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NFT: A League of Their Own

26.2 : 7/1/2022 11:12 am
Released 30 years ago today. One of my favorite sports movies (mainly b/c of Tom Hanks).

I've always wanted to tell someone that they look like a penis with a little hat on, but unfortunately I've never had the right opportunity.
Link - ( New Window )
Jimmy: Sir, I've quite drinking.  
bceagle05 : 7/1/2022 11:17 am : link
Mr. Harvey: You've seen the error of your ways?
Jimmy: No, I just can't afford it.
"Ok some of dem are goin home"  
Stu11 : 7/1/2022 11:19 am : link
Awesome movie. I always loved it, but it's been a whole new level watching it over and over with my 17yo daughter whole loves sports. Tour de force performances by so many- obviously Hanks but also Rosie O'Donnell, and he's only in it for like 20 minutes or so but Jon Lovitz' was great with his never ending machine gun stream of one liners. "Ladies see this is how it works- the train moves, not the platform..."
Maybe my favorite sports movie.  
bceagle05 : 7/1/2022 11:20 am : link
One of those movies where everything came together - funny, dramatic, great story, culturally significant, perfect casting. Holds up really well to this day.
RE:  
26.2 : 7/1/2022 11:25 am : link
In comment 15745674 Stu11 said:
Quote:
Awesome movie. I always loved it, but it's been a whole new level watching it over and over with my 17yo daughter whole loves sports. Tour de force performances by so many- obviously Hanks but also Rosie O'Donnell, and he's only in it for like 20 minutes or so but Jon Lovitz' was great with his never ending machine gun stream of one liners. "Ladies see this is how it works- the train moves, not the platform..."


Lovitz was great! "Gonna go home and give my wife a pickle tickle." LOFL
Avoid the Clap - Jimmy Duggan  
Anakim : 7/1/2022 11:26 am : link
That's good advice!



Love that movie and I had such a huge crush on one of the players (I think her name was Ellen Sue or something. The Southern blonde). I hated the ending and there's that whole theory that Dottie dropped the ball on purpose, but I'd rather have seen Rockford win and Kit fade into oblivion.
RE:  
Anakim : 7/1/2022 11:27 am : link
In comment 15745674 Stu11 said:
Quote:
Awesome movie. I always loved it, but it's been a whole new level watching it over and over with my 17yo daughter whole loves sports. Tour de force performances by so many- obviously Hanks but also Rosie O'Donnell, and he's only in it for like 20 minutes or so but Jon Lovitz' was great with his never ending machine gun stream of one liners. "Ladies see this is how it works- the train moves, not the platform..."


You know General Omar Bradley? Well, there's too strong of a resemblance.
you missed the cutoff…  
bluefin : 7/1/2022 11:29 am : link
Hey cow girls. see that grass?  
Greg from LI : 7/1/2022 11:30 am : link
Don't eat it!
You starting using your head!  
bceagle05 : 7/1/2022 11:33 am : link
That's that lump that's three feet above your ass!
.  
arcarsenal : 7/1/2022 11:37 am : link
Almost positive it was the first movie I saw in the theatres. True classic.
How it works is  
JerseyCityJoe : 7/1/2022 11:40 am : link
The train moves not the station.
RE: You starting using your head!  
Stu11 : 7/1/2022 11:40 am : link
In comment 15745702 bceagle05 said:
Quote:
That's that lump that's three feet above your ass!

" Some are more prominent than others Doros"🤣😂
Lovitz' character was a great example of how to use a  
Mad Mike : 7/1/2022 11:41 am : link
supporting character. Too much of him would probably have gotten annoying - he was great while he was there, and then they moved on.
Big Yankee Fan Here  
LTIsTheGreatest : 7/1/2022 11:58 am : link
When haters bitch and moan about the Yanks success this year or try to undermine it with lame excuses I love to defer to the line "THERE'S NO CRYING IN BASEBALL!!"
Love this movie!  
JCin332 : 7/1/2022 12:19 pm : link
..
Fantastic movie...  
moze1021 : 7/1/2022 12:23 pm : link
I think it's time to watch it with my kids!!

Also of note, for those unaware.. Amazon will soon be releasing a series based on the movie (new characters, new storylines)

It comes out in August.

D'Arcy Carden (aka Janis) is part of the cast!
RE: Fantastic movie...  
Jim in Tampa : 7/1/2022 12:32 pm : link
In comment 15745774 moze1021 said:
Quote:
I think it's time to watch it with my kids!!

Also of note, for those unaware.. Amazon will soon be releasing a series based on the movie (new characters, new storylines)

It comes out in August.

D'Arcy Carden (aka Janis) is part of the cast!

Here's a link to the Amazon trailer.

TV Series - ( New Window )
Also as part of the 30th anniversary  
Stu11 : 7/1/2022 12:43 pm : link
This guy visited the Marka Hootch actress and did a piece on her. She can still rake!
Link - ( New Window )
...  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 7/1/2022 12:50 pm : link
Never seen this movie.
Penny Marshall  
mattlawson : 7/1/2022 12:57 pm : link
Give her credit it’s a great fucking movie
Little Kid:  
bradshaw44 : 7/1/2022 1:11 pm : link
"Avoid the Clap."

