the scenario i just laid out above where he cuts his salary $3.4m would play out like this (i think, can't recall another paycut restructure like this).
JB makes $10m this year, $9m converted to bonus, still hits UFA next year. Don't think he'd do better on the open market (Gilmore essentially got 1 year $9.5m).
His cap $ this year would go down to just under $14m, saving the nyg 9m+.
next year his already existing void year would carry about $5.8m of dead cap.
the key though is as a trade asset his value would go up because he'd basically count as the minimum for a team trading for him.
guess we'll see in the next few days but that is a scenario that fits with everything Schoen said.
Might need even a bit more salary cut...not liking a dead cap exceeding $5M at first blush.
Nevertheless, good thoughts. My guess is JB doesn't give but who the hell knows...
If i had to be on over or under the 10m i'd probably bet under. Gilmore is on a 7.75m cap number this year and it sounds like Bradberry wants to get to UFA next March, which gives teams less ways to manipulate the cap hit.
just 5 teams have $15m or more in effective cap space to reasonably afford a 1 year $10m cap hit. Browns, Panthers, Dolphins, Chargers, Bengals.
so the odds not exactly in his favor to get anywhere close to the 13.4m he's on paper for right now, especially since the nyg have likely already been willing to deal him to any of those teams at a similar approximate cost for whatever they can get back.
the number only needs to be as high as whatever the alternative is where he's making less.
if it's $8m (7m bonus) the dead cap hit next year is $4.8m.
imo having him as a trade asset to bring back a 4th or 5th round pick at the deadline is worth a dead cap hit. It's almost like a reverse comp pick.
They have been honest about the plan for next season to an unprecedented level.
it's not about the season - it's about asset management.
schoen says they had compensation agreed to for him with 2 different teams.
do you cut bait now, or move paper around to hopefully cash in the asset a few months from now?
by far the best future outcome is getting a draft pick as opposed to nothing. my own belief is draft capital is more important than a modest dead cap hit, though the ease with which Schoen created 2 extra draft picks with slight trade downs gives me a little pause on that theory.
Would start thinking less and less about potential trade value
Dan Duggan
✔
@DDuggan21
Yes. They could designate him as a post-June 1 cut. Savings would be $11.5M instead of $10.1M, with a $1.4M dead money charge in 2023. They don’t need to wait until after June 1 though. It’s just a designation. Money doesn’t become available until June 2, which shouldn’t matter
Ryan Dunleavy
✔
@rydunleavy
Joe Schoen had a lot to say about James Bradberry today on @CartonRoberts and @TMKSESPN. I wrote it all up but the biggest news … sounds like he is about to be released for no compensation and also that #Giants had some deals in place but teams and JB couldn’t reach new contract
Dan Duggan
✔
@DDuggan21
Replying to @DDuggan21
Asked for injury updates during the interview, Schoen said he expects the majority of players, including Sterling Shepard and Blake Martinez, to be ready for camp. He mentioned Nick Gates and Matt Peart as possible exceptions to that.
They have been honest about the plan for next season to an unprecedented level.
it's not about the season - it's about asset management.
schoen says they had compensation agreed to for him with 2 different teams.
do you cut bait now, or move paper around to hopefully cash in the asset a few months from now?
by far the best future outcome is getting a draft pick as opposed to nothing. my own belief is draft capital is more important than a modest dead cap hit, though the ease with which Schoen created 2 extra draft picks with slight trade downs gives me a little pause on that theory.
I dont disagree with anything you're saying.
We have a tendency to overvalue our own players because of the hope that a trade transaction brings. The reality is Bradberry is a good but very well paid corner, and trading him away was never going to be what some people expected.
Not if they had Robinson rated as the better player.
I also think the ineptitude of the offense the past few seasons vs the defense which at times has played decent would sway the opinion on Robinson vs a CB to some extent.
The Giants do have some young talent at CB and drafted another in the third round.
Dan Duggan
✔
@DDuggan21
Joe Schoen said on WFAN they should have resolution on James Bradberry by the end of the week. This is obviously headed toward his release, probably sooner than later.
So they’re going to release him after passing on Andrew Booth last week?
You need to stop thinking this is 1 -year fix. It's going to take another year or two on top of this one.
Replacing Bradberry with Booth, or Gordon, would have been perfectly in line with a long term fix. Robinson is going for the quick fix.
I love these posts. They never backfire.
Booth ends up a mediocre player and forgetful. Just feels like more whining. Aaron Robinson was a very talented kid coming out last year and has size. Did a jam up job against Kelce and Waller, even. Round 2 projection and taken in round 3. Inside/outside potential. Ran 4.39 at his pro day..
