AAA Fisher
AA TBD
A+ Santos
A Colon
FCL Acuna
19-year-old Jose Acuna making the start for the FCL Mets today. He's off to a fantastic start to his 2022. His 2.04 FIP is 6th in the organization, and his 12.41 K/9 is 18th (Pitchers with 10+ innings pitched)
Jesus Baez is now tied for 2nd in the DSL in HR's with 5. The league leader Bryant Betancourt (6) has played 3 more games and is repeating the DSL
Hoping Alvarez gets to catch Max today.
Saw/heard some nice comments regarding his bat from McCann and Max... will be interesting to hear Max's perspective on his receiving ability. My guess is if he doesn't comment on it, it's not good...
he's going to learn how to call big league games at the big league level. i think there's always things to learn at any level, but realistically at AA/AAA he's going to be catching a blend of young upside pitchers who don't understand how to attack big league hitters any more than he does and a handful of more veteran AAAA types who do (the pitching versions of crash davis). but none of them the full package of what it takes to be in the big leagues or else they'd be in the big leagues.
the DH is a gamechanger for a prospect in Alvarez' situation because as long as he hits he can come along at whatever his aptitude allows. catch 1 day a week, 2, 3, etc. protect him with some strong defenders and the risk is minimized. then the only reason he goes down is if he doesn't hit.
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comments were very positive but even within that he acknowledged it took him a long time to figure out how to call a solid big league game. That's certainly an argument against Alvarez coming up in 2022 and catching, and that becomes their quandary, are they okay with him missing out on a few months of reps behind the plate? and if so, what do you do then? Send him back down for a few months next year? When does he make them up? It's a tough call.
he's going to learn how to call big league games at the big league level. i think there's always things to learn at any level, but realistically at AA/AAA he's going to be catching a blend of young upside pitchers who don't understand how to attack big league hitters any more than he does and a handful of more veteran AAAA types who do (the pitching versions of crash davis). but none of them the full package of what it takes to be in the big leagues or else they'd be in the big leagues.
the DH is a gamechanger for a prospect in Alvarez' situation because as long as he hits he can come along at whatever his aptitude allows. catch 1 day a week, 2, 3, etc. protect him with some strong defenders and the risk is minimized. then the only reason he goes down is if he doesn't hit.
Eric,
I'm talking specifically about him catching the MLB staff in 2022 in a pennant race. He can't really "learn on the job" in a big game against the Braves in September.
And McCann himself
“It’ll take you three or four years before you really understand calling a game at this level,” he said. “It doesn’t matter how much homework you do, how much help you have from the dugout. It takes that experience of getting burned in a game by a guy and then logging it in the memory book to then two years down the road say, ‘I’m not getting burned the same way I got burned two years ago.’ That type of stuff. "
So no, I don't think anybody really agrees that occasional catching is going to do a ton for his development. If the thought is the bat can help the big club now, then yeah it likely can. If the thought is occasionally catching vs. getting the reps isn't a real issue, I completely disagree and I'd suggest McCann himself pretty clearly does as well.
Also, how would you compare someone like Alvarez at this point to Piazza (at any point). I think Piazza struggled to throw out baserunners, but was he a bad framer? passed balls? throwing out runners is just a part of it.
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In comment 15742787 DanMetroMan said:
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comments were very positive but even within that he acknowledged it took him a long time to figure out how to call a solid big league game. That's certainly an argument against Alvarez coming up in 2022 and catching, and that becomes their quandary, are they okay with him missing out on a few months of reps behind the plate? and if so, what do you do then? Send him back down for a few months next year? When does he make them up? It's a tough call.
he's going to learn how to call big league games at the big league level. i think there's always things to learn at any level, but realistically at AA/AAA he's going to be catching a blend of young upside pitchers who don't understand how to attack big league hitters any more than he does and a handful of more veteran AAAA types who do (the pitching versions of crash davis). but none of them the full package of what it takes to be in the big leagues or else they'd be in the big leagues.
the DH is a gamechanger for a prospect in Alvarez' situation because as long as he hits he can come along at whatever his aptitude allows. catch 1 day a week, 2, 3, etc. protect him with some strong defenders and the risk is minimized. then the only reason he goes down is if he doesn't hit.
Eric,
I'm talking specifically about him catching the MLB staff in 2022 in a pennant race. He can't really "learn on the job" in a big game against the Braves in September.
this year if he comes up it's probably 80-90% as DH unless when he catches he's just a natural.
I see him as 3rd or 4th in line for the DH spot over the next 2 months if it doesn't get solved by one of the options ahead of him. 1st in line right now should be Vientos because 2nd in line is probably a trade (which is why i'd have been aggressive with Vientos because his performance could dictate the trade posture one way or the other). 3rd would be Dom or JDD getting another extended shot post-deadline if still here and then I think behind that is when Alvarez may become the best option if he's crushing AAA.
but if someone seizes the DH spot in the next few weeks whether it's Dom, Vientos, or a trade AND Alvarez smashes AAA, i think it may make sense to bring him up and give him a shot catching. That's a scenario where he's in a tougher position to stick for the postseason but it's not impossible. just unlikely. but the positive to that scenario is somehow the DH situation has improved.