-Jimmy Duggan

Duggan: HEY, that's good advice!!



After he signs the baseball for the little kid. Hilarious.
RE: Avoid the Clap - Jimmy Duggan  
bradshaw44 : 7/1/2022 1:11 pm : link
In comment 15745686 Anakim said:
Quote:
That's good advice!



Love that movie and I had such a huge crush on one of the players (I think her name was Ellen Sue or something. The Southern blonde). I hated the ending and there's that whole theory that Dottie dropped the ball on purpose, but I'd rather have seen Rockford win and Kit fade into oblivion.


Damn it, just saw this. You beat me
I always thought that in the end of the movie  
bradshaw44 : 7/1/2022 1:13 pm : link
that the actress was Gina Davis with old person make up on. But it turns out that is a totally different woman.

I also thought they did a good job with the Kit elderly woman actress.
I will never get tired of that movie  
Jay on the Island : 7/1/2022 1:28 pm : link
Tom Hanks was so incredible.
RE: I always thought that in the end of the movie  
GF1080 : 7/1/2022 1:33 pm : link
In comment 15745822 bradshaw44 said:
Quote:
that the actress was Gina Davis with old person make up on. But it turns out that is a totally different woman.

I also thought they did a good job with the Kit elderly woman actress.


Wait really?!?!? I thought that was Davis.
According to Imdb...  
JohnG in Albany : 7/1/2022 1:39 pm : link
Lynn Cartwright played "Older Dottie" and Kathleen Butler played "Older Kit".

Terrific movie.
RE: RE: I always thought that in the end of the movie  
bradshaw44 : 7/1/2022 1:48 pm : link
In comment 15745834 GF1080 said:
Quote:
In comment 15745822 bradshaw44 said:


Quote:


that the actress was Gina Davis with old person make up on. But it turns out that is a totally different woman.

I also thought they did a good job with the Kit elderly woman actress.



Wait really?!?!? I thought that was Davis.


Blew my mind when I found this out. I only learned that about a year ago.
RE: RE: RE: I always thought that in the end of the movie  
GF1080 : 7/1/2022 1:59 pm : link
In comment 15745849 bradshaw44 said:
Quote:
In comment 15745834 GF1080 said:


Quote:


In comment 15745822 bradshaw44 said:


Quote:


that the actress was Gina Davis with old person make up on. But it turns out that is a totally different woman.

I also thought they did a good job with the Kit elderly woman actress.



Wait really?!?!? I thought that was Davis.



Blew my mind when I found this out. I only learned that about a year ago.


I'm experiencing that now so I believe it. Wow.
My uncle is a Braves fan who despises the Mets  
Greg from LI : 7/1/2022 2:03 pm : link
He used to always call Mike Piazza "Big Dottie Hinson", which was so tired and stupid that it was perversely hilarious.
RE: Also as part of the 30th anniversary  
Matt M. : 7/1/2022 2:05 pm : link
In comment 15745800 Stu11 said:
Quote:
This guy visited the Marka Hootch actress and did a piece on her. She can still rake! Link - ( New Window )
That's what you call raking?
RE: My uncle is a Braves fan who despises the Mets  
moze1021 : 7/1/2022 2:11 pm : link
In comment 15745864 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
He used to always call Mike Piazza "Big Dottie Hinson", which was so tired and stupid that it was perversely hilarious.


Yeah... kinda ridiculous.. I mean, Dottie could throw.
" That was some peeing"  
gtt350 : 7/1/2022 5:38 pm : link
.
RE: RE: I always thought that in the end of the movie  
BlackLight : 7/2/2022 3:32 am : link
In comment 15745834 GF1080 said:
Quote:
In comment 15745822 bradshaw44 said:


Quote:


that the actress was Gina Davis with old person make up on. But it turns out that is a totally different woman.

I also thought they did a good job with the Kit elderly woman actress.



Wait really?!?!? I thought that was Davis.


My understanding is that Davis dubbed in the dialogue for Older Dottie with her own voice. All the more impressive because you can't even tell. It's perfectly synched.

Also one of the better sports movie debates of all time - did Dottie drop the ball at the end on purpose (I still say no).
RE: RE: Also as part of the 30th anniversary  
BlackLight : 7/2/2022 3:37 am : link
In comment 15745867 Matt M. said:
Quote:
In comment 15745800 Stu11 said:


Quote:


This guy visited the Marka Hootch actress and did a piece on her. She can still rake! Link - ( New Window )

That's what you call raking?


For a 61-year-old woman, sure.
Where are you going?  
Jimmy Googs : 7/2/2022 7:54 am : link
Oh, I am just going to go home, grab a shower and a shave, and give the wife a little pickle tickle...
Great movie!  
Tom from LI : 7/2/2022 8:52 am : link
I love that time period. Life was so simple. Ron Howards dad listening to the radio.

I thought it was a cool thing that Dottie did by dropping the ball in the world series when her sister collided into her.

She never dropped it before and she did it for her sister because that was the life she wanted and Dottie didn't want.

It's a feel good movie.

Honorable mention... Betty Spaghetti was a hottie. I know that was Penny Marshall's real life daughter.

