The payoff on the scam. All the time they spent setting it up and none of us knew where it was going. What a we'll played scam.
Howard describing chuck always spinning his soda, why? Because Jimmy was probably always fucking with him in every way so Chuck just developed protective habits.
The last words of both Howard and Chuck to Jimmy were both about what a piece of shit he was.
I also saw that originally Howard was supposed to be the corporate overlord prick and Chuck the kindly older brother and 3 episodes or so in based on the actors they changed it up.
Howard is the ultimate tragic figure. What a gut punch and what an episode.
Also Mike the great fucked up and walked right into lalos trap and let lalo trick him into pulling his guys off of everybody. He should have known Lalo would assume the phones were tapped at the nursing home.
What a note to go on hiatus on! 6 more episodes to go until the end of the series on August 15th. The next episode (seventh of season six) will be in seven weeks on July 11th.
Questions abound: When do we see Gene again? Does Lalo live or die? When do Walter and/or Jesse show up? What happens to Kim?
I always thought Lalo was dead because there’s no way a character like
that could be alive in the BB universe, but who knows? One thing I’ve thought about a lot is the sit down between Hector, the twins, and Gus when the Salamancas want to kill Walt over Tuco. I find it difficult to believe that meeting happens if the Salamancas know for a fact that Gus tried to or successfully killed Lalo.
I guess it’s possible for Don Eladio to find out about the meth lab from a still alive Lalo. Lalo does mention that Bolsa Will side with Gus due to money. Can someone remind me of what happens to Bolsa in BB? Is he arrested by the Mexican government or is he killed by assassins??
First time since Janice shot Richie on The Sopranos
of the Howard scam. We just didn't know the moves being made to get there, or whether it was going to work.
Once the flame flickered, it was obvious Howard was going to die. Lalo couldn't leave a 'civilian' witness. What remains is whether Kim lives. I'm thinking yes. She gets scared straight, like she did, for a while, after getting caught shoplifting. Saul is now owned by Lalo, so he can't get out, but Kim can, if she takes the Sandpiper money and dedicates it to helping the underprivileged. Lalo will use her as a threat to keep Saul in line as a criminal lawyer.
In one of the other Saul threads, someone with a better memory than mine recalled that Saul's worry in his introduction on BB was that Lalo was after him.
flickered I got a pit in my stomach. Reminded me of when Uncle Jack and his crew showed up in the desert. You just knew it wasn't going to end well for somebody.
in advance of the final season, and suddenly having to wait a week between episodes is brutal. This wait until until July 11 will feel like a year to me.
taking Howard down (not the killing) was warranted. He was fucking over a lot of old folks who wouldn't have lived to see their share of the lawsuit just so HHM would make a little more. He put corporate greed ahead of the good of the client.
I pray there is another spinoff that includes post BB for the Jimmy in
taking Howard down (not the killing) was warranted. He was fucking over a lot of old folks who wouldn't have lived to see their share of the lawsuit just so HHM would make a little more. He put corporate greed ahead of the good of the client.
I love the old lady representing Sandpiper comments in the meeting room when the meeting went Awry. "is this how its done" totally oblivious to the gravity of the situation and acted very well
taking Howard down (not the killing) was warranted. He was fucking over a lot of old folks who wouldn't have lived to see their share of the lawsuit just so HHM would make a little more. He put corporate greed ahead of the good of the client.
seems a bit harsh, lol.
Questions, How did the picture of the broken arm guy change?
Was the picture physically swapped out by the phony private investigator or was there a chemical change in the picture which made howard feels sick and the picture changes somewhow?
Also, Does anyone know why the Phony Private investigator agreed to do this to Howard? I mean this was downright cruel to do to someone. I think there is a missing storyline where somehow howard must have screwed over this Private investigator somehow in the past and this was payback.
RE: I pray there is another spinoff that includes post BB for the Jimmy in
Nebraska and getting back to New Mexico storyline. Vince Gillian and these writers are awesome.
I'd love for that as well. Unfortunately I think this is the end of it all. Wouldn't shock me if the entire last episode takes place with Jimmy in Nebraska post BB.
If they were to do another spin off it would probably involve Gus' pre BB and BCS.
getting to the point where they'd rank this show ahead of Breaking Bad? I think I'm there. As much as I loved BB, BCS just has such a deeper bench of great characters outside of its lead. Creating Kim, Howard, Lalo, and Nacho just for this show, with the latter two coming from a throwaway line in Saul's first BB episode. On top fleshing out the backstories for characters like Mike and Gus. I'm a bit in awe of the writing and story-telling. This is peak-level TV. Last night was an unbelievable episode
The epilogue of Howard is still to be told. I am guessing
JMM goes into bankruptcy? How will the Lalo killing be explained to authorities? Will we have dream sequences with Howard and Chuck haunting Jimmy? This is gonna be awesome!!
getting to the point where they'd rank this show ahead of Breaking Bad? I think I'm there. As much as I loved BB, BCS just has such a deeper bench of great characters outside of its lead. Creating Kim, Howard, Lalo, and Nacho just for this show, with the latter two coming from a throwaway line in Saul's first BB episode. On top fleshing out the backstories for characters like Mike and Gus. I'm a bit in awe of the writing and story-telling. This is peak-level TV. Last night was an unbelievable episode
Yes, This episode last night eclipse the BB finale. The Howard shooting was higher impact then Who shot JR scene from Dallas.
of the Howard scam. We just didn't know the moves being made to get there, or whether it was going to work.