Corners often take time to develop. McKinney didn't explode until the 2nd half of the second season. Robinson to me showed enough in his rookie year that he deserves a shot in his sophomore year to start.
Just let Bradberry walk and let the young guys get their crack.
If you can get a trade without a subsidy, obviously that's ideal. But let's end this unnecessary soap opera. We don't need Bradberry.
I agree with this. They need to end it one way or another by the end of the week.
Where's the "soap opera"? They're trying to work it out. Neither side has said a single bad word about the other. Sounds like the opposite of soap opera to me.
I look forward to seeing how Aaron Robinson plays this season
but if Robinson has to start 17 games on the outside...watch out. He’s going to get shredded. I don’t get the warm and fuzzy from what I saw that he is talented to hold up.
Dan Duggan
✔
@DDuggan21
Joe Schoen said on WFAN they should have resolution on James Bradberry by the end of the week. This is obviously headed toward his release, probably sooner than later.
So they’re going to release him after passing on Andrew Booth last week?
You need to stop thinking this is 1 -year fix. It's going to take another year or two on top of this one.
Replacing Bradberry with Booth, or Gordon, would have been perfectly in line with a long term fix. Robinson is going for the quick fix.
I love these posts. They never backfire.
Booth ends up a mediocre player and forgetful. Just feels like more whining. Aaron Robinson was a very talented kid coming out last year and has size. Did a jam up job against Kelce and Waller, even. Round 2 projection and taken in round 3. Inside/outside potential. Ran 4.39 at his pro day..
Corners often take time to develop. McKinney didn't explode until the 2nd half of the second season. Robinson to me showed enough in his rookie year that he deserves a shot in his sophomore year to start.
Baked or fried? The sure didn't love him enough to exercise his option. Scholarship is over. Time to produce bigly or go be a backup somewhere. He is out of excuses not that the bunch on Big Blue Excuses Interactive won't issue them.
but if Robinson has to start 17 games on the outside...watch out. He’s going to get shredded. I don’t get the warm and fuzzy from what I saw that he is talented to hold up.
Just my view...
Well, this is the year to develop him. That's what coaches are supposed to do.
We bought him in the third round, which is a very respectable slot. So, let's see what we have.
Listen he's a starting corner in the league, it's just you know where we are financially, we need to sign our draft picks, practice squad, and replacement costs during the season.
I wish we could build a bot that posted this quote everytime someone posts something ignorant about the cap.
RE: RE: Oh and again not that I think 2022 is all that important
U
but if Robinson has to start 17 games on the outside...watch out. He’s going to get shredded. I don’t get the warm and fuzzy from what I saw that he is talented to hold up.
Just my view...
Well, this is the year to develop him. That's what coaches are supposed to do.
We bought him in the third round, which is a very respectable slot. So, let's see what we have.
Backup material. The guys that bought him were morons...
Yes, the Giants think so much of Robinson as an outside corner
Joe Schoen is not necessarily going on the FAN to convey truth to Giants fans.
The "unfortunately" definitely makes it sound like they are going to release him. But it could also be a negotiating tactic to get Bradberry back to the table.
Otherwise, why do you say "end of the week"? Why not just release him now? End of the week sounds like they are granting JB's agent one more shot to come to terms.
I really don't get people dying on the DJ hill. Yeah, good kid & hard worker from all accounts, but he is a subpar-at best-QB.
No one is "dying on the DJ hill." We just would like to see him have a chance with a better OL, better coaching, and better weapons in a year where, despite the 5000 idiotic posts saying otherwise on this website, there were no franchise QBs to take in this draft - as the draft itself proved. And every football draft writer on the planet says next year's draft is way better for QBs
The people "dying on the DJ hill" are the ones already proclaiming Jones dead. You are all so dug in on it that I dont know how you will be rooting for the Giants this season - if Jones does well and the team does well, you all look like idiots
You are all so dug in on it that I dont know how you will be rooting for the Giants this season - if Jones does well and the team does well, you all look like idiots
People have been making this same silly post for a couple years. Victory laps taken for something that hasn't happened and isn't going to happen.
RE: Yes, the Giants think so much of Robinson as an outside corner
that they were going to draft Gardner with their first draft pick
If their plan is Robinson replacing Bradberry in Wink's defense that depends on corners holding up 1-on-1 - yikes
I'm going to make a leap here and assume you know that every NFL team runs 3,4 and 5 WR sets. With Bradberry's situation, we had a dearth of corners. Therefore, targeting corners in the draft made sense. Thus, the interest in Sauce...