My favorite all time movie or at least in my top 3 is Cinderella Man.
Look up Don Zimmer’s 1962 Topps baseball card  
Dave in PA : 7/2/2022 8:57 am : link
A very Duganesque picture
RE: My uncle is a Braves fan who despises the Mets  
ColHowPepper : 7/2/2022 9:07 am : link
In comment 15745864 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
He used to always call Mike Piazza "Big Dottie Hinson", which was so tired and stupid that it was perversely hilarious.

That is funny. Wife and I watched last night for the first time. Thanks for this thread, 26.2 !!

It was so unabashedly full of schamaltz that I couldn't help but love it. And oddly touching for some BBIers reacting as if hit over the head by a 2x4 when they found out elderly Dottie was not played by Geena Davis. (Also seemed to me that Straithairn ('Good Night and Good Luck') did not play elderly Ira.) The final scenes of HOF induction with the sepia-like photos of yesteryear pulled at my strings. Silly me.

But the film could not have worked had the Rockford Peaches--those acting them--not looked as if they could 'play some ball'. Probably a combo of adroit editing and some athleticism on their part, even Rosie, and look at Madonna! Only Kit's delivery fell short for me.
Jon Lovitz stole the show.  
MadPlaid : 7/2/2022 10:03 am : link
So funny. He improved yelling at the cow to Shut up! Brilliant.

The dance sequence in the club is one of my favorite parts. Madonna got to swing dance with the Big Ragoo. Awesome.

And, Lord, I’d like to thank you for that waitress in South Bend, You know who she is, she kept calling your name.
RE: RE: RE: I always thought that in the end of the movie  
bradshaw44 : 7/2/2022 9:37 pm : link
In comment 15746176 BlackLight said:
Quote:
In comment 15745834 GF1080 said:


Quote:


In comment 15745822 bradshaw44 said:


Quote:


that the actress was Gina Davis with old person make up on. But it turns out that is a totally different woman.

I also thought they did a good job with the Kit elderly woman actress.



Wait really?!?!? I thought that was Davis.



My understanding is that Davis dubbed in the dialogue for Older Dottie with her own voice. All the more impressive because you can't even tell. It's perfectly synched.

Also one of the better sports movie debates of all time - did Dottie drop the ball at the end on purpose (I still say no).


That’s a debate? It was clear she did it intentionally. It is eluded to multiple times after the fact. Like when Dottie says “Look at how happy she is”. She definitely did it on purpose. She also talked about how the league meant so much more to Kit then it did for her. She was helping out her kid sister.
I think it’s debatable.  
bceagle05 : 7/2/2022 9:49 pm : link
Dottie told her pitcher to pitch to Kit’s weakness - high fastballs - just a few moments earlier, so she wasn’t showing much mercy. And their relationship was not good at that point.
When they showed the real players at the end credits  
Greg from LI : 7/2/2022 10:30 pm : link
Most of them looked pretty good out on the field for ladies who must have been at least in their 70s at the time.
RE: RE: RE: RE: I always thought that in the end of the movie  
BlackLight : 7/3/2022 4:24 am : link
In comment 15746549 bradshaw44 said:
Quote:
In comment 15746176 BlackLight said:


Quote:


In comment 15745834 GF1080 said:


Quote:


In comment 15745822 bradshaw44 said:


Quote:


that the actress was Gina Davis with old person make up on. But it turns out that is a totally different woman.

I also thought they did a good job with the Kit elderly woman actress.



Wait really?!?!? I thought that was Davis.



My understanding is that Davis dubbed in the dialogue for Older Dottie with her own voice. All the more impressive because you can't even tell. It's perfectly synched.

Also one of the better sports movie debates of all time - did Dottie drop the ball at the end on purpose (I still say no).



That’s a debate? It was clear she did it intentionally. It is eluded to multiple times after the fact. Like when Dottie says “Look at how happy she is”. She definitely did it on purpose. She also talked about how the league meant so much more to Kit then it did for her. She was helping out her kid sister.


As somebody else said, she told Betty Spaghetti to pitch to Kit's weakness, so she was clearly wanting to win. Nothing happened between that moment and Kit rounding third that justifies a decision to drop the ball on purpose.

The game definitely meant more to Kit than it did to Dottie, but it meant enough to Dottie that she came back for Game 7, and all to intentionally throw the game with one out to go?
This is really a good debate  
Matt M. : 7/3/2022 1:26 pm : link
It always bothered me that she dropped the ball. I was never quite sure if it was on purpose or she just got beat by Kitt this one time because she wanted it more. Either way I didn't like it, but it bothers me more if she dropped it on purpose.

I may have to watch this movie again. When I first saw it years ago, I liked it, but didn't love it. Maybe it's worth another look.
RE: This is really a good debate  
Mike in NY : 7/3/2022 1:34 pm : link
In comment 15746758 Matt M. said:
Quote:
It always bothered me that she dropped the ball. I was never quite sure if it was on purpose or she just got beat by Kitt this one time because she wanted it more. Either way I didn't like it, but it bothers me more if she dropped it on purpose.

I may have to watch this movie again. When I first saw it years ago, I liked it, but didn't love it. Maybe it's worth another look.


