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NFT: Better Call Saul-tonight's episode was best ever!! Spoilers

MartyNJ1969 : 5/23/2022 11:18 pm
Lalo shooting Hamlin after the rigged setup was incredible. The last six episodes are going to be wild
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simply...  
Pete in CO : 5/23/2022 11:21 pm : link
...outstanding.
I sat there with my jaw on the floor  
RodneyHamp : 5/23/2022 11:26 pm : link
for a good 5 minutes after it ended. Holy crap.
I was really not feeling the past few eps  
shockeyisthebest8056 : 5/24/2022 2:39 am : link
and the Howard set-up was totally boring me. But the pay-off was worth the dragged out set-up.

Never in the BCS-BB universe has a character been done this dirty.

I’m in disbelief.
One thing that I forgot while watching the ep  
shockeyisthebest8056 : 5/24/2022 3:08 am : link
is that this is news to Jimmy, but Kim already knows.
RE: I was really not feeling the past few eps  
Route 9 : 5/24/2022 3:26 am : link
In comment 15716969 shockeyisthebest8056 said:
Quote:
and the Howard set-up was totally boring me. But the pay-off was worth the dragged out set-up.

Never in the BCS-BB universe has a character been done this dirty.

I’m in disbelief.


I always wait and watch the show binge style. It's a completely different experience. Same with Breaking Bad.
Astonishing turn of events  
rnargi : 5/24/2022 6:38 am : link
...
Couple of things  
oghwga : 5/24/2022 7:25 am : link
The payoff on the scam. All the time they spent setting it up and none of us knew where it was going. What a we'll played scam.

Howard describing chuck always spinning his soda, why? Because Jimmy was probably always fucking with him in every way so Chuck just developed protective habits.

The last words of both Howard and Chuck to Jimmy were both about what a piece of shit he was.

I also saw that originally Howard was supposed to be the corporate overlord prick and Chuck the kindly older brother and 3 episodes or so in based on the actors they changed it up.

Howard is the ultimate tragic figure. What a gut punch and what an episode.

Also Mike the great fucked up and walked right into lalos trap and let lalo trick him into pulling his guys off of everybody. He should have known Lalo would assume the phones were tapped at the nursing home.
Did Mike have guys  
pjcas18 : 5/24/2022 7:29 am : link
on Jimmy and Kim?
Absolutely  
oghwga : 5/24/2022 7:33 am : link
He had guys following both. Remember Kim confronted them and then Mike told Kim Lalo was alive?
RE: Absolutely  
pjcas18 : 5/24/2022 7:34 am : link
In comment 15716993 oghwga said:
Quote:
He had guys following both. Remember Kim confronted them and then Mike told Kim Lalo was alive?


Yes, I didn't know he still had guys on them.
What was Mike  
pjcas18 : 5/24/2022 7:36 am : link
supposed to do though? Even if he felt Lalo knew it was being recorded he's sort of in a paradox - damned if you do, damned if you don't.

The plot thickens  
Optimus-NY : 5/24/2022 8:03 am : link
What a note to go on hiatus on! 6 more episodes to go until the end of the series on August 15th. The next episode (seventh of season six) will be in seven weeks on July 11th.

Questions abound: When do we see Gene again? Does Lalo live or die? When do Walter and/or Jesse show up? What happens to Kim?
I always thought Lalo was dead because there’s no way a character like  
shockeyisthebest8056 : 5/24/2022 9:00 am : link
that could be alive in the BB universe, but who knows? One thing I’ve thought about a lot is the sit down between Hector, the twins, and Gus when the Salamancas want to kill Walt over Tuco. I find it difficult to believe that meeting happens if the Salamancas know for a fact that Gus tried to or successfully killed Lalo.

