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Michael Lombardi - “Daboll doesn’t trust Jones”

JoeyBigBlue : 9/27/2022 1:20 pm
In the latest GM Shuffle, Lombardi claims that it’s obvious that Daboll doesn’t fully trust Jones. He specifically references the end of the the 2nd quarter. Giants get the ball from the Cowboys with 2:30 seconds left until halftime, with all 3 timeouts. Instead of running a two minute drill to get some points, Daboll is perfectly fine with sitting on the ball and going into half time. Hard to argue against this. It probably is a reflection on Daboll’s outlook on Jones.
I agree.  
BrettNYG10 : 9/27/2022 1:21 pm : link
I thought it was even more obvious in the first two games.
Or maybe  
five5 : 9/27/2022 1:22 pm : link
It was awful clock management by the coach?
He doesn't trust him but  
Giantimistic : 9/27/2022 1:23 pm : link
goes for it on 4th and 2 on the 50 and throws a pass.

Not sure I buy this.

Maybe he doesn't trust his oline yet.
Probably better  
Lines of Scrimmage : 9/27/2022 1:23 pm : link
to start with "BD does not trust Jones, his OL and WR's at critical times in the game".
WTF?  
robbieballs2003 : 9/27/2022 1:23 pm : link
The lack of timeouts used was stupid but what the fuck is he talking about again. Yeah, they don't trust "Jones" but went for it on 4th and 2. Please stop referencing this dumbass.
He’s right.  
ajr2456 : 9/27/2022 1:23 pm : link
Said it week 1.
How did the Giants sit on the ball  
robbieballs2003 : 9/27/2022 1:24 pm : link
?
Then why did they call 8 consecutive Passing plays that drive?  
guitarguybs12 : 9/27/2022 1:24 pm : link
.
This is pretty damn apparent  
BigBlue7 : 9/27/2022 1:24 pm : link

And it's not that he doesn't trust Jones to make the right throw - he doesn't trust Jones to get the ball out to the right read on time.

Most of the frustration I have seen from Daboll on the sidelines is when Jones comes of his first read and then throws the ball away.

So it's not a frustration with Jones being wreckless, but more of a frustration for Jones not seeing the whole field and pulling the trigger.

Would love if there was an All 22 breakdown of every pass play to show what was supposed to happen vs what actually happened.
What an asswipe  
Giants73 : 9/27/2022 1:25 pm : link
Giants were driving down the field, then there was a bs opi that led to 3rd and 23. Sure doesn’t trust him though. Douchbag
RE: Then why did they call 8 consecutive Passing plays that drive?  
robbieballs2003 : 9/27/2022 1:25 pm : link
In comment 15835256 guitarguybs12 said:
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.


Stop with facts. That's not allowed. Feelings are what matter.
RE: This is pretty damn apparent  
guitarguybs12 : 9/27/2022 1:25 pm : link
In comment 15835258 BigBlue7 said:
Quote:

Most of the frustration I have seen from Daboll on the sidelines is when Jones comes of his first read and then throws the ball away.

So it's not a frustration with Jones being wreckless, but more of a frustration for Jones not seeing the whole field and pulling the trigger.


well now you're just extrapolating bullshit
Again, I don't it's a "doesnt trust Jones"  
BigBlue7 : 9/27/2022 1:25 pm : link
the same way Judge didn't trust Glennon.

Jones  
US1 Giants : 9/27/2022 1:26 pm : link
Neither the 2-minute offense nor the red zone offense is in DJ's toolbox.
Michael Lombardi said that  
larryflower37 : 9/27/2022 1:27 pm : link
Wow I would have never thought he would take the opportunity to bash the Giants and try to start controversy where there was none with the Giants
RE: RE: This is pretty damn apparent  
BigBlue7 : 9/27/2022 1:27 pm : link
In comment 15835261 guitarguybs12 said:
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In comment 15835258 BigBlue7 said:


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Most of the frustration I have seen from Daboll on the sidelines is when Jones comes of his first read and then throws the ball away.

So it's not a frustration with Jones being wreckless, but more of a frustration for Jones not seeing the whole field and pulling the trigger.




well now you're just extrapolating bullshit



"I don't have any other counterpoints so I will just go right for a personal attack"
RE: How did the Giants sit on the ball  
JoeyBigBlue : 9/27/2022 1:28 pm : link
In comment 15835255 robbieballs2003 said:
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?


There was no urgency in that drive. On the first play Jones ran for a a yard and they let the clock run down to the 2 minute warning. On the next play Jones runs for 10 yards, and they let the clock run down to 1:35. It’s pretty apparent that they could’ve done a ton more if they wanted to score on that drive.
RE: RE: RE: This is pretty damn apparent  
robbieballs2003 : 9/27/2022 1:28 pm : link
In comment 15835267 BigBlue7 said:
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In comment 15835261 guitarguybs12 said:


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In comment 15835258 BigBlue7 said:


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Most of the frustration I have seen from Daboll on the sidelines is when Jones comes of his first read and then throws the ball away.

So it's not a frustration with Jones being wreckless, but more of a frustration for Jones not seeing the whole field and pulling the trigger.




well now you're just extrapolating bullshit




"I don't have any other counterpoints so I will just go right for a personal attack"


How many balls has Jones thrown away?
RE: He doesn't trust him but  
OBJ_AllDay : 9/27/2022 1:29 pm : link
In comment 15835250 Giantimistic said:
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goes for it on 4th and 2 on the 50 and throws a pass.

Not sure I buy this.

Maybe he doesn't trust his oline yet.


Had no issue going for it, but you need to run something down the field more if your going to do it. Can't leave the cowboys time to run 2 plays following a miss there.
RE: RE: How did the Giants sit on the ball  
robbieballs2003 : 9/27/2022 1:29 pm : link
In comment 15835269 JoeyBigBlue said:
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In comment 15835255 robbieballs2003 said:


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?



There was no urgency in that drive. On the first play Jones ran for a a yard and they let the clock run down to the 2 minute warning. On the next play Jones runs for 10 yards, and they let the clock run down to 1:35. It’s pretty apparent that they could’ve done a ton more if they wanted to score on that drive.


They were in a hurry up offense calling the play on the fly. They weren't sitting on the ball. It is amazing what people think they see.
The Mannings  
OBJRoyal : 9/27/2022 1:29 pm : link
Specifically Payton, couldn’t believe the Giants never called a timeout.
RE: Again, I don't it's a  
Thunderstruck27 : 9/27/2022 1:29 pm : link
In comment 15835262 BigBlue7 said:
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the same way Judge didn't trust Glennon.


Where do people come up with this shit?
Not trusting Lombardi is a better way to go through life  
ghost718 : 9/27/2022 1:30 pm : link
.
The great thing about "talking heads" is there is one  
Walker Gillette : 9/27/2022 1:30 pm : link
for everybody! I guess guys sit around trying to find underserved opinions and if they do, wahlah! I had a friend who worked for a betting service in the 90s, they told one half of their customers to take the points and the other half to give. This way they were guaranteed to have happy customers. You don't have to make everybody happy, just enough.
And I put Jones in quotes before  
robbieballs2003 : 9/27/2022 1:31 pm : link
because how can anything be blamed on Jones. We have no WR. Our OL is garbage but, yeah, he doesn't trust Jones. Please explain going for it on 4th and 2 by throwing it with Jones at midfield with not trusting Jones. If they didn't trust Jones they would have punted it away.
Or maybe...  
manh george : 9/27/2022 1:32 pm : link
it was a reflection on the entire Giants offense, with a sieve for an OL that was getting Jones killed, no top-flight wr's, and an exceedingly mediocre TE pair headed by a green rookie?

Daboll could be having an illicit love affair with Jones and there would STILL be absolutely no reason for him to believe that THIS offense could hold up in a two-minute drill.

This particular example is absolutely pathetic "proof" as to whether or not Daboll thinks Jones can perform his function competently.
Michael Lombardi  
larryflower37 : 9/27/2022 1:32 pm : link
The same guy that picks Washington to win the division every year?
Hey I’m not taking Lombardi’s word as gospel  
JoeyBigBlue : 9/27/2022 1:33 pm : link
But it was very apparent in that drive that Daboll was content to go into half time. I think even Aikman mentioned it on the broadcast.
RE: Hey I’m not taking Lombardi’s word as gospel  
robbieballs2003 : 9/27/2022 1:34 pm : link
In comment 15835288 JoeyBigBlue said:
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But it was very apparent in that drive that Daboll was content to go into half time. I think even Aikman mentioned it on the broadcast.


How was it apparent when they went for it on 4th and 2? Holy shit.
RE: This is pretty damn apparent  
speedywheels : 9/27/2022 1:34 pm : link
In comment 15835258 BigBlue7 said:
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And it's not that he doesn't trust Jones to make the right throw - he doesn't trust Jones to get the ball out to the right read on time.

Most of the frustration I have seen from Daboll on the sidelines is when Jones comes of his first read and then throws the ball away.

How many times did he "throw the ball away" last night?

Then compare that with the number of times he was running for his life and/or got sacked

So it's not a frustration with Jones being wreckless, but more of a frustration for Jones not seeing the whole field and pulling the trigger.

Would love if there was an All 22 breakdown of every pass play to show what was supposed to happen vs what actually happened.
RE: RE: Hey I’m not taking Lombardi’s word as gospel  
JoeyBigBlue : 9/27/2022 1:35 pm : link
In comment 15835291 robbieballs2003 said:
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In comment 15835288 JoeyBigBlue said:


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But it was very apparent in that drive that Daboll was content to go into half time. I think even Aikman mentioned it on the broadcast.



How was it apparent when they went for it on 4th and 2? Holy shit.



What are you talking about ? They never got to 4th and 2 on that drive.
RE: This is pretty damn apparent  
speedywheels : 9/27/2022 1:36 pm : link
In comment 15835258 BigBlue7 said:
Quote:

And it's not that he doesn't trust Jones to make the right throw - he doesn't trust Jones to get the ball out to the right read on time.

Most of the frustration I have seen from Daboll on the sidelines is when Jones comes of his first read and then throws the ball away.

So it's not a frustration with Jones being wreckless, but more of a frustration for Jones not seeing the whole field and pulling the trigger.

Would love if there was an All 22 breakdown of every pass play to show what was supposed to happen vs what actually happened.


How many times did Jones "throw the ball away" last night?

Compare that to how many times was he running for his life and/or got sacked?
RE: Michael Lombardi  
JoeyBigBlue : 9/27/2022 1:36 pm : link
In comment 15835285 larryflower37 said:
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The same guy that picks Washington to win the division every year?


He actually picked Philadelphia this season.
RE: RE: RE: Hey I’m not taking Lombardi’s word as gospel  
robbieballs2003 : 9/27/2022 1:38 pm : link
In comment 15835294 JoeyBigBlue said:
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In comment 15835291 robbieballs2003 said:


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In comment 15835288 JoeyBigBlue said:


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But it was very apparent in that drive that Daboll was content to go into half time. I think even Aikman mentioned it on the broadcast.



How was it apparent when they went for it on 4th and 2? Holy shit.




What are you talking about ? They never got to 4th and 2 on that drive.


I was at the game. They went for it on 4th down and didn't get it. Dallas got the ball back and drove a little bit and missed the FG.
RE: RE: RE: Hey I’m not taking Lombardi’s word as gospel  
speedywheels : 9/27/2022 1:38 pm : link
In comment 15835294 JoeyBigBlue said:
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What are you talking about ? They never got to 4th and 2 on that drive.


Yes. Yes they did.
Game play by play - ( New Window )
RE: RE: RE: RE: Hey I’m not taking Lombardi’s word as gospel  
robbieballs2003 : 9/27/2022 1:39 pm : link
In comment 15835300 robbieballs2003 said:
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In comment 15835294 JoeyBigBlue said:


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In comment 15835291 robbieballs2003 said:


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In comment 15835288 JoeyBigBlue said:


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But it was very apparent in that drive that Daboll was content to go into half time. I think even Aikman mentioned it on the broadcast.



How was it apparent when they went for it on 4th and 2? Holy shit.




What are you talking about ? They never got to 4th and 2 on that drive.



I was at the game. They went for it on 4th down and didn't get it. Dallas got the ball back and drove a little bit and missed the FG.


1st & 10 at NYG 20
(2:30 - 2nd) D.Jones scrambles right end pushed ob at NYG 21 for 1 yard (C.Golston).

(2:30 - 2nd) Two-Minute Warning

2nd & 9 at NYG 21
(2:00 - 2nd) (Shotgun) D.Jones up the middle to NYG 31 for 10 yards (D.Lawrence).

1st & 10 at NYG 31
(1:35 - 2nd) (No Huddle, Shotgun) D.Jones pass short middle to R.James to NYG 45 for 14 yards (J.Lewis).

1st & 10 at NYG 45
(1:15 - 2nd) (No Huddle, Shotgun) D.Jones sacked at NYG 42 for -3 yards (D.Lawrence).

(1:15 - 2nd) Timeout #1 by DAL at 00:42.

2nd & 13 at NYG 42
(0:42 - 2nd) (Shotgun) D.Jones pass incomplete short right.

3rd & 13 at NYG 42
(0:35 - 2nd) (Shotgun) D.Jones pass deep right to K.Golladay to DAL 38 for 20 yards (M.Hooker) [D.Armstrong]. DAL-T.Diggs was injured during the play. PENALTY on NYG-S.Shepard, Offensive Pass Interference, 10 yards, enforced at NYG 42 - No Play.

3rd & 23 at NYG 32
(0:24 - 2nd) (Shotgun) D.Jones pass short left to S.Barkley to DAL 47 for 21 yards (L.Vander Esch; D.Wilson).

(0:24 - 2nd) Timeout #2 by DAL at 00:10.

4th & 2 at DAL 47
(0:10 - 2nd) (Shotgun) D.Jones pass incomplete short left to K.Golladay.

(0:08 - 2nd) Timeout #1 by NYG at 00:08.
Some of you seem to have inside info  
joeinpa : 9/27/2022 1:39 pm : link
From the coach. In your next convo with him could you ask whom they are drafting to replace him next season…. Thanks in advance
Hmmm  
jvm52106 : 9/27/2022 1:40 pm : link
so none of you see that DaBoll didn't want to give the Boys a chance to have the ball with a bunch of time left and by calling time outs you let Dallas substitute in and prepare as well.

I was fine with it but the pass to Golladay was the questionable part. I thought we could have come up with something better.

Not trusting Jones is an answer in a vacuum but what about not trusting my Oline, or my shitty WR's to able to do anything!!!!
RE: RE: RE: RE: Hey I’m not taking Lombardi’s word as gospel  
JoeyBigBlue : 9/27/2022 1:41 pm : link
In comment 15835300 robbieballs2003 said:
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In comment 15835294 JoeyBigBlue said:


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In comment 15835291 robbieballs2003 said:


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In comment 15835288 JoeyBigBlue said:


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But it was very apparent in that drive that Daboll was content to go into half time. I think even Aikman mentioned it on the broadcast.



How was it apparent when they went for it on 4th and 2? Holy shit.




What are you talking about ? They never got to 4th and 2 on that drive.



I was at the game. They went for it on 4th down and didn't get it. Dallas got the ball back and drove a little bit and missed the FG.



My bad, you’re right. I forgot they picked up 21 yards on a Barkley short pass.
Jones just doesn't have IT  
GiantBlue : 9/27/2022 1:43 pm : link
He holds the ball too long and makes poor decisions.

He will be a fine back-up to some team.
Nobody with a straight face can argue that Daboll  
robbieballs2003 : 9/27/2022 1:43 pm : link
doesn't trust Jones when they went for it on 4th and 2 with the risk of not converting that could have lead to 3 points the other way.
RE: WTF?  
UConn4523 : 9/27/2022 1:44 pm : link
In comment 15835252 robbieballs2003 said:
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The lack of timeouts used was stupid but what the fuck is he talking about again. Yeah, they don't trust "Jones" but went for it on 4th and 2. Please stop referencing this dumbass.


Yeah, it doesn't make sense.
RE: Nobody with a straight face can argue that Daboll  
UConn4523 : 9/27/2022 1:45 pm : link
In comment 15835317 robbieballs2003 said:
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doesn't trust Jones when they went for it on 4th and 2 with the risk of not converting that could have lead to 3 points the other way.


The only thing I can think of is that he saw how the pressure was constant and didn't "Trust" that to fix itself before the half. That would make sense to me. Once we had a little momentum his decision to keep going made sense to me.
RE: Nobody with a straight face can argue that Daboll  
ajr2456 : 9/27/2022 1:45 pm : link
In comment 15835317 robbieballs2003 said:
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doesn't trust Jones when they went for it on 4th and 2 with the risk of not converting that could have lead to 3 points the other way.


One play doesn’t make the point false.
RE: Jones just doesn't have IT  
uconngiant : 9/27/2022 1:45 pm : link
In comment 15835315 GiantBlue said:
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He holds the ball too long and makes poor decisions.

He will be a fine back-up to some team.


Another yahoo I see.

The line was like the Red Sea opening with Moses. It was terrible most of the night. He was pressured 22 times last night, that is not on him
Yeah, not trusting the OL I can buy.  
robbieballs2003 : 9/27/2022 1:46 pm : link
But Jones? It is more agenda driven bullshit by Lombardi.
RE: RE: Nobody with a straight face can argue that Daboll  
robbieballs2003 : 9/27/2022 1:47 pm : link
In comment 15835324 ajr2456 said:
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In comment 15835317 robbieballs2003 said:


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doesn't trust Jones when they went for it on 4th and 2 with the risk of not converting that could have lead to 3 points the other way.



One play doesn’t make the point false.


Yes it does. If he didn't trust Jones he would have punted.
RE: Nobody with a straight face can argue that Daboll  
JoeyBigBlue : 9/27/2022 1:47 pm : link
In comment 15835317 robbieballs2003 said:
Quote:
doesn't trust Jones when they went for it on 4th and 2 with the risk of not converting that could have lead to 3 points the other way.



It was 10 seconds to go on the Dal 47. Daboll called a safe play to Golladay who should of made the catch and put the team in FG range. There wasn’t much of gamble.
They also wouldn't have continued to pass the ball.  
robbieballs2003 : 9/27/2022 1:48 pm : link
They would have ran tbe clock out. It is unreal arguing this.
BigBlue7 is on a special kind of roll today  
Mad Mike : 9/27/2022 1:48 pm : link
Pearls from one thread to the next.
They could not trust Jones  
ajr2456 : 9/27/2022 1:48 pm : link
And still go for it in that spot because they felt they had to.
RE: RE: Nobody with a straight face can argue that Daboll  
robbieballs2003 : 9/27/2022 1:49 pm : link
In comment 15835329 JoeyBigBlue said:
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In comment 15835317 robbieballs2003 said:


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doesn't trust Jones when they went for it on 4th and 2 with the risk of not converting that could have lead to 3 points the other way.




It was 10 seconds to go on the Dal 47. Daboll called a safe play to Golladay who should of made the catch and put the team in FG range. There wasn’t much of gamble.


Are you serious? They almost gave up 3 points to Dallas by not converting. I feel like I am dealing with such stubborn people trying to validate this moron's point.
RE: They could not trust Jones  
robbieballs2003 : 9/27/2022 1:49 pm : link
In comment 15835332 ajr2456 said:
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And still go for it in that spot because they felt they had to.


Why would they have to?
RE: They also wouldn't have continued to pass the ball.  
ajr2456 : 9/27/2022 1:49 pm : link
In comment 15835330 robbieballs2003 said:
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They would have ran tbe clock out. It is unreal arguing this.


And what concede the game? Based on this logic the only way they don’t trust Jones is if they run the ball every play?
Daboll  
PaulN : 9/27/2022 1:50 pm : link
Fucked up the time management toward the end of the half, not Jones. You play aggressive and play to win. That was not what he promised us. That was a bad job.
RE: RE: They could not trust Jones  
ajr2456 : 9/27/2022 1:50 pm : link
In comment 15835334 robbieballs2003 said:
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In comment 15835332 ajr2456 said:


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And still go for it in that spot because they felt they had to.



Why would they have to?


Because the data supports going for it and the team needed to get some points.
RE: RE: They also wouldn't have continued to pass the ball.  
robbieballs2003 : 9/27/2022 1:50 pm : link
In comment 15835336 ajr2456 said:
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In comment 15835330 robbieballs2003 said:


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They would have ran tbe clock out. It is unreal arguing this.



And what concede the game? Based on this logic the only way they don’t trust Jones is if they run the ball every play?


ajr, you are smarter than this. You're hatred for Jones is clouding this argument for you.
There were many problems  
Dave on the UWS : 9/27/2022 1:51 pm : link
last night, but the QB who got his ass kicked virtually EVERY play was NOT one of them.
RE: RE: RE: They could not trust Jones  
robbieballs2003 : 9/27/2022 1:52 pm : link
In comment 15835338 ajr2456 said:
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In comment 15835334 robbieballs2003 said:


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In comment 15835332 ajr2456 said:


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And still go for it in that spot because they felt they had to.



Why would they have to?



Because the data supports going for it and the team needed to get some points.


So what is the argument, Daboll doesn't trust Jones but goes for it anyway? Isn't thst the exact opposite of what Lombardi is saying?
It’s not.  
ajr2456 : 9/27/2022 1:52 pm : link
They don’t fully trust him. It’s been obvious since week 1.
RE: RE: RE: Nobody with a straight face can argue that Daboll  
JoeyBigBlue : 9/27/2022 1:52 pm : link
In comment 15835333 robbieballs2003 said:
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In comment 15835329 JoeyBigBlue said:


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In comment 15835317 robbieballs2003 said:


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doesn't trust Jones when they went for it on 4th and 2 with the risk of not converting that could have lead to 3 points the other way.




It was 10 seconds to go on the Dal 47. Daboll called a safe play to Golladay who should of made the catch and put the team in FG range. There wasn’t much of gamble.



Are you serious? They almost gave up 3 points to Dallas by not converting. I feel like I am dealing with such stubborn people trying to validate this moron's point.



It was a slight gamble. Golladay should of made the catch, and it would of been difficult for Maher to make a 55+ yard kicks with in an outdoor stadium.
RE: RE: RE: RE: They could not trust Jones  
ajr2456 : 9/27/2022 1:53 pm : link
In comment 15835344 robbieballs2003 said:
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In comment 15835338 ajr2456 said:


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In comment 15835334 robbieballs2003 said:


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In comment 15835332 ajr2456 said:


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And still go for it in that spot because they felt they had to.



Why would they have to?



Because the data supports going for it and the team needed to get some points.



So what is the argument, Daboll doesn't trust Jones but goes for it anyway? Isn't thst the exact opposite of what Lombardi is saying?


It’s not because you’re isolating one play and making a conclusion about it. Look at the full three weeks as a whole and not individual play calls
RE: RE: RE: RE: Nobody with a straight face can argue that Daboll  
robbieballs2003 : 9/27/2022 1:54 pm : link
In comment 15835347 JoeyBigBlue said:
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In comment 15835329 JoeyBigBlue said:


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In comment 15835317 robbieballs2003 said:


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doesn't trust Jones when they went for it on 4th and 2 with the risk of not converting that could have lead to 3 points the other way.




It was 10 seconds to go on the Dal 47. Daboll called a safe play to Golladay who should of made the catch and put the team in FG range. There wasn’t much of gamble.



Are you serious? They almost gave up 3 points to Dallas by not converting. I feel like I am dealing with such stubborn people trying to validate this moron's point.




It was a slight gamble. Golladay should of made the catch, and it would of been difficult for Maher to make a 55+ yard kicks with in an outdoor stadium.


You don't need to explain the gamble to me. I know what the benefits and consequences were. But if the point being made is you don't trust your QB, which is complete bullshit, then why not punt it away and go into half time? If you don't trust the QB then you don't ask him to convert a 4th and 2 or throw the ball every play on that drive.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: They could not trust Jones  
robbieballs2003 : 9/27/2022 1:54 pm : link
In comment 15835350 ajr2456 said:
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In comment 15835344 robbieballs2003 said:


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In comment 15835338 ajr2456 said:


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In comment 15835334 robbieballs2003 said:


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In comment 15835332 ajr2456 said:


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And still go for it in that spot because they felt they had to.



Why would they have to?



Because the data supports going for it and the team needed to get some points.



So what is the argument, Daboll doesn't trust Jones but goes for it anyway? Isn't thst the exact opposite of what Lombardi is saying?



It’s not because you’re isolating one play and making a conclusion about it. Look at the full three weeks as a whole and not individual play calls


I'm not isolating one play. Why did he pass on every play in that series?
punting it before the half isn't conceding the game  
UConn4523 : 9/27/2022 1:56 pm : link
conceding the game is what Judge did last year.
Because you can’t just not pass the ball and run  
ajr2456 : 9/27/2022 1:56 pm : link
It every time. Look at the ways the plays have been called. They don’t trust him to let it rip and attack. Some of it’s not Jones’ fault, but some of it is.
I’m not going to spend  
JoeyBigBlue : 9/27/2022 1:56 pm : link
My entire afternoon arguing this. I’m just passing the message. But one thing is true here. Either Daboll doesn’t full trust Jones, or he’s terrible at managing the clock. One or the other.
RE: Because you can’t just not pass the ball and run  
robbieballs2003 : 9/27/2022 1:58 pm : link
In comment 15835360 ajr2456 said:
Quote:
It every time. Look at the ways the plays have been called. They don’t trust him to let it rip and attack. Some of it’s not Jones’ fault, but some of it is.


Lmfao. So where is the evidence he doesn't trust Jones. Still waiting.
RE: I’m not going to spend  
robbieballs2003 : 9/27/2022 1:59 pm : link
In comment 15835363 JoeyBigBlue said:
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My entire afternoon arguing this. I’m just passing the message. But one thing is true here. Either Daboll doesn’t full trust Jones, or he’s terrible at managing the clock. One or the other.


Again, lmfao. Not trusting Jones other than putting the ball in his hands every play thay series. It can't be not trusting the OL. No. It is 100% Jones. Got it.
RE: Not trusting Lombardi is a better way to go through life  
No1MDGiantsFan : 9/27/2022 2:01 pm : link
In comment 15835276 ghost718 said:
Quote:
.


This
RE: This is pretty damn apparent  
Gman11 : 9/27/2022 2:02 pm : link
In comment 15835258 BigBlue7 said:
Quote:

And it's not that he doesn't trust Jones to make the right throw - he doesn't trust Jones to get the ball out to the right read on time.

Most of the frustration I have seen from Daboll on the sidelines is when Jones comes of his first read and then throws the ball away.


Yeah, because Jones has all day to survey the field and pick out his 4th or 5th read. Just stand back there and wait 10 or 15 seconds for a receiver to break free. It'll happen if he just had some patience.

Do these people even watch the games?
RE: There were many problems  
Pork Chop : 9/27/2022 2:06 pm : link
In comment 15835342 Dave on the UWS said:
Quote:
last night, but the QB who got his ass kicked virtually EVERY play was NOT one of them.


+100

Just like every other threat on BBI, confirmation bias runs very strong here
Maybe Lombardi Was Watching a Different Game  
clatterbuck : 9/27/2022 2:10 pm : link
in his head --one in which Giants WRs were open at all levels and the O-line gave Jones a perfect pocket from which to operate. What a dipshit take on what might have been the best game of Jones's career. Personally, given the horrendous protection and the terrible WR play, I was screaming for the Giants to "run the damn ball" more. Look. Jones might not be "the guy" but he played his heart out last night, kept his eyes downfield under tremendous pressure, ran for 80 yds, and made some really good throws. He was fearless. Lombardi once again proves he's very bad at his job.
So some of you believe Lombardi?  
section125 : 9/27/2022 2:11 pm : link
The reported hated by BBIers the most...
ALmost all teams are very careful about starting a 2 minute drill at half. The usually try to get to midfield before using timeouts so that there is no chance that the opponent can get the ball back with 1:30 left.

The ignorance here is appalling.
RE: Nobody with a straight face can argue that Daboll  
81_Great_Dane : 9/27/2022 2:12 pm : link
In comment 15835317 robbieballs2003 said:
Quote:
doesn't trust Jones when they went for it on 4th and 2 with the risk of not converting that could have lead to 3 points the other way.
The whole sequence was weird and the logic behind it is unclear. They had time and all three timeouts. It was a perfect spot for a 2-minute drill.

But they made no effort to run that kind of offense, or to preserve clock, or to seem to really go for a score. Prior to the fourth down play, the thinking seemed to be: "Let's not give Dallas the ball back, or if we do, let's not leave them time to work. If we can get into field goal range, great. If not, we get the ball to start the second half."

And then they get to the fourth down play, and that thinking seems to change. They took a big risk on that play, because Dallas could have (and did) completed one pass and gotten into field goal range.

My conclusion: Daboll doesn't trust the Giants' O to run a 2-minute drill. It's not clear whether it's Jones he doesn't trust, or the line, or the receivers, or someone else. Maybe he hasn't liked what he's seen of the 2-minute O in practice. But that was a very cautious, even timid, way to handle the end of the half — until it wasn't.
IMO Daboll doesn't trust the passing game  
UConn4523 : 9/27/2022 2:12 pm : link
that I buy. The combination of Jones, the OL and WR's doesn't inspire confidence and the OL was the big culprit lastnight followed by the WR's.
RE: RE: Nobody with a straight face can argue that Daboll  
robbieballs2003 : 9/27/2022 2:17 pm : link
In comment 15835400 81_Great_Dane said:
Quote:
In comment 15835317 robbieballs2003 said:


Quote:


doesn't trust Jones when they went for it on 4th and 2 with the risk of not converting that could have lead to 3 points the other way.

The whole sequence was weird and the logic behind it is unclear. They had time and all three timeouts. It was a perfect spot for a 2-minute drill.

But they made no effort to run that kind of offense, or to preserve clock, or to seem to really go for a score. Prior to the fourth down play, the thinking seemed to be: "Let's not give Dallas the ball back, or if we do, let's not leave them time to work. If we can get into field goal range, great. If not, we get the ball to start the second half."

And then they get to the fourth down play, and that thinking seems to change. They took a big risk on that play, because Dallas could have (and did) completed one pass and gotten into field goal range.

My conclusion: Daboll doesn't trust the Giants' O to run a 2-minute drill. It's not clear whether it's Jones he doesn't trust, or the line, or the receivers, or someone else. Maybe he hasn't liked what he's seen of the 2-minute O in practice. But that was a very cautious, even timid, way to handle the end of the half — until it wasn't.


Listen, I agree with the timeouts. I was yelling to call them. With that said. The ball was close to the players so they just got lined up and called the play at the line of scrimmage. They weren't letting the clock run down to 1 before snapping the ball. Tom Brady has mentioned this before that they purposely would let the clock dwindle and their mentality was FG or clock run out. The other team would never get the ball back. There is a difference between not trusting your QB and having a certain philosophy. This did not scream that Daboll doesn’t trust Jones at all.
Jones played a good game last night  
j_rud : 9/27/2022 2:20 pm : link
I thought he read the field well especially considering the pressure. There were several comments by the broadcast team re: Jones continuing to look downfield as he extended plays and scrambled. He's also making better decisions as a runner.

Strange morning-after to have a bone to pick with Jones. He, Thomas, and Barkley are the only ones who showed up on that side of the ball.
I can't read through this whole thread,  
Mike in Long Beach : 9/27/2022 2:25 pm : link
so I don't know if it's been said... but the lack of a two-minute drill at the end of the half was not an indictment of Jones. It was an indictment of the whole offense, and rightfully so. In fact, if he didn't milk down the clock as much as he did, Dallas would've likely been in a position to kick a much easier field goal as opposed to the 57 yarder (which he missed).

It was perfectly played by Daboll. If you happen to make a play or two and get within striking distance, start burning your timeouts and go for it. If you don't? Play it safe and don't give Dallas a chance to tack on points.
save Pat Leonard, Lombardi is the biggest asshole  
Victor in CT : 9/27/2022 2:32 pm : link
around.
Daboll  
RetroJint : 9/27/2022 2:35 pm : link
doesn’t trust his Oline & receivers . Jones might be a bit slow in his progressions . But over the first 3 games he’s getting the crap kicked out of him. All 11 defenders are featured prominently in your TV screen . And nobody can get behind a DB . It’s a claustrophobic environment .
Man  
OlyWABigBlue : 9/27/2022 2:36 pm : link
Lombardi is just stirring the shit and oddly, some are tasting the recipe.
RE: IMO Daboll doesn't trust the passing game  
JB_in_DC : 9/27/2022 2:40 pm : link
In comment 15835401 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
that I buy. The combination of Jones, the OL and WR's doesn't inspire confidence and the OL was the big culprit lastnight followed by the WR's.


Yeah. If Jones has time in the pocket and good targets, I think Daboll’s approach would be a lot more indicative of Jones-specific distrust.

This passing offense is bottom 5 in the league, Daboll is coaching to win, but when you’re EPA (or insert metric) is what our passing game’s is, you can’t call games like the Bills do.
Interesting Take from Dan Schneier -Offense Made Progress  
clatterbuck : 9/27/2022 2:48 pm : link
"Excluding the last gasp drive, the #Giants went 3-and-out just 2-of-9 series, scored or got to 50 on every other, and totaled nearly 350 in a game they allowed the most pressures of ANY team this year.
DJ and Kafka created yards from nothing.
The offense made progress in Week 3."
Lombardi  
Cheech d : 9/27/2022 2:53 pm : link
Lombardi is a jerk off and a click baiter.
Daboll is evaluating everything and his might eyes tell him he shouldn’t trust the offensive line, the receivers or the quarterback in certain situations.
My eyes tell me that Jones is low on the list of players he doesn’t trust right now.
He kept them in the game last night with his arm, his legs and his toughness.
Lombardi should pick another game for killing Jones.
Can’t stand him!!
It's..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 9/27/2022 2:54 pm : link
not even 3PM on Tuesday and ajr has already posted a couple hundred times about Jones today.

If someone triggers a guy that much to waste days typing about him - it might be time to seek help or take a pause.

People who came away from that game with the impression that Jones is terrible or that he can't be trusted are just blinded by hatred.

I bet Vegas took a bath last week on the over/under 100 Jones post quota. They have to up their game as ajr continues to flounder in his.
Could be Jones..,  
2ndroundKO : 9/27/2022 2:57 pm : link
could be the rest of the offense. Who knows?
RE: Jones just doesn't have IT  
VinegarPeppers : 9/27/2022 2:57 pm : link
So he made the Neal look bad huh? Geez! He holds the ball because nobody's open. We have the worst OL and worst WR ROOM in the NFL and it's the worst room we've had in what, 30 years?

In comment 15835315 GiantBlue said:
Quote:
He holds the ball too long and makes poor decisions.

He will be a fine back-up to some team.
RE: IMO Daboll doesn't trust the passing game  
SirLoinOfBeef : 9/27/2022 2:58 pm : link
In comment 15835401 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
that I buy. The combination of Jones, the OL and WR's doesn't inspire confidence and the OL was the big culprit lastnight followed by the WR's.


That sounds more like it.
He's Earning Trust  
blright : 9/27/2022 3:08 pm : link
I don't care what Lombardi says. Maybe Daboll didn't trust the offensive line because Jones was running for his life the entire game.

I feel like this is really Jones' second year in the NFL, and he's progressing now that he has a legit coaching staff. He just looks better. Is he a franchise QB? Jury is out, but at least you can now see a trajectory.
In the end, you're not likely to lose money  
BlackLight : 9/27/2022 3:14 pm : link
betting on the Giants and Daboll moving on from Daniel Jones after this season is over. Even before you consider the quality of Jones's play, there are good reasons to make that bet.

But just relying on those assumptions to make the prediction doesn't help a football pundit who needs people to pay attention to him to maintain a career as a football pundit. So you have start getting out over your skis and making statements like "Daboll doesn't trust Daniel Jones" - the evidence for which is tenuous.
There are other reason why he ran out the clock then  
BillT : 9/27/2022 3:14 pm : link
Having the Cowboys teeing off on our OL and Jones by running a typical 2 minute drill was a recipe for disaster. He approached it carefully and killed the clock and almost got into FG range anyway. Getting off the field 6-3 was a win for the Giants.
End of the first half was odd all-around. I am not sure Daboll  
Jimmy Googs : 9/27/2022 3:20 pm : link
knew what he was doing, or what he wanted to accomplish quite frankly.

Some day this team will score touchdowns again.

Some day...

Lombardi's full of shit  
WillieYoung : 9/27/2022 3:23 pm : link
We passed on first down (turned into a scramble because surprise the line didn't hold up. Ran a draw on second and passed several times after that. problem is once we are not in a running situation the line can't hold up.
If it was apparent Daboll didn’t trust someone  
mfsd : 9/27/2022 3:28 pm : link
it was his OL, not Jones

But by all means lap up whatever new fake controversy this clown shovels in your dish if it makes you happy
I don't buy it...Daboll would have clearly had Jones take a knee  
KingBlue : 9/27/2022 3:31 pm : link
If Dabs didn't trust Jones, he would have clearly had Jones take a knee on 2nd and 3rd down.

Lombardi is talking out of his ass... Did Jones take a knee?

Yeah, I didn't think so.
Lombardi is BENEATH CONTEMPT.  
Red Dog : 9/27/2022 3:35 pm : link
.
I've been critical of Jones in the past  
OBJ_AllDay : 9/27/2022 4:07 pm : link
But there aren't too many qbs in the league who would have fared much better in yesterdays game under those circumstances. He played very well considering.
I don't buy this at all  
gmen4ever : 9/27/2022 4:10 pm : link
Makes no sense
RE: It's..  
ajr2456 : 9/27/2022 4:18 pm : link
In comment 15835475 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
not even 3PM on Tuesday and ajr has already posted a couple hundred times about Jones today.

If someone triggers a guy that much to waste days typing about him - it might be time to seek help or take a pause.

People who came away from that game with the impression that Jones is terrible or that he can't be trusted are just blinded by hatred.

I bet Vegas took a bath last week on the over/under 100 Jones post quota. They have to up their game as ajr continues to flounder in his.


It’s weird that you follow me around and post almost exclusively about me. I’m sure the hookers are cheap enough in Charlotte you can get your fix there.

And 100 is quit the exaggeration. I’ve also said in multiple posts Jones wasn’t at fault for last night and played ok. I’ve posted about saqoun and how we should resign him and how his blocking as improved. And how the time to throw stat lacks the context that people are making assumptions on Jones for. But sure keep up your narratives.

Your obsession with me is weird
Misplaced hate  
Thegratefulhead : 9/27/2022 4:18 pm : link
No one hates Jones, they think he sucks, you insufferable twats.

They hate you!

Really, it is your ridiculous arguments and subjective reasoning that people hate.

Jones?

He just isn't good enough.

You are a bunch of babies that get your panties in a big bunched up wad when people criticize Ya Boi. I am sure that is very, very uncomfortable for you. That is no reason to turn into a toddler.

Buy some nice boxers, not from Walmart.

It's better.
RE: This is pretty damn apparent  
Hammer : 9/27/2022 4:23 pm : link
In comment 15835258 BigBlue7 said:
Quote:

And it's not that he doesn't trust Jones to make the right throw - he doesn't trust Jones to get the ball out to the right read on time.

Most of the frustration I have seen from Daboll on the sidelines is when Jones comes of his first read and then throws the ball away.

So it's not a frustration with Jones being wreckless, but more of a frustration for Jones not seeing the whole field and pulling the trigger.

Would love if there was an All 22 breakdown of every pass play to show what was supposed to happen vs what actually happened.


How do you know this?
RE: Misplaced hate  
Thunderstruck27 : 9/27/2022 4:24 pm : link
In comment 15835644 Thegratefulhead said:
Quote:
No one hates Jones, they think he sucks, you insufferable twats.

They hate you!

Really, it is your ridiculous arguments and subjective reasoning that people hate.

Jones?

He just isn't good enough.

You are a bunch of babies that get your panties in a big bunched up wad when people criticize Ya Boi. I am sure that is very, very uncomfortable for you. That is no reason to turn into a toddler.

Buy some nice boxers, not from Walmart.

It's better.


You sound like a lunatic. Take a break...we get it, Jones sucks.
During the first two games and parts of last night  
JonC : 9/27/2022 4:32 pm : link
yes I'd agree, they're being very specific with what's called for Jones and they're trying to guide him through the action while everyone comes up to speed on the new system. This also applies to the OL and the skill players. Collectively and also each man has to demonstrate a grasp of assignments.

Also, last night it sure seemed like they loosened the handcuffs on Jones and gave him some options, they moved protection, ran more vertical route combos to try and get the ball downfield and open up some space.
Never big in moments that matter  
Thegratefulhead : 9/27/2022 4:39 pm : link
For everyone's talk about the OL and skill players, that was a very, very competitive game until late in the 4th quarter. If Jones could have thrown a perfect, indefensible pass or 2 in key moments, we win that game.

We have lost a lot of close games during his career.

I hold him accountable for his play.
RE: He doesn't trust him but  
djm : 9/27/2022 4:40 pm : link
In comment 15835250 Giantimistic said:
Quote:
goes for it on 4th and 2 on the 50 and throws a pass.

Not sure I buy this.

Maybe he doesn't trust his oline yet.


Thank you.

I smell bullshit. He doesn't trust him but yet.... does trust him.

RE: During the first two games and parts of last night  
section125 : 9/27/2022 4:41 pm : link
In comment 15835669 JonC said:
Quote:
yes I'd agree, they're being very specific with what's called for Jones and they're trying to guide him through the action while everyone comes up to speed on the new system. This also applies to the OL and the skill players. Collectively and also each man has to demonstrate a grasp of assignments.

Also, last night it sure seemed like they loosened the handcuffs on Jones and gave him some options, they moved protection, ran more vertical route combos to try and get the ball downfield and open up some space.


Thank you JonC. It seemed like a different offense and a different Jones last night. Still tries to make plays holding the ball too long, but it sure looked like a loosening of the reins. I liked it. Too many dropped balls and that bogus PI called on Shep killed them - well, as did Feliciano 8 yards down field on the screen...
RE: During the first two games and parts of last night  
ColHowPepper : 9/27/2022 4:50 pm : link
In comment 15835669 JonC said:
Quote:
yes I'd agree, they're being very specific with what's called for Jones and they're trying to guide him through the action while everyone comes up to speed on the new system. This also applies to the OL and the skill players. Collectively and also each man has to demonstrate a grasp of assignments.

Also, last night it sure seemed like they loosened the handcuffs on Jones and gave him some options, they moved protection, ran more vertical route combos to try and get the ball downfield and open up some space.

Agree here too. One of the best plays last night imo was one I've not seen mentioned, midway or so through first quarter: Jones takes the snap (don't recall if under C) wheels clockwise and toward the far sideline as if he's on a designed run or roll-out, the S releases on Bellinger closes on Jones, who gets it to Bellinger on time and accurately toward the far sideline, ~ 9 yards gain. It was a play I've seen run by NFL offenses! Imagine that.
I thought Bellinger had a decent night in the passing game, one of the very few 'reliable' targets.
Looked To Me  
Bernie : 9/27/2022 4:55 pm : link
That they were trying to push the ball deep but DJ didn’t like what he saw so he held it and that’s when the pressure came. In the 4th qtr, I was yelling at the TV for him to just let it rip. This offense needs to develop confidence.
Maybe he doesn't trust the o line and receivers  
kelly : 9/27/2022 5:34 pm : link
That's where the problem was
Lombardi is a moron  
Jerry in_DC : 9/27/2022 6:08 pm : link
But it couldn't be more obvious that they don't trust Jones. Just watch the games. It looks like they're calling plays for a 3rd round rookie.
RE: Looked To Me  
speedywheels : 9/27/2022 6:19 pm : link
In comment 15835693 Bernie said:
Quote:
That they were trying to push the ball deep but DJ didn’t like what he saw so he held it and that’s when the pressure came. In the 4th qtr, I was yelling at the TV for him to just let it rip. This offense needs to develop confidence.


So he's supposed to throw it to a receiver is completely covered ( or into double/triple) coverage, just so he can "let it rip"?

He holds on to the ball because the shit we have for WR can't get any separation at all
RE: Lombardi is a moron  
speedywheels : 9/27/2022 6:20 pm : link
In comment 15835763 Jerry in_DC said:
Quote:
But it couldn't be more obvious that they don't trust Jones. Just watch the games. It looks like they're calling plays for a 3rd round rookie.


You may watch the games, but with that comment, it's pretty clear you don't know what you're watching...
A couple things  
BSIMatt : 9/27/2022 6:46 pm : link
This guy is a complete imbecile.

You can easily argue against it, starting and ending with…take a look at that pass pro and the dudes running routes Lombardi. It’s quite literally that fucking cut and dry.
RE: RE: Because you can’t just not pass the ball and run  
santacruzom : 9/27/2022 8:03 pm : link
In comment 15835366 robbieballs2003 said:
Quote:
In comment 15835360 ajr2456 said:


Quote:


It every time. Look at the ways the plays have been called. They don’t trust him to let it rip and attack. Some of it’s not Jones’ fault, but some of it is.



Lmfao. So where is the evidence he doesn't trust Jones. Still waiting.


If the evidence consists of a game in which Jones never throws a pass, I don't think you'll ever see it.
...  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 9/27/2022 8:06 pm : link
We have way too many Michael Lombardi threads on BBI.
.  
arcarsenal : 9/27/2022 8:08 pm : link
It's not that Daboll doesn't trust Jones. He lacks confidence in the entire operation.. meaning, the pass blocking, which was virtually non-existent, and the pass-catching group which has to be the worst in the NFL at this point.

Jones is only one piece, and last night, the offensive woes were not his fault.
RE: Maybe he doesn't trust the o line and receivers  
No1MDGiantsFan : 9/27/2022 8:08 pm : link
In comment 15835741 kelly said:
Quote:
That's where the problem was


It’s really this simple and obvious
RE: RE: RE: They also wouldn't have continued to pass the ball.  
giantstock : 9/27/2022 8:28 pm : link
In comment 15835339 robbieballs2003 said:
Quote:
In comment 15835336 ajr2456 said:


Quote:


In comment 15835330 robbieballs2003 said:


Quote:


They would have ran tbe clock out. It is unreal arguing this.



And what concede the game? Based on this logic the only way they don’t trust Jones is if they run the ball every play?



ajr, you are smarter than this. You're hatred for Jones is clouding this argument for you.


No he isn't smarter than this.

You should've read the postgame thread. He hates Jones so he makes things up just to stay in an argument.
RE: RE: RE: RE: They also wouldn't have continued to pass the ball.  
ajr2456 : 9/27/2022 8:50 pm : link
In comment 15835960 giantstock said:
Quote:
In comment 15835339 robbieballs2003 said:


Quote:


In comment 15835336 ajr2456 said:


Quote:


In comment 15835330 robbieballs2003 said:


Quote:


They would have ran tbe clock out. It is unreal arguing this.



And what concede the game? Based on this logic the only way they don’t trust Jones is if they run the ball every play?



ajr, you are smarter than this. You're hatred for Jones is clouding this argument for you.



No he isn't smarter than this.

You should've read the postgame thread. He hates Jones so he makes things up just to stay in an argument.


This is weird because I didn’t post in the game thread. Maybe you’re not smart?
Of course, we could always go to Daboll's own words to check  
Tom in NY : 9/27/2022 9:15 pm : link
From today's presser:

Q: When you look back at last night and the way Daniel played given the unrest that he was in and some of the things he created, what did you see there? And what kind of a step forward was that for him for a lack of a better way to put it?

A: I think he’s made steps each game. I thought he played well yesterday. He was under some duress. He escaped. He made some loose plays. He did some things with his feet. He made some good throws. He competed his tail off. I thought all the guys competed. I thought we played hard, and we competed for 60 minutes. We just lacked on some other things that caused us to have the result that we had. I thought he was really good on the sideline. Again, I think he’s improved every game. He’s really improved every practice, and he was a good leader out there. And he competed as hard as he could compete and gave us a chance.
I can't believe the nonsense in this thread ..  
DefenseWins : 9/27/2022 9:39 pm : link
Some of you have completely lost it
Back to the Corner