I saw a Zoom call with some of the cast and Sweeny Murti. It was purposely supposed to be ambiguous why the ball was dropped.
I don't believe she would drop it on purpose  
steve in ky : 7/3/2022 1:37 pm : link
First of all she told the pitcher, "high fastball, she can't hit them and she can't lay off them", She wanted the win and was using every edge against her sister to get it.

Secondly throughout the entire movie she was ultra competitive, it would be entirely against character to throw the game.

Thirdly, it would be against character for her to do that to her coach and teammates.

Lastly, going back to the play she never expected her to hit it, and she looked shocked when she did and as the play unfolded before her. At no point did she give any indication she saw her sister scoring as a possible outcome.

She simply dropped it after the contact.
Black Light and steve in ky make pretty persuasive  
ColHowPepper : 7/3/2022 1:47 pm : link
arguments, so I asked my wife (she has sisters) and advised her of BL's and steve's reasons.

She said, all true, but with her sister rounding 3rd and about literally to hold Kit's fate in her hand, it was in her power to drop the ball and elevate Kit. In effect, my wife was saying, love of her sister and big sister bridging the bitter divide that had grown between them.

I kind of lean to this as well, if only because in (I think) the slow mo of Dottie crashing backward and her shoulder and forearm landing hard, the grip on the horsehide releases when hand and wrist are on the ground, not on impact, which is when you'd expect the ball to be knocked loose.
I found this  
steve in ky : 7/3/2022 2:00 pm : link
Quote:
My mom, Helen Callaghan — Geena Davis’ character Dottie Hinson was loosely based on her — was the AAGPBL batting champion in 1945. She didn’t keep much memorabilia from her playing days, but she did have a worn-out leather glove that she liked to use whenever we played catch together when I was young. I took her to see Marshall’s film when it came out in the summer of 1992, not long before she died of cancer. She loved it and felt that Penny had “got it right.” But she added that she would never drop a ball on purpose — not for anyone — as Dottie does in the movie’s big-game climatic scene. It would have been a betrayal of her teammates.

Link - ( New Window )
Also for those that watched it more recently  
steve in ky : 7/3/2022 2:09 pm : link
wasn't there a scene when Dottie was older and her grand kids were playing basketball and she told the older one to remember that his younger brother is littler and to let him get some shots, but then pulls him aside and whispers to him to "kill him".

If I'm remembering correctly that kind of gives an example of her and Kit's relationship. She loved her and wanted her to have her chance, but wouldn't do anything not to bury her when playing against her.
RE: I found this  
Matt M. : 7/3/2022 2:10 pm : link
In comment 15746768 steve in ky said:
Quote:


Quote:


My mom, Helen Callaghan — Geena Davis’ character Dottie Hinson was loosely based on her — was the AAGPBL batting champion in 1945. She didn’t keep much memorabilia from her playing days, but she did have a worn-out leather glove that she liked to use whenever we played catch together when I was young. I took her to see Marshall’s film when it came out in the summer of 1992, not long before she died of cancer. She loved it and felt that Penny had “got it right.” But she added that she would never drop a ball on purpose — not for anyone — as Dottie does in the movie’s big-game climatic scene. It would have been a betrayal of her teammates.

Link - ( New Window )
That's a great find...and I believe her. But, it doesn't answer what Penny Marshall did with that scene. I do believe the post a little while ago that indicated it was left intentionally ambiguous.
^  
ColHowPepper : 7/3/2022 2:12 pm : link
steve, that's cool. But I'm uncertain whether the 'on purpose' in
Quote:
"would never drop a ball on purpose — not for anyone — as Dottie does in the movie’s big-game climatic scene"
is modified by "as Dottie does". In other words, Penny Marshall does have Dottie drop it on purpose, even if the real Dottie, Helen, would never.
RE: Also for those that watched it more recently  
steve in ky : 7/3/2022 2:26 pm : link
In comment 15746777 steve in ky said:
Quote:
wasn't there a scene when Dottie was older and her grand kids were playing basketball and she told the older one to remember that his younger brother is littler and to let him get some shots, but then pulls him aside and whispers to him to "kill him".

If I'm remembering correctly that kind of gives an example of her and Kit's relationship. She loved her and wanted her to have her chance, but wouldn't do anything not to bury her when playing against her.


If someone has access to watch it, I'd be interested in this scene. I think it's a tell from Marshall that Dottie doesn't think one sibling, even older, should just let the other one win, but have to earn it. Which of course Kit did in the end.
RE: RE: Also for those that watched it more recently  
ColHowPepper : 7/3/2022 3:22 pm : link
In comment 15746792 steve in ky said:
Quote:
In comment 15746777 steve in ky said:

Quote:

wasn't there a scene when Dottie was older and her grand kids were playing basketball and she told the older one to remember that his younger brother is littler and to let him get some shots, but then pulls him aside and whispers to him to "kill him".

If I'm remembering correctly that kind of gives an example of her and Kit's relationship. She loved her and wanted her to have her chance, but wouldn't do anything not to bury her when playing against her.

If someone has access to watch it, I'd be interested in this scene. I think it's a tell from Marshall that Dottie doesn't think one sibling, even older, should just let the other one win, but have to earn it. Which of course Kit did in the end.

