would "zip it" on Jones. We know he's had every disadvantage a QB can possibly have. That's not an excuse, its a fact.
He didn't get an extension (wise decision by NYG). But jeez, let's see how this plays out a bit with the hope of an NFL caliber OL, play callers and a few weapons. If it doesn't go well, call him Dave Brown 2.0 to your hearts content. But to spout off 4 practices in? Odd.
Everyone is a QB expert.
Lets hope our new regime is smart enough to build a team that will support different levels of QB play. You hope you get a great one who plays big in the big moments but you still have to win games with acceptable QB play.
RE: RE: RE: Jones has always been inaccurate, this shouldn't surprise
I don't know what a "Jones stans" is but I do know that this is a useless argument on Day 4 of camp.
Maybe he's Dave Brown 2.0 or alternatively. maybe with the benefit of some NFL caliber combo of OL, weapons, coaching he's some middle tier QB e.g. Ryan Tannehill. I don't know. But let's see the thing play out a bit shall we?
Day 4 of camp or August of year 4 with the same issues?
I'd say Jones issues have been:
-team's complete inability to run the ball (setting up near constant bad down/distance situations)
-inability to pass block
-unimaginative and ineffective coaching
-ridiculously high rate of injury of skill position players
-his own injury problems
-his ball security issues
In that order.
RE: RE: Jones has always been inaccurate, this shouldn't surprise
I don't know what a "Jones stans" is but I do know that this is a useless argument on Day 4 of camp.
Maybe he's Dave Brown 2.0 or alternatively. maybe with the benefit of some NFL caliber combo of OL, weapons, coaching he's some middle tier QB e.g. Ryan Tannehill. I don't know. But let's see the thing play out a bit shall we?
Day 4 of camp or August of year 4 with the same issues?
I'd say Jones issues have been:
-team's complete inability to run the ball (setting up near constant bad down/distance situations)
-inability to pass block
-unimaginative and ineffective coaching
-ridiculously high rate of injury of skill position players
-his own injury problems
-his ball security issues
The scrutiny is going to be really tough to bear all camp, as far as it relates to comments on these threads. Every misplaced ball, every miscue, etc. etc. I s going to be fodder for people yelling "See??? See??? We told you!"
LOL
Meanwhile you read they focused on the run game and threw 18 total passes, with this comment from Daboll: "Some times in practice you just ask the QB to throw it up because you simply want to see how the DBs play that ball".
This is going to be a Jones fest every day on these threads.... lol
I don't know what a "Jones stans" is but I do know that this is a useless argument on Day 4 of camp.
Maybe he's Dave Brown 2.0 or alternatively. maybe with the benefit of some NFL caliber combo of OL, weapons, coaching he's some middle tier QB e.g. Ryan Tannehill. I don't know. But let's see the thing play out a bit shall we?
Day 4 of camp or August of year 4 with the same issues?
I'd say Jones issues have been:
-team's complete inability to run the ball (setting up near constant bad down/distance situations)
-inability to pass block
-unimaginative and ineffective coaching
-ridiculously high rate of injury of skill position players
-his own injury problems
-his ball security issues
In that order.
So none of it’s his fault, got it.
>> Reading comprehension.
-his own injury problems
-his ball security issues
If you guys remember from his first training camp, he was remarkably accurate, hitting guys in stride, something Eli struggled in. This was mentioned in threads repeatedly.
Besides coaching him to make tight window throws (which he did a LOT as a rookie), Daboll has to de-program Jones from Garrett's "don't you dare make a mistake" offense.
Jones may be unfixable, but Daboll is going to try to get the most out of him. I expected struggles early. Taylor has looked better because he knows the playbook having been in Buffalo.
Let it play out.
Career completion percentages:
Eli Manning: 60.3 percent
Daniel Jones 62.8 percent
Eli was a down field passer. DJ is not. So you would expect DJ to have a higher completion percentage. And DJ can only attain 62.8% even though he has the lowest yards per pass attempt in the league. Not good.
If you guys remember from his first training camp, he was remarkably accurate, hitting guys in stride, something Eli struggled in. This was mentioned in threads repeatedly.
Besides coaching him to make tight window throws (which he did a LOT as a rookie), Daboll has to de-program Jones from Garrett's "don't you dare make a mistake" offense.