Once the flame flickered, it was obvious Howard was going to die. Lalo couldn't leave a 'civilian' witness. What remains is whether Kim lives. I'm thinking yes. She gets scared straight, like she did, for a while, after getting caught shoplifting. Saul is now owned by Lalo, so he can't get out, but Kim can, if she takes the Sandpiper money and dedicates it to helping the underprivileged. Lalo will use her as a threat to keep Saul in line as a criminal lawyer.
In one of the other Saul threads, someone with a better memory than mine recalled that Saul's worry in his introduction on BB was that Lalo was after him.
The Sandpiper money is the only way to explain Jimmy's palace we got to see in EP 1 - Also the moment Lalo walks in the door you know Howard is a dead man.
RE: RE: I pray there is another spinoff that includes post BB for the Jimmy in
Nebraska and getting back to New Mexico storyline. Vince Gillian and these writers are awesome.
I'd love for that as well. Unfortunately I think this is the end of it all. Wouldn't shock me if the entire last episode takes place with Jimmy in Nebraska post BB.
If they were to do another spin off it would probably involve Gus' pre BB and BCS.
That's good too if they go pre BB. I really hope they don't stop. Would love to see Gus early days in Philly
Can you imagine for a moment if Disney gave the reins of storywriting and directing to Star Wars for Episodes 7 ,8, and 9 to Vince Gillian? That Saga would have finished on an incredible note.
RE: The epilogue of Howard is still to be told. I am guessing
JMM goes into bankruptcy? How will the Lalo killing be explained to authorities? Will we have dream sequences with Howard and Chuck haunting Jimmy? This is gonna be awesome!!
Would think they will say Suicide. Everything around him going bad and he wanted to kill himself in front of the people he blamed.
The episode itself was amazing.
RE: RE: The epilogue of Howard is still to be told. I am guessing
JMM goes into bankruptcy? How will the Lalo killing be explained to authorities? Will we have dream sequences with Howard and Chuck haunting Jimmy? This is gonna be awesome!!
Would think they will say Suicide. Everything around him going bad and he wanted to kill himself in front of the people he blamed.
The episode itself was amazing.
Agreed. Suicide seems like the easy coverup regarding Howard.
RE: Questions, How did the picture of the broken arm guy change?
Was the picture physically swapped out by the phony private investigator or was there a chemical change in the picture which made howard feels sick and the picture changes somewhow?
Also, Does anyone know why the Phony Private investigator agreed to do this to Howard? I mean this was downright cruel to do to someone. I think there is a missing storyline where somehow howard must have screwed over this Private investigator somehow in the past and this was payback.
Why do most of the people involved with Jimmy’s scams (outside of Kim) do this? Money. Many of them are criminals and conmen just like Slippin Jimmy.
RE: Questions, How did the picture of the broken arm guy change?
Also, Does anyone know why the Phony Private investigator agreed to do this to Howard? I mean this was downright cruel to do to someone. I think there is a missing storyline where somehow howard must have screwed over this Private investigator somehow in the past and this was payback.
I don't think that guy was a private investigator. Jimmy and Kim figured Howard would reach out to a PI and they somehow scammed him into calling a fake number with that patsy ready to answer the call. Howard explained it to Cliff in the aftermath of the big meeting but I forget all the details. They were a step ahead of him the whole way.
getting to the point where they'd rank this show ahead of Breaking Bad? I think I'm there. As much as I loved BB, BCS just has such a deeper bench of great characters outside of its lead. Creating Kim, Howard, Lalo, and Nacho just for this show, with the latter two coming from a throwaway line in Saul's first BB episode. On top fleshing out the backstories for characters like Mike and Gus. I'm a bit in awe of the writing and story-telling. This is peak-level TV. Last night was an unbelievable episode
I can’t go that far. I can do a top 10 episodes of BB off the top of my head and I’m not sure BCS approaches that level. However, it’s a great show and I’d argue it’s a Mount Rushmore television spinoff/sequel/prequel. The writers did an amazing job creating a separate world for Jimmy that wasn’t overly dependent on the BB universe. And amazingly, they managed to do this from 5 somewhat forgettable lines of dialogue on BB.
Kim is a big upgrade over Skylar - that might be the biggest reason for me. Lalo and Nacho are fantastic characters, you get a little different side of Gus, and the more Mike the better.
Also, I can't look at Bryan Cranston and NOT see Tim Whatley the dentist from Seinfeld, so that had an effect, too.
I have it right there with the episode where Chuck loses his shit at Jimmy hearing.
I have a question... why did Kim hate Howard so much (btw, I had to go back just now and change "does" to "did" in that sentence🥺). Jimmy I get, obviously. A looong history there. But Howard has always been good to Kim. I get he goes against a lot of what she stands for in terms of her principles, but the urge to just ruin him in every capacity always struck me as over-the-top. Of course, she never wanted this. But she didn't want his life working out. Can anyone shine a light on her motivation?
And let me caveat... Better Call Saul is currently my favorite TV show. I am by NO means slighting it. But there is a WHOLE lot of recency bias going on in these statements that it's better than Breaking Bad. It's not. Breaking Bad is a generational, top 5 of all time TV show.
I have it right there with the episode where Chuck loses his shit at Jimmy hearing.
I have a question... why did Kim hate Howard so much (btw, I had to go back just now and change "does" to "did" in that sentence🥺). Jimmy I get, obviously. A looong history there. But Howard has always been good to Kim. I get he goes against a lot of what she stands for in terms of her principles, but the urge to just ruin him in every capacity always struck me as over-the-top. Of course, she never wanted this. But she didn't want his life working out. Can anyone shine a light on her motivation?
To answer your question why Kim hated Howard. Howard humiliated Kim by putting her in doc review with junior clerks when she supported Jimmy over Chuck over the misshap with the bank review board and transposed number. Even after Kim worked hard to get into the good graces of Howard , he still treated her like crap. Also, Howard never wanted to hire Jimmy at the firm and he was a further extension of Chuck.