I agree with the analogy but think you might have it flipped. To be clear, older Dottie does tell the older brother to give his younger brother a chance, at some shots; then she pulls the younger one aside and says, now kill him (the older). So, even if the couplet is ambiguous, it certainly admits of Dottie dropping the ball in the last scene in the WS to give Kit a leg up, in life, which it clearly did, with Kit the hero signing autographs as they exit their dressing rooms.
RE: Fantastic movie...  
FJ : 7/3/2022 6:43 pm : link
In comment 15745774 moze1021 said:
Quote:
I think it's time to watch it with my kids!!

Also of note, for those unaware.. Amazon will soon be releasing a series based on the movie (new characters, new storylines)

It comes out in August.

D'Arcy Carden (aka Janis) is part of the cast!


Janet
Good lord, of course Dottie dropped the ball on purpose.  
Jimmy Googs : 7/3/2022 6:52 pm : link
She was a great catcher and the best player in the league. Coming back to play in that game and telling the pitcher she can’t lay off the high ones are different instances. Dottie knows that play at the plate was Kit’s time.

Kit’s life took after that and Dottie’s never got any worse. Win-win.

It’s a good flick,.the whole missing the cutoff man dialogue is superb...
RE: RE: Also for those that watched it more recently  
Matt M. : 7/3/2022 8:54 pm : link
In comment 15746792 steve in ky said:
Quote:
In comment 15746777 steve in ky said:


Quote:


wasn't there a scene when Dottie was older and her grand kids were playing basketball and she told the older one to remember that his younger brother is littler and to let him get some shots, but then pulls him aside and whispers to him to "kill him".

If I'm remembering correctly that kind of gives an example of her and Kit's relationship. She loved her and wanted her to have her chance, but wouldn't do anything not to bury her when playing against her.



If someone has access to watch it, I'd be interested in this scene. I think it's a tell from Marshall that Dottie doesn't think one sibling, even older, should just let the other one win, but have to earn it. Which of course Kit did in the end.
I don't recall that scene at all.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: I always thought that in the end of the movie  
bradshaw44 : 7/3/2022 11:15 pm : link
In comment 15746569 BlackLight said:
Quote:
In comment 15746549 bradshaw44 said:


Quote:


In comment 15746176 BlackLight said:


Quote:


In comment 15745834 GF1080 said:


Quote:


In comment 15745822 bradshaw44 said:


Quote:


that the actress was Gina Davis with old person make up on. But it turns out that is a totally different woman.

I also thought they did a good job with the Kit elderly woman actress.



Wait really?!?!? I thought that was Davis.



My understanding is that Davis dubbed in the dialogue for Older Dottie with her own voice. All the more impressive because you can't even tell. It's perfectly synched.

Also one of the better sports movie debates of all time - did Dottie drop the ball at the end on purpose (I still say no).



That’s a debate? It was clear she did it intentionally. It is eluded to multiple times after the fact. Like when Dottie says “Look at how happy she is”. She definitely did it on purpose. She also talked about how the league meant so much more to Kit then it did for her. She was helping out her kid sister.



As somebody else said, she told Betty Spaghetti to pitch to Kit's weakness, so she was clearly wanting to win. Nothing happened between that moment and Kit rounding third that justifies a decision to drop the ball on purpose.

The game definitely meant more to Kit than it did to Dottie, but it meant enough to Dottie that she came back for Game 7, and all to intentionally throw the game with one out to go?


Betty Spaghetti left the league after learning her husband was killed in action. It’s the Beauty Queen that was pitching I believe.

And the reason she told her to throw it high was because she felt her sister knew she would do that which is why she did it. It was a tell to her sister when she stopped the game to talk to the pitcher. And Kit then over came her inability not to be able to hit that pitch because she knew it was coming. And Dottie let her finish off the moment with the win.

That’s how I always viewed it. And even watching it the first time I remember thinking she’s gonna let her win if she gets the chance.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: I always thought that in the end of the movie  
Jim in Fairfax : 7/3/2022 11:41 pm : link
In comment 15746932 bradshaw44 said:
Quote:

And the reason she told her to throw it high was because she felt her sister knew she would do that which is why she did it. It was a tell to her sister when she stopped the game to talk to the pitcher. And Kit then over came her inability not to be able to hit that pitch because she knew it was coming. And Dottie let her finish off the moment with the win.

That’s how I always viewed it. And even watching it the first time I remember thinking she’s gonna let her win if she gets the chance.


Geena Davis was asked about this recently (not for the first time). She says she knows whether Dottie dropped it on purpose, but she’s taking it to her grave. Penny Marshall has already taken the answer to her grave.
RE: RE: RE: Also for those that watched it more recently  
steve in ky : 7/4/2022 2:20 am : link
In comment 15746812 ColHowPepper said:
Quote:
In comment 15746792 steve in ky said:


Quote:


In comment 15746777 steve in ky said:

Quote:

wasn't there a scene when Dottie was older and her grand kids were playing basketball and she told the older one to remember that his younger brother is littler and to let him get some shots, but then pulls him aside and whispers to him to "kill him".

