It is a lot if $, but the $ being thrown around is just insane. We live in a world where Tobias Harris is going to make $37 million this coming season.
RE: Good start to the offseason with Burks, Noel, and Walker all gone
was talked about on "Get Up" this morning. The consensus seemed to be that the Knicks were going to greatly overpay for Brunson by giving him $100M. I tend to agree. They seem to be desperate, especially for a PG. More proof of that was their desperate desire to try and get Ivey.
The Knicks need to draft better. Plenty of teams find really good players in the mid to late first round. The argument can't be that the draft is worthless unless you can make a top five pick.
How far does Brunson, RJB, and Obi get the Knicks, even if Obi gets a lot more minutes?
Don't watch Get Up looking for astute basketball analysis.
First, no one got clowned when Fred VanVleet got 21+Million a year. Now the Knicks are getting clowned for signing the best FA on the market for 5M more per year? And you could make a solid argument that Brunson is better than FVV anyway.
Second, how far does it take them? Not sure, but giving Brunson that money is definitely better than giving it to Kemba, Burks and Noel. That's really all that matters. When the Knicks sign Brunson he'll be paid like the 15th highest paid PG in the league, improve the team and the Knicks will still have every valuable asset they have to try and get a star to come to NY. They'll have made the team more competitive but still not a contender. Rose is clearly confident that one of these big stars will shake loose and we will be ready to try and land him.
Is not better than Brunson and it’s not even really close.
I really don’t see how this is an overpay for Brunson.
- he can be a lead guard or play off ball easily.
-he’s 25 and has gotten better every year in the league.
- he’s a good shooter and defender.
- he has won everywhere he’s played.
Fans and media are obsessed with contracts. I would love great players on bargain deals too but it doesn’t work like that. And when you get a free agent you typically have to overpay the current team.
I would bet he contends for an all star spot this year in the East.
RE: They're not paying Brunson 100mill to play off ball
He plays off ball in DAL because he plays with one of the top 5 players in the league who absolutely should start every possession with the ball. Not so, here in NY. He'll be the true PG here and he's outstanding as the PnR ball handler.
Totally agree. One of the major bonuses to Brunson is it takes the ball the hell out of Randle's hands, thank god.
Not going into that argument. But if that’s how you feel and a max is on the horizon then RJB needs to go. (I’m not saying I agree) but if you are maxing a player the Knicks better make sure it’s the right player. Or…. Eat another mistake an include him in a deal for a true max. You can only have a couple of max players (if you don’t draft well or if they are not willing to take a hair cut) so you better make sure they are true max players.
was talked about on "Get Up" this morning. The consensus seemed to be that the Knicks were going to greatly overpay for Brunson by giving him $100M. I tend to agree. They seem to be desperate, especially for a PG. More proof of that was their desperate desire to try and get Ivey.
The Knicks need to draft better. Plenty of teams find really good players in the mid to late first round. The argument can't be that the draft is worthless unless you can make a top five pick.
How far does Brunson, RJB, and Obi get the Knicks, even if Obi gets a lot more minutes?
How is it an overpay? he is going to be the 14th highest paid PG, how is that an overpay?
and why is it only Brunson, Rj and Obi?
Knicks have drafted well under Leon Rose and Walt Perrin
In January the Mavericks could have apparently resigned Brunson for 4/55. Now it's $100M. I know he played well in the playoffs, but that's quite an increase in a very short period of time. The price increase is also affected by the fact that the Knicks are desperate for a PG.
defer to others who know more. It just seems like a giant increase to me in a very short period of time. Hopefully, it works out, and maybe it will if it increases the chance that another good FA signs this year or next.
Brunson is in the middle of the pack for PG. (I know behind Luka and the stats). Let’s just hope he moves into the top 10. Now stat guys is there ever been a team to start (Brunson, RJB, Randle) three left handed players?
Would have to be a sign and trade and I know it was discussed a while back prior to the nets. Not sure if any promises were made by either side with Mitch. Do you? And was it lately?
was talked about on "Get Up" this morning. The consensus seemed to be that the Knicks were going to greatly overpay for Brunson by giving him $100M. I tend to agree. They seem to be desperate, especially for a PG. More proof of that was their desperate desire to try and get Ivey.
