Defensive coordinator Wink Martindale said that Thibodeaux was his No. 1 guy in this year’s draft class and linebackers coach Drew Wilkins said that if Martindale “created an outside linebacker in a lab” it would have been Thibodeaux
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2022/05/27/kayvon-thibodeaux-in-red-jersey-at-giants-otas-but-no-long-term-health-concerns/
Sorry if posted I did a search and didn’t see it
Couldn’t be more on the same page.
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Wink wants CBs above all. I’m sure I heard that somewhere.
bbi posters like to make up stuff in their heads sometimes. I'm sure any DC would like to generate pressure with 4.
You seem to be ignorant of both what Wink said and the board reaction to it.
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In comment 15720186 BillT said:
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We agree about tackle but I think edge was the better pick over corner. As I said above the Giants biggest defensive problems last year were no pass rush and being gashed on the edge in the run game. Thibs solves both those issues. Wink may well generally favor CB but I bet Schoen saw that.
I would have preferred ER as well, but not Thibs. I actually think some of the other ER/DEs still on board later and into Rd 2 were really good prospects and great value at that point. The CB dropoff from Gardner to Rd 2 guys was much bigger.
Hope Thibs kills it now that he is a NYG. He better...
Just don’t get the doubts folks have about Thibs. He’s a monster prospect. The dropoff from him to the next edge prospect was enormous. You can get high quality CBs anywhere in the first (McCreary for example) and there will be some next year no matter where we pick. Elite edge guys are top ten picks.
Plenty of doubts about Thibs. Go to any pre draft day you want and find the threads. The dropoff may not be much if any when you look at the whole picture on a prospect and not just the highlight films...
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In comment 15720193 Jimmy Googs said:
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In comment 15720186 BillT said:
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Plenty of doubts about Thibs. Go to any pre draft day you want and find the threads. The dropoff may not be much if any when you look at the whole picture on a prospect and not just the highlight films...
Sure, plenty of doubts by guys (like me) sitting on their couches listening to “draft experts”. Schoen, Wink, Wilkins and teams like the Cowboys don’t seem to share those doubts. Tough choice there.
Let’s hope he takes advantage of a great opportunity to become a consistent All Pro type player before worrying about other topics. If he dies it will all come his way in NY...
I think it was all smoke generated by some team to drop his stock in hopes they could have an opportunity to get him.
The giants did a lot of work on him. Interviewed him at the combine. Had dinner with him before his pro day and had him in for a visit. We all read and saw the reports and yet dismissed it. By most reports we were all in on Charles Cross.
Let’s hope he takes advantage of a great opportunity to become a consistent All Pro type player before worrying about other topics. If he dies it will all come his way in NY...
Here the thing. The “just football” analysis we here is mostly amateur (Sy excepted) “draft experts” and journalists (even more amateur). It’s got to be taken with a grain of salt. Relying on these kinds of sources for the non football stuff is fools gold. That’s especially true once we get the opinions of Schoen and Wink. How do you hold on to that after listening to what Wilkins said.
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you want to rely on. Thibs has ER talent for certain but some doubts on field and off field create a whole a picture.
Let’s hope he takes advantage of a great opportunity to become a consistent All Pro type player before worrying about other topics. If he dies it will all come his way in NY...
Here the thing. The “just football” analysis we here is mostly amateur (Sy excepted) “draft experts” and journalists (even more amateur). It’s got to be taken with a grain of salt. Relying on these kinds of sources for the non football stuff is fools gold. That’s especially true once we get the opinions of Schoen and Wink. How do you hold on to that after listening to what Wilkins said.
Here’s the thing. Talent isn’t enough. I am sure you heard and relied upon lots of similar things picking at near or the top of the Draft over the past decade from the experts Reese, Gettleman, their front office people and coaches.
How did that work out for them and you?
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In comment 15720295 Jimmy Googs said:
Here’s the thing. Talent isn’t enough. I am sure you heard and relied upon lots of similar things picking at near or the top of the Draft over the past decade from the experts Reese, Gettleman, their front office people and coaches.
How did that work out for them and you?
Aren’t you making my point for me. Sure, the pros have those kind of opinions and have done the work and have the access to make those kind of calls. No one is perfect on that stuff but at least they have a legit chance. That’s why I trust Schoen and Wink and Wilkins opinions on Thibs. But you talked about the opinions on this board taken from a bunch of “draft experts” and journalists. Them, not so much.
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In comment 15720295 Jimmy Googs said:
Here’s the thing. Talent isn’t enough. I am sure you heard and relied upon lots of similar things picking at near or the top of the Draft over the past decade from the experts Reese, Gettleman, their front office people and coaches.
How did that work out for them and you?
