going to take longer.
I don't see a trade up.
One is coming of a major injury, the other off a terrible year. This team needs to get younger and healthier, not keep running back the same highly paid vets who have been part of the losing and hoping for better results.
Giants intend to dump, what was it, $40M? They are currently close to $11M over the cap for 2022. Moves will have to be made. Maybe, Bradbury just gets extended.
As to Martinez, he tore his ACL. I'm sincerely surprised by how optimistic people are for players returning from an ACL when it's very rare for players to return to form after recovery. Those that do recover, it most often takes more than 1 full year to do so. Patrick Peterson is the only true exception I've ever really found.
They need to dump players and that includes some good players that are just costing too much. It's reset time. We have more gaps than we currently have picks and those lower picks will likely not amount to much. If/When they dump high salary players they will have even more gaps to fill. Moving up will cost draft picks when they really need more draft picks.
Regardless, if everything goes the Giants way, you still have players learning a new defensive scheme and jumping from around a mid 20s level rank to top 5 is unlikely. I'd love to proven wrong though.
It's not "the Bears".
It's DA BEARS!
We're starting over again.
Get ready for more losing until the rebuild is well under way. Think 2023 or 2024 at the earliest. If they have to dump Daniel Jones, it is going to take longer.
If? Dumping Jones is the first thing they should do.
We added a great shut down corner in the off-season and along with Bradbury we can have one of the best CB duos in the league.
We are a different team with a healthy Martinez and if we had some semblance of a pass rush (Hutchinson) we can be back as an elite D...
I should hope so... being there are only 3 other teams in our division. I'll take it a step further... I'll bet we could make top 4 in our division.
Hope is not a plan.
Not expecting Martinez to be retained. The ACL took away our core guy on D, imv..So LBs need an influx and hopefully they can be obtained in the draft. Carter may get a reprieve and they might have plans for the younger backers, but LB needs a lot of talent infusion..
We have a young DL and an Edge would be nice, but not sure HOW MUCH Wink values that position. TBD..
Fixing LB would go along way towards pointing the arrow up, imv
First, we have to get rid of players and make cap space before making any bold statements etc.
Second, we need to know what the Gmen plan to do defensively- guessing right now based on Wink's past defenses.
Third, we then need to acquire players.
I think this team can field a very young, hungry, aggressive defense but one that will have learning and growing pains. How fast the players can jell and how much of an impact can we get from guys in this years draft will be very important.
What will help our defense some is an offense that can at least score points this year. If we can get some points generated and some TOP on our side that will aid our defense.
Regardless this is a rebuilding year but we should see major strides by the end of the year.
Hmmm. I'm completely other way. The sooner we cut the cord with Jones the sooner we can move forward to finding a real solution at QB.
We added a great shut down corner in the off-season and along with Bradbury we can have one of the best CB duos in the league.
We are a different team with a healthy Martinez and if we had some semblance of a pass rush (Hutchinson) we can be back as an elite D...
Yes - this the same thinking is what got Gettleman fired and me thinking the Giants could go places this past season -- well I was wrong and so was Gettleman -- you most likely will be disappointed in what is about to happen now because:
This team was in last place in the division this year -- they were terrible and getting worse -- we are 11 million over the cap and the new GM wants to trim $40 million off the cap -- this means players are going to be cut -- and players with big salaries like Bradbury and Martinez will either be cut, traded or take a pay cut -- you take Bradbury out of the equation and you don't even know if Martinez can play at the same level again -- and you are trimming a defense that for most of the season couldn't stop the other team from making a first down or scoring on third down or the end of any half
Frankly, I'd rather have a struggling, younger defense with many new faces than keeping the overpaid parts we currently have.
You guys do realize we are still one of the worst teams in the NFL?
The Bears beat the Giants 29-3. The Bears.
Come on... to be fair the wheels were completely off when we played the Bears... with Glennon going what was it like 2 for 20 and 30 yards lol. You could also go the other way and point out the fact that prior to wheels off we only lost to the Chiefs 20-17 (and really should have won that game).
We added a great shut down corner in the off-season and along with Bradbury we can have one of the best CB duos in the league.
We are a different team with a healthy Martinez and if we had some semblance of a pass rush (Hutchinson) we can be back as an elite D...
And you forget how many backup QB’s we faced in the 2nd half of 2020.
We added a great shut down corner in the off-season and along with Bradbury we can have one of the best CB duos in the league.
We are a different team with a healthy Martinez and if we had some semblance of a pass rush (Hutchinson) we can be back as an elite D...
They weren't "darn near" anything. They were 9th in points allowed, but they were closer to 16th than they were to 5th.
The only thing you can say about that defense is that they were good at holding opponents to FGs. Unfortunately, here's what they were bad at:
3rd downs (T-25th)
RZ trips (24th)
Plays per drive (T-31th)
Time per drive (29th)
They aren't one player away from being an "elite" defense, and even if they were it's unlikely that player is in this draft. Trading up is a preposterous idea.
The Giants defense was NOT good last year. The Giants were 21st in the NFL. We had one of the worst run defenses in the NFL.
Quote:
We darn near top 5 on D at the end of 2020
We added a great shut down corner in the off-season and along with Bradbury we can have one of the best CB duos in the league.
We are a different team with a healthy Martinez and if we had some semblance of a pass rush (Hutchinson) we can be back as an elite D...
And you forget how many backup QB’s we faced in the 2nd half of 2020.
We have a great shut down corner?
who the hell is that?
No more consolation prizes, no more seeing things that aren't reality and making decisions as such.
Quote:
Giants wasted 10 years.
We're starting over again.
Get ready for more losing until the rebuild is well under way. Think 2023 or 2024 at the earliest. If they have to dump Daniel Jones, it is going to take longer.
If? Dumping Jones is the first thing they should do.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Everyone knows you want Jones gone. You post it everywhere you can. Give it a rest.
Schoen has said he wants as many at bats as he can get when it comes to the draft on top of this. Not to mention we may need to burn draft capital next year to move up for a QB.
Our offense has been 31st 3 of the last 5 years, burning picks for an edge in a deep class is the last thing i would do
- How quickly can the Giants get demonstrably more production at QB
- How well the new front office self scouts and subtracts/keeps the right players
- How many of the top 100 picks over the next 2 years become immediate contributors
Football has unmistakably become a resource allocation business.
There are critical components to the pie, and the good teams get as many of the big slices at or below their proportionate cost/value.
The Giants have like one or two players you can say that about.