I guess it’s possible for Don Eladio to find out about the meth lab from a still alive Lalo. Lalo does mention that Bolsa Will side with Gus due to money. Can someone remind me of what happens to Bolsa in BB? Is he arrested by the Mexican government or is he killed by assassins??
First time since Janice shot Richie on The Sopranos  
bceagle05 : 5/24/2022 9:09 am : link
that I’ve jumped out of my seat watching a TV show. Maybe Ned Stark’s death on Game of Thrones. Brilliant plot twist.
we always knew the endgame  
fkap : 5/24/2022 9:49 am : link
of the Howard scam. We just didn't know the moves being made to get there, or whether it was going to work.

Once the flame flickered, it was obvious Howard was going to die. Lalo couldn't leave a 'civilian' witness. What remains is whether Kim lives. I'm thinking yes. She gets scared straight, like she did, for a while, after getting caught shoplifting. Saul is now owned by Lalo, so he can't get out, but Kim can, if she takes the Sandpiper money and dedicates it to helping the underprivileged. Lalo will use her as a threat to keep Saul in line as a criminal lawyer.

In one of the other Saul threads, someone with a better memory than mine recalled that Saul's worry in his introduction on BB was that Lalo was after him.
as soon as the candle  
Enzo : 5/24/2022 9:51 am : link
flickered I got a pit in my stomach. Reminded me of when Uncle Jack and his crew showed up in the desert. You just knew it wasn't going to end well for somebody.
Mike commented  
fkap : 5/24/2022 9:52 am : link
that he pulled guys off the low threat targets. oops
I binge-watched the first five seasons last month  
bceagle05 : 5/24/2022 9:57 am : link
in advance of the final season, and suddenly having to wait a week between episodes is brutal. This wait until until July 11 will feel like a year to me.
IMO  
fkap : 5/24/2022 10:27 am : link
taking Howard down (not the killing) was warranted. He was fucking over a lot of old folks who wouldn't have lived to see their share of the lawsuit just so HHM would make a little more. He put corporate greed ahead of the good of the client.
I pray there is another spinoff that includes post BB for the Jimmy in  
MartyNJ1969 : 5/24/2022 10:35 am : link
Nebraska and getting back to New Mexico storyline. Vince Gillian and these writers are awesome.
RE: IMO  
MartyNJ1969 : 5/24/2022 10:37 am : link
In comment 15717084 fkap said:
Quote:
taking Howard down (not the killing) was warranted. He was fucking over a lot of old folks who wouldn't have lived to see their share of the lawsuit just so HHM would make a little more. He put corporate greed ahead of the good of the client.


I love the old lady representing Sandpiper comments in the meeting room when the meeting went Awry. "is this how its done" totally oblivious to the gravity of the situation and acted very well
RE: IMO  
Enzo : 5/24/2022 10:39 am : link
In comment 15717084 fkap said:
Quote:
taking Howard down (not the killing) was warranted. He was fucking over a lot of old folks who wouldn't have lived to see their share of the lawsuit just so HHM would make a little more. He put corporate greed ahead of the good of the client.

seems a bit harsh, lol.
Questions, How did the picture of the broken arm guy change?  
MartyNJ1969 : 5/24/2022 10:42 am : link
Was the picture physically swapped out by the phony private investigator or was there a chemical change in the picture which made howard feels sick and the picture changes somewhow?


Also, Does anyone know why the Phony Private investigator agreed to do this to Howard? I mean this was downright cruel to do to someone. I think there is a missing storyline where somehow howard must have screwed over this Private investigator somehow in the past and this was payback.
RE: I pray there is another spinoff that includes post BB for the Jimmy in  
OBJ_AllDay : 5/24/2022 10:46 am : link
In comment 15717094 MartyNJ1969 said:
Quote:
Nebraska and getting back to New Mexico storyline. Vince Gillian and these writers are awesome.


I'd love for that as well. Unfortunately I think this is the end of it all. Wouldn't shock me if the entire last episode takes place with Jimmy in Nebraska post BB.

