Defensive coordinator Wink Martindale said that Thibodeaux was his No. 1 guy in this year’s draft class and linebackers coach Drew Wilkins said that if Martindale “created an outside linebacker in a lab” it would have been Thibodeaux
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2022/05/27/kayvon-thibodeaux-in-red-jersey-at-giants-otas-but-no-long-term-health-concerns/
Sorry if posted I did a search and didn’t see it
Quinn's remarks in particular were extremely enlightening on a number of fronts... KT, Ojulari, Ward, etc.
Cry 'Havoc!', and let slip the dogs of war.
I think it would have been Sauce
Quinn's remarks in particular were extremely enlightening on a number of fronts... KT, Ojulari, Ward, etc.
Who is Quinn?
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people really need to watch the pressers with the defensive position coaches on Thursday (on the front page).
Quinn's remarks in particular were extremely enlightening on a number of fronts... KT, Ojulari, Ward, etc.
Who is Quinn?
I meant Wilkins.
If you take Wink at face value, then it was Thibs
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who would have been the pick?
If you take Wink at face value, then it was Thibs
Exactly.
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who would have been the pick?
I think it would have been Sauce
The picks would have been Sauce and Ekwonu if Schoen had his way...
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In comment 15720020 Lowell said:
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who would have been the pick?
I think it would have been Sauce
The picks would have been Sauce and Ekwonu if Schoen had his way...
Not buying that for a second. He got just who he wanted. They were the best players at the most important positions to fill for this team.
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In comment 15720022 bigblue12 said:
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In comment 15720020 Lowell said:
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who would have been the pick?
I think it would have been Sauce
The picks would have been Sauce and Ekwonu if Schoen had his way...
Not buying that for a second. He got just who he wanted. They were the best players at the most important positions to fill for this team.
Well, one of our most accurate insiders even said the Giants draft room was pretty pisses that the Jets took Sauce. Maybe because his positiin is more premium and they view Thibs' positiin as being more densely replaceable, but I also dont they were disappointed with Thibs. I know Im not. I also think Neal would have been their actual first choice at OT if both were there.His veratility just echoes every other OL move Shoen has made.
Quinn's remarks in particular were extremely enlightening on a number of fronts... KT, Ojulari, Ward, etc.
I used to read them all, but got tired of the same old cliches and non-information in those interviews. Usually every player is going to be great. They are working hard. Yadda, yadda, yadda.
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people really need to watch the pressers with the defensive position coaches on Thursday (on the front page).
Quinn's remarks in particular were extremely enlightening on a number of fronts... KT, Ojulari, Ward, etc.
I used to read them all, but got tired of the same old cliches and non-information in those interviews. Usually every player is going to be great. They are working hard. Yadda, yadda, yadda.
Well, I recommend listening to what Wilkins, Henderson, and Patterson had to say.
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In comment 15720006 Eric from BBI said:
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people really need to watch the pressers with the defensive position coaches on Thursday (on the front page).
Quinn's remarks in particular were extremely enlightening on a number of fronts... KT, Ojulari, Ward, etc.
Who is Quinn?
I meant Wilkins.
Thought that is who you meant, but then I was wondering what I missed.
Yeah, Wilkens wasn't too exuberant...
However, they were pretty good at disguising who they were after, so perhaps it actually went as planned Thibs, then remaining OT of Neal and Ekwonu.
The best way I can answer this is that in 2020 when we hired Judge, the guy who I was leaning towards for HC was Martindale (I had a BBI readers just send me an e-mail yesterday with a back-and-forth conversation I had with him in January 2020 reminding me that I wanted Martindale). Martindale was my #1 choice for DC this offseason... I honestly didn't think we could land him and didn't understand the "we want to keep Graham talk" from the Giants).
During a media session with the Baltimore media, Martindale called Wilkins a rising star as a coach. Was thrilled when he came along.
Patterson is regarded was one of the best DL coaches in the game.
Getting Kafka was a major coup. Jury is out on Bobby Johnson, but he has a track record in Buffalo and I like the way he presents himself (latter doesn't mean much but I'll take it).
My take.
Daboll is hiring coaches who have a track record of performance.
Judge hired his buddies.
I never took it any other way - #1 ER. Which of course means, he would have been #1 overall since Walker and Hutchinson went 1 and 2...