Not sure what more they could have done. Doesn't sound like they had an offer before the draft. I too thought they might be able to get a pick for him during or right after the draft from a team that did not address CB.
Can't force a trading partner. He as as patient as he could have been.
Yup
RE: RE: Yes, the Giants think so much of Robinson as an outside corner
that they were going to draft Gardner with their first draft pick
If their plan is Robinson replacing Bradberry in Wink's defense that depends on corners holding up 1-on-1 - yikes
I'm going to make a leap here and assume you know that every NFL team runs 3,4 and 5 WR sets. With Bradberry's situation, we had a dearth of corners. Therefore, targeting corners in the draft made sense. Thus, the interest in Sauce...
Im going to make a leap here and assume you know that there are only 2 sides to a field, so there are only 2 outside corners. The rest are slot corners
They were obviously targeting Gardner to replace Bradberry
Joe Schoen is not necessarily going on the FAN to convey truth to Giants fans.
The "unfortunately" definitely makes it sound like they are going to release him. But it could also be a negotiating tactic to get Bradberry back to the table.
Otherwise, why do you say "end of the week"? Why not just release him now? End of the week sounds like they are granting JB's agent one more shot to come to terms.
The Giants needed to upgrade every position. The corners were taken so they took a pass rusher.
Doesn't change the fact Bradberry is overpaid and had a really rough year:
Should the Giants cut a different player?
I think we can cut Martinez and save $3.5M+. I can live without him.
We're going to be living without him soon enough anyway. Let's one of the rookies get his reps. This applies to any roster vet that can offer cap savings; it's not just Bradberry.
The Giants needed to upgrade every position. The corners were taken so they took a pass rusher.
Doesn't change the fact Bradberry is overpaid and had a really rough year:
Should the Giants cut a different player?
Jones and Barkley are good for $11M, I believe...
I believe we get the best cap relief by trading both Jones and SB to get to that $11M number. On the other hand, releasing them has negligible savings.
If you can get a trade without a subsidy, obviously that's ideal. But let's end this unnecessary soap opera. We don't need Bradberry.
Quote:
the scenario i just laid out above where he cuts his salary $3.4m would play out like this (i think, can't recall another paycut restructure like this).
JB makes $10m this year, $9m converted to bonus, still hits UFA next year. Don't think he'd do better on the open market (Gilmore essentially got 1 year $9.5m).
His cap $ this year would go down to just under $14m, saving the nyg 9m+.
next year his already existing void year would carry about $5.8m of dead cap.
the key though is as a trade asset his value would go up because he'd basically count as the minimum for a team trading for him.
guess we'll see in the next few days but that is a scenario that fits with everything Schoen said.
Might need even a bit more salary cut...not liking a dead cap exceeding $5M at first blush.
Nevertheless, good thoughts. My guess is JB doesn't give but who the hell knows...
If i had to be on over or under the 10m i'd probably bet under. Gilmore is on a 7.75m cap number this year and it sounds like Bradberry wants to get to UFA next March, which gives teams less ways to manipulate the cap hit.
just 5 teams have $15m or more in effective cap space to reasonably afford a 1 year $10m cap hit. Browns, Panthers, Dolphins, Chargers, Bengals.
so the odds not exactly in his favor to get anywhere close to the 13.4m he's on paper for right now, especially since the nyg have likely already been willing to deal him to any of those teams at a similar approximate cost for whatever they can get back.
the number only needs to be as high as whatever the alternative is where he's making less.
if it's $8m (7m bonus) the dead cap hit next year is $4.8m.
imo having him as a trade asset to bring back a 4th or 5th round pick at the deadline is worth a dead cap hit. It's almost like a reverse comp pick.
it's not about the season - it's about asset management.
schoen says they had compensation agreed to for him with 2 different teams.
do you cut bait now, or move paper around to hopefully cash in the asset a few months from now?
by far the best future outcome is getting a draft pick as opposed to nothing. my own belief is draft capital is more important than a modest dead cap hit, though the ease with which Schoen created 2 extra draft picks with slight trade downs gives me a little pause on that theory.
They just aren't going to be in demand as much as one would hope...
✔
@DDuggan21
Yes. They could designate him as a post-June 1 cut. Savings would be $11.5M instead of $10.1M, with a $1.4M dead money charge in 2023. They don’t need to wait until after June 1 though. It’s just a designation. Money doesn’t become available until June 2, which shouldn’t matter
✔
@rydunleavy
Joe Schoen had a lot to say about James Bradberry today on @CartonRoberts and @TMKSESPN. I wrote it all up but the biggest news … sounds like he is about to be released for no compensation and also that #Giants had some deals in place but teams and JB couldn’t reach new contract
✔
@DDuggan21
Replying to @DDuggan21
Asked for injury updates during the interview, Schoen said he expects the majority of players, including Sterling Shepard and Blake Martinez, to be ready for camp. He mentioned Nick Gates and Matt Peart as possible exceptions to that.