If they were to do another spin off it would probably involve Gus' pre BB and BCS.
Is anybody else  
Kyle in NY : 5/24/2022 10:46 am : link
getting to the point where they'd rank this show ahead of Breaking Bad? I think I'm there. As much as I loved BB, BCS just has such a deeper bench of great characters outside of its lead. Creating Kim, Howard, Lalo, and Nacho just for this show, with the latter two coming from a throwaway line in Saul's first BB episode. On top fleshing out the backstories for characters like Mike and Gus. I'm a bit in awe of the writing and story-telling. This is peak-level TV. Last night was an unbelievable episode
The epilogue of Howard is still to be told. I am guessing  
MartyNJ1969 : 5/24/2022 10:47 am : link
JMM goes into bankruptcy? How will the Lalo killing be explained to authorities? Will we have dream sequences with Howard and Chuck haunting Jimmy? This is gonna be awesome!!
RE: Is anybody else  
MartyNJ1969 : 5/24/2022 10:51 am : link
In comment 15717115 Kyle in NY said:
Quote:
getting to the point where they'd rank this show ahead of Breaking Bad? I think I'm there. As much as I loved BB, BCS just has such a deeper bench of great characters outside of its lead. Creating Kim, Howard, Lalo, and Nacho just for this show, with the latter two coming from a throwaway line in Saul's first BB episode. On top fleshing out the backstories for characters like Mike and Gus. I'm a bit in awe of the writing and story-telling. This is peak-level TV. Last night was an unbelievable episode


Yes, This episode last night eclipse the BB finale. The Howard shooting was higher impact then Who shot JR scene from Dallas.
RE: we always knew the endgame  
Gmanfandan : 5/24/2022 10:53 am : link
In comment 15717052 fkap said:
Quote:
of the Howard scam. We just didn't know the moves being made to get there, or whether it was going to work.

Once the flame flickered, it was obvious Howard was going to die. Lalo couldn't leave a 'civilian' witness. What remains is whether Kim lives. I'm thinking yes. She gets scared straight, like she did, for a while, after getting caught shoplifting. Saul is now owned by Lalo, so he can't get out, but Kim can, if she takes the Sandpiper money and dedicates it to helping the underprivileged. Lalo will use her as a threat to keep Saul in line as a criminal lawyer.

In one of the other Saul threads, someone with a better memory than mine recalled that Saul's worry in his introduction on BB was that Lalo was after him.
The Sandpiper money is the only way to explain Jimmy's palace we got to see in EP 1 - Also the moment Lalo walks in the door you know Howard is a dead man.
RE: RE: I pray there is another spinoff that includes post BB for the Jimmy in  
MartyNJ1969 : 5/24/2022 10:56 am : link
In comment 15717114 OBJ_AllDay said:
Quote:
In comment 15717094 MartyNJ1969 said:


Quote:


Nebraska and getting back to New Mexico storyline. Vince Gillian and these writers are awesome.



I'd love for that as well. Unfortunately I think this is the end of it all. Wouldn't shock me if the entire last episode takes place with Jimmy in Nebraska post BB.

If they were to do another spin off it would probably involve Gus' pre BB and BCS.




That's good too if they go pre BB. I really hope they don't stop. Would love to see Gus early days in Philly

Can you imagine for a moment if Disney gave the reins of storywriting and directing to Star Wars for Episodes 7 ,8, and 9 to Vince Gillian? That Saga would have finished on an incredible note.
RE: The epilogue of Howard is still to be told. I am guessing  
KevinBBWC : 5/24/2022 10:57 am : link
In comment 15717120 MartyNJ1969 said:
Quote:
JMM goes into bankruptcy? How will the Lalo killing be explained to authorities? Will we have dream sequences with Howard and Chuck haunting Jimmy? This is gonna be awesome!!


Would think they will say Suicide. Everything around him going bad and he wanted to kill himself in front of the people he blamed.