I suppose I get all that, but it still felt over-the-top.
All of that was in-reaction to Kim going against Howard's mentor and the founding partner of the firm on both a professional and personal level. Stronger penalties have been levied against people for similar transgressions. She was the provoker in those disputes, and it didn't undo all the good he did for her over the years.
And you saw it in her eyes in the episode before last nights; how she aggressively U-turned away from the meeting that was poised to be the catalyst for her career and was driven solely be vengeance for Howard. Just seemed like a lot. Perhaps Howard's final words were spot on. Bottom line is she got off on it.
And let me caveat... Better Call Saul is currently my favorite TV show. I am by NO means slighting it. But there is a WHOLE lot of recency bias going on in these statements that it's better than Breaking Bad. It's not. Breaking Bad is a generational, top 5 of all time TV show.
Agree with Mike here.
Howard was a total dick to Kim. Remember Howard punishing her when she went to bat for Jimmy and he got the big job at the other firm and made himself such a distraction that he forced Clifford Main to fire him without cause so he could keep his bonus? And Howard put Kim in doc review on Sandpiper as punishment, then Kim worked her ass off to find the Mesa Verde case to bring to HHM, and Howard basically took it from her and left her in doc review. Chuck and Howard basically stole Mesa Verde from Kim. That's why she hates Howard. Remember it was Jimmy's scheming that got Mesa Verde to fire HHM (the address switcheroo).
And that brought Mesa Verde back to Kim.
Howard was a pretty egotistical douche, but it never seemed like he was a douche just to be one, it's because he has high professional (and personal) standards and principles for not only himself, but also everyone who works at HHM. And really, there's nothing truly inherently bad about that. So Howard, while at times unlikable, does show his personal side in his positive personal interactions with the low people on the totem pole at HHM, and when offering Jimmy a job, and even tells Jimmy he admires him for going to bat for the scholarship for the girl that had a little bit of a checkered past. So Howard is ultimately a forgivable character, one who doesn't deserve the pain and misfortune that Kim and Jimmy enact upon him.
And now that we know that it ultimately results in Howard's murder, I think this will be Kim's undoing. I don't think she's going to survive this.
or was the flashback scene in Kim's childhood in Nebraska? I know Jimmy ultimately becomes Gene and moves to Nebraska. If I'm remembering that right about Kim, I doubt that's something that won't be explored.
I think Kim loses a bit of her soul when she tells Jimmy she wants to go after Howard.
Remember, it was Jimmy who tried to first brush the idea off, hope she would drop it, told her it was a bridge too far, gave her multiple chances to stop it, even up to the day that he ran into Judge Casimiro, seeing the broken arm, and Kim at each time re-buffed Jimmy and was the main driving force behind the plan.
She's going to know that it was mainly her that caused Howard to be in their apartment that night, when Lalo made his re-appearance. And that's going to devastate her.
Kim had some somewhat reasonable reasons to dislike Howard. But I think the point of it all is that they did this simply because they could, because we've seen a few times now that Kim gets off on the thrill. That she's very much "Slippin Kimmy" in her own right. Howard had it correct, right before his demise, telling her that there's a piece of her missing. They had no good reason to do this. They did it for kicks. That's my read on it. The breaking bad journey of Kim has really been remarkable. She's more evil and vindictive than Jimmy could ever dream of being.
a hard time believing that there will be any more story to the breaking bad universe; unfortunately time takes its toll and we're getting too far in real life from the start of Breaking Bad for these actors. Mike & Gus are now 12-13 years older than their first appearances in Breaking Bad and its getting harder and harder to believe that these actors are portraying younger versions of themselves than when we originally had seen them. Other side characters like Todd in the El Camino movie and Huell either gained or lost a ton of weight from Breaking Bad. Just getting more difficult to keep spinning deeper into the past of their storylines as these actors are continually aging and a lot of real life time is passing.
RE: RE: I pray there is another spinoff that includes post BB for the Jimmy in
Nebraska and getting back to New Mexico storyline. Vince Gillian and these writers are awesome.
I'd love for that as well. Unfortunately I think this is the end of it all. Wouldn't shock me if the entire last episode takes place with Jimmy in Nebraska post BB.
If they were to do another spin off it would probably involve Gus' pre BB and BCS.
I bet a bunch of the remaining episodes we be based on current day Saul
I'd love to see a show about Mike's days on the force
I maintain that wanting an early, albeit lesser, settlement for old folk who otherwise wouldn't live to see a penny is a factor. It's been hammered home several times. Juxtaposed with Howard over the top telling the old bat it's going to be years (that angle would be in tiny fine print, not screamed from the mountain top).
Plus, it's hammered again and again how Kim is on a help the poor phase. It may just be sugar to help the medicine go down, but I think it is a real factor, or at least Kim can delude herself into thinking it is. And, for all his flaws, Saul has a soft spot for the little guy. He started out wanting the early settlement for himself, being in dire straits after having being disbarred for a year, but he's awash in clients now.
And for whomever asked...the drops Saul/Kim smeared on the original photos were a chemical to make Howard temporarily look like he was on drugs. It was covered in an episode not long ago.
in making no attempt to make the BB characters look younger. They simply told the audience to deal with it, and moved on. At some point, though, there's a limit. Hector and Gus in a BCS prequel would need new actors.
a hard time believing that there will be any more story to the breaking bad universe; unfortunately time takes its toll and we're getting too far in real life from the start of Breaking Bad for these actors. Mike & Gus are now 12-13 years older than their first appearances in Breaking Bad and its getting harder and harder to believe that these actors are portraying younger versions of themselves than when we originally had seen them. Other side characters like Todd in the El Camino movie and Huell either gained or lost a ton of weight from Breaking Bad. Just getting more difficult to keep spinning deeper into the past of their storylines as these actors are continually aging and a lot of real life time is passing.