Also, how would you compare someone like Alvarez at this point to Piazza (at any point). I think Piazza struggled to throw out baserunners, but was he a bad framer? passed balls? throwing out runners is just a part of it.
Defense behind the plate is not comparable to a C. The is handling the entire pitching staff, he’s calling the game, heck Bassitt the other day hinted it took him quite a while to get comfortable throwing to Tomas Nido, one of the better defensive C in baseball. Mike Piazza had a weak arm but was actually regarded as a plus game called and at worst an average C (again outside of his arm which was unarguably poor).
Also, how would you compare someone like Alvarez at this point to Piazza (at any point). I think Piazza struggled to throw out baserunners, but was he a bad framer? passed balls? throwing out runners is just a part of it.
Piazza was good at blocking balls but that was all pre-framing so im not sure. I guess in those days we talked about catchers pitched like throwing to and i dont remember piazza being particularly well regarded or knocked in that regard (so neutral?).
the big thing i remember with him was constant discussion of ways to keep the bat in the lineup and pitchers making comments that whatever deficiencies he had on defense they wanted the bat in the lineup scoring runs for them.
Subsequent work by Baseball Prospectus analyst Max Marchi in 2012 and Baseball Info Solutions founder John Dewan in 2013 also supported the idea that Piazza’s presence improved his pitchers’ results, as Piazza was pleased to point out in his book. The more sophisticated our statistical tools become, the better Piazza appears, and the more accurate Glavine’s statement seems.
i think this is miss-framing (no pun intended) the objective.
Alvarez only needs to be competent.
Patrick Mazeika has been able to play catcher competently - miscommunications with Bassitt and all - and he has 39 sporadic MLB games having done so. 315 in the minors, so by the time Alvarez would in theory be in play for a call up he'd be at about half that.
James McCann needs to be a very good defensive catcher because if he's not that he's barely a big leaguer.
If Francisco Alvarez (or any other catcher) posts an 800-900 ops the bar for their defensive contribution is far lower. Especially as a young player.
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I completely disagree catching 1-2 times a week is going to be enough to really get him where he needs to be long-term. He's caught 128 professional games in his entire life. McCann himself (who would know more than you are I) noted to catch you need many reps and make many mistakes. McCann caught 331 minor league games before being called up and even then his reputation was as a below average defensive C. To suggest 1-2 games per week is enough to get Alvarez from "not ready" to catching routinely for a contender is pretty silly all due respect.
i think this is miss-framing (no pun intended) the objective.
Alvarez only needs to be competent.
Patrick Mazeika has been able to play catcher competently - miscommunications with Bassitt and all - and he has 39 sporadic MLB games having done so. 315 in the minors, so by the time Alvarez would in theory be in play for a call up he'd be at about half that.
James McCann needs to be a very good defensive catcher because if he's not that he's barely a big leaguer.
If Francisco Alvarez (or any other catcher) posts an 800-900 ops the bar for their defensive contribution is far lower. Especially as a young player.
Not in a pennant race it’s not. Max Scherzer almost certainly would prefer throwing to James McCann and his zero bat than throwing to a rookie learning on the job who will get 5 ab’s to impact the game. In fact I’d put significant money on that being the choice of SP’s in a big game in a pennant race
And as stealing bases becomes rarer, throwing becomes even less important. Obviously, you can't have a complete noodle-arm back there, but the difference in 24% vs 35% CS is negligible. That's what? About 1 extra SB every couple weeks?
His arm obviously was weak and for as long as he played his throwing motion was oddly long/never corrected/unable to correct it
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Throwing is somewhat overrated and Alvarez has a good arm but worth noting it hasn’t really translated into very good CS%. He’s thrown out 14/59 this season (24%) career he’s at 23%. Piazza as a big leaguer threw out 23% of runners for comparisons sake
And as stealing bases becomes rarer, throwing becomes even less important. Obviously, you can't have a complete noodle-arm back there, but the difference in 24% vs 35% CS is negligible. That's what? About 1 extra SB every couple weeks?
I couldn’t even tell you who the best throwing catchers in baseball are this year. This isn’t Rickey Henderson vs. Bob Boone.
Not in a pennant race it’s not. Max Scherzer almost certainly would prefer throwing to James McCann and his zero bat than throwing to a rookie learning on the job who will get 5 ab’s to impact the game. In fact I’d put significant money on that being the choice of SP’s in a big game in a pennant race
Dan i've been saying for months including in this thread that if alvarez comes up this year it's going to be to DH primarily. Even in that role I suspect they will give him a few starts at catcher because they are 1 injury away from possibly wanting him to play catcher over mazeika. unless he shows the aptitude to catch big league pitchers you are correct he will likely not see time there in any important games.
all of this is also why i said it was a bit of a missed opportunity to not let him catch Scherzer's rehab start because that was the rare valuable learning experience away from a big league game that mattered in the standings but that's a different discussion.
