Jake Fischer has a notebook coming out this morning and Bleacher Report is releasing some snippets..
Nets are offering Kyrie a shorter term incentive laden deal, expected to talk up until the 29th deadline..
Knicks are trying to clear 25 million to sign Brunson
This FO is a bit more methodical than others and definitely values draft capital. I never believed #11 was in play for Brogdon unless they were unloading unwanted players or getting a future #1. Brogdon should be considered a negative asset right now.
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“If the Knicks fail to acquire Brunson in free agency and lose out on a trade for Indiana Pacers guard Malcolm Brogdon, they would probably take a look at the possibility of Irving.”
Supposedly, if the Nets don't give Irving what he wants, he will head to the Lakers for their MLE. He is a strange guy and feels he owes Lebron. I don't think the Knicks are really on his radar and never were. All that being said, I'm sure, he and the Nets will come to some sort of compromise as they both have a lot to lose by not working it out. I'm sure the Nets don't want KD demanding a trade.
Where are you getting that Kyrie stuff from. Honestly haven’t followed the drama too in depth but that whole “owing LeBron/MLE” stuff sounds crazy even for Kyrie.
@JakeLFischer
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16s
One thing that is certain: the Atlanta Hawks, sources say, are operating with the goal of trading John Collins before Thursday night gets underway.
Don't see much of an "asset" coming to the Knicks dropping down in this draft, once you get past the top 8 or so these guys are all viewed "similarly", I'd be very surprised to see a team give up anything of note to move from say 15 to 11 this year.
CHA gets Kemba and Noel (and saves $12m in salary this year and $30m next year)
IND gets Burks, Fournier, and a CHA first this year
NYK gets Hayward and Brogdon (consolidation trade, assuming they know via backchannels Brunson is not coming).
I think Hollinger is underselling his ability to block shots and finish in the paint. I think he'll wind up being similar to Mitch. Ceilings are similar but I don't think we'll ever see Mitch reach his given how little he's improved since he came into the league. If they're going to move on from Mitch then Duren could fit that role well.
With that said, I'm not all that interested in using a lottery pick on a traditional center. I'd much rather roll the dice on a wing like Griffin as far as asset maximization goes.
@JeremyWoo
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"Duren has some of the best physical tools in the draft, with a chiseled frame, long arms and a strong base that should make him a quality rebounder and play-finisher. He can be a little bit slow getting off the floor, and scouts have always held concerns about his motor, but he is also extremely young and has a bit of untapped skill upside as a passer (and hopefully as a shooter). Duren can otherwise be too reliant on bullying defenders in lieu of skill. He’s an excellent rebounder who also offers a defensive presence in changing shots, and there’s a pretty good chance he winds up as a starting-caliber player. Some patience will be necessary here, and as a traditional center, he fits a devalued archetype. Many teams suspect he’s not quite as tall as his listed 6' 11" (he didn’t measure at the combine). But if Duren’s effort level continues to tick upward as he matures, he has a solid enough set of strengths to return nice value."
It's possible Davis falls to 11 (unlikely but possible). Woo has him 9, Hollinger 29 (acknowledging he likes him less than some other people too)
In my opinion, he's being way underrated. I said elsewhere, he reminds me of the earliest (Houston Cougar) days that we saw Hakeem Olajuwan. Duren is 6'10" 250, has a 7'5" WS. His speed and hops are as good as it gets for a BIG. Furthermore, his balance, hands and coordination are all top notch too.
Would I dare predict he will have Dream's all time great career? No, but I do believe he'll be one of the best players in this draft.
As far as Mitch Robinson comp, Duren has much better hands and coordination to develop an offensive game. He already shows glimpses as a passer/shooter.
Happy to share summary of other players if anyone's interested
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Thibs loves Johnny Davis and the org loves the kid from Ohio St. Look out one of those 2 guys. Davis could be the target if they move to #7.
It's possible Davis falls to 11 (unlikely but possible). Woo has him 9, Hollinger 29 (acknowledging he likes him less than some other people too)
Most of the mocks have him going to the Wizards at 10, and I saw one that had him to SA at 9. Seems like he gets into our range but doesn't quite fall to us. I like him. I think he's a more polished and better all around player than most of the other guy people are talking about at our spot currently.
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Duren is a rim-running, shot-swatting big man — albeit one with good upside to be a starter because of how big, long, strong and athletic he is. He catches the ball well. He is explosive athletically and finishes above the rim. He has good shot-blocking instincts from the weak side and has the frame to turn into a primary rim protector with some work. The big question with Duren is, “How high do you draft someone whose game is relatively limited?” The swing skill for Duren is his perimeter defense. If he can prove to be reliable enough to stay on the court in space and not get beaten by opposing guards, he can be a top-10 center in the NBA. I brought up DeAndre Jordan earlier, and a lot of outcomes end with Duren being somewhat like peak Jordan. The game has changed enough to where I don’t think prime Jordan would top out as an All-NBA player in the 2020s and 2030s, but he can still be impactful through his sheer athleticism and strength. It took Jordan a few years to become a quality starter, and I can see it taking some time for Duren too. Long term, Duren needs to be able to stay on the floor in the biggest moments. I think he has potential if he can get with a coaching staff that can fix some of his minor, experience-based issues on defense, but it’s not a sure thing. Fit will be very important for him. Teams that think he’ll be able to do that will likely see him as a back-half-of-the-lottery guy. Teams that don’t will see him more as a mid-first-rounder.
Happy to share summary of other players if anyone's interested
Reads again like a Mitch-replacement without a *likely* ceiling much higher than current Mitch. Worth remembering if Mitch plays college ball as a freshman he's likely a lotto pick himself.
