in a 154 game schedule. He has seven games in which to hit at least one more. Too bad 73 is not within reach. I would love to see Bonds record surpassed. By the way, there can be no doubt that Bonds was fully juiced in 2001. The most HRs he hit in any other year was 49.
I was only looking at the guy from the Twins who was leading going into yesterday but Boegarts snuck up ahead of him as well and is right on Judge’s tail.
Going to be a nip and tuck race to the end between these three guys but the way Judge is locked in it wouldn’t surprise me if he opened up a lead on them. Especially if he gets 61 and 62 out of the way quickly.
Sometimes chasing things like that takes a guy out of his normal swing but so far doesn’t seem to be the case for Judge. It’d be great if he gets another tonight.
Never gets rattled. Gets terrible calls while at bat and makes a face or chirps to himself, but digs back in..
The post about Ruth getting an asterisk for hitting 60 while surrounded by one of the best lineups to every play is funny but true. Lou Gehrig behind Ruth. If Giancarlo was healthy the whole season it would be comparable - and Gehrig hit for high average too.
It was reported the snag was 7 years 245 vs 7 years 280. The price now will be around 7 years 400, if we are lucky. That was a huge mistake by Cashman. Whatever, you can't do anything about that now.
and at that price, good luck to whoever pulls the trigger. Would set a bad precedent for the league too.
The reality is this might be the best season he will ever have and you have to pay for his 30+ year old years. No issue with price if he were 25, but he’s not.
RE: It would be great to see Judge set the record for most home runs
in a 154 game schedule. He has seven games in which to hit at least one more. Too bad 73 is not within reach. I would love to see Bonds record surpassed. By the way, there can be no doubt that Bonds was fully juiced in 2001. The most HRs he hit in any other year was 49.
A couple quick two home run games…. And 70 wouldn’t be out of play.
It was reported the snag was 7 years 245 vs 7 years 280. The price now will be around 7 years 400, if we are lucky. That was a huge mistake by Cashman. Whatever, you can't do anything about that now.
Judge and his team will know there is only so much the market will bear. I will not blame him for getting anything he gets, but I think $40 mill is a good target. Maybe the Yanks can go less years, but higher $$ per annum. Same overall numbers, but in a shorter period.
Judge keeps himself in great shape. Whatever the new S&C staff has done tweaking his workout regimine it is working. I think he can be effective until 38.
Realistically, 7 years at $300/$320 mill is my guess.
but Judge is having a truly historic season. He is hands down the AL MVP and I know I will get shit for this comment but I don't care, Judge will be the true HR king IMO.
People forget the Yanks have two advantages- neither of which guarantee he will return- but both make it more likely than not.
One- he’s making $20M this year. To go to $40M is only a $20M difference to the Yanks- for all other teams, this is a real $40M payroll increase that likely limits other options.
Keep in mind as well that Chapman and Britton come off the Yanks payroll (there are other FAs too, but their salaries are the highest) at the end of the year. For luxury tax purposes, those two account for $31.5M- allowing the Yanks to go to $40M and still REDUCE their luxury tax for the payroll. That’s a major advantage.
Two- he will certainly get a QO. That hurts many teams ability to pursue giving out a contract that big AND giving up their second highest pick. The Yanks don’t have to give up anything to sign him and as noted above, take a smaller payroll hit.
In the end, I suspect that this will be an 8 year deal for a minimum of $40M. However, I would also not be surprised if it is a frontloaded deal. For luxury tax purposes, it remains $40M per over the life of the deal for the Yanks, but the actual cost goes down over time while the luxury tax limit will likely continue to rise.
The reason for a frontloaded deal is also due to the new CBA. If a player is traded during the life of a deal, the receiving team’s luxury bill is based on the remaining money left on the deal. In the past (like with the Stanton deal), it was based on the annual value of the deal when signed- thus Stanton’s luxury tax bill for the Yanks is only $22M ($25M minus the $3M per the Marlins kicked in) power year.
If the Yanks frontloaded the deal and then traded Judge when he’s 37 or 38, the new team would not be hit with a $40M luxury tax hit, but what remains. If frontloaded, the deal could be in the $20M something per year.
I would also note that the expectations that Judge would not be able to play out the whole deal might be misguided. We are too used to seeing the roided up sluggers break down in their mid-30s. I suspect that was more of a road side effect than the natural progression of time. For example, many years ago, Frank Howard played into his late 30s. However, Howard was never the athlete Judge is and wasn’t as good for an extended time as Judge is. Howard’s prime years were really about 5 years long. Judge might not be an OF by the end of the deal and might be a DH- but he’d still be effective as long as he stays healthy.
It was reported the snag was 7 years 245 vs 7 years 280. The price now will be around 7 years 400, if we are lucky. That was a huge mistake by Cashman. Whatever, you can't do anything about that now.
Judge and his team will know there is only so much the market will bear. I will not blame him for getting anything he gets, but I think $40 mill is a good target. Maybe the Yanks can go less years, but higher $$ per annum. Same overall numbers, but in a shorter period.
Judge keeps himself in great shape. Whatever the new S&C staff has done tweaking his workout regimine it is working. I think he can be effective until 38.
Realistically, 7 years at $300/$320 mill is my guess.
He is going to have every big market suitor after him, this is going to end at 7/370 to 7/400. I promise you Judge will not sign with the Yankees for 300-320 for 7 years without at least testing the market. If the Yankees want to get this done, they are going to have to blow them out of the water.
RE: RE: RE: RE: He will get more than 40 mil a year
Realistically, 7 years at $300/$320 mill is my guess.
He is going to have every big market suitor after him, this is going to end at 7/370 to 7/400. I promise you Judge will not sign with the Yankees for 300-320 for 7 years without at least testing the market. If the Yankees want to get this done, they are going to have to blow them out of the water.
Name the teams that can do that...
Dodgers, Mets, Red Sox, Giants(maybe), St Louis(Pujols is retiring), Angels
Dodgers already have a huge payroll - adding another $50 mill???