The episode itself was amazing.
RE: RE: The epilogue of Howard is still to be told. I am guessing  
OBJ_AllDay : 5/24/2022 11:04 am : link
In comment 15717127 KevinBBWC said:
Quote:
In comment 15717120 MartyNJ1969 said:


Quote:


JMM goes into bankruptcy? How will the Lalo killing be explained to authorities? Will we have dream sequences with Howard and Chuck haunting Jimmy? This is gonna be awesome!!



Would think they will say Suicide. Everything around him going bad and he wanted to kill himself in front of the people he blamed.

The episode itself was amazing.


Agreed. Suicide seems like the easy coverup regarding Howard.
RE: Questions, How did the picture of the broken arm guy change?  
shockeyisthebest8056 : 5/24/2022 11:09 am : link
In comment 15717111 MartyNJ1969 said:
Quote:
Was the picture physically swapped out by the phony private investigator or was there a chemical change in the picture which made howard feels sick and the picture changes somewhow?


Also, Does anyone know why the Phony Private investigator agreed to do this to Howard? I mean this was downright cruel to do to someone. I think there is a missing storyline where somehow howard must have screwed over this Private investigator somehow in the past and this was payback.


Why do most of the people involved with Jimmy’s scams (outside of Kim) do this? Money. Many of them are criminals and conmen just like Slippin Jimmy.
RE: Questions, How did the picture of the broken arm guy change?  
bceagle05 : 5/24/2022 11:10 am : link
In comment 15717111 MartyNJ1969 said:
Quote:
Also, Does anyone know why the Phony Private investigator agreed to do this to Howard? I mean this was downright cruel to do to someone. I think there is a missing storyline where somehow howard must have screwed over this Private investigator somehow in the past and this was payback.

I don't think that guy was a private investigator. Jimmy and Kim figured Howard would reach out to a PI and they somehow scammed him into calling a fake number with that patsy ready to answer the call. Howard explained it to Cliff in the aftermath of the big meeting but I forget all the details. They were a step ahead of him the whole way.
Sorry, I misunderstood your question.  
bceagle05 : 5/24/2022 11:11 am : link
You mentioned that he was a phony PI.
RE: Is anybody else  
shockeyisthebest8056 : 5/24/2022 11:18 am : link
In comment 15717115 Kyle in NY said:
Quote:
getting to the point where they'd rank this show ahead of Breaking Bad? I think I'm there. As much as I loved BB, BCS just has such a deeper bench of great characters outside of its lead. Creating Kim, Howard, Lalo, and Nacho just for this show, with the latter two coming from a throwaway line in Saul's first BB episode. On top fleshing out the backstories for characters like Mike and Gus. I'm a bit in awe of the writing and story-telling. This is peak-level TV. Last night was an unbelievable episode


I can’t go that far. I can do a top 10 episodes of BB off the top of my head and I’m not sure BCS approaches that level. However, it’s a great show and I’d argue it’s a Mount Rushmore television spinoff/sequel/prequel. The writers did an amazing job creating a separate world for Jimmy that wasn’t overly dependent on the BB universe. And amazingly, they managed to do this from 5 somewhat forgettable lines of dialogue on BB.
I would put BCS ahead of BB at this point too.  
bceagle05 : 5/24/2022 11:18 am : link
Kim is a big upgrade over Skylar - that might be the biggest reason for me. Lalo and Nacho are fantastic characters, you get a little different side of Gus, and the more Mike the better.

Also, I can't look at Bryan Cranston and NOT see Tim Whatley the dentist from Seinfeld, so that had an effect, too.
Hard to really separate them though.  
bceagle05 : 5/24/2022 11:19 am : link
Both shows elevate one another.
Maybe the best BCS ever  
Mike in Long Beach : 5/24/2022 11:35 am : link
I have it right there with the episode where Chuck loses his shit at Jimmy hearing.