Lmao, I felt for Vince Gilligan in the Breaking Bad movie; trying to pass off new Jesse Plemons as Todd. Dude has just given up.
I'd have defended Kim as well, based on the work with underprivileged that seemed to really be a passion of hers. But she literally did a u-turn away from a job opportunity that would have allowed her to make that her career, if it's what she actually truly cared about. Even when Jimmy brings it up in this episode, she just waved it away that it didn't really matter. She wanted revenge, for no good reason. I love the character Kim, but deep down, she's bad.
on Hector Salamanca's rise to power, obviously with a new actor to play a young Salamanca.
Could have an episode where the recruit the twins and them getting their first kill, lol.
This is definitely a universe akin to Star Wars where it should continued to be explored. What a freaking two shows. Breaking Bad and BCS are to the tv industry what GF and GF2 were to the film industry.
i love the opening of the episode. you knew some serious crap was
end of the show is just recapping Chuck's tipping point argument with Jimmy when it came out that Chuck was holding him back. Chuck said something to the sort of Jimmy's not a bad guy, even though he does try and do things for the overall good, the manner that he executes them in ultimately harms everyone around him.
As soon as Howard made the conscience decision to engage with Jimmy he was doomed. Even if Jimmy's baseline reasoning was to get the Sandpiper money to the residents (and himself) sooner, as soon as Howard engaged rather than walk away he put himself in danger. Kim is going down that same path, giving Jimmy the nudge he needed to start this war with Howard. Now she has blood on her hands too. Jimmy is not directly a bad guy, but everyone around him always ends up paying the price for his deeds.
end of the show is just recapping Chuck's tipping point argument with Jimmy when it came out that Chuck was holding him back. Chuck said something to the sort of Jimmy's not a bad guy, even though he does try and do things for the overall good, the manner that he executes them in ultimately harms everyone around him.
As soon as Howard made the conscience decision to engage with Jimmy he was doomed. Even if Jimmy's baseline reasoning was to get the Sandpiper money to the residents (and himself) sooner, as soon as Howard engaged rather than walk away he put himself in danger. Kim is going down that same path, giving Jimmy the nudge he needed to start this war with Howard. Now she has blood on her hands too. Jimmy is not directly a bad guy, but everyone around him always ends up paying the price for his deeds.
1. She uses the vacuum man. I don't view it coincidental she lays eyes on the card first.
2. She jumps from a roof and kills herself. In the first season and third season they show Kim high on a roof, and the camera smash cuts from her to ground level.
Kim throwing bottles from a high level as the camera watches them splat onto the ground, is a scene they continue to show the audience. She said in season 2, "I should just jump off the roof right now" in one of her scenes.
The fact they did the suicide angle with Nacho makes me less inclined to believe option 2. BUT they have foreshadowed her and roofs from the start.
because I just don’t see Jimmy shaking that off to the point that he’s able to continue being Saul Goodman. But my original thoughts on her future proved to be untrue with the scenes of Jimmy’s house being seized and there’s no sign that Kim lives there. I thought that they still might be together and Jimmy simply left without her. The vacuum repair guy is an option.
I do wonder how we get from current Jimmy/Saul to BB Saul
The first episode in BB with Saul he is not only harassing Francesca but just flippantly suggests to Walt and Jesse they just whack Badger.
Neither of these things seem even remotely possible with the current incarnation of Saul. It's a big change and I wonder how it happens and how he is able to suppress whatever is left of Jimmy.
RE: I do wonder how we get from current Jimmy/Saul to BB Saul
The first episode in BB with Saul he is not only harassing Francesca but just flippantly suggests to Walt and Jesse they just whack Badger.
Neither of these things seem even remotely possible with the current incarnation of Saul. It's a big change and I wonder how it happens and how he is able to suppress whatever is left of Jimmy.
Him losing Kim, whether it is by death or she does the van thing and vanishes. Her absence from the Breaking Bad series is what wears on Saul. She plays a major roll in his life so DEFINITELY her fate are the final pieces into the Saul we know in BB.
RE: I do wonder how we get from current Jimmy/Saul to BB Saul
The first episode in BB with Saul he is not only harassing Francesca but just flippantly suggests to Walt and Jesse they just whack Badger.
Neither of these things seem even remotely possible with the current incarnation of Saul. It's a big change and I wonder how it happens and how he is able to suppress whatever is left of Jimmy.
In the beginning of the second-to-last Breaking Bad episode, Walt was in the vacuum guy's hideout, bald and as enraged as ever. I remember thinking, how the hell are they going to get us to him having hair and a machine gun in less than 2 episodes, and they did it wonderfully.
I hear ya, but with 6 to go, there's still plenty of time for Saul to take his darker turns.
Is there a possibility that a spin-off show about Kim is in the cards? It would be a shame to killer her off or just have her leave and not be seen again.
The scene with Kim and Jimmy going at it while listening in on Cliff reveal the settlement was great. As endearing as the Jimmy/Kim relationship is, they always show them as very domestic - except when they pull off a scam, after which they rip each other’s clothes off. Perfect ending after a long, great setup
And yet, Howard ends up being a tragic figure in the end. Quintessential rich douchebag lawyer…and yet your heart breaks for him as he melts down over how Jimmy and Kim played him, followed by Lalo walking in like his grim reaper
And let me caveat... Better Call Saul is currently my favorite TV show. I am by NO means slighting it. But there is a WHOLE lot of recency bias going on in these statements that it's better than Breaking Bad. It's not. Breaking Bad is a generational, top 5 of all time TV show.