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In comment 15720022 bigblue12 said:
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In comment 15720020 Lowell said:
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who would have been the pick?
I think it would have been Sauce
The picks would have been Sauce and Ekwonu if Schoen had his way...
Not buying that for a second. He got just who he wanted. They were the best players at the most important positions to fill for this team.
Not suggesting Schoen is lamenting over Thibs & Neal as he is on the record saying he had about 6-7 guys he was good with.
But signs point clearly to Sauce and Ekwonu...
That’s certainly possible. However, the Giants biggest defensive problems last year were no pass rush and being gashed on the edge in the run game. Thibs solves both those issues. Wink may well faves CB but I bet Schoen saw that.
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initial staff, preseason, vs Daboll's, do you get a better vibe from these guys? We all get excited listening to initial pressers with the coaches and new staffs, but I get the feeling these guys are more calmly reassuring vs Judge's staff. More substance behind the interviews...
My take.
Daboll is hiring coaches who have a track record of performance.
Judge hired his buddies.
That is true on Judge hiring his friends. Think he tried to get "teachers" instead of coaches.
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Martindale's comments about Kayvon, he could have meant that Kayvon was his #1 edge guy, not #1 overall. That's the way I took it.
That’s certainly possible. However, the Giants biggest defensive problems last year were no pass rush and being gashed on the edge in the run game. Thibs solves both those issues. Wink may well faves CB but I bet Schoen saw that.
favor, ugh.
However, they were pretty good at disguising who they were after, so perhaps it actually went as planned Thibs, then remaining OT of Neal and Ekwonu.
One of the picks was always an OT. It had to be otherwise our rookie GM would have been facing massive criticism by not seriously addressing a critical position where he had literally nobody to play...
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Sauce would have been the pick at #5. But not sure what they would have done at #7 - but would not be surprised if it was Thibs over Neal.
However, they were pretty good at disguising who they were after, so perhaps it actually went as planned Thibs, then remaining OT of Neal and Ekwonu.
One of the picks was always an OT. It had to be otherwise our rookie GM would have been facing massive criticism by not seriously addressing a critical position where he had literally nobody to play...
Unless, he went strictly BPA and Thibs was rated higher than Neal/Ekwonu. There were other OTs they could get in the 2nd round.
I prefer the way this turned out, but Schoen likely looks at it differently from us. I will go by what he said - I will have 7 guys I can take...(paraphrasing of course)
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Sauce would have been the pick at #5. But not sure what they would have done at #7 - but would not be surprised if it was Thibs over Neal.
However, they were pretty good at disguising who they were after, so perhaps it actually went as planned Thibs, then remaining OT of Neal and Ekwonu.
One of the picks was always an OT. It had to be otherwise our rookie GM would have been facing massive criticism by not seriously addressing a critical position where he had literally nobody to play...
Absolutely. Folks that thought not getting an OT in round 1 wasn’t a failure were off base. That was the must have. We can reasonably argue about CB or EDGE. Not OT.
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In comment 15720134 section125 said:
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Sauce would have been the pick at #5. But not sure what they would have done at #7 - but would not be surprised if it was Thibs over Neal.
However, they were pretty good at disguising who they were after, so perhaps it actually went as planned Thibs, then remaining OT of Neal and Ekwonu.
One of the picks was always an OT. It had to be otherwise our rookie GM would have been facing massive criticism by not seriously addressing a critical position where he had literally nobody to play...
Unless, he went strictly BPA and Thibs was rated higher than Neal/Ekwonu. There were other OTs they could get in the 2nd round.
I prefer the way this turned out, but Schoen likely looks at it differently from us. I will go by what he said - I will have 7 guys I can take...(paraphrasing of course)
No, go read Schoen's comments all about scenarios. Thibs was taken there (at #5) because there were still 2 OTs left.
Schoen absolutely was going OT with #5 or #7. When he knew that it was guaranteed he would have one of his two guys at OT, he turned back to the best Defensive Player still left on his board which was Thibs.
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In comment 15720134 section125 said:
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Sauce would have been the pick at #5. But not sure what they would have done at #7 - but would not be surprised if it was Thibs over Neal.
However, they were pretty good at disguising who they were after, so perhaps it actually went as planned Thibs, then remaining OT of Neal and Ekwonu.