Jones may be unfixable, but Daboll is going to try to get the most out of him. I expected struggles early. Taylor has looked better because he knows the playbook having been in Buffalo.
Let it play out.
Taylor and Dabol were not in Buffalo at the same time. Taylor left Buffalo before Dabol got there. Taylor has looked better because he has more experience playing in various systems and he has no pressure on him.
If you guys remember from his first training camp, he was remarkably accurate, hitting guys in stride, something Eli struggled in. This was mentioned in threads repeatedly.
Besides coaching him to make tight window throws (which he did a LOT as a rookie), Daboll has to de-program Jones from Garrett's "don't you dare make a mistake" offense.
Jones may be unfixable, but Daboll is going to try to get the most out of him. I expected struggles early. Taylor has looked better because he knows the playbook having been in Buffalo.
Let it play out.
Career completion percentages:
Eli Manning: 60.3 percent
Daniel Jones 62.8 percent
Eli was a down field passer. DJ is not. So you would expect DJ to have a higher completion percentage. And DJ can only attain 62.8% even though he has the lowest yards per pass attempt in the league. Not good.
Team can't run the ball. They also generally lack downfield weapons and even to the extent they have a little bit of downfield speed (Engram via seam, Slayton), they never really use it because of persistent OL leaks and the fact that the OC is a pussy.
Play a little multiple choice: You feel this is the kind of environment that:
a) destroys a QBs chance to develop and show well
b) doesn't matter; its always the QBs fault
I choose to live in 2022. Let's see if Jones can be good or solid or adequate. If he is not, so be it...Taylor will serve as a bridge to whatever is next. But to have an all day, every day thread about Jones is...what's the word I am looking for...STUPID.
If you guys remember from his first training camp, he was remarkably accurate, hitting guys in stride, something Eli struggled in. This was mentioned in threads repeatedly.
Besides coaching him to make tight window throws (which he did a LOT as a rookie), Daboll has to de-program Jones from Garrett's "don't you dare make a mistake" offense.
Jones may be unfixable, but Daboll is going to try to get the most out of him. I expected struggles early. Taylor has looked better because he knows the playbook having been in Buffalo.
Let it play out.
Career completion percentages:
Eli Manning: 60.3 percent
Daniel Jones 62.8 percent
Eli was a down field passer. DJ is not. So you would expect DJ to have a higher completion percentage. And DJ can only attain 62.8% even though he has the lowest yards per pass attempt in the league. Not good.
totally correct. and let's not forget completion pcts are higher in this era than in previous eras.
I don't know what a "Jones stans" is but I do know that this is a useless argument on Day 4 of camp.
Maybe he's Dave Brown 2.0 or alternatively. maybe with the benefit of some NFL caliber combo of OL, weapons, coaching he's some middle tier QB e.g. Ryan Tannehill. I don't know. But let's see the thing play out a bit shall we?
Day 4 of camp or August of year 4 with the same issues?
I'd say Jones issues have been:
-team's complete inability to run the ball (setting up near constant bad down/distance situations)
-inability to pass block
-unimaginative and ineffective coaching
-ridiculously high rate of injury of skill position players
-his own injury problems
-his ball security issues
In that order.
So none of it’s his fault, got it.
>> Reading comprehension.
-his own injury problems
-his ball security issues
Got our first OL vs DL 1-on-1’s of camp today. Going to thread nine here.
1. Andrew Thomas has looked very solid this summer. Has more than held his own against Kayvon Thibodeaux:
2. Leonard Williams is having a strong camp. Looks explosive. He’s the best player on this defense until Xavier McKinney takes that title from him:
3. Oshane Ximines has been one of the surprises of camp. Has gotten the best of Evan Neal a few times. But offside penalties like the first rep here bring back bad memories:
4. NT Justin Ellis jumped offside two straight times. Lot of that from the DL in this drill. Daboll was not happy:
5. Thibodeaux showing his quickness against backup RT Matt Gono:
6. More Thibodeaux vs Thomas:
7. Williams’ strength evident against Shane Lemieux:
8. Dexter Lawrence has been dominant early in camp. Believe this rep is vs. Jamil Douglas (if I ever become coach for a day, I’d cut any player who rolls up his jersey. Real headache for attendance purposes).
9. Good rep for Ximines, eventually, against Neal. But don’t think Daboll appreciated it after another offside penalty:
Has been pleasant to see is how positive the word has been around Aaron Robinson.