If I'm remembering correctly that kind of gives an example of her and Kit's relationship. She loved her and wanted her to have her chance, but wouldn't do anything not to bury her when playing against her.

If someone has access to watch it, I'd be interested in this scene. I think it's a tell from Marshall that Dottie doesn't think one sibling, even older, should just let the other one win, but have to earn it. Which of course Kit did in the end.


I agree with the analogy but think you might have it flipped. To be clear, older Dottie does tell the older brother to give his younger brother a chance, at some shots; then she pulls the younger one aside and says, now kill him (the older). So, even if the couplet is ambiguous, it certainly admits of Dottie dropping the ball in the last scene in the WS to give Kit a leg up, in life, which it clearly did, with Kit the hero signing autographs as they exit their dressing rooms.


Yeah the more I think about I think you’re right, she says it to the younger one. I’m still not convinced she threw the game, but I believe you are remembering this part correctly
I loved this movie.  
Klaatu : 7/5/2022 6:23 am : link
"Dirt in the Skirt," lol. Hanks was terrific, and Madonna and Rosie O'Donnell reminded me of an old-time comedic duo.

Lynn Cartwright had a long career in movies and TV. She was married (for 50 years) to legendary Hollywood heavy, Leo Gordon.
A few thoughts  
Matt M. : 7/5/2022 2:34 pm : link
1) I just watched the first 40 minutes or so on Sunday night. So, I saw the seen with the grandsons. Why give the older brother the advice to let the younger brother shoot and then tell the younger brother to kill him? It's contradictory and makes less sense coming from the older sibling in a bitter rivalry.

2) They made such a big deal about Marla Hooch's looks (or lack thereof), but nothing about Rosie O'Donnell?

3) I found Rosie O'Donnell's character annoying right from the start.

4) Prior to this thread, I had no idea Betty Spaghetti was Penny Marshall's daughter. So, obviously, I also didn't know that Rob Reiner adopted her when he was married to Penny Marshall...or at least made enough of an impression for her to take his name. I don't even think I knew she had children.
RE: A few thoughts  
Mike in NY : 7/5/2022 3:09 pm : link
In comment 15747525 Matt M. said:
Quote:
1) I just watched the first 40 minutes or so on Sunday night. So, I saw the seen with the grandsons. Why give the older brother the advice to let the younger brother shoot and then tell the younger brother to kill him? It's contradictory and makes less sense coming from the older sibling in a bitter rivalry.

2) They made such a big deal about Marla Hooch's looks (or lack thereof), but nothing about Rosie O'Donnell?

3) I found Rosie O'Donnell's character annoying right from the start.

4) Prior to this thread, I had no idea Betty Spaghetti was Penny Marshall's daughter. So, obviously, I also didn't know that Rob Reiner adopted her when he was married to Penny Marshall...or at least made enough of an impression for her to take his name. I don't even think I knew she had children.


Regarding Point 1 I think it is to show how Dottie changed as a result of her time in AAGPBL. Part of the relationship dynamic was that everything was Dottie first and Kit was an afterthought. Her growth as a person was realizing that sometimes other people needed a chance to shine.
RE: RE: A few thoughts  
Matt M. : 7/5/2022 3:36 pm : link
In comment 15747539 Mike in NY said:
Quote:
In comment 15747525 Matt M. said:


Quote:


1) I just watched the first 40 minutes or so on Sunday night. So, I saw the seen with the grandsons. Why give the older brother the advice to let the younger brother shoot and then tell the younger brother to kill him? It's contradictory and makes less sense coming from the older sibling in a bitter rivalry.

2) They made such a big deal about Marla Hooch's looks (or lack thereof), but nothing about Rosie O'Donnell?

3) I found Rosie O'Donnell's character annoying right from the start.

4) Prior to this thread, I had no idea Betty Spaghetti was Penny Marshall's daughter. So, obviously, I also didn't know that Rob Reiner adopted her when he was married to Penny Marshall...or at least made enough of an impression for her to take his name. I don't even think I knew she had children.



Regarding Point 1 I think it is to show how Dottie changed as a result of her time in AAGPBL. Part of the relationship dynamic was that everything was Dottie first and Kit was an afterthought. Her growth as a person was realizing that sometimes other people needed a chance to shine.
I guess, but I find that horseshit. Kit didn't shine because she wasn't a star. She was an OK player. Dottie was never trying to intentionally overshadow her sister. Kit was just a brat who couldn't handle her own failures and blamed them on Dottie.

Setting all that aside, if we want to accept Dottie has changed, I still find that scene contradictory. If you tell the older kid to let the younger kid shoot and then tell the younger kid to kill him, with that gusto, you then are likely setting up the older kid for humiliation. It just didn't jive with me the way she did it. But, likely I'm overthinking this and it's just to boost the younger kid's confidence. I just hope the unseen next scene if this were real didn't include the younger kid then gloating on the older sibling's face.