One of the picks was always an OT. It had to be otherwise our rookie GM would have been facing massive criticism by not seriously addressing a critical position where he had literally nobody to play...
Absolutely. Folks that thought not getting an OT in round 1 wasn’t a failure were off base. That was the must have. We can reasonably argue about CB or EDGE. Not OT.
OT was a lock. The "you can find good OL later" crowd have no legs to stand on here with this loigc. Schoen had several OTs that made the grade and at a prime investment spot and one of massive need. Not picking an OT there would have been egregious.
And Gardner was the cleaner pick (over Thibs) and solves for Bradberry situation. Schoen wanted to Gardner and then would have likely gone ER in Rd 2 (the Penn St guy?) but found himself instead trying get one of his last remaining top targets at CB (McCreary) on his list. And whene he lost him, he started trading down...
I would have preferred ER as well, but not Thibs. I actually think some of the other ER/DEs still on board later and into Rd 2 were really good prospects and great value at that point. The CB dropoff from Gardner to Rd 2 guys was much bigger.
Hope Thibs kills it now that he is a NYG. He better...
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We agree about tackle but I think edge was the better pick over corner. As I said above the Giants biggest defensive problems last year were no pass rush and being gashed on the edge in the run game. Thibs solves both those issues. Wink may well generally favor CB but I bet Schoen saw that.
I would have preferred ER as well, but not Thibs. I actually think some of the other ER/DEs still on board later and into Rd 2 were really good prospects and great value at that point. The CB dropoff from Gardner to Rd 2 guys was much bigger.
Hope Thibs kills it now that he is a NYG. He better...
Just don’t get the doubts folks have about Thibs. He’s a monster prospect. The dropoff from him to the next edge prospect was enormous. You can get high quality CBs anywhere in the first (McCreary for example) and there will be some next year no matter where we pick. Elite edge guys are top ten picks.
I wanted an OT and an impact defender in the 1st Round (would've been fine with an OT and WR). Preferred Neal over Ekwonu because of questions about Andrew Thomas' health, future on the team. I'd rather have Neal at LT if need be in a year or two rather than Ekwonu. Hopefully, Thomas and Neal will indeed be our bookend Tackles for many years to come, but I'm hesitant to etch that in stone right now.
The Sauce/Thibs debate just goes to show why most of the pre-draft scuttlebutt ought to be ignored. As I recall, all we heard was how much the Jets didn't want Sauce, and how much they loved Thibs. Meanwhile, the Giants were "all-out" on Thibs. So go figure. I can believe that the Giants would've drafted Sauce if he was still there at #5, but I'm glad he wasn't. I see Thibs as more of a force-multiplier, whose presence will impact the play of our entire front seven in a good way.
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I see Thibs as more of a force-multiplier, whose presence will impact the play of our entire front seven in a good way.
This exactly.
Neal
IK
NEED OT if only one left at 5 OT is picked over everyone else
Gardner
Thib (Said to be Wink #1 more OLB than Hutch)
Hutch
Walker (Presume he was the 6th acceptable player)
Ended up almost best case.
By this best case is Jets take Thibs and we get Sauce and Neal. I prefer what happened for the reasons that others have stated.
Worst case first four are Neal, IK, Sauce, Thibs
We take Hutch and trade out of 7.
bbi posters like to make up stuff in their heads sometimes. I'm sure any DC would like to generate pressure with 4.
I prefer the way this turned out, but Schoen likely looks at it differently from us. I will go by what he said - I will have 7 guys I can take...(paraphrasing of course)/////
No, go read Schoen's comments all about scenarios. Thibs was taken there (at #5) because there were still 2 OTs left.
Schoen absolutely was going OT with #5 or #7....
Agree googs, and to section's notion about waiting until 2nd to grab an OT, in terms of Schoen looking at it differently, had Schoen been our GM when Flowers was drafted, good wager to think he might have waited. 2022 definitely not the year to be cute.
Historically, rico has had a pretty darn good track record, but historically means that it's been one or more of the prior regimes sharing inside info. Either he was spot on about Sauce and it didn't fall that way, KT being a very desirable fallback, and/or rico's legacy informants were out of the JS/Dabs loop, and might not even be around any more.