Idk where your info comes from but the camp practice I attended and from what I've seen in highlights of camp he seems to be getting picked on in coverage a bunch... I'm just saying what I've seen... not read.
Bobby Skinner is no QB guru in case you didn't know...
But posters on BBI are. Interesting.
And the Aaron Robinson noise is just snippets I've read. I haven't seen any chatter on any DB being picked on so far. Second team DBs (it's not a position with much depth) maybe but not the first.
No way one can take seriously what he thinks he sees in week 1 of camp and day 1 in pads. It even sounds ridiculous. Jones will get plenty of rope otherwise he’d already be gone.
Bobby Skinner is no QB guru in case you didn't know...
But posters on BBI are. Interesting.
And the Aaron Robinson noise is just snippets I've read. I haven't seen any chatter on any DB being picked on so far. Second team DBs (it's not a position with much depth) maybe but not the first.
Im saying at least I have my own opinion from actually watching and not just Bobby Skinner's opinion, having never watched...
So far in this brief bit of camp it has been clear that Tyrod releases the football much faster and has thrown the ball more accurately than DJ has... thats all
Im saying at least I have my own opinion from actually watching and not just Bobby Skinner's opinion, having never watched...
So far in this brief bit of camp it has been clear that Tyrod releases the football much faster and has thrown the ball more accurately than DJ has... thats all
Funny, but the reporters haven't mentioned that, well, from what I read.
He didn't get an extension (wise decision by NYG). But jeez, let's see how this plays out a bit with the hope of an NFL caliber OL, play callers and a few weapons. If it doesn't go well, call him Dave Brown 2.0 to your hearts content. But to spout off 4 practices in? Odd.
Everyone is a QB expert.
Lets hope our new regime is smart enough to build a team that will support different levels of QB play. You hope you get a great one who plays big in the big moments but you still have to win games with acceptable QB play.
Quote:
In comment 15767986 Producer said:
Quote:
The numbers have always said that. The eye test has always said that.
Ahhh, no.
Here are Daniel Jones' ranks in completion pct through his career. And I don't think I need to tell you that completion pct is a measure of accuracy.
2019: 24th
2020: 31st
2021: 23rd
Are these the rankings of an accurate NFL passer?
Quote:
In comment 15768201 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
Still standing firm is incredible
I don't know what a "Jones stans" is but I do know that this is a useless argument on Day 4 of camp.
Maybe he's Dave Brown 2.0 or alternatively. maybe with the benefit of some NFL caliber combo of OL, weapons, coaching he's some middle tier QB e.g. Ryan Tannehill. I don't know. But let's see the thing play out a bit shall we?
Day 4 of camp or August of year 4 with the same issues?
I'd say Jones issues have been:
-team's complete inability to run the ball (setting up near constant bad down/distance situations)
-inability to pass block
-unimaginative and ineffective coaching
-ridiculously high rate of injury of skill position players
-his own injury problems
-his ball security issues
In that order.
Quote:
The numbers have always said that. The eye test has always said that.
Oh, you mean when he's had one second to throw and no starting receivers???
This hyperbole makes the other hyperbole come out of the woodwork.
Jones was tied for 2nd most pocket time (with 7 others) at 2.5 second per snap in 2022.
Jones was right in the middle of the league in pressure percentage at 23.3% of the time.
Jones just simply wasn’t in the disadvantage many insist he was.
Quote:
In comment 15768216 NYG22 said:
Quote:
In comment 15768201 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
Still standing firm is incredible
I don't know what a "Jones stans" is but I do know that this is a useless argument on Day 4 of camp.
Maybe he's Dave Brown 2.0 or alternatively. maybe with the benefit of some NFL caliber combo of OL, weapons, coaching he's some middle tier QB e.g. Ryan Tannehill. I don't know. But let's see the thing play out a bit shall we?
Day 4 of camp or August of year 4 with the same issues?
I'd say Jones issues have been:
-team's complete inability to run the ball (setting up near constant bad down/distance situations)
-inability to pass block
-unimaginative and ineffective coaching
-ridiculously high rate of injury of skill position players
-his own injury problems
-his ball security issues
In that order.
So none of it’s his fault, got it.
Halt the legend status.
People will need to learn to calm down. Maybe.