Matt M  
Mike in NY : 7/5/2022 3:46 pm : link
Because I don't know how much of the movie you have seen, I didn't want to get into events that take place later on in the movie. No matter how well Kit does she is always being measured up to Dottie and/or drawing the short end of the stick/having to make compromises. If you have seen the whole movie I will elaborate more, but just didn't want to spoil things for you.
RE: Matt M  
Matt M. : 7/5/2022 4:28 pm : link
In comment 15747559 Mike in NY said:
Quote:
Because I don't know how much of the movie you have seen, I didn't want to get into events that take place later on in the movie. No matter how well Kit does she is always being measured up to Dottie and/or drawing the short end of the stick/having to make compromises. If you have seen the whole movie I will elaborate more, but just didn't want to spoil things for you.
I've seen the movie. I know the deal and it sucks for Kit. But, Kit is also her own worst enemy. She is a sore loser and constantly makes that comparison herself.
RE: RE: Matt M  
Mike in NY : 7/5/2022 4:56 pm : link
In comment 15747591 Matt M. said:
Quote:
In comment 15747559 Mike in NY said:


Quote:


Because I don't know how much of the movie you have seen, I didn't want to get into events that take place later on in the movie. No matter how well Kit does she is always being measured up to Dottie and/or drawing the short end of the stick/having to make compromises. If you have seen the whole movie I will elaborate more, but just didn't want to spoil things for you.

I've seen the movie. I know the deal and it sucks for Kit. But, Kit is also her own worst enemy. She is a sore loser and constantly makes that comparison herself.


I get it that Kit is a spoiled brat, but she is not wrong that Dottie asks to be traded and they trade Kit instead. Here she is in the league and one of the better pitchers, but heaven forbid someone inconvenience Dottie so Kit has to immediately pack and join an entirely new set of girls.
RE: RE: RE: Matt M  
Matt M. : 7/5/2022 5:02 pm : link
In comment 15747606 Mike in NY said:
Quote:
In comment 15747591 Matt M. said:


Quote:


In comment 15747559 Mike in NY said:


Quote:


Because I don't know how much of the movie you have seen, I didn't want to get into events that take place later on in the movie. No matter how well Kit does she is always being measured up to Dottie and/or drawing the short end of the stick/having to make compromises. If you have seen the whole movie I will elaborate more, but just didn't want to spoil things for you.

I've seen the movie. I know the deal and it sucks for Kit. But, Kit is also her own worst enemy. She is a sore loser and constantly makes that comparison herself.



I get it that Kit is a spoiled brat, but she is not wrong that Dottie asks to be traded and they trade Kit instead. Here she is in the league and one of the better pitchers, but heaven forbid someone inconvenience Dottie so Kit has to immediately pack and join an entirely new set of girls.
IF you were running the team, would you have traded Dottie or Kit?
RE: RE: RE: RE: Matt M  
Mike in NY : 7/5/2022 5:08 pm : link
In comment 15747607 Matt M. said:
Quote:
In comment 15747606 Mike in NY said:


Quote:


In comment 15747591 Matt M. said:


Quote:


In comment 15747559 Mike in NY said:


Quote:


Because I don't know how much of the movie you have seen, I didn't want to get into events that take place later on in the movie. No matter how well Kit does she is always being measured up to Dottie and/or drawing the short end of the stick/having to make compromises. If you have seen the whole movie I will elaborate more, but just didn't want to spoil things for you.

I've seen the movie. I know the deal and it sucks for Kit. But, Kit is also her own worst enemy. She is a sore loser and constantly makes that comparison herself.



I get it that Kit is a spoiled brat, but she is not wrong that Dottie asks to be traded and they trade Kit instead. Here she is in the league and one of the better pitchers, but heaven forbid someone inconvenience Dottie so Kit has to immediately pack and join an entirely new set of girls.

IF you were running the team, would you have traded Dottie or Kit?


This was not a trade negotiation between equal participants. Teams were set by the league. If Dottie got traded spoiled brat Kit would probably have blamed Dottie for making Kit look like the bad one.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Matt M  
Matt M. : 7/5/2022 5:11 pm : link
In comment 15747609 Mike in NY said:
Quote:
In comment 15747607 Matt M. said:


Quote:


In comment 15747606 Mike in NY said:


Quote:


In comment 15747591 Matt M. said:


Quote:


In comment 15747559 Mike in NY said:


Quote:


Because I don't know how much of the movie you have seen, I didn't want to get into events that take place later on in the movie. No matter how well Kit does she is always being measured up to Dottie and/or drawing the short end of the stick/having to make compromises. If you have seen the whole movie I will elaborate more, but just didn't want to spoil things for you.

I've seen the movie. I know the deal and it sucks for Kit. But, Kit is also her own worst enemy. She is a sore loser and constantly makes that comparison herself.



I get it that Kit is a spoiled brat, but she is not wrong that Dottie asks to be traded and they trade Kit instead. Here she is in the league and one of the better pitchers, but heaven forbid someone inconvenience Dottie so Kit has to immediately pack and join an entirely new set of girls.

IF you were running the team, would you have traded Dottie or Kit?



This was not a trade negotiation between equal participants. Teams were set by the league. If Dottie got traded spoiled brat Kit would probably have blamed Dottie for making Kit look like the bad one.
That's my point. No matter what, Kit will blame Dottie for anything that goes wrong.
Nah, going too far. Kit was just immature and Dottie wasn’t.  
Jimmy Googs : 7/5/2022 5:23 pm : link
And basically it took a plate at the plate and a purposely dropped ball to move Kit into a better place. A little helpful nudge in life.