I think this is true...
I went back and watched all of Breaking Bad last summer and it's just a masterpiece. Better Call Saul is great, but I'm addition to the recency bias it still benefits from being attached to Breaking Bad a bit.. it's a show about the journey but we know a large part of where it ends
Vince Gilligan has created an absolute masterpiece of story telling…
and character development. How do you create this amazing universe in Breaking Bad, and then create it’s equally compelling prequel, without a drop off in quality or watchability. Just brilliant.
is better than Breaking Bad I think are impacted by the recency theory.
The way I view it is Breaking Bad allowed Gilligan to take his sweet time on character development and long sweeping plot arcs because of the goodwill and devoted fan base.
but if Better Call Saul was released first I'm not sure I would have made it through season 1. And it's not to say it isn't a fantastic show, it is, but it's made so much better by knowing the characters (that we know) and their story from Breaking Bad.
Someone was saying Howard became the sympathetic character in Jimmy and Kim's apartment.
i don't view it that way and it could just be my twisted views but I viewed Lalo as the sympathetic character and kind of hoped he shot Howard - makes the end cleaner and Jimmy and Kim become the "victim"
All of this off a throwaway line in Breaking Bad of, "It wasn't me, it was Ignacio. Lalo didn't send you? No Lalo?"
I am actually amazed at how creatively talented Vince Gilligan and Peter Gould are that they could take that random throwaway line and craft an entire 60+ episode prequel years later.
Howard describing chuck always spinning his soda, why? Because Jimmy was probably always fucking with him in every way so Chuck just developed protective habits.
The last words of both Howard and Chuck to Jimmy were both about what a piece of shit he was.
.......
Agree with your stance On Chuck's paranoia ----I think Slippin Jimmy started messing with Chuck the same way he messed w/Howard, just at a different level and over a longer period of time. Jimmy sharpened his teeth somewhere/how.
The skate borders who tried to con him with the fake injury/money scam.....he sent them to scam Tucco's Grandmother, and to TUcco took care of them for "karma". Jimmy is one dude I wouldn't mess with.
All of this off a throwaway line in Breaking Bad of, "It wasn't me, it was Ignacio. Lalo didn't send you? No Lalo?"
I am actually amazed at how creatively talented Vince Gilligan and Peter Gould are that they could take that random throwaway line and craft an entire 60+ episode prequel years later.
And the pre-story/mystery wasn't tainted the way Star Wars did with their prequels. Same with LOST explaining the mysteries of the show in a boring ass way.
taking Howard down (not the killing) was warranted. He was fucking over a lot of old folks who wouldn't have lived to see their share of the lawsuit just so HHM would make a little more. He put corporate greed ahead of the good of the client.
I love the old lady representing Sandpiper comments in the meeting room when the meeting went Awry. "is this how its done" totally oblivious to the gravity of the situation and acted very well
I've been in hundreds of mediations. Have heard folks comment that more than a handful of times. I actually had the thought that it would be funny if the old lady said something like that. Where are my residuals?! ;-)
at Cinnabon. Since we know from Breaking Bad, Saul still thinks Lalo is alive and out to get him. It would be a nice ending for Lalo to see Saul again at Cinnabon to close out the series.
RE: Hoping the final 2-3 episodes has flashforwards of Saul's life working
at Cinnabon. Since we know from Breaking Bad, Saul still thinks Lalo is alive and out to get him. It would be a nice ending for Lalo to see Saul again at Cinnabon to close out the series.
would it be a flash forward or actual "real time"? I mean it ends there, right?
RE: RE: Hoping the final 2-3 episodes has flashforwards of Saul's life working
at Cinnabon. Since we know from Breaking Bad, Saul still thinks Lalo is alive and out to get him. It would be a nice ending for Lalo to see Saul again at Cinnabon to close out the series.
would it be a flash forward or actual "real time"? I mean it ends there, right?
LOL.....good question.
I'm still going with a flash forward, mostly because it is forward in the future from the current Better Call Saul series timeline that we're all currently watching.
RE: Hoping the final 2-3 episodes has flashforwards of Saul's life working
at Cinnabon. Since we know from Breaking Bad, Saul still thinks Lalo is alive and out to get him. It would be a nice ending for Lalo to see Saul again at Cinnabon to close out the series.
I wonder how are they going to explain Lalo being out there - to the point that Saul mentions it to Walt and Jesse - when he has no role in the cartel that we see in any episode of BB. Also, recall from BB that when Gus confronts Hector, he tells him the entire Salamanca family is no more. Is that just a plot hole? More likely scenario would be that Gus/Mike kill Lalo before the end of BCS, and Saul never finds out about his death.
I can't remember - does Don Eladio know about Gus' secret meth lab in BB, or does he not know anything about it? Again, I suspect that video we saw Lalo make never makes its way to Don Eladio.
I know it happened a while ago but what did the shot of the whiskey glasses mean when it registered that Nacho betrayed him? What exactly about the glasses tipped him off? Or did it just hint to Lalo that Nacho went missing and I'm over thinking?
I know it happened a while ago but what did the shot of the whiskey glasses mean when it registered that Nacho betrayed him? What exactly about the glasses tipped him off? Or did it just hint to Lalo that Nacho went missing and I'm over thinking?
Just that he was nowhere to be found during the spree imo.
Never in the BCS-BB universe has a character been done this dirty.
I’m in disbelief.
Never in the BCS-BB universe has a character been done this dirty.
I’m in disbelief.
I always wait and watch the show binge style. It's a completely different experience. Same with Breaking Bad.