LOL
Meanwhile you read they focused on the run game and threw 18 total passes, with this comment from Daboll: "Some times in practice you just ask the QB to throw it up because you simply want to see how the DBs play that ball".
This is going to be a Jones fest every day on these threads.... lol
Quote:
In comment 15768217 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
In comment 15768216 NYG22 said:
Quote:
In comment 15768201 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
Still standing firm is incredible
I don't know what a "Jones stans" is but I do know that this is a useless argument on Day 4 of camp.
Maybe he's Dave Brown 2.0 or alternatively. maybe with the benefit of some NFL caliber combo of OL, weapons, coaching he's some middle tier QB e.g. Ryan Tannehill. I don't know. But let's see the thing play out a bit shall we?
Day 4 of camp or August of year 4 with the same issues?
I'd say Jones issues have been:
-team's complete inability to run the ball (setting up near constant bad down/distance situations)
-inability to pass block
-unimaginative and ineffective coaching
-ridiculously high rate of injury of skill position players
-his own injury problems
-his ball security issues
In that order.
So none of it’s his fault, got it.
>> Reading comprehension.
-his own injury problems
-his ball security issues
Those things are his fault.
>> Can we just let it play the fck out?
Quote:
If you guys remember from his first training camp, he was remarkably accurate, hitting guys in stride, something Eli struggled in. This was mentioned in threads repeatedly.
Besides coaching him to make tight window throws (which he did a LOT as a rookie), Daboll has to de-program Jones from Garrett's "don't you dare make a mistake" offense.
Jones may be unfixable, but Daboll is going to try to get the most out of him. I expected struggles early. Taylor has looked better because he knows the playbook having been in Buffalo.
Let it play out.
Career completion percentages:
Eli Manning: 60.3 percent
Daniel Jones 62.8 percent
Eli was a down field passer. DJ is not. So you would expect DJ to have a higher completion percentage. And DJ can only attain 62.8% even though he has the lowest yards per pass attempt in the league. Not good.
Giants training camp observations, Day 5: Pads on but Daniel Jones struggles again, a rookie injury and another scuffle - ( New Window )
Besides coaching him to make tight window throws (which he did a LOT as a rookie), Daboll has to de-program Jones from Garrett's "don't you dare make a mistake" offense.
Jones may be unfixable, but Daboll is going to try to get the most out of him. I expected struggles early. Taylor has looked better because he knows the playbook having been in Buffalo.
Let it play out.
Taylor and Dabol were not in Buffalo at the same time. Taylor left Buffalo before Dabol got there. Taylor has looked better because he has more experience playing in various systems and he has no pressure on him.
Quote:
In comment 15768026 Dave on the UWS said:
Quote:
If you guys remember from his first training camp, he was remarkably accurate, hitting guys in stride, something Eli struggled in. This was mentioned in threads repeatedly.
Besides coaching him to make tight window throws (which he did a LOT as a rookie), Daboll has to de-program Jones from Garrett's "don't you dare make a mistake" offense.
Jones may be unfixable, but Daboll is going to try to get the most out of him. I expected struggles early. Taylor has looked better because he knows the playbook having been in Buffalo.
Let it play out.
Career completion percentages:
Eli Manning: 60.3 percent
Daniel Jones 62.8 percent
Eli was a down field passer. DJ is not. So you would expect DJ to have a higher completion percentage. And DJ can only attain 62.8% even though he has the lowest yards per pass attempt in the league. Not good.
Team can't run the ball. They also generally lack downfield weapons and even to the extent they have a little bit of downfield speed (Engram via seam, Slayton), they never really use it because of persistent OL leaks and the fact that the OC is a pussy.
Play a little multiple choice: You feel this is the kind of environment that:
a) destroys a QBs chance to develop and show well
b) doesn't matter; its always the QBs fault
I choose to live in 2022. Let's see if Jones can be good or solid or adequate. If he is not, so be it...Taylor will serve as a bridge to whatever is next. But to have an all day, every day thread about Jones is...what's the word I am looking for...STUPID.
Quote:
In comment 15768026 Dave on the UWS said:
Quote:
If you guys remember from his first training camp, he was remarkably accurate, hitting guys in stride, something Eli struggled in. This was mentioned in threads repeatedly.
Besides coaching him to make tight window throws (which he did a LOT as a rookie), Daboll has to de-program Jones from Garrett's "don't you dare make a mistake" offense.