Good for Dottie. That is what a big sister should be doing...

There's no scenario  
bceagle05 : 7/5/2022 6:44 pm : link
in which an athlete would drop a ball like that to lose a game - well, aside from point shaving or something. Doesn't mean a "Hollywood ending" of some kind wasn't given to this fictional scenario - ghost players wouldn't emerge from cornfields in Iowa either - but it would still be disappointing if you appreciate this as a good sports movie.
RE: There's no scenario  
Matt M. : 7/5/2022 10:26 pm : link
In comment 15747647 bceagle05 said:
Quote:
in which an athlete would drop a ball like that to lose a game - well, aside from point shaving or something. Doesn't mean a "Hollywood ending" of some kind wasn't given to this fictional scenario - ghost players wouldn't emerge from cornfields in Iowa either - but it would still be disappointing if you appreciate this as a good sports movie.
This I agree with. There is a huge difference between and parent or older sibling letting a little one win and essentially throwing a game in the World Series like that.
Great recent interview with cast & screenwriter  
Jim in Fairfax : 7/6/2022 12:28 am : link
Ganz, the screenwriter, says it was never in his or his co-writer’s mind that Dottie dropped it on purpose. Also mentions proposed prequel following Jimmy Dugan that the studio wouldn’t bite on.

Quote:
“Babaloo and I never for a moment thought that Dottie dropped the ball on purpose. We never thought that, but after enough people said it (laughs), we said, “Maybe we don’t know our own character as well as we thought we did. Maybe we’re wrong.”


A League of Their Own Hits 30 - ( New Window )
RE: Great recent interview with cast & screenwriter  
steve in ky : 7/6/2022 7:49 am : link
In comment 15747796 Jim in Fairfax said:
Quote:
Ganz, the screenwriter, says it was never in his or his co-writer’s mind that Dottie dropped it on purpose. Also mentions proposed prequel following Jimmy Dugan that the studio wouldn’t bite on.



Quote:


“Babaloo and I never for a moment thought that Dottie dropped the ball on purpose. We never thought that, but after enough people said it (laughs), we said, “Maybe we don’t know our own character as well as we thought we did. Maybe we’re wrong.”

A League of Their Own Hits 30 - ( New Window )



Well if the writers never entertained the thought she dropped it on purpose that kind of settles it.
RE: RE: Great recent interview with cast & screenwriter  
Matt M. : 7/6/2022 3:48 pm : link
In comment 15747813 steve in ky said:
Quote:
In comment 15747796 Jim in Fairfax said:


Quote:


Ganz, the screenwriter, says it was never in his or his co-writer’s mind that Dottie dropped it on purpose. Also mentions proposed prequel following Jimmy Dugan that the studio wouldn’t bite on.



Quote:


“Babaloo and I never for a moment thought that Dottie dropped the ball on purpose. We never thought that, but after enough people said it (laughs), we said, “Maybe we don’t know our own character as well as we thought we did. Maybe we’re wrong.”

A League of Their Own Hits 30 - ( New Window )




Well if the writers never entertained the thought she dropped it on purpose that kind of settles it.
Exactly.
RE: Great recent interview with cast & screenwriter  
Matt M. : 7/6/2022 3:59 pm : link
In comment 15747796 Jim in Fairfax said:
Quote:
Ganz, the screenwriter, says it was never in his or his co-writer’s mind that Dottie dropped it on purpose. Also mentions proposed prequel following Jimmy Dugan that the studio wouldn’t bite on.



Quote:


“Babaloo and I never for a moment thought that Dottie dropped the ball on purpose. We never thought that, but after enough people said it (laughs), we said, “Maybe we don’t know our own character as well as we thought we did. Maybe we’re wrong.”

A League of Their Own Hits 30 - ( New Window )
There's some good stuff in there.
RE: RE: Great recent interview with cast & screenwriter  
Anakim : 7/6/2022 4:04 pm : link
In comment 15747813 steve in ky said:
Quote:
In comment 15747796 Jim in Fairfax said:


Quote:


Ganz, the screenwriter, says it was never in his or his co-writer’s mind that Dottie dropped it on purpose. Also mentions proposed prequel following Jimmy Dugan that the studio wouldn’t bite on.



Quote:


“Babaloo and I never for a moment thought that Dottie dropped the ball on purpose. We never thought that, but after enough people said it (laughs), we said, “Maybe we don’t know our own character as well as we thought we did. Maybe we’re wrong.”

A League of Their Own Hits 30 - ( New Window )




Well if the writers never entertained the thought she dropped it on purpose that kind of settles it.



Though you could argue that the movie is not some sort of mystery which must have its innate meaning, but it instead can be interpreted through the human activity of debate and consensus.

Reminds me of that South Park episode. Like how people overanalyze Catcher in the Rye. Did JD Salinger meant for all these different nuances and alternative interpretations or was it meant to be straightforward and taken as face value? And perhaps the better question is does it even matter what the writer intended? As Freud would say, sometimes a cigar is just a cigar...but he's not the final authority to determine if it is or not.
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