I have a question... why did Kim hate Howard so much (btw, I had to go back just now and change "does" to "did" in that sentence🥺). Jimmy I get, obviously. A looong history there. But Howard has always been good to Kim. I get he goes against a lot of what she stands for in terms of her principles, but the urge to just ruin him in every capacity always struck me as over-the-top. Of course, she never wanted this. But she didn't want his life working out. Can anyone shine a light on her motivation?
Also...  
Mike in Long Beach : 5/24/2022 11:37 am : link
And let me caveat... Better Call Saul is currently my favorite TV show. I am by NO means slighting it. But there is a WHOLE lot of recency bias going on in these statements that it's better than Breaking Bad. It's not. Breaking Bad is a generational, top 5 of all time TV show.
RE: Maybe the best BCS ever  
MartyNJ1969 : 5/24/2022 11:49 am : link
In comment 15717176 Mike in Long Beach said:
Quote:
I have it right there with the episode where Chuck loses his shit at Jimmy hearing.

I have a question... why did Kim hate Howard so much (btw, I had to go back just now and change "does" to "did" in that sentence🥺). Jimmy I get, obviously. A looong history there. But Howard has always been good to Kim. I get he goes against a lot of what she stands for in terms of her principles, but the urge to just ruin him in every capacity always struck me as over-the-top. Of course, she never wanted this. But she didn't want his life working out. Can anyone shine a light on her motivation?


To answer your question why Kim hated Howard. Howard humiliated Kim by putting her in doc review with junior clerks when she supported Jimmy over Chuck over the misshap with the bank review board and transposed number. Even after Kim worked hard to get into the good graces of Howard , he still treated her like crap. Also, Howard never wanted to hire Jimmy at the firm and he was a further extension of Chuck.
I suppose I get all that, but it still felt over-the-top.  
Mike in Long Beach : 5/24/2022 12:09 pm : link
All of that was in-reaction to Kim going against Howard's mentor and the founding partner of the firm on both a professional and personal level. Stronger penalties have been levied against people for similar transgressions. She was the provoker in those disputes, and it didn't undo all the good he did for her over the years.

And you saw it in her eyes in the episode before last nights; how she aggressively U-turned away from the meeting that was poised to be the catalyst for her career and was driven solely be vengeance for Howard. Just seemed like a lot. Perhaps Howard's final words were spot on. Bottom line is she got off on it.
RE: Also...  
allstarjim : 5/24/2022 12:24 pm : link
In comment 15717177 Mike in Long Beach said:
Quote:
And let me caveat... Better Call Saul is currently my favorite TV show. I am by NO means slighting it. But there is a WHOLE lot of recency bias going on in these statements that it's better than Breaking Bad. It's not. Breaking Bad is a generational, top 5 of all time TV show.


Agree with Mike here.

Howard was a total dick to Kim. Remember Howard punishing her when she went to bat for Jimmy and he got the big job at the other firm and made himself such a distraction that he forced Clifford Main to fire him without cause so he could keep his bonus? And Howard put Kim in doc review on Sandpiper as punishment, then Kim worked her ass off to find the Mesa Verde case to bring to HHM, and Howard basically took it from her and left her in doc review. Chuck and Howard basically stole Mesa Verde from Kim. That's why she hates Howard. Remember it was Jimmy's scheming that got Mesa Verde to fire HHM (the address switcheroo).

And that brought Mesa Verde back to Kim.

Howard was a pretty egotistical douche, but it never seemed like he was a douche just to be one, it's because he has high professional (and personal) standards and principles for not only himself, but also everyone who works at HHM. And really, there's nothing truly inherently bad about that. So Howard, while at times unlikable, does show his personal side in his positive personal interactions with the low people on the totem pole at HHM, and when offering Jimmy a job, and even tells Jimmy he admires him for going to bat for the scholarship for the girl that had a little bit of a checkered past. So Howard is ultimately a forgivable character, one who doesn't deserve the pain and misfortune that Kim and Jimmy enact upon him.