Mets - not far fetched
Red Sox - would be a coup - and 75 HR with the Green Monster is possible - but they are already sold out every game and only 40k people
Giants - hometown kid goes home
Angels - would they do it with Ohtani and Trout(monster line up)
St Louis - great BB town. He would be King of StL.
the exception and has an extended prime and/or remains productive through his mid to late 30s. I can certainly see him as a 1B/DH type slugger like Thome. But it's also possible his 30s ending up looking like Pujols with the Angels.
the exception and has an extended prime and/or remains productive through his mid to late 30s. I can certainly see him as a 1B/DH type slugger like Thome. But it's also possible his 30s ending up looking like Pujols with the Angels.
That's fine and might be accurate, but you are kidding yourselves that a player of his mangitude, coming off this season will be rational. You think if the Dodgers flame out in the playoffs again, they are going to be rational when they have never turned down a big contract? I doubt it. Whether he is worth it (which I think he is) or not is beside the point, he is going to get a paid on the open market a lot more than people on this thread believe.
Realistically, 7 years at $300/$320 mill is my guess.
He is going to have every big market suitor after him, this is going to end at 7/370 to 7/400. I promise you Judge will not sign with the Yankees for 300-320 for 7 years without at least testing the market. If the Yankees want to get this done, they are going to have to blow them out of the water.
Name the teams that can do that...
Dodgers, Mets, Red Sox, Giants(maybe), St Louis(Pujols is retiring), Angels
Dodgers already have a huge payroll - adding another $50 mill???
Mets - not far fetched
Red Sox - would be a coup - and 75 HR with the Green Monster is possible - but they are already sold out every game and only 40k people
Giants - hometown kid goes home
Angels - would they do it with Ohtani and Trout(monster line up)
St Louis - great BB town. He would be King of StL.
How about a trade: Trout to the Yanks for boat load of prospects, and the Angels sign Judge.
the exception and has an extended prime and/or remains productive through his mid to late 30s. I can certainly see him as a 1B/DH type slugger like Thome. But it's also possible his 30s ending up looking like Pujols with the Angels.
That's fine and might be accurate, but you are kidding yourselves that a player of his mangitude, coming off this season will be rational. You think if the Dodgers flame out in the playoffs again, they are going to be rational when they have never turned down a big contract? I doubt it. Whether he is worth it (which I think he is) or not is beside the point, he is going to get a paid on the open market a lot more than people on this thread believe.
I don't doubt he's going to get a monster contract. And it's certainly possible he's productive well into his 30s. But I think history tells us it's more likely the the back half (if not more) of that deal is going to be ugly.
but I think the best case scenario for both side is a shorter term contract at much higher annual pay. Something like 6 years $300m. I just cant imagine a guy with Judge's build holding up for much more than another 3/4 seasons. He's already 30 after all.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: He will get more than 40 mil a year
How about a trade: Trout to the Yanks for boat load of prospects, and the Angels sign Judge.
Mike Trout is a great player that is constantly hurt. If the Angels go for Judge it will be to be with with Trout and Ohtani.
That's a ton of payroll, hence the trade plus the Angels get what they don't have now: additional players particularly relief pitching and another starter.
I think Judge has been hurt more than Trout, no?
Honestly, the only teams I think he might leave for are the Giants and
the Mets. Boston is theoretically possible, but if they traded a 26 year old homegrown superstar like Betts rather than pay him, it seems unlikely that they'd break the bank for Judge. Plus, they're saddled with Martinez for a while and will have Bogaerts and Devers hitting FA soon. The Dodgers, I don't know, it just doesn't seem feasible that they could afford him too. The Cardinals, unless I'm mistaken, have never signed anyone to a truly gargantuan contract before. Doesn't seem like their style.
The Mets absolutely would do it. They have the bankroll, a team playing great ball already, it's still NY so his life would be mostly unchanged. The Giants are his childhood team, back home in NoCal, a team that was really good last year and figures to be good again if they can add a big star.
Anyway, I have been a strong proponent of the Angels dealing Trout for young prospects. He's been there how long and they've won how many playoff games?
How many dominant years does he have left, esp with injuries starting to show now.
and the Yankees only advantage left is to sign him before he gets to market after the season. To do that, they will have to blow him away. If not, he goes to market and one of those teams does it, he is gone. I think if he gets to market, he is gone.
and the Yankees only advantage left is to sign him before he gets to market after the season. To do that, they will have to blow him away. If not, he goes to market and one of those teams does it, he is gone. I think if he gets to market, he is gone.
I believe that, if the money is at least roughly equivalent, he'll stay a Yankee. The Yankees can match anyone's offer. As much as Hal doesn't want to pay up, letting him leave would be such a disaster both from a PR standpoint and a baseball standpoint that I truly can't believe that they wouldn't give him whatever they have to in order to retain him. I mean, what's plan B? There isn't one. They'll trade away some of their vets to help offset the cost and you'll see young guys like Peraza and Cabrera taking their places as starters. Maybe even Volpe at some point, though 2024 is more likely.
RE: RE: and the Angels are a joke of an organization
Which represents a total question mark. Will they have new owners in place by the time free agency begins? Even if they do, would Judge be willing to put his faith in whoever it is? Yeah, money talks, but Judge is getting paid wherever he goes. Uncertain ownership was the biggest reason Bill Belichick refused to take the Jets' HC job in 2000.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: He will get more than 40 mil a year
How about a trade: Trout to the Yanks for boat load of prospects, and the Angels sign Judge.
Mike Trout is a great player that is constantly hurt. If the Angels go for Judge it will be to be with with Trout and Ohtani.
That's a ton of payroll, hence the trade plus the Angels get what they don't have now: additional players particularly relief pitching and another starter.
I think Judge has been hurt more than Trout, no?
Trout has been MLB longer, so more chances, but has not played a full season since 2016(2018 was 140 games) after being an iron man for 5 or 6 years. Only 101 games this year.
RE: RE: and the Angels are a joke of an organization
Anyway, I have been a strong proponent of the Angels dealing Trout for young prospects. He's been there how long and they've won how many playoff games?
How many dominant years does he have left, esp with injuries starting to show now.