Quote:
They have been honest about the plan for next season to an unprecedented level.
it's not about the season - it's about asset management.
schoen says they had compensation agreed to for him with 2 different teams.
do you cut bait now, or move paper around to hopefully cash in the asset a few months from now?
by far the best future outcome is getting a draft pick as opposed to nothing. my own belief is draft capital is more important than a modest dead cap hit, though the ease with which Schoen created 2 extra draft picks with slight trade downs gives me a little pause on that theory.
I dont disagree with anything you're saying.
We have a tendency to overvalue our own players because of the hope that a trade transaction brings. The reality is Bradberry is a good but very well paid corner, and trading him away was never going to be what some people expected.
I also think the ineptitude of the offense the past few seasons vs the defense which at times has played decent would sway the opinion on Robinson vs a CB to some extent.
The Giants do have some young talent at CB and drafted another in the third round.
Quote:
In comment 15698588 jeff57 said:
Quote:
In comment 15698557 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
Dan Duggan
✔
@DDuggan21
Joe Schoen said on WFAN they should have resolution on James Bradberry by the end of the week. This is obviously headed toward his release, probably sooner than later.
So they’re going to release him after passing on Andrew Booth last week?
You need to stop thinking this is 1 -year fix. It's going to take another year or two on top of this one.
Replacing Bradberry with Booth, or Gordon, would have been perfectly in line with a long term fix. Robinson is going for the quick fix.
I love these posts. They never backfire.
Booth ends up a mediocre player and forgetful. Just feels like more whining. Aaron Robinson was a very talented kid coming out last year and has size. Did a jam up job against Kelce and Waller, even. Round 2 projection and taken in round 3. Inside/outside potential. Ran 4.39 at his pro day..
Corners often take time to develop. McKinney didn't explode until the 2nd half of the second season. Robinson to me showed enough in his rookie year that he deserves a shot in his sophomore year to start.
Not entirely true. Dunleavy's own paper the NY Post, specifically Steve Serby wrote an article that Judge needs to be fired.
Bradberry has been handsomely paid by the New York Giants. He will be fine.
If you can get a trade without a subsidy, obviously that's ideal. But let's end this unnecessary soap opera. We don't need Bradberry.
I agree with this. They need to end it one way or another by the end of the week.
Quote:
Just let Bradberry walk and let the young guys get their crack.
If you can get a trade without a subsidy, obviously that's ideal. But let's end this unnecessary soap opera. We don't need Bradberry.
I agree with this. They need to end it one way or another by the end of the week.
Where's the "soap opera"? They're trying to work it out. Neither side has said a single bad word about the other. Sounds like the opposite of soap opera to me.
That would qualify as a resolution...not likely but would be something.
Just my view...
So what? How is he fucked over, he will be making millions off the Gmen without even playing for them.
Quote:
In comment 15698630 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
In comment 15698588 jeff57 said:
Quote:
In comment 15698557 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
Dan Duggan
✔
@DDuggan21
Joe Schoen said on WFAN they should have resolution on James Bradberry by the end of the week. This is obviously headed toward his release, probably sooner than later.
So they’re going to release him after passing on Andrew Booth last week?
You need to stop thinking this is 1 -year fix. It's going to take another year or two on top of this one.
Replacing Bradberry with Booth, or Gordon, would have been perfectly in line with a long term fix. Robinson is going for the quick fix.
I love these posts. They never backfire.
Booth ends up a mediocre player and forgetful. Just feels like more whining. Aaron Robinson was a very talented kid coming out last year and has size. Did a jam up job against Kelce and Waller, even. Round 2 projection and taken in round 3. Inside/outside potential. Ran 4.39 at his pro day..
Corners often take time to develop. McKinney didn't explode until the 2nd half of the second season. Robinson to me showed enough in his rookie year that he deserves a shot in his sophomore year to start.
Not that Robinson
Gonna be awkward when he gets benched for TT
Link - ( New Window )
Just my view...
Well, this is the year to develop him. That's what coaches are supposed to do.
We bought him in the third round, which is a very respectable slot. So, let's see what we have.
Why is that 'good to hear'? Are you trolling?
I really don't get people dying on the DJ hill. Yeah, good kid & hard worker from all accounts, but he is a subpar-at best-QB.