The Knicks need to draft better. Plenty of teams find really good players in the mid to late first round. The argument can't be that the draft is worthless unless you can make a top five pick.
How far does Brunson, RJB, and Obi get the Knicks, even if Obi gets a lot more minutes?
How is it an overpay? he is going to be the 14th highest paid PG, how is that an overpay?
and why is it only Brunson, Rj and Obi?
Knicks have drafted well under Leon Rose and Walt Perrin
In January the Mavericks could have apparently resigned Brunson for 4/55. Now it's $100M. I know he played well in the playoffs, but that's quite an increase in a very short period of time. The price increase is also affected by the fact that the Knicks are desperate for a PG.
The price increased because he was their 2nd best player the second half of the year and in the playoffs..
The Mavs are willing to go to 5 for 110 according to reports
I'm sure if they wanted to, they could make it happen but how would that work? Resign Mitch and trade for Ayton? How does Mitch, Ayton, Randle, Obi fit on the floor? Sign Mitch and send him there (BYC challenges?)? Trade Obi for Ayton? Randle? The fit seems tricky.
I'm trying to think of a situation where a talented up and coming player got run out of town like the Suns seem to be running Ayton out of town - where that player blossomed later. Take a chance on talent, of course, but wow that situation has real red flags for me.
RJ and Brunson shouldn't be at their full potential. I'm not so sure that it's a given Brunson is a better player and by a lot. Outside of a spurt with Rose(who came off the bench), RJ really hasn't had a good PG to work with.
I'm excited to see how these guys come into camp and what they've improved on.
You know who I'm a little excited about...Sims. He's been working with Randle and they both look jacked. I think Randle comes in super motivated and I think Sims takes a step forward. He was a little raw last year, but there is something about this kid that I really like. Seems very determined.
Fit on GS (Boston if no Williams) etc cause those teams have shooters. Ayton can actually stroke it for a big fella. We haven’t had a 5 who could shoot in some time.
was talked about on "Get Up" this morning. The consensus seemed to be that the Knicks were going to greatly overpay for Brunson by giving him $100M. I tend to agree. They seem to be desperate, especially for a PG. More proof of that was their desperate desire to try and get Ivey.
The Knicks need to draft better. Plenty of teams find really good players in the mid to late first round. The argument can't be that the draft is worthless unless you can make a top five pick.
How far does Brunson, RJB, and Obi get the Knicks, even if Obi gets a lot more minutes?
How is it an overpay? he is going to be the 14th highest paid PG, how is that an overpay?
and why is it only Brunson, Rj and Obi?
Knicks have drafted well under Leon Rose and Walt Perrin
In January the Mavericks could have apparently resigned Brunson for 4/55. Now it's $100M. I know he played well in the playoffs, but that's quite an increase in a very short period of time. The price increase is also affected by the fact that the Knicks are desperate for a PG.
I think you have that backwards. From what I’ve read, the Mavs OFFERED Brunson 4-$55M and he declined
I sure hope so. But there's been so much noise around our pursuit of Brunson. So much that I'm pretty much expecting a tampering complaint from Dallas at some point. But there's been no public chatter on Ayton.
was talked about on "Get Up" this morning. The consensus seemed to be that the Knicks were going to greatly overpay for Brunson by giving him $100M. I tend to agree. They seem to be desperate, especially for a PG. More proof of that was their desperate desire to try and get Ivey.
The Knicks need to draft better. Plenty of teams find really good players in the mid to late first round. The argument can't be that the draft is worthless unless you can make a top five pick.
How far does Brunson, RJB, and Obi get the Knicks, even if Obi gets a lot more minutes?
How is it an overpay? he is going to be the 14th highest paid PG, how is that an overpay?
and why is it only Brunson, Rj and Obi?
Knicks have drafted well under Leon Rose and Walt Perrin
In January the Mavericks could have apparently resigned Brunson for 4/55. Now it's $100M. I know he played well in the playoffs, but that's quite an increase in a very short period of time. The price increase is also affected by the fact that the Knicks are desperate for a PG.
I think you have that backwards. From what I’ve read, the Mavs OFFERED Brunson 4-$55M and he declined
I heard that's what Brunson asked for, but as I said, I will defer to others who know more.
its contingent on a max deal. What do you guys think about Ayton on a max deal. The suns don't seem all that interested and it doesn't seem like anyone else is all that interested either.