What injuries starting to show? He had a broken wrist on a HBP and a undiagnosed collapsed lung - six months(?) in a freak accident diving for a ball. They have solved the oblique problem.
He's going to test the market and someone is going to throw silly money at Judge. It's going to take a lot of years and a lot of AAV.
He is not signing for under 40 AAV when he can easily get the same money for 7 years. I would not even want to know what a 9 year or 10 year contract with Judge would look like.
He's going to test the market and someone is going to throw silly money at Judge. It's going to take a lot of years and a lot of AAV.
He is not signing for under 40 AAV when he can easily get the same money for 7 years. I would not even want to know what a 9 year or 10 year contract with Judge would look like.
Judge is a very smart guy. Maybe he is not looking to spend the next 8-10 years living out of a suitcase. Just married. Will be starting a family. Maybe by 38 he will walk away to be home with kids.
Maybe he wants 500 Hrs - will need about 280 more that would be 40 /year for 7 years...
Perhaps 7/$350 gets it done....
RE: RE: IMO, there is no change Judge goes to the mets.
Why not? They have plenty of money to throw around and a competitive team.
A. I believe the Yankees will match any offer he gets.
B. I don't see Judge as the kind of guy that wants to make half of a city hate him. I don't see him sticking it to Yankee fans like that. I can see the west coast, but not the mets.
He's going to test the market and someone is going to throw silly money at Judge. It's going to take a lot of years and a lot of AAV.
He is not signing for under 40 AAV when he can easily get the same money for 7 years. I would not even want to know what a 9 year or 10 year contract with Judge would look like.
if you think Judge is accepting a 7 year deal. He wants a deal that brings him to retirement, 40/41 years old. That was clear when he was negotiating before the season. He will get 9 years, possibly 10 from someone.
They may be kicking themselves for painting themselves into this corner, but the consequences to letting him walk will be so drastic that I don't believe they have a choice.
They may be kicking themselves for painting themselves into this corner, but the consequences to letting him walk will be so drastic that I don't believe they have a choice.
Yep, this will cost them $100M extra. Judge is worth way too much as far as revenue generated to let him walk. They tried to get him at a bargain and now they will be paying top dollar.
if you think Judge is accepting a 7 year deal. He wants a deal that brings him to retirement, 40/41 years old. That was clear when he was negotiating before the season. He will get 9 years, possibly 10 from someone.
9 years and 350 million. get ready
There is not a doubt in my mind he can get 350 for 7. So, 350 for 9 is not even in the ballpark.
RE: RE: I do agree that the Yankees will match any offer
Yep, this will cost them $100M extra. Judge is worth way too much as far as revenue generated to let him walk. They tried to get him at a bargain and now they will be paying top dollar.
$100 mill extra over the last offer - ok. $100 mill over another team - no it will not.
if you think Judge is accepting a 7 year deal. He wants a deal that brings him to retirement, 40/41 years old. That was clear when he was negotiating before the season. He will get 9 years, possibly 10 from someone.
9 years and 350 million. get ready
There is not a doubt in my mind he can get 350 for 7. So, 350 for 9 is not even in the ballpark.
if you think Judge is accepting a 7 year deal. He wants a deal that brings him to retirement, 40/41 years old. That was clear when he was negotiating before the season. He will get 9 years, possibly 10 from someone.
9 years and 350 million. get ready
There is not a doubt in my mind he can get 350 for 7. So, 350 for 9 is not even in the ballpark.
but he's not seeing that over a 7/8 year deal. That's so far above what's being offered to other, younger players that it isn't even realistic. He will get more than Trout/Cole which puts him around $40m a year for a long term deal.
run in the $34 to $36 mill range and most were for much younger players. I think $40 mill is entirely reasonable and possible. That is 10% more than the highest current contracts and that is a huge leap.
I can see the Yanks conceding higher AAV vs length - keep it to 7/8 years vs 10 years.
Say 7/8$325/$350 vs 10/$400. If Judge wants to play until 40/41 years old I think the AAV will be lower.
but I'd bet a lot of money his AAV is closer to $40M than $50. Only 1 person makes OVER $40M and it's Scherzer because he only got 2 years.
He is also 38. Judge is somewhat old I guess, but he is 30 and he is going to win the Triple Crown and he can field. He is the ultimate five-tool player, who is coming to market on maybe the highest of any high any player has. He is going to break banks and records. I know from a damn good source his team is looking for 400 over 7. I am not saying they will get it or be anywhere close to getting it, but I do know he is not signing of 7 years 280 with the Yankees and I doubt he would sign for less than 350/7 before hitting the open market.
but I'd bet a lot of money his AAV is closer to $40M than $50. Only 1 person makes OVER $40M and it's Scherzer because he only got 2 years.
He is also 38. Judge is somewhat old I guess, but he is 30 and he is going to win the Triple Crown and he can field. He is the ultimate five-tool player, who is coming to market on maybe the highest of any high any player has. He is going to break banks and records. I know from a damn good source his team is looking for 400 over 7. I am not saying they will get it or be anywhere close to getting it, but I do know he is not signing of 7 years 280 with the Yankees and I doubt he would sign for less than 350/7 before hitting the open market.
You can look for whatever contract you want. But he wanted Trout money before the season. Getting Trout +$4 mill is pretty step increase. The jump from $35 mill to $50 mill is absurdly large. Out of the question? No. But not from the Yankees. I will not say never.
There is at some point a place the Yanks will say no.
It's absurd to think he will get $15M more per year than the next guy AND a long term deal when he will be 31 years old. His age now doesn't matter, he will be 31 when he signs the new deal.
That was literally the only thing he said that was true. How is judge not the ultimate 5 tool player?
Hits for power
Hits for average(.315 in this day and age is amazing)
He's a fast/good base runner
He is a GG caliber CF and RF
He has one of the best arms in all of baseball
He's a true leader and a great ambassador for the game
who is a plus fielder, leading the league in batting average, and 2nd on the team in Steals. That sounds like a hell of a player even if he only hits 20 HRs.