Jones may be unfixable, but Daboll is going to try to get the most out of him. I expected struggles early. Taylor has looked better because he knows the playbook having been in Buffalo.
Let it play out.
Career completion percentages:
Eli Manning: 60.3 percent
Daniel Jones 62.8 percent
Eli was a down field passer. DJ is not. So you would expect DJ to have a higher completion percentage. And DJ can only attain 62.8% even though he has the lowest yards per pass attempt in the league. Not good.
totally correct. and let's not forget completion pcts are higher in this era than in previous eras.
Quote:
In comment 15768229 NYG22 said:
Quote:
In comment 15768217 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
In comment 15768216 NYG22 said:
Quote:
In comment 15768201 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
Still standing firm is incredible
I don't know what a "Jones stans" is but I do know that this is a useless argument on Day 4 of camp.
Maybe he's Dave Brown 2.0 or alternatively. maybe with the benefit of some NFL caliber combo of OL, weapons, coaching he's some middle tier QB e.g. Ryan Tannehill. I don't know. But let's see the thing play out a bit shall we?
Day 4 of camp or August of year 4 with the same issues?
I'd say Jones issues have been:
-team's complete inability to run the ball (setting up near constant bad down/distance situations)
-inability to pass block
-unimaginative and ineffective coaching
-ridiculously high rate of injury of skill position players
-his own injury problems
-his ball security issues
In that order.
So none of it’s his fault, got it.
>> Reading comprehension.
-his own injury problems
-his ball security issues
Those things are his fault.
>> Can we just let it play the fck out?
There’s a lot more he’s at fault for but sure.
1. Andrew Thomas has looked very solid this summer. Has more than held his own against Kayvon Thibodeaux:
2. Leonard Williams is having a strong camp. Looks explosive. He’s the best player on this defense until Xavier McKinney takes that title from him:
3. Oshane Ximines has been one of the surprises of camp. Has gotten the best of Evan Neal a few times. But offside penalties like the first rep here bring back bad memories:
4. NT Justin Ellis jumped offside two straight times. Lot of that from the DL in this drill. Daboll was not happy:
5. Thibodeaux showing his quickness against backup RT Matt Gono:
6. More Thibodeaux vs Thomas:
7. Williams’ strength evident against Shane Lemieux:
8. Dexter Lawrence has been dominant early in camp. Believe this rep is vs. Jamil Douglas (if I ever become coach for a day, I’d cut any player who rolls up his jersey. Real headache for attendance purposes).
9. Good rep for Ximines, eventually, against Neal. But don’t think Daboll appreciated it after another offside penalty:
Touchdowns & top plays from first practice in pads - ( New Window )
5 things we learned from training camp (8/1) - ( New Window )
Halt the legend status.
People will need to learn to calm down. Maybe.
Bobby Skinner is no QB guru in case you didn't know...
Idk where your info comes from but the camp practice I attended and from what I've seen in highlights of camp he seems to be getting picked on in coverage a bunch... I'm just saying what I've seen... not read.
Quote:
Was bad today according to Bobby Skinner.
Halt the legend status.
People will need to learn to calm down. Maybe.
Bobby Skinner is no QB guru in case you didn't know...
But posters on BBI are. Interesting.
And the Aaron Robinson noise is just snippets I've read. I haven't seen any chatter on any DB being picked on so far. Second team DBs (it's not a position with much depth) maybe but not the first.
Quote:
In comment 15768241 Toth029 said:
Quote:
Was bad today according to Bobby Skinner.
Halt the legend status.
People will need to learn to calm down. Maybe.
Bobby Skinner is no QB guru in case you didn't know...
But posters on BBI are. Interesting.
And the Aaron Robinson noise is just snippets I've read. I haven't seen any chatter on any DB being picked on so far. Second team DBs (it's not a position with much depth) maybe but not the first.
Im saying at least I have my own opinion from actually watching and not just Bobby Skinner's opinion, having never watched...
So far in this brief bit of camp it has been clear that Tyrod releases the football much faster and has thrown the ball more accurately than DJ has... thats all
53 is Ximines
Im saying at least I have my own opinion from actually watching and not just Bobby Skinner's opinion, having never watched...
So far in this brief bit of camp it has been clear that Tyrod releases the football much faster and has thrown the ball more accurately than DJ has... thats all
Funny, but the reporters haven't mentioned that, well, from what I read.