Howard describing chuck always spinning his soda, why? Because Jimmy was probably always fucking with him in every way so Chuck just developed protective habits.
The last words of both Howard and Chuck to Jimmy were both about what a piece of shit he was.
I also saw that originally Howard was supposed to be the corporate overlord prick and Chuck the kindly older brother and 3 episodes or so in based on the actors they changed it up.
Howard is the ultimate tragic figure. What a gut punch and what an episode.
Also Mike the great fucked up and walked right into lalos trap and let lalo trick him into pulling his guys off of everybody. He should have known Lalo would assume the phones were tapped at the nursing home.
Yes, I didn't know he still had guys on them.
Questions abound: When do we see Gene again? Does Lalo live or die? When do Walter and/or Jesse show up? What happens to Kim?
I guess it’s possible for Don Eladio to find out about the meth lab from a still alive Lalo. Lalo does mention that Bolsa Will side with Gus due to money. Can someone remind me of what happens to Bolsa in BB? Is he arrested by the Mexican government or is he killed by assassins??
Once the flame flickered, it was obvious Howard was going to die. Lalo couldn't leave a 'civilian' witness. What remains is whether Kim lives. I'm thinking yes. She gets scared straight, like she did, for a while, after getting caught shoplifting. Saul is now owned by Lalo, so he can't get out, but Kim can, if she takes the Sandpiper money and dedicates it to helping the underprivileged. Lalo will use her as a threat to keep Saul in line as a criminal lawyer.
In one of the other Saul threads, someone with a better memory than mine recalled that Saul's worry in his introduction on BB was that Lalo was after him.
I love the old lady representing Sandpiper comments in the meeting room when the meeting went Awry. "is this how its done" totally oblivious to the gravity of the situation and acted very well
seems a bit harsh, lol.
Also, Does anyone know why the Phony Private investigator agreed to do this to Howard? I mean this was downright cruel to do to someone. I think there is a missing storyline where somehow howard must have screwed over this Private investigator somehow in the past and this was payback.
I'd love for that as well. Unfortunately I think this is the end of it all. Wouldn't shock me if the entire last episode takes place with Jimmy in Nebraska post BB.
If they were to do another spin off it would probably involve Gus' pre BB and BCS.
Yes, This episode last night eclipse the BB finale. The Howard shooting was higher impact then Who shot JR scene from Dallas.
Once the flame flickered, it was obvious Howard was going to die. Lalo couldn't leave a 'civilian' witness. What remains is whether Kim lives. I'm thinking yes. She gets scared straight, like she did, for a while, after getting caught shoplifting. Saul is now owned by Lalo, so he can't get out, but Kim can, if she takes the Sandpiper money and dedicates it to helping the underprivileged. Lalo will use her as a threat to keep Saul in line as a criminal lawyer.
In one of the other Saul threads, someone with a better memory than mine recalled that Saul's worry in his introduction on BB was that Lalo was after him.
Quote:
Nebraska and getting back to New Mexico storyline. Vince Gillian and these writers are awesome.
I'd love for that as well. Unfortunately I think this is the end of it all. Wouldn't shock me if the entire last episode takes place with Jimmy in Nebraska post BB.
If they were to do another spin off it would probably involve Gus' pre BB and BCS.
That's good too if they go pre BB. I really hope they don't stop. Would love to see Gus early days in Philly
Can you imagine for a moment if Disney gave the reins of storywriting and directing to Star Wars for Episodes 7 ,8, and 9 to Vince Gillian? That Saga would have finished on an incredible note.
Would think they will say Suicide. Everything around him going bad and he wanted to kill himself in front of the people he blamed.
The episode itself was amazing.
Quote:
JMM goes into bankruptcy? How will the Lalo killing be explained to authorities? Will we have dream sequences with Howard and Chuck haunting Jimmy? This is gonna be awesome!!
Would think they will say Suicide. Everything around him going bad and he wanted to kill himself in front of the people he blamed.
The episode itself was amazing.
Agreed. Suicide seems like the easy coverup regarding Howard.
Also, Does anyone know why the Phony Private investigator agreed to do this to Howard? I mean this was downright cruel to do to someone. I think there is a missing storyline where somehow howard must have screwed over this Private investigator somehow in the past and this was payback.
Why do most of the people involved with Jimmy’s scams (outside of Kim) do this? Money. Many of them are criminals and conmen just like Slippin Jimmy.
I don't think that guy was a private investigator. Jimmy and Kim figured Howard would reach out to a PI and they somehow scammed him into calling a fake number with that patsy ready to answer the call. Howard explained it to Cliff in the aftermath of the big meeting but I forget all the details. They were a step ahead of him the whole way.
I can’t go that far. I can do a top 10 episodes of BB off the top of my head and I’m not sure BCS approaches that level. However, it’s a great show and I’d argue it’s a Mount Rushmore television spinoff/sequel/prequel. The writers did an amazing job creating a separate world for Jimmy that wasn’t overly dependent on the BB universe. And amazingly, they managed to do this from 5 somewhat forgettable lines of dialogue on BB.
Also, I can't look at Bryan Cranston and NOT see Tim Whatley the dentist from Seinfeld, so that had an effect, too.
I have a question... why did Kim hate Howard so much (btw, I had to go back just now and change "does" to "did" in that sentence🥺). Jimmy I get, obviously. A looong history there. But Howard has always been good to Kim. I get he goes against a lot of what she stands for in terms of her principles, but the urge to just ruin him in every capacity always struck me as over-the-top. Of course, she never wanted this. But she didn't want his life working out. Can anyone shine a light on her motivation?