But he's also a 7'4" 450lb behemoth who hits 500ft homers in his sleep.
That was literally the only thing he said that was true. How is judge not the ultimate 5 tool player?
Hits for power
Hits for average(.315 in this day and age is amazing)
He's a fast/good base runner
He is a GG caliber CF and RF
He has one of the best arms in all of baseball
He's a true leader and a great ambassador for the game
I guess he's a 6 tool player
what else did I say that was untrue?
RE: RE: RE: and the Angels are a joke of an organization
Anyway, I have been a strong proponent of the Angels dealing Trout for young prospects. He's been there how long and they've won how many playoff games?
How many dominant years does he have left, esp with injuries starting to show now.
What injuries starting to show? He had a broken wrist on a HBP and a undiagnosed collapsed lung - six months(?) in a freak accident diving for a ball. They have solved the oblique problem.
He's got a bad back that he admits will need treatment daily for rest of his career. I'm just going on what they say.
Plus, with his body type and how hard he plays - injuries are going to happen IMO as he ages.
That was literally the only thing he said that was true. How is judge not the ultimate 5 tool player?
Hits for power
Hits for average(.315 in this day and age is amazing)
He's a fast/good base runner
He is a GG caliber CF and RF
He has one of the best arms in all of baseball
He's a true leader and a great ambassador for the game
I guess he's a 6 tool player
This year, no question.
But he's not a high average hitter, career.
RE: RE: RE: RE: and the Angels are a joke of an organization
Anyway, I have been a strong proponent of the Angels dealing Trout for young prospects. He's been there how long and they've won how many playoff games?
How many dominant years does he have left, esp with injuries starting to show now.
What injuries starting to show? He had a broken wrist on a HBP and a undiagnosed collapsed lung - six months(?) in a freak accident diving for a ball. They have solved the oblique problem.
He's got a bad back that he admits will need treatment daily for rest of his career. I'm just going on what they say.
Plus, with his body type and how hard he plays - injuries are going to happen IMO as he ages.
Can you delve into this one a little further. What bad back does he have and has he missed any games because of it? Aside from maybe a rest day here and there.
Also, regarding his body type, why is he more prone to injuries? Do you have examples of other extremely large guys that had injuries due to their size? There are a ton of football players that are his size and basketball players that are his size that play way more violently and have long careers, but a baseball player can't? None of this s accurate, IMO.
He's got a bad back that he admits will need treatment daily for rest of his career. I'm just going on what they say.
Plus, with his body type and how hard he plays - injuries are going to happen IMO as he ages.
Can you delve into this one a little further. What bad back does he have and has he missed any games because of it? Aside from maybe a rest day here and there.
Also, regarding his body type, why is he more prone to injuries? Do you have examples of other extremely large guys that had injuries due to their size? There are a ton of football players that are his size and basketball players that are his size that play way more violently and have long careers, but a baseball player can't? None of this s accurate, IMO.
I must have missed the bad back. As fluid as he is, I do not see a bad back. He had an oblique issue, which many players have gotten recently. But I do not remember a back.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: and the Angels are a joke of an organization
Anyway, I have been a strong proponent of the Angels dealing Trout for young prospects. He's been there how long and they've won how many playoff games?
How many dominant years does he have left, esp with injuries starting to show now.
What injuries starting to show? He had a broken wrist on a HBP and a undiagnosed collapsed lung - six months(?) in a freak accident diving for a ball. They have solved the oblique problem.
He's got a bad back that he admits will need treatment daily for rest of his career. I'm just going on what they say.
Plus, with his body type and how hard he plays - injuries are going to happen IMO as he ages.
Can you delve into this one a little further. What bad back does he have and has he missed any games because of it? Aside from maybe a rest day here and there.
Also, regarding his body type, why is he more prone to injuries? Do you have examples of other extremely large guys that had injuries due to their size? There are a ton of football players that are his size and basketball players that are his size that play way more violently and have long careers, but a baseball player can't? None of this s accurate, IMO.
Trout has said himself it's something he'll have to manage on a daily basis for the rest of his career.
Also had calf injury last season that he basically missed the whole season. He's had leg issues - which is one reason his SB are not even in the equation anymore.
Of course he could be injury free the rest of his career, I am obviously projecting.
And I'm saying this in terms of making a case for trading him - how many more years do the Angels get of what has been a fantastic career but playoff free (not all his fault).
RE: RE: It would be great to see Judge set the record for most home runs
in a 154 game schedule. He has seven games in which to hit at least one more. Too bad 73 is not within reach. I would love to see Bonds record surpassed. By the way, there can be no doubt that Bonds was fully juiced in 2001. The most HRs he hit in any other year was 49.
A couple quick two home run games…. And 70 wouldn’t be out of play.
70 would be nice. It would tie McGwire's roid season.
Anyway, I have been a strong proponent of the Angels dealing Trout for young prospects. He's been there how long and they've won how many playoff games?
How many dominant years does he have left, esp with injuries starting to show now.
What injuries starting to show? He had a broken wrist on a HBP and a undiagnosed collapsed lung - six months(?) in a freak accident diving for a ball. They have solved the oblique problem.
He's got a bad back that he admits will need treatment daily for rest of his career. I'm just going on what they say.
Plus, with his body type and how hard he plays - injuries are going to happen IMO as he ages.
Can you delve into this one a little further. What bad back does he have and has he missed any games because of it? Aside from maybe a rest day here and there.
Also, regarding his body type, why is he more prone to injuries? Do you have examples of other extremely large guys that had injuries due to their size? There are a ton of football players that are his size and basketball players that are his size that play way more violently and have long careers, but a baseball player can't? None of this s accurate, IMO.
Trout has said himself it's something he'll have to manage on a daily basis for the rest of his career.
Also had calf injury last season that he basically missed the whole season. He's had leg issues - which is one reason his SB are not even in the equation anymore.
Of course he could be injury free the rest of his career, I am obviously projecting.
And I'm saying this in terms of making a case for trading him - how many more years do the Angels get of what has been a fantastic career but playoff free (not all his fault).