-McNeil back tonight
Sort of Wilmer Flores-like. There is a human element to athletes some of us sometimes don't consider (or care about) - and I'm not grandstanding or claiming I do, just sharing an observation.
Of reps and experience. Do they run him out there next season 40% of the time even if it’s to the detriment of the staff (as he learns on the job?) as for my Scherzer example, I think we all notice that 9/10 times a “personal catcher” for a specific pitcher (generally an ace who is given that luxury) its almost always a defensive dynamo/underwhelming bat and not vice versa. You don’t often see top pitchers “choosing” bat over glove types as their personal caddy
freeman got 6/162m (w/ CA state taxes)
freeman leaving the braves off a world series win was nearly tantamount to jeter leaving the yankees. you just don't expect something like that to happen for anything more than ridiculous financial differences.
i know it sounds crazy but i wonder if the 2 teams would just swap them. the LAD would get a player 3 years younger who presumably would have no issue getting traded back to CA.
Freeman has played better so maybe the Dodgers don't want to do it, but they'd stand to save some room against the luxury tax and maybe the Braves would kick in a prospect?
Sort of Wilmer Flores-like. There is a human element to athletes some of us sometimes don't consider (or care about) - and I'm not grandstanding or claiming I do, just sharing an observation.
His feelings sure appear legitimate and it’s a business but it was reported the Braves had very little communication with him once FA began. That’s their right but it’s can understand the conflict he must have been feeling. The Braves were his organization from 18-now and he (obviously along with his teammates) led them to a World Series title, he’s now with a team akin to an all-star team, I’m sure he’d love another ring but I can’t imagine he feels as connected to LAD.
freeman got 6/162m (w/ CA state taxes)
freeman leaving the braves off a world series win was nearly tantamount to jeter leaving the yankees. you just don't expect something like that to happen for anything more than ridiculous financial differences.
i know it sounds crazy but i wonder if the 2 teams would just swap them. the LAD would get a player 3 years younger who presumably would have no issue getting traded back to CA.
Freeman has played better so maybe the Dodgers don't want to do it, but they'd stand to save some room against the luxury tax and maybe the Braves would kick in a prospect?
Who knows what really went down but the way it’s been reported they kind of treated him oddly for an all-timer for that franchise and the money stuff was almost secondary. Maybe that narrative is coming from Freeman but his behavior/statements since then lead me to believe he’s being sincere
Of reps and experience. Do they run him out there next season 40% of the time even if it’s to the detriment of the staff (as he learns on the job?) as for my Scherzer example, I think we all notice that 9/10 times a “personal catcher” for a specific pitcher (generally an ace who is given that luxury) its almost always a defensive dynamo/underwhelming bat and not vice versa. You don’t often see top pitchers “choosing” bat over glove types as their personal caddy
yes to the bold. you can always replace him late in games if necessary. if Scherzer or Bassitt is just completely against throwing to him you work around that and let him catch for the less significant starters.
remember he will also get another full spring training and extra time to work on all the mental reps that go along with being a catcher which is outside of the game reps. catching fewer games will actually give him less to prep for and more time to be prepped for the games he gets. catching fewer pitchers would also give him less to have to process mentally.
you want an omelet you have to break some eggs. they won't need to force it in a pennant race since they have the DH option but next year there may be some growing pains. just as there may be some growing pains with Vientos.
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olson got 8/168m
freeman got 6/162m (w/ CA state taxes)
freeman leaving the braves off a world series win was nearly tantamount to jeter leaving the yankees. you just don't expect something like that to happen for anything more than ridiculous financial differences.
i know it sounds crazy but i wonder if the 2 teams would just swap them. the LAD would get a player 3 years younger who presumably would have no issue getting traded back to CA.
Freeman has played better so maybe the Dodgers don't want to do it, but they'd stand to save some room against the luxury tax and maybe the Braves would kick in a prospect?
Who knows what really went down but the way it’s been reported they kind of treated him oddly for an all-timer for that franchise and the money stuff was almost secondary. Maybe that narrative is coming from Freeman but his behavior/statements since then lead me to believe he’s being sincere
this is just a guess but since the NYY and LAD were 2 teams in it, I wonder if ATL just figured the only way he was coming back was if he told them that was his preference. They knew they couldn't win a bidding war.
maybe they didn't communicate their respect for him well but they only hurt themselves by doing so because they had to give out a similar contract, to a lesser player, and give up good prospects to do it. so they were incentivized for Freeman to want to choose them.
Pat Ragazzo @ragazzoreport
now
Outfielder Ender Inciarte has a locker at Citi Field and jersey No. 22. No roster move has been made yet by the Mets
He isnt ready to catch in a pennant race
@AnthonyDiComo
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43s
News: Max Scherzer's rehab start tonight has been postponed. No reason yet, but he's scheduled to throw tomorrow instead for Binghamton at Hartford.
Mangum may be done for the year FWIW