And now that we know that it ultimately results in Howard's murder, I think this will be Kim's undoing. I don't think she's going to survive this.
Am I making this up  
Mike in Long Beach : 5/24/2022 12:26 pm : link
or was the flashback scene in Kim's childhood in Nebraska? I know Jimmy ultimately becomes Gene and moves to Nebraska. If I'm remembering that right about Kim, I doubt that's something that won't be explored.
To expound on this  
allstarjim : 5/24/2022 12:29 pm : link
I think Kim loses a bit of her soul when she tells Jimmy she wants to go after Howard.

Remember, it was Jimmy who tried to first brush the idea off, hope she would drop it, told her it was a bridge too far, gave her multiple chances to stop it, even up to the day that he ran into Judge Casimiro, seeing the broken arm, and Kim at each time re-buffed Jimmy and was the main driving force behind the plan.

She's going to know that it was mainly her that caused Howard to be in their apartment that night, when Lalo made his re-appearance. And that's going to devastate her.
.  
Kyle in NY : 5/24/2022 12:31 pm : link
Kim had some somewhat reasonable reasons to dislike Howard. But I think the point of it all is that they did this simply because they could, because we've seen a few times now that Kim gets off on the thrill. That she's very much "Slippin Kimmy" in her own right. Howard had it correct, right before his demise, telling her that there's a piece of her missing. They had no good reason to do this. They did it for kicks. That's my read on it. The breaking bad journey of Kim has really been remarkable. She's more evil and vindictive than Jimmy could ever dream of being.
I have  
Steve in Greenwich : 5/24/2022 12:43 pm : link
a hard time believing that there will be any more story to the breaking bad universe; unfortunately time takes its toll and we're getting too far in real life from the start of Breaking Bad for these actors. Mike & Gus are now 12-13 years older than their first appearances in Breaking Bad and its getting harder and harder to believe that these actors are portraying younger versions of themselves than when we originally had seen them. Other side characters like Todd in the El Camino movie and Huell either gained or lost a ton of weight from Breaking Bad. Just getting more difficult to keep spinning deeper into the past of their storylines as these actors are continually aging and a lot of real life time is passing.
RE: RE: I pray there is another spinoff that includes post BB for the Jimmy in  
ron mexico : 5/24/2022 12:54 pm : link
In comment 15717114 OBJ_AllDay said:
Quote:
In comment 15717094 MartyNJ1969 said:


Quote:


Nebraska and getting back to New Mexico storyline. Vince Gillian and these writers are awesome.



I'd love for that as well. Unfortunately I think this is the end of it all. Wouldn't shock me if the entire last episode takes place with Jimmy in Nebraska post BB.

If they were to do another spin off it would probably involve Gus' pre BB and BCS.


I bet a bunch of the remaining episodes we be based on current day Saul

I'd love to see a show about Mike's days on the force
on top of all the personal vendetta angle  
fkap : 5/24/2022 1:00 pm : link
I maintain that wanting an early, albeit lesser, settlement for old folk who otherwise wouldn't live to see a penny is a factor. It's been hammered home several times. Juxtaposed with Howard over the top telling the old bat it's going to be years (that angle would be in tiny fine print, not screamed from the mountain top).

Plus, it's hammered again and again how Kim is on a help the poor phase. It may just be sugar to help the medicine go down, but I think it is a real factor, or at least Kim can delude herself into thinking it is. And, for all his flaws, Saul has a soft spot for the little guy. He started out wanting the early settlement for himself, being in dire straits after having being disbarred for a year, but he's awash in clients now.

And for whomever asked...the drops Saul/Kim smeared on the original photos were a chemical to make Howard temporarily look like he was on drugs. It was covered in an episode not long ago.
I think the show made a smart choice  
fkap : 5/24/2022 1:06 pm : link
in making no attempt to make the BB characters look younger. They simply told the audience to deal with it, and moved on. At some point, though, there's a limit. Hector and Gus in a BCS prequel would need new actors.
You could do a spinoff  
allstarjim : 5/24/2022 1:07 pm : link
on Hector Salamanca's rise to power, obviously with a new actor to play a young Salamanca.

Could have an episode where the recruit the twins and them getting their first kill, lol.
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