Im confused. You're talking about Trout or Judge? You responded to a post about Judge, but it sounds like you are referring to Trout.
sorry for the misunderstanding. I thought(as others did apparently too) you were referring to judge when you said he's going to be injury prone because of his body type. Sorry for the confusion.
Ruth only played in 151 games but Judge and Maris also missed games.
Ruth only played in 151 games but Judge and Maris also missed games.
You are correct. I always thought it was the team's 151st.
I'm pretty sure that team is named the New York Yankees.
(jk of course)
You’re not. He’s in the clear lead for HR’s and RBI and looks like he’s .2 ahead in BA.
Quote:
Judge currently is leading all triple crown categories.
You’re not. He’s in the clear lead for HR’s and RBI and looks like he’s .2 ahead in BA.
Yup. Boegarts went 0-2 and Arraez 0-5.
Hate to root against guys, but in this case may they go 0 for the rest of the season
Going to be a nip and tuck race to the end between these three guys but the way Judge is locked in it wouldn’t surprise me if he opened up a lead on them. Especially if he gets 61 and 62 out of the way quickly.
Sometimes chasing things like that takes a guy out of his normal swing but so far doesn’t seem to be the case for Judge. It’d be great if he gets another tonight.
The post about Ruth getting an asterisk for hitting 60 while surrounded by one of the best lineups to every play is funny but true. Lou Gehrig behind Ruth. If Giancarlo was healthy the whole season it would be comparable - and Gehrig hit for high average too.
Still worth it if his production is anything close to this year. And the marketing end of things...kids have someone great to look up to.
Still worth it if his production is anything close to this year. And the marketing end of things...kids have someone great to look up to.
He'd be worth it at 35-45 HRs per year.
It was reported the snag was 7 years 245 vs 7 years 280. The price now will be around 7 years 400, if we are lucky. That was a huge mistake by Cashman. Whatever, you can't do anything about that now.
The reality is this might be the best season he will ever have and you have to pay for his 30+ year old years. No issue with price if he were 25, but he’s not.
A couple quick two home run games…. And 70 wouldn’t be out of play.
Quote:
50 mil to 60 mil
It was reported the snag was 7 years 245 vs 7 years 280. The price now will be around 7 years 400, if we are lucky. That was a huge mistake by Cashman. Whatever, you can't do anything about that now.
Judge and his team will know there is only so much the market will bear. I will not blame him for getting anything he gets, but I think $40 mill is a good target. Maybe the Yanks can go less years, but higher $$ per annum. Same overall numbers, but in a shorter period.
Judge keeps himself in great shape. Whatever the new S&C staff has done tweaking his workout regimine it is working. I think he can be effective until 38.
Realistically, 7 years at $300/$320 mill is my guess.
People forget the Yanks have two advantages- neither of which guarantee he will return- but both make it more likely than not.
One- he’s making $20M this year. To go to $40M is only a $20M difference to the Yanks- for all other teams, this is a real $40M payroll increase that likely limits other options.
Keep in mind as well that Chapman and Britton come off the Yanks payroll (there are other FAs too, but their salaries are the highest) at the end of the year. For luxury tax purposes, those two account for $31.5M- allowing the Yanks to go to $40M and still REDUCE their luxury tax for the payroll. That’s a major advantage.
Two- he will certainly get a QO. That hurts many teams ability to pursue giving out a contract that big AND giving up their second highest pick. The Yanks don’t have to give up anything to sign him and as noted above, take a smaller payroll hit.
In the end, I suspect that this will be an 8 year deal for a minimum of $40M. However, I would also not be surprised if it is a frontloaded deal. For luxury tax purposes, it remains $40M per over the life of the deal for the Yanks, but the actual cost goes down over time while the luxury tax limit will likely continue to rise.
The reason for a frontloaded deal is also due to the new CBA. If a player is traded during the life of a deal, the receiving team’s luxury bill is based on the remaining money left on the deal. In the past (like with the Stanton deal), it was based on the annual value of the deal when signed- thus Stanton’s luxury tax bill for the Yanks is only $22M ($25M minus the $3M per the Marlins kicked in) power year.
If the Yanks frontloaded the deal and then traded Judge when he’s 37 or 38, the new team would not be hit with a $40M luxury tax hit, but what remains. If frontloaded, the deal could be in the $20M something per year.
I would also note that the expectations that Judge would not be able to play out the whole deal might be misguided. We are too used to seeing the roided up sluggers break down in their mid-30s. I suspect that was more of a road side effect than the natural progression of time. For example, many years ago, Frank Howard played into his late 30s. However, Howard was never the athlete Judge is and wasn’t as good for an extended time as Judge is. Howard’s prime years were really about 5 years long. Judge might not be an OF by the end of the deal and might be a DH- but he’d still be effective as long as he stays healthy.
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In comment 15826016 Chip said:
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50 mil to 60 mil
It was reported the snag was 7 years 245 vs 7 years 280. The price now will be around 7 years 400, if we are lucky. That was a huge mistake by Cashman. Whatever, you can't do anything about that now.
Judge and his team will know there is only so much the market will bear. I will not blame him for getting anything he gets, but I think $40 mill is a good target. Maybe the Yanks can go less years, but higher $$ per annum. Same overall numbers, but in a shorter period.
Judge keeps himself in great shape. Whatever the new S&C staff has done tweaking his workout regimine it is working. I think he can be effective until 38.
Realistically, 7 years at $300/$320 mill is my guess.
He is going to have every big market suitor after him, this is going to end at 7/370 to 7/400. I promise you Judge will not sign with the Yankees for 300-320 for 7 years without at least testing the market. If the Yankees want to get this done, they are going to have to blow them out of the water.
Realistically, 7 years at $300/$320 mill is my guess.
He is going to have every big market suitor after him, this is going to end at 7/370 to 7/400. I promise you Judge will not sign with the Yankees for 300-320 for 7 years without at least testing the market. If the Yankees want to get this done, they are going to have to blow them out of the water.
Name the teams that can do that...