Quote:
Good to hear.
Gonna be awkward when he gets benched for TT
I see this happening, I don't see Jones being productive in a quick read, quick throw offense
I wish we could build a bot that posted this quote everytime someone posts something ignorant about the cap.
Quote:
U
but if Robinson has to start 17 games on the outside...watch out. He’s going to get shredded. I don’t get the warm and fuzzy from what I saw that he is talented to hold up.
Just my view...
Well, this is the year to develop him. That's what coaches are supposed to do.
We bought him in the third round, which is a very respectable slot. So, let's see what we have.
Backup material. The guys that bought him were morons...
If their plan is Robinson replacing Bradberry in Wink's defense that depends on corners holding up 1-on-1 - yikes
We bought him in the third round, which is a very respectable slot. So, let's see what we have.
They can't upgrade every position, and with the dreadful financial situation Rabbit Foot Dave left, some positions will take a step back or stand pat.
QB, RB, corner, safety, TE, inside & middle linebacker, and interior d-line have to dance with who they brought to prom.
Romen wasn't ... well ya know.
The "unfortunately" definitely makes it sound like they are going to release him. But it could also be a negotiating tactic to get Bradberry back to the table.
Otherwise, why do you say "end of the week"? Why not just release him now? End of the week sounds like they are granting JB's agent one more shot to come to terms.
Quote:
Good to hear.
Why is that 'good to hear'? Are you trolling?
I really don't get people dying on the DJ hill. Yeah, good kid & hard worker from all accounts, but he is a subpar-at best-QB.
No one is "dying on the DJ hill." We just would like to see him have a chance with a better OL, better coaching, and better weapons in a year where, despite the 5000 idiotic posts saying otherwise on this website, there were no franchise QBs to take in this draft - as the draft itself proved. And every football draft writer on the planet says next year's draft is way better for QBs
The people "dying on the DJ hill" are the ones already proclaiming Jones dead. You are all so dug in on it that I dont know how you will be rooting for the Giants this season - if Jones does well and the team does well, you all look like idiots
People have been making this same silly post for a couple years. Victory laps taken for something that hasn't happened and isn't going to happen.
If their plan is Robinson replacing Bradberry in Wink's defense that depends on corners holding up 1-on-1 - yikes
I'm going to make a leap here and assume you know that every NFL team runs 3,4 and 5 WR sets. With Bradberry's situation, we had a dearth of corners. Therefore, targeting corners in the draft made sense. Thus, the interest in Sauce...
Doesn't change the fact Bradberry is overpaid and had a really rough year:
Should the Giants cut a different player?
Doesn't change the fact Bradberry is overpaid and had a really rough year:
Should the Giants cut a different player?
Jones and Barkley are good for $11M, I believe...
Can't force a trading partner. He as as patient as he could have been.
Yup
Quote:
that they were going to draft Gardner with their first draft pick
If their plan is Robinson replacing Bradberry in Wink's defense that depends on corners holding up 1-on-1 - yikes
I'm going to make a leap here and assume you know that every NFL team runs 3,4 and 5 WR sets. With Bradberry's situation, we had a dearth of corners. Therefore, targeting corners in the draft made sense. Thus, the interest in Sauce...
Im going to make a leap here and assume you know that there are only 2 sides to a field, so there are only 2 outside corners. The rest are slot corners
They were obviously targeting Gardner to replace Bradberry
The "unfortunately" definitely makes it sound like they are going to release him. But it could also be a negotiating tactic to get Bradberry back to the table.
Otherwise, why do you say "end of the week"? Why not just release him now? End of the week sounds like they are granting JB's agent one more shot to come to terms.
glad I wasnt the only one thinking this.
Doesn't change the fact Bradberry is overpaid and had a really rough year:
Should the Giants cut a different player?
I think we can cut Martinez and save $3.5M+. I can live without him.
Quote:
The Giants needed to upgrade every position. The corners were taken so they took a pass rusher.
Doesn't change the fact Bradberry is overpaid and had a really rough year:
Should the Giants cut a different player?
I think we can cut Martinez and save $3.5M+. I can live without him.
We're going to be living without him soon enough anyway. Let's one of the rookies get his reps. This applies to any roster vet that can offer cap savings; it's not just Bradberry.
Quote:
The Giants needed to upgrade every position. The corners were taken so they took a pass rusher.
Doesn't change the fact Bradberry is overpaid and had a really rough year:
Should the Giants cut a different player?
Jones and Barkley are good for $11M, I believe...
I believe we get the best cap relief by trading both Jones and SB to get to that $11M number. On the other hand, releasing them has negligible savings.