Aren’t you making my point for me. Sure, the pros have those kind of opinions and have done the work and have the access to make those kind of calls. No one is perfect on that stuff but at least they have a legit chance. That’s why I trust Schoen and Wink and Wilkins opinions on Thibs. But you talked about the opinions on this board taken from a bunch of “draft experts” and journalists. Them, not so much.
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In comment 15720309 BillT said:
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In comment 15720295 Jimmy Googs said:
Here’s the thing. Talent isn’t enough. I am sure you heard and relied upon lots of similar things picking at near or the top of the Draft over the past decade from the experts Reese, Gettleman, their front office people and coaches.
How did that work out for them and you?
Aren’t you making my point for me. Sure, the pros have those kind of opinions and have done the work and have the access to make those kind of calls. No one is perfect on that stuff but at least they have a legit chance. That’s why I trust Schoen and Wink and Wilkins opinions on Thibs. But you talked about the opinions on this board taken from a bunch of “draft experts” and journalists. Them, not so much.
I didn’t talk anything about who’s opinions are more reliable or what everybody should focus on the most in evaluating a player. Schoen and his guys should have gotten to know everything they needed to about Thibs and they concluded he works for them at #5. That’s all.
You simply went off saying how can anyone have doubts about this monster prospect and I told you there were plenty of conversations going on about doubts and potential issues with Thibs. And not everything is about disregarding him altogether but sometimes enough risk or doubt in the calculus can cause a prospect to fall from one tier to a lower one.
Is this not intuitive?
Wink has been interviewing for head jobs for a while so McDonald has probably been the heir apparent for several years - with the only issue being that Wink hadn't yet landed a head job. I wouldn't be shocked if Macdonald had come close to getting poached away more than once so harbough felt some urgency trying to balance continuity with Wink in the short term vs. not losing their longer term continuity by bringing Macdonald back who may have several years until he's a HC candidate.
Now from Wink's perspective it also made sense to go to NY if he wants to be a HC. Spags got head coaching jobs each of his first 2 years as NYG Dc. McAdoo got HC interviews after some pretty mediocre years as OC. Patrick Graham got interviews, and apparently got close to landing the MIN job even after a bad year where his defense allowed more points than Wink's in what was considered a disaster year for Baltimore. Coaches that succeed in NY seem to get attention and improve their job prospects, and I do think a very legitimate question mark on Wink's resume is the degree to which he can succeed outside the Ravens established culture. If Wink succeeds here despite the exact opposite type of established culture he will be a hot name like Quinn was last year.
I don’t know, we’ll see. Hope he is the goods as mentioned earlier.
Later bill...
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Forget the above. Got confused on your point. Just saying the info we’re getting now on Thibs is not just as good, it’s probably quite a bit better than anything we got from anywhere pre draft. Worth factoring in.
I don’t know, we’ll see. Hope he is the goods as mentioned earlier.
Later bill...
Later.
They got the pick right.
“He was Drew’s No. 1 guy, Drew Wilkins, the outside linebacker coach, and he was my number one guy coming out of the process,” Martindale said. BBV article
There is a sign Sauce was #1 on their board, but none that Ekwonu was for right tackle. Why take a guy who's never played RT when you have a guy who has played nearly 800 snaps there?
When Schoen said "Get Thibadeux ready", meaning on the card, it was with a look of some disappointment.
In comment 15720157 Jimmy Googs said:
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In comment 15720072 Jimmy Googs said:
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In comment 15720022 bigblue12 said:
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In comment 15720020 Lowell said:
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who would have been the pick?
I think it would have been Sauce
The picks would have been Sauce and Ekwonu if Schoen had his way...
Not buying that for a second. He got just who he wanted. They were the best players at the most important positions to fill for this team.
Not suggesting Schoen is lamenting over Thibs & Neal as he is on the record saying he had about 6-7 guys he was good with.
But signs point clearly to Sauce and Ekwonu...
There is a sign Sauce was #1 on their board, but none that Ekwonu was for right tackle. Why take a guy who's never played RT when you have a guy who has played nearly 800 snaps there?
When Schoen said "Get Thibadeux ready", meaning on the card, it was with a look of some disappointment.
Because its quite possible Ekwonu will be the better player long term. Schoen said he had them both pretty much next to each other but give the slight edge to Ekwonu based on his word choices...
I heard Neal was OT1, Ekwonu's name did not come up. Given the info accuracy of the past, I'm content they got their OT1.
It's not like we lost out on anything as nobody has played an actual NFL down yet. But enough of signs point to Sauce and Ekwonu as to where he would have gone given all four as choices...
That's fine. Maybe Schoen did a good job of keeping things under wraps then for once, or he wanted to pay a nice compliment to the Carolina Panther GM for whatever reason...
:-)