Dodgers, Mets, Red Sox, Giants(maybe), St Louis(Pujols is retiring), Angels
Dodgers already have a huge payroll - adding another $50 mill???
Mets - not far fetched
Red Sox - would be a coup - and 75 HR with the Green Monster is possible - but they are already sold out every game and only 40k people
Giants - hometown kid goes home
Angels - would they do it with Ohtani and Trout(monster line up)
St Louis - great BB town. He would be King of StL.
That's fine and might be accurate, but you are kidding yourselves that a player of his mangitude, coming off this season will be rational. You think if the Dodgers flame out in the playoffs again, they are going to be rational when they have never turned down a big contract? I doubt it. Whether he is worth it (which I think he is) or not is beside the point, he is going to get a paid on the open market a lot more than people on this thread believe.
That would have to be the best decision ever by a player.
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Realistically, 7 years at $300/$320 mill is my guess.
He is going to have every big market suitor after him, this is going to end at 7/370 to 7/400. I promise you Judge will not sign with the Yankees for 300-320 for 7 years without at least testing the market. If the Yankees want to get this done, they are going to have to blow them out of the water.
Name the teams that can do that...
Dodgers, Mets, Red Sox, Giants(maybe), St Louis(Pujols is retiring), Angels
Dodgers already have a huge payroll - adding another $50 mill???
Mets - not far fetched
Red Sox - would be a coup - and 75 HR with the Green Monster is possible - but they are already sold out every game and only 40k people
Giants - hometown kid goes home
Angels - would they do it with Ohtani and Trout(monster line up)
St Louis - great BB town. He would be King of StL.
How about a trade: Trout to the Yanks for boat load of prospects, and the Angels sign Judge.
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the exception and has an extended prime and/or remains productive through his mid to late 30s. I can certainly see him as a 1B/DH type slugger like Thome. But it's also possible his 30s ending up looking like Pujols with the Angels.
That's fine and might be accurate, but you are kidding yourselves that a player of his mangitude, coming off this season will be rational. You think if the Dodgers flame out in the playoffs again, they are going to be rational when they have never turned down a big contract? I doubt it. Whether he is worth it (which I think he is) or not is beside the point, he is going to get a paid on the open market a lot more than people on this thread believe.
I don't doubt he's going to get a monster contract. And it's certainly possible he's productive well into his 30s. But I think history tells us it's more likely the the back half (if not more) of that deal is going to be ugly.
How about a trade: Trout to the Yanks for boat load of prospects, and the Angels sign Judge.
Mike Trout is a great player that is constantly hurt. If the Angels go for Judge it will be to be with with Trout and Ohtani.
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How about a trade: Trout to the Yanks for boat load of prospects, and the Angels sign Judge.
Mike Trout is a great player that is constantly hurt. If the Angels go for Judge it will be to be with with Trout and Ohtani.
Angels wouldnt trade Ohtani for Judge straight up, or theyd be stupid to.
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How about a trade: Trout to the Yanks for boat load of prospects, and the Angels sign Judge.
Mike Trout is a great player that is constantly hurt. If the Angels go for Judge it will be to be with with Trout and Ohtani.
That's a ton of payroll, hence the trade plus the Angels get what they don't have now: additional players particularly relief pitching and another starter.
I think Judge has been hurt more than Trout, no?
The Mets absolutely would do it. They have the bankroll, a team playing great ball already, it's still NY so his life would be mostly unchanged. The Giants are his childhood team, back home in NoCal, a team that was really good last year and figures to be good again if they can add a big star.
Will be getting new ownership.
Money talks...............
Anyway, I have been a strong proponent of the Angels dealing Trout for young prospects. He's been there how long and they've won how many playoff games?
How many dominant years does he have left, esp with injuries starting to show now.
Largest contract in the history of the sport.
Largest AAV in the history of the sport, and really dwarving anyone else on a long term deal.
Of course, it's a game of maximizing. And they probably rake you over the coals for that 8th year to get to the unprecedented 4-handle on total size.
And if he won't take $400/8 years from the greatest franchise in the history of the game, he just doesn't like living here.
I believe that, if the money is at least roughly equivalent, he'll stay a Yankee. The Yankees can match anyone's offer. As much as Hal doesn't want to pay up, letting him leave would be such a disaster both from a PR standpoint and a baseball standpoint that I truly can't believe that they wouldn't give him whatever they have to in order to retain him. I mean, what's plan B? There isn't one. They'll trade away some of their vets to help offset the cost and you'll see young guys like Peraza and Cabrera taking their places as starters. Maybe even Volpe at some point, though 2024 is more likely.
Which represents a total question mark. Will they have new owners in place by the time free agency begins? Even if they do, would Judge be willing to put his faith in whoever it is? Yeah, money talks, but Judge is getting paid wherever he goes. Uncertain ownership was the biggest reason Bill Belichick refused to take the Jets' HC job in 2000.
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In comment 15826133 BillKo said:
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How about a trade: Trout to the Yanks for boat load of prospects, and the Angels sign Judge.
Mike Trout is a great player that is constantly hurt. If the Angels go for Judge it will be to be with with Trout and Ohtani.
That's a ton of payroll, hence the trade plus the Angels get what they don't have now: additional players particularly relief pitching and another starter.
I think Judge has been hurt more than Trout, no?
Trout has been MLB longer, so more chances, but has not played a full season since 2016(2018 was 140 games) after being an iron man for 5 or 6 years. Only 101 games this year.
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No one who wants to win would sign there.
Will be getting new ownership.
Money talks...............
Anyway, I have been a strong proponent of the Angels dealing Trout for young prospects. He's been there how long and they've won how many playoff games?
How many dominant years does he have left, esp with injuries starting to show now.
What injuries starting to show? He had a broken wrist on a HBP and a undiagnosed collapsed lung - six months(?) in a freak accident diving for a ball. They have solved the oblique problem.
Why not? They have plenty of money to throw around and a competitive team.
He is not signing for under 40 AAV when he can easily get the same money for 7 years. I would not even want to know what a 9 year or 10 year contract with Judge would look like.
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He's going to test the market and someone is going to throw silly money at Judge. It's going to take a lot of years and a lot of AAV.
He is not signing for under 40 AAV when he can easily get the same money for 7 years. I would not even want to know what a 9 year or 10 year contract with Judge would look like.
Judge is a very smart guy. Maybe he is not looking to spend the next 8-10 years living out of a suitcase. Just married. Will be starting a family. Maybe by 38 he will walk away to be home with kids.
Maybe he wants 500 Hrs - will need about 280 more that would be 40 /year for 7 years...
Perhaps 7/$350 gets it done....
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None.
Why not? They have plenty of money to throw around and a competitive team.
A. I believe the Yankees will match any offer he gets.
B. I don't see Judge as the kind of guy that wants to make half of a city hate him. I don't see him sticking it to Yankee fans like that. I can see the west coast, but not the mets.
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He's going to test the market and someone is going to throw silly money at Judge. It's going to take a lot of years and a lot of AAV.
He is not signing for under 40 AAV when he can easily get the same money for 7 years. I would not even want to know what a 9 year or 10 year contract with Judge would look like.
Well, you're going to find out.
9 years and 350 million. get ready
Yep, this will cost them $100M extra. Judge is worth way too much as far as revenue generated to let him walk. They tried to get him at a bargain and now they will be paying top dollar.
And I think he genuinely like being in NY. Maybe he has the leverage to make Hal open up the check book more this offseason and improve the team more.
9 years and 350 million. get ready
There is not a doubt in my mind he can get 350 for 7. So, 350 for 9 is not even in the ballpark.
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Yep, this will cost them $100M extra. Judge is worth way too much as far as revenue generated to let him walk. They tried to get him at a bargain and now they will be paying top dollar.
$100 mill extra over the last offer - ok. $100 mill over another team - no it will not.
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if you think Judge is accepting a 7 year deal. He wants a deal that brings him to retirement, 40/41 years old. That was clear when he was negotiating before the season. He will get 9 years, possibly 10 from someone.
9 years and 350 million. get ready
There is not a doubt in my mind he can get 350 for 7. So, 350 for 9 is not even in the ballpark.
Bro, he's not getting $50M per year.
Judge will get around $40M AAV and they will have to give him an extra 2 years to get it done, IMO.
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In comment 15826338 Kmed6000 said:
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if you think Judge is accepting a 7 year deal. He wants a deal that brings him to retirement, 40/41 years old. That was clear when he was negotiating before the season. He will get 9 years, possibly 10 from someone.
9 years and 350 million. get ready
There is not a doubt in my mind he can get 350 for 7. So, 350 for 9 is not even in the ballpark.
Bro, he's not getting $50M per year.
Yes, he is.
I can see the Yanks conceding higher AAV vs length - keep it to 7/8 years vs 10 years.
Say 7/8$325/$350 vs 10/$400. If Judge wants to play until 40/41 years old I think the AAV will be lower.
He is also 38. Judge is somewhat old I guess, but he is 30 and he is going to win the Triple Crown and he can field. He is the ultimate five-tool player, who is coming to market on maybe the highest of any high any player has. He is going to break banks and records. I know from a damn good source his team is looking for 400 over 7. I am not saying they will get it or be anywhere close to getting it, but I do know he is not signing of 7 years 280 with the Yankees and I doubt he would sign for less than 350/7 before hitting the open market.
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but I'd bet a lot of money his AAV is closer to $40M than $50. Only 1 person makes OVER $40M and it's Scherzer because he only got 2 years.
He is also 38. Judge is somewhat old I guess, but he is 30 and he is going to win the Triple Crown and he can field. He is the ultimate five-tool player, who is coming to market on maybe the highest of any high any player has. He is going to break banks and records. I know from a damn good source his team is looking for 400 over 7. I am not saying they will get it or be anywhere close to getting it, but I do know he is not signing of 7 years 280 with the Yankees and I doubt he would sign for less than 350/7 before hitting the open market.
You can look for whatever contract you want. But he wanted Trout money before the season. Getting Trout +$4 mill is pretty step increase. The jump from $35 mill to $50 mill is absurdly large. Out of the question? No. But not from the Yankees. I will not say never.
There is at some point a place the Yanks will say no.
That was literally the only thing he said that was true. How is judge not the ultimate 5 tool player?
Hits for power
Hits for average(.315 in this day and age is amazing)
He's a fast/good base runner
He is a GG caliber CF and RF
He has one of the best arms in all of baseball
He's a true leader and a great ambassador for the game
I guess he's a 6 tool player
But he's also a 7'4" 450lb behemoth who hits 500ft homers in his sleep.
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lol. Settle down.
That was literally the only thing he said that was true. How is judge not the ultimate 5 tool player?
Hits for power
Hits for average(.315 in this day and age is amazing)
He's a fast/good base runner
He is a GG caliber CF and RF
He has one of the best arms in all of baseball
He's a true leader and a great ambassador for the game
I guess he's a 6 tool player
what else did I say that was untrue?
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In comment 15826173 Greg from LI said:
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No one who wants to win would sign there.
Will be getting new ownership.
Money talks...............
Anyway, I have been a strong proponent of the Angels dealing Trout for young prospects. He's been there how long and they've won how many playoff games?
How many dominant years does he have left, esp with injuries starting to show now.
What injuries starting to show? He had a broken wrist on a HBP and a undiagnosed collapsed lung - six months(?) in a freak accident diving for a ball. They have solved the oblique problem.
He's got a bad back that he admits will need treatment daily for rest of his career. I'm just going on what they say.
Plus, with his body type and how hard he plays - injuries are going to happen IMO as he ages.
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lol. Settle down.
That was literally the only thing he said that was true. How is judge not the ultimate 5 tool player?
Hits for power
Hits for average(.315 in this day and age is amazing)
He's a fast/good base runner
He is a GG caliber CF and RF
He has one of the best arms in all of baseball
He's a true leader and a great ambassador for the game
I guess he's a 6 tool player
This year, no question.
But he's not a high average hitter, career.
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In comment 15826178 BillKo said:
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In comment 15826173 Greg from LI said:
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No one who wants to win would sign there.
Will be getting new ownership.
Money talks...............
Anyway, I have been a strong proponent of the Angels dealing Trout for young prospects. He's been there how long and they've won how many playoff games?
How many dominant years does he have left, esp with injuries starting to show now.
What injuries starting to show? He had a broken wrist on a HBP and a undiagnosed collapsed lung - six months(?) in a freak accident diving for a ball. They have solved the oblique problem.
He's got a bad back that he admits will need treatment daily for rest of his career. I'm just going on what they say.
Plus, with his body type and how hard he plays - injuries are going to happen IMO as he ages.
Can you delve into this one a little further. What bad back does he have and has he missed any games because of it? Aside from maybe a rest day here and there.
Also, regarding his body type, why is he more prone to injuries? Do you have examples of other extremely large guys that had injuries due to their size? There are a ton of football players that are his size and basketball players that are his size that play way more violently and have long careers, but a baseball player can't? None of this s accurate, IMO.
He's got a bad back that he admits will need treatment daily for rest of his career. I'm just going on what they say.
Plus, with his body type and how hard he plays - injuries are going to happen IMO as he ages.
Can you delve into this one a little further. What bad back does he have and has he missed any games because of it? Aside from maybe a rest day here and there.
Also, regarding his body type, why is he more prone to injuries? Do you have examples of other extremely large guys that had injuries due to their size? There are a ton of football players that are his size and basketball players that are his size that play way more violently and have long careers, but a baseball player can't? None of this s accurate, IMO.
I must have missed the bad back. As fluid as he is, I do not see a bad back. He had an oblique issue, which many players have gotten recently. But I do not remember a back.
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In comment 15826257 section125 said:
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In comment 15826178 BillKo said:
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In comment 15826173 Greg from LI said:
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No one who wants to win would sign there.
Will be getting new ownership.
Money talks...............
Anyway, I have been a strong proponent of the Angels dealing Trout for young prospects. He's been there how long and they've won how many playoff games?
How many dominant years does he have left, esp with injuries starting to show now.
What injuries starting to show? He had a broken wrist on a HBP and a undiagnosed collapsed lung - six months(?) in a freak accident diving for a ball. They have solved the oblique problem.
He's got a bad back that he admits will need treatment daily for rest of his career. I'm just going on what they say.
Plus, with his body type and how hard he plays - injuries are going to happen IMO as he ages.
Can you delve into this one a little further. What bad back does he have and has he missed any games because of it? Aside from maybe a rest day here and there.
Also, regarding his body type, why is he more prone to injuries? Do you have examples of other extremely large guys that had injuries due to their size? There are a ton of football players that are his size and basketball players that are his size that play way more violently and have long careers, but a baseball player can't? None of this s accurate, IMO.
https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/34303098/mike-trout-dealing-pretty-rare-back-condition-according-los-angeles-angels-trainer
Trout has said himself it's something he'll have to manage on a daily basis for the rest of his career.
Also had calf injury last season that he basically missed the whole season. He's had leg issues - which is one reason his SB are not even in the equation anymore.
Of course he could be injury free the rest of his career, I am obviously projecting.
And I'm saying this in terms of making a case for trading him - how many more years do the Angels get of what has been a fantastic career but playoff free (not all his fault).
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in a 154 game schedule. He has seven games in which to hit at least one more. Too bad 73 is not within reach. I would love to see Bonds record surpassed. By the way, there can be no doubt that Bonds was fully juiced in 2001. The most HRs he hit in any other year was 49.
A couple quick two home run games…. And 70 wouldn’t be out of play.
70 would be nice. It would tie McGwire's roid season.
Yeah, I'm more thinking in terms of hitting that.300 mark.
And remember, that .284 includes this year - which it should.
But the question becomes over the next 5-8 years of his career is he closer to a .270 hitter or .300 hitter.
We will know then.
But for 2022, he's the best in the sport.
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In comment 15826511 BillKo said:
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In comment 15826257 section125 said:
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In comment 15826178 BillKo said:
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In comment 15826173 Greg from LI said:
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No one who wants to win would sign there.
Will be getting new ownership.
Money talks...............
Anyway, I have been a strong proponent of the Angels dealing Trout for young prospects. He's been there how long and they've won how many playoff games?
How many dominant years does he have left, esp with injuries starting to show now.
What injuries starting to show? He had a broken wrist on a HBP and a undiagnosed collapsed lung - six months(?) in a freak accident diving for a ball. They have solved the oblique problem.
He's got a bad back that he admits will need treatment daily for rest of his career. I'm just going on what they say.
Plus, with his body type and how hard he plays - injuries are going to happen IMO as he ages.
Can you delve into this one a little further. What bad back does he have and has he missed any games because of it? Aside from maybe a rest day here and there.
Also, regarding his body type, why is he more prone to injuries? Do you have examples of other extremely large guys that had injuries due to their size? There are a ton of football players that are his size and basketball players that are his size that play way more violently and have long careers, but a baseball player can't? None of this s accurate, IMO.
https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/34303098/mike-trout-dealing-pretty-rare-back-condition-according-los-angeles-angels-trainer
Trout has said himself it's something he'll have to manage on a daily basis for the rest of his career.
Also had calf injury last season that he basically missed the whole season. He's had leg issues - which is one reason his SB are not even in the equation anymore.
Of course he could be injury free the rest of his career, I am obviously projecting.
And I'm saying this in terms of making a case for trading him - how many more years do the Angels get of what has been a fantastic career but playoff free (not all his fault).
Im confused. You're talking about Trout or Judge? You responded to a post about Judge, but it sounds like you are referring to Trout.
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it's sad to say, but that's a high BA in this day and age.
Yeah, I'm more thinking in terms of hitting that.300 mark.
And remember, that .284 includes this year - which it should.
But the question becomes over the next 5-8 years of his career is he closer to a .270 hitter or .300 hitter.
We will know then.
But for 2022, he's the best in the sport.
This aint your dads mlb. There are currently only 11 players in all of MLB hitting over .300 and most are barely over.