I have a question... why did Kim hate Howard so much (btw, I had to go back just now and change "does" to "did" in that sentence🥺). Jimmy I get, obviously. A looong history there. But Howard has always been good to Kim. I get he goes against a lot of what she stands for in terms of her principles, but the urge to just ruin him in every capacity always struck me as over-the-top. Of course, she never wanted this. But she didn't want his life working out. Can anyone shine a light on her motivation?
To answer your question why Kim hated Howard. Howard humiliated Kim by putting her in doc review with junior clerks when she supported Jimmy over Chuck over the misshap with the bank review board and transposed number. Even after Kim worked hard to get into the good graces of Howard , he still treated her like crap. Also, Howard never wanted to hire Jimmy at the firm and he was a further extension of Chuck.
And you saw it in her eyes in the episode before last nights; how she aggressively U-turned away from the meeting that was poised to be the catalyst for her career and was driven solely be vengeance for Howard. Just seemed like a lot. Perhaps Howard's final words were spot on. Bottom line is she got off on it.
Agree with Mike here.
Howard was a total dick to Kim. Remember Howard punishing her when she went to bat for Jimmy and he got the big job at the other firm and made himself such a distraction that he forced Clifford Main to fire him without cause so he could keep his bonus? And Howard put Kim in doc review on Sandpiper as punishment, then Kim worked her ass off to find the Mesa Verde case to bring to HHM, and Howard basically took it from her and left her in doc review. Chuck and Howard basically stole Mesa Verde from Kim. That's why she hates Howard. Remember it was Jimmy's scheming that got Mesa Verde to fire HHM (the address switcheroo).
And that brought Mesa Verde back to Kim.
Howard was a pretty egotistical douche, but it never seemed like he was a douche just to be one, it's because he has high professional (and personal) standards and principles for not only himself, but also everyone who works at HHM. And really, there's nothing truly inherently bad about that. So Howard, while at times unlikable, does show his personal side in his positive personal interactions with the low people on the totem pole at HHM, and when offering Jimmy a job, and even tells Jimmy he admires him for going to bat for the scholarship for the girl that had a little bit of a checkered past. So Howard is ultimately a forgivable character, one who doesn't deserve the pain and misfortune that Kim and Jimmy enact upon him.
And now that we know that it ultimately results in Howard's murder, I think this will be Kim's undoing. I don't think she's going to survive this.
Remember, it was Jimmy who tried to first brush the idea off, hope she would drop it, told her it was a bridge too far, gave her multiple chances to stop it, even up to the day that he ran into Judge Casimiro, seeing the broken arm, and Kim at each time re-buffed Jimmy and was the main driving force behind the plan.
She's going to know that it was mainly her that caused Howard to be in their apartment that night, when Lalo made his re-appearance. And that's going to devastate her.
Quote:
Nebraska and getting back to New Mexico storyline. Vince Gillian and these writers are awesome.
I'd love for that as well. Unfortunately I think this is the end of it all. Wouldn't shock me if the entire last episode takes place with Jimmy in Nebraska post BB.
If they were to do another spin off it would probably involve Gus' pre BB and BCS.
I bet a bunch of the remaining episodes we be based on current day Saul
I'd love to see a show about Mike's days on the force
Plus, it's hammered again and again how Kim is on a help the poor phase. It may just be sugar to help the medicine go down, but I think it is a real factor, or at least Kim can delude herself into thinking it is. And, for all his flaws, Saul has a soft spot for the little guy. He started out wanting the early settlement for himself, being in dire straits after having being disbarred for a year, but he's awash in clients now.
And for whomever asked...the drops Saul/Kim smeared on the original photos were a chemical to make Howard temporarily look like he was on drugs. It was covered in an episode not long ago.
Could have an episode where the recruit the twins and them getting their first kill, lol.
Lmao, I felt for Vince Gilligan in the Breaking Bad movie; trying to pass off new Jesse Plemons as Todd. Dude has just given up.
Could have an episode where the recruit the twins and them getting their first kill, lol.
This is definitely a universe akin to Star Wars where it should continued to be explored. What a freaking two shows. Breaking Bad and BCS are to the tv industry what GF and GF2 were to the film industry.
As soon as Howard made the conscience decision to engage with Jimmy he was doomed. Even if Jimmy's baseline reasoning was to get the Sandpiper money to the residents (and himself) sooner, as soon as Howard engaged rather than walk away he put himself in danger. Kim is going down that same path, giving Jimmy the nudge he needed to start this war with Howard. Now she has blood on her hands too. Jimmy is not directly a bad guy, but everyone around him always ends up paying the price for his deeds.
As soon as Howard made the conscience decision to engage with Jimmy he was doomed. Even if Jimmy's baseline reasoning was to get the Sandpiper money to the residents (and himself) sooner, as soon as Howard engaged rather than walk away he put himself in danger. Kim is going down that same path, giving Jimmy the nudge he needed to start this war with Howard. Now she has blood on her hands too. Jimmy is not directly a bad guy, but everyone around him always ends up paying the price for his deeds.
Well put. you nailed it!!
2. Lalo/Fring situation has to be resolved. I would bet the farm that somehow, they turn the tables on Lalo.
3. After all the dust settles, we'll see how Jimmy is set up to meet Walter White, but we won't see White.
4. In the end, we'll see Jimmy at the Pretzel Shop...wondering how it all went wrong. Maybe calling for another vacuum model.
2. She jumps from a roof and kills herself. In the first season and third season they show Kim high on a roof, and the camera smash cuts from her to ground level.
Kim throwing bottles from a high level as the camera watches them splat onto the ground, is a scene they continue to show the audience. She said in season 2, "I should just jump off the roof right now" in one of her scenes.