Inconsistent shooter and a so-so athlete?
BRING HIM ON!
Meant to say that even if he doesn't develop a perimeter game, he still has Capela-type of upside because of his defensive and passing abilities.
If they haven't done it yet it won't happen and you can't draft on it
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has 0 career 3's in his career and 53% from the FT line, strange comparison "if he develops a perimeter shot" no?
Meant to say that even if he doesn't develop a perimeter game, he still has Capela-type of upside because of his defensive and passing abilities.
Capela has unusually quick feet for his size, and that was his reputation pre-draft. An absurd athlete with limited "skills".
"His end-to-end mobility and condor-like wingspan make him one of the best international big men in the 2014 crop, as he covers a ton of ground horizontally and vertically."
Hollinger on Duren-
"’d describe his feet as more “good” than “great;” he can be a little slow at times and at others had to give up excessive cushion to feel like he could keep in front. The biggest barrier for him is just that the bar for “switchable big” in the NBA is getting so darned high, especially as we get deeper into the postseason. He’s good enough to get there though."
If they haven't done it yet it won't happen and you can't draft on it
True, but there are exceptions. Al Horford and Boogie come to mind. Maybe Blake Griffin too, but I don't remember how he shot in Oklahoma.
As he is right now, Duren is really good. If he can develop a perimeter shot, he'll be really fucking good.
@TheNBACentral
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1m
There are credible rumblings in circulation that Kyrie Irving has had some recent contact with LeBron James to presumably discuss a potential reunion, per @TheSteinLine
@TheNBACentral
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1m
There are credible rumblings in circulation that Kyrie Irving has had some recent contact with LeBron James to presumably discuss a potential reunion, per @TheSteinLine
Good. Keep him away from us.
Reads again like a Mitch-replacement without a *likely* ceiling much higher than current Mitch. Worth remembering if Mitch plays college ball as a freshman he's likely a lotto pick himself.
I think Mitch's ceiling is limited by his intelligence or rather, lack thereof
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Reads again like a Mitch-replacement without a *likely* ceiling much higher than current Mitch. Worth remembering if Mitch plays college ball as a freshman he's likely a lotto pick himself.
I think Mitch's ceiling is limited by his intelligence or rather, lack thereof
In fairness (again I'm not "against" Duren) but his motor and instincts have been questioned as well, not sure about his "intelligence"
Also, give me Tari Eason. That LSU program was a mess. He might have another gear that we haven't seen yet.
The threat is he signs for the MLE I believe. While it sounds incredibly unlikely, this is Kyrie we're talking about. Not exactly a guy whose next move is easy to predict. He forfeited millions in earnings last year and I wouldn't put it past him to sign for the MLE just to spite the Nets for not giving him a max.
Also mentioned that he was pretty sure Brunson wasn't leaving Dallas.
@esidery
The Knicks are expected to re-sign Mitchell Robinson, per @TheSteinLine
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(I'm unclear if this is this Sidery guy simply repeating what Stein said the other day as "new")
I do believe they want Ivey. AJ called that months ago, but they are not going to leave themselves without assets to get him as they still want the next available star.
I have said it all along, they will stay at 11 or trade down or trade completely out of the draft for a 2023 pick, if they can.
I do believe they want Ivey. AJ called that months ago, but they are not going to leave themselves without assets to get him as they still want the next available star.
I have said it all along, they will stay at 11 or trade down or trade completely out of the draft for a 2023 pick, if they can.
Staying at 11 is the smart play, rather than making a dumb fallback option like trading it for Brogdon.
@esidery
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50s
The Knicks will indeed become a legitimate threat to sign Jalen Brunson from the Mavericks if they can create the necessary cap space, per
@TheSteinLine
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New York is trying to trade Alec Burks, Kemba Walker and Nerlens Noel to shed salary for Brunson.
@esidery
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50s
The Knicks will indeed become a legitimate threat to sign Jalen Brunson from the Mavericks if they can create the necessary cap space, per
@TheSteinLine
.
New York is trying to trade Alec Burks, Kemba Walker and Nerlens Noel to shed salary for Brunson.
Good luck with trying to clear the space without attaching draft picks.
For me the two guys outside of Ivey that make the most sense are Dyson Daniels and Shaeden Sharpe.
The first for his playmaking, defense, and length, and the second for potential upside.
I think we can get either at #7. Those would be my targets. Duran? Davis? are duplications.
For me the two guys outside of Ivey that make the most sense are Dyson Daniels and Shaeden Sharpe.
The first for his playmaking, defense, and length, and the second for potential upside.
I think we can get either at #7. Those would be my targets. Duran? Davis? are duplications.
How are the Knicks getting to 7?
I know Kyrie is very much an "individual", but those in NBPA leadership typically feel like they have a responsibility to sign for as much as possible for leverage purposes in future negotiations with the NBA. The theory goes, if they take a big pay cut then the NBA owners can kind of point out "Do you guys really need all that money if you can take a big pay cut like that?" CP3 might have cost himself a ring due to thinking like this as the NBPA President.
On the otherhand, wasn't Kyrie the guy in the Bubble who brought up "We should create our own league!" during the discussions after all the civil unrest due to the Jacob Blake shooting iirc.
With all due respect, that idea obviously doesn't make sense financially and I'm sure Kyrie realized him and everyone else would need to take a significant pay cut to make that happen. So maybe he doesn't care about the money that much?
So all that being said... I don't know what the hell he's thinking LOL. Most NBPA guys care about getting as paid as possible, but Kyrie clearly isn't "most guys".