I don’t see Brunson as a true point. More of a scoring guard. With Randle and Barrett on the team, they will be more of your primary ball handlers and Brunson will play off of them much like he did with Luka.
And what do you do with Quick off the bench? Another player who needs the ball to be effective.
The Randle at pt fwd experiment was a failure. We need a real PG and Randle needs to handle the ball much less.
its contingent on a max deal. What do you guys think about Ayton on a max deal. The suns don't seem all that interested and it doesn't seem like anyone else is all that interested either.
I wouldnt hate it, he has more to his game than shown in Phoenix because Booker and CP3 are there and i dont think the Suns letting Ayton leave is so much a discredit of Ayton but it just shows how cheap Sarver is..
Suns are going to take a major step back next year
And for the few who think Brunson is better than RJ…. You’re going to be very disappointed in results then. Brunson benefited playing next to a top 5 player in the game. It’s different situations but RJ is a much, much better player.
And for the few who think Brunson is better than RJ…. You’re going to be very disappointed in results then. Brunson benefited playing next to a top 5 player in the game. It’s different situations but RJ is a much, much better player.
His numbers were better when he was on the court without Luka
I don’t see Brunson as a true point. More of a scoring guard. With Randle and Barrett on the team, they will be more of your primary ball handlers and Brunson will play off of them much like he did with Luka.
And what do you do with Quick off the bench? Another player who needs the ball to be effective.
The Randle at pt fwd experiment was a failure. We need a real PG and Randle needs to handle the ball much less.
RJ should have the ball more in his hands.
I think you need Randle off the team totally to maximize Brunson, RJ, and IQ.
And for the few who think Brunson is better than RJ…. You’re going to be very disappointed in results then. Brunson benefited playing next to a top 5 player in the game. It’s different situations but RJ is a much, much better player.
His numbers were better when he was on the court without Luka
And for the few who think Brunson is better than RJ…. You’re going to be very disappointed in results then. Brunson benefited playing next to a top 5 player in the game. It’s different situations but RJ is a much, much better player.
Brunsons numbers were better when Luka didn’t play, so that doesn’t support the idea that he was benefited by playing next to a top 5 player. The idea that RJ is much better than Brunson is a tough case to make. At this point in their careers they are pretty close, both have All Star potential, but the advantage on RJs side is he is much younger so likely has the higher ceiling.
but ill pass. I said the same yesterday. I just dont want to pay him 33 mill or whatever his max is. I see him as embiid lite and i dont think embiid lite is the best player on a good team and at that salary i want to think he will be my best player. You will very quickly be locked into a core of Bruson, RJ, and Ayton. RJ and Ayton would have to make bit strides for that to be a true contender.
That said if we did get him, id be excited just cause he does make us better. He is a good NBA center, just not a guy that should make superstar money
Was surrounded by shooters in Dallas - THJR, Finney, Kleber, Bullock. Perfect for his game.
Coming to the Knicks with JR, RJ, And Mitch - lot of non shooting and lane clogging. Brunson is a better shooter than RJ - will create gaps and opportunities for RJ to drive and kick.
If Brunson signs - his game will be optimize without JR and Mitch. I don’t like the fit with Jalen and those 2.
Averages high teens (call it 17). Will shoot over 60%. Besides rim diving off PNRs, he's got a solid shot from 12-15 and will knock down 75% of FTs. Has been north of 10 in rebounds every year of his career.
Has improved his defense (not saying he's great, but he's statistically a tad better than average).
His playoff stats almost exactly match his in season stats.
Ya think about CP3? I always felt his leadership was overrated. He seems more like an insufferable prick than a good teammate.
We’re on the same page. Dude has played for a lot of teams and is very demanding. And once your game goes south, like CP3 did in the playoffs, that type of leadership becomes stand offish
@ShamsCharania
Denver is nearing trading Monte Morris and Will Barton to Washington in deal for Kentavious Caldwell-Pope and Ish Smith, sources tell @TheAthletic
This trade is awful. Nuggets save 5 mill to get two worse players. Contracts are basically the same except Morris is signed for another season after this one.
Averages high teens (call it 17). Will shoot over 60%. Besides rim diving off PNRs, he's got a solid shot from 12-15 and will knock down 75% of FTs. Has been north of 10 in rebounds every year of his career.
Has improved his defense (not saying he's great, but he's statistically a tad better than average).
His playoff stats almost exactly match his in season stats.
Im not the biggest Mitch fan, but if i can get mitch for 12 mill or Ayton for 33 mill i prolly lean Mitch. Better defender, probably similar rebounder, neither are 3 point shooters. Yes Ayton's offensive game is LIGHT YEARS ahead of Mitch, but you lose for mitch for nothing and pay ayton 20 mill more, so he can hit the 12 footer? Ehh, i dont love it.
Averages high teens (call it 17). Will shoot over 60%. Besides rim diving off PNRs, he's got a solid shot from 12-15 and will knock down 75% of FTs. Has been north of 10 in rebounds every year of his career.
Has improved his defense (not saying he's great, but he's statistically a tad better than average).
His playoff stats almost exactly match his in season stats.
Yeah. Salary cap relief which will be used to sign Brunson
Now if they can somehow dump Fournier, who never should have been signed in the first place. I was pining hard for DeMar DeRozan
The Knicks need to draft better. Plenty of teams find really good players in the mid to late first round. The argument can't be that the draft is worthless unless you can make a top five pick.
How far does Brunson, RJB, and Obi get the Knicks, even if Obi gets a lot more minutes?
Don't watch Get Up looking for astute basketball analysis.
First, no one got clowned when Fred VanVleet got 21+Million a year. Now the Knicks are getting clowned for signing the best FA on the market for 5M more per year? And you could make a solid argument that Brunson is better than FVV anyway.
Second, how far does it take them? Not sure, but giving Brunson that money is definitely better than giving it to Kemba, Burks and Noel. That's really all that matters. When the Knicks sign Brunson he'll be paid like the 15th highest paid PG in the league, improve the team and the Knicks will still have every valuable asset they have to try and get a star to come to NY. They'll have made the team more competitive but still not a contender. Rose is clearly confident that one of these big stars will shake loose and we will be ready to try and land him.
I really don’t see how this is an overpay for Brunson.
- he can be a lead guard or play off ball easily.
-he’s 25 and has gotten better every year in the league.
- he’s a good shooter and defender.
- he has won everywhere he’s played.
Fans and media are obsessed with contracts. I would love great players on bargain deals too but it doesn’t work like that. And when you get a free agent you typically have to overpay the current team.
I would bet he contends for an all star spot this year in the East.
Totally agree. One of the major bonuses to Brunson is it takes the ball the hell out of Randle's hands, thank god.
Quote:
was talked about on "Get Up" this morning. The consensus seemed to be that the Knicks were going to greatly overpay for Brunson by giving him $100M. I tend to agree. They seem to be desperate, especially for a PG. More proof of that was their desperate desire to try and get Ivey.
The Knicks need to draft better. Plenty of teams find really good players in the mid to late first round. The argument can't be that the draft is worthless unless you can make a top five pick.
How far does Brunson, RJB, and Obi get the Knicks, even if Obi gets a lot more minutes?
How is it an overpay? he is going to be the 14th highest paid PG, how is that an overpay?
and why is it only Brunson, Rj and Obi?
Knicks have drafted well under Leon Rose and Walt Perrin
In January the Mavericks could have apparently resigned Brunson for 4/55. Now it's $100M. I know he played well in the playoffs, but that's quite an increase in a very short period of time. The price increase is also affected by the fact that the Knicks are desperate for a PG.
Glad to hear this. He’s a good player, and a much better fit than Murray.
Quote:
In comment 15743396 AcidTest said:
Quote:
was talked about on "Get Up" this morning. The consensus seemed to be that the Knicks were going to greatly overpay for Brunson by giving him $100M. I tend to agree. They seem to be desperate, especially for a PG. More proof of that was their desperate desire to try and get Ivey.
The Knicks need to draft better. Plenty of teams find really good players in the mid to late first round. The argument can't be that the draft is worthless unless you can make a top five pick.
How far does Brunson, RJB, and Obi get the Knicks, even if Obi gets a lot more minutes?
How is it an overpay? he is going to be the 14th highest paid PG, how is that an overpay?
and why is it only Brunson, Rj and Obi?
Knicks have drafted well under Leon Rose and Walt Perrin
In January the Mavericks could have apparently resigned Brunson for 4/55. Now it's $100M. I know he played well in the playoffs, but that's quite an increase in a very short period of time. The price increase is also affected by the fact that the Knicks are desperate for a PG.
The price increased because he was their 2nd best player the second half of the year and in the playoffs..
The Mavs are willing to go to 5 for 110 according to reports
Interesting. He certainly is a distressed asset.
I'm sure if they wanted to, they could make it happen but how would that work? Resign Mitch and trade for Ayton? How does Mitch, Ayton, Randle, Obi fit on the floor? Sign Mitch and send him there (BYC challenges?)? Trade Obi for Ayton? Randle? The fit seems tricky.
I'm trying to think of a situation where a talented up and coming player got run out of town like the Suns seem to be running Ayton out of town - where that player blossomed later. Take a chance on talent, of course, but wow that situation has real red flags for me.
would love it but there are reports Mitch is basically a done deal
I'm excited to see how these guys come into camp and what they've improved on.
You know who I'm a little excited about...Sims. He's been working with Randle and they both look jacked. I think Randle comes in super motivated and I think Sims takes a step forward. He was a little raw last year, but there is something about this kid that I really like. Seems very determined.
Quote:
In comment 15743396 AcidTest said:
Quote:
was talked about on "Get Up" this morning. The consensus seemed to be that the Knicks were going to greatly overpay for Brunson by giving him $100M. I tend to agree. They seem to be desperate, especially for a PG. More proof of that was their desperate desire to try and get Ivey.
The Knicks need to draft better. Plenty of teams find really good players in the mid to late first round. The argument can't be that the draft is worthless unless you can make a top five pick.
How far does Brunson, RJB, and Obi get the Knicks, even if Obi gets a lot more minutes?
How is it an overpay? he is going to be the 14th highest paid PG, how is that an overpay?
and why is it only Brunson, Rj and Obi?
Knicks have drafted well under Leon Rose and Walt Perrin
In January the Mavericks could have apparently resigned Brunson for 4/55. Now it's $100M. I know he played well in the playoffs, but that's quite an increase in a very short period of time. The price increase is also affected by the fact that the Knicks are desperate for a PG.
I think you have that backwards. From what I’ve read, the Mavs OFFERED Brunson 4-$55M and he declined
I sure hope so. But there's been so much noise around our pursuit of Brunson. So much that I'm pretty much expecting a tampering complaint from Dallas at some point. But there's been no public chatter on Ayton.
Quote:
In comment 15743398 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
In comment 15743396 AcidTest said:
Quote:
was talked about on "Get Up" this morning. The consensus seemed to be that the Knicks were going to greatly overpay for Brunson by giving him $100M. I tend to agree. They seem to be desperate, especially for a PG. More proof of that was their desperate desire to try and get Ivey.
The Knicks need to draft better. Plenty of teams find really good players in the mid to late first round. The argument can't be that the draft is worthless unless you can make a top five pick.
How far does Brunson, RJB, and Obi get the Knicks, even if Obi gets a lot more minutes?
How is it an overpay? he is going to be the 14th highest paid PG, how is that an overpay?
and why is it only Brunson, Rj and Obi?
Knicks have drafted well under Leon Rose and Walt Perrin
In January the Mavericks could have apparently resigned Brunson for 4/55. Now it's $100M. I know he played well in the playoffs, but that's quite an increase in a very short period of time. The price increase is also affected by the fact that the Knicks are desperate for a PG.
I think you have that backwards. From what I’ve read, the Mavs OFFERED Brunson 4-$55M and he declined
I heard that's what Brunson asked for, but as I said, I will defer to others who know more.
Quote:
.
would love it but there are reports Mitch is basically a done deal
They could always sign and trade Mitch somewhere if they could close on Ayton.
Just a hunch, but of all the “what could the next move be” it’s one of the few options that could work.
And what do you do with Quick off the bench? Another player who needs the ball to be effective.
The Randle at pt fwd experiment was a failure. We need a real PG and Randle needs to handle the ball much less.
I wouldnt hate it, he has more to his game than shown in Phoenix because Booker and CP3 are there and i dont think the Suns letting Ayton leave is so much a discredit of Ayton but it just shows how cheap Sarver is..
Suns are going to take a major step back next year
I'd think Mitch would be a good cheaper option for the Suns in a sign and trade.
I'd think Mitch would be a good cheaper option for the Suns in a sign and trade.
Its true but i think Ayton has more to his game than just bring set up by a Point
And for the few who think Brunson is better than RJ…. You’re going to be very disappointed in results then. Brunson benefited playing next to a top 5 player in the game. It’s different situations but RJ is a much, much better player.
And for the few who think Brunson is better than RJ…. You’re going to be very disappointed in results then. Brunson benefited playing next to a top 5 player in the game. It’s different situations but RJ is a much, much better player.
His numbers were better when he was on the court without Luka
Quote:
I don’t see Brunson as a true point. More of a scoring guard. With Randle and Barrett on the team, they will be more of your primary ball handlers and Brunson will play off of them much like he did with Luka.
And what do you do with Quick off the bench? Another player who needs the ball to be effective.
The Randle at pt fwd experiment was a failure. We need a real PG and Randle needs to handle the ball much less.
RJ should have the ball more in his hands.
I think you need Randle off the team totally to maximize Brunson, RJ, and IQ.
Quote:
Over Mitch. If you can get him, you get him.
And for the few who think Brunson is better than RJ…. You’re going to be very disappointed in results then. Brunson benefited playing next to a top 5 player in the game. It’s different situations but RJ is a much, much better player.
His numbers were better when he was on the court without Luka
Sample size my friend.
And for the few who think Brunson is better than RJ…. You’re going to be very disappointed in results then. Brunson benefited playing next to a top 5 player in the game. It’s different situations but RJ is a much, much better player.
Brunsons numbers were better when Luka didn’t play, so that doesn’t support the idea that he was benefited by playing next to a top 5 player. The idea that RJ is much better than Brunson is a tough case to make. At this point in their careers they are pretty close, both have All Star potential, but the advantage on RJs side is he is much younger so likely has the higher ceiling.
That said if we did get him, id be excited just cause he does make us better. He is a good NBA center, just not a guy that should make superstar money
Coming to the Knicks with JR, RJ, And Mitch - lot of non shooting and lane clogging. Brunson is a better shooter than RJ - will create gaps and opportunities for RJ to drive and kick.
If Brunson signs - his game will be optimize without JR and Mitch. I don’t like the fit with Jalen and those 2.
He was kind of a dud in this years playoffs....
If he ever got his head straight he would be a complete force
Quote:
work ethic.
He was kind of a dud in this years playoffs....
Monty used him as a scapegoat for CP3 meltdown. For as great as a leader CP3 is touted - I bet he wears out his welcome quick with teammates.
Has improved his defense (not saying he's great, but he's statistically a tad better than average).
His playoff stats almost exactly match his in season stats.
We’re on the same page. Dude has played for a lot of teams and is very demanding. And once your game goes south, like CP3 did in the playoffs, that type of leadership becomes stand offish
JJ Redick basically admitted this and i thinj Matt Barnes as well
Link - ( New Window )
Denver is nearing trading Monte Morris and Will Barton to Washington in deal for Kentavious Caldwell-Pope and Ish Smith, sources tell @TheAthletic
This trade is awful. Nuggets save 5 mill to get two worse players. Contracts are basically the same except Morris is signed for another season after this one.
Has improved his defense (not saying he's great, but he's statistically a tad better than average).
His playoff stats almost exactly match his in season stats.
Im not the biggest Mitch fan, but if i can get mitch for 12 mill or Ayton for 33 mill i prolly lean Mitch. Better defender, probably similar rebounder, neither are 3 point shooters. Yes Ayton's offensive game is LIGHT YEARS ahead of Mitch, but you lose for mitch for nothing and pay ayton 20 mill more, so he can hit the 12 footer? Ehh, i dont love it.
Has improved his defense (not saying he's great, but he's statistically a tad better than average).
His playoff stats almost exactly match his in season stats.
I'm sold...can we afford him?