The fact they did the suicide angle with Nacho makes me less inclined to believe option 2. BUT they have foreshadowed her and roofs from the start.
The first episode in BB with Saul he is not only harassing Francesca but just flippantly suggests to Walt and Jesse they just whack Badger.
Neither of these things seem even remotely possible with the current incarnation of Saul. It's a big change and I wonder how it happens and how he is able to suppress whatever is left of Jimmy.
The first episode in BB with Saul he is not only harassing Francesca but just flippantly suggests to Walt and Jesse they just whack Badger.
Neither of these things seem even remotely possible with the current incarnation of Saul. It's a big change and I wonder how it happens and how he is able to suppress whatever is left of Jimmy.
Him losing Kim, whether it is by death or she does the van thing and vanishes. Her absence from the Breaking Bad series is what wears on Saul. She plays a major roll in his life so DEFINITELY her fate are the final pieces into the Saul we know in BB.
The first episode in BB with Saul he is not only harassing Francesca but just flippantly suggests to Walt and Jesse they just whack Badger.
Neither of these things seem even remotely possible with the current incarnation of Saul. It's a big change and I wonder how it happens and how he is able to suppress whatever is left of Jimmy.
In the beginning of the second-to-last Breaking Bad episode, Walt was in the vacuum guy's hideout, bald and as enraged as ever. I remember thinking, how the hell are they going to get us to him having hair and a machine gun in less than 2 episodes, and they did it wonderfully.
I hear ya, but with 6 to go, there's still plenty of time for Saul to take his darker turns.
The scene with Kim and Jimmy going at it while listening in on Cliff reveal the settlement was great. As endearing as the Jimmy/Kim relationship is, they always show them as very domestic - except when they pull off a scam, after which they rip each other’s clothes off. Perfect ending after a long, great setup
And yet, Howard ends up being a tragic figure in the end. Quintessential rich douchebag lawyer…and yet your heart breaks for him as he melts down over how Jimmy and Kim played him, followed by Lalo walking in like his grim reaper
Amazing television. All I can say
Jaw dropping ending. Unreal.
I think this is true...
I went back and watched all of Breaking Bad last summer and it's just a masterpiece. Better Call Saul is great, but I'm addition to the recency bias it still benefits from being attached to Breaking Bad a bit.. it's a show about the journey but we know a large part of where it ends
The way I view it is Breaking Bad allowed Gilligan to take his sweet time on character development and long sweeping plot arcs because of the goodwill and devoted fan base.
but if Better Call Saul was released first I'm not sure I would have made it through season 1. And it's not to say it isn't a fantastic show, it is, but it's made so much better by knowing the characters (that we know) and their story from Breaking Bad.
at least IMO
i don't view it that way and it could just be my twisted views but I viewed Lalo as the sympathetic character and kind of hoped he shot Howard - makes the end cleaner and Jimmy and Kim become the "victim"
I am actually amazed at how creatively talented Vince Gilligan and Peter Gould are that they could take that random throwaway line and craft an entire 60+ episode prequel years later.
Howard describing chuck always spinning his soda, why? Because Jimmy was probably always fucking with him in every way so Chuck just developed protective habits.
The last words of both Howard and Chuck to Jimmy were both about what a piece of shit he was.
.......
Agree with your stance On Chuck's paranoia ----I think Slippin Jimmy started messing with Chuck the same way he messed w/Howard, just at a different level and over a longer period of time. Jimmy sharpened his teeth somewhere/how.
I am actually amazed at how creatively talented Vince Gilligan and Peter Gould are that they could take that random throwaway line and craft an entire 60+ episode prequel years later.
And the pre-story/mystery wasn't tainted the way Star Wars did with their prequels. Same with LOST explaining the mysteries of the show in a boring ass way.
( I mean who the Dharma Initiative really was)
Good God that ruined everything.
Quote:
taking Howard down (not the killing) was warranted. He was fucking over a lot of old folks who wouldn't have lived to see their share of the lawsuit just so HHM would make a little more. He put corporate greed ahead of the good of the client.
I love the old lady representing Sandpiper comments in the meeting room when the meeting went Awry. "is this how its done" totally oblivious to the gravity of the situation and acted very well
I've been in hundreds of mediations. Have heard folks comment that more than a handful of times. I actually had the thought that it would be funny if the old lady said something like that. Where are my residuals?! ;-)
Lalo didn't assume it, he realized it when he heard the clicking sound as he called his uncle from the drain pipe.
I also thought the Howard storyline was dragging, and was wondering where it was going, but wow, what a payoff. Can't wait for the final episodes.
would it be a flash forward or actual "real time"? I mean it ends there, right?
Quote:
at Cinnabon. Since we know from Breaking Bad, Saul still thinks Lalo is alive and out to get him. It would be a nice ending for Lalo to see Saul again at Cinnabon to close out the series.
would it be a flash forward or actual "real time"? I mean it ends there, right?
LOL.....good question.
I'm still going with a flash forward, mostly because it is forward in the future from the current Better Call Saul series timeline that we're all currently watching.
I wonder how are they going to explain Lalo being out there - to the point that Saul mentions it to Walt and Jesse - when he has no role in the cartel that we see in any episode of BB. Also, recall from BB that when Gus confronts Hector, he tells him the entire Salamanca family is no more. Is that just a plot hole? More likely scenario would be that Gus/Mike kill Lalo before the end of BCS, and Saul never finds out about his death.
I can't remember - does Don Eladio know about Gus' secret meth lab in BB, or does he not know anything about it? Again, I suspect that video we saw Lalo make never makes its way to Don Eladio.
Just that he was nowhere to be found during the spree imo.
Good shit.
:shocking: